OOC: 19th Century Fantasy Earth Interest Thread

[Jbeil]

I would point out that there is probably very little historical precedent for any acute Human-Elvish rivalry. We've mostly been on separate parts of the planet, save for fairly brief interactions in the mid 1st millennium. After that, human interaction with high elves was basically limited to trade with Bar min Duinath, which doesn't hold anything humans would be particularly interested in taking, and High Elves don't make very good slaves since they tend to die if they are mentally 'broken'. And if you have a non-'broken' slave, then they're just as likely to try to murder you with a carving knife as serve you your turkey.

After that, the primary Human-Elvish interface would have been along the Eastern European border with the Steppe Elf kingdoms. Discrimination against them might occur in those areas, but I don't really see there being enough High Elves in Europe to establish a firm base for discrimination against them, much less the Dark Elves who probably think of humans as semi-legendary monsters.

Goblins and Orcs, now, have been launching raids and attacks on humans from Africa for a long time, and could reasonably make up a fairly large slave population in Europe.

I'm actually thinking of abolishing slavery...

[Radictistan]

Hey, Volt, I think I may have screwed up in that "Elven Orient" thread. You were referring to India in that last post, weren't you?

[Voltronica]

yup...@Rad

I was like where's the elephant?? That part was really messed up.

@OMG
You just gave me the Idea of cross breeding elves with Orcs, humans, or Goblins...

[Radictistan]

I'll delete that post, then.

[OMGeverynameistaken]

Even assuming such a breeding program would work, you don't have enough elves to feed into it. High Elves, at least. Steppe Elves may be more common, but we don't have a player to define them as yet.

And I really doubt that a High Elf would stick around for something traumatic as rape, if that was your plan.

[Vortiaganica]

What have I missed?

[Trivval]

This looks really interesting... I might just sign up.

[Vortiaganica]

Ey, Nicks. Would it be alright to assume that some of the Australian megafauna are still alive in Australia?

If so, could orcs under the instruction of elves be taught to tame them and ride them? (Australian megafauna could be massive. The ancestor of the wombat weighed two tonnes)

[Trivval]

Ey, Nicks. Would it be alright to assume that some of the Australian megafauna are still alive in Australia?

If so, could orcs under the instruction of elves be taught to tame them and ride them? (Australian megafauna could be massive. The ancestor of the wombat weighed two tonnes)

Diprotodon Cavalry, fucking up your Bears since 1.6 Million years ago.

[Oterro]

Ey, Nicks. Would it be alright to assume that some of the Australian megafauna are still alive in Australia?

If so, could orcs under the instruction of elves be taught to tame them and ride them? (Australian megafauna could be massive. The ancestor of the wombat weighed two tonnes)

Diprotodon Cavalry, fucking up your Bears since 1.6 Million years ago.

The only proper animals for the cavalry are horses. and mammoths.
subtlebumpissubtle

[Demphor]

Hey Nick, is it okay that you can also put magenta around Shark Bay, Australia, I've made claims there and I want them secured.

Also, does anyone mind if I found a Scouting movement, and build it into the World Organization of the Scout Movement?

[Voltronica]

Did anyone notice that the Gibraltar strait has been "closed" by Western Averi?

just figured that be really important somehow...

[Chemaki]

Diprotodon Cavalry, fucking up your Bears since 1.6 Million years ago.

The only proper animals for the cavalry are horses. and mammoths.

But Velociraptors, amirite?

[Old Tyrannia]

The only proper animals for the cavalry are horses. and mammoths.

But Velociraptors, amirite?

Technically, me and the Undead have claim to Velociraptor. It's found predominantly in Mongolia & China.

[Imeriata]

Did anyone notice that the Gibraltar strait has been "closed" by Western Averi?

just figured that be really important somehow...

Obviously so must the union step in to protect our maker given superiority in the Mediterranean.

[Oterro]

The Gibraltar strait being closed is horrifically important, considering how much trade goes through there.

[Ordo Drakul]

The Gibraltar strait being closed is horrifically important, considering how much trade goes through there.

Do we even have trade yet?

[Oterro]

The Gibraltar strait being closed is horrifically important, considering how much trade goes through there.

