AMW Big Discussion Thread

[Lusaka]

Hello!

So, erm, I've been thinking (sorry, that should have come with a content warning) and I wonder where the Federation of North Waynesia might find support other than in the British Federation.

There is, of course, an on-going conflict, played down by the establishment but little short of civil war in truth. Clearly the likes of the CSR and CPRD are going to support left-wing majority-black revolutionaries, and I suspect that California and possibly the likes of America and Chrinthania may also be sympathetic to some degree, or at least hostile to the minority-rule establishment even if they don't want to help the Socialist-lead rebels.

But I wonder how realistic AMW is being. The world's economy is still predominantly dictated by markets and to the benefit of Capitalists, but I sometimes wonder if nations aren't being played in an overly romanticised way. Shouldn't a lot of states find themselves beholden to the interests of the rich men who virtually decide their electoral results through control of the media and/or funding for rival political parties? Wouldn't some of those same rich men have interests in North Waynesia, and wouldn't they be working to protect them against majority-rule and Socialism?

If I ramp up the conflict and rope the CSR or CPRD or some other lefty sorts into supporting the Lusakans, will anyone other than the Walmies back the establishment? Or are all the world's other horrible rich men fine with letting the British take whatever they want?

[Chrinthanium]

We're not fine with letting the British take what they want. Fact of the matter is, the Chrinthania are sympathetic to the majority-black socialist-led rebels in Lusaka. Furthermore, we'd be willing to ship guns and ammunition down there to assist the rebels. We might even hold a telethon in your honor to send the money down there with which to purchase said items. The problem is we don't want to fight someone else's war. We wouldn't be willing to commit military units to this ordeal. It isn't because of a fear of the might of the British; it is simply because you're too far away and well outside our sphere of influence, which isn't large to begin with. To get us to commit anymore than shipping assistance to your rebels, it would take a lot of wheel grease. Perhaps more than Lusaka can offer.

I don't think there would be too many nations willing to support the Federation of North Waynesia outside of the British Federation. Maybe a few people in the loop who want to keep a particular relationship with the British, but most would probably either be indifferent or, at least in word, hint as sympathy for the rebels. Quite honestly, the British Federation is set up in such a way it doesn't require outside assistance for much. It's pretty insular in almost every way. It's almost as if it is a self-contained world that simply doesn't need any of the other AMW nations to do anything.

Outside of the IC issue, the OOC issue is that AMW isn't playing its nations as too romanticized. It isn't playing its nations at all. It's been the issue with AMW since before I arrived. We'll talk about the "good old days" when so-and-so was here and all the action, but no one is willing to do anything now to create "good new days." You could probably nuke your own nation and no one would do anything, outside of pop up a news story decrying the event and offering humanitarian aid to non-radioactive areas. I sometimes feel that this isn't an RP group, but more a collection of museum pieces that can't be touched, only looked at from a distance.

If I went to the claims map and removed every nation that hasn't posted an IC post in 30 days or longer, you'd see a fair few more blank spots. I guess that we're all just here waiting for someone else to kick start the party when we have the power ourselves to so do. Though, to be fair, when I say things like this, I'm often asked what I want us to do. Well, AMW, it isn't what I want AMW to do specifically, just do something, eh?

[/rant]

[Councordia]

If I went to the claims map and removed every nation that hasn't posted an IC post in 30 days or longer, you'd see a fair few more blank spots. I guess that we're all just here waiting for someone else to kick start the party when we have the power ourselves to so do. Though, to be fair, when I say things like this, I'm often asked what I want us to do. Well, AMW, it isn't what I want AMW to do specifically, just do something, eh?

Still here. Is this regarding an RP?

[Chrinthanium]

It's regarding a staggering lack of activity within the group as a whole and not a singular RP.

[Iansisle]

Hey, I made a (short and pointless) IC post (an an irrelevant thread, while ignoring far more important issues)!

