War of the Setting Sun [OOC, Closed]

[Of the Quendi]

Nation name: Carloso
Side in the Conflict: Quendi
Amount of troops initialy deployed: 300,000
War RP example(s): http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=147768&p=7472596#p7472596
Why does your nation want to get involved: Carloso supports Quendi due to the sheer brutality of the Japanese regime. I have read many of Quendi's RP posts and I like his skills. Carloso stands for diplomacy, freedom and prosperity via force if necessary. Carloso does not support the Japanese dynasty and its ''puppets''. Also Carloso strives for power over islands and therefore Carloso pledges its help with Quendi if excepted. Lastly Greater Evil Imperial Japanese Dynasty has relation with Greater Diensted, the location of Carloso's arch enemy and rival Dukopolious.

Accepted.

Nation name:joneslind
[b]Side in the Conflict: (Quendi, Japanese, Other (please explain)chinese,thay are powerful
Amount of troops initialy deployed:40,000
[b]War RP example(s): (provide links to your first post in the RP's)this is my first rp
Why does your nation wants to get involved: (150 words minimum)i need a powerful allie,and a beter economic sorce.this war is also a chance to help a nation in need.the nation of china needs suport in war time,and i want to control a aisan teritory.wod like to finaly be in a war for one time in this game,i will become a world power from the war.

Application invallid.

[Carloso]

I plan to deploy an extra 5,000 everday. Okay

[Socialist States Owen]

Actually, it was a dissapointing post. 10 years in a week? Taking control of GEIJD's territories by yourself? Neither side is going to agree to that.

I am going for one RL week, cause lets be honest, that is fair. Being outside control of you're account for longer then that is just.. well... mean. And 10 years is plenty of time to hit the "reset" button on his nation bringing it back inline for a fresh start.

Trust me, I don't like the nation at all... don't believe me, look up my history with him. However, even I am willing to say that this is fair.

As for territories.... he is loosing everything but his mainland. The coalition can do with them what they want.

Granted, this is if he agrees to sign this.

Uhh, you can't control his account. Thats pretty bad form.

Also, Taiwan cannot be included in any such deal.

Do we get your Empire still?

I am Planning to go ahead with my long ago set plot, although with some huge modifications as a compromise to all.

My Empire will end up split in a Cold War Polarized styled West-East division similar to Korea or worse in terms of hostilities, although neither one dares attack the other; while the East, (my part retained), comes under Isolated China & Paddy Of Fernature, to remain safe & under occupation for 10 in game years, then, I will do a civil war scenario where I try to reconquer the West from Yushuu Matsuo's hands (yes, Yushuu Ikito will be defeated by whoever catches him first, although he will tried by the international community. His brother, is plotting his own rise, so he is the one rising in the Western portion of our Empire).

Finally, all coalition states are going to be allowed to build bases in my nation, as well as obtain reparations from us.

Either way, your empire has to be lost in its entirety - and you will accept the military restrictions we impose. We don't mean taking away your empire for 10 years then giving it back - once a deal is agreed, your empire is gone. It's home islands or nothing.

By the way GEIJD, if you abandon the war with the Taiwan battle unresolved, I'll have to assume your forces surrendered, so you will have to finish that battle first.

[Paddy O Fernature]

I am going for one RL week, cause lets be honest, that is fair. Being outside control of you're account for longer then that is just.. well... mean. And 10 years is plenty of time to hit the "reset" button on his nation bringing it back inline for a fresh start.

Trust me, I don't like the nation at all... don't believe me, look up my history with him. However, even I am willing to say that this is fair.

As for territories.... he is loosing everything but his mainland. The coalition can do with them what they want.

Granted, this is if he agrees to sign this.

Uhh, you can't control his account. Thats pretty bad form.

Watch me. If he signs this, I will occupy his mainland as a peacekeeping force with total control for a 10 year (IC) period. He will be disarmed, his war based economy changed over to something productive, and the coalition forces gain all of his colonies. In exchange, Japan gets a fresh start and hopefully will learn from this and not screw it up.

Everyone wins.

[Useful Daveia]

Well the big toys are actually the ones I love so much. In real life, I sort of envy the other countries with their nuclear weapons, carriers, etc.

