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As the Poppies Bloom (TWI ONLY | OOC)

A staging-point for declarations of war and other major diplomatic events. [In character]

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Menna Shuli
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 461
Founded: Feb 22, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Menna Shuli » Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:07 pm

Image

A rough version of the Pueblo Ignacio map. The olive is an olive orchard, the purple is a vineyard. Darker brown is the flood area. Basically.

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Dormill and Stiura
Diplomat
 
Posts: 907
Founded: Sep 19, 2015
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Dormill and Stiura » Fri Mar 15, 2019 5:12 pm

Thuzbekistan wrote:Sorry for the short post, but I wanted to start the naval standoff and didn't have a needed post from AM contacting the commies.

Which frigate in particular attempted the ramming? To clarify the two frigates that were on station were FFH-205 Travis Agthoven and FFH-207 Raphaël Van Horn.
Menna Shuli wrote:(Image)

A rough version of the Pueblo Ignacio map. The olive is an olive orchard, the purple is a vineyard. Darker brown is the flood area. Basically.

Neat map, Menna.
The Fourth Doraltic Republic
Freedom, Unity, Democracy

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Wellsia
Envoy
 
Posts: 207
Founded: Jul 18, 2016
Moralistic Democracy

Postby Wellsia » Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:43 pm

Menna Shuli wrote:Wellsia, I haven't really seen this RP occurring in "real time". I don't think a week has actually occurred for the purposes of the story on the ground. I was basically assuming that the Battle of the Delta is only a few days old, not a week. Otherwise every time I'm left waiting to post seems like a delay that didn't really happen. I don't want there to have been a week between the landing and the attack on Pueblo Ignacio. It would have happened the next day if I wasn't waiting.

EDIT: This isn't me intentionally throwing shade, it's just my military is being made out to be more and more incompetent with each post. They're meant to be underprepared and overconfident, not cartoonishly stupid.


When I get off work tonight I’ll edit it, wasn’t my intention to make them cartoonishly, and will rewrite that as well, just lots of old generals learned one way of doing things and can’t see a better option, WW1, WW2, Korea, Vietnam, both Gulf Wars all have cases of old style generals not wanting to learn new things . Once again I’ll fix it tonight.

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Thuzbekistan
Minister
 
Posts: 2177
Founded: Dec 29, 2017
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Thuzbekistan » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:20 pm

Dormill and Stiura wrote:
Thuzbekistan wrote:Sorry for the short post, but I wanted to start the naval standoff and didn't have a needed post from AM contacting the commies.

Which frigate in particular attempted the ramming? To clarify the two frigates that were on station were FFH-205 Travis Agthoven and FFH-207 Raphaël Van Horn.
Menna Shuli wrote:(Image)

A rough version of the Pueblo Ignacio map. The olive is an olive orchard, the purple is a vineyard. Darker brown is the flood area. Basically.

Neat map, Menna.

Either one
Proud Member of The Western Isles, the Best RP region on NS.
An RP I'm Proud of: Orsandian Civil War
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Economic Left/Right: -5.0
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.72

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Menna Shuli
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Posts: 461
Founded: Feb 22, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Menna Shuli » Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:45 pm

Wellsia wrote:
Menna Shuli wrote:Wellsia, I haven't really seen this RP occurring in "real time". I don't think a week has actually occurred for the purposes of the story on the ground. I was basically assuming that the Battle of the Delta is only a few days old, not a week. Otherwise every time I'm left waiting to post seems like a delay that didn't really happen. I don't want there to have been a week between the landing and the attack on Pueblo Ignacio. It would have happened the next day if I wasn't waiting.

EDIT: This isn't me intentionally throwing shade, it's just my military is being made out to be more and more incompetent with each post. They're meant to be underprepared and overconfident, not cartoonishly stupid.


When I get off work tonight I’ll edit it, wasn’t my intention to make them cartoonishly, and will rewrite that as well, just lots of old generals learned one way of doing things and can’t see a better option, WW1, WW2, Korea, Vietnam, both Gulf Wars all have cases of old style generals not wanting to learn new things . Once again I’ll fix it tonight.

Don't worry about editing it, we'll assume the week was used moving men up the river. It's fine, I had a post I wanted to do about that but I can ditch it and skip to the attack proper once Mik posts.

I didn't mean to be intense about this, but every mention of the Mennan plan by others has played up how dumb it is, especially Mik's posts, and while that's partially the point, it kind of felt like it was just getting piled on. It was kind of slipping to a point where it felt like it wasn't the characters being called dumb but the writer, if you catch my drift. Also, the week of waiting wasn't an intentional choice made IC, it's because of OOC waiting, so that was also a bit weird to me.

