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[TWI ONLY] The Senate of the Western Isles

Where nations come together and discuss matters of varying degrees of importance. [In character]

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Agadar
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7784
Founded: Dec 06, 2009
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Agadar » Tue Jul 26, 2016 12:08 pm

How are you going to enforce said endorsement cap? You can't just kick Ayeris out, and you can't get people to lower their endorsements, it's not in them who did it in the first place.


The same way every other region in the history of NationStates enforces endorsement caps: warning people to lower their endorsements should they violate the cap, and ejecting them should they fail to comply with the warning. Also, the only people who violate the endorsement cap are those who actively seek to violate it, because everyone else will stop gathering endorsements long before they violate the cap.

Furthermore, this region has shown time and time again about how much we actually care about the World Assembly, being not much. Yeah sure, whoever gets the position can try and recruit World Assembly members, but most active nations do that by themselves.


You will likely not find many people who care less about the World Assembly than my own person. But regardless of how I feel about the World Assembly, is it a simple fact that whoever has the most WA endorsements will inherit the region should the Founder CTE, and as such we must choose between either actively involving ourselves with the World Assembly, or accepting the risk that the region will die together with its Founder.

Furthermore, this can already be done without any amendments in the first place, citing Article II; Section 2 and 3: We all know the executives can give executive orders, and it is clearly in the Presidents scope to provide neccasary actions for previously unforeseen matters. Knowing this, and that what to do if Van disappears is a previously unforeseen matter that needs action, the President could simply issue an executive order and appoint an heir to the WA Delegate position or if needed issue an endorsement cap, but I personally think the fact this region doesn't have one attracts people, it did for me


If Van gets banned or otherwise unexpectedly CTE's, then there is absolutely nothing the President or anyone else can do to stop the executive WA delegate. It will already be too late, and we will be fully at the mercy of whoever has the most endorsements.

I like that idea! Or it could just be the current president, then the Vice President becomes president, then there would be an election for Vice President.


Anyone can run for President. It is as such not feasible for the President to also be the executive WA delegate because it is unsafe and practically impossible to safely transfer the WA delegacy between Presidents.

And doesn't the name Secretary of Endorsments just sound weird?


It's 'Endorsements', and no, I don't think it sounds weird.
Proud resident of The Western Isles, the #1 role-playing region!
Developer of Telegrammer, NS API Java Wrapper, and more!

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Taziristan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1311
Founded: Jun 11, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Taziristan » Tue Jul 26, 2016 12:51 pm

The simple fact of the matter here is that we have a nation who we do not know that is actively seeking endorsements and does not talk to us or roleplaying. This nation would inherit the region. Not only should there be an endorsement cap, but thI'd secretary of endorsements should be made as soon as possible. Banning van is not a large leap from banning our secretary of information. This could happen, it eventually will happen in the CTE as van is his own person and could even die tomorrow. We need this security, we need this position.
Occupation of Taziristan
Proud member of The Western Isles.
Former Secretary of the Exterior.
Former Senator.

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Eutriston
Envoy
 
Posts: 237
Founded: Jun 17, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Eutriston » Tue Jul 26, 2016 12:57 pm

I'll let this go through, I don't think the position itself is needed but the purpose of it is a problem that needs addressed, and it be better not to remain in gridlock for so long we never come up with the solution we wanted in the first place. We are not the U.S. Congress.
Capitalism is Much Superior Commie
No Nationstates Stats Used
Proud Member of The Western Isles
Former Member of the Information Committee of The Western Isles
Former Senator of The Western Isles
Former Chief Justice of the Western Isles

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Agadar
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7784
Founded: Dec 06, 2009
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Agadar » Wed Jul 27, 2016 2:42 pm

It seems we're just about done discussing the proposal, with no one having a strong voice for changes/improvements or opposition to it. As such, I move to vote.
Proud resident of The Western Isles, the #1 role-playing region!
Developer of Telegrammer, NS API Java Wrapper, and more!

