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Europe - Prussia
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 426
Founded: Oct 25, 2009
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Europe - Prussia » Tue Jan 29, 2019 9:17 am

Chrinthanium wrote:
Europe - Prussia wrote:Hello people of AMW, and a very, very, very late merry Christmas and new year!

As you can see I’m still alive, but busy enough that I haven’t even read anything on the forums or discord. But now that I have a couple of weeks of vacations I’ll post something in the TITS thread ( or whatever its name is) and something more, probably.

Now, the reason of this post is because I want to make some changes to my claims. For starters, I’d like to drop the COIAS. There's no point in keeping the secondary claim if I barely keep up with Valendia, and I haven't developed the COIAS beyond some posts on discord.

Second, from my main claim I'd like to drop Goa and claim Panama, Micronesia, the Kerala State of India and Eritrea. Minus Goa and plus the new territories I requested the total population would be 209,094,855.

I know that originally I was reticent to expand to the 200 million mark, but I want to keep some core ideas of the COIAS, which I'm going to implement in Valendia, and the extra territory will help with that.

Now, my idea is to recreate the Hanseatic League in AMW, but with a lot of substantial changes in comparison to its RL counterpart. It would cover all the non-European territories of my claim, plus Bremen and Hamburg, and it would help to explain how the empire has kept those territories until now.

In paper, the League would be an Imperial Subject, but in reality it would be more like a tributary or satellite state of Valendia; they would have to pay a tithe, give some land for military bases and cooperate with the empire in the case of war, but beyond that the League would manage their affairs as they see fit.

Historically, the League was formed at the beginning of the 18 century from imperial colonies in Africa, right after a revolution happened in Valendia. Instead of expending troops and resources in recapturing far-flung colonies and bring them into compliance with the new order, the new emperor negotiated with the Europe-based old Hanseatic League, who were tasked with colonization efforts in Africa and were its de facto rulers, eventually leading the creation of the modern League. Its original core territory was in Africa, with its de jure capital in Hamburg, but with negotiations and some subtle threat it began to expand to the east.

Politically, the League is a confederation and a commercial pact rolled into one, though it doesn’t necessarily mean that by signing a commercial treaty with the League a country is also joining its confederation. Its government is composed by a Council of representatives, one for each nation part of the League. The Council also has legislative powers which are rarely used, as they prefer for the local legislative of each nation to handle the day-to-day lawmaking. There’s an independent judiciary, but like in the legislative most of the day-to-day issues are seen by the local courts of each nation.

Politically and culturally (unlike in Valendia where there’s a great emphasis on honor, duty and justice), and rescuing one of the base ideas that formed the COIAS, in the League everything is much more lax, especially on economic matters. As a country founded by merchants there’s very few restrictions, and most of them were imposed by the empire and only about truly heinous things for them, like slavery.

Economically, the League is supported by four main pillars: natural resources, trade, tourism and services. As I said before, the League was founded by merchants, so it can be considered one big shipping company and its territory a very big Special Economic Zone.

Regarding the military, there’s an army, navy and air force. Of the three, the navy is the most important one, for obvious reasons, while the army is the smallest one, though that doesn’t mean they are the weakest, because if they are not on active service the soldiers work in one of the League-owned Private Military Companies. The Navy has a similar arrangement, but instead of sailors entire ships which function as floating armories are employed. However, if in the worst case scenario Valendia can back them up, per their agreement.

Finally, regarding the Panama Canal; like Suez, the Canal will be controlled by an international commission. The League will have the biggest stake obviously, but everybody will have a voice in its administration.

Rather than go into my idea on the claim, which, to be honest, still feels like two claims merged into one...

Lately, myself included, we've had a lot of shifts, moves, expansions, 2nd claims.... and no one really does anything with them. AMW has never been fast-paced, but lately we're moving slower than a glacier. I just want you to think a bit and tell me this is where your passion is and that this idea is something that's got you ready and roaring to play it otherwise, I wouldn't see the point in making a change at all. If you do feel that passion that makes you say, "Gee, I really want to RP this because I like the idea that much," then you will have my full support.


Uh, Chrin, that's kinda what I'm doing right now.

Look, I'm going to put it as simple as possible: I'm dropping my secondary claim and at the same time requesting an expansion to my main claim, Valendia, so I can reach the 200 million people mark, which is something i have been considering for some time now as you might remember. The rest of the wall text is pretty much fluff, used to explain how the empire was able to keep such far-flung territories for so long and to introduce other elements in my claim such as organized crime and corruption, because you can't expect a 200 million country to be all perfect and with no problems.

Ultimately, if my request keeps raising objections, which I understand because accepting it would mean another 200 million claim on AMW, I'll withdraw it and keep the COIAS and Valendia as it currently stands.

Layarteb wrote:What is the possibility of Saint-Laurent having some representation on said commission for the Panama Canal?


Considering Saint-Laurent is right at the entrance of the Canal, a seat for you is pretty much guaranteed.
Last edited by Europe - Prussia on Tue Jan 29, 2019 10:57 am, edited 4 times in total.
A member of A Modern World as Valendia:

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Layarteb
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 8171
Founded: Antiquity
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Layarteb » Tue Jan 29, 2019 11:14 am

Europe - Prussia wrote:
Chrinthanium wrote:

Rather than go into my idea on the claim, which, to be honest, still feels like two claims merged into one...

Lately, myself included, we've had a lot of shifts, moves, expansions, 2nd claims.... and no one really does anything with them. AMW has never been fast-paced, but lately we're moving slower than a glacier. I just want you to think a bit and tell me this is where your passion is and that this idea is something that's got you ready and roaring to play it otherwise, I wouldn't see the point in making a change at all. If you do feel that passion that makes you say, "Gee, I really want to RP this because I like the idea that much," then you will have my full support.


Uh, Chrin, that's kinda what I'm doing right now.

Look, I'm going to put it as simple as possible: I'm dropping my secondary claim and at the same time requesting an expansion to my main claim, Valendia, so I can reach the 200 million people mark, which is something i have been considering for some time now as you might remember. The rest of the wall text is pretty much fluff, used to explain how the empire was able to keep such far-flung territories for so long and to introduce other elements in my claim such as organized crime and corruption, because you can't expect a 200 million country to be all perfect and with no problems.

Ultimately, if my request keeps raising objections, which I understand because accepting it would mean another 200 million claim on AMW, I'll withdraw it and keep the COIAS and Valendia as it currently stands.

Layarteb wrote:What is the possibility of Saint-Laurent having some representation on said commission for the Panama Canal?


Considering Saint-Laurent is right at the entrance of the Canal, a seat for you is pretty much guaranteed.

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Chrinthanium
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 14081
Founded: Feb 04, 2006
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Chrinthanium » Tue Jan 29, 2019 7:58 pm

Europe - Prussia wrote:
Chrinthanium wrote:

Rather than go into my idea on the claim, which, to be honest, still feels like two claims merged into one...

Lately, myself included, we've had a lot of shifts, moves, expansions, 2nd claims.... and no one really does anything with them. AMW has never been fast-paced, but lately we're moving slower than a glacier. I just want you to think a bit and tell me this is where your passion is and that this idea is something that's got you ready and roaring to play it otherwise, I wouldn't see the point in making a change at all. If you do feel that passion that makes you say, "Gee, I really want to RP this because I like the idea that much," then you will have my full support.


Uh, Chrin, that's kinda what I'm doing right now.

Look, I'm going to put it as simple as possible: I'm dropping my secondary claim and at the same time requesting an expansion to my main claim, Valendia, so I can reach the 200 million people mark, which is something i have been considering for some time now as you might remember. The rest of the wall text is pretty much fluff, used to explain how the empire was able to keep such far-flung territories for so long and to introduce other elements in my claim such as organized crime and corruption, because you can't expect a 200 million country to be all perfect and with no problems.

Ultimately, if my request keeps raising objections, which I understand because accepting it would mean another 200 million claim on AMW, I'll withdraw it and keep the COIAS and Valendia as it currently stands.

Layarteb wrote:What is the possibility of Saint-Laurent having some representation on said commission for the Panama Canal?


Considering Saint-Laurent is right at the entrance of the Canal, a seat for you is pretty much guaranteed.

No, it has nothing to do with the size of the claim at all. I'm just tired of people doing things like expansions and 2nd claims and doing nothing with them. If you're going to play it and play it regularly, then go for it. If this isn't something you're going to want to do after 2 months, I'd rather you not change at all.
About Me: Just your typical aging gay man trying desperately to retain what youth remains within himself.
Always remember you are loved and cherished. You are my friend and that means the world to me!
You can address me as "Your Indefatigable Greatness" or "Chrin." Whichever you choose. I'm not picky. Also, the pronoun is "he" since I'm a gay dude.
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Europe - Prussia
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 426
Founded: Oct 25, 2009
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Europe - Prussia » Mon Feb 04, 2019 5:38 pm

Chrinthanium wrote:
Europe - Prussia wrote:
Uh, Chrin, that's kinda what I'm doing right now.

Look, I'm going to put it as simple as possible: I'm dropping my secondary claim and at the same time requesting an expansion to my main claim, Valendia, so I can reach the 200 million people mark, which is something i have been considering for some time now as you might remember. The rest of the wall text is pretty much fluff, used to explain how the empire was able to keep such far-flung territories for so long and to introduce other elements in my claim such as organized crime and corruption, because you can't expect a 200 million country to be all perfect and with no problems.

