NationStates

Why not just enforce embargoes and sanctions instead of a war? Surely you'd lose more lives than you'd save in a bloody conflict?

How many slaves are there and how does that compare to projected casualties/financial losses? A war is definitely not worth it...

Alternatively, blockades aren't always acts of war, so that's a good option.

Singaporean Transhumans wrote:I'm working on the PTFS Civil War OOC thread, will be up in a few hours (Not!)

btw for useless spam

I took this quiz. I apparently thought I was going to score Supremacy, but well...
im gonna delete my civbe game

I got Purity, which is obviously the best affinity. Anyone who disagrees is a disgusting technophile or a tree-hugging hippie. :>

New Frenco Empire wrote:

Singaporean Transhumans wrote:I'm working on the PTFS Civil War OOC thread, will be up in a few hours (Not!)

btw for useless spam

I took this quiz. I apparently thought I was going to score Supremacy, but well...
im gonna delete my civbe game

I got Purity, which is obviously the best affinity. Anyone who disagrees is a disgusting technophile or a tree-hugging hippie. :>

But there's nothing wrong with being a technophile...

Praesidia wrote:Why not just enforce embargoes and sanctions instead of a war? Surely you'd lose more lives than you'd save in a bloody conflict?

How many slaves are there and how does that compare to projected casualties/financial losses? A war is definitely not worth it...

Alternatively, blockades aren't always acts of war, so that's a good option.

What makes you think the Imperium has any trade with Excidium Planetis? IC, our nations have hardly interacted beyond the World Assembly, and our Isolationist policies tend to leave us without trading partners in general.

Allancia wrote:

New Frenco Empire wrote:I got Purity, which is obviously the best affinity. Anyone who disagrees is a disgusting technophile or a tree-hugging hippie. :>

But there's nothing wrong with being a technophile...

It is once you forget the face of Mother Earth!

I got Supremacy, thankfully. Harmony would have also worked, but I consider myself to be slightly more on the "Techno" side of a Technogaianist. Slightly.

Tinfect wrote:

Praesidia wrote:Why not just enforce embargoes and sanctions instead of a war? Surely you'd lose more lives than you'd save in a bloody conflict?

How many slaves are there and how does that compare to projected casualties/financial losses? A war is definitely not worth it...

Alternatively, blockades aren't always acts of war, so that's a good option.

What makes you think the Imperium has any trade with Excidium Planetis? IC, our nations have hardly interacted beyond the World Assembly, and our Isolationist policies tend to leave us without trading partners in general.

Then blockade! A well done blockade can cripple the target's economy. Look at the Union blockade of the Confederates! You don't even have to block all the ships, just the ones large enough to carry sizeable materiel. Plus, if they attack your blockade then they are declaring war, not you. It'll make the WA side of things much simpler, I'm sure.

Tinfect wrote:

Atomic Utopia wrote:So how big is your empire? what 50, 300 billion people?

Just over 67 Billion people, at the moment.
And suddenly your factbook gives you 829 Billion.
What.

Honestly I am trying to decide on a number that is not too big as to sound excessive and not too small (so each planet does not have a small population). 829 was the first number that popped into my brain before I even asked you that question, I was just attempting to find out what others have for their populations and attempt to find out where to place mine.

I would like to have plenty of planets from an RP perspective because:

-Planetary evacuations are fun.
-Having to prioritize where to send fleets is fun and adds fodder to the diplomatic chatter.
-Gives me more excuses to have things occurring, if you have only 30 or so planets having a horrible disease break out on one of them every week is kind of excessive.
-It means I can border more stuff, and therefore be more concerned about more stuff without sounding silly

On the other hand, too many planets makes the concept of an empire that big seem excessive and might also break people's willing suspension of disbelief.

Aeiouia wrote:I got Supremacy, thankfully. Harmony would have also worked, but I consider myself to be slightly more on the "Techno" side of a Technogaianist. Slightly.

Same with me, looking at how the system works I will probably be a combo of supremacy and purity. Invade everything that I can and attempt to beat my enemies through technology. Like I do in any other Civ game, until I fail that is.

Atomic Utopia wrote:Honestly I am trying to decide on a number that is not too big as to sound excessive and not too small (so each planet does not have a small population). 829 was the first number that popped into my brain before I even asked you that question, I was just attempting to find out what others have for their populations and attempt to find out where to place mine.