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Verdon
Diplomat
 
Posts: 679
Founded: Apr 27, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Verdon » Sat Jul 30, 2016 8:35 pm

second motion

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Dashgrinaar
Minister
 
Posts: 2001
Founded: Apr 30, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Dashgrinaar » Sat Jul 30, 2016 9:46 pm

Motion carried, the voting period is now open.
Dashgrinaar
Proud Member of The Western Isles
Speaker Pro Tempore and Senator Emeritus
Vice President of The Western Isles

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Agadar
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7784
Founded: Dec 06, 2009
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Agadar » Sat Jul 30, 2016 11:49 pm

I vote FOR.
Proud resident of The Western Isles, the #1 role-playing region!
Developer of Telegrammer, NS API Java Wrapper, and more!

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Polar Svalbard
Senator
 
Posts: 3642
Founded: Mar 28, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Polar Svalbard » Sun Jul 31, 2016 7:14 pm

Psst, hey maybe, just maybe you add in a part that says we ban ayers from the region. You know, because he's worthless to the region and a potential enemy to the regime. Just saying.
Member of The Western Isles
Svalbardian international policy summarized: "Shoot first, hope that no one asks questions later." - Linaviar

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Eutriston
Envoy
 
Posts: 237
Founded: Jun 17, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Eutriston » Sun Jul 31, 2016 8:54 pm

Polar Svalbard wrote:Psst, hey maybe, just maybe you add in a part that says we ban ayers from the region. You know, because he's worthless to the region and a potential enemy to the regime. Just saying.

He hasn't done anything to deserve as such. Remember, innocent until proven guilty, not guilty until proven innocent. We could move to question why he constantly tries to maintain his status as second highest endorsed, and if his answer is not satisfactory or otherwise treasonous, we could base our decision off of that, rather than suspicion.
Capitalism is Much Superior Commie
No Nationstates Stats Used
Proud Member of The Western Isles
Former Member of the Information Committee of The Western Isles
Former Senator of The Western Isles
Former Chief Justice of the Western Isles

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Agadar
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7784
Founded: Dec 06, 2009
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Agadar » Mon Aug 01, 2016 4:25 am

Polar Svalbard wrote:Psst, hey maybe, just maybe you add in a part that says we ban ayers from the region. You know, because he's worthless to the region and a potential enemy to the regime. Just saying.


There is no need to: if Ayers refuses to comply with the EndorSec's endorsement cap, then he is authorized to banject him.
Proud resident of The Western Isles, the #1 role-playing region!
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Polar Svalbard
Senator
 
Posts: 3642
Founded: Mar 28, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Polar Svalbard » Mon Aug 01, 2016 12:35 pm

Agadar wrote:
Polar Svalbard wrote:Psst, hey maybe, just maybe you add in a part that says we ban ayers from the region. You know, because he's worthless to the region and a potential enemy to the regime. Just saying.


There is no need to: if Ayers refuses to comply with the EndorSec's endorsement cap, then he is authorized to banject him.

Hey you were the one that said "What if Van gets banned tomorrow?" So, you know, just best looking out for my glorious president and founder.
Member of The Western Isles
Svalbardian international policy summarized: "Shoot first, hope that no one asks questions later." - Linaviar

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Agadar
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7784
Founded: Dec 06, 2009
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Agadar » Mon Aug 01, 2016 2:41 pm

Polar Svalbard wrote:
Agadar wrote:
There is no need to: if Ayers refuses to comply with the EndorSec's endorsement cap, then he is authorized to banject him.

Hey you were the one that said "What if Van gets banned tomorrow?" So, you know, just best looking out for my glorious president and founder.


Your worries are shared by all of us, but like Eutriston already indicated, until something like the Secretary of Endorsements Amendment becomes law, we have no legal grounds to ban Ayers. We have only suspicions that could be followed up on.
Proud resident of The Western Isles, the #1 role-playing region!
Developer of Telegrammer, NS API Java Wrapper, and more!

