Earth II [Main Thread | OOC | Open RP]

[Hi No Moto]

A glorious first victory for the World Champions!!! I'll post a reaction to the win in a day or to, also Brink just to let you know the Emperor was in attendance for that game. Just wanted to let you know he is in the country haha.

Also Brink any chance of a group stage table? I know it's only one game and you might be planning to put one up after all the first games are over but I thought I'd just ask.

Yes yes, or an IC thread where say, oh I don't know, a nondescript man and his nondescript partner happen upon, let's say a penthouse suite in a large, nondescript apartment complex with say a great view of the dignitaries box in a particular stadium?

Well looking at the stadium that my team was playing in ... I don't think there is an apartment complex in the area that has a view like that so ... better luck next time biatch!!

[Layarteb]

Yes yes, or an IC thread where say, oh I don't know, a nondescript man and his nondescript partner happen upon, let's say a penthouse suite in a large, nondescript apartment complex with say a great view of the dignitaries box in a particular stadium?

Well looking at the stadium that my team was playing in ... I don't think there is an apartment complex in the area that has a view like that so ... better luck next time biatch!!

Day 15 - Realm of Cotland vs Empire of Hi No Moto (Ellis Park)



Day 20 - Empire of Hi No Moto vs Empire of Layarteb (Free State Stadium)



I just need to be within 2,000 to 2,500 meters.



Could this be Jack Delaney walking with a nondescript partner past World Cup security forces?



Oh my oh my oh my....

[Hi No Moto]

Do it and I nuke the capital of New Africa.

That's some good incentive for Brink to get his security up to scratch

[Brydog]

I got the Foreign Minister attending the games, she will have excellent security.

[Dalmasce]

Narrative is short, for which I apologise but unless I go into rambling that's how it is. I will get longer as the story progresses, industrial accidents begin and so on but this is really the beginning of the thread still. In short English; post up.

[Layarteb]

Narrative is short, for which I apologise but unless I go into rambling that's how it is. I will get longer as the story progresses, industrial accidents begin and so on but this is really the beginning of the thread still. In short English; post up.

You'll be my hero if you include Mike Mulligan and a steam shovel named Mary Anne.

[Dalmasce]

Narrative is short, for which I apologise but unless I go into rambling that's how it is. I will get longer as the story progresses, industrial accidents begin and so on but this is really the beginning of the thread still. In short English; post up.

You'll be my hero if you include Mike Mulligan and a steam shovel named Mary Anne.

One amazing invention at a time, I have to think these things up, you know.

[Layarteb]

General Question to All Earth II Members

We have (for sake of argument) 15 - 20 active threads right now. Some are past stories, some are conferences, some are one-offs, et cetera. However, some concern global and current events. Now here at Earth II, we don't really have closed threads. Obviously a diplomatic meeting between two nations is rather limited to them but on the whole, our threads are open and concern all players. Why is it that so few people post in threads that are not their own? Let's take some current examples: Byzantium has just had a major coup in China and the leadership is gone, he publicly executed President Chomei on live television - yet no nation has a reaction to this? Kalimor has a war going on with two city-states right on my other border and is a new nation popping up but no nation takes note of this? Cotland and Terra Reborn invade northern Morocco against some pirates and the world remains mute - as if nowhere else there are these troubles.

What I am getting at is the cross-participation is generally low. There might be an example here or there where more people post, or are invited in to post but that's where it lies.

So this is an honest question, what reason(s) would you have for not posting in these threads? Surely even if they're not in your corner of the world they'll affect you in some way, shape, or form. Follow-up to this, what would entice you to post if you aren't?


In the coming days if you go onto our IRC chat room - I'd like to openly discuss this. I think it's distressing to a lot of you to post 15 posts into an RP where you do all this and no one even notices.

[Brydog]

Mostly I can't think of how I want to take part in it.

[Layarteb]

Mostly I can't think of how I want to take part in it.