Ultimately, if my request keeps raising objections, which I understand because accepting it would mean another 200 million claim on AMW, I'll withdraw it and keep the COIAS and Valendia as it currently stands.



Considering Saint-Laurent is right at the entrance of the Canal, a seat for you is pretty much guaranteed.

No, it has nothing to do with the size of the claim at all. I'm just tired of people doing things like expansions and 2nd claims and doing nothing with them. If you're going to play it and play it regularly, then go for it. If this isn't something you're going to want to do after 2 months, I'd rather you not change at all.


Fair enough. Then, I withdraw my proposal; I'll keep Valendia as it currently stands, and the COIAS as a secondary claim.

I'll keep the idea of a international commission controlling the Panama Canal though.
A member of A Modern World as Valendia:

Birthed by the dream of the Holy Saint, forever guarded by the white and black lions and the sun that shines upon them.

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Marimaia
Diplomat
 
Posts: 769
Founded: Antiquity
Benevolent Dictatorship

Postby Marimaia » Fri Feb 22, 2019 5:43 pm

So I'd like to present a proposal for a second claim, it's quite a small claim but in many ways the small size actually plays to the advantage of the idea. I've already spent some time discussing it with Rome, and I'd be more than happy to hear opinions from other group members.

The Kingdom of Nuova Lombardia

Claim: Guatemala, El Salvador, Honduras, Nicaragua, Costa Rica
Population: 43,023,665
Demonym: Nuova Lombardian/Lombardian
Capital: Nuovo Milano/New Milan (RL Guatemala City)
Government: Absolute Monarchy
- King: Fiorenzo Ludovico Sforza, rules as Fiorenzo II

Total GDP: $430,236,650,000
GDP per capita: $10,000
Currency: Nuova Lombardian florin (Fl)
Official Languages: Italian, Spanish


Brief History, to be fleshed out with @SPQR/-Roma Invicta-:

As the Borgia-ruled empire fell and the Roman Republic was re-established, many Italian noble and merchant families began to re-evaluate their position in light of the sweeping changes to the political landscape. Some took the opportunity to settle old scores while others fled the possibility of 'being settled' by adversaries that they had made along the way. Primary amongst the latter were the House of Sforza and the House of Pazzi. Ever the practitioners of intrigue, the Sforza family had eventually bent the knee to the Borgias and carved out their own niche within the empire, making enemies of several families in the process. As for the Pazzi, their failed attempt to overthrow the Medici of Florence had seen them exiled from their home city before aligning with the Sforzas. The two families attempted to evade and frustrate their rivals by moving to the Roman colonies in Central America, where they built up influence and a powerbase before leading the colony of Guatemala in revolt against Rome. This resulted in the birth of a state under Sforza leadership, which was soon named as the Kingdom of Nuova Lombardia after the home region of the family. The capital was renamed Nuova Milano after the city that formed their most famous territory.

Politics:

The Kingdom of Nuova Lombardia is an absolute monarchy ruled by the House of Sforza since the kingdom's founding. The role of monarch combines executive, legislative and judicial functions, with royal decrees forming the basis of Lombardian legislation. While on paper the monarch can effectively do whatever they desire and pass any law they wish, no matter what it may be, in practise the monarch consults with the Royal Council before issuing decrees. Comprised of various ministers of state, the Royal Council is charged with "drafting and overseeing the implementation of the internal, external, financial, economic, educational and defense policies, and general affairs of the state", fulfilling much the same role that a Cabinet fulfills in other nations. The competence of the ministers of state can vary wildly depending on the whims of the reigning monarch, as some rulers prefer sycophants while others prefer to actually be advised by people who know what their ruler doesn't. Thankfully the current monarch is of the latter inclination so he can be advised by people wiser than himself on certain matters. The Royal Council is headed by the Lord Chancellor, an individual who acts as the monarch's closest advisor, appointed and authorized to make decisions on behalf of the monarch's name. The Lord Chancellor is the highest-ranking member of the Royal Council, and leads meetings of the council as proxy for the monarch when the ruler is absent for whatever reason. Outside of the Royal Council the nation is divided into five Duchies, each of which is then divided into a varying number of Counties. These titles (as well as their attendant incomes) are given and taken by decree of the reigning monarch, meaning that the other noble families of Nuova Lombardia do their best to curry favour with the King at all times (although this does nothing to dampen what seems to be a rampant appetite for intrigue and self-advancement). When it comes to tax collection, the National Levy Administration are responsible for the entire nation including the lesser nobility, who are punished more harshly than regular citizens for tax offences because 'they should know better'.

The current monarch is Fiorenzo Ludovico Sforza, who rules under the regnal name of Fiorenzo II. Aged twenty-three and possessing the 'Sforza talent for intrigue', Fiorenzo is always polite and well-spoken around foreign dignitaries and his own 'regular' subjects. His public image is one of quiet dignity, appearing to be every inch the scion of old nobility. Even behind closed doors Fiorenzo frowns upon the use of profanity, viewing it as a demonstration of vulgarity, and if others use profanity in his presence then they are greeted with a contemptuous glare. This does not necessarily mean that Fiorenzo is a completely benevolent monarch, however. He follows the age-old ways of the House of Sforza, acting as a patron of the arts while enjoying pastimes such as riding and hawking; dissent against Sforza rule results in reprisals from the Ksirafai (more popularly referred to as the 'Razors'), the secret police who infiltrate universities, workplaces, and the like. The Razors observe, make notes, and eliminate as directed by the King or the Lord Chancellor. For more overt displays of strength Fiorenzo can either call upon the kingdom's armed forces or the Sforza Royal Guards, a brigade-sized unit of six thousand troops. The Sforza Royal Guards are unofficially known as the 'Black Guard' due to the fact that all of the personnel are of African heritage*, a throwback to the practise of recruiting slaves as the Royal Guards during the slavery era; the slave soldiers were believed to be more loyal than free men because they relied on their monarch for their lives. The modern Sforza Royal Guard are recruited from the Afro-Lombardian population as well as from Africa itself if the possibility arises.

*(Note that this sort of thing actually happened in real life, for example a Moroccan sultan in the late 17th century actually had a nascent breeding program with West Africans brought to Morocco to live in special colonies. Girls were trained to be servants, boys were trained to be soldiers. At its peak he had 150,000 soldiers who had been 'produced' in such a manner.)

His Lord Chancellor is the sixty-seven year old Aurelio Pazzi, a shrewd and worldly individual who firmly believes in the old Lombardian adage that "the Sforza rule, the Pazzi manage". The pair make for a formidable team as they are often of the same mind on a wide variety of matters. There are those among the nobility of Nuova Lombardia who either believe that Fiorenzo II is a puppet of Aurelio or that their own family should be in a position of greater influence, and it is only a matter of time before this becomes an issue which needs to be addressed one way or another.

Economy:

The Lombardian economy is primarily oligarcho-capitalist in nature. Industries described as being of 'strategic national significance' operate as monopolies under the watchful stewardship of the Pazzi family, including the major utilities such as energy supply, water supply, and communications. The rest of the major Lombardian corporations are owned by the kingdom's age-old families, with the Pazzi family jealously guarding their substantial influence over the kingdom's banking and financial sector.

In regard to energy supply, Nuova Lombardia produces a great deal of hydroelectricity with the result that the kingdom's reliance on foreign energy is kept relatively low.

Agriculture is an important sector of the Lombardian economy. Thanks to the kingdom's abundance of arable land, Nuova Lombardia is an effective producer of crops such as sugar, coffee, bananas, cardamom, pineapples, melons, peanuts, tobacco, and other fruits and vegetables. The kingdom's primary agricultural exports also include beef, shrimp, and lobster. While there is a degree of mining activity within the kingdom it is not considered to be a primary source of exports, with most of the gold, silver, and industrial metal production going into domestic use. The manufacturing sector focuses primarily on goods such as apparel, textiles, and automobile parts for other nations. Nuova Lombardia is also increasingly interested in tourism. The kingdom possesses a great deal of natural beauty and they are attempting to cast themselves as a unique alternative to other nations in the region, although they would have no qualms about cooperating with neighbours and the like in joint ventures and developments.

Foreign Relations:

The Kingdom of Nuova Lombardia would seek to be on good terms with fellow Catholic nations such as Saint Laurent and Austrinia/Australisia. While the kingdom may not be on the best of terms with the Roman Republic they do still regard the Pope as their spiritual father. Nuova Lombardian attitudes are not particularly enlightened regarding Muslims in general or Arabs in particular, while they do not actively hate them they are not especially welcoming towards them either. Other nations would be treated respectfully if they treat Nuova Lombardia with respect, while refusal to trade or engage in diplomatic relations would be viewed as rather odd.

Military

The Armed Forces of Nuova Lombardia (AFNL) number some 430,000 personnel between three major services: the Royal Nuova Lombardian Army (RNLA), the Royal Nuova Lombardian Air Force (RNLAF), and the Royal Nuova Lombardian Navy (RNLN). The RNLA is the largest of the three services and are highly experienced at jungle and mountain warfare. While Nuova Lombardia may not possess the latest in military hardware, their primary focus is on resisting invasion and maintaining civil order so they are best served by reliable and easily-maintained military equipment. The Sforza Royal Guards receive more intense training and better equipment than the standard armed forces to reflect their position as direct protectors of the throne.


