Sovereign Empires Coalition (Main Thread v4)

[Jbeil]

Don't say WWI...Only Americans believe we were losing WWI.

O RLY?

The fact that 6 million highly trained troops, better German tactics and the Germans managing to drop shells on Paris while the allies retreated doesn't mean that we nearly lost?

Nope.
Considering that Paris didn't fall, and the Germans were as deep underground(In trenches) as us...Coupled with bombs dropping on Germany and Germany suffering millions in casualties as well means that we didn't lose...

[Celis]

I was saying that you were LOSING not that you LOST. There is a difference mind you. And I noticed it was Germany that was knee deep in French soil and not the other way around. ;D

[The Matthew Islands]

O RLY?

The fact that 6 million highly trained troops, better German tactics and the Germans managing to drop shells on Paris while the allies retreated doesn't mean that we nearly lost?

Nope.
Considering that Paris didn't fall, and the Germans were as deep underground(In trenches) as us...Coupled with bombs dropping on Germany and Germany suffering millions in casualties as well means that we didn't lose...

It came pretty damn close though. All it would have taken was a bit more luck for the Germans and the British army to activate it 'stupidity' function.

Plus, to be fair, WW1 was an ass kicking for everyone.

[Jbeil]

I was saying that you were LOSING not that you LOST. There is a difference mind you. And I noticed it was Germany that was knee deep in French soil and not the other way around. ;D

Knee deep in French soil, but still far away from Paris...Or at least, far enough...

[The Matthew Islands]

I was saying that you were LOSING not that you LOST. There is a difference mind you. And I noticed it was Germany that was knee deep in French soil and not the other way around. ;D

That was because Germany was the aggressor. Once Germany took that land and the Allies sorted out their defences, they kind of didn't need to move. It was more based on who would run out of steam first.

[Jbeil]

Nope.
Considering that Paris didn't fall, and the Germans were as deep underground(In trenches) as us...Coupled with bombs dropping on Germany and Germany suffering millions in casualties as well means that we didn't lose...

It came pretty damn close though. All it would have taken was a bit more luck for the Germans and the British army to activate it 'stupidity' function.

Plus, to be fair, WW1 was an ass kicking for everyone.

Well, we didn't lose...And we weren't losing...At least, not majorly...
Which proves my point that only Americans believe that they saved the Franco-British from the 'Huns/Later Nazis'...

[Celis]

I was just pointing out the fact that you didn't push the Germans back until the Americans came into play.

[Jbeil]

I was just pointing out the fact that you didn't push the Germans back until the Americans came into play.

We didn't push them back. But, we didn't lose...Which disproves the original argument, that France got "3" "ass-kickings" in 150 years.

[The Matthew Islands]

Well, we didn't lose...And we weren't losing...At least, not majorly...
Which proves my point that only Americans believe that they saved the Franco-British from the 'Huns/Later Nazis'...

True, by 1918 we were going to win, its just the Americans helped shorten it a LOT.

[Jbeil]

Well, we didn't lose...And we weren't losing...At least, not majorly...
Which proves my point that only Americans believe that they saved the Franco-British from the 'Huns/Later Nazis'...

True, by 1918 we were going to win, its just the Americans helped shorten it a LOT.

True, the Americans helped us win...But our victory, due to many causes, was really inevitable.
All they did was shorted the time it took us...

[The Matthew Islands]

We didn't push them back. But, we didn't lose...Which disproves the original argument, that France got "3" "ass-kickings" in 150 years.

Disproves huh?

Indochina.

[Jbeil]

We didn't push them back. But, we didn't lose...Which disproves the original argument, that France got "3" "ass-kickings" in 150 years.

Disproves huh?

Indochina.

Hm...Hm...Hm...It wasn't a total ass-kicking, we established South Vietnam...
Besides, it was the Americans' fault that we didn't win...They refused to help us 'check' the growth of Communism...

[The Matthew Islands]

Disproves huh?

Indochina.

Hm...Hm...Hm...It wasn't a total ass-kicking, we established South Vietnam...
Besides, it was the Americans' fault that we didn't win...They refused to help us 'check' the growth of Communism...

South Vietnam was a brutal dictatorship, worse in some cases than North Vietnam. Plus the Indochina war was more independence than communism.

Also.
Dien Bien Phu. Pretty ass kicking to me.

[Celis]

"After the German march on Paris was brought to a halt, the Western Front settled into a static battle of attrition with a trench line that changed little until 1917."

"Throughout 1915–17, the British Empire and France suffered more casualties than Germany, because of both the strategic and tactical stances chosen by the sides."

So the Germans were not only fighting a war with the French and the British at this time... But they were also fighting the Russians. And they still managed to retain a foothold deep in your country and inflict more casualties on your men.

