The United Left [OOC|SIGN-UP|6.0]

[The United Motherland]

Multiple issudes with this:

- Anywhere "Predecessor" is written in reference to TNI should actually be "Successor".

- 3.2 and 3.5 are at odds. If 3.2 states that the laws and structure of the UL are so streamlined by everything changing based on 3 votes, which would be near autocracy, then it cannot be a bureacratic mess.

- This entire bill is slightly arrogant in assuming the UL is the sole left-wing alliance, in which case it is clearly not, seeing as the Commonwealth of Socialist States exists. So, in order to gain the entirety of the left-wing in TNI you would simultaneosly need the CSS' approval as well as the UL's

1. Can fix that.

2. I was pointing more in the sense that any structure besides the central command(which has no correctly defined powers and has tripped over it's own cords on a fair few occasions), but besides that it is totally unclear what goes on besides a total mesh of laziness and random work structures. It's severely unorganized and everything could be done with a lot of efficiency - but it would be a lot easier to do the TNI because it's faster and because of the other reasons as well. But I do see your point.

3. It is not - but that is a different issue and we are currently focusing on the older and more primary recognized alliance. CSS is outside of the commissioners reach although I do state multiple times "and other alliances."

[The United Remnants of America]

Multiple issudes with this:

- Anywhere "Predecessor" is written in reference to TNI should actually be "Successor".

- 3.2 and 3.5 are at odds. If 3.2 states that the laws and structure of the UL are so streamlined by everything changing based on 3 votes, which would be near autocracy, then it cannot be a bureacratic mess.

- This entire bill is slightly arrogant in assuming the UL is the sole left-wing alliance, in which case it is clearly not, seeing as the Commonwealth of Socialist States exists. So, in order to gain the entirety of the left-wing in TNI you would simultaneosly need the CSS' approval as well as the UL's

1. Can fix that.

2. I was pointing more in the sense that any structure besides the central command(which has no correctly defined powers and has tripped over it's own cords on a fair few occasions), but besides that it is totally unclear what goes on besides a total mesh of laziness and random work structures. It's severely unorganized and everything could be done with a lot of efficiency - but it would be a lot easier to do the TNI because it's faster and because of the other reasons as well. But I do see your point.

3. It is not - but that is a different issue and we are currently focusing on the older and more primary recognized alliance. CSS is outside of the commissioners reach although I do state multiple times "and other alliances."

1. Kay.

2. How are we to know it's more efficient? I'm guessing you have a charter for TNI ready to prove this?

3. But, still, can we assume that the left-wing that isn't UL is on-board with this?

[The United Motherland]

1. Can fix that.

2. I was pointing more in the sense that any structure besides the central command(which has no correctly defined powers and has tripped over it's own cords on a fair few occasions), but besides that it is totally unclear what goes on besides a total mesh of laziness and random work structures. It's severely unorganized and everything could be done with a lot of efficiency - but it would be a lot easier to do the TNI because it's faster and because of the other reasons as well. But I do see your point.

3. It is not - but that is a different issue and we are currently focusing on the older and more primary recognized alliance. CSS is outside of the commissioners reach although I do state multiple times "and other alliances."

1. Kay.

2. How are we to know it's more efficient? I'm guessing you have a charter for TNI ready to prove this?

3. But, still, can we assume that the left-wing that isn't UL is on-board with this?

1. Currently no - there is no charter. Yet there is one in the making. Of course you kind of forget the situation I'm in on writing anything. Yet, the UL does not have one either which saying actually having a constitution/charter is a great advantage in the new alliance.

2. That is still for another day - URA. If I decide to take care of that I will negotiate with them. And we've already planned talks about this for tonight.

[The United Remnants of America]

Hm. I'll approve. For now. But I'm interested to see how this develops.

Will TNI have an anti-missile network and a QRF set up?

[Vedria]

Vedria Approves

[The United Motherland]

Hm. I'll approve. For now. But I'm interested to see how this develops.

Will TNI have an anti-missile network and a QRF set up?

can work on that

[The United Motherland]

Aaaand, it passes.

Jordslag may still voice his opinion yet he is outnumbered.

I guess things go into affect then.

[Vedria]

Aaaand, it passes.

Jordslag may still voice his opinion yet he is outnumbered.

I guess things go into affect then.

We shall see.

How long till we get the new threads up?

[The United Motherland]

Aaaand, it passes.

Jordslag may still voice his opinion yet he is outnumbered.

I guess things go into affect then.

We shall see.

How long till we get the new threads up?

I ain't putting a time limit.

Things are jostling and rostling so I can't say exactly when. I mean I'm going into end-year testing mode tommorow so I basically loose a whole work week to write.

But hopefully as soon as possible.

[Vedria]

We shall see.

How long till we get the new threads up?

I ain't putting a time limit.

