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Terra Firma, Planning and discussion

Where nations come together and discuss matters of varying degrees of importance. [In character]

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Transnapastain
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 12241
Founded: Antiquity
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Transnapastain » Thu Apr 10, 2014 4:10 pm

Tule wrote:What tank gun caliber did ANTO use before 128 mm? 120? 105? Smoothbore or rifled?


125 smoothbore. Before that, 105 like irl

I actually think ya'll are going back to 120 and retconning the 128 thing, but thats up to Virana

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Tule
Senator
 
Posts: 3883
Founded: Jan 29, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Tule » Thu Apr 10, 2014 4:21 pm

Transnapastain wrote:
Tule wrote:What tank gun caliber did ANTO use before 128 mm? 120? 105? Smoothbore or rifled?


125 smoothbore. Before that, 105 like irl

I actually think ya'll are going back to 120 and retconning the 128 thing, but thats up to Virana


I hope so, I fucking hate 128 mm now after trying to design a tank around that gun.
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Virana
Minister
 
Posts: 2547
Founded: Jan 04, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Virana » Thu Apr 10, 2014 6:57 pm

The only reason we upsized from 120 is because somebody wanted to use a gun launched ATGM. But if you think about it, anything larger than 120 would probably require an autoloader, and that means almost every ANTO tank since the 70s needs to be drastically redesigned (since most of them were centered around the 4-crewed, manual loader design, and all ad hoc autoloader implementations are just a compromise - and the tanks were not built with an autoloader in mind).

So yeah, we're retconning the 128 thing. Standard ANTO tank caliber is 120 mm. The U.R. uses smoothbore primarily to facilitate APFSDS rounds. And before that, we used 105 like rl. (unfortunately Hollywood won't be making money this year)

oh and under suggestion from licana, lanos must keep 128 mm under ANTO law. that is all. no not rly

also speshul msg from trans: ANTO now fites for latin freedom
Last edited by Virana on Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:11 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Transnapastain
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 12241
Founded: Antiquity
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby Transnapastain » Thu Apr 10, 2014 8:37 pm

I'm making a new data map!

This idea comes from Virana and Pardes, who have a ranking of the nations in their region based on how politically free they are.

Image

So, how politically free is your nation? Sham elections? Captin Murrica freedom? loltyranny?

for reference, heres a map of world freedoms from Freedom House
Last edited by Transnapastain on Thu Apr 10, 2014 8:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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The Republic of Lanos
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Posts: 17727
Founded: Apr 17, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby The Republic of Lanos » Thu Apr 10, 2014 8:40 pm

Lanosland fuck yeah!

120mm? Meh your call.

Trans. Wtf. What are you doing? Stahp. :P

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Aqizithiuda
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 12163
Founded: Jun 28, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Aqizithiuda » Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:09 pm

Transnapastain wrote:I'm making a new data map!

This idea comes from Virana and Pardes, who have a ranking of the nations in their region based on how politically free they are.

([url=http://i.imgur.com/2UGiLhm.png?1]Image)[/url]

So, how politically free is your nation? Sham elections? Captin Murrica freedom? loltyranny?

for reference, heres a map of world freedoms from Freedom House


I dunno, probably medium at the moment, but with the potential to go very low if the next Reiks isn't such a progressive man.
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The Akasha Colony
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Posts: 13882
Founded: Apr 25, 2010
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Akasha Colony » Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:18 pm

Carthage is high freedom. 8)
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San-Silvacian
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Posts: 12111
Founded: Aug 11, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby San-Silvacian » Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:35 pm

Philippines and Baltic States both medium freedoms.
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Kastingrad
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 431
Founded: Jan 29, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Kastingrad » Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:38 pm

Kastingrad is medium.
Defcon: 5 4 3 2 1

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Premislyd
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Posts: 10456
Founded: Feb 06, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby Premislyd » Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:39 pm

uscanya is wrong color

should be gold for having too much freedumbs
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Licana
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Posts: 16108
Founded: Jul 26, 2010
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Licana » Thu Apr 10, 2014 9:52 pm

Premislyd wrote:uscanya is wrong color

should be gold for having too much freedumbs

^

but replace uscanya with bosque.
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The Akasha Colony
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Posts: 13882
Founded: Apr 25, 2010
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The Akasha Colony » Thu Apr 10, 2014 10:18 pm

Virana wrote:The only reason we upsized from 120 is because somebody wanted to use a gun launched ATGM. But if you think about it, anything larger than 120 would probably require an autoloader, and that means almost every ANTO tank since the 70s needs to be drastically redesigned (since most of them were centered around the 4-crewed, manual loader design, and all ad hoc autoloader implementations are just a compromise - and the tanks were not built with an autoloader in mind).

