Discussion about the Holy Historian Confederation

[Roma MA]

Reformatted, looks nicer. Text fits a Religious Confederation.

The Constitution of the Holy Historian Confederation
We, as citizens of The Holy Historian Confederation, do righteously issue this Regional Constitution in the name of local peace, cooperation, justice, and security. By the guiding hand of Neuve Zealandia we birth this confederacy as brothers in arms. May we uphold it on our honor, else lord Hiroyuki smite us.

ARTICLE I: Rights to Legislation and Senatorial Power

• Section 1
  
  • The Senate, acting in the best wishes of Lord Hiroyuki himself, is granted full and total powers of Legislation, to better band together, protect, and promote the peoples of the Holy Historian Confederation
• Section 2
  
  • Every nation of Historia, by Lord Hiroyuki's grace, shall be granted rights to vote in the Senate. Those who represent Lord Hiroyuki himself, the Officers (see Article 3) are recognized as moderators of Debate and Senate. They are Lord Hiroyuki's Paragons. His First Prophet, Neuve Zealandia also holds special powers of moderation of Debate and Senate should need arise.
    
    • Meetings for the Debate must be announced at least 24 hours beforehand to give citizen nations adequate time to join.
    • A 2/3 majority is required for the execution of any policy, law, or declaration.
    • A greater percentage is required to veto any Legislation.
• Section 3
  
  • The Senate is an arm of the Lord Hiroyuki, and by extension, the officers and ruler of the region, and will act as such in affairs which are relevant politics of regions beyond Historia.
• Section 4
  
  • All members of the Senate may present a policy, law, or declaration to meeting.
    
    • Issues and discussions announced by Neuve Zealandia precede all over topics.
    • Officers of the Holy Confederation shall retain Rights Secunudus in precedence of their issues and discussions.
ARTICLE 2: Rights to Freedoms

• Section 1
  
  • All nations of the Holy Historian Confederation retain the right to declare their freedoms unjustly infringed upon by outside parties, whether within or without the Confederation.
    
    • If such a declaration surfaces, a committee will be convened between the Confederation's Officers and Supreme Leader to decide on proper action and judgement.
• Section 2
  
  • Nations of the Region may freely decide their policies without fear of Senate intervention.
    
    • Only a policy, law, or declaration that was proposed by an officer or the Supreme leader may supersede their rights.
    • Even then, a nation has the right to Section 1.
ARTICLE 3: Rights to Office and Status

• Section 1
  
  • Officers are the messengers and enforcers of his holiness's will. They are the religious bishops which you look to for guidance. A Officer must adhere to the will of Supreme Leader, else they risk excommunication.
• Section 2
  
  • Officers are the select nations chosen by our ruler to execute his bidding, and to maintain the region during our ruler's disinterest. Officers may also only be demoted by Supreme Leader.
• Section 3
  
  • For an officer to veto a bill, at least 2 must agree to do so (unless Supreme leader intervenes).
• Section 4
  
  • An excommunicated nation (whether it be an officer or a normal member of society) will be shunned by its brothers and friends. Only Supreme Leader may lift the excommunication.
ARTICLE 4: Rights of Supreme Leadership

• Section 1
  
  • Supreme Leader Neuve Zealandia is above the law, and is the embodiment of Hiroyuki on earth.
• Section 2
  
  • Supreme Leader Neuve Zealandia is holy in all things, and is responsible for keeping historical records of our region.
• Section 3
  
  • Supreme Leader Neuve Zealandia may veto a bill by himself, and any law which is passed by the Senate may be sent for repeal by his greatness.
• Section 4
  
  • Supreme Leader Neuve Zealandia may not pass any policy, law, or declaration by himself. All issues must be presented to the Senate.
• Section 5
  
  • All previous sections in ARTICLE 3 are permitted to exist by his holiness.

[Neuve Zealandia]

I do like the ideas about a way of electing Judges in Hithlia's post. At the moment I think it'd be a shortlist between that and Roma MA's. Might announce an hour's deadline before doing the poll

We need to devise a succession policy, in case something happens to the Supreme Leader. I also think it is foolish to refer to the current Supreme Leader in name in the constitution.
I know this might seem like an overly pessimistic suggestion, given the young age of our confederacy, but many nations and empires have fallen because they considered their leader immortal.

Here's my version of a Constitution. Please, make any suggestions and amendments where you wish.

This is fantastic. The best one I've seen yet.