Things are jostling and rostling so I can't say exactly when. I mean I'm going into end-year testing mode tommorow so I basically loose a whole work week to write.

But hopefully as soon as possible.

Gudfuk.

[Alosteq Diin Nastja]

[table][td][blocktext]I. The United Left is very inactive compared to past or even common standards - reaching below even most quite inactive threads.

This point is moot as of now. We've been very active recently.

II. The United Left no longer has a very active or even representative head-of-command, and all United Left laws are at the whim of only the commissioners.

Considering that the Commissars are elected by the people, they are pretty representative.

III. The United Left does not have a council or a peoples representative body, and yet only elects three major players for the entire alliance.

As opposed to the two unelected persons in charge when you were in power.

IV. The United Left is no longer living up to its name - and denies more harsh leftists and old allies of the left front for common issues that many leftists posses.

The UL rejects nations based on levels of civil and political rights, a central tenant of all true sects of the Left wing.

V. The United Left has become a very bureaucratic mess and thus would require total restructuring of the alliance to fix it.

What bureaucracy?

VI. The United Left could certainly do with a different role play environment and a much stronger and more versatile alliance in the long run and for our collective enjoyment.

The applications have also been decided based on quality of roleplay. The last RP's that the UL engaged in were complete and utter messes.

VII. The United Left currently is only 10 members, and the new plans for the alliance could fix the United Left's member list and make it populated and diverse once again.

Creating a new alliance won't solve the underlying problem of a lack of interest in leftist organisations.

IIX. The United Left has been caught to run with poorly trained, inexperienced, or generally distasteful members in office and the TNI, it's constitution, and it's relations could bring experienced, trained, and proper people to the government.

Who exactly are you referring to?

IIX. The United Left is also very out with diplomatic situations or encounters - and the TNI could rebirth the left's great ability to educate, agitate, and organize with people all across the world.

We were never really involved before either. The major events the UL was involved in were orchestrated by the espionage unit in order to create an air of validity around the puppets we used.

---

And it seems like something of this nature would be voted on by those who are in the alliances being destroyed rather than just those in control.

[Servinta]

[table][td][blocktext]I. The United Left is very inactive compared to past or even common standards - reaching below even most quite inactive threads.

This point is moot as of now. We've been very active recently.

II. The United Left no longer has a very active or even representative head-of-command, and all United Left laws are at the whim of only the commissioners.

Considering that the Commissars are elected by the people, they are pretty representative.

III. The United Left does not have a council or a peoples representative body, and yet only elects three major players for the entire alliance.

As opposed to the two unelected persons in charge when you were in power.

IV. The United Left is no longer living up to its name - and denies more harsh leftists and old allies of the left front for common issues that many leftists posses.

The UL rejects nations based on levels of civil and political rights, a central tenant of all true sects of the Left wing.

V. The United Left has become a very bureaucratic mess and thus would require total restructuring of the alliance to fix it.

What bureaucracy?

VI. The United Left could certainly do with a different role play environment and a much stronger and more versatile alliance in the long run and for our collective enjoyment.

The applications have also been decided based on quality of roleplay. The last RP's that the UL engaged in were complete and utter messes.

VII. The United Left currently is only 10 members, and the new plans for the alliance could fix the United Left's member list and make it populated and diverse once again.

Creating a new alliance won't solve the underlying problem of a lack of interest in leftist organisations.

IIX. The United Left has been caught to run with poorly trained, inexperienced, or generally distasteful members in office and the TNI, it's constitution, and it's relations could bring experienced, trained, and proper people to the government.

Who exactly are you referring to?

IIX. The United Left is also very out with diplomatic situations or encounters - and the TNI could rebirth the left's great ability to educate, agitate, and organize with people all across the world.

We were never really involved before either. The major events the UL was involved in were orchestrated by the espionage unit in order to create an air of validity around the puppets we used.

---

And it seems like something of this nature would be voted on by those who are in the alliances being destroyed rather than just those in control.

[Cyllea]

[table][td][blocktext]I. The United Left is very inactive compared to past or even common standards - reaching below even most quite inactive threads.

This point is moot as of now. We've been very active recently.

II. The United Left no longer has a very active or even representative head-of-command, and all United Left laws are at the whim of only the commissioners.

Considering that the Commissars are elected by the people, they are pretty representative.

III. The United Left does not have a council or a peoples representative body, and yet only elects three major players for the entire alliance.

As opposed to the two unelected persons in charge when you were in power.

IV. The United Left is no longer living up to its name - and denies more harsh leftists and old allies of the left front for common issues that many leftists posses.

The UL rejects nations based on levels of civil and political rights, a central tenant of all true sects of the Left wing.

V. The United Left has become a very bureaucratic mess and thus would require total restructuring of the alliance to fix it.

What bureaucracy?

VI. The United Left could certainly do with a different role play environment and a much stronger and more versatile alliance in the long run and for our collective enjoyment.