The plan Shala came up with works if you have his exact mindset, namely that casualties don't matter if you can drown the enemy in a tide of bodies. He's not stupid, he just doesn't give a shit about keeping his men alive.
Last edited by Menna Shuli on Fri Mar 15, 2019 7:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Miklania
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Founded: Jun 06, 2015
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Miklania » Fri Mar 15, 2019 8:27 pm

I never intended to make it seem like the author wasn't smart. Shala's plan does make sense with that mindset. The mindset is, however, so totally alien to the other military observers that it comes across as carelessness. They don't really understand the Menna and their culture as well as they think they do. I was hoping that was half of what was coming across. Sul is a more competent leader, and I expect that he will be reversing the initial impression made by Shala over time.

I also apologize for the delay in getting things posted, I've had a few papers to do for classes which have been eating away at my writing time. The post should be going up momentarily.

On Government: Checks and balances and ways of stopping things from happening are the only things that provide a stable government and a stable society.

On Democracy: It is a very neutral thing. It can be the best way of ensuring a reasonable government, or it can lead to genocide in the name of 'the people'.

On NSG: I believe the technical term for you people is "malformed conscience".

On society: Until reason and science become cool again, the "enlightened" who profess both but practice neither will continue to gleefully chip away at the bedrock of human society.

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Wellsia
Envoy
 
Posts: 207
Founded: Jul 18, 2016
Moralistic Democracy

Postby Wellsia » Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:30 pm

Menna Shuli wrote:
Wellsia wrote:
When I get off work tonight I’ll edit it, wasn’t my intention to make them cartoonishly, and will rewrite that as well, just lots of old generals learned one way of doing things and can’t see a better option, WW1, WW2, Korea, Vietnam, both Gulf Wars all have cases of old style generals not wanting to learn new things . Once again I’ll fix it tonight.

Don't worry about editing it, we'll assume the week was used moving men up the river. It's fine, I had a post I wanted to do about that but I can ditch it and skip to the attack proper once Mik posts.

I didn't mean to be intense about this, but every mention of the Mennan plan by others has played up how dumb it is, especially Mik's posts, and while that's partially the point, it kind of felt like it was just getting piled on. It was kind of slipping to a point where it felt like it wasn't the characters being called dumb but the writer, if you catch my drift. Also, the week of waiting wasn't an intentional choice made IC, it's because of OOC waiting, so that was also a bit weird to me.

The plan Shala came up with works if you have his exact mindset, namely that casualties don't matter if you can drown the enemy in a tide of bodies. He's not stupid, he just doesn't give a shit about keeping his men alive.


I pictured your men and officers, being much like Soviet or Japanese generals, men counted like ammo, and all that mattered was victory, I never thought of them as dumb, just set in their ways. I was going to use Sul's modification of the plan and out maneuvering the Javerians and Wellsians as a wake up call to the Wellsians and throw the entire Wellsian plan into a flux. Much like European generals were shocked by the Japanese in the opening stages of WW2, overconfidence and conceit doesn't work against a superior enemy.

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Wellsia
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Founded: Jul 18, 2016
Moralistic Democracy

Postby Wellsia » Fri Mar 15, 2019 10:04 pm

Just read Miklania's post, just to give you my idea of the defenders, In my opinion the San Javerian consist of a 'brigade' of some 500 men with only 200 or less actually being soldiers per say, and many of them untrained conscripts. They have only their rifles and one RPG per 20 men, also there are dozen technicals (pickup trucks mounting twin heavy machine guns or a recoilless rifle). This part is completely up to the approval of Menna Shuli. The Wellsians are a Mi'at or half-company of 3 officers and 102 other ranks. one section of 17 is stationed in the building northwest of the town, closest to the flood zone, the rest of the 1st platoon (32 men) is near the vineyard, the second platoon and command unit (56 men) in the village as a general reserve. There is no one in the church. I know it would make a tactical strong point, but it is against Wellsian culture to use a holy place as a military point. The Wellsians have 22 light mortars (18 x 37 mm and 4 x 50 mm) and 10 x 7.62 mm machine guns (8 light SAW, and 2 MMG), plus 2 x 90 mm RR.
Last edited by Wellsia on Sat Mar 16, 2019 1:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Thuzbekistan
Minister
 
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Founded: Dec 29, 2017
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Thuzbekistan » Sat Mar 16, 2019 5:33 am

Mik that was a good post. Really good read.
Proud Member of The Western Isles, the Best RP region on NS.
An RP I'm Proud of: Orsandian Civil War
An INTJ, -A/-T

Economic Left/Right: -5.0
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.72

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Menna Shuli
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Posts: 461
Founded: Feb 22, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Menna Shuli » Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:18 am

