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Ralnis
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 28558
Founded: Aug 06, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Ralnis » Sun Nov 21, 2021 3:54 pm

G-Tech Corporation wrote:
Ralnis wrote:Who needs horses when you have chariots?


Horses draw chariots - well, or mules, or donkeys, or wild asses. Or elephant or dromedaries. Or slaves. All decent options.

Actually yeah, I suppose you don't need horses. Belay that.

Need to see if I can trade with Tibet in the future.
This account must be deleted. The person behind it is a racist, annoying waste of life that must be shunned back to whatever rock he crawled out from.

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Endem
Senator
 
Posts: 3667
Founded: Aug 19, 2018
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Endem » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:01 pm

Suriyanakhon wrote:

To answer the question in the image: honestly, it's because if I did, my balls would be hanging out and I wouldn't want to be mistaken for a Scot.
Last edited by Endem on Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
All my posts are done at 3 A.M., lucidity is not a thing at that hour.

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Endem
Senator
 
Posts: 3667
Founded: Aug 19, 2018
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Endem » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:03 pm

Saxony-Brandenburg wrote:
Joohan wrote:
Selective breeding wouldn't really be necessary on the overall effectiveness of camels. Modern camel species aren't very genetically different from their ancestors prior to human domestication. Case in point, feral Bactrian camels and domestic Bactrian camels have almost parity in terms of physical attributes


Well there we go. It seems my camels are just fucking great from the get-go. Even still, we are breeding camels like crazy. Gotta make lots of those guys as like, our primary method of moving x thing to place y.

I also use camels! With the whole lightly armoured cavalry, I just need to steal or figuree out the composite bow to make them really useful!
Edit: Nevermind about the bows, apparently it could have been a thing in Sumer for 1k years at that point, I think I'm good.
Last edited by Endem on Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
All my posts are done at 3 A.M., lucidity is not a thing at that hour.

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Orostan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6593
Founded: May 02, 2016
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Orostan » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:16 pm

Joohan wrote:
Orostan wrote:
The Shen use copper square shaped currency probably with a stamp of their king on it.


Why would the shen use currency at all? If they're mostly influenced by the Chinese, who themselves don't use a currency, then what would prompt them to? Currency, irl, came with advent of large commercial economies and state institutions. if Aaron didn't give them this idea, then they wouldn't have come up with it on their own.

They fly a green flag and also speak a different language than the Chinese do.


Every tribe in china speaks a different language. The only lingua franca would be whatever conlang Aaron has put together for record keeping.

As well, G has raised some protests from the numerous new inventions proposed in your most recent post:

Threshing machine, the brick furnaces, the steam engine, the blast furnaces, stamp mills, among other things. As we've said before, the overwhelming majority of new developments should be coming directly from Aaron - the native population taking vastly longer to create similar innovations. I don't recall Aaron at any point in the IC going about the meticulous labor of personally designing a threshing machine and then testing it.
The listed inventions are certainly within Aaron's ability to create, but they require his direct supervision - a native will not by his own labors make similar progress. Remember, it took centuries for people in our own timeline to invent these things. Peoples brains aren't fired up merely by Aaron's presence.

Likewise, feel free to drop the details below if you'd like, but G has described them, your " steam engines " more resemble water boilers than anything, and would have dubious efficiency. And he's described your blast furnaces as more aking to column smelters. That's all fine and well, just be sure to note their inefficiencies as Aaron experiments with them. Also, their proliferation across the country shouldn't really be a thing right now. If a town wanted to sink an investment, that's fine, I wouldn't tell you no - but it suffer's from another issue -

I'm dubious of your assertion that iron production has " increased ". Your armies, in short time, have vastly increased, tens of thousands of people have been killed or fled the country, and swaths of the nation are effectively in the hands of traditional tribal authorities. None of this paints a picture of increased mine productivity. Having slaves doesn't make up for poor logistical infrastructure. Iron should be something of a rarity right now, being eaten entirely by the war machine.

1) I should have been more specific. For external trade China uses copper “currency” mostly to simplify foreign trade, the Shen would do the same thing especially in Korea.

2) the Longshan language or relatives of it are the most common in China, the Shen would probably have a writing system based off the Chinese one but more suited to their own language.

3) G-Tech specifically approved the type of steam engine I describe in very clear language.