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Taziristan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1311
Founded: Jun 11, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Taziristan » Mon Aug 01, 2016 5:30 pm

Agadar wrote:
Polar Svalbard wrote:Hey you were the one that said "What if Van gets banned tomorrow?" So, you know, just best looking out for my glorious president and founder.


Your worries are shared by all of us, but like Eutriston already indicated, until something like the Secretary of Endorsements Amendment becomes law, we have no legal grounds to ban Ayers. We have only suspicions that could be followed up on.

If van drops below a hundred endorsements, I suggest a banjection. However, constitutionally that would be miKS decision. The Senate cannot ban people. Only the president and founder can do that, and even then, the founder does so with the presidents ok.
Occupation of Taziristan
Proud member of The Western Isles.
Former Secretary of the Exterior.
Former Senator.

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Agadar
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7784
Founded: Dec 06, 2009
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Agadar » Tue Aug 02, 2016 5:48 am

Taziristan wrote:
Agadar wrote:
Your worries are shared by all of us, but like Eutriston already indicated, until something like the Secretary of Endorsements Amendment becomes law, we have no legal grounds to ban Ayers. We have only suspicions that could be followed up on.

If van drops below a hundred endorsements, I suggest a banjection. However, constitutionally that would be miKS decision. The Senate cannot ban people. Only the president and founder can do that, and even then, the founder does so with the presidents ok.


The Founder is legally allowed to ban people according to Consequences for Actions under the 'Treason' and 'Sedition' clauses, but we digress.

The voting period on the Secretary of Endorsements Amendment has ended, as it is dictated to last at most 48 hours by the Senate Procedure and Conduct and 56 hours have passed since Speaker Dash declared the opening of the voting period.

While I am glad the amendment passed the Senate, I would like to express my disappointment that out of the 5 sitting Senators, only ONE (namely, myself) cast their vote. I will not be calling colleagues out individually, as I do not know the nature of their absence during this voting and thus it would be premature of me to (mis)judge them, but I do hope I won't be the only Senator actively partaking in the passing of laws in the future.
Proud resident of The Western Isles, the #1 role-playing region!
Developer of Telegrammer, NS API Java Wrapper, and more!

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Dashgrinaar
Minister
 
Posts: 2001
Founded: Apr 30, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Dashgrinaar » Tue Aug 02, 2016 11:10 am

The Amendment passes the Senate 6 votes to none, with 13 abstaining. It shall be presented to the Court for further action.
Dashgrinaar
Proud Member of The Western Isles
Speaker Pro Tempore and Senator Emeritus
Vice President of The Western Isles

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Verdon
Diplomat
 
Posts: 679
Founded: Apr 27, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Verdon » Sat Aug 06, 2016 11:47 am

Due to some personal stuff and changes, I will be taking a more passive role on NS. I formally resign from my senate position and highly recommend Agadar as next speaker pro tempore!

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Agadar
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7784
Founded: Dec 06, 2009
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Agadar » Sat Aug 06, 2016 2:43 pm

Verdon wrote:Due to some personal stuff and changes, I will be taking a more passive role on NS. I formally resign from my senate position and highly recommend Agadar as next speaker pro tempore!


This is sad to hear. I hope you will make it safe and well through the personal stuff and changes you're going through. I'm glad you'll still stick around, albeit more passively. If you ever need any support, I am here to listen and help.

I'd also like to thank you for your recommendation. It means a lot to know my efforts are valued by you.
Proud resident of The Western Isles, the #1 role-playing region!
Developer of Telegrammer, NS API Java Wrapper, and more!

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Dashgrinaar
Minister
 
Posts: 2001
Founded: Apr 30, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Dashgrinaar » Sun Aug 07, 2016 1:04 pm

I'm going to be slightly inactive for the next two weeks, so the new Speaker Pro Tempore will need to step right into their positions. Therefore, I see Agadar as the best candidate and Agadar will assume the position of SPT.