The game does have a built in method of succession in the Delegate mechanism. We just need to elect someone else to share power with me in some form of a duumvirate so that should I leave, power can be transferred easily. The problem is that my powers are inherent in the Region, i.e. the only way I can be stripped of them is by leaving the region. The Delegate, however, is a voted position so that solves that problem

[Roma MA]

Reformatted, looks nicer. Text fits a Religious Confederation.

The Constitution of the Holy Historian Confederation
We, as citizens of The Holy Historian Confederation, do righteously issue this Regional Constitution in the name of local peace, cooperation, justice, and security. By the guiding hand of Neuve Zealandia we birth this confederacy as brothers in arms. May we uphold it on our honor, else lord Hiroyuki smite us.

ARTICLE I: Rights to Legislation and Senatorial Power

• Section 1
  
  • The Senate, acting in the best wishes of Lord Hiroyuki himself, is granted full and total powers of Legislation, to better band together, protect, and promote the peoples of the Holy Historian Confederation
• Section 2
  
  • Every nation of Historia, by Lord Hiroyuki's grace, shall be granted rights to vote in the Senate. Those who represent Lord Hiroyuki himself, the Officers (see Article 3) are recognized as moderators of Debate and Senate. They are Lord Hiroyuki's Paragons. His First Prophet, Neuve Zealandia also holds special powers of moderation of Debate and Senate should need arise.
    
    • Meetings for the Debate must be announced at least 24 hours beforehand to give citizen nations adequate time to join.
    • A 2/3 majority is required for the execution of any policy, law, or declaration.
    • A greater percentage is required to veto any Legislation.
• Section 3
  
  • The Senate is an arm of the Lord Hiroyuki, and by extension, the officers and ruler of the region, and will act as such in affairs which are relevant politics of regions beyond Historia.
• Section 4
  
  • All members of the Senate may present a policy, law, or declaration to meeting.
    
    • Issues and discussions announced by Neuve Zealandia precede all over topics.
    • Officers of the Holy Confederation shall retain Rights Secunudus in precedence of their issues and discussions.
ARTICLE 2: Rights to Freedoms

• Section 1
  
  • All nations of the Holy Historian Confederation retain the right to declare their freedoms unjustly infringed upon by outside parties, whether within or without the Confederation.
    
    • If such a declaration surfaces, a committee will be convened between the Confederation's Officers and Supreme Leader to decide on proper action and judgement.
• Section 2
  
  • Nations of the Region may freely decide their policies without fear of Senate intervention.
    
    • Only a policy, law, or declaration that was proposed by an officer or the Supreme leader may supersede their rights.
    • Even then, a nation has the right to Section 1.
ARTICLE 3: Rights to Office and Status

• Section 1
  
  • Officers are the messengers and enforcers of his holiness's will. They are the religious bishops which you look to for guidance. A Officer must adhere to the will of Supreme Leader, else they risk excommunication.
• Section 2
  
  • Officers are the select nations chosen by our ruler to execute his bidding, and to maintain the region during our ruler's disinterest. Officers may also only be demoted by Supreme Leader.
• Section 3
  
  • For an officer to veto a bill, at least 2 must agree to do so (unless Supreme leader intervenes).
• Section 4
  
  • An excommunicated nation (whether it be an officer or a normal member of society) will be shunned by its brothers and friends. Only Supreme Leader may lift the excommunication.
ARTICLE 4: Rights of Supreme Leadership

• Section 1
  
  • Supreme Leader Neuve Zealandia is above the law, and is the embodiment of Hiroyuki on earth.
• Section 2
  
  • Supreme Leader Neuve Zealandia is holy in all things, and is responsible for keeping historical records of our region.
• Section 3
  
  • Supreme Leader Neuve Zealandia may veto a bill by himself, and any law which is passed by the Senate may be sent for repeal by his greatness.
• Section 4
  
  • Supreme Leader Neuve Zealandia may not pass any policy, law, or declaration by himself. All issues must be presented to the Senate.
• Section 5
  
  • All previous sections in ARTICLE 3 are permitted to exist by his holiness.

10/10

[Roma MA]

I do like the ideas about a way of electing Judges in Hithlia's post. At the moment I think it'd be a shortlist between that and Roma MA's. Might announce an hour's deadline before doing the poll

We need to devise a succession policy, in case something happens to the Supreme Leader. I also think it is foolish to refer to the current Supreme Leader in name in the constitution.
I know this might seem like an overly pessimistic suggestion, given the young age of our confederacy, but many nations and empires have fallen because they considered their leader immortal.