"On 3 May 1917, during the Nivelle Offensive, the weary French 2nd Colonial Division, veterans of the Battle of Verdun, refused their orders, arriving drunk and without their weapons."

Highly Trained? 20,000 French soldiers deserted.

"After the sinking of seven U.S. merchant ships by submarines and the publication of the Zimmerman telegram, Wilson called for war on Germany, which the U.S. Congress declared on 6 April 1917."

"Western Front settled into a static battle of attrition with a trench line that changed little until 1917."

Enough said?

[Jbeil]

Hm...Hm...Hm...It wasn't a total ass-kicking, we established South Vietnam...
Besides, it was the Americans' fault that we didn't win...They refused to help us 'check' the growth of Communism...

South Vietnam was a brutal dictatorship, worse in some cases than North Vietnam. Plus the Indochina war was more independence than communism.

Also.
Dien Bien Phu. Pretty ass kicking to me.

So ?
We never said we want to establish a democracy...We only wanted a Capitalist nation...No matter what it is...
Not in our view...Communism was our reason...

Also, Dien Bien Phu was only one battle...And we were SERIOUSLY outnumbered...
Although, true...It was a massive loss...

[Jbeil]

"After the German march on Paris was brought to a halt, the Western Front settled into a static battle of attrition with a trench line that changed little until 1917."

"Throughout 1915–17, the British Empire and France suffered more casualties than Germany, because of both the strategic and tactical stances chosen by the sides."

So the Germans were not only fighting a war with the French and the British at this time... But they were also fighting the Russians. And they still managed to retain a foothold deep in your country and inflict more casualties on your men.

"On 3 May 1917, during the Nivelle Offensive, the weary French 2nd Colonial Division, veterans of the Battle of Verdun, refused their orders, arriving drunk and without their weapons."

Highly Trained? 20,000 French soldiers deserted.

"After the sinking of seven U.S. merchant ships by submarines and the publication of the Zimmerman telegram, Wilson called for war on Germany, which the U.S. Congress declared on 6 April 1917."

"Western Front settled into a static battle of attrition with a trench line that changed little until 1917."

Enough said?

1-They were on the offensive, we were on the defensive...They got into France before we can stop them...But we did.
Also, bad management was the reason behind our massive losses...The French army was a joke at the time.

2-And ? We never claimed to be highly trained.

3-Nope.
We weren't losing, and due to our attrition somewhat working, we were going to win.
The US only made it faster...

[The Matthew Islands]

"After the German march on Paris was brought to a halt, the Western Front settled into a static battle of attrition with a trench line that changed little until 1917."

"Throughout 1915–17, the British Empire and France suffered more casualties than Germany, because of both the strategic and tactical stances chosen by the sides."

So the Germans were not only fighting a war with the French and the British at this time... But they were also fighting the Russians. And they still managed to retain a foothold deep in your country and inflict more casualties on your men.

"On 3 May 1917, during the Nivelle Offensive, the weary French 2nd Colonial Division, veterans of the Battle of Verdun, refused their orders, arriving drunk and without their weapons."

Highly Trained? 20,000 French soldiers deserted.

"After the sinking of seven U.S. merchant ships by submarines and the publication of the Zimmerman telegram, Wilson called for war on Germany, which the U.S. Congress declared on 6 April 1917."

"Western Front settled into a static battle of attrition with a trench line that changed little until 1917."

Enough said?

1: Its hard to take a well fortified trench when half your men are killed before they even get close. The Germans were settled in French territory gunning down lines of men, and vice versa.

2: 20,000 French deserted. You wouldn't? You're a human being, living in a rain filled mud hole surrounded by the partially buried dead bodies of your friends, waiting each day for a shell to fall on top of you with the threat of being ordered to walk across a ravaged mud field towards enemy machine guns looms ever closer. Frankly I am surprised it was only 20,000. Nothing could have properly trained you for WW1.

3: A battle of Attrition that we were winning. The Germans were low on production and food. They were simply running out. The defences of each side were substantial enough to remain unchanged because the tactics of the era hadn't adapted properly. Know why it changed in 1918? Because the Germans had managed to adapt a proper tactic for breaking through trenches. If it had bee thought of it in 1914, 15, 16, 17 the war would have been over quicker.

The American provided fresh new soldiers, who weren't physically and mentally worn down by living in the trenches, fighting a malnourished and equally exhausted enemy who had just desperately thrown everything they had into a final offensive. There weren't new men for the Germans, but for the British and French there were new Americans.

