2nd attempt at a NATO-UF Detente (closed)

[Zarnicovia nova]

Kamala Harris: We want SM and their allies to stop Non-Misinformation, pledging:
to refrain fully from spreading false information, rumours, or unconfirmed reports from intelligence agencies so as to prevent misunderstandings that may cause a rise in tension
to work tirelessly and endlessly to prevent the spread of misinformation, fake news and rumours through further joint cooperation.
Both parties agree to put aside their differences for the purposes of collectively ensuring peace and security in the region.
NATO reforms will happen and all members will cooperate with it.
UF will not try to influence and accuse NATO members and the NATO pledges to do the same.
Starting the trade relations between all parties members.
Cooling off the tensions through the Council Of Nations previously made by Atlantica.
UF will continue their business and NATO will too under international law.
Both sides will refrain from engaging in proxy wars or direct wars.
Both sides will not interfere in each other internal matters.
NAP will remain between both alliances.

"I think this also goes to far. They have their right to say whatever but it should be shown to the open public eye and press for people to amke up their own minds. Again I think that forced trade would be against national sovern."

[Southeast Marajarbia]

Kamala Harris: We want SM and their allies to stop Non-Misinformation, pledging:
to refrain fully from spreading false information, rumours, or unconfirmed reports from intelligence agencies so as to prevent misunderstandings that may cause a rise in tension
to work tirelessly and endlessly to prevent the spread of misinformation, fake news and rumours through further joint cooperation.
Both parties agree to put aside their differences for the purposes of collectively ensuring peace and security in the region.
NATO reforms will happen and all members will cooperate with it.
UF will not try to influence and accuse NATO members and the NATO pledges to do the same.
Starting the trade relations between all parties members.
Cooling off the tensions through the Council Of Nations previously made by Atlantica.
UF will continue their business and NATO will too under international law.
Both sides will refrain from engaging in proxy wars or direct wars.
Both sides will not interfere in each other internal matters.
NAP will remain between both alliances.

Carl Williams: "While this is in line with my already proposed treaty, and even has a lot of the elements involved, I cannot take the word of the United States unless they pledge to do the same."

[Greatest States Of America]

"Firstly, we demand that the United States be removed from leadership and cease denying that they are truly in control. Second, we want the US and France to no longer have veto powers and/or allow ALL reform proposals to at least be voted upon instead of thrown into a trash can. Third, we want a joint council between NATO and UF to be established at the very least to ensure that this does not happen again. Fourth, we want increased trade between NATO and UF members if NATO can ensure to never violate the sovereignty of NATO members again, even if similar events during the war between Vikanias and Meretica ever took place. Finally, we want the US, UK, and France to acknowledge that they have terrorist groups in NATO's ranks, and to apologize for increased aggressive behavior. In exchange, UF will also hold democratic elections for leadership and refrain from attempts to make NATO apart of UF or GA, unless the requests above are violated. We also call for the NAP between both sides to remain in place." Said Carl.

"On the first statement and second statements. I think you don't have to demand anything from NATO it's constition it's members and it's founders when your not even part of it and have shown agreesion and discontent towards it. We as a member of NATO and a powerful country who has much reason to be against US and French control considering their past actions in our country and attempts to colonize it, yet we support the status quo as it gives relative stability and as far as we are concerned only minor abuse as occured. Tho we do admit that abuse is possible maybe some ability for NATO members to veto them out if they abuse. Now on to the third statement, again why should NATO give the UF any power over eachother. I and my country do not disapprove of a joint council just it's purpose. It should be to prevent war not to puppet one allience under another. Fourth by forcing increased trade aren't you already voilating national sovereignty. As far as can see the only people NATO had voilated in anyway shape or form is the GLA which you admit to be a terrorist organization. Finally well i think the final statement is true and should happen but I do think the GLA should be allowed to be able to be in the elections or else a large populus would not get their part it would only be a partial democracy and maybe compromise will deradilize the GLA and allow for a stable democratic state in GAL. Also the stuff above are literally making NATO part of UF/GA. I do think those alliences are good in their own ways it would infringe upon NATO and NATO member sovern. What exactly would a NAP be?"

Kamala Harris: I agree.

[Janpia]

We propose that all proposals will be voted on unless they are illegal by NATO law, that elections in member states and in NATO be free and fair. The UF will guarantee the same thing, and neither alliance will claim sovereignty over each other. The non-aggression pact will be upheld. I'd assume that both alliances do most of these anyway, so I don't see any reason for anyone to reject these. Any questions?