So yeah, we're retconning the 128 thing. Standard ANTO tank caliber is 120 mm. The U.R. uses smoothbore primarily to facilitate APFSDS rounds. And before that, we used 105 like rl. (unfortunately Hollywood won't be making money this year)

oh and under suggestion from licana, lanos must keep 128 mm under ANTO law. that is all. no not rly

also speshul msg from trans: ANTO now fites for latin freedom


And after all the work trying to figure out how to make the 128 mm gun work...

I may retain it anyway and be like Britain, cuz fuk ur ruelz u cn't tel me wat 2 du. :roll:
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The Republic of Lanos
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Posts: 17727
Founded: Apr 17, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby The Republic of Lanos » Fri Apr 11, 2014 7:45 am

Technically, the only two ANTO tanks that came standard with autoloaders is the Leclerc and the Eagle, the pirated Leclerc.

Um, does Lourde care if I use the copy...

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San-Silvacian
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Posts: 12111
Founded: Aug 11, 2011
Ex-Nation

Postby San-Silvacian » Fri Apr 11, 2014 8:41 am

The Republic of Lanos wrote:Technically, the only two ANTO tanks that came standard with autoloaders is the Leclerc and the Eagle, the pirated Leclerc.

Um, does Lourde care if I use the copy...


Isn't Wapan apart of Anto?

Because if so, the Type 90 and Type 10 both came with autoloaders.

Speaking of whick, I should pester Japan for some Type 90s.
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Tule
Senator
 
Posts: 3883
Founded: Jan 29, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Tule » Fri Apr 11, 2014 10:04 am

Tule has high freedoms.

Since we're discussing the topic of freedom: What are gun laws like in your country.

Although The constitution of Tule does not specifically protect individual access to guns, other clauses have made many forms of gun restrictions unconstitutional.

Legally incompetent people (minors or severely mentally ill) may not possess firearms, and it is illegal to provide them with firearms as well. Furthermore, people who have been found guilty of a crime and thus been prohibited for life to own a weapon may not possess firearms, nor is it legal to provide them with firearms.

Firearms with either a barrel shorter than 50 cm or full-auto capability are subject to a $ 1000 transfer tax, $ 2000 if they have both features.
Last edited by Tule on Fri Apr 11, 2014 3:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Formerly known as Bafuria.
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Radical moderate, conservative liberal, anarcho-statist.

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Glaswegistan
Diplomat
 
Posts: 785
Founded: Dec 10, 2011
Libertarian Police State

Postby Glaswegistan » Fri Apr 11, 2014 12:46 pm

Tule wrote:Tule has high freedoms.

Since we're discussing the topic of freedom: What are gun laws like in your country.

Although The constitution of Tule does not specifically protect individual access to guns, other clauses have made many forms of gun restrictions unconstitutional.

Legally incompetent people (minors or severely mentally ill) may not possess firearms, and it is illegal to provide them with firearms as well. Furthermore, people who have been found guilty of a crime and thus been prohibited for life to own a weapon may not possess firearms, nor is it legal to provide them with firearms.

Firearms with a barrel shorter than 50 cm or full-auto capability have a $ 1000 transfer tax, firearms with both those features have a $ 2000 transfer tax.


Iberian firearm laws are generally fairly lax, owing in part to the Tradicionalista's long-standing support for firearms ownership, but in particular to the 1986 Freedom of Arms Act and the 2001 Arms Ownership Act, both of which re-evaluated previous firearms legislation and set new laws regarding ownership and trafficking. The 1986 FoA Act restricted the right to bear arms in regards to individuals with a criminal record (barring consequent appeals to restore an individuals firearm ownership rights) or a history of mental illness, but also increased the freedoms of various other stratum of society, notably, veterans of the armed forces are considered under the FoA Act to be eligible to own most forms of armament, whilst the Act also closed a loophole restricting the rights of Muslims to own firearms (The 2001 AO Act further cemented the right of Muslims to own firearms).