When will we ever get those I ask myself? My NS nation, on the other hand, would be better off without having to be reduced to a military I am already familiar with, not to mention how powerful NS military technology is compared to Rl ones. I am going to be powerless if someone invades me. Lyras told me I could make a weapons purchase because I accepted the deal he made with me over TG, concerning me fixing my roleplaying.

I want to maintain an offensive, power projecting capacity, even though I will not be using it. It is just that...having stealth bombers, nuclear weapons, aircraft carriers, nuclear submarines, etc. sounds just so wonderful, moreover, my NS nation's people would love to see a Longsword sit in a dock, for many to visit it during peacetime. Like said, I wish to be left alone. I can fix everything, I promise, I will. Please, spare my military.

"the Emperor and a good portion of his staff will at the least be locked up for life as a result of war-crimes and the empire is dissolved, but ultimately life goes on. "

- As for my Emperor & His Politburo regime, I do not really like giving them up. Especially my Emperor, since I wanted to created a nation led by an eccentric, enigmatic, Divine-like character, to make things really interesting...however, I already reached a compromise with Owen. I am planning to make my Emperor abdicate in favour of a vacation off his career, live in TurtleShroom, moreover, his main wife Azula takes the throne. The Emperor then becomes "Senior Cloistered". As for the Seii Taishogun, Uchiha Madara will give up his position in favour of Uchiha Itachi.

Might as well drag this discussion back out from TGs considering it's relevant to all.

With regards to retain power-projection capability GEIJD, why do you believe the coalition should let you retain it? Your state has proven itself not only to be entirely unsympathetic to the sovereignty of other nations, awfully lacking in terms of security measures for military-grade materiel and even now, you're investing four trillion in a post-war military. Your entire GDP isn't even four trillion, so even before you begin reconstruction you'll be having large chunks sliced out over time to pay the debt for a military... That will just sit in bases and look shiny and allow the population to look at war-machines akin to those which slaughtered their sons and fathers in the war?

Never mind that whole cities worth of infrastructure have been rendered null and inert by EMP, forget about the actual effects of nuclear initiations upon your soil, that doesn't need cleaning up, you need to show your starving and ill citizens the glories of military hardware!

A nations worth isn't considered by how big it's boats are or if they have nuclear submarines, but how the population within lives it's life. In your current state, the Dystopia is basically a third world country not only in living standards and ethics, but the way it's government handles the nations. They don't want to rebuild hospitals, begin clean-up operations or organise transport links, they'd rather hand everyone a soviet-surplus NBC suit and buy some fancy warships and fighter jets.

[Socialist States Owen]

Uhh, you can't control his account. Thats pretty bad form.

Watch me. If he signs this, I will occupy his mainland as a peacekeeping force with total control for a 10 year (IC) period. He will be disarmed, his war based economy changed over to something productive, and the coalition forces gain all of his colonies. In exchange, Japan gets a fresh start and hopefully will learn from this and not screw it up.

Everyone wins.

...and if he wanted to, he could retcon your involvement or ignore you. Believe me, I want to punish him IC, but I won't declare overarching control of his accounts actions because it makes things easier.

EDIT - Daveia, I've already explained that to GEIJD via TG but he seems to think he can be peaceful and spend a lot on his military at the same time. But this is GEIJD - he dosen't take good advice.

[Paddy O Fernature]

Watch me. If he signs this, I will occupy his mainland as a peacekeeping force with total control for a 10 year (IC) period. He will be disarmed, his war based economy changed over to something productive, and the coalition forces gain all of his colonies. In exchange, Japan gets a fresh start and hopefully will learn from this and not screw it up.

Everyone wins.

...and if he wanted to, he could retcon your involvement or ignore you. Believe me, I want to punish him IC, but I won't declare overarching control of his accounts actions because it makes things easier.

And how do you propose an occupation should work then? Just sit back and let him do whatever he wants? Gee, if only Imperial Japan had received such a sweet deal post WW2.

[Socialist States Owen]

...and if he wanted to, he could retcon your involvement or ignore you. Believe me, I want to punish him IC, but I won't declare overarching control of his accounts actions because it makes things easier.

