Stille Nacht: Crown's Burden [OOC][MT]

[The Manticoran Empire]

Correction, Gerald Ford class carrier

OK. That makes more sense.

[West-Phalia]

Nation/Organisation/Character: Fiefdom of West-Phalia
Alignment (Phallia/Atla/Neutral): New Phallia
What do you plan to do?: I plan to help reinforce the border between Phallia and Atla, to decrease the likelihood of a successful enemy counterattack.
RP Sample: https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=395428

Orbat: https://www.nationstates.net/nation=west-phalia/detail=factbook/id=788513

I thought you would be on Atla's side since you broke away from new Phallia? haha

A: West-Phalia didn't really break away from New Phallia, we just kinda left. Also, we still consider the people of New Phallia as brethren, and consider the Atlish as savages.

[West-Phalia]

Nation/Organisation/Character: Fiefdom of West-Phalia
Alignment (Phallia/Atla/Neutral): New Phallia
What do you plan to do?: I plan to help reinforce the border between Phallia and Atla, to decrease the likelihood of a successful enemy counterattack.
RP Sample: https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=395428

Orbat: https://www.nationstates.net/nation=west-phalia/detail=factbook/id=788513

I hate to nitpick but your order of battle is weird. Your divisions have the strength of brigades and some only battalions. In addition, the ration of men to vehicles is all out of whack. Your Verletzung der Infanterie Corps. It has the right personnel strength with 32,000 men but with only 3 vehicles it is the most underequipped corps I have ever seen. Do your guys march everywhere? A general rule of tactical organization is as follows:
Team: 2-4 soldiers
Squad: 8-10 soldiers
Section: 12-18 soldiers
Platoon: 20-50 soldiers
Company: 60-190 soldiers
Battalion: 300-1,000 soldiers
Regiment: 1,500-2,000 soldiers
Brigade: 3,000-5,000 soldiers
Division: 10,000-15,000 soldiers
Corps: 20,000-45,000 soldiers
Field Army: 80,000+

A good rule of thumb for vehicles is that a brigade level force should have about 500 armored vehicles, with the breakdown depending on whether it is light infantry, mechanized, or armored. An armored force should have about 100 tanks and 100 tracked armored fighting vehicles. A mechanized force should have about 300 tracked or wheeled armored fighting vehicles and light infantry should be entirely uparmored general purpose wheeled vehicles, such as Humvees, Tigrs, and MRAPs.

The reason the Verletzung der Infanterie have so few armoured vehicles is because the Verletzung are basically engineers. the Verletzung are sort of modeled after WWI Stormtroopers, troops that can quickly swarm they're way into fortified enemy positions. Another thing, I don't put light vehicles, such as Humvees, on the Orbat. 'Armoured Vehicle' in my case really only means, 'artillery and tanks'. But now that I think about it, I probably should model light vehicles onto the Orbat, so thanks for the tip.

[Murovanka]

@Noveos, good post, I take it you attacked a city grids and government servers? I can reply to that. Will help the Crown Prince convince the cabinet to invade.

Nation/Organisation/Character: Fiefdom of West-Phalia
Alignment (Phallia/Atla/Neutral): New Phallia
What do you plan to do?: I plan to help reinforce the border between Phallia and Atla, to decrease the likelihood of a successful enemy counterattack.
RP Sample: https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=395428

Orbat: https://www.nationstates.net/nation=west-phalia/detail=factbook/id=788513

Yay, West Phalia to the East of New Phallia comes to help...

I believe Westphallians left New Phallia after political turmoil in the 30s, so they were the aristocracy and middle class and religious who left to save their wealth from the rampaging proletariat. I could see why the two of us would be friendly, but that means we can't have island disputes and wars.

What Manticora posted about military organization is right, though it's not simple and we can work with it. However there's a deployment limit on 1-2 brigades (10k men).

Why do people keep assuming they'll have air superiority. I already have a practical Lyndon Johnson class carrier off the coast of phallia with 5th gen fighters, plus two more on the way. Y'all are gonna have to fight for air superiority

To be clear, Achesia agreed to do the dam operation, which means we will have near air superiority over the Wein river at the start of conflict. Control for air will otherwise be contested.