This is fantastic. The best one I've seen yet.

The game does have a built in method of succession in the Delegate mechanism. We just need to elect someone else to share power with me in some form of a duumvirate so that should I leave, power can be transferred easily. The problem is that my powers are inherent in the Region, i.e. the only way I can be stripped of them is by leaving the region. The Delegate, however, is a voted position so that solves that problem

I also like the judge article. It should be added to whatever Constitution we have.

[Hithlia]

The game does have a built in method of succession in the Delegate mechanism. We just need to elect someone else to share power with me in some form of a duumvirate so that should I leave, power can be transferred easily. The problem is that my powers are inherent in the Region, i.e. the only way I can be stripped of them is by leaving the region. The Delegate, however, is a voted position so that solves that problem

Just to throw out an unedited suggestion, what if the changes were the following:

The Second Article
Section 1 - The Executive Authority of the Region shall be vested in the title of Supreme Leader. The Supreme Leader shall hold the title of Regional Delegate to the World Assembly.

and

The Third Article
Section Six – The Director shall oversee all secular, interregional activity. The Director may not serve as Regional Delegate to the World Assembly.

That way, a duumvirate is avoided and, in practicality, the holder of the Regional Delegate title is the Supreme Leader. Does that work?

[Occasus Portus]

I would like to suggest this.

ARTICLE 5

Section 1
A Holy Council consisting of the Senate Officers will discuss and debate religious issues and vote on new Canon Laws.

Section 2
Supreme Leader Neuve Zealandia has the same authority and priority in the Holy Council as in the Senate. See Article 4 Section 3.

Section 3
An Officer chosen by the Supreme Leader will have more power than the other Officers in the Holy Council but will still have less power than the Supreme Leader. This position exists in the event that Supreme Leader is not present at the Holy Council, however if how a religious issue was solved is not to the pleasure of Supreme Leader it must be repealed and revisited.

Section 4 3
Canon Laws can be proposed by any Officer , however the High Bishop will have priority over the other Officers in the Holy Council , though the Supreme Leader has priority over all.

I was thinking that the Holy Council consist of different nations than the Senate, but due to the religious aspects of the Officers as Bishops, I was forced to rewrite my proposition. If it can be agreed that the Officers have a religious role but do not have power in the Holy Council then I can rewrite it to my original draft.\

EDIT: I should have made it clearer that this was an add on to Rome MA's constitution.

Some feedback has made it clear I should edit a Section of this article.
Edits are made to Section 3 and 4.
The High Bishop position has been erased from this Article.

[Neuve Zealandia]

I'm gonna have to bow out cause I've got 500 years of land law to study but Roma and Ethingynameperson ones both have my stamp of approval

[Shanix]

I'll give whatever we want a good formatting, and I'm a bit preferential to mine.

[Roma MA]

I'll give whatever we want a good formatting, and I'm a bit preferential to mine.

You mean ours? Lol.

[Mandchourie]

It would be interesting to have some kind of triumvirate : The Senate, the Great Leader, the arch-bishop/patriarch/pope/whatever his name is of the church of Hiroyuki (blessed was his name for giving us the /his/ board)(bwhnfgut/his/b).

The constitution would guarantee the equilibrium between those 3 power. In normal time, the senate would be in charge most of the time but the Great Leader and the *Religious Leader* could intervene in political debate and hold the same power individually. At least in the law.

The 2/3 law would work everytime there is no consensus in the senate, making statu-quo impossible in dire situation.

I'm pretty sure the struggle between the democratic senate, the tyrannical Great Leader and the religious *Religious leader* woud be fun to witness.

[Neuve Zealandia]

Repost my ideas
As we can't really create an operable Republic or Theocracy within the limits of the game, I recoommend we adopt a Westminster styled constitution. In this, the Senate or whatever name we so choose would derive its power to legislate from me, the head of state, and thus require royal assent (analagous to my proposed veto power). The de facto leader of the Region (the prime minister) would govern in my stead for Times when I'm unavailable to administrate the region. This can be achieved by using your ability to vote for a regional delegate, who holds all the powers that I do. I, as founder, have the ability to dissmiss them from their position which would create a check upon their power. The power to elect officers would rest in me or the RD, and their number cannot be more than 3 per area of responsibility. Furthermore, to avoid officers from amassing too much power, one officer cannot hold more than two officers (the exceptions being me and the RD). In order to ban an individual, a court consisting of the RD and at least 2 other officers (must be an odd number) will be convened and must have a 2/3 majority for a ban. Thoughts?