[Councordia]

Well, I suppose I could start a 'welcome to Councordia' sort of IC RP

[The Crooked Beat]

Regarding Lusaka, if I remember correctly there was some talk a while back in the preliminary discussion phase of a former Gandvian colonial presence, elements of which might persist in the form of a small though highly cohesive, fairly wealthy, and militant community of Reformed-Protestant exiles, so while of course North Waynesia may not rate especially high on Riga's list of priorities, given the permanence of European concerns, I could definitely see Gandvik supporting the regime there to an extent at least. Strategic competition with Walmington, in light of the Imperial Federation's inconvenient backing of the troublesome Gull Flag Republic, would doubtless be one element in that state of affairs, the Gandvians perhaps wanting to undercut North Waynesia's reliance on its former colonial rulers and thereby secure for themselves more favorable economic concessions, on top of the moral victory which a defeat for Walmingtonian interests would represent. And then there's possibly also a familial or emotional element at play, certain influential players at home still feeling an attachment to the place or counting among the still-resident Gandvian expatriates relatives and business associates. Fears for their safety in the event of a 'communist' takeover could easily cause Gandvik to pay North Waynesia much closer attention than a strict calculation of strategic interest might otherwise warrant.

In Gandvik, at least, wealthy capitalists and industrialists do indeed wield a great deal of informal influence over state policy and public opinion, and if they saw some reason to interfere in what's going on in North Waynesia, there's every likelihood that Gandvik would involve itself in at least some fashion.

[Chrinthanium]

Well, I suppose I could start a 'welcome to Councordia' sort of IC RP

I think that would be pretty cool. Can't wait to see what you've created

[Councordia]

All right. I should have a Thread up in a couple of nights.

[Chrinthanium]

Hey guys,

This may come as unwelcome news for some, welcome news for others, but I haven't had any new ideas in a very long time. I'm rather stuck with nothing to contribute. Couple that with the near complete lack of activity from the group as a whole and I am more or less just taking up space on the map. So, after some contemplation time, I think my tenure with AMW has come to an end. I just feel I have nothing to give the community and that is something people should expect from the members of the group. Furthermore, I have less time to devote to the group than I did 6 months ago.

I will still be around the IRC as often as I can. I can even still upkeep the map or turn the originals over to someone else (I use Paint.Net). If I get a good idea, then hopefully you guys will let me reapply.

It's been a great run and I love you guys.

[The Crooked Beat]

Well, Chrin, there's no denying that AMW as a whole has been very quiet as of late, and if you're not feeling especially productive, it seems like you're far from the only one, and I would certainly include myself in that low-contributor category. Perhaps, seeing as France does occupy a desirable piece of European real estate, there's at least a shred of wisdom in abandoning it if you feel a long stretch of reduced activity coming on, though for the same reasons there's probably not any cause to withdraw completely from AMW where, to a degree, probably a bunch of us could justifiably be accused, at this point, of just taking up space on the map, again myself included.

Do you think you'd even be willing to stake-out a kind of placeholder claim, maybe a smaller nation, one whose limited size would perhaps allow it to express a certain national character more fully and with fewer compromises than are inherent in a larger state of great-power status?

[Amerique]

One thing I've seen mentioned a few times by people I've shown AMW to is the lack of RP on the offsite forum which, given that our active threads don't often appear on the first few pages of the NationStates forum and all the other threads around makes it hard to distinguish our group or see our activity and active threads. Traditionally, I and others I know (including Beeg) have RPed on offsite forums or been in regions which link to separate forums to RP and distinguish active threads of various types, be it news or story RP. It's then easier to provide a link to the forum where everyone can see past and present RP threads to get an idea of what we're all about, as well as an easy-to-find map.

I would propose doing all our RP and region activity aside from maybe applications on the offsite forums or, if that can be an issue, perhaps posting our RP and replies on the forum as well as NS.

[Chrinthanium]

Well, Chrin, there's no denying that AMW as a whole has been very quiet as of late, and if you're not feeling especially productive, it seems like you're far from the only one, and I would certainly include myself in that low-contributor category. Perhaps, seeing as France does occupy a desirable piece of European real estate, there's at least a shred of wisdom in abandoning it if you feel a long stretch of reduced activity coming on, though for the same reasons there's probably not any cause to withdraw completely from AMW where, to a degree, probably a bunch of us could justifiably be accused, at this point, of just taking up space on the map, again myself included.

Do you think you'd even be willing to stake-out a kind of placeholder claim, maybe a smaller nation, one whose limited size would perhaps allow it to express a certain national character more fully and with fewer compromises than are inherent in a larger state of great-power status?

