Bureau for the Improvement of NS Businesses [Organisation]

[Aurora Confederacy]

This is probably my most successful one
Diamond Star its been around and isn't that well laid out compared to the ones like VLT or Montellucci, though all the important stuff is there. It I admit is inspred by VLT in terms of some of the features though nothing has been copied off any other storefront. My Genesis Aerosystems one however copies Diamond Star, and I have attempted a pan regional storefront in the form of Astyrail, which has several Astyrian participants, for this I set about a generic layout to which I handed to the other participants of Astyrail. see here and here Viper was the first, then I adapted it to Trans Polar Railways. (best viewed on wide screen)

yet on the otherhand I see ones like this all the time and it does not do GE&T any favours.

[Jungastia]

The Astyrail thing gets me a bit, its basically a huge group of the same storefronts. I'd go as far as saying it was spam in my mind that there is now like 5 of almost identical storefronts.

Seconded to that the overall design is a bit off, the blue text is not good. Further, a major international railway operator for example Thalys, Eurostar in the real world, and mine and Akimonad's Velocia here in the NS world use a single basic stock/design. Thalys uses the PBA/PBKA (different but really one in the same) Eurostar's Class 373/TMST and then Velocia's V-225 (in day and night version)

Velocia is something that works along the line of Eurostar/Thalys and international rail is something of an interest area of mine and something me and Aki worked out in very very big detail.

Id also say that the partner stuff needs to be about a 5th of the size

(see Velocia http://iiwiki.com/velocia)

[Aurora Confederacy]

The idea with the format is to give uniformity but to allow each participant to tweak it slightly as required. which is what i did with Trans Polar by adding more elements to it.

[Jungastia]

The idea with the format is to give uniformity but to allow each participant to tweak it slightly as required. which is what i did with Trans Polar by adding more elements to it.

But if its something like that it should be one single storefront, not loads doing the same thing. Assuming a Thalys style model of shared ownership, then all services would be branded in the key brand, and marketed by the key brand.

[Aurora Confederacy]

I will speak to the other partners about making each storefront unique, so making Astyrail more like "interrail" - allowing diversity within different nations.

[Jungastia]

I will speak to the other partners about making each storefront unique, so making Astyrail more like "interrail" - allowing diversity within different nations.

Interrail is just a ticket, no serves are branded it, and again Interrail had only one website really (excluding variations based on purchasers location). Tweaking slightly does not solve the issue. For it to have any use they would all need to be substantially unique, or in one single storefront.

[Controlled Interests]

True. There has also been a recent influx of rather barebones companies. Now I'm no expert in this field (I'm not even a full-fledged member of the bureau), but some of the new "ideas" are pretty poorly conceived. I don't want to mention any names, but some businesses just take up space. Their owners, not realizing that their company has very little market potential, make hopeless bumps that have little to no effect on business.

In this sense, I have begun to wonder if the Bureau should provide "active" help, as in, reach out to failing businesses directly and provide advice. Not really sure about you guys, but this could be pretty helpful for first time posters.

I second this. There have been so many one liner spam storefronts that get a disproportionate amount of business then the well thought out ones. Honestly, the only good storefronts that are getting business is your NGA thing. Great idea with NGA btw, I love it! But the mediumly good fronts get the most business. Orcrando Airlines is winning, along with all the new arms fronts.
EDIT: Like, I really do not understand This

Thanks! The NGASE is going pretty well, albeit lots of bbcode and busy work. That last URL truly exemplifies what I'm talking about. The thing is, the International forum gets posts like these as well, but you only seem them once in a while due to high activity of existing monoliths. GE&T has fewer gigantic threads, so the problem is that these less-than-ideal storefronts take up lots of space, to the point where it is spammy. Instead, what we should do is:

Increase the activity of the moderately good storefronts by actively approaching them with advice. Storefronts like these: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=10781 have the potential to become very good, with proper guidance. If we promote these moderate looking storefronts and turn them into high quality ones, we can, to a certain extent, drown out the bad ones completely.

http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=10781
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=269062
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=269359

[Vitaphone Racing]

Not to rain on the parade but:

I'm morally conflicted when it comes to naming and shaming noob storefronts. Yes they might be terrible but there are no firm, official guidelines on what and what not is acceptable RP quality. People are entitled to have bad storefronts, they are entitled to refuse advice and you are entitled to ignore them. Trying to drown them out purposefully is a bit much; we don't want to have a divided community from running people out of metaphorical business or provoke people into bumping their stores even more excessively than what they do.

Offering advice in people's storefronts again is something I'm against because it makes the person running the store look bad, as if they need your help because they aren't good enough as it is. This is why telgramming is preferable because nobody else needs know and judge.

There will always be good storefronts and bad storefronts, but history has proved that good storefronts will be found time and time again. The presence of bad stores hasn't diminished this and probably never will.

