The Azadistani - Munkchester War [OOC] [MT?] [Closed]

[Rhinocera]

Y’all can’t call us irrational until that lizard attack gets retconned. Besides, Ausitoria and myself (I don’t actually speak for Aus, but I’m making an educated assumption) are trying to be relatively reasonable and haven’t made a move of aggression against anyone. The air attack was an out of the blue move that no ally supports, nor would permit (as evidenced by Aus’s response to it). With these facts considered, along with the fact that Azadistan appears to be a less than seasoned rper, can we just allow the cancellation. If not, it is what it is. Just remember, that’s true for all sides.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

Y’all can’t call us irrational until that lizard attack gets retconned. Besides, Ausitoria and myself (I don’t actually speak for Aus, but I’m making an educated assumption) are trying to be relatively reasonable and haven’t made a move of aggression against anyone. The air attack was an out of the blue move that no ally supports, nor would permit (as evidenced by Aus’s response to it). With these facts considered, along with the fact that Azadistan appears to be a less than seasoned rper, can we just allow the cancellation. If not, it is what it is. Just remember, that’s true for all sides.

I hate to sound unreasonable here, but not really, no. This is a really bad rp move. You can't just control somebodys nation unless he has actually given consent to that, joining an IC organisation does not equate itself with consent.

[Libraria and Ausitoria]

I don’t control the nation. However, as they are in the Commonwealth, and I do control that, for Azadistan to act it (ICly) needs my permission, and I (OOCly) have the absolutely power to choose the Commonwealth’s losses.

Which are zero, as the attack was called off.

@Philipines: As for retconning, the definition of ‘enemy territory’ is sufficiently obscure that they could have been barely entering an adjacent continental shelf. As such I haven’t retconned anything. I’ve just corrected the number of people who are dead.

As for RPing, it may have escaped your notice, but I have about thirty posts to respond to. I will RP it. In my IC post.

If you all could stop arguing so much, I’d actually have time to finish it, which would be grand?

@Beringia: that is one extremely tedious way of doing it. The other ways involve a non-stationary observer and/or altering the bow-wave angle.

Anyway, who’s using lizards? Personally I’m fine with that, although it would be better if there’s some confusion about whether they are actually lizards or a regiment with people who dress up as lizards to terrify their enemies. That way everybody will be free to RP with their own version of reality.

[Ishraq]

Greetings, I have only just discovered this OOC thread.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

I don’t control the nation. However, as they are in the Commonwealth, and I do control that, for Azadistan to act it (ICly) needs my permission, and I (OOCly) have the absolutely power to choose the Commonwealth’s losses.

Which are zero, as the attack was called off.

@Philipines: As for retconning, the definition of ‘enemy territory’ is sufficiently obscure that they could have been barely entering an adjacent continental shelf. As such I haven’t retconned anything. I’ve just corrected the number of people who are dead.

As for RPing, it may have escaped your notice, but I have about thirty posts to respond to. I will RP it. In my IC post.

If you all could stop arguing so much, I’d actually have time to finish it, which would be grand?

@Beringia: that is one extremely tedious way of doing it. The other ways involve a non-stationary observer and/or altering the bow-wave angle.

Anyway, who’s using lizards? Personally I’m fine with that, although it would be better if there’s some confusion about whether they are actually lizards or a regiment with people who dress up as lizards to terrify their enemies. That way everybody will be free to RP with their own version of reality.

Was it a joint decision?
Because a while ago, when I formed a joint nation with Nitom, if he'd decided to do something like that without asking me (or the other way around), results probably wouldn't have been good.

[Neo Philippine Empire]

I don’t control the nation. However, as they are in the Commonwealth, and I do control that, for Azadistan to act it (ICly) needs my permission, and I (OOCly) have the absolutely power to choose the Commonwealth’s losses.

Which are zero, as the attack was called off.

I don't think so.

While Azad is certainly your protectorate, he is a problematic one. Azad acted impulsively ICly without L&A's consent and you failed to control that in the thread. I have no qualms when you say that you have the ability to call off Azad's attacks but as far as I can see, you failed to do that in the thread as well. Since Azad made the attack without the permission of your nation, I think he has the right to dictate his losses on his own.

@Philipines: As for retconning, the definition of ‘enemy territory’ is sufficiently obscure that they could have been barely entering an adjacent continental shelf. As such I haven’t retconned anything. I’ve just corrected the number of people who are dead.

As for RPing, it may have escaped your notice, but I have about thirty posts to respond to. I will RP it. In my IC post.

"Adjacent continental shelf"

Acting like a Lawyer is cool and all but I don't think you know what you're really talking about.