While I like the idea of having a second claim in the Americas, my previous technocrat-militarist Mexico idea was a little bland to say the least (and too strong in terms of population and economy). I feel that Nuova Lombardia is something a little different which has the possibility of adding to the regional dynamic without throwing it out of whack. There are opportunities for my own internal RPs due to the various families and institutions, while other nations in the region (or further afield) might be interested in talks/alliances/what have you. It's got absolutely nothing to do with the Caliphate or the Margraves so it gives me something different to play with but it doesn't upset the general world stage or occupy a vast swathe of territory.

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Embers Holy Empire
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 8
Founded: Feb 14, 2019
Corporate Bordello

Postby Embers Holy Empire » Sat Feb 23, 2019 2:38 pm

Nation Name: Embers Holy Empire
Languages: southern twang english
Ideal location: Oklahoma and Texas would make up the western border, North Carolina to Florida would make up the eastern border, The Gulf of Mexico as the southern, and the boundary with existing nation as the northern.

Government: A recreation of the original United states founding fathers. A constitutional democratic republic with limited terms for all offices.

History: In 2019 after a tedious vote, Embers Holy Empire succeeded from the United States to avoid a bloody civil war that would have occurred if not for the break away. Tensions between far right and far left had reached an all time high. Emberians embraced the right side of the political spectrum.

Culture: Typical southern american values include holding doors open for ladies, collecting guns, and going to church on sundays. Racism only exists in museums. Emberians also love sports.

Economy: The Emberian economy centers around space exploration using technologies created by NASA and Elon Musk, aviation, and tourism. Our main exports space faring technology and manufactured parts for space docking.

Military: All Emberians are required to perform 1 year of Military service before age 25. As we are in our first year of existence, multiple incentives to retain individuals after the first year have been put in place, including high salaries, and honorary nationwide discounts for all active service members. We will never provoke, but believe the best defense is a strong offense.

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AMW Applications
Bureaucrat
 
Posts: 45
Founded: Jul 20, 2010
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby AMW Applications » Sat Feb 23, 2019 3:54 pm

Right'o

About time I made sure the map matched the claims list. It does. As always, double check to ensure that part of your claim hasn't accidentally been left off to be carved up by the British or Romans.

Marimaia's pending 2nd claim is not on this map. Update will come when/if that claim is granted approval.

Now, gaze upon my bucket paint skillz, yo!

https://i.imgur.com/FKTUV91.png

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Chrinthanium
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 14081
Founded: Feb 04, 2006
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Chrinthanium » Sat Feb 23, 2019 3:56 pm

Embers Holy Empire wrote:Nation Name: Embers Holy Empire
Languages: southern twang english
Ideal location: Oklahoma and Texas would make up the western border, North Carolina to Florida would make up the eastern border, The Gulf of Mexico as the southern, and the boundary with existing nation as the northern.

Government: A recreation of the original United states founding fathers. A constitutional democratic republic with limited terms for all offices.

History: In 2019 after a tedious vote, Embers Holy Empire succeeded from the United States to avoid a bloody civil war that would have occurred if not for the break away. Tensions between far right and far left had reached an all time high. Emberians embraced the right side of the political spectrum.

Culture: Typical southern american values include holding doors open for ladies, collecting guns, and going to church on sundays. Racism only exists in museums. Emberians also love sports.

Economy: The Emberian economy centers around space exploration using technologies created by NASA and Elon Musk, aviation, and tourism. Our main exports space faring technology and manufactured parts for space docking.

Military: All Emberians are required to perform 1 year of Military service before age 25. As we are in our first year of existence, multiple incentives to retain individuals after the first year have been put in place, including high salaries, and honorary nationwide discounts for all active service members. We will never provoke, but believe the best defense is a strong offense.

Several issues with this application.... all of which can be answered as follows: it doesn't give enough information about anything for us to really make a decision on. That, and if you had looked at more than just the map, the claims list (which supersedes the map in all cases) would show the areas you're asking for are currently claimed and therefore cannot be taken. Just look one post above yours to see what I mean by "enough information."

Thanks for you interest in AMW.

As for Marimaia...

I've been a bit tough on 2nd claims as of late. Again, my only issue would be if this is something that will actually still be RP'd in 2 month or 5 months or so forth. Outside of that, I have no issues with the idea whatsoever and, if approved, look forward to seeing how it rolls.
Last edited by Chrinthanium on Sat Feb 23, 2019 3:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.
About Me: Just your typical aging gay man trying desperately to retain what youth remains within himself.
Always remember you are loved and cherished. You are my friend and that means the world to me!
You can address me as "Your Indefatigable Greatness" or "Chrin." Whichever you choose. I'm not picky. Also, the pronoun is "he" since I'm a gay dude.
------------
Part of A Modern World RP group.

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Marimaia
Diplomat
 
Posts: 769
Founded: Antiquity
Benevolent Dictatorship

Postby Marimaia » Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:41 pm

Chrinthanium wrote:As for Marimaia...

I've been a bit tough on 2nd claims as of late. Again, my only issue would be if this is something that will actually still be RP'd in 2 month or 5 months or so forth. Outside of that, I have no issues with the idea whatsoever and, if approved, look forward to seeing how it rolls.


Well Rome and I have already got a couple of ideas for Nuova Lombardia, and I have some ideas myself for what I'd like to do with it.

Due to the kingdom's relative remoteness from Europe, Africa, and Asia, it can be a potential location for political exiles with enough money to buy the friendship of the House of Sforza; as it is an absolute monarchy, once you're in with the monarch then your only real concern would be staying on their good side. Nuova Lombardia could also be a local partner for nations which don't have hang-ups about ideas like democracy, it could be a hub for mercenaries (harkening back to the condottieri of the RL Italian city-states) and various other dubious activities. The neighbouring COIAS (or groups within it) could have arrangements with the Sforza regarding cultivation of marijuana and poppies.

Basically Nuova Lombardia can offer quite a lot to other members of AMW if they are interested, but equally there's enough potential just between me and Rome (and potentially Saint-Laurent) to make it worthwhile.
Last edited by Marimaia on Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Nuova Lombardia
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 8
Founded: Feb 14, 2019
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Nuova Lombardia » Wed Mar 06, 2019 12:48 pm

Marimaia here!

After double-checking with Chrin that I can start posting with Nuova Lombardia, I received an affirmative so here it is. This way I can keep storylines for the Caliphate and Lombardia on separate nations and you guys won't have to intially wonder which claim I'm posting for.

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The Crooked Beat
Diplomat
 
Posts: 640
Founded: Feb 22, 2005
Left-wing Utopia

Postby The Crooked Beat » Sat Mar 23, 2019 3:59 pm

Good day, comrades, and happy spring! I trust you are all observing a worshipful and Godly Feast of Gregory the Illuminator, and happy birthday also to Akira Kurosawa! (Yes, I had to look all this up).

So, I've danced around this idea, in its general outlines at least, a number of times now, and I think I'm more or less ready to commit. Namely, I'd like to go ahead and reduce Gandvik fairly significantly, back nearer to its original extent and a population of approximately 17 million, in the basic variant at least. Mega-Gandvik, as it now stands, really feels a bit too tacked-on, for starters, and more importantly tends, I think, to unbalance European politics and history especially as pertains to the Shield. A smaller Gandvik would, according to my thoughts of the moment anyway, be more cohesive, easier for me to manage, far easier for the Shield to cope with historically, and more interesting both to play and to interact with. This decluttered Gandvik would probably operate under a deep and pervasive paranoia regarding its place in Europe and the world, and its intense fear of Shieldian domination would look a good deal more plausible in light of relative strengths. It would be strong enough, however, to reasonably look after itself, strong enough at any rate to preserve its sovereignty throughout the twentieth century, and able to play at least some kind of an international role.

Variant A, which can be done without any territorial exchanges, would amount to this:

Estonia+Latvia+Lithuania: 6,049,186
Finland: 5,513,000
Murmansk Oblast: 753,557
Karelian Republic: 622,484
Vitebsk (Belarus): 1,230,821
Pskov Oblast: 636,546
Novgorod Oblast: 606,476
Tver Oblast: 1,283,873
Smolensk Oblast: 949.348

For a total population of 17,645,291.

Variant B would, if Ian is perhaps willing to gift me the remainder of Belarus, boost the total to 27,148,798 people.

This preserves the vast bulk of real-life Russia's population for some prospective future player, in addition to three-Ocean access by way of Saint Petersburg, Arkhangelsk, and Vladivostok. While Arkhangelsk is obviously less convenient of a port than Murmansk, I'm inclined to hold onto Lapland and the Kola Peninsula for what I must shamefully admit are in effect strategic reasons, to provide for Gandvik an outlet to the sea that isn't so readily interdicted by Walmington, which I can only picture as one of Gandvik's chief antagonists. The shoe is to some extent on the other foot for any future occupant of Russia, though Gandvik, presumably, would be in no position to blockade what probably stands to be a far larger and more powerful state, particularly with Shieldian and Walmingtonian hostility more or less taken for granted.