Essentially, the modern law-abiding, sane Iberian citizen can consider the ownership of handguns, hunting rifles and automatic weapons to be entirely feasible, and a profitable civil arms industry has grown in Iberia since the Civil War. Less clearly legislated on is the subject of ammunition, with hollow-point ammunition for both rifles and handguns occupying an ambiguous place in Iberian law, this legal ambiguity is the cause of the famous Hernandez vs. Ceylon court case remaining in a legal limbo since 2005, with the similar case of Gutierrez vs. Singapore only spared from being an ongoing Iberian legal concern by the advent of Singapore's independence (Where, due to the nation of Singapore inheriting the Iberian legal system, the case remains in a legal limbo), in both cases, the issue of home-made hollow point ammunition has caused abrasion within the legal system due to the ambiguous standards applied to the manufacture of such ammunition.

Basically, the Tradicionalista isn't flat-out retarded, so firearms are reasonably free, but the lawyers are retarded in that way lawyers tend to be, so there's a lot of bizarre loopholes and pitfalls.
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Sevvania
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6765
Founded: Nov 12, 2010
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Sevvanian Gun Laws

Postby Sevvania » Fri Apr 11, 2014 1:08 pm

Tule wrote:What are gun laws like in your country?

Basic Overview of Sevvanian Gun Laws:
•Manually-operated firearms are legal for civilian ownership. This includes things like break-action, revolving-action, bolt-action, etc.
•Semi-automatic firearms are legal for civilian ownership, unless they can be easily converted to fully-automatic firearms.
•Fully-automatic firearms are illegal for civilian ownership. They are limited to police and military use.
•Fully-automatic firearms used by police must be chambered for a cartridge of no greater than 9x33mm, essentially limiting them to machine pistols and/or submachine guns.
•Firearms that fire a projectile of .50 caliber or greater are illegal for civilian ownership, with the exception of shotgun slugs and manually-operated blackpowder firearms.
•Shoulder-fired (non-handgun) firearms must be at least 26" in overall length.
•Other sensible regulations apply: You can't have a gun if you have criminal history, mental disability, etc.
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The Republic of Lanos
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 17727
Founded: Apr 17, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby The Republic of Lanos » Fri Apr 11, 2014 1:38 pm


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The Kievan People
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Posts: 11387
Founded: Jul 02, 2004
Ex-Nation

Postby The Kievan People » Fri Apr 11, 2014 2:09 pm

In Austrasia there are precisely three ways for a civilian to own a gun. Austrasia has no tradition of private civilian gun ownership, except for hunting which is a historically aristocratic pass time. They are:

1. If you are a member of the Landsturm you are issued a military rifle, accessories and a big can of ammo. You are responsible for keeping the gun in working order (Landsturm members must be able to present their rifle and ammo can in good condition on demand for inspection), but opening the ammunition can is strictly forbidden without authorization from the central government. Separate ammunition is provided to Landsturm units for training exercises. Strictly speaking though Landsturm members (like all soldiers in Austrasia) do not own any of their equipment and they can be held financially liable if they break it or lose it.
2. If you are licensed hunter and a member of a licensed hunting lodge you may purchase hunting guns. Hunting guns being defined as any gun on the authorized list of hunting guns, which is maintained by the central government and is more or less nothing but bolt and lever-action long rifles and pump or break-action shotguns. Hunting firearms may only be operated on hunting grounds or at shooting ranges for licensed hunters. A permit must be obtained from the local government to keep either the weapons or ammunition in a private home. Most owners prefer to leave their gun at a lodge or range, because it eliminates their liability in the event it is lost or stolen.
3. Firearms may be owned as historic collectibles. In this case a certificate from a licensed authenticator must be obtained vouching for the weapons historical status and the weapon must be registered with the relevant organs. Discharging a historical firearm is absolutely forbidden without local government permission, which must be obtained on a case by case basis.

In all cases the registered owner of the firearm is legally liable for any misuse of their weapon by any party. This includes weapons which are lost or stolen that have not been reported as such. Should investigators feel a firearm owner did not execute due diligence when storing their lost or stolen weapon, they may be liable for misuse anyways.

Private ownership of firearms by foreigners or permanent residents within Austrasia is absolutely forbidden under all circumstances. Ownership of any firearm which does not fall under any of the above three categories is absolutely forbidden. Attempting to bring firearms into the country without proper paperwork is a serious offense, and can result in temporary or permanent blacklisting for non-citizens. Seized guns are destroyed as a rule.