Artillery you mean? Sure, just keep in mind it will b protected to some degree against insurgent attack but so far they've been rather incapable so security is lax.

Artillery, communications equipment, vehicles. In addition, this isn't an insurgent group but something more like Delta Force or SEALs.

I am also considering moving a carrier strike group into the area to "protect the Empire's commercial interests".

As of now only christo and twelve are permitted to send fleets. Do you want to join the battle and for what reason? It will just be a bit too cluttered with many fleets.

[Christoslavia]

Muro that was in response to Novels claiming air superiority.

[Christoslavia]

There have been multiple people who are claiming air superiority especially those comparing this to desert storm for whatever reason

[Murovanka]

Muro that was in response to Novels claiming air superiority.

Am aware, as I said we will talk it through, once noveos releases the battle plan it will roughly go along those lines.

Would you like to do the landing operation in the dam, or would you like to Westphalia? Basically as we advance up the Wein river Atla may look to opening the dam and flood The Valley. The commando battalion will have to hold the dam against a brigades worth of enemies with air support (NP Air Force will concentrate on Valley and so get air superiority there.

[Christoslavia]

I can have my battalion do it, hell they might go down in a blaze of glory action movie style or they miraculously hold the dam. Either way they all knew that this might very well be a suicide mission and are willing to do what it takes.

[The Manticoran Empire]

@Noveos, good post, I take it you attacked a city grids and government servers? I can reply to that. Will help the Crown Prince convince the cabinet to invade.

Nation/Organisation/Character: Fiefdom of West-Phalia
Alignment (Phallia/Atla/Neutral): New Phallia
What do you plan to do?: I plan to help reinforce the border between Phallia and Atla, to decrease the likelihood of a successful enemy counterattack.
RP Sample: https://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=395428

Orbat: https://www.nationstates.net/nation=west-phalia/detail=factbook/id=788513

Yay, West Phalia to the East of New Phallia comes to help...

I believe Westphallians left New Phallia after political turmoil in the 30s, so they were the aristocracy and middle class and religious who left to save their wealth from the rampaging proletariat. I could see why the two of us would be friendly, but that means we can't have island disputes and wars.

What Manticora posted about military organization is right, though it's not simple and we can work with it. However there's a deployment limit on 1-2 brigades (10k men).

Why do people keep assuming they'll have air superiority. I already have a practical Lyndon Johnson class carrier off the coast of phallia with 5th gen fighters, plus two more on the way. Y'all are gonna have to fight for air superiority

To be clear, Achesia agreed to do the dam operation, which means we will have near air superiority over the Wein river at the start of conflict. Control for air will otherwise be contested.

Artillery, communications equipment, vehicles. In addition, this isn't an insurgent group but something more like Delta Force or SEALs.

I am also considering moving a carrier strike group into the area to "protect the Empire's commercial interests".

As of now only christo and twelve are permitted to send fleets. Do you want to join the battle and for what reason? It will just be a bit too cluttered with many fleets.

First of all it is a Carrier Strike Group, not a fleet. Secondly, it is a show of force to protect the commercial interests of the Empire *cough*and provide air support for my commandos*cough*. I'm not going to join the battle itself unless absolutely necessary.

[The Manticoran Empire]

There have been multiple people who are claiming air superiority especially those comparing this to desert storm for whatever reason

After learning more, I'm thinking this will end up more like Vietnam or Korea.

[Christoslavia]

There have been multiple people who are claiming air superiority especially those comparing this to desert storm for whatever reason

After learning more, I'm thinking this will end up more like Vietnam or Korea.

Technically a fleet can be considered anything more than 1 vessel

[Achesia]

The only two people who are going to manage to get air superiority are me or Muro, because we have the advantage of this being home field. Everyone else is just supporting either side.

[The Manticoran Empire]

After learning more, I'm thinking this will end up more like Vietnam or Korea.

Technically a fleet can be considered anything more than 1 vessel

Technically Lichtenstein has an Army. In reality, it's more like a brigade. A Fleet is comprised of multiple groups, which themselves are comprised of several squadrons. A carrier strike group has a supercarrier, cruiser squadron, destroyer squadron, sometimes an attack submarine squadron, and a carrier air wing.