TITE: Airstrikes against Munkchester

Captain Ahmed: I have found the Royal Palace.
Colonel Begunm: ok, fire a blank but then send an actual bomb if they don't leave.

I'm pretty sure no one puts their Royal Palaces on a Continental Shelf.

[Erdoganzstan]

hello brothers I stumbled on this thread

[South Harlonia]

Y’all can’t call us irrational until that lizard attack gets retconned.

1) It's plausible in NS MT
2) It's actually closer to a crocodilian or theropod than to a squamate lizard

Besides, Ausitoria and myself (I don’t actually speak for Aus, but I’m making an educated assumption) are trying to be relatively reasonable and haven’t made a move of aggression against anyone. The air attack was an out of the blue move that no ally supports, nor would permit (as evidenced by Aus’s response to it).

So is Azadistan Aus or not?

With these facts considered, along with the fact that Azadistan appears to be a less than seasoned rper, can we just allow the cancellation. If not, it is what it is. Just remember, that’s true for all sides.

How about No!

Which are zero, as the attack was called off.

Are you Azadistan or not? Because if not then you can't control another players, that's not cool bro.

[Lamoni]

Because I have been asked to help settle the Azadistan dispute, as it relates to L&A attempting to "control" Azadistan...

A player (Nation A) cannot take control of another player's (Nation B) military or other forces without the consent of Nation B. If Nation A were to do so, it would constitute godmodding. The simplest way to end the dispute is to ask Azadistan if they conducted the attack or not. If Azadistan did conduct the attack, then it would be up to Azadistan if they want to continue with the attack, or to retcon it, without any form of coercion.

There have also been questions addressed to me about if L&A has taken over Azadistan's account. While such an action would not be actionable by itself, it is *highly* frowned upon by moderation, as everyone who uses the shared nation can be punished for rule-breaking behavior performed via that account.

If there are further questions, or if someone spots any rule violations, please report such to the Moderation sub-form.

And finally... iModLoom.

[Old Beringia]

@Beringia: that is one extremely tedious way of doing it. The other ways involve a non-stationary observer and/or altering the bow-wave angle.

Right... Ignoring the fact that there's really no way for a plane to receive messages using that method... How exactly does this relate to my plane again?

[Rhinocera]

Y’all can’t call us irrational until that lizard attack gets retconned.

1) It's plausible in NS MT
2) It's actually closer to a crocodilian or theropod than to a squamate lizard

Besides, Ausitoria and myself (I don’t actually speak for Aus, but I’m making an educated assumption) are trying to be relatively reasonable and haven’t made a move of aggression against anyone. The air attack was an out of the blue move that no ally supports, nor would permit (as evidenced by Aus’s response to it).

So is Azadistan Aus or not?

With these facts considered, along with the fact that Azadistan appears to be a less than seasoned rper, can we just allow the cancellation. If not, it is what it is. Just remember, that’s true for all sides.

How about No!

Which are zero, as the attack was called off.

Are you Azadistan or not? Because if not then you can't control another players, that's not cool bro.

I really don’t see how mega croc is plausible for NS MT. Honestly, aerial strike carriers are stretching it, but at least they’re technology. An ancient reptile is fantasy tech.

[South Harlonia]

1) It's plausible in NS MT
2) It's actually closer to a crocodilian or theropod than to a squamate lizard

So is Azadistan Aus or not?

How about No!

Are you Azadistan or not? Because if not then you can't control another players, that's not cool bro.

I really don’t see how mega croc is plausible for NS MT. Honestly, aerial strike carriers are stretching it, but at least they’re technology. An ancient reptile is fantasy tech.

No its the same. NS Earth is huge, much larger than real earth. More abundant resources to support a hyper-predator that don't exist in real earth. Facotrs such as the existence of other massive megafaunal predators & herbivores would necessitate the ecological need for a notch in the trophic pyramid that isn't needed in real earth. Also, keep in mind the dinosaurs didn't die off in everyone's canon.

Of course it doesn't exist in real earth, but it is entirely plausible for NS earth.

[Greater vakolicci haven]

I really don’t see how mega croc is plausible for NS MT. Honestly, aerial strike carriers are stretching it, but at least they’re technology. An ancient reptile is fantasy tech.

No its the same. NS Earth is huge, much larger than real earth. More abundant resources to support a hyper-predator that don't exist in real earth. Facotrs such as the existence of other massive megafaunal predators & herbivores would necessitate the ecological need for a notch in the trophic pyramid that isn't needed in real earth. Also, keep in mind the dinosaurs didn't die off in everyone's canon.

Of course it doesn't exist in real earth, but it is entirely plausible for NS earth.

If people don't agree with a bit of tech you're using it's good play to not use it.

[Libraria and Ausitoria]

I’m inclined to agree using giant crocodile-type dinosaurs in intelligent warfare in ridiculous, if that’s what’s going on?