[Celis]

There was a non-aggression pact signed by the Germans and Russians around 1917. This mean't that all the soldiers that were fighting the Russians would be coming to assist the Germans. Luckily the Americans decided to get involved at this time. Otherwise you would have had another German army that you would have had to deal with. So you were not losing? If the Americans wouldn't have gotten involved... I see a grave occurrence otherwise.

[The Matthew Islands]

So ?
We never said we want to establish a democracy...We only wanted a Capitalist nation...No matter what it is...
Not in our view...Communism was our reason...

Also, Dien Bien Phu was only one battle...And we were SERIOUSLY outnumbered...
Although, true...It was a massive loss...

Numbers shouldn't be as much of a problem if you are sitting in a well fortified hill top with support.

[The Matthew Islands]

There was a non-aggression pact signed by the Germans and Russians around 1917. This mean't that all the soldiers that were fighting the Russians would be coming to assist the Germans. Luckily the Americans decided to get involved at this time. Otherwise you would have had another German army that you would have had to deal with. So you were not losing? If the Americans wouldn't have gotten involved... I see a grave occurrence otherwise.

Actually they had already arrived. The Spring offensive. The Germans had broken through and were stopped. It was a similar move to the Battle of the Bulge.

[Third Mexican Empire]

"After the German march on Paris was brought to a halt, the Western Front settled into a static battle of attrition with a trench line that changed little until 1917."

"Throughout 1915–17, the British Empire and France suffered more casualties than Germany, because of both the strategic and tactical stances chosen by the sides."

So the Germans were not only fighting a war with the French and the British at this time... But they were also fighting the Russians. And they still managed to retain a foothold deep in your country and inflict more casualties on your men.

"On 3 May 1917, during the Nivelle Offensive, the weary French 2nd Colonial Division, veterans of the Battle of Verdun, refused their orders, arriving drunk and without their weapons."

Highly Trained? 20,000 French soldiers deserted.

"After the sinking of seven U.S. merchant ships by submarines and the publication of the Zimmerman telegram, Wilson called for war on Germany, which the U.S. Congress declared on 6 April 1917."

"Western Front settled into a static battle of attrition with a trench line that changed little until 1917."

Enough said?

1-They were on the offensive, we were on the defensive...They got into France before we can stop them...But we did.
Also, bad management was the reason behind our massive losses...The French army was a joke at the time.

2-And ? We never claimed to be highly trained.

3-Nope.
We weren't losing, and due to our attrition somewhat working, we were going to win.
The US only made it faster...

Mexico shoul;d have taken Germany's offer :/

[Jbeil]

So ?
We never said we want to establish a democracy...We only wanted a Capitalist nation...No matter what it is...
Not in our view...Communism was our reason...

Also, Dien Bien Phu was only one battle...And we were SERIOUSLY outnumbered...
Although, true...It was a massive loss...

Numbers shouldn't be as much of a problem if you are sitting in a well fortified hill top with support.

Well, considering that they were running out of resources, as the Army couldn't provide them with anything, especially since the Vietnamese had anti-aircraft guns, and they STILL managed to repulse numerous Vietnamese assaults, I would say that numbers did matter...
Especially considering that the Vietnamese outnumbered the French in that battle with at least 30,000 men.

[Jbeil]

1-They were on the offensive, we were on the defensive...They got into France before we can stop them...But we did.
Also, bad management was the reason behind our massive losses...The French army was a joke at the time.

2-And ? We never claimed to be highly trained.

3-Nope.
We weren't losing, and due to our attrition somewhat working, we were going to win.
The US only made it faster...

Mexico shoul;d have taken Germany's offer :/

No they shouldn't.
They weren't going to win.
Germany couldn't provide them with resources due to the British blockade, and it would just end up being Mexico vs US.
And even if the US wasn't ready, as the British learned before, it is hard to occupy the American mainland.
The US would have won eventually.

[Third Mexican Empire]

Mexico shoul;d have taken Germany's offer :/

No they shouldn't.
They weren't going to win.
Germany couldn't provide them with resources due to the British blockade, and it would just end up being Mexico vs US.
And even if the US wasn't ready, as the British learned before, it is hard to occupy the American mainland.
The US would have won eventually.

Jbeil shut up.

You speak lies.

The Mexican Cession belongs to mexico dammit

[Jbeil]

No they shouldn't.
They weren't going to win.
Germany couldn't provide them with resources due to the British blockade, and it would just end up being Mexico vs US.
And even if the US wasn't ready, as the British learned before, it is hard to occupy the American mainland.
The US would have won eventually.

Jbeil shut up.

You speak lies.

The Mexican Cession belongs to mexico dammit

Wow, it seems like I struck a nerve.

Nah, Mexico was going to lose...

Besides, they have practically reclaimed them, even if not officially...
Many of the States ceded by Mexico will soon become mostly Mexican...