Rep. Konasch: To sum it up yes. We will vote aye on this of it was put forward to vote

[Southeast Marajarbia]

Senator Nome writes a note that is sent to the President, President-elect, Parliament, and the Royal Family.

These talks are a sham. NATO is too ignorant to budge on these matters. Embrace MP Hookstraten's suggestion the moment that this group votes to end the talks. Nothing will come of this.

IC:

Senator Nome: "To get back to the matter at hand, the largest part that needs reform is that one nation holds far more power than any of the others. We have seen in recent years as well as the far past that this is bad for democracy and nations alike. Either the veto power should be removed from NATO or more nations should be given veto power, and this veto power must be approved by a majority of nations with it. Nations with veto power should also be changed every so often so that the same nations aren't always making decisions. Veto powers are not bipartisan; they are clearly partisan in favor of whoever is doing the vetoing.

Additionally, to prevent talks from breaking down in the future, we should make it mandatory for both alliances to see the talks all the way through. Either all talks should require that a vote is used to end a meeting or an agreement must be reached."

"Exactly. Senator Nome not only has a valid point, but also provides evidence of NATO needing to abide partially by the second term in my treaty." Said Carl.

[Zarnicovia nova]

Senator Nome writes a note that is sent to the President, President-elect, Parliament, and the Royal Family.

These talks are a sham. NATO is too ignorant to budge on these matters. Embrace MP Hookstraten's suggestion the moment that this group votes to end the talks. Nothing will come of this.

IC:

Senator Nome: "To get back to the matter at hand, the largest part that needs reform is that one nation holds far more power than any of the others. We have seen in recent years as well as the far past that this is bad for democracy and nations alike. Either the veto power should be removed from NATO or more nations should be given veto power, and this veto power must be approved by a majority of nations with it. Nations with veto power should also be changed every so often so that the same nations aren't always making decisions. Veto powers are not bipartisan; they are clearly partisan in favor of whoever is doing the vetoing.

Additionally, to prevent talks from breaking down in the future, we should make it mandatory for both alliances to see the talks all the way through. Either all talks should require that a vote is used to end a meeting or an agreement must be reached."

"The veto power should be a semi-elected position. With two ideology different countries poccessing it. Both generally powerful and popular amongst(OOC: sussy baka among us) their ideology to be truely bipartisan. Still 2 vetos."

[English Realm]

Dame Sarah MacIntosh CMG, a senior Foreign Office diplomat, arrives at the meeting as the representative of the English Realm. As the country is (SIC) leaning towards the Americans now (end SIC), Sarah will ensure that whatever- if anything- comes of these talks, they do not interfere on English interests. She will not take a side in the meeting directly.

[Greatest States Of America]

Kamala Harris: We want SM and their allies to stop Non-Misinformation, pledging:
to refrain fully from spreading false information, rumours, or unconfirmed reports from intelligence agencies so as to prevent misunderstandings that may cause a rise in tension
to work tirelessly and endlessly to prevent the spread of misinformation, fake news and rumours through further joint cooperation.
Both parties agree to put aside their differences for the purposes of collectively ensuring peace and security in the region.
NATO reforms will happen and all members will cooperate with it.
UF will not try to influence and accuse NATO members and the NATO pledges to do the same.
Starting the trade relations between all parties members.
Cooling off the tensions through the Council Of Nations previously made by Atlantica.
UF will continue their business and NATO will too under international law.
Both sides will refrain from engaging in proxy wars or direct wars.
Both sides will not interfere in each other internal matters.
NAP will remain between both alliances.

Carl Williams: "While this is in line with my already proposed treaty, and even has a lot of the elements involved, I cannot take the word of the United States unless they pledge to do the same."

Kamala Harris: How else is a word given? It clearly states that both sides will be accountable and will pledge and vow the things in the agreement.

[Southeast Marajarbia]

Carl Williams: "While this is in line with my already proposed treaty, and even has a lot of the elements involved, I cannot take the word of the United States unless they pledge to do the same."

Kamala Harris: How else is a word given? It clearly states that both sides will be accountable and will pledge and vow the things in the agreement.

Carl Williams: "I want to hear you and President Biden pledge to this in front of a public and/or "filmed in front of a live-studio" audience, as to me, the United States is untrustworthy. It's either that, my treaty (OOC: With some edits to ensure that everybody gets what they want), or democratic elections within NATO."