And how do you propose an occupation should work then? Just sit back and let him do whatever he wants? Gee, if only Imperial Japan had received such a sweet deal post WW2.

Are you actually listening? I was saying you can't physically do anything to control his account OOC, and to suggest you should try to do so is very poor form - certainly you should know better. I still think we should occupy him and hopefully he won't retcon, but if he really, really wanted to be a total bellend, he could do so.

[The New Imperia]

I kinda think we should limit his military funding to 25%. If we're going to make his country "better" then we should give room for infrastructure and we don't want him to be a risk in the future

[Socialist States Owen]

I kinda think we should limit his military funding to 25%. If we're going to make his country "better" then we should give room for infrastructure and we don't want him to be a risk in the future

Do you mean 25% of what it is now, or 25% of his government budget or GNP?

The way I see it, we should cripple his military beyond offensive capability and focus on milking his economy for a while.

[The New Imperia]

for his economy 25% wouldn't allow him much. Letting him keep it at 50+ would cause problems in the future. Due to problems that arise when introducing a sudden change to an aggressive populace, the best thing to do would be to make it gradual. Make it 25% for a while. His economy will likely improve with the coalitions help (to a certain extent), making the yen more valuable. After a while we should reduce it to 10-15% and leave it at that.

With handling the populace in general. That right should be held by the occupiers of the land at the end of the war. for example, whoever takes Taiwan would control its populace, in terms of Infrastructure, Education, Industry. Obviously problems will come along the road (Japan protesting) but it would be better than Leaving the populace to the will of the once great homeland. It is also the only realistic way to get the once enemy civilians to cooperate. Giving them what Japan never could.

[Paddy O Fernature]

And how do you propose an occupation should work then? Just sit back and let him do whatever he wants? Gee, if only Imperial Japan had received such a sweet deal post WW2.

Are you actually listening? I was saying you can't physically do anything to control his account OOC, and to suggest you should try to do so is very poor form - certainly you should know better. I still think we should occupy him and hopefully he won't retcon, but if he really, really wanted to be a total bellend, he could do so.

I can't help but wonder if it is you who is having a problem with hearing. I am talking about post war occupation, while you are talking about physical account control.

for his economy 25% wouldn't allow him much. Letting him keep it at 50+ would cause problems in the future. Due to problems that arise when introducing a sudden change to an aggressive populace, the best thing to do would be to make it gradual. Make it 25% for a while. His economy will likely improve with the coalitions help (to a certain extent), making the yen more valuable. After a while we should reduce it to 10-15% and leave it at that.

With handling the populace in general. That right should be held by the occupiers of the land at the end of the war. for example, whoever takes Taiwan would control its populace, in terms of Infrastructure, Education, Industry. Obviously problems will come along the road (Japan protesting) but it would be better than Leaving the populace to the will of the once great homeland. It is also the only realistic way to get the once enemy civilians to cooperate. Giving them what Japan never could.

This sounds fair, though I do feel that the Coalition should foot as little of a bill over his rebuilding as possible. Besides, if the local populations spend their own money, and produce the labor behind the reconstruction, insurrection becomes less likely as they would be less willing at the idea of blowing up their own materials.

[San-Silvacian]

I kinda think we should limit his military funding to 25%. If we're going to make his country "better" then we should give room for infrastructure and we don't want him to be a risk in the future

I posted something to you in the IC.

[Socialist States Owen]

for his economy 25% wouldn't allow him much. Letting him keep it at 50+ would cause problems in the future. Due to problems that arise when introducing a sudden change to an aggressive populace, the best thing to do would be to make it gradual. Make it 25% for a while. His economy will likely improve with the coalitions help (to a certain extent), making the yen more valuable. After a while we should reduce it to 10-15% and leave it at that.

With handling the populace in general. That right should be held by the occupiers of the land at the end of the war. for example, whoever takes Taiwan would control its populace, in terms of Infrastructure, Education, Industry. Obviously problems will come along the road (Japan protesting) but it would be better than Leaving the populace to the will of the once great homeland. It is also the only realistic way to get the once enemy civilians to cooperate. Giving them what Japan never could.

