OOC: Things to do in Caracasus before you die (MT/PMT/Dip)

[Flauc]

I think a Flauc 'victory' would be the mot interesting option..

What do you mean?

[Caracasus]

Don't worry, I wasn't relying on Tekeristani military support in this.

A border skirmish - that's possible - we'll have to have a think about how that'd go down.

Flaucese victory, duh.

Flauc attacks after the de facto mobilization? But how and who wins and how does the conflict stop?

The thing is, Caracasus is mobilizing its armed forces. If an attack happens, I genuinely can't see it ending until after a long, drawn out and bloody war. It'd be nice to avoid such a thing.

Caracasus isn't ever going to not mobilize because one of their neighbours said "don't mobilize".

[Tekeristan]

I think a Flauc 'victory' would be the mot interesting option..

What do you mean?

Show em their tech doesn't mean everything, I suppose.
Reminders of the true horrors of war, etc.

[Caracasus]

What do you mean?

Show em their tech doesn't mean everything, I suppose.
Reminders of the true horrors of war, etc.

Caracasus had more than enough of that in Oehiton.

[Flauc]

Show em their tech doesn't mean everything, I suppose.
Reminders of the true horrors of war, etc.

Caracasus had more than enough of that in Oehiton.

No, but it would be cool to see Flauc occupy parts of Northern Osirio and have Caracasusian government beg for peace. Flauc would accept peace as a gesture of "humanity". Marela knows very well he can't occupy all of Caracasus.

[Significance]

Hacking my systems: The normal rules for Carosi apply in the virtual reality as well. If you enter and do stuff without my permission I control your characters and decide what happens to them. Including deaht and mutilation.

Want to proceed hacking Carosi's systems? (Y/N)

The Conference: Another OOC warning. Your characters are still outside Carosi territory. Once they are in, you can RP them just normal. The standard rules apply. They might commit some "involuntary actions" for one reason or the other. If such an action occurs there is not much use protesting it in OOC, simply continue to RP her with her remorse or disbelieve of the past action. While this can occur, it does not necessarily have to. Remember that anything can happen to the characters. This is particularly important for Balagan and Significance as you have both send your heads of state. They can die and they can be mutilated and they can become insane. Keep that in mind if you wish to continue. What happens to them largely depends on your action. Heroic but stupid actions like attacking a group of armed guards with a knife in hopes of overwhelming them can and most likely will lead to the death of the character in this RP. PCs are free to kill each other though this is highly discouraged. A dead character ends this RP for the player. Therefore their chances of survival are relatively high. I hope that this will clarify things and that you will continue anyway to come to Carosi.

About the hacking. Maybe I can clarify for everyone. I say I did something, not giving specifics in the post, but a broad overview of what just happened. It's up to everyone else to fill in the specifics. Yes I suppose it's doing something without your permission, but you still have the choice of what I did, kind of like a compromise.

If Carosi insists on playing their own game, perhaps you could say I found only want you wanted me to find, like a red herring.

About the conference. Anything but death. Mortally injured, multilated and insane put together but not death. I can 'fix' to an extent any damage you cause to her but not death. Maybe even have something protecting her seeing as I already laid the groundwork for it unintentionally, to explain why she survives. Up to you but as I said, I will pay the price anyway you like for her not being able to die, just don't kill her. Fair?

[Tekeristan]

Show em their tech doesn't mean everything, I suppose.
Reminders of the true horrors of war, etc.

Caracasus had more than enough of that in Oehiton.

Never truly participated until the very, very end, did they?

Never had hundreds simply vanish, to have hundreds more captured & never be released..

Happy happy joy joy!

[Caracasus]

Caracasus had more than enough of that in Oehiton.

No, but it would be cool to see Flauc occupy parts of Northern Osirio and have Caracasusian government beg for peace. Flauc would accept peace as a gesture of "humanity". Marela knows very well he can't occupy all of Caracasus.

How would you win though? Caracasus =/= the Karthos Soviet. Caracasusians might well seek peace and multilateral agreements but...

You'd be invading a mountainous province. You'd be going up against a technologically advanced nation with a strong cultural tradition of resisting invaders and what they feel as imperialism. An invasion would also trigger a total war - there is absolutely no way that invading Caracasus wouldn't result in that.

[Caracasus]

Caracasus had more than enough of that in Oehiton.

Never truly participated until the very, very end, did they?