I'm not contemplating any huge changes along the political-economic angle, although naturally this reduced Gandvik, relieved of its vast petrochemical reserves, wouldn't be anywhere near so insulated from global markets. In light of its rather more trying position in the European food-chain Gandvik's state socialism and centralized planning might even be more pronounced, as the nation strives to meet its ravenous appetite for hard currency (cue innuendo) with a heavy emphasis on export-oriented industry. Fuel would undoubtedly be rationed, food quite possibly as well, under a climate of more or less perpetual defense-readiness, though small Gandvik's requirements in that line would also be more modest, and met at least in part by domestic supplies of (ecologically quite disastrous) shale oil. The power grid would presumably amount to an unholy combination of nuclear and peat-burning plants, as one mineral which Gandvik can source domestically is Uranium, thanks to the mines at Sillamäe, which incidentally also, if I'm not mistaken, contains one of Europe's primary rare-earth minerals deposits. That latter might help to provide for a domestic electronics industry of no small importance, presumably geared toward export to the wealthier, more advanced economies of western Europe and North America. Nokia, after all!

Nickel mines in the far north (at the appropriately-named Nikkel!), some tungsten I believe, cobalt, platinum, and chromium are some other domestic mineral resources of probable economic significance, and even if Gandvik obviously does not stand to be a raw exporter on an Arabian or RL-Russian level Riga would attempt to exploit these deposits as fully as possible. New-Gandvik is still a heavily-industrialized country, service sector remaining limited in comparison to the wealthier states of Europe, and domestic politics are very much the politics of organized labor-versus-industrial employers. The nation can probably see to its own food requirements in an emergency, and doubtless agriculture is subsidized as heavily as Riga can afford for explicitly strategic purposes. Lots of dairy, wheat, potatoes, a large and undoubtedly over-active fishing fleet based out of Murmansk, plenty of small-scale vegetable gardening, though chances are that anything not grown in Gandvik or caught by Gandvian fishermen is, owing in no small part to the Gandvian Mark's deliberately low valuation by way of whatever our primary reserve currency happens to be, scarce and expensive. Overall, I'd expect that Gandvik could act as a source of relatively cheap, if notoriously fractious and ill-disciplined, manufacturing labor for the more highly-developed western consumer economies.

New-Gandvik, now far more exposed to the wider world, will clearly depend for its survival on the goodwill of at least some major powers, and I've been leaning in the direction of a relatively friendly relationship with Valendia. In strategic terms, if we assume that Valendia and the Shield, both proud and powerful states which share a lengthy border, have had their share of beefs, a Valendian-Gandvian linkage, if not necessarily a treaty-sanctified alliance, seems to make a fair amount of sense, and with Gandvik basically adding up to the haunted-house outgrowth of the Teutonic order-states there might be some not-inconsiderable cultural affinity there as well. Gandvik's traditional ruling class, after all, is primarily of German extraction or spuriously Germanized, probably most Gandvians speak at least some German, and German would have been the language of government and elite culture up until the early 1900s anyway. Indeed, Gandvik from the 1850s to present is in large part the story of attempts to assert a Fennic cultural identity, if arguably an invented one, against a 'foreign' Teutonism. Out of this struggle would subsequently arise the modern Gandvian fascist far-right. Ideally, from Riga's point of view anyway, Valendia would tend to view Gandvik as a useful counterweight to the Shieldian-Walmingtonian axis, and Riga for its part might well be prepared to bend over backwards in order to please the Valendians.

At least some degree of historical friendliness with Amerique and California would be helpful as well, since while Gandvik was not, until very recently, a democracy in anything but the most selective definition of that term, neither has it ever been particularly oppressive, and the generals or retired generals which typically happen to govern the place have with very few brief exceptions embodied a spirit of pragmatism and consensus. All of this, when considered in light of the nation's problems with Walmington and the Shield, possibly by extension Britain as well, two of those avowedly imperialistic democracies and the third doubtless much more autocratic, for most of its history, than Gandvik ever was, could just possibly, I think, make dealings with Gandvik palatable to socialistic North American electorates (strange to say!). That, of course, and Gandvik's most of the way socialist already, though it hasn't felt at all comfortable actually saying that until just recently. Maybe not much of an institutional democracy, true, yet strongly subject to popular pressure on industrial channels. Corporatism verging on fascism, though far more of a Peronist than a Francoist character.

Government, as already, a massive bureaucratic morass, colossal public sector, key industries both nationally-owned and subject to the directives of a planning ministry. Public corruption endemic, particularly at low levels, a pervasive culture of favors and informality, a strong patrimonial spirit, the head of state typically an honest and wellmeaning if all too often deliberately inoffensive and powerless character whose chief responsibility is to mediate between warring ministries. Confused, chaotic, inefficient, and functionally, in terms of the hardships visited upon everyday Gandvians by bribe-seeking functionaries, fairly oppressive, though not formally so, and a high tolerance of dissent and nonconformism. Policing likewise sporadic, cynical, extractive, predatory, viscerally racist, antisemitic, often brutal to the point of extrajudicial killing and 'suicide while in custody,' in short a group of men (all men) totally beyond control and entrenched within a fortress of time-honored legal impunity, though then again we could really say the same about police in almost any country with any system.

In the cultural arena mainstream Gandvik, although now self-assertively Fennic in language and tradition, owes a great deal to Valendia and to Martin Luther in particular. Guardianship of public morals from subversive influences is a role which the Lutheran state church, theoretically subservient to the political authority though in practice virtually independent and unafraid to throw its significant weight around, reserves for itself, and it does its best to promote and protect a staid, stolid, undemonstrative and deeply reserved standard of behavior, perhaps described more accurately as cold, intolerant, prudish, and profoundly misogynistic. Many things which aren't technically illegal are nonetheless proscribed and persecuted by a traditionally arch-conservative church leadership, which remains to the present day militantly xenophobic, homophobic, and antisemitic. Whether or not most Gandvians are, genuinely, any of those things, there exists nonetheless a broad and to a large extent unthinking spirit of conformity with ecclesiastical pronouncements among a people whose level of religious commitment may not be especially high, but whose rates of church attendance are, relative to the nations of western Europe and North America, astronomical. There exists however a thriving and riotous 'Base Culture,' primarily youth-driven as such matters usually are, which traffics in what the arbiters of official right would consider deviant or subversive.

A comfortable majority of Gandvians are, well, Gandvian, which is to say that most of the population identifies with the Fennic-speaking and Lutheran 'national' community. Significant minorities, listed according to their level of de facto exclusion from the linguistic-religious Gandvian nation, in ascending order, are Germans, still on the whole a privileged and predominantly elite group strongly represented in upper bureaucratic and military ranks, Sami, previously subject to sharp discrimination though now basically assimilated, Jews, in much the same boat as the Sami, Slavs, no longer subject to legal discrimination though often targeted by church rhetoric and popular violence, Catholics, barred from government or military posts and many categories of employment until as late as 1970, and religious nonconformists or 'sectarians' in official usage, upon whom legal sanctions were lifted also in 1970 however still treated in many circles, Movers in particular, as something of a Fifth Column, a fundamentally subversive, anti-state, and most damningly pro-Walmingtonian element, still widely discriminated-against in actual practice. It should be noted that the state government itself, particularly now as it attempts to bring off a quasi-democratic transition, has generally set itself strongly against ethnic, linguistic, and religious discrimination and likes to trumpet the idea of Gandvik as a tolerant, inclusive, multicultural nation where civic life is open to all. Perhaps counter-intuitively, military leaders, ever-conscious of the nation's limited manpower pool and declining population, have come down very strongly against discriminatory legislation, and generally strive to suppress racist attitudes among national servicemen.

Now onto the military, a subject which I shall spoilerize:

With its reduced resource base New-Gandvik can't expect to provide for its own requirements in every sphere, as could the continent-spanning hundred-million-plus variant. Gandvik still stands to be self-sufficient in small surface warships and auxiliaries, trucks, artillery, light armored vehicles, small arms and personal equipment, and communications gear, all going from what Finland manufactures in real life. I'd also like to hold onto some antitank and manportable surface-to-air missiles sketched out for maximalist Gandvik, and if Amerique is amenable, my thought is that some of these guided weapons might be based on technology transfers from abandoned projects. What I have in mind specifically are the Philco-Ford Saber/Alternate Stinger, the Ford AAWS-M (a laser beam-rider rejected in favor of the heat-seeking design that eventually became the Javelin), and, as a fail-safe tank destroyer, the MGM-166 LOSAT.

Gandvik's going to need some help, though, with the more advanced and development-intensive items that it probably can't afford to pursue on its own, and for the sake of convenience I've put together a wish-list:

Air Force
-Northrop N-156/Cometa: The F-5 would be just about ideal for this new version of Gandvik, which is now less concerned with monitoring vast swaths of airspace than with short-range interception and air-superiority in what Air Force doctrine assumes will be contested skies. Cheap, light, highly maneuverable, versatile, clearly offering a lot of scope for modernization, a perfect aircraft for the Ilmavoimat, and if Ian is amenable I'd love to turn Gandvik into Europe's premier Cometa operator. Perhaps some examples could have been built or assembled locally?
-Northrop Codorniz: Best candidate for Gandvik's first-rate combat aircraft, all the cheapness and maintainability of the N-156 with more motive power and a much more capable radar. Maybe too advanced a plane for California to entertain a Gandvian order.
-If not the F-20, perhaps Gandvik might have managed to get its paws on a few dozen early-model F-18s from Amerique?
-Grumman A-6: Always had a soft spot for this one, and if some relatively low-hour airframes were available for the right price, the Ilmavoimat might well have put aside its normal aversion to single-role types. The A-6's excellent radar, impressive stores capacity, and all-weather, low-altitude precision-attack capabilities would still be unmatched in the Gandvian Air Force and, if I'm not totally off the mark, in the GFR's Air Force as well. Characteristic Grumman overbuilding and the structural toughness demanded of any carrier-based aircraft would also suit operations from dispersed emergency airstrips.
-Grumman OV-1: A modernizing Gandvian army, increasingly conscious of its shortcomings on the electronic battlefield, would have jumped at the chance to acquire some OV-1s. Another stout and sturdy Grumman product, completely at home on rough and undeveloped airstrips close to the front line, lower operating costs and better endurance than a helicopter. Very high on the Gandvian shopping-list even if they don't come with side-looking radar pods included, something that can always be built at home by Nokia!