Taiwan won't be a problem - theres no reason citizens would remain loyal to Japan. Additionally, the US spends like 5% of its economy on its military - why would we let GEIJD use 25%? It should be a fraction of that at the most.

Additionally, seeing as Japan has plans to carry out a 'glorious uprising', I suggest a lot of bases on his mainland - so if nessecary his LOL LOOK HOW LOYAL WE ARE populace can be put down by force.

[Itailian Maifias]

*rubs brow*


Do I want do know what I missed the last four days?

[Tehraan]

*rubs brow*


Do I want do know what I missed the last four days?

Nothing too special.

Some debates on cruise missiles on the OOC.

[The New Imperia]

I kinda think we should limit his military funding to 25%. If we're going to make his country "better" then we should give room for infrastructure and we don't want him to be a risk in the future

I posted something to you in the IC.

ik. ill be getting to it after japan posts to be fair. but im gonna ask you to attack a different portion of the islands (of your choice) to help spread out Japan's artillery. I asked the same of Vir Sidus. I will be taking out his artillery and establishing air dominance soon, but it would still allow for faster military control if we all went at our own pace.

for his economy 25% wouldn't allow him much. Letting him keep it at 50+ would cause problems in the future. Due to problems that arise when introducing a sudden change to an aggressive populace, the best thing to do would be to make it gradual. Make it 25% for a while. His economy will likely improve with the coalitions help (to a certain extent), making the yen more valuable. After a while we should reduce it to 10-15% and leave it at that.

With handling the populace in general. That right should be held by the occupiers of the land at the end of the war. for example, whoever takes Taiwan would control its populace, in terms of Infrastructure, Education, Industry. Obviously problems will come along the road (Japan protesting) but it would be better than Leaving the populace to the will of the once great homeland. It is also the only realistic way to get the once enemy civilians to cooperate. Giving them what Japan never could.

Taiwan won't be a problem - theres no reason citizens would remain loyal to Japan. Additionally, the US spends like 5% of its economy on its military - why would we let GEIJD use 25%? It should be a fraction of that at the most.

Additionally, seeing as Japan has plans to carry out a 'glorious uprising', I suggest a lot of bases on his mainland - so if nessecary his LOL LOOK HOW LOYAL WE ARE populace can be put down by force.

Having an large military presence post war will only cause the populace to feel controlled. Since the populace is chock full of pride in their leader who has brought the nation to its knees, the best thing to do would be to have as little direct influence as possible. Keep the Emperor as head of state but give him little power. Keep military bases off the mainland but nearby (my plan with Hawaii, assuming Japan is defeated there). Limit the mainlands industrial capability. Allow cultural events and ways of life to continue uninterrupted. Provide education and healthcare. Lower his military budget gradually so the population does not assume we're leaving them defenseless. In fact we should force the emperor to decrease the budget behind closed doors. If we do all of that, a large scale rebellion would be realistically impossible and any acts of terrorism by a Japanese rebel group would lead the general populace to see them as the "bad guys"

[Socialist States Owen]

I posted something to you in the IC.

ik. ill be getting to it after japan posts to be fair. but im gonna ask you to attack a different portion of the islands (of your choice) to help spread out Japan's artillery. I asked the same of Vir Sidus. I will be taking out his artillery and establishing air dominance soon, but it would still allow for faster military control if we all went at our own pace.

Taiwan won't be a problem - theres no reason citizens would remain loyal to Japan. Additionally, the US spends like 5% of its economy on its military - why would we let GEIJD use 25%? It should be a fraction of that at the most.

Additionally, seeing as Japan has plans to carry out a 'glorious uprising', I suggest a lot of bases on his mainland - so if nessecary his LOL LOOK HOW LOYAL WE ARE populace can be put down by force.

Having an large military presence post war will only cause the populace to feel controlled. Since the populace is chock full of pride in their leader who has brought the nation to its knees, the best thing to do would be to have as little direct influence as possible. Keep the Emperor as head of state but give him little power. Keep military bases off the mainland but nearby (my plan with Hawaii, assuming Japan is defeated there). Limit the mainlands industrial capability. Allow cultural events and ways of life to continue uninterrupted. Provide education and healthcare. Lower his military budget gradually so the population does not assume we're leaving them defenseless. In fact we should force the emperor to decrease the budget behind closed doors. If we do all of that, a large scale rebellion would be realistically impossible and any acts of terrorism by a Japanese rebel group would lead the general populace to see them as the "bad guys"

I'm not suggesting we put a trooper to every civilian. But his military has to be incapable of launching a serious attack against another nation, and we have to have some military precense on Japan - not enough to seem like an oppressing force, but definitley enough to quell any resistance.

