AMW Big Discussion Thread

[DaShunchao]

Currently assigned trade ports:

*Quanzhao has been assigned to the Marimaian Caliphate

*Macau remains assigned to Iberia

*Hong-Kong belongs to either the Norse or Walmington.

* Whoever does not get Hong Kong will be given Nanao island or another Guangdong port of their choosing at my approval.

*Valendia has been assigned Xiamen

[Chrinthanium]

As in all things AMW, there comes time to think and then a time to do. In the time to do, one must press forward with ideas born over the last month with steadfast determination. One must continually review and reconsider the idea in order to assume that the basic premise is always held above the whims of its creator. Thus, in stating these platitudes, I hereby state that I have come to several conclusions regarding the Iberian claim. Most of these ideas remain in infancy, but infants can and do grow into full-fledged entities. The main thought process at this juncture is the settlement of the capital of Iberia not on Madrid, as originally planned, but on Barcelona; to elevate the Catalans to the position that the Castilians achieved in real life. It would not be so far fetch to believe it could have occurred and I do believe that, having the ruling dynasty originate in Catalan territory (though it be Valencia, which at the time was part of Cataluña) and giving the ruling dynasty the official title of House of Borja (Borgia in English), that such placement of the seat of Imperial power in Barcelona makes more sense than Madrid, which was center of Castile (for the most part). In consideration, there is some historical precedent in a union that could eventually have brought such a thought to fruition. The dynastic union between Aragon and the County of Barcelona and the eventual union of Aragon and Castile can be used to launch such an idea. It can also be as simple as (it was E-P who simplified the idea) that the Trastamaras remain in history with the Aragonese branch inheriting everything and then having them eliminated (through natural or sinister means) until the Borja are placed on the throne and, Hey, Presto! there we have a Catalan on the throne ruling from a capital in Barcelona from which a great empire springs forth (similar to how it worked when they crossed the Med into Italy, though focusing more on the peninsula of Iberia than Italy and the Med). So, that's where I'm going. Catalans in an exalted place ruling a united Iberian peninsula from their power base, and the Duchies of Toulouse and Aquitaine as well (via, once again, dynastic union).

The issue of language does not seem to present much of a problem, thanks to the advice of Roania. Having such a large portion of the Iberian peninsula speaking Castilian would allow for it to be an official language of the Iberian Kingdom, along side Catalan, Portuguese, and any other which may be required. Oh, and my dear friend, Ian, I must point out at this juncture that the Catalan language does not, as you put it, use a lisp. Those silly Castilian speakers do, however, seem to use it.

[Walmington on Sea]

That seems very reasonable to me. It would give Walmington a significant power base for colonisation and makes sense from a historical point of view. I also like the idea about a last Ditch (heh) defence of "England" against the Norse, even though a large part of their army would likely have consisted of Mercians, Northumbrians and Angles by that point - traitors to the English cause, of course . With ports on both the North and Irish Seas and the fertile heartlands of England under Norse control, they would probably have called it a day, especially with an Amberlander raid on Scandinavia. Zealand and Amberland are very close to several important ports, not least the King's home at Kungahälla.

I have three small (or rather not so small) suggestions regarding this split though.
1. I would really like to claim Birmingham and its corporations and industrial base for the Norse, but seeing as it sits right in the centre of the Western Midlands, that would necessitate adding the counties of Warwickshire and possibly also Stoke-on-Trent and Staffordshire to the Norse territory.
2. Milton Keynes is stabbing into East of England quite a bit, it would be more aesthetically pleasing to remove that salient - or you might keep it as a former border fortress - which for everyone who has read Good Omens would be strange . Your call of course.
3. With Scotland* going to the Norse, it might make sense to change the Shetlands and the Faeroer Islands to them as well, since I don't quite see how they could have remained independent in the midst of a literal Norse Sea.
All of these are merely ideas I had when looking at the map, of course. If you find that this reduces Walmington too much (a good 4-5 million people, after all), I'm absolutely willing to either switch other counties to you or find another solution that works for both of us such as a Walmingtonian Northern Ireland or a population switch as we did in London, only in the other direction.

*Scotland would likely have married into the Norse aristocracy, which probably makes them traitors to the Celtic cause. Ah, well. Nobody can say no to Scandinavian women.