Failing the North American connection, the leading options would either be the Mirage series or the Novi Avion, though I suppose a Lavi-esque domestic development wouldn't necessarily be too farfetched.

-Lockheed Tormenta/C-130: The obvious choice, if available, for Gandvik's transport requirement. Gandvik would even take civil L-100 models. If not the Hercules, I suppose it would have to be either the C-160 or the G.222. Then again maybe I could poach something from Fokker...
-Lockheed P-3: While Gandvik's maritime-patrol requirements are modest, there's certainly some call for something like the Orion to operate over the Barents Sea, and if California happened to retire the type in the 1990s, Gandvik would have been delighted to snap some up. If not the Orion, it would have to be the Atlantique, failing that something cobbled-together from a civil transport. Clearly not an arena where Gandvik can afford to sink too much effort.
-Grumman E-2: Possibly a slight luxury when the other demands on Gandvik's military spending are considered, though it's hard to put too high a value on airborne early warning. Four or five spare B or even A variant airframes, low-hour, suitable for a working-over by the domestic electronics industry, plus maybe another two or three for conversion into electronic warfare platforms, would be perfect.

-Vertol 107: I'm a big fan of the H-21, and I'd love for Gandvik to fly its successor, the Model 107, better known as the CH-46, assuming that the Piasecki-Vertol connection allocates it to Amerique. Most in Gandvian service would be utility transports, plus a minority tasked with shore-based antisubmarine/airborne minelaying/search-and-rescue.
-Kaman Seasprite: Gandvik obviously doesn't need many shipboard helicopters, though the Seasprite is the natural choice to meet that modest requirement, particularly if they'd been withdrawn in favor of the SH-60 in Amerique.
-Bell/Agusta-Bell 204/205: The classic utility helicopter, Gandvik would have been equally happy to either militarize civilian models or acquire withdrawn military variants. Cheap and simple, can't be beat for general tasks. Perhaps some built or assembled locally?
-Aérospatiale SA 340/Gazelle, or CSR copy: First choice for helicopter trainer/light utility/antitank, if not the Gazelle then perhaps the MBB BO 105?
-If Vertol/Sikorsky helicopters aren't available, the first alternatives would be Aérospatiale with the Puma and Super Frelon, then the CSR's home-built Gazelles and Pumas (SOKO and IAR), and if none of that's on, I suppose it would have to be a patched-together collection of scrap-value Alouette IIIs, Sikorsky S-58s and S-55s, and civil Hueys.

Army
-Gandvik could well, I think, have been the ideal customer for an export-oriented, less-than-cutting-edge tank like the AMX-40, as I doubt anyone would have sold the Gandvians a cutting-edge tank like the Leopard 2 or Abrams back in the 1980s (I'm assuming British tanks are completely off the table, in light of strained relations with Walmington), and the AMX-40 might have been seen as the best thing available short of an expensive, economically-hazardous domestic program.
-Leopard 1: Natural tank for Gandvik if relations with Valendia were good at the time, and a possible alternative to the AMX-40 if we assume that Gandvian requirements drove development of the 1A6 variant with a 120mm gun. The Leopard 1A6 would probably retain a fair amount of credibility, on Shieldian battlefields at least, into the present day. Presumably quite worn out by now and in need of replacement, though still adequate.
-Leopard 2 or Abrams: Gandvik would obviously be looking around for a current-generation MBT to supplement its preexisting fleet of '50s-'60s tanks, whether Leopard 1s, AMX-30s, M60s or something altogether different, and while the Leclerc is maybe a bit too new and too expensive, some surplus M1A1s or Leopard 2s, two or three hundred or however many the seller is willing to part with, would fit the bill nicely.
-Marder IFV: Solid, well-protected vehicle, old enough by now to be leaving Valendian service? Gandvik would be interested in pursuing the proposed 35mm cannon upgrade, or alternatively the KUKA M12 variant.
-Luchs: Another useful vehicle perhaps leaving service in Valendia or already withdrawn? Upgunning would also be on the Gandvian list of priorities.
-AIFV/M113/Lynx: The M113 family would work well in a pinch, and Gandvik would greedily sponge-up any examples available.
-AMX VCI: If several hundred of these became available after their retirement from the Roman forces, Gandvik would be very glad to have them.

-Air Defense: With a homebuilt short-range SAM covering low altitudes, Gandvik still needs medium- and long-range systems, and the best case would be Roland plus HAWK, or even Patriot if Gandvik could get it. Land-based Tartar, for maximum exoticism? Not an especially large slate to select from, though missiles from the CSR would meet the requirement if available, and nowadays Gandvik may start to go shopping there more often.

-In the arena of artillery, the only two items that really jump out are the MLRS and the M109 from Amerique. Otherwise Gandvik's requirements are pretty well covered by domestic production.

Navy
-Gandvik could probably use three or four frigates for work in the Barents Sea, and my preference here is for either secondhand Oliver Hazard Perry or Knox-class ships. Maybe the Knox class would be more interesting, actually, regardless of how old they'd be by the time Gandvik ever received them. Chances are they'd be filling in for something downright ancient. I could honestly see Gandvik hanging on to a few Dealey-class DEs, lovingly maintained and complete with DASH drones!
-Submarines are one glaring omission from the Finnish catalogue (by treaty), and Valendia, provided it's taken up RL Germany's role as leading purveyor of small, cheap SSKs, is probably the best source for Gandvik. My preference is for five or six retired Type 206s. Then again maybe the Type 207, in RL built for Norway, went to Gandvik in AMW? Nothing with any great range is required for what's essentially a coast-defense/blockade-of-Amberland mission, and the Navy probably doesn't have enough personnel to crew a larger boat.

Missiles
-The USA's disproportionate role as European supplier restricts the choices here, though if we do a bit of digging around we can find some more creative options, if required. I'd prefer to go American/Californian, in keeping with what I hope will be the Ilmavoimat's all-Northrop fighter/interceptor force, so AIM-9/7/120, AGM-62/65/78/88, TOW/HeliTOW (carried by Gandvian Hueys, probably, not an assignment for the faint of heart!). Anti-ship might end up being some twisted adaptation of the AGM-78 Standard ARM for an added twist of Gandvian oddness, or possibly a Gabriel clone.

Personnel
Active strength, career personnel plus conscripts, would stand at either 125,281 (variant A) or 192,756 (variant B) inclusive of Army, Air Force, and Navy but not counting paramilitary Civil Guard and Border Guard. Mobilized strength would be 882,264 (A) or 1,357,439 (B), predominantly trained reservists between the ages of 20 and 40. At an all-out, 'total defense' condition nearer to two or three million men would be available for military service in all capacities, though the majority of that figure would consist of essentially static Territorial Army troops age 40 and over. National service would be seen, for the most part, as a patriotic duty, at best an exciting break in the humdrum of daily life, at worst an inescapable obligation, and Riga's strategic paranoia probably means that the call-up is difficult and legally burdensome to evade. The basic term of enlistment is five hundred days, followed by annual refresher training to age 40, in the case of enlisted men, or 60 for officers and NCOs.

The Army, naturally, would soak up the preponderant share of tri-service personnel, Navy, including a sizable coastal artillery corps, second, Air Force, responsible also for administering the long-range SAM umbrella, third. Notwithstanding the fact that it closes-off what is potentially a vast additional source of personnel, the military follows a very strict men-only policy in recruitment, and women are ineligible for conscription or voluntary enlistment in any of the three main armed services. Women can, however, be drafted into auxiliary organizations like the Civil Defense Corps, under whose administrative remit is organized an elite wildland firefighting department, the Ministry of Transport, which also discharges significant search-and-rescue responsibilities, and the Combined Services Nursing Corps, while under emergency circumstances any woman with a medical degree is subject to compulsory assignment to a military field hospital.