The applications have also been decided based on quality of roleplay. The last RP's that the UL engaged in were complete and utter messes.

VII. The United Left currently is only 10 members, and the new plans for the alliance could fix the United Left's member list and make it populated and diverse once again.

Creating a new alliance won't solve the underlying problem of a lack of interest in leftist organisations.

IIX. The United Left has been caught to run with poorly trained, inexperienced, or generally distasteful members in office and the TNI, it's constitution, and it's relations could bring experienced, trained, and proper people to the government.

Who exactly are you referring to?

IIX. The United Left is also very out with diplomatic situations or encounters - and the TNI could rebirth the left's great ability to educate, agitate, and organize with people all across the world.

We were never really involved before either. The major events the UL was involved in were orchestrated by the espionage unit in order to create an air of validity around the puppets we used.

---

And it seems like something of this nature would be voted on by those who are in the alliances being destroyed rather than just those in control.

Funny how the entire UL didn't get to vote on 230+ members getting purged and completely expelling all political opposition.

[The United Remnants of America]

[The United Motherland]

-Snip-

[Vedria]

I'm pushing for the TNI since it would facilitate a merger with the CSS, thereby increasing our strength and creating a new, united left.

WE CAN BECOME STRONK AGAIN

[The United Motherland]

I'm pushing for the TNI since it would facilitate a merger with the CSS, thereby increasing our strength and creating a new, united left.

WE CAN BECOME STRONK AGAIN

I've already negotiated silly

They said that they most likely will join if our charter is not bad - basically.

[Vedria]

I'm pushing for the TNI since it would facilitate a merger with the CSS, thereby increasing our strength and creating a new, united left.

WE CAN BECOME STRONK AGAIN

I've already negotiated silly

They said that they most likely will join if our charter is not bad - basically.

YESSS

So guize, basically, TNI = UL+CSS

That's all there is to it.

[The United Motherland]

I've already negotiated silly

They said that they most likely will join if our charter is not bad - basically.

YESSS

So guize, basically, TNI = UL+CSS

That's all there is to it.

Well - it's def more than just a merger. It has a lot of far-reaching reasons that would have to do with reputation and mentality of the sort - but basically things are looking better.

[New Aeyariss]

Eh....

I was beginning to wonder where have the commies went . ~ 4 months of lack of action without any communist to fight with. And now you appear eh masse.

Bueno. I finally will have something to do!

[The United Motherland]

Eh....

I was beginning to wonder where have the commies went . ~ 4 months of lack of action without any communist to fight with. And now you appear eh masse.

Bueno. I finally will have something to do!

It's my magical cooking touch.

And now I'm going to leave for a whole week - seeya.

[New Aeyariss]

Eh....

I was beginning to wonder where have the commies went . ~ 4 months of lack of action without any communist to fight with. And now you appear eh masse.

Bueno. I finally will have something to do!

It's my magical cooking touch.

And now I'm going to leave for a whole week - seeya.

Good luck, ha ha!

[Vedria]

It's my magical cooking touch.

And now I'm going to leave for a whole week - seeya.

Good luck, ha ha!

And so, it begins once more...

[New Jordslag]

Dealing with SACTO sympathising terrorists in good old Ardoki.

http://forum.nationstates.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=342883

Well. That was... controversial.

[New Jordslag]