Do we even have trade yet?

In 1850?

Are you asking if trade exists in 1850?

[Ordo Drakul]

Do we even have trade yet?

In 1850?

Are you asking if trade exists in 1850?

Do any of our nations trade with each other as yet? It's quite possible our trade routes are very much different from RL, thus the Gibraltar Strait may only be of use to one or two nations.

[Oterro]

In 1850?

Are you asking if trade exists in 1850?

Do any of our nations trade with each other as yet? It's quite possible our trade routes are very much different from RL, thus the Gibraltar Strait may only be of use to one or two nations.

Well if we take orcs as Africans, and thus slaves, then any European nation other than Italy and Austria who wishes to get said slaves will have to pass by the Gibraltar Strait; considering that markets were pretty free in 1850, not all ships sailing under your country's ensign would be under direct government influence anyway.

[Ordo Drakul]

Do any of our nations trade with each other as yet? It's quite possible our trade routes are very much different from RL, thus the Gibraltar Strait may only be of use to one or two nations.

Well if we take orcs as Africans, and thus slaves, then any European nation other than Italy and Austria who wishes to get said slaves will have to pass by the Gibraltar Strait; considering that markets were pretty free in 1850, not all ships sailing under your country's ensign would be under direct government influence anyway.

Until our colonial powers establish, the trade isn't there-in RL, slaves weren't used heavily until after colonies had established and the sponsor nation suffered a lack of citizens willing to relocate-neither condition has yet occurred, so Gibraltar may not be the plum you think-how much mileage did the Almohads get out of it?

[Old Tyrannia]

I would point out that there is probably very little historical precedent for any acute Human-Elvish rivalry. We've mostly been on separate parts of the planet, save for fairly brief interactions in the mid 1st millennium. After that, human interaction with high elves was basically limited to trade with Bar min Duinath, which doesn't hold anything humans would be particularly interested in taking, and High Elves don't make very good slaves since they tend to die if they are mentally 'broken'. And if you have a non-'broken' slave, then they're just as likely to try to murder you with a carving knife as serve you your turkey.

After that, the primary Human-Elvish interface would have been along the Eastern European border with the Steppe Elf kingdoms. Discrimination against them might occur in those areas, but I don't really see there being enough High Elves in Europe to establish a firm base for discrimination against them, much less the Dark Elves who probably think of humans as semi-legendary monsters.

Goblins and Orcs, now, have been launching raids and attacks on humans from Africa for a long time, and could reasonably make up a fairly large slave population in Europe.

I'd dispute this fact, reason being that my entire nation hinges on it not being true. That said, I like your timeline- very interesting. You may be a complete asshole, OMG, but you are a genius. I think I will edit it to include Fu Lei history.

[Ordo Drakul]

I would point out that there is probably very little historical precedent for any acute Human-Elvish rivalry. We've mostly been on separate parts of the planet, save for fairly brief interactions in the mid 1st millennium. After that, human interaction with high elves was basically limited to trade with Bar min Duinath, which doesn't hold anything humans would be particularly interested in taking, and High Elves don't make very good slaves since they tend to die if they are mentally 'broken'. And if you have a non-'broken' slave, then they're just as likely to try to murder you with a carving knife as serve you your turkey.

After that, the primary Human-Elvish interface would have been along the Eastern European border with the Steppe Elf kingdoms. Discrimination against them might occur in those areas, but I don't really see there being enough High Elves in Europe to establish a firm base for discrimination against them, much less the Dark Elves who probably think of humans as semi-legendary monsters.

Goblins and Orcs, now, have been launching raids and attacks on humans from Africa for a long time, and could reasonably make up a fairly large slave population in Europe.

I'd dispute this fact, reason being that my entire nation hinges on it not being true. That said, I like your timeline- very interesting. You may be a complete asshole, OMG, but you are a genius. I think I will edit it to include Fu Lei history.

More likely there is a huge human slave pop in Africa, if the goblins and orcs are the ones doing the raiding.

[Old Tyrannia]

Here's the edited timeline, including Fu Lei history.