Here is an exchange we had about this:

Orostan: “Also is it possible for me to make a much simpler and low pressure steam engine than the ones I have been trying to build? Early engines operated at much lower pressure than what I am trying to use. Obviously I can’t mass produce them but even one or two engines per city would be a good help for me.”

G-Tech: “For sure - low pressure steam engines are great for a host of designs, and the pressure is really the dangerous thing about steam engines. There's no reason your society shouldn't be capable of producing large quantities of low pressure steam engines safely, aside from the many demands on her iron output.”

He has let me do more than I asked on this front at least.

The steam engines I am using are most similar to Watt’s steam engine and right now can only be produced in Luoyang or other cities with an advanced enough industry.

4)There is no reason why making halberds or armor should eat up literally all of my iron production. Most Chinese cities and roads aren’t being attacked by bandits, the bandit war is taking place in rural areas far from cities that would be doing industrial work. A lot of people are dead, but I also have a lot of captives to work in iron mines and a secure system of roads.
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed hungry person. True freedom can only be where there is no exploitation and oppression of one person by another; where there is not unemployment, and where a person is not living in fear of losing his job, his home and his bread. Only in such a society personal and any other freedom can exist for real and not on paper.” -J. V. STALIN
Ernest Hemingway wrote:Anyone who loves freedom owes such a debt to the Red Army that it can never be repaid.

Napoleon Bonaparte wrote:“To understand the man you have to know what was happening in the world when he was twenty.”

Cicero wrote:"In times of war, the laws fall silent"



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Saxony-Brandenburg
Minister
 
Posts: 2669
Founded: Mar 07, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Saxony-Brandenburg » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:30 pm

Endem wrote:
Saxony-Brandenburg wrote:
Well there we go. It seems my camels are just fucking great from the get-go. Even still, we are breeding camels like crazy. Gotta make lots of those guys as like, our primary method of moving x thing to place y.

I also use camels! With the whole lightly armoured cavalry, I just need to steal or figuree out the composite bow to make them really useful!
Edit: Nevermind about the bows, apparently it could have been a thing in Sumer for 1k years at that point, I think I'm good.

Hejazi warriors are by now well known for their very fancy and powerful recurve bows. And for some reason... they seem to be capable of firing longer distances than most.
"When Adam delved and Eve span, who was then the gentleman?"

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Saxony-Brandenburg
Minister
 
Posts: 2669
Founded: Mar 07, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Saxony-Brandenburg » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:32 pm

Suriyanakhon wrote:

Wait, there are cultures where men DONT wear skirts rn? Hm?! Weirdos
Last edited by Saxony-Brandenburg on Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"When Adam delved and Eve span, who was then the gentleman?"

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Joohan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6001
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Joohan » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:40 pm

G-Tech Corporation wrote:
Saxony-Brandenburg wrote:
Well there we go. It seems my camelry are just fucking great from the get-go


Obviously we must invent genetic sequencing to splice the excellent camel genes in with the rubbish horse genes. It is the only way to circumvent the selective breeding process.


I just imagined what a camel-horse hybrid abomination would look like, and I just wanna let you know that you've been banned from ever participating in New Civ's in perpetuity.
If you need a witness look to yourself

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism!


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Joohan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6001
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Joohan » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:41 pm

Ralnis wrote:
G-Tech Corporation wrote:
Horses draw chariots - well, or mules, or donkeys, or wild asses. Or elephant or dromedaries. Or slaves. All decent options.

Actually yeah, I suppose you don't need horses. Belay that.

Need to see if I can trade with Tibet in the future.


Central asia has both Bactrian and dromedary camels native to it
If you need a witness look to yourself

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism!


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Ralnis
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 28558
Founded: Aug 06, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Ralnis » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:42 pm

Joohan wrote:
Ralnis wrote:Need to see if I can trade with Tibet in the future.


Central asia has both Bactrian and dromedary camels native to it

And now I have another weapon to use against cavalry.
This account must be deleted. The person behind it is a racist, annoying waste of life that must be shunned back to whatever rock he crawled out from.