I popped into IRC and Amerique reminded me of when Chrinthanium was in Australia and about how he thought that location better fit the culture/national character. I admit that was a great spot for them, but you know me and claim jumping. But, in the same vein as your reply, TCB, it did get me thinking about a potential smaller claim that could just sit off in the distance being.... whatever it is without being in a position to matter much to anyone else's history. In fact, in the past, I have simply used "a few people" from WoS or Geletia to populate portions of a claim without having to deal with colonial histories and all that jazz.

With a few other members having asked me if I've given my decision a careful review, perhaps that would be better than just up and leaving AMW. I think, TCB, your suggestion is better than dropping out altogether. At least I'd still be in the group and able to do things that may be silly and/or ridiculous without tainting someone else's history. Granted, I won't be able to top Chingiz in the ludicrous department, but I could at least be some form of hilarity in an absurdly-serious world. I will do this, but I need time to work it out. France is officially unclaimed if someone wants it. I'll look at the map and let it speak to me.

One thing I've seen mentioned a few times by people I've shown AMW to is the lack of RP on the offsite forum which, given that our active threads don't often appear on the first few pages of the NationStates forum and all the other threads around makes it hard to distinguish our group or see our activity and active threads. Traditionally, I and others I know (including Beeg) have RPed on offsite forums or been in regions which link to separate forums to RP and distinguish active threads of various types, be it news or story RP. It's then easier to provide a link to the forum where everyone can see past and present RP threads to get an idea of what we're all about, as well as an easy-to-find map.

I would propose doing all our RP and region activity aside from maybe applications on the offsite forums or, if that can be an issue, perhaps posting our RP and replies on the forum as well as NS.

Well, I know that WoS/Drapol doesn't log into the offsite. In fact, he doesn't even have an account there. There's something about RPing on the offsite forum that prevents the accidental post from non-members, but I would, personally, prefer to see our stuff on NS. Perhaps that's just because I am a stickler for these forums and prefer them to the offsite.

[Chemaki]

I know it's a poor excuse but I've spent the past couple of months lurking on the forums, waiting for something to reply to! I haven't had much time to complete Rumyak's factbook or start any longwinded roleplays myself as university has sucked up all my time this term, but I'll do my part over the holidays and try to defibrillate this place with an interesting drama, possibly with Depkazia... I've been searching for months for a substitute for AMW should the community ever tank, but I can't find anything that comes close to the creative outlet that this place gives me (Okay; that's a bit rich considering I've had less than 30 IC posts in the last 6 years...). It seems awfully like this dearth in activity is due to a lack of new blood; the only nations that aren't run by AMW veterans are Korea and Manchuria, and even then I don't even know if they're still alive and kicking. Not only we're not replenishing members so there are fewer people here, but those who are left seem to be a little bit bored with the RP that's on offer, either switching nations to stave off boredom or just lurking and constantly preening their facebooks (perhaps that's just me).

Think right now how much activity and fuss five, four, or even three applicants would generate; certainly enough to get every active member still around posting and discussing on this thread. In the long-run it also means more nations to roleplay with and more people partaking in roleplay threads - if we keep people's interest, the boost in activity should build upon itself as new players and AMW veterans alike come back to see what's happening.

Finding these new players is an issue in itself, but I've found a lot of great roleplayers on the regular NS forums who would contribute a lot here. As cheesy as it is, I'd happily draft some invitations to a few of them (more tasteful than the bulk region invites new players get) and see if it translates to fresh ideas and more activity here, if you guys are all down for that.

[The Crooked Beat]

I don't think that would be a bad idea, Chemaki, so by all means you have my vote. Been thinking about the same sort of thing myself a bit, lately, to be honest.

Also, in the process of trying to work out Gandvian history in more detail, or at all really, I got to thinking that, like Dra-pol's recent Terra Pericolosa, there might be something to the idea of making it into an RP, rather than just writing about things from a factual perspective. So my idea, at the moment exceedingly basic, is to set things off in maybe 1923-24, with Gandvik in a revolutionary situation, a shaky republic standing awkwardly between communist, fascist, and royalist elements all angling for a chance to overthrow the sitting government. This sort of dynamic could just as easily, I suppose, exist in the present day, though I have been wondering lately if maybe setting things in the past might help to secure a greater freedom of action, given that the consequences of mistakes, miscalculations, and provocations are a lot more distant.