I would want WoS without Britain to have small but significant outposts. The obvious ones do include Singapore and Hong Kong, of course. I am not trying to lay down the law, but I think that if these are to be colonial outposts, and WoS is to be amongst the nations with colonial outposts, well, does this not seem natural?

So many other potential outposts are worthy of consideration, but I owe a reply of some relevance and this is taking far too long.

You have my vote. It fits Walmington perfectly and keeps those vital locations out of the reach of the vast 100M+ powers. I will claim territories close to Singapore though, as well as a treaty port/military harbour in China or Indochina.

Gosh, this is so ruddy complicated.

If you were to take Birmingham, you would indeed probably have to take Staffordshire, Stoke (thanks awfully, old bean!), and probably Warwickshire. That represents a shift of the better part of five million people (so a nine or ten million swing, over-all). The alternative might be to broaden the scope of industries present in Manchester, Leeds, and Glasgow et cetera.

It does look well on the map, however, and I have not really wanted a 'big' nation, so I think that I may be agreeable to these shifts. I would be even happier to be free of Milton Keynes than I would to be free of Stoke-on-Trent.

Instead of WoS giving up the islands between our homelands, Ulster, and our colonies on Iceland and Greenland, why do you not give up your untenable position on Ellan Vannin!

No, I am not trying to claim the Isle of Man, but the far northern sea is Walmingtonian, not Norse. Iceland and Greenland are Walmingtonian, Ulster is Walmingtonian, you're lucky the Western Isles aren't Walmingtonian. Perhaps we ought to discuss that?

[Chrinthanium]

I have been trying to better our map. In the recent month, I have updated the French regions to correlate to their new arrangements. I am very certain there's a lot more to do, but one bit at a time. What I am VERY proud to announce is that the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland will FINALLY have counties drawn in on it. I actually found a map with a rough facsimile of the modern counties (not ceremonial). So, that will come out with the next update. Since they were drawn onto the very same map we already use, it came as a great pleasure to me to simply copy and paste it into ours. Morocco also redid its internal subdivisions and I found a suitable map from which to hand draw them into Morocco. So did D.R. Congo. These, too, will appear on the next map update. I'll keep looking around for others as time permits.

[Cassanos]

That seems very reasonable to me. It would give Walmington a significant power base for colonisation and makes sense from a historical point of view. I also like the idea about a last Ditch (heh) defence of "England" against the Norse, even though a large part of their army would likely have consisted of Mercians, Northumbrians and Angles by that point - traitors to the English cause, of course . With ports on both the North and Irish Seas and the fertile heartlands of England under Norse control, they would probably have called it a day, especially with an Amberlander raid on Scandinavia. Zealand and Amberland are very close to several important ports, not least the King's home at Kungahälla.

I have three small (or rather not so small) suggestions regarding this split though.
1. I would really like to claim Birmingham and its corporations and industrial base for the Norse, but seeing as it sits right in the centre of the Western Midlands, that would necessitate adding the counties of Warwickshire and possibly also Stoke-on-Trent and Staffordshire to the Norse territory.
2. Milton Keynes is stabbing into East of England quite a bit, it would be more aesthetically pleasing to remove that salient - or you might keep it as a former border fortress - which for everyone who has read Good Omens would be strange . Your call of course.
3. With Scotland* going to the Norse, it might make sense to change the Shetlands and the Faeroer Islands to them as well, since I don't quite see how they could have remained independent in the midst of a literal Norse Sea.
All of these are merely ideas I had when looking at the map, of course. If you find that this reduces Walmington too much (a good 4-5 million people, after all), I'm absolutely willing to either switch other counties to you or find another solution that works for both of us such as a Walmingtonian Northern Ireland or a population switch as we did in London, only in the other direction.

*Scotland would likely have married into the Norse aristocracy, which probably makes them traitors to the Celtic cause. Ah, well. Nobody can say no to Scandinavian women.


You have my vote. It fits Walmington perfectly and keeps those vital locations out of the reach of the vast 100M+ powers. I will claim territories close to Singapore though, as well as a treaty port/military harbour in China or Indochina.

Gosh, this is so ruddy complicated.

If you were to take Birmingham, you would indeed probably have to take Staffordshire, Stoke (thanks awfully, old bean!), and probably Warwickshire. That represents a shift of the better part of five million people (so a nine or ten million swing, over-all). The alternative might be to broaden the scope of industries present in Manchester, Leeds, and Glasgow et cetera.