[Achesia]

@Noveos, good post, I take it you attacked a city grids and government servers? I can reply to that. Will help the Crown Prince convince the cabinet to invade.



Yay, West Phalia to the East of New Phallia comes to help...

I believe Westphallians left New Phallia after political turmoil in the 30s, so they were the aristocracy and middle class and religious who left to save their wealth from the rampaging proletariat. I could see why the two of us would be friendly, but that means we can't have island disputes and wars.

What Manticora posted about military organization is right, though it's not simple and we can work with it. However there's a deployment limit on 1-2 brigades (10k men).



To be clear, Achesia agreed to do the dam operation, which means we will have near air superiority over the Wein river at the start of conflict. Control for air will otherwise be contested.



As of now only christo and twelve are permitted to send fleets. Do you want to join the battle and for what reason? It will just be a bit too cluttered with many fleets.

First of all it is a Carrier Strike Group, not a fleet. Secondly, it is a show of force to protect the commercial interests of the Empire *cough*and provide air support for my commandos*cough*. I'm not going to join the battle itself unless absolutely necessary.

Ya I'm with Muro, no naval forces from Manticore. We have enough of that. Just stick to SF.

[The Manticoran Empire]

I hate to nitpick but your order of battle is weird. Your divisions have the strength of brigades and some only battalions. In addition, the ration of men to vehicles is all out of whack. Your Verletzung der Infanterie Corps. It has the right personnel strength with 32,000 men but with only 3 vehicles it is the most underequipped corps I have ever seen. Do your guys march everywhere? A general rule of tactical organization is as follows:
Team: 2-4 soldiers
Squad: 8-10 soldiers
Section: 12-18 soldiers
Platoon: 20-50 soldiers
Company: 60-190 soldiers
Battalion: 300-1,000 soldiers
Regiment: 1,500-2,000 soldiers
Brigade: 3,000-5,000 soldiers
Division: 10,000-15,000 soldiers
Corps: 20,000-45,000 soldiers
Field Army: 80,000+

A good rule of thumb for vehicles is that a brigade level force should have about 500 armored vehicles, with the breakdown depending on whether it is light infantry, mechanized, or armored. An armored force should have about 100 tanks and 100 tracked armored fighting vehicles. A mechanized force should have about 300 tracked or wheeled armored fighting vehicles and light infantry should be entirely uparmored general purpose wheeled vehicles, such as Humvees, Tigrs, and MRAPs.

The reason the Verletzung der Infanterie have so few armoured vehicles is because the Verletzung are basically engineers. the Verletzung are sort of modeled after WWI Stormtroopers, troops that can quickly swarm they're way into fortified enemy positions. Another thing, I don't put light vehicles, such as Humvees, on the Orbat. 'Armoured Vehicle' in my case really only means, 'artillery and tanks'. But now that I think about it, I probably should model light vehicles onto the Orbat, so thanks for the tip.

So 32,000 engineers have fewer armored engineer vehicles than most engineer battalions?

[The Manticoran Empire]

First of all it is a Carrier Strike Group, not a fleet. Secondly, it is a show of force to protect the commercial interests of the Empire *cough*and provide air support for my commandos*cough*. I'm not going to join the battle itself unless absolutely necessary.

Ya I'm with Muro, no naval forces from Manticore. We have enough of that. Just stick to SF.

Aw. Can I bring ships in later? Cause it wouldn't really make sense for a country that has the ability to SF forces several hundred kilometers inland to not also want to protect their economic interests in said region.

[Achesia]

Ya I'm with Muro, no naval forces from Manticore. We have enough of that. Just stick to SF.

Aw. Can I bring ships in later? Cause it wouldn't really make sense for a country that has the ability to SF forces several hundred kilometers inland to not also want to protect their economic interests in said region.

No, sorry. We just have enough forces cluttering the situation as it is.

[The Manticoran Empire]

Aw. Can I bring ships in later? Cause it wouldn't really make sense for a country that has the ability to SF forces several hundred kilometers inland to not also want to protect their economic interests in said region.

No, sorry. We just have enough forces cluttering the situation as it is.

Damn.

[The Twelve Isles]

Hey Achesia, what do you have in mind for my deploying soldiers?

Should I just send them in and we assume that arrangements have already been made between our nations, or should we actually go about making the arrangements IC?