Gandvian ground forces are organized into Northern Command, everything north of the Nyland Gulf, Southern Command, everything to the south, and Reserve Command, the latter earmarked for a 'swing' role and of notably lighter composition as befits a force optimized for rapid deployment. Southern Command, responsible for the long and, historically, much-contested Shieldian border, is by far the largest and heaviest of Gandvik's permanent field formations, and contains most of the Army's mechanized units. Northern Command, for its part, is particularly well-adapted to cold-weather operations, while Reserve Command contains the Army's primary air- and amphibious-landing units. The the permanent Commands, corresponding roughly to an army headquarters, control, respectively, five, two, and seven divisions, large and powerful all-arms formations assembled in turn from three so-called Regimental Groups, a structure owing no small debt to the American concept of the Regimental Combat Team. The Regimental Group, a thoroughly, resolutely modern organization which combines under a single authority engineers, reconnaissance troops, field artillery, air defense artillery, and electronic intelligence resources with the arms of decision, the light infantry, armored grenadiers, and tankers upon whose shoulders rests the conduct of the main battle, is as its name implies based upon the fairly ancient institution of the Regiment, still the Gandvian Army's fundamental building-block and the setting for any serviceman's career in uniform. Each Gandvian regiment, most of which have existed more or less continuously since the 1500s or 1600s, is tied intimately to its garrison and its recruitment area, and is almost inevitably the focus of much regional pride. With only a handful of exceptions, national servicemen are inducted upon call-up into their 'home' regiment, where they will serve out their initial term of conscription and their full reserve commitment together with other men from their local area, frequently friends and relatives. While this custom is, as with everything in the armed forces, 'subject to the requirements of the service,' and while personnel with certain sought-after qualifications can find themselves assigned just about anywhere, every effort is made to maintain the national serviceman's association with his home district. Of the fifty-one regiments listed in the Army's standing order of battle, only two, Armored Regiment 112, the armor school's 'resident' trials-and-test unit, and parachute-trained Infantry Regiment 27 are recruited nationally, and while specialist personnel are trained at centralized arm-of-service schools, they are customarily returned to serve with their home regiment.

The traditional Gandvian regimental system is, naturally, not without its disadvantages, perhaps the most painful of which is the chance that one particular locality might, in wartime, end up losing a disproportionate number of its young men, including, alarmingly, multiple close relatives, a type of tragedy repeated time and time again through the centuries. It has also been observed that such strong regional associations can tend to impart a palpable degree of friction to operations at the division level and above, when the self-contained, highly cohesive, strongly habituated, indeed often rather insular and, perhaps, somewhat parochial regiment is forced to work with 'strangers,' and a divisional commander's value is usually calculated according to his success in breaking down those formidable barriers of mutual distrust. The regiment, after all, provides for the Gandvian serviceman an alternative focus for loyalty and self-identification, one undoubtedly a great deal more personal, relatable, and immediate than the Army as a corporate body, and excessive concern for one's own regiment, manifested for instance in a reluctance to attack boldly or defend resolutely and thus risk heavy casualties, or in a failure to effectively cooperate with a 'foreign' regiment, has cost dozens of colonels, dozens at least, their careers and reputations. It nonetheless remains the General Staff's clear belief that the advantages to be gained from localized recruitment, the relative ease with which newly-inducted conscripts are socialized into Army life, ready familiarity among the men and across divisions of rank, and the informal ties of friendship and mutual obligation which tend to obviate the need for disciplinary strictness and spit-and-polish in most instances, comfortably outweigh the system's costs. Of no small importance, moreover, is the fact that the Gandvian regimental system also permits extremely rapid mobilization in an emergency.
Last edited by The Crooked Beat on Sat Mar 23, 2019 3:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Beddgelert
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Beddgelert » Sat Mar 23, 2019 10:45 pm

This post is rushed, as I'm 24 hours away from a trip to the US for which I have neither fully planned nor even begun to pack, and I am very tired after a late shift at the bar, but I just wanted to say -as I'll probably not be able to post much if at all in the next fortnight or so- that I'm always up for changes that may see TCB happy and potentially active-by-AMW-measures-at-least.

The CSR hasn't many friends, and this new Gandvik that's just starting to come to terms with its Socialistic inclinations may fit in geopolitically.
The Shield was a traditional Geletian foe, meaning that Riga and Akink may have inadvertently been on the same side many times over the centuries. But the rise of the CSR during the C20th being shortly followed by the Gull Flag Revolution no doubt lead to the former initially viewing the latter with enthusiasm, and so turning against Gandvik. This likely lasts only until the CSR comes to regard the Gulls as an epoch behind and to characterise their revolution as a bourgeois one. That would be a fine time for Riga to start self-ID'ing as Socialist, from the perspective of any hopeful of association with the ten-times-larger CSR.

I suspect that the proposed changes may mean that I should scale-back some of the CSR's Super-Gandvik enabled claims to Soviet ordnance?

On a related note, I'm torn on whether to stick with IAR-316 and 317 and credit Commonwealth espionage, or to claim KA-126 and its family based on IAR manufacture. Either way, SOKO Gazelle derivatives won't be happening in the CSR, so are either gone or there to be claimed, I dunno.

The CSR will probably be relying on multiple models from one fighter programme, though, which may or may not be of interest in Riga. IAR-95 in single and twin-seat, single and twin-engine, single and twin-fin, turbojet and turbofan, point-interceptor and multi-role configurations. The single-engine turbojet, single-seat, single-fin, interceptor variants are basically the CSR's people's fighter concept and probably cost only a couple of million dollars a piece, while more substantial variants are seen as direct rivals to foreign multi-role fighters.
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Saint-Laurent
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Saint-Laurent » Sun Mar 24, 2019 5:54 am

I'll never stand in the way of downsizing a claim to make it easier to manage.
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DaShunchao
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Postby DaShunchao » Sun Mar 24, 2019 3:29 pm

As discussed in the channel, ever since I got back from my health problems, I'm not going to keep the Roman Empire in Africa. I had some plans for it, but the changing map and players and my own general failure to be active rendered it less pleasant for me. Also, I'm not sure what those plans were. For the first time in my life I didn't keep notes.

Instead, with the Depkazian claim shrinking, I have a claim I've played with for a long time, now all laid out. I also have plans and rp ideas, which I've appended at the end.

Eransahar

Claim: (Image)
Population: > 180.991 million
Demonym: Persian

Government
Capital: There is no official capital, though many of the permanent organs of state are located in Hamadan. Royal palaces are located there, in Esfahan, and in Zrang
Shahanshah: Rostam XXI Suren
Grand Vizier: Bavani DabuIn

The Grand Vizier sits at the head of the Royal Government, and combines the roles of Supreme Court, Chancellor, Prime Minister and Regent in his person. He is assisted in his work by a small body of officials.

Legislative Body: House of Wisdom; tricameral advisory body
The Great House (10 seats)
The Council of the Satraps

Internal Divisions: Eran is a heavily decentralized state, with satrapies deciding many of their internal laws and regulations. Satraps are appointed by the Shahanshah to 10 year terms, that are often (but not always) renewed for the duration of the life of the incumbent. The last major reorganization of Satrapies took place in 1870, establishing 70, of which 41 are represented on the council.

In addition to the Satraps, there are seven Shahs (formerly Shazadehs), permanent hereditary positions. Most of these Shahdoms are officially made up of 2 satrapies. With the exception of Armenia and the Aliids, they are located in the east of the country.

Shahdom of Parthia
Shahdom of Chorasmia
Shahdom of Armenia (Persarmenia)
Shahdom of Sogdia (Samarkand)
Imamate of Ali (Gilan)
Shahdom of Turan
Shahdom of Bactria

The local Exilarch is also numbered amongst the Shahdoms, though he controls no territory in the current Empire. The Patriarch of the East is a member of the Great House, but is not ranked in precedence. The Moabdan-Moabd, Sasan IX, is the hereditary governor of Persis and the leader of the Great House, but is ranked above the Shahs.

Franchise:

There is no universal franchise and no popular representation at the Shahanshah’s court. However, each satrapy and Shahdom has its own council, usually elected, and in modern times (since 1920, in most cases) the Satrap is appointed according to a list provided by that council.

Occasional attempts at establishing representation for the populace at the court have stumbled a number of times, though each attempt has come closer than its predecessors.

Economy
Total GDP: 624,418,950,000
GDP per capita: 3,450
Currency: Iranian Dinar (IID)
Exports: Oil is the major export, but the economy remains diversified. Mining is prominent in the eastern provinces, with limestone, coal and salt being primary focuses, though precious gems, gold and silver deposits are also exploited. Agriculture was a major sector for centuries, and ongoing efforts to modernize the industry are beginning to bear fruit.

Manufacturing is of limited importance, though expanding as modern agricultural techniques continue to drive people to the cities.

Imports: Despite repeated efforts to establish local industries, Eran continues to rely on foreigners for electronics, computers and other expert equipment. The educated Iranian population is being used to lure in foreign investment in these fields.

Language
Official Language: Persian
Other Major Languages: Armenian, Pashto, Baloch, Azeri, Kurdish, Urdu, others
Scripts: In the 1910s, Shahanshah Rostam XIX Suren decreed that a modified Latin alphabet would be used for the Persian Language, supplanting the Arabic script that had been used for centuries.

The so-called Persianate script is now broadly used in Eran proper. Armenian and Arabic are the other two commonly used alphabets.

Native scripts, such as Avestan or Sanskrit (in the east) have been extinct in general usage for a millennium, but are occasionally used for official purposes.

Religion
Official Religion: Zoroastrianism (Royal Priesthood)

Following the overthrow of the Arsacids, the Surenids reestablished Zoroastrianism as the official faith of the Iranian plateau. The formal priesthood in Isfahan was established following the movement of the dynasty to the central plateau, under the leadership of the Sassanians of Persis.

It can be distinguished from other, now heretical, sects in two important ways:
First, the doctrine of Zurvan as First Mover. other sects consider this a novelty, though in practice Zurvan is an intellectual curiosity, not a figure of worship. Second, the hereditary high priesthood, with the Surenid Shahanshahs as patrons. Older forms of the faith considered the proper successor to the prophet to be colleges of Magi collectively.