It does look well on the map, however, and I have not really wanted a 'big' nation, so I think that I may be agreeable to these shifts. I would be even happier to be free of Milton Keynes than I would to be free of Stoke-on-Trent.

Instead of WoS giving up the islands between our homelands, Ulster, and our colonies on Iceland and Greenland, why do you not give up your untenable position on Ellan Vannin!

No, I am not trying to claim the Isle of Man, but the far northern sea is Walmingtonian, not Norse. Iceland and Greenland are Walmingtonian, Ulster is Walmingtonian, you're lucky the Western Isles aren't Walmingtonian. Perhaps we ought to discuss that?

Either I'm terrible at map-reading or I've been in AMW for too long, but I actually assumed that the Isle of Man would be Walmingtonian anyway . You might not try to claim it, but I'm definitely offering it, it would feel strange to have it as anything but quintessentially English in AMW.

As for the northern islands, that does make sense - and I definitely think claims to natural resouces in the Arctic will be a bone of contention, with some Norse considering both the northern islands as well as Greenland and Iceland as naturally Nordic. The Hebrides, however, are definitely Norse - or Scottish, but since the Dunkelds married into Norse royalty, there we are .

If you give your go-ahead for these switches (English counties are discussed and Isle of Man to Walmington), I'll finalise my claim.

[DaShunchao]

I've given it some thought, and discussed it a bit in discord.

I'm willing to give the remainder of South Vietnam to Amerique and Dra-Pol, to be divided as per their previous roleplaying setting.

[Walmington on Sea]

Oh, perhaps I was thinking too much of the Norwegian reign over Mann. I do not think that I had mentioned it specifically since the last round of changes. Very well, the Walmingtonians shall learn to ride the motorised velocipede!

I think it fair to assume that, historically, Walmington and the Danelaw will have fought more wars than Denmark and Sweden! Mann; Shetland, Orkney, the Faeroes ((Newry)); some of the Western Isles, Bornholm, and maybe Rugen, Oland and Gotland, as well as ports and harbours in Britain, Ireland, Jutland, Iceland ((Albany)), and Greenland ((Norbray)) likely switching hands many times over the last thousand years.

I would like to have Bornholm, which has gone back and forth with Gandvik, I believe, and lies mid way between Angleland and Amberland though I am not trying to claim any other Swedish islands. I have never been completely clear on which of us had at any given moment.

I wonder if the iron-age expansion of your ancient ancestors in Jutland, at least, might have played a role in driving the Angles from the Angeln and to the high seas in the first place.

In order for the new shape of the region to work, I think that the Angles will need to begin their voyages and settlements in the Early Middle Ages, around the time of the Gaelic voyagers who are less hypothetical than they are factually established in AMW, and perhaps -if you listen to Walmingtonians- once in the fog his history reigned over coasts and isles in an arc from Amberland to New England. Before the Vikings came.

I imagine that trying to conquer (or reconquer) Jutland was a centuries long Angelish folly, attempting to ease the link between our Baltic homelands, and England and the North Atlantic colonies, which doubtless suffered greatly in Norse raiding, and never having the manpower to hold mainland territory, especially as calls for relief constantly arrived from here or there.

Perhaps in turn the Walmingtonians owe more to the continental armies of Gandvik, Valendia, and the Shield than we care to admit (though we may give the latter some fraternal credit), for ensuring that their blood enemies never had the opportunity to mass their own strength against Angleland for long enough to crush its Engl-ish identify.

As to Vietnam, Dra-pol, and Amerique, I will have to return to the matter, interesting as it may be.

[The Crooked Beat]

Hi everyone!

By the way, just thought I'd post a link to the new(ish) factbook: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=438332

[Chrinthanium]

viewtopic.php?f=23&t=438379

Guess what? Iberia's getting it's factbook in order!

[Chrinthanium]

Right, so I was vaguely thinking about tweaking a few things about Iberia. I wound up discussing it in Discord during my insomnia this night. The nuts and bolts of that conversation have led me to move forward with the vague ideas I was thinking of implementing as well as trying to work out just how Iberia works on the international stage.

Rather than go on with a huge post that will be run-on sentences at this level of sleep deprivation, here's a list of the changes I am proposing for Iberia. Thank you to the Discord chat with Beddgelert and Amerique.