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The Hierophancy
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1091
Founded: Oct 24, 2016
Compulsory Consumerist State

Postby The Hierophancy » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:46 pm

Suriyanakhon wrote:
Orostan wrote:The Shen have an organized state and are setting themselves up in Korea through a client state in the north made up of tribes they got to work with them. The Shen have a lot of the same technology that China does but they're not as good at using it and frequently trade raw iron ore for finished iron products from China. Their army would not be as hard to fight as China's and would lack a lot of equipment like automatic crossbows, but their use of iron and bronze would make them a big threat. They're also mountain people in many cases so they will not have the same terrain issues that Chinese soldiers living their entire lives on the north china plain have when put in mountains.

The Shen use copper square shaped currency probably with a stamp of their king on it. They fly a green flag and also speak a different language than the Chinese do. They're not necessarily bloodthirsty barbarians either but they are absolutely not friends of the average Korean. They also used to fight China frequently and a good part of their army is rebels and former bandits from the north of China. The social structure of their empire is more similar to Hanajima's and they have nobles unlike China.


Thanks, sounds like there will be an interesting conflict between the two for control of the peninsula. As a side note, I'm going to assume that they follow something akin to a Proto-Taoist religion, in contrast to southern Korea where Buddhism and animism are the dominant faiths.

Taosim 3000 years before Lao Tzu was gonna be my schtick smh. It'd make more sense for them to be shamanistic considering that the genetics of the ppl living there atm irl were very much Siberian, and the general ancient Chinese and Korean penchant for Shamanism (Wu in China and Muism in Korea). Well, it'd actually make more sense for them to be some completely forgotten religion we only know through little talismans and big god idols, but that's a lot harder to make up lol

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G-Tech Corporation
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 62444
Founded: Feb 03, 2010
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby G-Tech Corporation » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:48 pm

Orostan wrote:G-Tech: “For sure - low pressure steam engines are great for a host of designs, and the pressure is really the dangerous thing about steam engines. There's no reason your society shouldn't be capable of producing large quantities of low pressure steam engines safely, aside from the many demands on her iron output.”


Quite right - and a primitive low pressure steam engine is certainly useful. Just don't expect wonders from it, and you won't be disappointed. I wouldn't say that what you have is equivalent to a Watt engine though - there we're talking about "low pressure" as getting near to a bar, and containing pressure of that magnitude is difficult without specialized sealants and construction, which China doesn't possess in large quantities.

4)There is no reason why making halberds or armor should eat up literally all of my iron production. Most Chinese cities and roads aren’t being attacked by bandits, the bandit war is taking place in rural areas far from cities that would be doing industrial work. A lot of people are dead, but I also have a lot of captives to work in iron mines and a secure system of roads.


Again, we just had this discussion. If China is still in the process of standing up her armies for the war, and has been making do with two campaign armies so far, "most" Chinese cities and roads are still relatively unprotected and near to hostile polities. There are no rural places far from cities where this war is occurring - China never controlled those places due to her focus on urbanization and centralization. Those rural places are the polities which are sending armies to attack your roads and cities.
TG if you have questions about RP. If I don't know the answer, I know someone who does.

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Endem
Senator
 
Posts: 3667
Founded: Aug 19, 2018
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Endem » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:53 pm

Saxony-Brandenburg wrote:
Endem wrote:I also use camels! With the whole lightly armoured cavalry, I just need to steal or figuree out the composite bow to make them really useful!
Edit: Nevermind about the bows, apparently it could have been a thing in Sumer for 1k years at that point, I think I'm good.

Hejazi warriors are by now well known for their very fancy and powerful recurve bows. And for some reason... they seem to be capable of firing longer distances than most.

Ooh, did you make a new bow? More fancy bow? Do you think it would spread over in like a couple years to me due to that trade deal we made?
All my posts are done at 3 A.M., lucidity is not a thing at that hour.

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Saxony-Brandenburg
Minister
 
Posts: 2669
Founded: Mar 07, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Saxony-Brandenburg » Sun Nov 21, 2021 4:57 pm

Endem wrote:
Saxony-Brandenburg wrote:Hejazi warriors are by now well known for their very fancy and powerful recurve bows. And for some reason... they seem to be capable of firing longer distances than most.

Ooh, did you make a new bow? More fancy bow? Do you think it would spread over in like a couple years to me due to that trade deal we made?

It's highly culturally specific because we're all a bunch of herders with limited amounts of wood.
"When Adam delved and Eve span, who was then the gentleman?"