I would like to have plenty of planets from an RP perspective because:

-Planetary evacuations are fun.
-Having to prioritize where to send fleets is fun and adds fodder to the diplomatic chatter.
-Gives me more excuses to have things occurring, if you have only 30 or so planets having a horrible disease break out on one of them every week is kind of excessive.
-It means I can border more stuff, and therefore be more concerned about more stuff without sounding silly

On the other hand, too many planets makes the concept of an empire that big seem excessive and might also break people's willing suspension of disbelief.

Fair enough, the Imperium has quite a low population density in any case, especially given how most of our worlds are near Earth sized.

Aeiouia wrote:Same with me, looking at how the system works I will probably be a combo of supremacy and purity. Invade everything that I can and attempt to beat my enemies through technology. Like I do in any other Civ game, until I fail that is.

Same here. Military Victories are so much more fun, even though I inevitably get stomped by the end of the game.

Tinfect wrote:Same here. Military Victories are so much more fun, even though I inevitably get stomped by the end of the game.

I usually go for Technology Victories in Civilization games. Especially in Civ3, when you get this awesome cutscene in a Space Race Victory.

Praesidia wrote:Then blockade! A well done blockade can cripple the target's economy. Look at the Union blockade of the Confederates! You don't even have to block all the ships, just the ones large enough to carry sizeable materiel. Plus, if they attack your blockade then they are declaring war, not you. It'll make the WA side of things much simpler, I'm sure.

We could probably assist Tinfect with a blockade, since it would not involve hurting anyone. Although, we would prefer to win the battle at Olber and get the slaves liberated that way. So, it will be a possible backup plan if we fail.

Aeiouia wrote:

Tinfect wrote:Same here. Military Victories are so much more fun, even though I inevitably get stomped by the end of the game.

I usually go for Technology Victories in Civilization games. Especially in Civ3, when you get this awesome cutscene in a Space Race Victory.

Whelp. that was awesome. Now I have to actually try winning in Civ 3 instead of just playing around with an AI until Mayan Tanks/Jet Fighters show up from another continent to fuck up all my Middle Ages shit.

Atomic Utopia wrote:

Aeiouia wrote:
Indeed. As stated earlier, Aeiouia will probably take all possible non-violent actions to liberate your slaves if we find out in-character.

This will probably involve demanding their freedom as payment if we win the battle at Olber. Honestly, it would make a good plot point, as Aeiouia was planning on just pretending to fight your forces and letting you easily take the world without any resistance, since it has little value to us, and we do not want to hurt your soldiers by mistake.

However, if we are fighting for the freedom of an alien race, you can expect us to actually take the battle really seriously.

I wonder if it could be a joint operation. I no doubt will have a fleet go and attempt to clean up the mess my insane admiral has made and provide support for the Excidium Planetis citizens affected by the attempted nuking of the Homeship. It is only logical for support to be withheld until they give the slaves to us so we can free them.

That is assuming my nation does find out, because it is bad form to act on the statements in an OOC thread as intel for your IC nation.

I'm pretty sure attempted genocide is worse than slavery in all cases. If your nation refused to help us after YOUR admiral attempted to annihilate our nation, because of a purely internal matter, we would hold your nation responsible for supporting genocide.

Praesidia wrote:

Tinfect wrote:
What makes you think the Imperium has any trade with Excidium Planetis? IC, our nations have hardly interacted beyond the World Assembly, and our Isolationist policies tend to leave us without trading partners in general.

Then blockade! A well done blockade can cripple the target's economy. Look at the Union blockade of the Confederates! You don't even have to block all the ships, just the ones large enough to carry sizeable materiel. Plus, if they attack your blockade then they are declaring war, not you.

I'm pretty sure blockades only work when the target nation can't pack up and move away at FTL speeds. Nomads are hard to blockade.

Tinfect wrote:

Excidium Planetis wrote:They haven't passed their citizenship tests yet.

And so they are Slaves? That makes no sense whatsoever.

Excidium Planetis wrote:How do you plan on doing that? Capturing a heavily defended ship with 600 million citizens who legally allowed to own military grade weapons?