Approx. 250,000 BC - Divergence of the Homo Sapiens Vitalis from Homo Sapiens Sapiens ('Scientific' theory)

~20,000 BC - the Jade Emperor creates the Fu Lei and gives them supremacy over all other species

~14,000 BC - Awakening of the Elves (Actual Occurence)

~13,000 BC - First Elvish city founded in unknown location

~10,800 BC - Believed first contact between men and elves

8300 BC - First substantiated contact between men and elves, trade occurs.

6800 BC - Founding of the Turinasta Minnónar, or the Kingdom of the Firstborn. First Aran Ilye Eldar, King of All Elves, more commonly rendered as 'High King', crowned in the city of Alta Arta.

~6650 BC - First contact between Fu Lei, then a peaceful forest living tribe, and the High Elves.

6500 BC - The Great Exploration begins, Elvish settlers travel far and wide across the Steppes of the North, to Europe, to Africa and even America, founding colonies and trade posts. Sometime in this era, Bar min Duinath is founded as a trade outpost.

6350 BC - Fu Lei pay tribute to the High King of the Elves.

6000 BC - The Great Kinslaying. Prince Moriquare seeks to take control of the Kingdom in a bloody civil war. The first recorded slaying of Elf by Elf. Distant portions of the Kingdom break away and the empire enters its first slump.

5920 BC - The War of the North, the first recorded incidence of a magic user raising armies of undead. First recorded appearance of Orcs.

5810 BC - End of the War of the North, Northern Orcs scattered and exterminated in Siberia. Many move south to Africa.

5800 BC - The Second War of the North, a lieutenant of the previous sorcerer who survived the previous encounter with the Elvish kingdom regains his master's powers and attacks the kingdom.

4532 BC - The Sundering of the Kingdom. Having grown far larger than can be easily managed, the Turinasta Minnonar is divided into three separate realms. These almost immediately begin bickering with each other, although outright war never develops. The three states are:
The Northern Kingdom: Occupying the area between Kamchatka and Poland.
The Middle Kingdom: Occupying China, the Middle East, Anatolia, parts of Greece and Africa.
The Southern Kingdom: Occupying Oceania, South Asia, India.
At their greatest extent these kingdoms occupied vast swaths of land, although they gradually deteriorated over time, whether through external wars or simply being unwilling or unable to hold onto their outer territories for various reasons.

4477 BC - First Elvish contact with 'civilized' human states.

4450 BC - First Elvish-Human war, for unrecorded reasons between the Western Elvish Kingdom and a now extinct North African state. Elvish veterans of the war maintain that humans taking Elvish captives in an attempt to gain their immortality by drinking their blood was the cause of the war.

4429 BC - Elvish armies destroy said unknown kingdom and annihilate all traces of it. The only known remains are rough blocks which can sometimes be found by themselves in the desert with the Old Elvish phrase "sië ana cotumolva" or 'thus to our enemy' carved on them.

4120 BC - Divergence of the Southern Kingdom's population, first recorded appearance of 'Dark Elves'.

3948 BC - The oldest known maps of the Americas date from this era.

2610 BC - The Goblin War, joint Southern and Middle Kingdom armies venture into Central Asia to deal with the threat of the Goblin tribes. The war is extremely bloody on both sides, but ultimately inconclusive.

2357 BC - The Great Barrier arises between the Old World and the New. Contact is lost with Elven traders, who are presumably eaten by trolls.

1251 BC - Lacking any willing enemies, the Elvish Kingdom begins a slow military decline. The so called 'Seve Marda' or 'Peace of the World' begins. Philosophy and science flourish in the Elvish Kingdom.

1022 BC - Fu Lei philosopher K'ung-tzu is born.

950 BC - K'ung-tzu dies. The Fu Lei now begin to build their own civilization, moving out of their ancient caves and building new towns.

910 BC - First breach of the 'peace' when Goblin tribes, organized under Orcish leaders, emerge from Persia and attack the western border of the Elvish states. Loss of territory is coupled with significant social unrest in the Elvish kingdoms.

890 BC - Goblin tribes attack Fu Lei towns in Mongolia. Fu Lei requests for Elvish aid are ignored by the High King and the Fu Lei cease to pay tribute. The first Fu Lei wang or sovereign is crowned, establishing the kingdom of Wu.