[Greatest States Of America]

Senator Nome writes a note that is sent to the President, President-elect, Parliament, and the Royal Family.

These talks are a sham. NATO is too ignorant to budge on these matters. Embrace MP Hookstraten's suggestion the moment that this group votes to end the talks. Nothing will come of this.

IC:

Senator Nome: "To get back to the matter at hand, the largest part that needs reform is that one nation holds far more power than any of the others. We have seen in recent years as well as the far past that this is bad for democracy and nations alike. Either the veto power should be removed from NATO or more nations should be given veto power, and this veto power must be approved by a majority of nations with it. Nations with veto power should also be changed every so often so that the same nations aren't always making decisions. Veto powers are not bipartisan; they are clearly partisan in favor of whoever is doing the vetoing.

Additionally, to prevent talks from breaking down in the future, we should make it mandatory for both alliances to see the talks all the way through. Either all talks should require that a vote is used to end a meeting or an agreement must be reached."

"Exactly. Senator Nome not only has a valid point, but also provides evidence of NATO needing to abide partially by the second term in my treaty." Said Carl.

Kamala Harris: The rules will be the same for everyone. NATO has veto members. France, UK, USA, Eclius, and soon others so that democracy remains. But you can interpret it for your ownself.

[Greatest States Of America]

Kamala Harris: How else is a word given? It clearly states that both sides will be accountable and will pledge and vow the things in the agreement.

Carl Williams: "I want to hear you and President Biden pledge to this in front of a public and/or "filmed in front of a live-studio" audience, as to me, the United States is untrustworthy. It's either that, my treaty (OOC: With some edits to ensure that everybody gets what they want), or democratic elections within NATO."

Kamala Harris: We want Emperor Jackson to do the same.

[Zarnicovia nova]

Kamala Harris: How else is a word given? It clearly states that both sides will be accountable and will pledge and vow the things in the agreement.

Carl Williams: "I want to hear you and President Biden pledge to this in front of a public and/or "filmed in front of a live-studio" audience, as to me, the United States is untrustworthy. It's either that, my treaty (OOC: With some edits to ensure that everybody gets what they want), or democratic elections within NATO."

"What about my proposal for a bipartisan election. where generally leftist and right-wing government elect a left-wing and right-wing veto member to assure bipartisan vetos."

[The Territories of Sealand]

We propose that all proposals will be voted on unless they are illegal by NATO law, that elections in member states and in NATO be free and fair. The UF will guarantee the same thing, and neither alliance will claim sovereignty over each other. The non-aggression pact will be upheld. I'd assume that both alliances do most of these anyway, so I don't see any reason for anyone to reject these. Any questions?

Rep. Konasch: To sum it up yes. We will vote aye on this of it was put forward to vote

We also add that neither side should make accusations without firm evidence, and insults are strictly forbidden, as well as adding Zarnicova Nova's proposal. With that said, would anyone like to add to this proposal, or if there are any objections to this being put to vote? Both sides can add to this, or change elements of this. What matters is that a single resolution on achieving peace is achieved that most agree to. Then, we can go through the future of relations.

[Free Metropolitan France]

Carl Williams: "I want to hear you and President Biden pledge to this in front of a public and/or "filmed in front of a live-studio" audience, as to me, the United States is untrustworthy. It's either that, my treaty (OOC: With some edits to ensure that everybody gets what they want), or democratic elections within NATO."

"What about my proposal for a bipartisan election. where generally leftist and right-wing government elect a left-wing and right-wing veto member to assure bipartisan vetos."

Foreign Minister: It's an alliance, not a government. Veto power is solely for peaceful purposes. Except for SM and Meretican accusations, there has been no problem with it.

[Zarnicovia nova]

"What about my proposal for a bipartisan election. where generally leftist and right-wing government elect a left-wing and right-wing veto member to assure bipartisan vetos."

Foreign Minister: It's an alliance, not a government. Veto power is solely for peaceful purposes. Except for SM and Meretican accusations, there has been no problem with it.

"Yes I know it has no abuse yet but I think that this would well be bipartisan like NATO claims."

[Janpia]

Rep. Konasch: To sum up what we agreed so far:

-To continue the NAP.
-Open up Trade Relations between the 2 alliances
- Ensure democracy through elections
- Both sides will not attempt to influence, accuse, or start misinformation against each other
- Both will settle down differences to ensure peace and security
- Both sides agrees to not start a proxy war

[Free Metropolitan France]

Rep. Konasch: To sum up what we agreed so far:

-To continue the NAP.
-Open up Trade Relations between the 2 alliances
- Ensure democracy through elections
- Both sides will not attempt to influence, accuse, or start misinformation against each other
- Both will settle down differences to ensure peace and security
- Both sides agrees to not start a proxy war

Foreign Minister: 2 isn't needed and unwanted but other than that we agree.