1: Iberia shall henceforth stop being any form of a democracy and shall instead become an absolute monarchy.
2: Iberia shall henceforth be unashamedly conservative in its outlook and shall endeavor to maintain strong relations with other right-wing, autocratic states and those of a similar ilk through means of military, economic, and political support as well as being aligned in such a way as to give her strong allied favorable trade deals for her mineral wealth as well as joint ventures in building military and defense apparatus.
3: Iberia shall expand. My proposal sees Zimbabwe (13,805,084), Botswana (2,214,858), the Brazilian state of Santa Catarina (6,727,000), and French Southern and Antarctic Lands (0) being added to the empire. This would give the Kingdom of Iberia a total global population of 184,896,105 which is a total increase of 20,532,084.
4: Iberia shall definitely go more authoritarian and it will be highly Catholic.

This is the starting point of the changes. Questions should be posted below if you have any. I'm basically trying to bring some of the idea I had for Britain into Iberia.

[Chemaki]

I'm back! Jeez, I have a lot to catch up on.

[Chrinthanium]

I'm back! Jeez, I have a lot to catch up on.

We told you to bring back your nation for the last 2 weeks. Silly rabbit

[Chrinthanium]

So, there were a few items on my mind today which I thought I should bring up here. Some deal with actual nations while one deals with the apps thread, which is where I shall begin.

The second post of the AMW Applications Thread hosts a list of current claims. Since most AMWers have long since forsaken the offsite message board, I have been at a loss of where to put factbook links. What I have decided is to place them on the 2nd post of the applications thread. To this end I am requesting that anyone with a factbook (no matter how complete) link their threads here so I can begin that process. This will assist AMW members in locating where any AMW factbook is located as well as potential members to see the histories created in our nations to help give them a leg up in creating their future claims. I know there are links scattered through this thread, but getting the links submitted under here will simplify the process for me.

I am thinking about AMW World Cup and a potential revisit to creating that thread again with Amerique hosting this go around. That depends on him actually wanting to do so. We'd need at least enough nations to have 4 groups from which the top two teams would advance to the knockout stage. To this end, if need be, the WRE can be reduced like the UK does into constituent parts (Spain, Portugal, Italy, and whatever I decide to call the entirety of Southern France). That would give one group right there, plus if we have Ian both as GFR and California and Caliphate, Valendia, Gandvik we've another group. Then Amerique, Walmington, Kulandu, Chrinthania is yet another group. There is Romnika, Beddgelert, Japan, and Convallaria. Plus Depkazia into the mix and we're fully integrated with one extra nation. If Cassanos does finally make a formal and precise claim, then we're two nations to the good. Of course, I could withdraw the WRE to one nation which means that we'd be short 1 nation with San Hieronymi being the fill in for that. There is also EP's other claim the CIAS, which could participate. Not to mention Ro's DaShun and TUGS. So we can do it if everyone is willing without breaking up nations to smaller parts as well. If you don't want to participate, you can still submit a team and, IIRC, there are settings in the NS Scorinators that allow you to handicap a team or set it some way where it might lose more than anything.

In considering WC history in AMW, Brazil has won it 5 times, Germany (Unified) once, West Germany 3 times, Italy 4 times, Spain 1 time, Uruguay twice, Argentina twice, England and France both once. I didn't want to divvy it up like that because it would cause interesting results in AMW. My proposal for AMW's World Cup history is as follows: Valendia has won it 4 times, WRE has won it 4 times, Amerique 2, Future Cass Claim 2, Walmington 1, Chrinthania 1, Beddgelert 1, Gandvik 1. That's 16 World Cups vs 20 RL World Cups. I know Ian likes California to almost make it only to fail, so I think they may have more 2nd place wins than anyone else in the world.

[Iansisle]

¡Vamos California!

I've always imagined los Osos as a bit of an expy of el Tri, perhaps minus the homophobic chanting. Lots of dominance in non-world-cup events combined with boisterous marches through the group stages and either oh-so-close or downright embarrassing exits in the single elimination rounds. I remember by some quirk of Chrin's last scoring system we'd had the most third place finishes of any nation; I'm down to still be the darlings of the saddest game on Earth. Oh, and the corruption and occasional bans from organized play. I'd like that too. Plus the part where our fans are super rich and loud and drunk all the god damn time. No, you don't understand, ALL the god damn time.

As for the GFR, I suppose they can send a team if we really need? I have a feeling it'll mostly be comprised of malnourished former peasants with sticks asking where all the ice is.