855 BC - Western War, the Middle Kingdom is driven from Anatolia and the Near East by various Goblin tribes. Contact is lost with Greece and the former colonials in that area integrate with the Human population or move to the Northern Kingdom.

567 BC - Fu Lei, then called the 'Ramanyaro' or 'winged rats', break off from the Turinasta Minnonar. King Shimin introduces new title of Huangdi or 'Emperor', establishing the Fu Lei Empire.

34 AD - Some silly human gets himself nailed to a tree by a bunch of Goblins for being a hippie.

488 AD - Battle of Alta Arta, fall of High King Velicalaco at the Gate of Rivers. Beginning of a mass exodus of Elves from the former Elven Kingdom. Fu Lei seize Elven capital and rename it 'Beijing', establishing it as the new Imperial capital.

488-690 AD - Known as the 'Terhat uin Adrhon' or 'Breaking of the World', this era saw the gradual collapse of the major Elvish states. The Steppe Elves adopted their nomadic lifestyle and the Southern Elvish Kingdom was divided into numerous warring states. The High Elves fled to the West and established their new homeland in the Middle East.
It is a particularly traumatic time in history for all Elves, particularly those who survived it. Vast numbers of Elves were killed fleeing, in civil wars, or by various aggressors, and many great works of Elvish civilization were destroyed.
Contact with the Human kingdoms of the West is lost for Elves outside of the Near East. The Northern Kingdom quickly devolves into squabbling princedoms, the Western portions of which are overtaken by human settlers.

704 AD - Last of the High Elf nobility exterminated within the borders of the Fu Lei Empire. Emperor Shang initiates construction of the Great Wall by repairing and linking old High Elf defences.

771 AD - The son of Velicalaco takes the name 'Himthond' or 'Steadfast root' and declares the founding of a new Elvish kingdom in the West. The Aranie Dunedhil is born.

900 AD - The Aranie Dunedhil loses its coastal territories to Goblin and Orcish tribes.

907 AD - End of the first Fu Lei dynasty, the Wu. Beginning of the Five Dynasties and Ten Kingdoms period (AD 907–960). The Empire is divided for the first time since the fall of High King Velicalaco.

960 AD - Establishment of the S'ung dynasty. The Empire is reunited under Emperor Che. During the time of the S'ung, Fu Lei technology is the most advanced in the world.

1115 AD - First trade re-established between the Elvish Kingdom and the Human states. Indirect contact between Humans and Eastern Elves.

1271 AD - Orc barbarians cross the Great Wall and subjugate much of the Fu Lei Empire, establishing the Great Khanate.

1290 AD - Elvish Kingdom begins systematic subjugation of the Goblin tribes to the East. This is complete by 1451 AD.

1341 AD - The Western Trade Corridor to Erin Aeanor is established. Erin Aeanor passes into the cultural sphere of the Elvish kingdom.

1309 AD - The last S'ung Emperor dies without an heir and leaves his empire to General Liu Shen, who establishes the Fang dynasty.

1368 AD - Emperor Qian of Fang destroys the capital of the Great Khanate, ending the Orcish occupation of Cathay. Fang dynasty embark upon a programme of extermination to rid the Empire of Orc and Goblin barbarians.

1410 AD - First use of Goblin auxiliaries in battle by the Elvish Kingdom. They prove quite successful against Orcs, since the taller brutes can't quite seem to figure out why their ankles are gone until their throats have been cut.

1816 AD - Birth of Prince Yuan of Fang, future Emperor of the Fu Le Empire.

1820 AD - Emperor Hong dies. Prince Yuan is named Emperor and adopts the era name Daoqing. Empress Dowager Chou becomes regent.

1836 AD - Empress Dowager Chou relinquishes power to her son, Emperor Daoqing of Fang. The Emperor changes his era name to Tianlong to mark the event. Year 1 of the Tianlong Era.

1850 - Present Day. Year 14 of the Tianlong Era.

[Radictistan]

Okay, I've adjusted the date of the foundation of the modern Sajedek state to about nine hundred years ago.