Never had hundreds simply vanish, to have hundreds more captured & never be released..

Happy happy joy joy!

No. They had aid freigters sunk, aid workers kidnapped and executed, Caracasusian civilians used as human shields, aid workers shelled with poison gas, kidnappings, assassinations and so forth.

And at that stage, Caracasus was not an aggressor.

[Tekeristan]

Mhm, fair.

Although if Flauc had an advantage.. Decisiveness, I guess.

[Significance]

No, but it would be cool to see Flauc occupy parts of Northern Osirio and have Caracasusian government beg for peace. Flauc would accept peace as a gesture of "humanity". Marela knows very well he can't occupy all of Caracasus.

How would you win though? Caracasus =/= the Karthos Soviet. Caracasusians might well seek peace and multilateral agreements but...

You'd be invading a mountainous province. You'd be going up against a technologically advanced nation with a strong cultural tradition of resisting invaders and what they feel as imperialism. An invasion would also trigger a total war - there is absolutely no way that invading Caracasus wouldn't result in that.

Why invade from that end of the border. Saruwa essential allows Flauc to march troops through Parsoh and Menthi, as long as he helps them in some way I'd presume, and attack at that end of the border. Then Menthi looks like the aggressor anyway. Some might actually believe that. Might. Tell me what you think of that suggestion.

[Tekeristan]

To continue the clarification, the GTP-led Tekeristan will still be rather cooperative with Maltsi & the remnants of Karthos.

[Caracasus]

How would you win though? Caracasus =/= the Karthos Soviet. Caracasusians might well seek peace and multilateral agreements but...

You'd be invading a mountainous province. You'd be going up against a technologically advanced nation with a strong cultural tradition of resisting invaders and what they feel as imperialism. An invasion would also trigger a total war - there is absolutely no way that invading Caracasus wouldn't result in that.

Why invade from that end of the border. Saruwa essential allows Flauc to march troops through Parsoh and Menthi, as long as he helps them in some way I'd presume, and attack at that end of the border. Then Menthi looks like the aggressor anyway. Some might actually believe that. Might. Tell me what you think of that suggestion.

Well, that might be tricky. The borders to the peninsula are probably going to be guarded as well.

[Significance]

Why invade from that end of the border. Saruwa essential allows Flauc to march troops through Parsoh and Menthi, as long as he helps them in some way I'd presume, and attack at that end of the border. Then Menthi looks like the aggressor anyway. Some might actually believe that. Might. Tell me what you think of that suggestion.

Well, that might be tricky. The borders to the peninsula are probably going to be guarded as well.

Yes but your not expecting an attack that way are you. Plus, most of your troops will be at the other end for the likely attack.

With how your country is run, by the time you managed to redeploy to the new threat, Flauc would have taken quite a bit of territory, especially if he pushes forward as fast as possible.

I can't believe I'm helping Flauc plan a war.

Shame I gave up on military actually.....

Maybe if it does go south I'll lend a hand, this time with a proper army.

[Flauc]

No, but it would be cool to see Flauc occupy parts of Northern Osirio and have Caracasusian government beg for peace. Flauc would accept peace as a gesture of "humanity". Marela knows very well he can't occupy all of Caracasus.

How would you win though? Caracasus =/= the Karthos Soviet. Caracasusians might well seek peace and multilateral agreements but...

You'd be invading a mountainous province. You'd be going up against a technologically advanced nation with a strong cultural tradition of resisting invaders and what they feel as imperialism. An invasion would also trigger a total war - there is absolutely no way that invading Caracasus wouldn't result in that.

Caracasus doesn't want a war.

Yeah, duh.. you are more advanced because you use a bit of PMT. I don't and I do not intend to.


Flauc is itself mountainous quite a bit, so we probably aren't bad at mountain warfare.

It wouldn't trigger a total war, really. Caracasus doesn't want a war. Perhaps your government could overreact to the victories of the Flaucese and sue for peace.

EDIT

While Caracasus is mobilized, I doubt the govt think Marela will dare. I am confident many will retreat or abandon their positions on the border if suddenly rockets, without and official declaration, rain over the border.

[Tekeristan]

Teker stronk!

[Flauc]

Teker stronk!

*launches ICBMs*

Teker nonexistant!

Sorry..

[Caracasus]

Public reaction will be interesting indeed. I'd imagine that it'd broadly be behind the decision to mobilize to begin with, petering out as time goes along. Not sure yet. Sure the Laughing Elephant will have plenty to say...