Ahura Mazda is often syncretised as the God of the Christians, Jews and Muslims; however, Royal Zoroastrianism retains the doctrine that Ahriman (Angyra Mainyu) is a coeval entity to Ahura Mazda. Heretical sects are accused of paying worship to the evil principle rather than the good. This pseudo-dualism has filtered in some ways into Eran’s Christianity, though both Muslims and Jews reject it out of hand.


Other Recognized Religions:
Church of the East, Patriarchate of Isfahan (Royal Christians)
Exilarch (Royal Jews)
Aliid Imamate (Royal Muslims)
Religions tolerated as such:
(Most) Other Christian denominations
Other Jewish denominations
Other Muslim denomination
Unrecognized Religions (Religions with no local religious head):
Buddhism
Hinduism; the state generally lumps all polytheistic (or faiths that appear polytheistic) under this broad umbrella.
Forbidden Religions:
All Iranian religions besides the official Zoroastrian Priesthood are banned, with membership in a dissenting organization punishable in a variety of ostensibly horrible ways. These include syncretists in the Northeast, Mazdaki levelers in southern Persia proper,, so-called ‘Magian Purists’ in the lands along the Caspian sea, and Mithraists along the western borders. These faiths are actively persecuted, though the last active suppression by military force took place in the 11th century with the extermination of the Manichaeans in Samarkand
Though Atheism is not forbidden, there is no provision for it, no public support, and a refusal to swear an oath is looked upon as an act almost as terrible as breaking one, and a guardian may be assigned to look after the interests of the party. Christian sects, usually protestant, that refuse oathtaking are also treated as legally incapable.


Military:

The Royal Army:
The Royal Army is the primary branch of the armed forces. A conscript force with a (small) elite core of volunteers, it continues the long historical trend of Persian infantry being numerous, but also not of the highest quality.

Conscription is via lottery, with all men aged between 18 and 30 liable to be called up. Volunteers can be of either gender. Many of the wealthier families used to pay for substitutes; this has now been formalized with the Donation system, where high school students will have their college and first home paid for if they serve for five years after graduation.

Persian armor and artillery are generally of average quality, and are usually treated as support weapons rather than massed for their own purpose.

The Royal Navy

The Royal Navy is a green-water navy, though the development of blue-water capabilities continues. Its primary base is located at the newly-developed port of Karachi in Sindh, but it maintains anchorages along the coast, with the Admiralty still located in Busehr, on the Persian gulf.

Air Force

There is no independent airforce. Eran’s planes are usually imitations or licensees of foreign powers, though efforts to establish a local aviation industry continue.

Missile Command

The Government of Eran maintains a small number of nuclear weapons, officially claiming a capacity of 30 warheads and a reserve of 50. They are controlled by a separate branch of the military that answers directly to the Grand Vizier and, through him, the Shahanshah. No nuclear testing has been officially undertaken since the 70s, though satellite images reveal activity in Herat satrapy that could indicate preparations for further testing.

Eran’s current Shahanshah has pledged no first use of nuclear weapons, though the traditionally elastic stance of the Eranian government towards what constitutes provocation is well-known.


Military Police

There is no civilian investigation agency, with terrorism and other organized criminal activities the responsibility of a force modelled after the Gendarmerie. This so-called Royal Guard is a broadly paramilitary organization with limited naval and aviation capabilities of its own. As its name suggests, parts of it are also dedicated to protecting the person and property of the Shahanshah.

Foreign Affairs

The Surenids have no set foreign policy except to maintain their independence of action. They are not fans of giving their word, but they will not break it once given.

While the dynasty still maintains claims to the provinces of Assyria and the Western Iranian plateau (now controlled by Romnika), and an irredentist movement continues to agitate to regain all the Achaeminid territories (passively supported by the Shahs of Armenia, who would benefit the most, and the Moabdan-Moabd), there is no appetite in the court for an aggressive war that would cost hundreds of thousands of lives and add millions of unwilling subjects even if victorious.

There is a cultural continuity along the western Satrapies that occasionally flares up into demanding union on one side or the other of the line, or even full independence, but the Royal Guard considers the suppression of these entities to be its top priority.

Rumors of agitators crossing the borders into Romnika and the CSR may be considered just that, rumors.

While the Surenids would like good relations with the Depkazian state to their north, there is general confusion as to how to attain this. The Marimaians across the gulf are an easier party to cooperate with, though relations cannot be termed more than ‘cordial’.

In general, the farther you are from Eran’s borders, the more the Eranian government likes you.

RP Ideas

*Eran wants to establish more control over the Persian gulf’s oil fields.

*Forces in the Eranian government want to establish a permanent peace treaty with Romnika, while others continue to press for war.

*The current Shahanshah is in his 70s, and has not yet chosen an heir from amongst his sons. Three parties have formed, each headed by a Royal Prince.

*With much of the attention of the royal guard on the western provinces, independence movements in the East have been allowed to develop.

*Mazdaki levellers in Persis have begun making common cause with CSR infiltrators.

User avatar
Nuova Lombardia
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 8
Founded: Feb 14, 2019
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Nuova Lombardia » Sun Mar 24, 2019 3:48 pm

If it's something that you'll enjoy and you've got ideas for it, then my response is a 'yes'.

Sometimes it can take a bit of time and shifting around to get something that you feel good about, you've talked about this claim idea on Discord quite a bit and you've had it in mind for quite a while. I say go for it.

User avatar
Chrinthanium
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 14081
Founded: Feb 04, 2006
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Chrinthanium » Sun Mar 24, 2019 4:34 pm

DaShunchao wrote:As discussed in the channel, ever since I got back from my health problems, I'm not going to keep the Roman Empire in Africa. I had some plans for it, but the changing map and players and my own general failure to be active rendered it less pleasant for me. Also, I'm not sure what those plans were. For the first time in my life I didn't keep notes.

Instead, with the Depkazian claim shrinking, I have a claim I've played with for a long time, now all laid out. I also have plans and rp ideas, which I've appended at the end.

Eransahar

Claim: (Image)
Population: > 180.991 million
Demonym: Persian

Government
Capital: There is no official capital, though many of the permanent organs of state are located in Hamadan. Royal palaces are located there, in Esfahan, and in Zrang
Shahanshah: Rostam XXI Suren
Grand Vizier: Bavani DabuIn

The Grand Vizier sits at the head of the Royal Government, and combines the roles of Supreme Court, Chancellor, Prime Minister and Regent in his person. He is assisted in his work by a small body of officials.

Legislative Body: House of Wisdom; tricameral advisory body
The Great House (10 seats)
The Council of the Satraps

Internal Divisions: Eran is a heavily decentralized state, with satrapies deciding many of their internal laws and regulations. Satraps are appointed by the Shahanshah to 10 year terms, that are often (but not always) renewed for the duration of the life of the incumbent. The last major reorganization of Satrapies took place in 1870, establishing 70, of which 41 are represented on the council.

In addition to the Satraps, there are seven Shahs (formerly Shazadehs), permanent hereditary positions. Most of these Shahdoms are officially made up of 2 satrapies. With the exception of Armenia and the Aliids, they are located in the east of the country.

Shahdom of Parthia
Shahdom of Chorasmia
Shahdom of Armenia (Persarmenia)
Shahdom of Sogdia (Samarkand)
Imamate of Ali (Gilan)
Shahdom of Turan
Shahdom of Bactria

The local Exilarch is also numbered amongst the Shahdoms, though he controls no territory in the current Empire. The Patriarch of the East is a member of the Great House, but is not ranked in precedence. The Moabdan-Moabd, Sasan IX, is the hereditary governor of Persis and the leader of the Great House, but is ranked above the Shahs.

Franchise:

There is no universal franchise and no popular representation at the Shahanshah’s court. However, each satrapy and Shahdom has its own council, usually elected, and in modern times (since 1920, in most cases) the Satrap is appointed according to a list provided by that council.

Occasional attempts at establishing representation for the populace at the court have stumbled a number of times, though each attempt has come closer than its predecessors.

Economy
Total GDP: 624,418,950,000
GDP per capita: 3,450
Currency: Iranian Dinar (IID)
Exports: Oil is the major export, but the economy remains diversified. Mining is prominent in the eastern provinces, with limestone, coal and salt being primary focuses, though precious gems, gold and silver deposits are also exploited. Agriculture was a major sector for centuries, and ongoing efforts to modernize the industry are beginning to bear fruit.

Manufacturing is of limited importance, though expanding as modern agricultural techniques continue to drive people to the cities.

Imports: Despite repeated efforts to establish local industries, Eran continues to rely on foreigners for electronics, computers and other expert equipment. The educated Iranian population is being used to lure in foreign investment in these fields.

Language
Official Language: Persian
Other Major Languages: Armenian, Pashto, Baloch, Azeri, Kurdish, Urdu, others
Scripts: In the 1910s, Shahanshah Rostam XIX Suren decreed that a modified Latin alphabet would be used for the Persian Language, supplanting the Arabic script that had been used for centuries.

The so-called Persianate script is now broadly used in Eran proper. Armenian and Arabic are the other two commonly used alphabets.

Native scripts, such as Avestan or Sanskrit (in the east) have been extinct in general usage for a millennium, but are occasionally used for official purposes.