[Southeast Marajarbia]

Rep. Konasch: To sum it up yes. We will vote aye on this of it was put forward to vote

We also add that neither side should make accusations without firm evidence, and insults are strictly forbidden, as well as adding Zarnicova Nova's proposal. With that said, would anyone like to add to this proposal, or if there are any objections to this being put to vote? Both sides can add to this, or change elements of this. What matters is that a single resolution on achieving peace is achieved that most agree to. Then, we can go through the future of relations.

Carl Williams: "I would like to add my proposed treaty to the proposal, replacing the first and second terms with Zarnicovia nova's representative's proposal, and for both sides to publicly pledge to abide by this proposal as replacement for the apology."

[Greatest States Of America]

Rep. Konasch: To sum up what we agreed so far:

-To continue the NAP.
-Open up Trade Relations between the 2 alliances
- Ensure democracy through elections
- Both sides will not attempt to influence, accuse, or start misinformation against each other
- Both will settle down differences to ensure peace and security
- Both sides agrees to not start a proxy war

Foreign Minister: 2 isn't needed and unwanted but other than that we agree.

Kamala Harris: I agree with Foreign Minister.

[Zarnicovia nova]

Rep. Konasch: To sum up what we agreed so far:

-To continue the NAP.
-Open up Trade Relations between the 2 alliances
- Ensure democracy through elections
- Both sides will not attempt to influence, accuse, or start misinformation against each other
- Both will settle down differences to ensure peace and security
- Both sides agrees to not start a proxy war

"We disagree with the trade relations. It should be up to indivual states wether to trade with another country. It would infringe on national sovern. and hurt buisseness in countries which it would be an issue for companies to be forced to make unprofitable and hurtful decisions because of some multi nation deal which the people with suffer from. This is about democracy I beleiv that it should be in a nation's people wether to trade or not."

[Meretica]

Rep. Konasch: To sum up what we agreed so far:

-To continue the NAP.
-Open up Trade Relations between the 2 alliances
- Ensure democracy through elections
- Both sides will not attempt to influence, accuse, or start misinformation against each other
- Both will settle down differences to ensure peace and security
- Both sides agree to not start a proxy war

Senator Nome: "We need to make the NAP permanent as well."

[Free Metropolitan France]

Rep. Konasch: To sum it up yes. We will vote aye on this of it was put forward to vote

We also add that neither side should make accusations without firm evidence, and insults are strictly forbidden, as well as adding Zarnicova Nova's proposal. With that said, would anyone like to add to this proposal, or if there are any objections to this being put to vote? Both sides can add to this, or change elements of this. What matters is that a single resolution on achieving peace is achieved that most agree to. Then, we can go through the future of relations.

Foreign Minister: We'd like to add the proposals made by Janpia and US.

[Southeast Marajarbia]

Rep. Konasch: To sum up what we agreed so far:

-To continue the NAP.
-Open up Trade Relations between the 2 alliances
- Ensure democracy through elections
- Both sides will not attempt to influence, accuse, or start misinformation against each other
- Both will settle down differences to ensure peace and security
- Both sides agrees to not start a proxy war

Carl Williams: "Good to know that both sides agree on something. However, we need confirmation that no aggressive acts will take place, from both GreatOceania and The King Isle"

[Free Metropolitan France]

Rep. Konasch: To sum up what we agreed so far:

-To continue the NAP.
-Open up Trade Relations between the 2 alliances
- Ensure democracy through elections
- Both sides will not attempt to influence, accuse, or start misinformation against each other
- Both will settle down differences to ensure peace and security
- Both sides agrees to not start a proxy war

"We disagree with the trade relations. It should be up to indivual states wether to trade with another country. It would infringe on national sovern. and hurt buisseness in countries which it would be an issue for companies to be forced to make unprofitable and hurtful decisions because of some multi nation deal which the people with suffer from. This is about democracy I beleiv that it should be in a nation's people wether to trade or not."

Foreign Minister: I agree. Trade should be up to the individual nation and its government.

[Greatest States Of America]

Kamala harris: All nations are allowed to do trade as they please we wouldn't enforce it.