Verdon, it's sad to see you leave the Senate, your tenure was a great one, and thank you for serving.
Dashgrinaar
Proud Member of The Western Isles
Speaker Pro Tempore and Senator Emeritus
Vice President of The Western Isles

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Agadar
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7784
Founded: Dec 06, 2009
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Agadar » Sun Aug 07, 2016 2:16 pm

Dashgrinaar wrote:I'm going to be slightly inactive for the next two weeks, so the new Speaker Pro Tempore will need to step right into their positions. Therefore, I see Agadar as the best candidate and Agadar will assume the position of SPT.

Verdon, it's sad to see you leave the Senate, your tenure was a great one, and thank you for serving.


I thank you for the appointment to Speaker Pro Tempore, and will do my best to make sure the Senate doesn't blow itself up while you're inactive during the coming two weeks.
Proud resident of The Western Isles, the #1 role-playing region!
Developer of Telegrammer, NS API Java Wrapper, and more!

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Agadar
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7784
Founded: Dec 06, 2009
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Agadar » Sat Aug 13, 2016 11:07 am

Our Founder Vancouvia has presented Ostehaar as his candidate for the office of Secretary of Endorsements, a position created recently by the Secretary of Endorsements Amendment. As outlined in this amendment, the Founder needs 'approval from the President and majority votes from the Senate and the Supreme Court' before the appointment is finalized. President Miklania has already given his approval, and thus it is now up to us, the Senate, to give or refuse our approval as well, via a simple majority vote.

As such, I hereby open a 48-hour voting period during which all Senators can cast their vote FOR or AGAINST appointing Ostehaar to Secretary of Endorsements.

Telegrams will be sent to all sitting Senators to ensure they are aware of this voting period.
Proud resident of The Western Isles, the #1 role-playing region!
Developer of Telegrammer, NS API Java Wrapper, and more!

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Agadar
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7784
Founded: Dec 06, 2009
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Agadar » Sat Aug 13, 2016 11:12 am

I consider Ostehaar to be a trustworthy and highly engaged member of TWI's community, and thus I vote FOR appointing him to Secretary of Endorsements.
Proud resident of The Western Isles, the #1 role-playing region!
Developer of Telegrammer, NS API Java Wrapper, and more!

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Doppler
Diplomat
 
Posts: 540
Founded: Apr 30, 2015
Ex-Nation

Postby Doppler » Sat Aug 13, 2016 10:17 pm

I vote FOR, Ostehaar is very trustful so he has earned my vote.
Proud member of The Western Isles
Please, call me Doppy

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Maplou
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 13
Founded: May 16, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Maplou » Sun Aug 14, 2016 4:13 pm

I vote FOR, seeing as Ostehaar is quite trustworthy
Just an average 7 mil ppl nation

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Agadar
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7784
Founded: Dec 06, 2009
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Agadar » Sun Aug 14, 2016 5:19 pm

All Senators have cast their votes, and thus the voting period has ended.

By unanimous vote, the Senate approves appointing Ostehaar to Secretary of Endorsements.

This result will be posted on the RMB for all to see.
Proud resident of The Western Isles, the #1 role-playing region!
Developer of Telegrammer, NS API Java Wrapper, and more!

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Taziristan
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1311
Founded: Jun 11, 2016
Ex-Nation

Postby Taziristan » Thu Aug 18, 2016 6:20 am

I would like to suggest that the Senate debate whether a law is needed again at making puppets simply to inflate our regions numbers. Eutriston created 25 or so and sent them here. If this practice is repeated, it would be extremely difficult to tell if it is an invasion or just a member of our region feeling that an inflated number of nations is better than an accurate one.

Edit: also, the debate should be more about whether it is necessary and where such legislation belongs. I'm thinking more as a presidential EO than a law.
Last edited by Taziristan on Thu Aug 18, 2016 6:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
Occupation of Taziristan
Proud member of The Western Isles.
Former Secretary of the Exterior.
Former Senator.

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