Wellsia wrote:Just read Miklania's post, just to give you my idea of the defenders, In my opinion the San Javerian consist of a 'brigade' of some 500 men with only 200 or less actually being soldiers per say, and many of them untrained conscripts. They have only their rifles and one RPG per 20 men, also there are dozen technicals (pickup trucks mounting twin heavy machine guns or a recoilless rifle). This part is completely up to the approval of Menna Shuli. The Wellsians are a Mi'at or half-company of 3 officers and 102 other ranks. one section of 17 is stationed in the building northwest of the town, closest to the flood zone, the rest of the 1st platoon (32 men) is near the vineyard, the second platoon and command unit (56 men) in the village as a general reserve. There is no one in the church. I know it would make a tactical strong point, but it is against Wellsian culture to use a holy place as a military point. The Wellsians have 22 light mortars (18 x 37 mm and 4 x 50 mm) and 10 x 7.62 mm machine guns (8 light SAW, and 2 MMG), plus 2 x 90 mm RR.


There would still be people in the church, as per my post, because your men aren't the only ones there. The regular town militia and local armed forces associated with the government (they couldn't be considered professional soldiers in a real sense) are in attendance as well. This would push the numbers of the defenders towards the 300 mark, maybe even a bit north of that.

My post simply initates the engagement by noting that my soldiers are on the scene. Everyone involved is free to write scenes as required, but the intent here is a costly Mennan victory, only achieved because of the Miklanian followthrough on Sul's plan and luck. The only scene I have in mind is Amikiku and her squad breaking through and taking the church when no one else could, earning them a reputation (and maybe a nickname like "The Bellringers" or something). Aside from that, I'm cool with whatever direction this goes.
Last edited by Menna Shuli on Mon Mar 18, 2019 12:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Almorea
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 112
Founded: May 18, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Almorea » Tue Mar 19, 2019 6:56 am

Great IC posts, I love reading them.

The flare-up between Thuz and D&S puts me in a really awkward position because my leader and Dyson just had a very friendly visit, on the same day of which my top diplomat voiced support for the Thuzbek navy's actions, and a few days before which my legislature passed a pro-MS resolution. This is going the backdrop of confusion as Almorea stumbles to adhere to a coherent policy regarding the San Javier war.
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Miklania
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Founded: Jun 06, 2015
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Miklania » Tue Mar 19, 2019 8:17 am

OOF, good luck with that.

Also, are we starting the naval encounters now? I haven't seen Thuz post much about his movements and Dothrakia is already claiming a run-in between a Doraltic frigate and a Thuzbek corvette.

On Government: Checks and balances and ways of stopping things from happening are the only things that provide a stable government and a stable society.

On Democracy: It is a very neutral thing. It can be the best way of ensuring a reasonable government, or it can lead to genocide in the name of 'the people'.

On NSG: I believe the technical term for you people is "malformed conscience".

On society: Until reason and science become cool again, the "enlightened" who profess both but practice neither will continue to gleefully chip away at the bedrock of human society.

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Menna Shuli
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Posts: 461
Founded: Feb 22, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Menna Shuli » Tue Mar 19, 2019 8:54 am

Miklania wrote:OOF, good luck with that.

Also, are we starting the naval encounters now? I haven't seen Thuz post much about his movements and Dothrakia is already claiming a run-in between a Doraltic frigate and a Thuzbek corvette.


If Thuz says its canon, then we can move forward. Otherwise, Doth will need to edit.

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Thuzbekistan
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Founded: Dec 29, 2017
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Thuzbekistan » Tue Mar 19, 2019 9:48 am

We are still doing it. I've just been incredibly busy.
Proud Member of The Western Isles, the Best RP region on NS.
An RP I'm Proud of: Orsandian Civil War
An INTJ, -A/-T

Economic Left/Right: -5.0
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.72

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Menna Shuli
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Posts: 461
Founded: Feb 22, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Menna Shuli » Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:06 am

Image
Quick Paint edit just to note the attack stuff. Purple areas are where Wellsia noted troop placements, but I figure they'd have moved to defend from the bulk of the attack or we can retcon their locations because the bulk of the attack isn't coming from the north (I was a bit confused as to that placement in the first place). The northwesternmost troops would be smack dab in the middle of the village graveyard, which seems counter to Wellsia's no holy place thing.
Last edited by Menna Shuli on Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Menna Shuli
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Founded: Feb 22, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Menna Shuli » Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:49 am

Oh, I also forgot to add that there are also Menna coming up the road from the south, as that would be where the vehicles and infantry on the river bank would approach from.

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Miklania
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Founded: Jun 06, 2015
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Miklania » Wed Mar 20, 2019 9:53 am

Defenders in the olive orchard and that end of the town would be expected, as the road is the most predictable axis of attack.

On Government: Checks and balances and ways of stopping things from happening are the only things that provide a stable government and a stable society.

On Democracy: It is a very neutral thing. It can be the best way of ensuring a reasonable government, or it can lead to genocide in the name of 'the people'.

On NSG: I believe the technical term for you people is "malformed conscience".