[Chrinthanium]

¡Vamos California!

I've always imagined los Osos as a bit of an expy of el Tri, perhaps minus the homophobic chanting. Lots of dominance in non-world-cup events combined with boisterous marches through the group stages and either oh-so-close or downright embarrassing exits in the single elimination rounds. I remember by some quirk of Chrin's last scoring system we'd had the most third place finishes of any nation; I'm down to still be the darlings of the saddest game on Earth. Oh, and the corruption and occasional bans from organized play. I'd like that too. Plus the part where our fans are super rich and loud and drunk all the god damn time. No, you don't understand, ALL the god damn time.

As for the GFR, I suppose they can send a team if we really need? I have a feeling it'll mostly be comprised of malnourished former peasants with sticks asking where all the ice is.

Well, at least the GFR team will be easy to beat... unless food and medical care become a prize, then we're all screwed! LOL

So, yeah, as far as California, we can make it however you want it. My scoring system is a scorinator that works these things out based on parameters input into the system then adds random luck to it all. If I were to sort it all out via a scorinator and AMW history, then no telling how many nations Beddgelert would encompass before becoming the CSR and all that mixing and working out but that could be done as well. My current system just is assigning it based on what people want/expect from their nations. I'm not setting anything in stone yet. Better to talk it out among us all before that's done. We're always a (usually) amiable group, so no need to try to upset anyone by me trying to say who does and doesn't suck at association football in AMW. Of course, the WRE does have 3 of the better teams in the world, so there's some room for the WRE to talk.

[Chrinthanium]

When Cassanos returned scouting a claim, it was my belief that it would be a good idea to drop Britain in his favor to do the claim he wanted to do. Since making that decision, I have done nothing but upset and disappoint. To be frank, I had stated I was loathe to give it up, but I decided, rightly or wrongly, that doing so would be good to bring back a player we all respected. I do not regret that decision, though I do regret some of its repercussions. Since that time there's been little interaction with Walmington and Me, though that's not by choice but circumstance as he'd never be in cahoots with a Papist nation. Ideas to substitute Britain with Spain were not even given a response on this thread. So, I digress and retreat back into a Roman Empire/Latin Union deal again rather than try to be the world's big bad--if that were what Britain was going to be.

However, I am also of the belief that I have always been confused by Walmington's idea. A little English claim that's not England, but is very English with all the kinds of peoples that are found in England. So why not just do England. Not a large-scale empire nor some behemoth claim, but just England. Or the UK as a whole. Take me, for example. After placing Chrinthania in Australia years ago, it kind of fit and became a roughly Australia-Kiwi analogue for AMW. It's not exactly Australia or New Zealand or any of it, but it's a nice blend of both. After believing I could put it anywhere and it would work, it kind of always felt better there because it belonged there because it vaguely represented what was there IRL. So why can't Walmington just be in the UK? Again, it doesn't have to be Britain. It doesn't have to be a large, globe-spanning empire. But it kind of fits there since, as it seems, that's roughly what you want to play. If the time investment is your concern, then look at everyone else in AMW... no one's moving a breakneck speed here. Frankly, I miss the Canadian Maritime Walmington. That was the Walmington I first encountered and it was a nice idea and it worked well, IMHO. Granted, you had Gurg to be Britain to your little Britain, but I quite liked the idea. There is no reason that the Angles and Saxons and Jutes couldn't have crossed the Atlantic and settled in Newfoundland at some point later than they did IRL Britain and create their own little niche nation there. This isn't RL, it's AMW, no reason to remain so beholden to real history if you can make it work in some sort of logical sense. Again, you don't have to be big and bad or globe-spanning, but it could work if you really wanted it to. Then there's no wondering "where do the English come from" since they come from you in their reduced capacity. Just a thought.

In fact, using my logic, I could divert the Angles and Saxons and Jutes southward into Iberia and create an England there. Granted, they'd be more tolerant to sunlight and probably not nearly as light skinned, but the point remains. It doesn't matter where you put it if you can give a logical reason as to why it is there. That's kind of been the advice I was always given in AMW no matter cockamamie idea I was trying at the time. Just try to be logical about it. So, divert the Anglo-Saxons to Iberia, mix them with some Arabs, and suddenly you have English speaking, Spanish looking peoples who are enjoying their tea just before siesta. Perhaps a Spanish Top Hat Dance? I know I'm being silly, but... again... my point still stands. Am I going that route? Probably not since, you know, Spain is really cool and so is Portugal and Italy (more on this later...).