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Joohan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6001
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Joohan » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:01 pm

Ralnis wrote:
Joohan wrote:
Central asia has both Bactrian and dromedary camels native to it

And now I have another weapon to use against cavalry.


Ah, be warned, camels aren't horses. I've work a lot with horses IRl, and in studying camels i've found that they react very differently. For one, they're noticeably more intelligent than the average horse - which though helps them to learn faster, also makes them more stubborn.

IC, it took me five years to get to a point where I can reasonably say that any camel is sufficiently tame. In that five years I was a camel herder for most of it, and I made four posts dedicated to showing my work and failures there in.

Just something to note of our expectations for you
If you need a witness look to yourself

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism!


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Suriyanakhon
Minister
 
Posts: 3380
Founded: Apr 27, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Suriyanakhon » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:04 pm

The Hierophancy wrote:
Suriyanakhon wrote:
Thanks, sounds like there will be an interesting conflict between the two for control of the peninsula. As a side note, I'm going to assume that they follow something akin to a Proto-Taoist religion, in contrast to southern Korea where Buddhism and animism are the dominant faiths.

Taosim 3000 years before Lao Tzu was gonna be my schtick smh. It'd make more sense for them to be shamanistic considering that the genetics of the ppl living there atm irl were very much Siberian, and the general ancient Chinese and Korean penchant for Shamanism (Wu in China and Muism in Korea). Well, it'd actually make more sense for them to be some completely forgotten religion we only know through little talismans and big god idols, but that's a lot harder to make up lol


From what Oro told me, the leadership and nobility of the region are exiles from Huaxia and would thus bring with them religious practices from the Yellow River which are the predecessor of the later folk beliefs which would form Taoism. Wu shamanism would be a major contributor in the formation of Taoism, so it would make sense to describe their religion as Proto-Taoist of sorts, with the common people in the region following a more Siberian shamanism instead.
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Ralnis
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 28558
Founded: Aug 06, 2012
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Ralnis » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:04 pm

Joohan wrote:
Ralnis wrote:And now I have another weapon to use against cavalry.


Ah, be warned, camels aren't horses. I've work a lot with horses IRl, and in studying camels i've found that they react very differently. For one, they're noticeably more intelligent than the average horse - which though helps them to learn faster, also makes them more stubborn.

IC, it took me five years to get to a point where I can reasonably say that any camel is sufficiently tame. In that five years I was a camel herder for most of it, and I made four posts dedicated to showing my work and failures there in.

Just something to note of our expectations for you

I know, I'm a fucking stupid but I have made some post about me trying to tame camels in Sumeria, I think. However most of my posts for the next ten years will be about fighting the other clans and tribes, improve the chariots and make them more advanced than what any Author should ever have.
This account must be deleted. The person behind it is a racist, annoying waste of life that must be shunned back to whatever rock he crawled out from.

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Orostan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6593
Founded: May 02, 2016
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Orostan » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:05 pm

G-Tech Corporation wrote:
Orostan wrote:G-Tech: “For sure - low pressure steam engines are great for a host of designs, and the pressure is really the dangerous thing about steam engines. There's no reason your society shouldn't be capable of producing large quantities of low pressure steam engines safely, aside from the many demands on her iron output.”


Quite right - and a primitive low pressure steam engine is certainly useful. Just don't expect wonders from it, and you won't be disappointed. I wouldn't say that what you have is equivalent to a Watt engine though - there we're talking about "low pressure" as getting near to a bar, and containing pressure of that magnitude is difficult without specialized sealants and construction, which China doesn't possess in large quantities.

4)There is no reason why making halberds or armor should eat up literally all of my iron production. Most Chinese cities and roads aren’t being attacked by bandits, the bandit war is taking place in rural areas far from cities that would be doing industrial work. A lot of people are dead, but I also have a lot of captives to work in iron mines and a secure system of roads.


Again, we just had this discussion. If China is still in the process of standing up her armies for the war, and has been making do with two campaign armies so far, "most" Chinese cities and roads are still relatively unprotected and near to hostile polities. There are no rural places far from cities where this war is occurring - China never controlled those places due to her focus on urbanization and centralization. Those rural places are the polities which are sending armies to attack your roads and cities.