Just assume arrangements have been made. I'd bring them into Haslet.

Cool. My post should be up tonight.

[Achesia]

Just assume arrangements have been made. I'd bring them into Haslet.

Cool. My post should be up tonight.

Can you hold off until I make my mobilization post possibly? Should be doing that tomorrow.

[The Manticoran Empire]

I'll finish my post about the firebase tomorrow and probably also include some news reports and home front stuff.

[The Twelve Isles]

Cool. My post should be up tonight.

Can you hold off until I make my mobilization post possibly? Should be doing that tomorrow.

Sorry, I posted it before I saw this.

I can edit it after you post if you want, so they work better together.

[Christoslavia]

Alright heres my ORBAT M8's


Christoslavian ORBAT

Army

14th Guerilla Warfare Regiment, 1st Battalion ~467 soldiers

Marine Corps

17th Mechanized Regiment ~4,000 Marines including 70 F-93 MBT's, 150 F-95 MRAP's, 50 F-30 LAV's, 50 F-71 AFV's, 15 T-9 Mobile AA Platforms
14th Infantry Regiment ~4,000 Marines, 250 F-95 MRAP's, 95 F-70 APC's, 50 F-1 Howitzers

Navy

3rd Naval Group
Halcyon Class Advanced Destroyers x2

Dominator Class Heavy Frigates x3

Purgatory Class Advanced Cruisers x2

Leviathan Class Nuclear Submarines x1 (Ballistic variant)

1 Victory Class Supercarrier
(Each Supercarrier has the capacity to carry up to 80+ aircraft of varying types. For this it will be S-79 Heavy Attack Helicopters x25, H-3 All Weather Stealth Multirole Fighter STOVL x 12, and H-1 Multirole Combat Jet x 35

7th Naval Group
Halcyon Class Advanced Destroyers x2

Dominator Class Heavy Frigates x3

Purgatory Class Advanced Cruisers x2

Leviathan Class Nuclear Submarines x1 (Cruise variant)

12th Naval Group
Halcyon Class Advanced Destroyers x2

Dominator Class Heavy Frigates x3

Purgatory Class Advanced Cruisers x2

Leviathan Class Nuclear Submarines (Attack variant) x1

14th Auxiliary Fleet
Mako Class Amphibious Assault Ship x5

Dominator Class Heavy Guided Missile Frigate x6

Supply Ships x20

Links to factbooks https://www.nationstates.net/nation=christoslavia/detail=factbook/id=753984
https://www.nationstates.net/nation=christoslavia/detail=factbook/id=786508

[Murovanka]

-snip-

Looks fine, but I did say you're limited to one carrier and Twelve to two. I don't like telling people what they can/can't do but everyone can handwave another dozen carrier groups and we'll end up with a numberwank. However, depending on outcome of the first battle (which can go either way IMO) following that yes we can consider reinforcements for a round 2.

Apologies for any misunderstanding, but please retcon the deployment of more fleets apart frmo the 3rd Naval Group; they can possibly be en route but won't arrive before the Isles ships come.

A naval battle, if that is what this is going to happen, will be:

New Phallian, Christoslavian and possibly Westphalian Navies against Twelve Isles. Engagement area off the coast of New Phallia and south of Westphalia, roughly 300-500km from mainland (that's standoff distance I think?). Isles has 2 carriers and Christo has one, the Phallian navies will mainly use missile boats/land based Ashms/strike fighters.

The closer Islish carriers get the easier it is for NPAF to attack his ships, there will be islands too where Phallian air forces can jump off which could be an Islish target. I suggest we make a separate map for navy stuff.

Does that sound fair?

---

Politically, an effective blockade would:
- cut NP off from reinforcements from Christo
- cut NP off from crucial oil and weapons imports
- in the long term damage economy as trade is halted

To consider is that Islish ships need to stay far off to be safe from NPAF strikes, but that also means that NP could have blockade runners carrying crucial supplies evade more easily.

[Murovanka]

One more thing regarding the cyberattack:

Unless Noveos or allies admit it, nobody knows who did it (goes for you CHristo I think). It's not that easy to trace who launched an attack and NP cybersecurity isn't that good to identify, so for now NP will blame Atla.