NATION

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Basic Primer to Naval Warfare

A staging-point for declarations of war and other major diplomatic events. [In character]

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Korrodos
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Founded: Aug 25, 2009
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Postby Korrodos » Tue Jul 27, 2010 12:22 am

I endorse this Guide (lol, like I throw any weight around), and also vote that it should be stickied.

I think good suggested reading would be Brodie's A Guide to Naval Strategy.

Thanks Questers!
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Yanitaria
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Postby Yanitaria » Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:19 am

I endorse this, it's a great guide, However, I would like to point out one inaccuracy. EW doesn't work how anyone on NS thinks it works, from what I've seen, and it's definitely not how I thought it worked.

Essentially most people think that you blast a signal on a frequency, and it prevents accurate range data. Whether it does this is irrelevant, because you are broadcasting on a signal it can obviously intercept.

The obvious solution since WWII? Instead of following your radar echos, follow the new signal! EW in that sense then becomes a liability. It can be targeted from much farther than it can usefully be used to detect or blot out the enemy's signal, and it messes with your own detection capabilities.

However there is then a subset of missiles that use Conical Lobe Switching. For those of you more learned on this subject, you'll know that this is the main source of EW prowess. Unfortunately it only effects a subportion of munitions, and, as evidenced by the sinking of the Israeli destroyer Eliat, is no longer necessarily relevant.

Most modern EW focuses on SIGINT, ESM, and ECCM.
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Ekraysia
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Postby Ekraysia » Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:21 am

I heartily endorse this product.

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Mikoyan-Guryevich
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Postby Mikoyan-Guryevich » Tue Jul 27, 2010 2:33 am

Sea mines?
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Brogavia
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Postby Brogavia » Tue Jul 27, 2010 5:16 pm

The Silver Sky wrote:And get your expensive flattops or transports carrying thousands of men and billions of dollars of equipment that you just transported across who knows how much water into the enemies gun range?

RO/ROs should be no where near the beachhead as long as there is organized heavy resistance and flat tops can be better used launching planes of helicopters.


I said flat ship. Not flat top. I meant any ship with a a large sturdy flat surface that you can put artillery on.
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LINTYLAND
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Postby LINTYLAND » Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:13 pm

Finally somebody took some time to make something like this. Questers you should get a title.
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St Star
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Postby St Star » Tue Jul 27, 2010 6:32 pm

Apparently I need to read an reevaluate my theories on Detection systems and Other such things.
Last edited by St Star on Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
St.Star Financial Strength :
Population: 1,472,000,000 +
Work force: 1.361B+
Major Ports: 14
Annual GDP: 104.4T
Road coverage: 8.28M km
Bullet rail coverage: 4.78M km
Total land area: 9.47M sqkm
connected land area: 6.38M sqkm
Purchasing Power:92.18T
Unfunded Liability: 0.00
Nation debt: 5.42T
Tax income: 41.6 T
Defense budget: 18.3T


[Note]All numbers updated at convenience.

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Yanitaria
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Postby Yanitaria » Wed Jul 28, 2010 1:04 am

St Star wrote:Poly carbon fiber hull that In general makes them much harder to kill, in addition high budgets in development allow our ships to carry Extreme range defensive missiles that make aerial attacks much more difficult when compounded with our Microwave detection systems, gives us a reliable detection range of 600Miles of most stealth air craft


Microwave detection system? You mean radar at very high frequencies. That'd actually make your range shorter, and would be worse against stealthy aircraft.

Longer wavelengths are required for that work.

Also, carbon fiber burns, which makes it, (along with titanium) a bad ship building material. Questers actually wrote on that as well.
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Taffy 3
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Postby Taffy 3 » Wed Jul 28, 2010 8:52 am

Yanitaria wrote:
St Star wrote:Poly carbon fiber hull that In general makes them much harder to kill




Also, carbon fiber burns, which makes it, (along with titanium) a bad ship building material. Questers actually wrote on that as well.

Just to add on to what Yani already posted, fire on a ship is an even greater threat than flooding. More ships in war are lost to fires that burn out of control than flooding.
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Willman
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Postby Willman » Wed Jul 28, 2010 10:16 am

This thread is truly great, I'll make sure to have everyone in my region give it a read. Oh, and I heartily endorse it for anyone else as well.
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Auremena
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Postby Auremena » Wed Jul 28, 2010 10:19 am

Submarine warfare is also severely misunderstood. Maybe I should write a doctrine with USPA.
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Laysley
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Postby Laysley » Wed Jul 28, 2010 10:46 am

Endorsed.
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Sailsia
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Postby Sailsia » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:13 am

Thank You. I am surprised no one has made a naval guide yet, since its highly needed.
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Bendira
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Postby Bendira » Wed Jul 28, 2010 11:49 am

http://wikistates.outwardhosting.com/wiki/P-900

How does this missile achieve its stealth capabilities? I am trying to find ways to stealth missiles myself.