By the way, if you think right now is bad, you should wind back your clocks to '09.

[Aurora Confederacy]

wioth 600 posts, some should know better,

however for the user with just 3 posts, My guess is give him time and guidance. I remember what my first storefront was like!

[Controlled Interests]

Not to rain on the parade but:

I'm morally conflicted when it comes to naming and shaming noob storefronts. Yes they might be terrible but there are no firm, official guidelines on what and what not is acceptable RP quality. People are entitled to have bad storefronts, they are entitled to refuse advice and you are entitled to ignore them. Trying to drown them out purposefully is a bit much; we don't want to have a divided community from running people out of metaphorical business or provoke people into bumping their stores even more excessively than what they do.

Offering advice in people's storefronts again is something I'm against because it makes the person running the store look bad, as if they need your help because they aren't good enough as it is. This is why telgramming is preferable because nobody else needs know and judge.

There will always be good storefronts and bad storefronts, but history has proved that good storefronts will be found time and time again. The presence of bad stores hasn't diminished this and probably never will.

By the way, if you think right now is bad, you should wind back your clocks to '09.

'Tis a point that I understand. What I meant by "actively" reaching out was through tg, instead of waiting for individuals to stroll through the NSBB. Perhaps its too extreme and maybe the NSBB is far too undermanned to carry out this duty, but anyways that was what I was thinking. Also, while I do understand that everyone is entitled to creating their own storefronts, some are just there for RP purposes and show a callous disregard for those who actually dedicate most of their time to GE&T.

[Falkasia]

As the original creator of the Bureau, I feel I must agree with Vitaphone Racing. The original charter set out to create an organization where advice could be given in an impartial manner, without seeming to be suffocating or elitist. The act of actively seeking out storefronts which are of lesser quality stumbles into a moral grey area, as foremost there is not a set criteria for categorizing said storefronts into bins of "quality" as well as the fact some storefront owners simply do not desire advice at all. The Bureau here is set up to act as a two-way forum where help can be sought and given, not forced upon others.

The idea was that if the Bureau exists, people will be more inclined to come here to ask questions about topics they are unsure about within the confines of a friendly environment. This, compared to the alternative of using pre-existing storefronts as a models or risking pissing off other players by spamming TGs for help.

[Aurora Confederacy]

if people want help, they generally ask for it. those that don't want help, will generally do their own thing. (I can be guilty of that sometimes), though it has to be said I have seen some new nations come in and knock out some presentable storefronts.

[The Free Republic of Akan]

if people want help, they generally ask for it. those that don't want help, will generally do their own thing. (I can be guilty of that sometimes), though it has to be said I have seen some new nations come in and knock out some presentable storefronts.

I am new, but how is Alagom looking? Its WIP though

[Aurora Confederacy]

looks okay to me.

I have noticed you have duplicated the link box, clever idea, gives a convenient jump pad around the store

[Tippercommon]

if people want help, they generally ask for it. those that don't want help, will generally do their own thing. (I can be guilty of that sometimes), though it has to be said I have seen some new nations come in and knock out some presentable storefronts.

I am new, but how is Alagom looking? Its WIP though

I would suggest that instead of marking each thing with a large picture, that you mark it with a header. In Lodestone Resource Technologies, I marked everything with a header of an identical style, and had an image of about 100-200px in width. Either way, I'd make all your product images the same width (about 200-300px) and use the [floatright] tab on it.

[The Free Republic of Akan]

I am new, but how is Alagom looking? Its WIP though

I would suggest that instead of marking each thing with a large picture, that you mark it with a header. In Lodestone Resource Technologies, I marked everything with a header of an identical style, and had an image of about 100-200px in width. Either way, I'd make all your product images the same width (about 200-300px) and use the [floatright] tab on it.

Ahh... I see. I will also try to put more info on each thingy.

[Vitaphone Racing]

Not to rain on the parade but:

I'm morally conflicted when it comes to naming and shaming noob storefronts. Yes they might be terrible but there are no firm, official guidelines on what and what not is acceptable RP quality. People are entitled to have bad storefronts, they are entitled to refuse advice and you are entitled to ignore them. Trying to drown them out purposefully is a bit much; we don't want to have a divided community from running people out of metaphorical business or provoke people into bumping their stores even more excessively than what they do.

Offering advice in people's storefronts again is something I'm against because it makes the person running the store look bad, as if they need your help because they aren't good enough as it is. This is why telgramming is preferable because nobody else needs know and judge.

There will always be good storefronts and bad storefronts, but history has proved that good storefronts will be found time and time again. The presence of bad stores hasn't diminished this and probably never will.

By the way, if you think right now is bad, you should wind back your clocks to '09.