Yes.
Imperial Soldiers are equipped with Powered Armour, Pulse Rifles, personal Energy Shielding, and the most advanced Armour Technology the Imperium can efficiently place on Powered Armour. Besides that, we have Armour support that likely outclasses your own by quite a bit, things such as our Grand Praetor Main Battle Tank. We are not afraid to use Planetcrackers to destroy your Scimitars, while our own Dreadnoughts, assorted Capital Ships, and Battleships massacre the rest of your fleet. We can, and will, follow the Reckoner wherever it goes. Beyond that, we clearly have allies in Atomic Utopia, and the Archailects.

The war may be long, it may even be hard. Millions, possibly Hundreds, of millions will die. But Excidium Planetis will not be among the survivors.

No, you said they didn't appear to be citizens. I explained why they are only considered residents, not citizens. Citizenship and Slavery are not mutually exclusive.

I'd like to see how you plan to deploy those tanks in a zero gravity environment where most ship sections below A level are separated by airlocks designed to fit humans, not armor divisions.
Also, last time I checked, your military fleet was outnumbered by mine, I had about 2 million civilian vessels, most armed with at least one offensive weapon, and a 7000 kilometer carrier with star docks, repair facilities, and literally millions of guns. And all of them will be fighting for the defense of their home. I hope your slaves (and I do mean that, any soldiers you brainwash into fighting an insane unprovoked war to slaughter civilians are far more slaves than any we have.) are loyal enough to commit suicide for your hypocritical crusade. Our slaves are freer than your citizens (unable to find much factbook info, so based mostly on NS stats and being a communist imperium). At least our slaves can vote, and are allowed far more civil freedoms than your citizens. Our slaves can purchase their freedom, but can your people ever escape their slavery to your government?

And our police force utilizes power armor, with energy rifles, coilguns, and some kind of pulse weapon. Bought them from AE Celestia. Urban warfare too, the defender's dream.

Excidium Planetis wrote:No, you said they didn't appear to be citizens. I explained why they are only considered residents, not citizens. Citizenship and Slavery are not mutually exclusive.

And that makes it okay to enslave them?

Excidium Planetis wrote:I'd like to see how you plan to deploy those tanks in a zero gravity environment where most ship sections below A level are separated by airlocks designed to fit humans, not armor divisions.

Well, for one, it really depends on whether or not your Ship's hull is made of Metal. Magnetism, and all that. But that is fair, we probably could not fit Tanks in most of the ship.

Excidium Planetis wrote:Also, last time I checked, your military fleet was outnumbered by mine, I had about 2 million civilian vessels, most armed with at least one offensive weapon,

Most of which are outclassed by a Princeps II, or Triarius III...

Excidium Planetis wrote: and a 7000 kilometer carrier with star docks, repair facilities, and literally millions of guns.

What did you miss about "Planetcracker"? And besides the point, if we do not feel like destroying the Reckoner, a Rassvet Dreadnought carries Planetary Bombardment weapons that would be of immense use here. Hell, older Ballistarius, and Macross Frigates carry them as well.

Excidium Planetis wrote:I hope your slaves (and I do mean that, any soldiers you brainwash into fighting an insane unprovoked war to slaughter civilians are far more slaves than any we have.) are loyal enough to commit suicide for your hypocritical crusade.

The soldiers of the Imperium, are by no means Slaves, they are free to leave whenever they wish, and we do not fire on Civilians if they are Non-Combatants. If they lay down their arms and do not fire on our Military Forces, they will remain unharmed.

Excidium Planetis wrote:Our slaves are freer than your citizens (unable to find much factbook info, so based mostly on NS stats and being a communist imperium)

*Socialist Imperium
But, yeah, I should probably write a Factbook on this. But, no, the Imperium has rather high Civil Rights, partially because it really is no business of the Imperium what one does in their free time unless they are disturbing the public order, (Murder, Theft, that sort of thing) or attempting to bring down the Imperium, and partially because we find that if you keep the people happy, they will have no reason to oppose the Government, Democracy, to them, would be worthless, as they already have most everything they want. Hell, we even let Private Industry deal with the things that Government really has no stake in. Beyond keeping our Citizens healthy, fed, and sheltered, it is largely private.
Except for Mining, Agriculture, Mass-Construction, Medical Services, Education, Military anything really and Research and Development.
I am sure I am forgetting something though.

Excidium Planetis wrote:. At least our slaves can vote

Wait, you let your Slaves vote? What.