Religion
Official Religion: Zoroastrianism (Royal Priesthood)

Following the overthrow of the Arsacids, the Surenids reestablished Zoroastrianism as the official faith of the Iranian plateau. The formal priesthood in Isfahan was established following the movement of the dynasty to the central plateau, under the leadership of the Sassanians of Persis.

It can be distinguished from other, now heretical, sects in two important ways:
First, the doctrine of Zurvan as First Mover. other sects consider this a novelty, though in practice Zurvan is an intellectual curiosity, not a figure of worship. Second, the hereditary high priesthood, with the Surenid Shahanshahs as patrons. Older forms of the faith considered the proper successor to the prophet to be colleges of Magi collectively.

Ahura Mazda is often syncretised as the God of the Christians, Jews and Muslims; however, Royal Zoroastrianism retains the doctrine that Ahriman (Angyra Mainyu) is a coeval entity to Ahura Mazda. Heretical sects are accused of paying worship to the evil principle rather than the good. This pseudo-dualism has filtered in some ways into Eran’s Christianity, though both Muslims and Jews reject it out of hand.


Other Recognized Religions:
Church of the East, Patriarchate of Isfahan (Royal Christians)
Exilarch (Royal Jews)
Aliid Imamate (Royal Muslims)
Religions tolerated as such:
(Most) Other Christian denominations
Other Jewish denominations
Other Muslim denomination
Unrecognized Religions (Religions with no local religious head):
Buddhism
Hinduism; the state generally lumps all polytheistic (or faiths that appear polytheistic) under this broad umbrella.
Forbidden Religions:
All Iranian religions besides the official Zoroastrian Priesthood are banned, with membership in a dissenting organization punishable in a variety of ostensibly horrible ways. These include syncretists in the Northeast, Mazdaki levelers in southern Persia proper,, so-called ‘Magian Purists’ in the lands along the Caspian sea, and Mithraists along the western borders. These faiths are actively persecuted, though the last active suppression by military force took place in the 11th century with the extermination of the Manichaeans in Samarkand
Though Atheism is not forbidden, there is no provision for it, no public support, and a refusal to swear an oath is looked upon as an act almost as terrible as breaking one, and a guardian may be assigned to look after the interests of the party. Christian sects, usually protestant, that refuse oathtaking are also treated as legally incapable.


Military:

The Royal Army:
The Royal Army is the primary branch of the armed forces. A conscript force with a (small) elite core of volunteers, it continues the long historical trend of Persian infantry being numerous, but also not of the highest quality.

Conscription is via lottery, with all men aged between 18 and 30 liable to be called up. Volunteers can be of either gender. Many of the wealthier families used to pay for substitutes; this has now been formalized with the Donation system, where high school students will have their college and first home paid for if they serve for five years after graduation.

Persian armor and artillery are generally of average quality, and are usually treated as support weapons rather than massed for their own purpose.

The Royal Navy

The Royal Navy is a green-water navy, though the development of blue-water capabilities continues. Its primary base is located at the newly-developed port of Karachi in Sindh, but it maintains anchorages along the coast, with the Admiralty still located in Busehr, on the Persian gulf.

Air Force

There is no independent airforce. Eran’s planes are usually imitations or licensees of foreign powers, though efforts to establish a local aviation industry continue.

Missile Command

The Government of Eran maintains a small number of nuclear weapons, officially claiming a capacity of 30 warheads and a reserve of 50. They are controlled by a separate branch of the military that answers directly to the Grand Vizier and, through him, the Shahanshah. No nuclear testing has been officially undertaken since the 70s, though satellite images reveal activity in Herat satrapy that could indicate preparations for further testing.

Eran’s current Shahanshah has pledged no first use of nuclear weapons, though the traditionally elastic stance of the Eranian government towards what constitutes provocation is well-known.


Military Police

There is no civilian investigation agency, with terrorism and other organized criminal activities the responsibility of a force modelled after the Gendarmerie. This so-called Royal Guard is a broadly paramilitary organization with limited naval and aviation capabilities of its own. As its name suggests, parts of it are also dedicated to protecting the person and property of the Shahanshah.

Foreign Affairs

The Surenids have no set foreign policy except to maintain their independence of action. They are not fans of giving their word, but they will not break it once given.

While the dynasty still maintains claims to the provinces of Assyria and the Western Iranian plateau (now controlled by Romnika), and an irredentist movement continues to agitate to regain all the Achaeminid territories (passively supported by the Shahs of Armenia, who would benefit the most, and the Moabdan-Moabd), there is no appetite in the court for an aggressive war that would cost hundreds of thousands of lives and add millions of unwilling subjects even if victorious.

There is a cultural continuity along the western Satrapies that occasionally flares up into demanding union on one side or the other of the line, or even full independence, but the Royal Guard considers the suppression of these entities to be its top priority.

Rumors of agitators crossing the borders into Romnika and the CSR may be considered just that, rumors.

While the Surenids would like good relations with the Depkazian state to their north, there is general confusion as to how to attain this. The Marimaians across the gulf are an easier party to cooperate with, though relations cannot be termed more than ‘cordial’.

In general, the farther you are from Eran’s borders, the more the Eranian government likes you.

RP Ideas

*Eran wants to establish more control over the Persian gulf’s oil fields.

*Forces in the Eranian government want to establish a permanent peace treaty with Romnika, while others continue to press for war.

*The current Shahanshah is in his 70s, and has not yet chosen an heir from amongst his sons. Three parties have formed, each headed by a Royal Prince.

*With much of the attention of the royal guard on the western provinces, independence movements in the East have been allowed to develop.

*Mazdaki levellers in Persis have begun making common cause with CSR infiltrators.


I echo Mari's sentiments. If it is something you'll enjoy, have ideas for, and will play.... then yes is my response.
About Me: Just your typical aging gay man trying desperately to retain what youth remains within himself.
Always remember you are loved and cherished. You are my friend and that means the world to me!
You can address me as "Your Indefatigable Greatness" or "Chrin." Whichever you choose. I'm not picky. Also, the pronoun is "he" since I'm a gay dude.
------------
Part of A Modern World RP group.

User avatar
Iansisle
Diplomat
 
Posts: 899
Founded: Antiquity
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Iansisle » Sun Mar 24, 2019 7:21 pm

I'm perfectly fine with TCB's proposed changes, and would have no problems relinquishing the rest of Belarus as long as you take Bryansk oblast as well. I don't think I could take the map's look otherwise. ;) And hey, everyone loves a long, narrow country, right? That would leave us with ~107,828,895 Shieldians (plus or minus Eastern European censuses), which seems way huge to me. Even assuming a healthy economic advantage to Gandvik, it seems unlikely that a historical 10-1 population advantage would have led for the Shieldians having as much trouble with the Gandvians as they do. It might be best for me to retreat out of Poland and Czechia. That would leave a contiguous area of just shy of 50m, which would be fine for a new claim.

It would mean the Shield pulling out of the Baltic, which is fine by me as that never really made sense except perhaps at the height of the Grand Empire. It would also mean we no longer directly border WoS, which could have some impacts on the trade talks we've been having. But it would hack the Shield down to 60,219,315, which is a more reasonable ratio to mini-Gandvik for currently established history. Plus, it would preserve the largely declining populations of Ukraine and southern Russia against the population gains of Poland and Czechia, simulating the violence and emigration resulting from the Revolution.

It's interesting to see this new alignment is really pushing Walmington and the Shield together even before the Revolution. The enemy of my enemy, eh?

Speaking of unusual alignments, I don't think California would have any major qualms selling the F-5 to Gandvik. However, California and Walmington are usually assumed to be on thoroughly good footing. Several time-fractures ago, it was Walmy abolitionist-driven intervention and recognition that kept Californian post-revolutionary economic and political history from mirroring that of, say, Haiti.

I mean, mind you, I've no idea who (if anyone?) built the missions and hauled all the slaves out there currently.

But, yeah, I don't see why California would have any particular problems. When it was first developed, the Cometa was seen as a more export-oriented second-rate fighter and only gained major acceptance in the FAC due to some seismic shifts in theory and strategy. The FAC only has real problems exporting what it sees as its top-line technology. It would be willing to export the Codorniz as well, though likely not as it was first being accepted into Californian service, and there might be some hesitation about providing the full avionics package used by the FAC. The Tormenta and the P-3/Virgo shouldn't pose any issues, although again some of the more sensitive top-end electronics in the more recent marks of the Virgo might not be included. For ordnance, early-mark or downrated Alforfóns should fill the anti-shipping role. The Gorrión and the Cascabel (which has been replaced by the Colibrí in Californian service) should be fine for air-to-air if you'd like them.

I may have to take a look at a lot of Shieldian kit, since a lot of it right now is based on Soviet kit taken from Big Gandvik via Beddgelert. Assuming a closer historical relationship between Walmington and the Shield, it might end up with a lot former Walmy stuff. Things for another day and another telegram no doubt!

User avatar
Saint-Laurent
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 24
Founded: Nov 08, 2017
Democratic Socialists

Postby Saint-Laurent » Mon Mar 25, 2019 7:20 am

I don't support a second claim for DaShunchao just based on the fact that there is zero activity under the first and there was nothing done in the African claim. I get that said claim is being dropped but it is being replaced so that two claims continue to exist with very little to no activity under them.
.:. Puppet of Layarteb .:.
En Dieu, la liberté | Guide to My Stories
Earth II | Earth II Discord
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