[Roma MA]

For the benefit of our two nations, and to preserve peace and control in our local region. The Republic of Sciaca and The Empire of Roma MA have decided to unite as equal, sovereign nations. With this alliance may we both prosper. Below are the agreed upon terms.


The Republic of Sciaca and The Empire of Roma MA will share in the patrolling and protecting of the whole of the middle of the Mediterranean. On top of this we will levy our authority in the region to control sea trade in this region as well; this is our birthright.

The Empire of Roma MA will willingly offer assistance to Sciaca with any invasion or act of aggression it has experienced. Sciaca is not obliged to return the same courtesy because of its smaller size.

Before any war is declared by either nation, a conversation must be held between the two on the topic of how it will affect them, and of what mutual actions (if any) should be taken.

Both parties will respect each other's independence, and will not partake in any action which may directly harm their partner.

A joint military and naval base will be held between the two nations at Corsica, a Roman island. This is to stress and put into practice a sense of cooperation between the nations.

Both nations will receive military access to their partner’s regions. Roma MA will send military orders through The Republic of Sciaca for Imperial troops in currently in Sciaca territory. The Empire will not directly command Roman troops unless the Empire intends to remove them from Sciaca territories or to protect Sciaca in a war.

With the terms declared the Roma MA/Sciaca alliance is complete.

[Gagauz Tarcil Budjak and Dobruj Peoples]

The Republic of Sciaca and The Empire of Roma MA will share in the patrolling and protecting of the whole of the middle of the Mediterranean. On top of this we will levy our authority in the region to control sea trade in this region as well; this is our birthright.

muh free trade

[Occasus Portus]

The Republic of Sciaca and The Empire of Roma MA will share in the patrolling and protecting of the whole of the middle of the Mediterranean. On top of this we will levy our authority in the region to control sea trade in this region as well; this is our birthright.

ree, no monopoly for you. Roman-Sciacan thalassocracy over the Mediterranean will not be tolerated.

[Gagauz Tarcil Budjak and Dobruj Peoples]

For the benefit, unity, and protection of us three nations, we, the Empire of Gagauz, Tarcil, Budjak, and Dobruj Peoples; the Principality of Antopatra, and the Republic of Occasus Portus, have decided to form an alliance, the East Seas Trade Alliance (ESTA). Below are the terms of the alliance.
1. These three nations will patrol and protect the Black and Eastern Mediterranean seas. We will control trade in the region as well
2. If one nation declares war, the other two nations will come to assist the first one.
3. Borders between the three nations will be open and any country's ships can dock in any other's ports.
Others are able to join this alliance, but must be capitalist and in the Eastern Mediterranean or Black Seas and are approved by all alliance members.
With that concludes the terms to the alliance.

[Clovinia]

Where do I make my claims in territory gaize

[Gagauz Tarcil Budjak and Dobruj Peoples]

So the Vassal Grand Duchy of Sinai-Suez has joined ESTA. Only good things can come of this.

[Roma MA]

Let this document act as a binding statement where the Swag Dictatorship of Jarl Ballin' and Roma MA united. While the peace making process was difficult, thanks to Mandchourie it was a success. Below are the terms.

The Republic of Sciaca, The Empire of Roma MA, and The Swag Dictatorship will share in the patrolling and protecting of the whole of the middle of the Mediterranean. On top of this we will levy our authority in the region to control sea trade in this region as well; this is our birthright.

The Empire of Roma MA will willingly offer assistance to The Swag DIctatorship with any invasion or act of aggression it has experienced. This is vice versa.

War is an important topic, therefore before war is declared by either nation a meeting must be held by all allies which are involved.

Both parties will respect each other's independence, and will not partake in any action which may directly harm their partner.

The Swag Dictatorship will join the military and naval base at Corsica.

The Swag Dictatorship will be permitted to build a Naval shipbuilding base at Corsica.

Both nations will receive military access to their partner’s regions.

Roma MA and The Swag Dictatorship will give up their old currency in exchange for a new, united currency. The Mediterranean Central Bank will be located in Roma, and according to agreement, the President of the bank will be selected by Jarl Balgruuf the Swag. This united currency will now be known as the CEURO.

[Gagauz Tarcil Budjak and Dobruj Peoples]

Red Sea and Caspian Sea welcome to ESTA Alliance!