No matter how few forces we put on the land GEIJD is still going to do it - you all put way too much trust in him on these things, IC and OOC. We improve his country and at the same time milk a load of money of it for ourselves as reperations, and at the same time remove him as a viable military threat. If he RP's his populace as enjoying the improvements then there isn't a problem, but if he RP's a rebellion anyway (because i'm almost dead certain he will) then theres no point trying to help him.

Either way, an interesting story is created and the coalition achieves a realistic victory rather than GEIJD somehow brokering a ceasefire, which would make a mockery of what is already a mockery of a war. It would be like double mockery. With a cherry and icing on top.

By the way, we still haven't adressed the issue that GEIJD wanked his way out of Daveias nuke strikes by somehow shooting most of them down - and losing only a couple of hundred thousand people, not millions. For starters, Kyoto should've been flattened by what Daveia sent over.

[Yohannes]

which would make a mockery of what is already a mockery of a war. It would be like double mockery. With a cherry and icing on top.

That whole small paragraph's awsome.

I am totally putting that into my signature when I finally change it in the near future.

[Socialist States Owen]

which would make a mockery of what is already a mockery of a war. It would be like double mockery. With a cherry and icing on top.

That whole small paragraph's awsome.

I am totally putting that into my signature when I finally change it in the near future.

Coolbro.

But seriously, Kyoto should be destroyed. Its nonsensical that GEIJDs uber godmod defences managed to shoot down all those ICBMs. In reality, shouldn't Japans homeland now be in nuclear winter?

I would've brought this up earlier but I didn't really think about it until now amongst all his other garbage.

[The New Imperia]

That whole small paragraph's awsome.

I am totally putting that into my signature when I finally change it in the near future.

Coolbro.

But seriously, Kyoto should be destroyed. Its nonsensical that GEIJDs uber godmod defences managed to shoot down all those ICBMs. In reality, shouldn't Japans homeland now be in nuclear winter?

I would've brought this up earlier but I didn't really think about it until now amongst all his other garbage.

i think we actually had a debate about this earlier, explaining to him how it would be impossible to get close to half of the nukes in time. And now he has forces heading elsewhere to invade some people.

[Socialist States Owen]

Coolbro.

But seriously, Kyoto should be destroyed. Its nonsensical that GEIJDs uber godmod defences managed to shoot down all those ICBMs. In reality, shouldn't Japans homeland now be in nuclear winter?

I would've brought this up earlier but I didn't really think about it until now amongst all his other garbage.

i think we actually had a debate about this earlier, explaining to him how it would be impossible to get close to half of the nukes in time. And now he has forces heading elsewhere to invade some people.

How can he possibly have the resources to do that? Dosen't that leave his territory wide open?

In other news, inb4 Mexican Liberation, who signed up then did bugger all for a long time, will appear with a force 'sneaked in by the Imperial Dragon Intelligence" or some bs.

Actually, did he even sign up? He's not on the the lists on the first page.

[Greater Evil Imperial Japanese Dystopia]

i think we actually had a debate about this earlier, explaining to him how it would be impossible to get close to half of the nukes in time. And now he has forces heading elsewhere to invade some people.

How can he possibly have the resources to do that? Dosen't that leave his territory wide open?

In other news, inb4 Mexican Liberation, who signed up then did bugger all for a long time, will appear with a force 'sneaked in by the Imperial Dragon Intelligence" or some bs.

Actually, did he even sign up? He's not on the the lists on the first page.

He did actually. Quendi has not updated the first in so long.

[San-Silvacian]

An ally this late?

He'll be more so target practice for the Allied Army, Navy, and Air Forces.

[Nitrongaia]

You might not have time, GEIJD, but I think we should wrap up Confrontation of Truths.