Would you say this is a creativity issue, the way the RP is written, or something else? What would resolve this?

[Brydog]

Well I got some ideas, so it seems not to be that much of a situation now.

[Layarteb]

Well I got some ideas, so it seems not to be that much of a situation now.

Seriously, think back to situations where you didn't, as your first statement was. I need to determine if this is something perhaps we can resolve or at least improve upon. Think it through in earnest and let me know.

[Dalmasce]

I wasn't even aware of the invasion of Morocco, or as the pinnacle nation to be affected by "SUDDEN FUCKERY" on my northern border, I would've responded. I note also at this point, having skimmed over the thread after finding it, it's a bit far along to interfere.

[Layarteb]

I wasn't even aware of the invasion of Morocco, or as the pinnacle nation to be affected by "SUDDEN FUCKERY" on my northern border, I would've responded. I note also at this point, having skimmed over the thread after finding it, it's a bit far along to interfere.

What do you think would have helped you notice it? A map, a telegram, a sort of regional trouble post?

[Dalmasce]

I wasn't even aware of the invasion of Morocco, or as the pinnacle nation to be affected by "SUDDEN FUCKERY" on my northern border, I would've responded. I note also at this point, having skimmed over the thread after finding it, it's a bit far along to interfere.

What do you think would have helped you notice it? A map, a telegram, a sort of regional trouble post?

A simple telegram would've sufficed, honestly.

[Brydog]

Well I got some ideas, so it seems not to be that much of a situation now.

Seriously, think back to situations where you didn't, as your first statement was. I need to determine if this is something perhaps we can resolve or at least improve upon. Think it through in earnest and let me know.

Well, ok. I was more interest in European affairs then other affairs, like i didn't care what going on in the other areas.

[Layarteb]

What do you think would have helped you notice it? A map, a telegram, a sort of regional trouble post?

A simple telegram would've sufficed, honestly.

Something such as:

Dear <PLAYER> there has been a new thread posted concerning <REGION>. This thread might interest you due to the proximity and the effect it could have on your economy/military/politics/etc.

<THREAD URL>

<VALEDICTION>

Seriously, think back to situations where you didn't, as your first statement was. I need to determine if this is something perhaps we can resolve or at least improve upon. Think it through in earnest and let me know.

Well, ok. I was more interest in European affairs then other affairs, like i didn't care what going on in the other areas.

Okay that gets to the root of something then, let's add this to the reason pile for now and see how the discussion threads. I'm wondering if this is a common sentiment.

[Khorsun]

I've wanted to get involved in various threads, but I thought the rule was to wait on that until I finished my initial claim thread...and I might be nearing a record for dragging mine out.

I think a helpful step would be for RP creators to do some more brainstorming ahead of time with other members as to what roles their nations might be able to take in the thread. I know that in mine I came up with ways I could include Brink and Lay and invited them into it, and that that's had some great results.

We also might want to have some discussion to firm up on the geopolitics situation; we know for example the big TOA/Hi No Moto rivalry is one key axis of it, but I think a lot of cases where people don't know how to respond to each other's threads is that we aren't all fully aware of just what our nations' interests would be in different parts of the world.

Think we need to get everyone equally up to speed on what the world's ideological divisions are, who everyone's major trade partners are, who's importing oil from who, who's exporting weapons to who, etc.

And perhaps what we need is some kind of breaking news announcements system; it can be something as dumb as an EII news Twitter feed, or just telling people to post major breakthroughs on the thread, or we can have the breaking news included in Lay's updates, or we could actually have a more sophisticated IC international news thread.

[Dalmasce]

A simple telegram would've sufficed, honestly.

Something such as:

Dear <PLAYER> there has been a new thread posted concerning <REGION>. This thread might interest you due to the proximity and the effect it could have on your economy/military/politics/etc.

<THREAD URL>

<VALEDICTION>

That'd be perfect honestly.