Azadistan asked me whether Ausitoria would approve an attack. After he or she had ‘started’ it I said no. Subsequently he or she called off the attack. Nobody clarified how far the attack had gone so I thought it was a case of the less said, soonest meanded. I suppose I could ask him or her to retcon the posts instead.

The continental shelf is frequently claimed these days. I don’t have time to go into whether you think I really know what I’m talking about or not, but if you look into it you’ll find I’m right. So it’s really perfectly plausible that the attack never got to its target. Of course Azadistan is as free to control their actions as Ausitoria is to eject them from the Commonwealth.

Anyway, Philipines, I have not failed to do anything. I have simply not yet showed how I did it. Please, please, please be patient.

@Beringia: I’ll explain later. Nothing of immediate significance.

As for those of you who keep telegraming me, stop it. Can’t you see I’m too busy?

[Libraria and Ausitoria]

@Aresin: You’re on a canal which can take ships. The Commonwealth thinks it unecessary and won’t approve it. Instead they will guarantee Aresin’s right to sale ships down from the lakes.

I’ll include all that in my next next post.

[South Harlonia]

I’m inclined to agree using giant crocodile-type dinosaurs in intelligent warfare in ridiculous, if that’s what’s going on?

What is happening is that I am deploying a creation that isnt feasible with finite real earth resources and constraints but is entirely hypothetically possible with NS earth boundless resources.

[Neo Philippine Empire]

Anyway, Philipines, I have not failed to do anything. I have simply not yet showed how I did it. Please, please, please be patient.

Objectively speaking, you failed to do anything.

If you claim that you haven't shown anything as of now, you're simply limited to claims. What's happening right now is that you haven't posted in the IC and you most likely claim that the attacks were rescinded via in the OOC. And of course, I think that mere claims without a post are not acceptable. I don't even need to be patient because the event already occurred, you can't do something about it in the thread even if you posted.

[Neo Philippine Empire]

Azadistan asked me whether Ausitoria would approve an attack. After he or she had ‘started’ it I said no. Subsequently he or she called off the attack. Nobody clarified how far the attack had gone so I thought it was a case of the less said, soonest meanded. I suppose I could ask him or her to retcon the posts instead.

The continental shelf is frequently claimed these days. I don’t have time to go into whether you think I really know what I’m talking about or not, but if you look into it you’ll find I’m right. So it’s really perfectly plausible that the attack never got to its target. Of course Azadistan is as free to control their actions as Ausitoria is to eject them from the Commonwealth.

Of course, this is another form of OOC warfare that I have mentioned. Ausitoria hasn't posted something that stopped Azadistan from attacking. You can't really retcon the post unless both parties(Azad and Munkchester) are involved in the decision making.

There are instances that the situation you mentioned did occur on other RPs but this isn't the case of Azad. It's not plausible that the attack never got to its target because Azad mentioned where the attack happened. (Reposting it in case you missed)

TITE: Airstrikes against Munkchester

Captain Ahmed: I have found the Royal Palace.
Colonel Begunm: ok, fire a blank but then send an actual bomb if they don't leave.

How interesting, is Ausitoria on the process booting out Azadistan from the Commonwealth? Why did you even make Azad your protectorate in the first place? I'm pretty sure there are more useful nations to turn into a protectorate. I don't see any reason to control an unstable nation that wouldn't give you many opportunities in the future.

[Aresin]

@Aresin: You’re on a canal which can take ships. The Commonwealth thinks it unecessary and won’t approve it. Instead they will guarantee Aresin’s right to sale ships down from the lakes.

I’ll include all that in my next next post.

I was never told of any canal, nor do I want one or acknowledge one existing in my nation. Furthermore, even if Azadistan is a part of the commonwealth, as you stated earlier you do not control the nation, which owns the land given to me. It was Azadistan's call, and he made it. If you don't like that, you should settle it IC.

[Old Beringia]

@Beringia: I’ll explain later. Nothing of immediate significance.

If you plan on responding to it by doing something funky you could just explain before you waste time writing it.

I’m inclined to agree using giant crocodile-type dinosaurs in intelligent warfare in ridiculous, if that’s what’s going on?

Aestorian scientists seem to be pretty creative with pushing the boundaries of what's possible. The scientists of South Harlonia could be the same way as far as biological/genetic engineering. I'd be okay with accepting it in my canon.

[Aresin]

I’m inclined to agree using giant crocodile-type dinosaurs in intelligent warfare in ridiculous, if that’s what’s going on?

Aestorian scientists seem to be pretty creative with pushing the boundaries of what's possible. The scientists of South Harlonia could be the same way as far as biological/genetic engineering. I'd be okay with accepting it in my canon.