Depending on whether this seems to anyone like a moderately worthwhile idea, I might try and tack-on some extra Gandvian colonies or at least colonial ventures or quasi-protectorates, possibly Xinjiang and Tibet, to give things a frontier element, so to speak.

Anyhow, another sketchy idea, make of it what you will.

[Chrinthanium]

I will post this here for everyone to read as I don't know if everyone is in the region...

Hey, those of you having issues connecting to the IRC are probably using an IRC client. The server nova.esper.net isn't working and hasn't been working since the day Beddgelert reported issues. The server ranger.esper.net IS working fine and that's the server I am now using to connect to our IRC. You can also use www.mibbit.com to access the IRC that way.

[Westinghaf]

Just a quick question about claims:
Map shows Ireland being claimed, but claims list does not include it. So how is situation in Ireland?

[Chrinthanium]

Just a quick question about claims:
Map shows Ireland being claimed, but claims list does not include it. So how is situation in Ireland?

Claimed.

[Amerique]

Parts of Ireland are British and the other parts are the Free Republic of Ireland, an American client since the late 19th century which occasionally causes conflict between the former Great War and Drapoel Wars allies. I threw a suggestion for an RP flashpoint there to WoS but things have been slow. I may contact him and revitalize that idea.

[Amerique]

That being said, I wouldn't mind relinquishing my half of the island if it'll get a new player in, I'm easy and open to any suggestions.

[Chrinthanium]

I've been trying to work out a rough idea of where the Chrinthani come from. Since I am going to use the Slavs for the Chrinthani, I'm thinking that they originate roughly around where they come from IRL and are pretty much escorted into Eastern Europe by the proto-Depkazi (read: forced at saber point). We crash through future Gandvian and Shieldian territory and find a bit of open land in Eastern Europe with one group of us getting lost and winding up as the Tsag. Of course, the Celts are getting pushed back towards Eastern Europe by the Saxons and come home to find the Slavs in part of their old territory and manage to hold onto SE Europe cutting off the Tsag and setting up that bit of history much later.

So,that's a rough idea of how and why we're in Eastern Europe.

[Westinghaf]

That being said, I wouldn't mind relinquishing my half of the island if it'll get a new player in, I'm easy and open to any suggestions.

Thanks, but it's not necessary. My original idea was about Middle East, so I'm now rewriting the entire idea and pondering about possible new location.

[Chrinthanium]

That being said, I wouldn't mind relinquishing my half of the island if it'll get a new player in, I'm easy and open to any suggestions.

Thanks, but it's not necessary. My original idea was about Middle East, so I'm now rewriting the entire idea and pondering about possible new location.

I can say without a doubt, after conversing with you on IRC, that I will be thrilled to see your proposal for our group.

[The Crooked Beat]

Hey everyone!

Having just done a bit of reading on Middle Eastern history, and having accordingly filled my head with various half-understood facts and notions, I'm inclined to revisit one of my sketchy ideas for a second claim in the middle east, quite possibly centered on what's left of Iran in a Parsistan revival of sorts. In concept this nation would be fairly similar to the Ottoman Empire in its later stages, namely a collection of various semi-autonomous provinces and warlord-fiefdoms orbiting a relatively weak central monarchy, a station which might end up being occupied by the latest descendant of some Central Asian conquering dynasty. This would, I think, just about have to be an Islamic nation, at least in terms of its rulers and of a large part of its population, though in order to introduce an element of potential tension with Depkazia perhaps Shia Islam will be the majority denomination. (Or is Depkazia actually Shia? I don't remember.)

Anyway, more detailed proposal in the works!

[Amerique]

Hey TCB, that does sound nifty indeed. Conceivably it could actually be an Ottoman or Seljuq Empire, particularly if Chemaki is no longer interested in that area (given the lack of RP from Rumyak) which would open it to have been a rival of the Byzantine Empire to add to that late Empire's woes with Geletia on the other side of things. Perhaps the Persians/Ottomans did have much of Anatolia in the last millenium at some point? Could explain Galatians siding with the Byzantines for such a long period of time. Parsistani Persia also sounds interesting, particularly with an eye towards the Indus. I believe the Depkazi are Hanafi Sunni.