(Image) Sponsored by the Greater Republic of Clejani - Daka Brândușa Form The New Internationale [TNI Resolution Number: 0] ARTICLE ONE; DEFINITIONS - I. A Minor Offense is when members of the alliance find ways to assist reactionary, revisionist, or any enemy figures during the transition. II. A Mid-Level Offense is when members of the alliance greatly find ways to assist reactionary, revisionist, or enemy figures during the transition. III. A Major Offense is when a member creates a strong enough split alliance or leaves the United Left with great aggression, or is a reactionary, revisionist, or enemy figure during the transition. ARTICLE TWO; AREA OF AFFECT - Every member, external alliance, and extra-alliance groups in the NS cannon are affected by the proposal. ARTICLE THREE; REASONS - This bill lists the current reasons why the United Left(and other willing/left-orientated organizations) will form the The New Internationale below: I. The United Left is very inactive compared to past or even common standards - reaching below even most quite inactive threads. II. The United Left no longer has a very active or even representative head-of-command, and all United Left laws are at the whim of only the commissioners. III. The United Left does not have a council or a peoples representative body, and yet only elects three major players for the entire alliance. IV. The United Left is no longer living up to its name - and denies more harsh leftists and old allies of the left front for common issues that many leftists posses. V. The United Left has become a very bureaucratic mess and thus would require total restructuring of the alliance to fix it. VI. The United Left could certainly do with a different role play environment and a much stronger and more versatile alliance in the long run and for our collective enjoyment. VII. The United Left currently is only 10 members, and the new plans for the alliance could fix the United Left's member list and make it populated and diverse once again. IIX. The United Left has been caught to run with poorly trained, inexperienced, or generally distasteful members in office and the TNI, it's constitution, and it's relations could bring experienced, trained, and proper people to the government. IIX. The United Left is also very out with diplomatic situations or encounters - and the TNI could rebirth the left's great ability to educate, agitate, and organize with people all across the world. ARTICLE FOUR; EFFECTS - This bill effectively creates The New Internationale, and by extent creating a whole alliance for the left wing. Thus, the UL and its satelite states/allies/other friendly structures will hopefully consider joining the TNI - although the merger will be negotiated seprately. I. The United Left will recognize The New Internationale as the predecessor and major alliance for the left movement. II. The United Left will close its threads when The New Internationale creates the proper predecessor threads to fulfill the same or similar purposes. III. The United Left administrator account will be put carefully under watch during the voting of the bill. IV. The United Left Commissioners will surrender offical UL accounts to The New Internationale government to not provoke any stealing of the account once the bill is voted in. V. The United Left propaganda and pictures are equally allowed to be used by The New Internationale unless those rights are revoked by the creator of the piece. VI. Any United Left members must not create split alliances to further damage left unity. VII. The United Left government workers, founders, and popular members will revive an award for their service to a year-standing alliance as of this April. VII. The United Left will halt any government developmental activities such as voting, appointing of ministers, or creation commissions unless the TNI construction is estimated to be beyond a month from the proposal suggestion date. ARTICLE FIVE; PUNISHMENT - Those who do not follow the law in order will be subject to the punishments dependent on the violation: I. A Minor Offense can lead to temporary removal from the alliance, temporary cut of aid/trade, or loss of access to the Strategic Defence Cooperation Act and it's predecessor bills. II. A Mid-Level Offense can lead to permanent banning from the alliance and its services - yet no invasion or extreme aggression. III. A Major Offense will ultimately lead to invasion of said nation and will be declared enemy by the TNI. The creator of the bill is allowed to interpret grey cases - yet those who are clear will be punished by the UL Commissioners until the TNI is formed. Equally, those who are deemed anti-productive to the effort or reactionary/revisionist may be subject to the punishments, but the punishments only can placed upon said reactionaries/revisionists by the creator of the bill. ARTICLE SIX; INTERPRETATIONS - Any misconceptions, errors, or loopholes in the bill are to be worked out by the creator of the bill. Thus, by the direct language of the bill and what it states are interpreted by the creator of the bill as well. Signed Warmly, Daka Brândușa, Greater Republic of Clejani

(Note: This was from my old OEN Condemnation proposal so sorry if it looks similar to IFA Council stuff. Thank :3)

For the most part, I approve. However...

IIX. The United Left has been caught to run with poorly trained, inexperienced, or generally distasteful members in office and the TNI, it's constitution, and it's relations could bring experienced, trained, and proper people to the government.

Excuse, me. I have run successful Alliances before, and I will again. I have worked out quite a few defensive and peace treaties. In no way can you call me inexperienced or poorly trained. Distasteful relies on the opinion, though calling me that would be simply rude. I understand that you want the New Internationale, TUM, but there's no reason to blame us for the UL's inactivity; we've simply had nothing to do. Additionally:

IV. The United Left Commissioners will surrender official UL accounts to The New Internationale government to not provoke any stealing of the account once the bill is voted in.

Surrender it to whom? We haven't even elected a TNI Government. You can't hand something over to positions that don't exist yet. Besides, we were elected to the UL Government, and seeing as, by your own words, the TNI is the direct successor of the UL, I say that the Commissars should be allowed to finish their terms, and then new elections shall be held for Commissars. It's only fair, after all. Or we could hold an election immediately after the formation of the TNI. And even if the same guys are elected, you can't still force us to surrender the account. You see my point? You can't rightly force us to surrender the UL Admin account if the people still want us in Office.

Also, there is a loophole in here that I do not quite like; you say that the merger will be discussed separately, meaning that it is possible for the UL to choose to stay independent. Yet you also say that the UL must close all it's threads once the TNI creates threads to fill out the same purpose. That would leave the UL crippled if they chose not to merge with you.

We also need to talk about what representative body we shall have. Obviously, in addition to the Commisars, we need a single, central leader to be chosen in elections. A Chairman of the TNI, maybe. That is obviously a major problem the UL is having, I will admit, but until you fix it so that the TNI doesn't end up exactly like the UL, I will have to disagree with your bill. I do realize that I am outvoted. Therefore, if you do not fix the mistakes I have pointed out, or at least compromise on them, I will resign in protest and join SACTO. Seriously. I am willing to give the TNI a try, but not if it becomes a dark, undemocratic version of the UL- which your bill leaves lots of room for.