I mean, it ain't exactly fair for our side to have giant robots and space ships, only for them to not be allowed to have a crocodile.

[Rhinocera]

@Beringia: I’ll explain later. Nothing of immediate significance.

If you plan on responding to it by doing something funky you could just explain before you waste time writing it.

I’m inclined to agree using giant crocodile-type dinosaurs in intelligent warfare in ridiculous, if that’s what’s going on?

Aestorian scientists seem to be pretty creative with pushing the boundaries of what's possible. The scientists of South Harlonia could be the same way as far as biological/genetic engineering. I'd be okay with accepting it in my canon.

Building an airship that lacks practical maneuverability is one thing (I’m not up to date on the specifics of the craft to be honest) but with other stuff that’s been deployed in this thread it’s nothing. We’ve got Gundams, mega lizards, aerial strike carriers, and AA rail weaponry. I’m all for scaling it back a bit, but y’all gotta recognize the ridiculousness as well. Whatever happened to conventional military armaments? Is a catch a lady falling into a volcano with a net drone from the atmosphere realistic? I’d lean towards no, but neither is half the stuff I’ve seen deployed here. I mean I’ll live with some of it, but I gotta draw a line at giant lizard monsters and gundams.

[Aresin]

If you plan on responding to it by doing something funky you could just explain before you waste time writing it.


Aestorian scientists seem to be pretty creative with pushing the boundaries of what's possible. The scientists of South Harlonia could be the same way as far as biological/genetic engineering. I'd be okay with accepting it in my canon.

Building an airship that lacks practical maneuverability is one thing (I’m not up to date on the specifics of the craft to be honest) but with other stuff that’s been deployed in this thread it’s nothing. We’ve got Gundams, mega lizards, aerial strike carriers, and AA rail weaponry. I’m all for scaling it back a bit, but y’all gotta recognize the ridiculousness as well. Whatever happened to conventional military armaments? Is a catch a lady falling into a volcano with a net drone from the atmosphere realistic? I’d lean towards no, but neither is half the stuff I’ve seen deployed here. I mean I’ll live with some of it, but I gotta draw a line at giant lizard monsters and gundams.

I mean, it's pretty well established that this isn't hard realistic MT though. Plus, scaling it back now would kind of mess up everyone's tempo, since it'll retcon pretty much everything. I propose we try to find a middle ground. Perhaps we can find a piece of fiction, like a video game or movie, and say that it's the limit for technology. IE: CoD Black Ops 2.

[South Harlonia]

If you plan on responding to it by doing something funky you could just explain before you waste time writing it.


Aestorian scientists seem to be pretty creative with pushing the boundaries of what's possible. The scientists of South Harlonia could be the same way as far as biological/genetic engineering. I'd be okay with accepting it in my canon.

Building an airship that lacks practical maneuverability is one thing (I’m not up to date on the specifics of the craft to be honest) but with other stuff that’s been deployed in this thread it’s nothing. We’ve got Gundams, mega lizards, aerial strike carriers, and AA rail weaponry. I’m all for scaling it back a bit, but y’all gotta recognize the ridiculousness as well. Whatever happened to conventional military armaments? Is a catch a lady falling into a volcano with a net drone from the atmosphere realistic? I’d lean towards no, but neither is half the stuff I’ve seen deployed here. I mean I’ll live with some of it, but I gotta draw a line at giant lizard monsters and gundams.

A bit hypocritical.

I have already explained how Soriue is plausible without the constraints of real earth resource scarcity.

[Old Beringia]

If you plan on responding to it by doing something funky you could just explain before you waste time writing it.


Aestorian scientists seem to be pretty creative with pushing the boundaries of what's possible. The scientists of South Harlonia could be the same way as far as biological/genetic engineering. I'd be okay with accepting it in my canon.

Building an airship that lacks practical maneuverability is one thing (I’m not up to date on the specifics of the craft to be honest) but with other stuff that’s been deployed in this thread it’s nothing. We’ve got Gundams, mega lizards, aerial strike carriers, and AA rail weaponry. I’m all for scaling it back a bit, but y’all gotta recognize the ridiculousness as well. Whatever happened to conventional military armaments? Is a catch a lady falling into a volcano with a net drone from the atmosphere realistic? I’d lean towards no, but neither is half the stuff I’ve seen deployed here. I mean I’ll live with some of it, but I gotta draw a line at giant lizard monsters and gundams.

Practical maneuvability is the least of your concerns. That ship is supposedly 3km long, that is over seven times the height of the original WTC, and 2km wide. Just two of them could cover the entirety of LAX and most other international airports. And it supposedly flies at Mach 8. How you consider that tame by comparison to even a railgun is beyond me.