Suffice to say that at a thousand klicks from the Albertssteiner fleet, with a radar signature somewhere between that of an F-22 and an F-35, the Hermes was virtually impossible to detect, especially in that particular flying pattern and that particular altitude. Each carried three P-900 missiles. At a range of one thousand kilometres, the Hermes launched their missiles and then withdrew back to their carriers. These missiles two would spread out, and because they possessed stealth properties, would receive the same benefits as the Hermes planes on their attack run. They would converge on pre-set positions, which were marked out to be in a preset area of where the Albertssteiner fleet was. At 50 kilometres from the area, the missiles would turn on their active radars and search for targets; when they found them, they would attack. Each missile had a high-explosive warhead weighing 750 kg, enough to severely cripple a destroyer. Four could knock an aircraft carrier out of action. The opening salvo had been made.


And shouldn't you give him a chance to detect your aircraft? After all, no aircraft are COMPLETELY undetectable are they?
Last edited by Bendira on Thu Jul 29, 2010 2:58 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Dinosians
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Postby Dinosians » Wed Jul 28, 2010 12:44 pm

True but they were flying low to the ocean, and are stealth aircraft so that made it much less likely that they would be detected. Not saying impossible but highly unlikely unless you had an AWACS right above the area.

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Strykla
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Postby Strykla » Wed Jul 28, 2010 2:04 pm

The CIWS doesn't only have to be a cannon, you know. A few Nimitz ships have been upgraded with missile CIWS systems.
And also, I'd like to point out how much naval warfare could be different if the US hadn't been bombed at Pearl Harbor. Before then, battleships were considered better than carriers, but without them, the carriers were all we had. That, combined with successful tactics, proved how carriers could be used with impunity.
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Bajireyn
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Postby Bajireyn » Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:07 pm

tagged
Right behind you...: UDL

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Hegstoria
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Postby Hegstoria » Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:18 pm

Tagged.
"Quotation is a serviceable substitute for wit."-Oscar Wilde

Defcon 5: Pax Hegstoriana
Defcon 4: Ehh, things are pretty good, but a bit heated
Defcon 3: War seems near, but not at the moment, and far from the mind
Defcon 2: Get a helmet
Defcon 1: Put on said helmet

Colonies: South-West Hegstodia, The Hegstoria Rhodesian Confederacy(3 independent colonies), Fuair

Major Leaders: President Jonathan F. Shepherd, Vice President Francis P. Sinclair, Minister of the Interior Samuel D. Lisbon, Minister of the Armed Forces General Stanley C. McAlister

Map: -currently under a redesign-

Size: 7,825,600 km^2

Life Expectancy: 84.59 years Courtesy of Unibot

Alliances: Skyguard Defense Network

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Calendove
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Postby Calendove » Wed Jul 28, 2010 3:24 pm

Bout time some one did something like this, tag
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Izistan
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Postby Izistan » Wed Jul 28, 2010 5:06 pm

There are some areas you can get away with stretching. In Example. St. Star considers it self a Naval power, our ships use a Poly carbon fiber hull that In general makes them much harder to kill, in addition high budgets in development allow our ships to carry Extreme range defensive missiles that make aerial attacks much more difficult when compounded with our Microwave detection systems, gives us a reliable detection range of 600Miles of most stealth air craft.

Confederate ships also use stealth technology. low profile and low signature on typical radar. How ever all of these strengths are off set by a general weakness in Air craft Technology. A respectable comparison to real world Armed forces puts the Confederate air force roughly comparable to the United states air force in the late 70s and early 80s.... The cause of this was that the Confederacy of Saint Star is a Naval nation. Bordering nations 2 and 3 times bigger than it in terms of population.

The St.star Naval technology allows it to field a comfortable fleet against nations of over a billion Population.


what the christ is this

How does this missile achieve its stealth capabilities?


Same way any other stealf cruise missile does. RCS reduction and shaping. This is why you bring very powerful radars to play with.
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Willman
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Founded: Jul 20, 2009
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Postby Willman » Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:23 pm

This needs a bump. Maybe even a stick.
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Reformed Britannia
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Postby Reformed Britannia » Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:30 pm

I personally think this should be stickied because it definately helped me out quite a bit.

A question about ASBMs: assuming you had a big enough ship, could you make an ASBM that could be launched from a ship?


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Dinosians
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Postby Dinosians » Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:47 pm

Reformed Britannia wrote:I personally think this should be stickied because it definately helped me out quite a bit.

A question about ASBMs: assuming you had a big enough ship, could you make an ASBM that could be launched from a ship?


Possibly but that is why they built Ballistic Missile Submarines.

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Estovakia
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Founded: Sep 02, 2005
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Postby Estovakia » Wed Jul 28, 2010 7:51 pm

I too would also like to see this stickied. Or rather, re-posted with other Naval Warfare advise that Questers (and others) have posted in the past to make a sort of super-mega thread on naval warfare, a kind of one-stop shop with all major questions answered on NS, along with a more thorough Q&A. Regardless, we definitely need a stickie on Naval Power (and air power IMHO since many of the issues such as ECM, stealth capabilities, radar capabilities, SAMs, and other fun stuff also apply to air battles as well which have at least an equal chance of being Rambo'ed and godmodded.)

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Rich and Corporations
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Postby Rich and Corporations » Wed Jul 28, 2010 8:12 pm

We need a sticky on basic military strategy.
Corporate Confederacy
DEFENSE ALERT LEVEL
PEACE WAR

Factbook [url=iiwiki.com/wiki/Corporate_Confederacy]Wiki Article[/url]
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