On society: Until reason and science become cool again, the "enlightened" who profess both but practice neither will continue to gleefully chip away at the bedrock of human society.

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Wellsia
Envoy
 
Posts: 207
Founded: Jul 18, 2016
Moralistic Democracy

Postby Wellsia » Wed Mar 20, 2019 12:01 pm

There will be one section of 17 in the vineyard, the rest have assembled south of the church to face the main attack. My commander thinks he is a military genius and that battles are fought strictly by the book, the problem is, he never opened the book.
Last edited by Wellsia on Wed Mar 20, 2019 12:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Balnik
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 164
Founded: Mar 10, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby Balnik » Wed Mar 20, 2019 12:14 pm

After the battle of PI I'll have the Legion mobilize south. They should be present for the next big conflict at that point.
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Menna Shuli
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 461
Founded: Feb 22, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Menna Shuli » Thu Mar 21, 2019 12:40 pm

I wanted Amikiku's whole thing to be only one post, but it got out of hand.

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Miklania
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Founded: Jun 06, 2015
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Miklania » Thu Mar 21, 2019 2:43 pm

Are the helicopters getting shoot at and strafing things Mennan or is that an allusion to the Miklanian force that ought to be heading there about now?

On Government: Checks and balances and ways of stopping things from happening are the only things that provide a stable government and a stable society.

On Democracy: It is a very neutral thing. It can be the best way of ensuring a reasonable government, or it can lead to genocide in the name of 'the people'.

On NSG: I believe the technical term for you people is "malformed conscience".

On society: Until reason and science become cool again, the "enlightened" who profess both but practice neither will continue to gleefully chip away at the bedrock of human society.

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Dormill and Stiura
Diplomat
 
Posts: 907
Founded: Sep 19, 2015
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Dormill and Stiura » Thu Mar 21, 2019 2:46 pm

Alright, I've got posts to write and no real place to start.

At this point in realtime, Doraltic forces are about to begin their attack on Rio Pena, but at the same time I believe that the Mennan and Doraltic forces have finally linked up, with Miklanian and Svalbardian reinforcements due within the next day or two. Additionally, Noro has given me permission to take his AFSBs under his flag down to San Javier, where I will drop off more Doraltic and begin providing Mennan reinforcements as well. However, I want to at least have one or two posts where all the military leaders involved meet while the political leadership meets in MS to establish a joint task force for the operation, making it official.

After all that, I'll have 3-5 posts in Rio Pena where I expect more resistance than just gangbangers so I want to know who I'll be dealing with between Wellsian or Balniki forces before I start writing that arc out.

Thuz, I'll write out a flashback to our naval encounter as told by the captain of the Raphaël Van Horn as he defends his actions to the fleet.
Menna, I think after Rio Pena falls that the Junta will start seriously ramping up its defenses, what kind of an air force do they have that could harm our forces?

Ultimately, upon Menna's assent, I believe that the joint task force and the Javerian defenders will meet thrice more before the RP ends, once on the fields just south of Castillo Verde, in Castillo Verde itself, and finally in Puerto Polo where the junta finally surrenders and its allies scatter back to their home countries before being captured themselves. In the aftermath, I will have news posts about an oil panic happening as prices skyrocket, and push for further military cooperation between Gaeltic and Southern Sea Nations that will begin my journey towards Southern Sea integration. As for San Javier itself, I have two options to go with depending on what y'all want.

1) The joint task force is replaced by a League Peacekeepers force that will remain and facilitate the foundation of a democratic Javerian government. Most of their operations will include ending the cartels and regaining control of Mejures and San Martin.
2) Communist revolutionaries take advantage of the power vacuum to start a new revolution with the aid of TWI's communist powers, culminating in the establishment of a socialist state in San Javier again with massive amounts of aid being sent in from Thuzbekistan, AM, and Brulafi, establishing a communist stronghold in the Southern Sea to counter MSTO and Doraltic influence.
The Fourth Doraltic Republic
Freedom, Unity, Democracy

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Menna Shuli
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Posts: 461
Founded: Feb 22, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Menna Shuli » Thu Mar 21, 2019 2:47 pm

Miklania wrote:Are the helicopters getting shoot at and strafing things Mennan or is that an allusion to the Miklanian force that ought to be heading there about now?

Either or. Your choice.

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Balnik
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 164
Founded: Mar 10, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby Balnik » Thu Mar 21, 2019 3:41 pm

Ah. So it's already been set in stone that SJ will be defeated? That's a shame.
Literal Nationalist

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Menna Shuli
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 461
Founded: Feb 22, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Menna Shuli » Thu Mar 21, 2019 4:18 pm

Balnik wrote:Ah. So it's already been set in stone that SJ will be defeated? That's a shame.

I mean, they don't really have the support not to. All the support they do have is very subtle or small.

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