Unsurprisingly the firearm market in Austrasia is quite restricted, private gun ownership is mostly a thing for young toffs who hang out at overpriced hunting lodges with their toff friends, and greying toffs who want to relive their glory days. The largest customers by far are institutions and the market is basically cornered by Austrasian manufacturers and import/export firms which have the resources and connections to get all the paperwork done. Which is surely a coincidence and not a protectionist regime to keep out mass produced Emmerian and Puzikan firearms at all. Austrasia is however happy to export guns by the truckload.
Last edited by The Kievan People on Fri Apr 11, 2014 2:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Fortunagen
Minister
 
Posts: 2331
Founded: Jan 25, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Fortunagen » Fri Apr 11, 2014 2:35 pm

Tule wrote:What are gun laws like in your country?

Lol completely outlawed like a btch.
Puzikas wrote:
Fortunagen wrote:Fortunagen is a non-nuclear state despite having vast reserves of uranium.

We couldn't POSSIBLY be stocking up for something.


Shutup, Iran! :p


Mistelemr wrote:With how many shootings that happen almost daily now, I find it hard to care.

Sure I hate myself for it, but fuck it, we invited this. It's sad, but at some point you just stop caring. People can scream and cry but nothing will ever get done about it. When was it last that a shooting incident like this (or any other) actually made people legitimately search for answers or try a new approach? None that I can think of, It's been the same people, shouting the same expletives with the same people dying.

I hear they have good internet over in Scandinavia.


One day, I'll make this sig cool again.

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Fortunagen
Minister
 
Posts: 2331
Founded: Jan 25, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Fortunagen » Fri Apr 11, 2014 2:37 pm

Transnapastain wrote:
So, how politically free is your nation? Sham elections? Captin Murrica freedom? loltyranny?

Free as RL Great Britain.
Puzikas wrote:
Fortunagen wrote:Fortunagen is a non-nuclear state despite having vast reserves of uranium.

We couldn't POSSIBLY be stocking up for something.


Shutup, Iran! :p


Mistelemr wrote:With how many shootings that happen almost daily now, I find it hard to care.

Sure I hate myself for it, but fuck it, we invited this. It's sad, but at some point you just stop caring. People can scream and cry but nothing will ever get done about it. When was it last that a shooting incident like this (or any other) actually made people legitimately search for answers or try a new approach? None that I can think of, It's been the same people, shouting the same expletives with the same people dying.

I hear they have good internet over in Scandinavia.


One day, I'll make this sig cool again.

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Glaswegistan
Diplomat
 
Posts: 785
Founded: Dec 10, 2011
Libertarian Police State

Postby Glaswegistan » Fri Apr 11, 2014 2:54 pm

Fortunagen wrote:
Transnapastain wrote:
So, how politically free is your nation? Sham elections? Captin Murrica freedom? loltyranny?

Free as RL Great Britain.


Image
21:46 Trans|Work Theres something wrong with every one of you.

No ideas are bad, but some are just stupid ~ Unknown

I quit ~ SsgtKirill

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The Republic of Lanos
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 17727
Founded: Apr 17, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby The Republic of Lanos » Fri Apr 11, 2014 2:55 pm

Glaswegistan wrote:
Fortunagen wrote:Free as RL Great Britain.


Image

Don't forget GCHQ man.

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Fortunagen
Minister
 
Posts: 2331
Founded: Jan 25, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Fortunagen » Fri Apr 11, 2014 3:06 pm

Puzikas wrote:
Fortunagen wrote:Fortunagen is a non-nuclear state despite having vast reserves of uranium.

We couldn't POSSIBLY be stocking up for something.


Shutup, Iran! :p


Mistelemr wrote:With how many shootings that happen almost daily now, I find it hard to care.

Sure I hate myself for it, but fuck it, we invited this. It's sad, but at some point you just stop caring. People can scream and cry but nothing will ever get done about it. When was it last that a shooting incident like this (or any other) actually made people legitimately search for answers or try a new approach? None that I can think of, It's been the same people, shouting the same expletives with the same people dying.

I hear they have good internet over in Scandinavia.


One day, I'll make this sig cool again.

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Kastingrad
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Posts: 431
Founded: Jan 29, 2012
Ex-Nation

Postby Kastingrad » Fri Apr 11, 2014 4:01 pm

Tule wrote:What are gun laws like in your country?


Too lazy to lay it all out, essentially like the State of Colorado, but with more mental health examinations and Kalashnikov's.
Last edited by Kastingrad on Fri Apr 11, 2014 4:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Defcon: 5 4 3 2 1

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