'Tis a point that I understand. What I meant by "actively" reaching out was through tg, instead of waiting for individuals to stroll through the NSBB. Perhaps its too extreme and maybe the NSBB is far too undermanned to carry out this duty, but anyways that was what I was thinking. Also, while I do understand that everyone is entitled to creating their own storefronts, some are just there for RP purposes and show a callous disregard for those who actually dedicate most of their time to GE&T.

I'm a bit curious as to your reasoning here. Why is having a storefront for RP purposes a bad thing and how is anybody else affected by it? This is free form RP after all, people are free to roleplay anyway they wish.

[Aurora Confederacy]

In some way you can say the airport threads are for RP purposes as they dont really do a lot other than provide "connections" to a nation, same with airlines for example, though they can provide footfall for the likes of Montelucci (what ever happenned to them) and the likes of Genesis.

I am in the middle of building a new railway station on NS as well.

[The Free Republic of Akan]

Does anyone else want to make so many storefronts? I just started my 3rd under construction. (Want it to be verrrrrrry detailed) arms front.

[Aurora Confederacy]

Akan, I have quite a few
Orbis - making trains
Diamond Star - Making trucks
Genesis - Making airliners and cargo planes
2 airlines
2 railway companies
a ship builders
an electronics company

Each one is *slightly* different, with the latest one being Aurora electronics, Orbis (being a reworking) a. probably the oldest one is Diamond Star

[Dungeyland]

What do you guys think of this? Especially with regards to the phone I tried to design in Inkscape. Oh, and it will forever bother me that NS turns the Greek letter chi into a normal x

[Aurora Confederacy]

add this "Introducing something very special: χ by infinity" to the image at the top of the header rather than using NS for it.
I sometimes make corporate tag lines as part of the header logo

[Tippercommon]

What do you guys think of this? Especially with regards to the phone I tried to design in Inkscape. Oh, and it will forever bother me that NS turns the Greek letter chi into a normal x

From a design standpoint, I would recommend:

• Making the letter chi in your banner just a little bit smaller.
• Incorporate the tagline "Introducing something very special: χ by infinity." in your banner using smaller text.
• I don't know if the white pluses in between the letters are a design choice or just trying to create a space. If it is just trying to create a space between the letters, use [color=#f5f7f4] instead of white. Or you could just make them in Inkscape with that same color scheme. I think it would look cool indeed.
• Make the price of the phone a different color, such as green or red. Right now, it's not that visible.
• The phone design itself definitely isn't incredibly bad in comparison to what you could have done. I personally don't know how to use Inskcape, but vector image editing software has its place, especially with products like this. It's good that you have a transparent background, and making it in an isometric view is definitely harder. Here are some suggestions on making it better:
  
  1. I'd suggest making the main lavender part a gradient of that color and a slightly darker version rather than having it one color with a little shadow. What I mean is making it something like this.
  2. The white spots near your lines are caused because a line is itself sort of a gradient. Towards the edges it gets lighter and more transparent. Because of this, when you fill the inside of the borders with color it appears to have gaps in it. I'd suggest going over those lines once more with a slightly thicker line. Yours looks about 1px in width. I'd go with 1.5px to 2px. Doesn't have to be that much.
  3. Perhaps making the brown side bit silver or grey and make it a gradient as well? The brown color is kinda ugly imo.

[Tippercommon]

'Tis a point that I understand. What I meant by "actively" reaching out was through tg, instead of waiting for individuals to stroll through the NSBB. Perhaps its too extreme and maybe the NSBB is far too undermanned to carry out this duty, but anyways that was what I was thinking. Also, while I do understand that everyone is entitled to creating their own storefronts, some are just there for RP purposes and show a callous disregard for those who actually dedicate most of their time to GE&T.

Seeing as how GE&T is an RP forum about trade and economics, and isn't restricted to just storefronts, this is not a problem. Besides being the place where storefront owners strut their stuff, GE&T can work in support of II and F&NI. IMO, the way change happens is passively. In my experience, when you "reach out" and tell people how to improve, it can be seen as insulting and no change will happen. They have to want to change and seek advice rather than having it shoved in their face. I mean, my style I would say is about the 20th generation of Libertarian Governance's style which I picked up back in like 2010. And I believe my first post on GE&T was a pretty badly formatted trade deal between me and Olwe regarding the sale of stealth destroyers.

I would say the definition of a "good storefront" nowadays has been artificially raised by the amount of graphic design that are in storefronts now. Back in like 2009, pretty much everyone's format was crap. And with the now huge gap between those who have been here for a while and those who barely now anything about BBCode or product design, progress takes time.

[Aurora Confederacy]

.... And I believe my first post on GE&T was a pretty badly formatted trade deal between me and Olwe regarding the sale of stealth destroyers.

I would say the definition of a "good storefront" nowadays has been artificially raised by the amount of graphic design that are in storefronts now. Back in like 2009, pretty much everyone's format was crap. And with the now huge gap between those who have been here for a while and those who barely now anything about BBCode, progress takes time.

have you got that post Tippercommon?