Of course, with Cassanos in the UK, WoS taking the UK (as a whole) becomes a moot point. I'd like to make a suggestion about how you're both chopping up England... you're making it far too complicated and no one seems to know where the dividing lines will be. It's beginning to look like it's going council-by-council and no map will ever be that pinpoint accurate. Your division of England doesn't have to be this complex or nerve wracking. That is if you both continue on. Haven't heard from Cassanos in days and I am growing more concerned I caused all this hoopla for naught. No matter the end result of it all, it's the last time I am ever giving up something for anyone else. It has never worked for me in the past and I'm fearing it won't work out this time. And even it become the greatest idea I've ever had, I'm still not giving anything else up for someone else (selfish as it may well sound).

Now, returning to a Roman Empire/Latin Union claim. For fuck's sake, I'm really tired of shifting claims. I've hardly ever been settled in AMW and I'm just over it, really. After going wishy-washy on a Latin or Pan-Latin claim, SPQR (aka Arcadia and now the Empire of Japan in AMW) asked for Italy since I was wishy-washy and I thought that was a great idea. I was thrilled to see his Roman claim, then he decided not to be Rome in two places and went to Japan. So, I jumped into Italy and then reorganized the colonies to wrap it around the Mediterranean Sea rather than the globe. Now, I'm sitting here with 209 million people (all but roughly 600,000 of which live around the Med) still trying to work it out and, frankly, the more I think about it the less thrilled I am about it. I am very tired and mulling around multiple ideas, some of which involve dropping all North African territories and focusing solely on Europe and moving those 70 millions somewhere else. Who knows at this point. As I work out the history, I'll probably be in a better position to decided which part could, if required, be cut out.

[Chrinthanium]

So, in contemplating the fate of my European claim, I've opted to resettle the European borders. I'll be dropping Portugal, North Africa, and most of Spain. What I am keeping from Spain is Navarre, Aragon, Catalonia, Valencia, and Balearic Islands. The rest will return to the dragons. I'm going to recenter the claim on Barcelona as a somewhat more successful Crown of Aragon-alike. I am also asking to add Switzerland to it. It's 104.4 million people in Europe. I'm also going to add the following as part of a more global empire: Aruba, Bonaire, Curacao, Trinidad and Tobago, Ghana, Guyana, Nicaragua, and El Salvador. This creates an empire of 145,983,127 people. I'm torn about what to name it, though I'm leaning towards the United Latin Kingdoms.

[Chrinthanium]

Right, I'm just not going to drop it all. I'm just going to drop North Africa, then add in Switzerland and the external territories I stated (Ghana, Nicaragua, El Salvador, Aruba, Bonaire, Curacao, Guyana, Trinidad and Tobago). It would create an empire of 187,659,099 and that's what I'm doing. That's where I feel fine.

[Chrinthanium]

You know what? After a DM conversation with Roania on Discord, I came to the realization as to why I am so unsettled on this Latin-ish claim. I figured out that you can't duplicated the idea I had for Britain in a Latin-ish Empire no matter how hard you try. It doesn't bring about the same feeling. When I went with the Fascist Britain idea, there was a lot of excitement and ideas being tossed my way. Now, some of that has changed to snark and unreplied messages. Frankly, I haven't any idea I like for Southern Europe. No matter what I do or how I work it or where I configure its borders, it doesn't feel the same as Fascist Britain did. I even screwed myself in the process as I need direct English interference in Chrinthania for my history.

[Chrinthanium]

Anyway, after a period of doubt and concern, keeping the European claim as Spain, Portugal, Southern France, Italy, Malta, San Marino, Andorra, Vatican City, Switzerland, and Monaco with the imperial possessions of El Salvador, Honduras, Guyana, Aruba, Bonaire, Curacao, Trinidad and Tobago, and Ghana is where it's going. I will be taking the Pan Latinist route, though I have to read up on that in order to at least have a full idea of how to work it into the claim. It will officially be called the Latin Empire simply to differentiate it from the Roman Empire, though outside of a name change, lots of Roman tradition will be built into it. I won't say it is fascist intentionally, though I'm fairly certain as it is built and expanded, fascism will definitely be involved.