[Layarteb]

(1) I've wanted to get involved in various threads, but I thought the rule was to wait on that until I finished my initial claim thread...and I might be nearing a record for dragging mine out.

(2) I think a helpful step would be for RP creators to do some more brainstorming ahead of time with other members as to what roles their nations might be able to take in the thread. I know that in mine I came up with ways I could include Brink and Lay and invited them into it, and that that's had some great results.

(3) We also might want to have some discussion to firm up on the geopolitics situation; we know for example the big TOA/Hi No Moto rivalry is one key axis of it, but I think a lot of cases where people don't know how to respond to each other's threads is that we aren't all fully aware of just what our nations' interests would be in different parts of the world.

(4) Think we need to get everyone equally up to speed on what the world's ideological divisions are, who everyone's major trade partners are, who's importing oil from who, who's exporting weapons to who, etc.

(5) And perhaps what we need is some kind of breaking news announcements system; it can be something as dumb as an EII news Twitter feed, or just telling people to post major breakthroughs on the thread, or we can have the breaking news included in Lay's updates, or we could actually have a more sophisticated IC international news thread.

So as you can see I numberized your statements here so that I can respond to them in kind because it's a rather interesting post.

(1) More of a gray area, I don't know that we've ever had a "you can't RP anywhere until your intro is done" rule but it's sort of fell into practice perhaps? Maybe some people (I remember in the old thread) getting into RPs before their intro was done but it concerned their area and no one really said "Stop you can't do that."

(2) Perhaps in planned threads but I want to see more spontaneity and unplanned threads - whereas brainstorming might not be an option.

(3) To play the other side, why not ask the question "Hey what are your relations with so and so?" This comes a lot in IRC, especially recently, "Hey if I attack so and so, how will you respond?" I think this is probably the best way, to ask simply because nations come and go frequently. I personally keep a spreadsheet of my diplomatic relations but I can't ask this of everyone.

(4) This is something Brink has wanted for a while but without help, he cannot do it alone. I'm up for seeing it done but we need everyone's help and with the lack of participation on the history, I must realistically wonder if it can happen.

(5) I personally loathe Twitter for all that it stands for and I think it probably isn't necessary. We have our news thread so we don't really need much more - people can post as they desire. If people were to bookmark or subscribe, they would know every update. This whole thread is OOC though - when threads get posted everyone sees and I include them in the main posts and everyone can see when I update. Perhaps the telegram I noted to Dalmasce is what you're looking for?

Something such as:

Dear <PLAYER> there has been a new thread posted concerning <REGION>. This thread might interest you due to the proximity and the effect it could have on your economy/military/politics/etc.

<THREAD URL>

<VALEDICTION>

That'd be perfect honestly.

Noted - this really is something I can do without much effort myself. Now here's a question - new guys? Say they join this RP with said conflict midway through. Outside of a helpful "Hey this might pertain to you" in their application approval any other ideas?

[Khorsun]

If you're free to hop into IRC now, Lay, there's a bit of a gathering going on.

[Layarteb]

repost

[Khorsun]

Looking good to me.

Might also want somewhere to put diplomatic info like treaties, international agreements or groups you're party to, etc.

And a military heading as well. Making people do a complete ORBAT is a pain in the ass, but providing at least the basic manpower info + the defense budget should be doable. Maybe an entry listing overseas military bases as well.

[Layarteb]

Looking good to me.

Might also want somewhere to put diplomatic info like treaties, international agreements or groups you're party to, etc.

And a military heading as well. Making people do a complete ORBAT is a pain in the ass, but providing at least the basic manpower info + the defense budget should be doable. Maybe an entry listing overseas military bases as well.

The bases are covered in the Consolidated thread, defense budget would go into the budget, manpower info yeah we can add that. I'm not going to force people to do ORBATs.