Excidium Planetis wrote: Our slaves can purchase their freedom, but can your people ever escape their slavery to your government?

So... You pay your slaves?
Are they then, not really slaves?
Because that rather changes everything.
Fair point though, Imperial Border Control has something of a "No one comes in, no one comes out." policy.

Excidium Planetis wrote:And our police force utilizes power armor, with energy rifles, coilguns, and some kind of pulse weapon. Bought them from AE Celestia. Urban warfare too, the defender's dream.

Oh. Thought you just had those Rocket things.
Might be harder than I thought.

Excidium Planetis wrote:(and I do mean that, any soldiers you brainwash into fighting an insane unprovoked war to slaughter civilians are far more slaves than any we have.)

Granted, while we would take all possible non-violent actions to free your slaves, we are pacifists. So, we would not attack you or support an attack on you in an effort to liberate them. We would support all peaceful operations to free them, however.

On that note, you have compulsory military service for five years for all citizens. And you are willing to send them out to fight an insane, unprovoked war against a pacifistic, fellow libertarian nation that poses absolutely no threat to you. Over a bet.

Excidium Planetis wrote:(and I do mean that, any soldiers you brainwash into fighting an insane unprovoked war to slaughter civilians are far more slaves than any we have.)

You mean your shock troopers aren't violent meatheads that have a jingoistic attitude on par with U.S Marines? You aren't doing military right at all.

Excidium Planetis wrote:And our police force utilizes power armor, with energy rifles, coilguns, and some kind of pulse weapon. Bought them from AE Celestia. Urban warfare too, the defender's dream.

Our "police" which is basically any civilian that likes the government gets BFGs to use.

Now try beating that.

New Frenco Empire wrote:

Excidium Planetis wrote:(and I do mean that, any soldiers you brainwash into fighting an insane unprovoked war to slaughter civilians are far more slaves than any we have.)

You mean your shock troopers aren't violent meatheads that have a jingoistic attitude on par with U.S Marines? You aren't doing military right at all.

By contrast, our shock troopers are more comparable to heavily-armoured Einsatzgruppen than the USMC. We may have gone slightly bonkers on the military bit.

Blakullar wrote:

New Frenco Empire wrote:
You mean your shock troopers aren't violent meatheads that have a jingoistic attitude on par with U.S Marines? You aren't doing military right at all.

By contrast, our shock troopers are more comparable to heavily-armoured Einsatzgruppen than the USMC. We may have gone slightly bonkers on the military bit.

Have you ever met a Muhreen? I swear, some of them would make even the SS cringe!

New Frenco Empire wrote:

Blakullar wrote:By contrast, our shock troopers are more comparable to heavily-armoured Einsatzgruppen than the USMC. We may have gone slightly bonkers on the military bit.

Have you ever met a Muhreen? I swear, some of them would make even the SS cringe!

Have you ever met the Russian equivalent to a deep-South conservative headbanger? Now imagine him in a three metre-tall suit of armour and with a chaingun that weighs more than most people...

Blakullar wrote:

New Frenco Empire wrote:Have you ever met a Muhreen? I swear, some of them would make even the SS cringe!

Have you ever met the Russian equivalent to a deep-South conservative headbanger? Now imagine him in a three metre-tall suit of armour and with a chaingun that weighs more than most people...

At this point, I'd say "gg", but since Fallout 4 is making power armor seem like actual power armor instead of gloried Kevlar...

g.motherfucking.g

Alright so three things...

1) My nation also has a form of slavery, But there is no trafficking, and there are limitations on how long a person can be a slave and what can happen to them. In one book i believe this form of slavery is called being a Serf. So, should that be kept a secret IC?

2) I said i would be assisting Excidium. By that i meant that I would be assisting with all groups he was supporting.

3) The ship that will be used in this.
Yes i know its not a alot, But its the only craft with enough force to maintain height in atmospheric conditions. That is to say it can come low in to the air with out crashing XD.

What does PTFS stand for?

Praesidia wrote:What does PTFS stand for?

"People's Technocratic Federation of Singapore". It is the Singaporean Transhuman's in-character name.

Aeiouia wrote:

Praesidia wrote:What does PTFS stand for?

"People's Technocratic Federation of Singapore". It is the Singaporean Transhuman's in-character name.

Ah, so is that RP open to any member of the League of Mechanocracies?