Apologies for the whining and moaning and restlessness. It took some time for me to snap into it and finally get my head around it and how best for it to work in AMW.

[The Crooked Beat]

Hi everyone,

Having fallen down a bit of a factbooking rabbit-hole lately, I have been attempting to reconstruct the Gandvian military-industrial catalogue for the umpteenth time, and while anyone would be correct to question the importance (or sanity) of such an activity, I've managed to confuse myself completely as to the merits of using an original (or more accurately a diversely-copied) scheme against simply sticking to real-life Russian and Soviet equipment. I'd like to go ahead and explain my reasoning, in hopes that it might make a bit more sense to me at least (since I won't flatter myself with the assumption that anyone else much cares! )

Obviously my sharp turn away from the relatively tangible arena of real-life Russian military equipment makes life a great deal more difficult for anyone who might stand to use Gandvian arms, Depkazia and Dra-pol standing probably at the top of that list. And not to mention, it makes life a bit difficult for me as well, since I've given myself an awful lot of extra work here.

One part of my thinking is that, rather than have to parcel-out Soviet/Russian designs on a case-by-case basis to someone who'd like to use this or who really wants that, the entire catalog can be thought of as up for grabs, as a pool of ready-to-use designs for players who either have an interest in that aesthetic or who'd rather not spend untold hours rooting around the internet in search of projects, prototypes, and one-offs.

Another element is the idea that such practices more clearly divorce Gandvik from Russia, and are indeed possibly an easy way to do so given my decidedly unpromising stabs at mushing-together a distinctive Gandvian cultural identity. A lot of Soviet designs don't really mesh well with my concept of Gandvik's history or its place in the world, and would either be difficult to explain or surplus to requirements. Unlike the USSR, after all, Gandvik could never have expected to enjoy an overwhelming degree of material superiority over the other major powers of Europe, and would therefore have been looking at war on numerically much closer terms with a nation like Valendia or the Danelaw, or some combination thereof.

So as usual, having set out in the belief that I had much more to say, I've exhausted my coherent thoughts on the matter. If AMW as whole thinks I'm being unpardonably annoying about all this, I can only say that such thoughts are certainly not wrong, and if the overall consensus is in favor of a turn back toward Russian/Soviet military equipment, or equipment that is at least recognizably such, probably only a strong push is needed before I cave in. Otherwise, if anyone thinks their nation would logically use or even copy Gandvian arms, please feel free to ask me any questions you might have about the various designations for various things, and in the meantime I'll at least try to get a short list of one-sentence descriptions for major items up, so we have something to refer to.

Anyhow, all the very best!

[Chemaki]

TCB, I'm mailing you an award as I type this.

*Proceeds to delete all of my research into obscure Cold War projects, mishmashed equipment and dubious Iranian aircraft*

[Chrinthanium]

There's a lot of confusion on the part of some, others are more in and out than normal, and then there's the mess I caused with dropping Britain. Maybe I'm the only one who thinks this, but I really think AMW should pick up this Etch-A-Sketch and shake it and clear the map and start over. Not so much a reboot, but a complete restart. Take all previous history and whatever and chuck it in the garbage bin and start a new with a solid plan and certain requirements that certain ones of us like myself are locked and can't leave because the group is tired of people like me screwing everything up.

Anyway, that's where my mind is at. Probably no one else cares, but I said it.

[Marimaia]

There's a lot of confusion on the part of some, others are more in and out than normal, and then there's the mess I caused with dropping Britain. Maybe I'm the only one who thinks this, but I really think AMW should pick up this Etch-A-Sketch and shake it and clear the map and start over. Not so much a reboot, but a complete restart. Take all previous history and whatever and chuck it in the garbage bin and start a new with a solid plan and certain requirements that certain ones of us like myself are locked and can't leave because the group is tired of people like me screwing everything up.

Anyway, that's where my mind is at. Probably no one else cares, but I said it.

It wouldn't be a bad idea in all honesty. It wouldn't be the first time that AMW's done this, and it's as good a time as any because there's not that much going on with us RP-wise at the moment.

If you want to press ahead with the idea, I'd support it.

[Chemaki]

I like the idea, though I am partly biased since I have yet to update my factbook and it needs a major overhaul. If the reboot happens I don't know how many fresh claims will happen though - I'm set on Romnika after all this time and I think Beeg and Mari will want to continue with the CSR and the Caliphate given all the time they've put into it.