[RomeW]

Here's my take regarding the non-participation issue:

For me, what it really boils down to is the sense that, if it doesn't directly involve me then, simply put, I just won't bother with it. The reason for this is that I've got my own stuff to take care of in RL as well as focusing on the issues affecting my nation right now- e.g., my "super claim thread"- that I just don't feel like I have much time to read and reply to someone else's thread when the story going on in the thread won't matter much- in the long run- to my nation. Yes, it is lazy of me, but look at it from this perspective- even though our threads are well-written and engaging, many of our threads ask for a large time commitment just based on the sheer volume of words and posts to read through. If I had nothing to take care of, I'd be more than happy to read through that, but since I have my own stuff to take care of, I'm just not willing to get involved unless I need to.

I did some thinking about why this is happening and concluded that since I've got a claim thread and lots of territory to reconcile that it's more important for me to focus my energies on finishing the claims than getting involved in a story that may only have a cursory interest to me. Realizing this, I wonder if I am the only one who thinks in this way- something tells me that I'm not.

I can't be sure of that line of thinking in others, but what I do know- after perusing the active threads- is that, of the 20 active threads that Earth II has, 11 are either introductory threads or claim threads (including my own). To me, that's a high number, and if others share my line of thinking, then we've got one big reason why others are not participating in others' threads- they're too busy concluding the threads that actually matter to them.

Sure, there's nothing to stop people from jumping into someone else's claim thread- at least, from what I can tell, nothing in the E2 rulebook- but my perception is that there's an unwritten rule here that says we do not interfere with someone else's claims, respecting pending claims as if they were established ones. This isn't a bad thing at all- in fact, I think it's a VERY good thing, since it's fostered a relatively hospitable environment where we can post freely without worrying about someone trying to swipe our land from under our noses, so long as we respect our fellow users. One of the worst things about other NS RPs is that you get a "competition" aspect to them and, ultimately, it's just not fun at all. No one likes to lose- especially if it keeps happening- and in environments where there's "winners and losers", there tends to be divisions rather quickly between the "winners" and the "losers" and the community stops working together, if not falling apart outright. While it's true that E2 has its "more dominant" members, at least here no one feels like there are actual bullies pushing people around- we work to include, not exclude and that's something I hope never stops.

Having said that, it makes me wonder if we need to fix the claiming rules in general. It always seemed silly to me that only "pending" claims can be contested- technically speaking, there isn't a claim on this map that isn't contestable, since to take land from someone else you need to RP for it (and against them) anyway. I also think that if people didn't worry about having to craft epic RP's just so the land they've claimed truly becomes theirs it might ease their minds to get involved in other things. I mean, it's hard for me to want to get excited about a world leader getting executed on live TV when I'm worried about resolving my mountain of claims as fast as possible. If I knew that I *had* them, without worry, then it would be different, since the fear of "losing" the land (relatively speaking) wouldn't be there.

So I'm thinking that the claim rules should go back- somewhat- to the way they were many moons ago, where a successful RP wasn't required to be completed so your claim got registered. Here's how I'd work it:

-You make a claim. The rest of the world gets seven (7) days to register contests to that claim. If no one contests after that time, it becomes yours, no questions asked.
-If someone does contest a claim, the two parties get seven days from that point to negotiate in good faith an equitable exchange, after which they've got to RP for it or someone drops their claim
-A claim still needs an accompanying RP post for it to be officially registered, and this can come before (but not after) the initial seven day period is done. Absent a post, the claim gets invalidated. The post can come in a "national activity thread" instead of a claim thread, but the post still needs to come. As per regular RP convention, they also need to be realistic- i.e., Fort Knox (or Rome ) can't be built in one post, nor can an ethnic group be cleaned in one post or a leader get elected in one post- and whatever doesn't get RP'ed doesn't happen, in addition to normal general E2 activity requirements
-Upper limits can be established on how much someone can claim in a month or a three month period, so that no one "hoards" land.

Hope it makes sense. I'm *way* past my bedtime, but this was too important for me not to weigh in.