[Tekeristan]

Oh yea, laughing ele!
Any word for Tek in there?

[Significance]

I still don't know why Flauc is making it obvious it's him.

With him helping the FMLN, it made sense. It was near impossible to deduce he was supporting the. Near.

With the rockets, yes, you haven't said anything, but rocket flight paths will tell Caracasus it came from you, which is an act of war. Even if they don't want it, doesn't mean they won't deal with it.

Using proxy forces from Menthi into Caracasus means you can deny involvement, but still deal a massive blow to communism. You could even give the new land to Menthi to show how much you value their country.

[Caracasus]

I still don't know why Flauc is making it obvious it's him.

With him helping the FMLN, it made sense. It was near impossible to deduce he was supporting the. Near.

With the rockets, yes, you haven't said anything, but rocket flight paths will tell Caracasus it came from you, which is an act of war. Even if they don't want it, doesn't mean they won't deal with it.

Using proxy forces from Menthi into Caracasus means you can deny involvement, but still deal a massive blow to communism. You could even give the new land to Menthi to show how much you value their country.

That'd be assuming that a) You can deny involvement that b) you will manage to capture territory and c) that you could hold it.

[Significance]

I still don't know why Flauc is making it obvious it's him.

With him helping the FMLN, it made sense. It was near impossible to deduce he was supporting the. Near.

With the rockets, yes, you haven't said anything, but rocket flight paths will tell Caracasus it came from you, which is an act of war. Even if they don't want it, doesn't mean they won't deal with it.

Using proxy forces from Menthi into Caracasus means you can deny involvement, but still deal a massive blow to communism. You could even give the new land to Menthi to show how much you value their country.

That'd be assuming that a) You can deny involvement that b) you will manage to capture territory and c) that you could hold it.

Yes because despite 90% of your forces being at the other end of the country, your glorious red army can hold back a large push with very little forces. One man is equivalent to 50 flauc men.

I'm joking of course, but I don't see how it's a bad plan compared to his other idea. It worked once on Karthos, maybe it could work again.

But what do I know about your forces, there invincible right?

[Tekeristan]

The Caracasus-Menthi border isn't exactly a very big one..
Guarded by well-equipped, trained, and motivated troops..

So pretty much the same position I am in, so I'm certain he can handle it. Isn't like Flauc can push much into Menthi without supervision - radar or otherwise.

[Flauc]

So, what do we do?

I won't invade VIA Iberis.. and either way, since Caracasus only borders Flauc on the southern border, it only makes sense that they think it's Flauc that is launching.

So Caracasus, what do we do? Do we go with the Flaucese attack Caracasus and seize maybe a tiny bit of land, and Caracasus asks for peace and Flauc accepts? Or we could have a border war.

For example, I didn't research lots, but Khalinin Gol ended in a Japanese loss even though (I think) Japan is very motivated.

Could it be possible that after rapid and succesful attacks and rockets flying, Caracasus decides to sue for peace? Because a war is definetly not good for the economy of Caracasus, because less is spent on the economy and more on the military. You don't regain revenue from military expenditures, but you do gain from industry etc.

[Caracasus]

That'd be assuming that a) You can deny involvement that b) you will manage to capture territory and c) that you could hold it.

Yes because despite 90% of your forces being at the other end of the country, your glorious red army can hold back a large push with very little forces. One man is equivalent to 50 flauc men.

I'm joking of course, but I don't see how it's a bad plan compared to his other idea. It worked once on Karthos, maybe it could work again.

But what do I know about your forces, there invincible right?

They're not invincible... what you've got to remember is that the Caracasusian army is going to be fighting a defensive war that they know (or strongly suspect) is coming. They've picked their positions, they've put into operation their weapons and equipment and they've secured vast areas of their border. Defensive battles are always easier on the defender - even more so if they know they're coming. There might well be instances where one Caracasusian soldier is worth fifty Flaucians... because the Caracasusian soldier is five miles away from their base, supplies, artillery backup and air support and the Flaucians are having to build FOB's in not great territory.

A border conflict isn't going to be about capturing territory, that's going to prove impossible on both sides. Don't forget, Flauc's also going to commit a lot of their army to defending the southern border. It's going to be airstrikes, artillery (maybe). Flauc's concept of rocket exchanges and perhaps limited airstrikes etc. before both sides realise that they've "made their point" makes a lot more sense.