1. I think it is fair to say I might not be able to make engines as good as historical Watt engines yet, but the structure is there. I will write about quality variation in engines, but I don’t think even limited ability to construct these and provide sealant would stop me from providing a argue amount of good engines over time.

2. Again, I thought we agreed that most cities and the routes between them would be secure. Your yourself said the war has been going on a while - why would China be “still in the process” of raising armies?

Suriyanakhon wrote:
The Hierophancy wrote:Taosim 3000 years before Lao Tzu was gonna be my schtick smh. It'd make more sense for them to be shamanistic considering that the genetics of the ppl living there atm irl were very much Siberian, and the general ancient Chinese and Korean penchant for Shamanism (Wu in China and Muism in Korea). Well, it'd actually make more sense for them to be some completely forgotten religion we only know through little talismans and big god idols, but that's a lot harder to make up lol


From what Oro told me, the leadership and nobility of the region are exiles from Huaxia and would thus bring with them religious practices from the Yellow River which are the predecessor of the later folk beliefs which would form Taoism. Wu shamanism would be a major contributor in the formation of Taoism, so it would make sense to describe their religion as Proto-Taoist of sorts, with the common people in the region following a more Siberian shamanism instead.

The rulers themselves are natives to the area, they depend on former rebels and bandits from China for the military and a lot of artisan work though. Chinese people would be a large part of the nobility too, but not the highest positions.
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed hungry person. True freedom can only be where there is no exploitation and oppression of one person by another; where there is not unemployment, and where a person is not living in fear of losing his job, his home and his bread. Only in such a society personal and any other freedom can exist for real and not on paper.” -J. V. STALIN
Ernest Hemingway wrote:Anyone who loves freedom owes such a debt to the Red Army that it can never be repaid.

Napoleon Bonaparte wrote:“To understand the man you have to know what was happening in the world when he was twenty.”

Cicero wrote:"In times of war, the laws fall silent"



#FreeNSGRojava
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Joohan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6001
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Joohan » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:11 pm

Orostan wrote:
4)There is no reason why making halberds or armor should eat up literally all of my iron production. Most Chinese cities and roads aren’t being attacked by bandits, the bandit war is taking place in rural areas far from cities that would be doing industrial work. A lot of people are dead, but I also have a lot of captives to work in iron mines and a secure system of roads.


Your armies have vastly been expanded from what they were prior to the rebellion, and so has the demand for iron to supply them. Your iron ore shipments would need to go through rural areas in order to reach cities. If by saying you've secured these places from attack, then that implies you have left other roads and swaths of countryside unprotected, which doesn't bode well from China's other fields of production. Also, slaves and pow's tend not to preform as well as loyal workers.

All in all, I would expect to see China's disposable ore reserves having lowered since the start of the rebellion.
If you need a witness look to yourself

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism!


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Suriyanakhon
Minister
 
Posts: 3380
Founded: Apr 27, 2020
Democratic Socialists

Postby Suriyanakhon » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:11 pm

Orostan wrote:The rulers themselves are natives to the area, they depend on former rebels and bandits from China for the military and a lot of artisan work though. Chinese people would be a large part of the nobility too, but not the highest positions.


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Orostan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6593
Founded: May 02, 2016
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Orostan » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:13 pm

Joohan wrote:
Orostan wrote:
4)There is no reason why making halberds or armor should eat up literally all of my iron production. Most Chinese cities and roads aren’t being attacked by bandits, the bandit war is taking place in rural areas far from cities that would be doing industrial work. A lot of people are dead, but I also have a lot of captives to work in iron mines and a secure system of roads.


Your armies have vastly been expanded from what they were prior to the rebellion, and so has the demand for iron to supply them. Your iron ore shipments would need to go through rural areas in order to reach cities. If by saying you've secured these places from attack, then that implies you have left other roads and swaths of countryside unprotected, which doesn't bode well from China's other fields of production. Also, slaves and pow's tend not to preform as well as loyal workers.

All in all, I would expect to see China's disposable ore reserves having lowered since the start of the rebellion.

The war has been going on for years. Bandit tribes that could seriously threaten iron ore shipments would have been destroyed already. The demand for iron weapons would be filled by now. I don’t understand why securing one area means I can’t keep any other area safe, especially over the span of years. Besides that most iron in China travels by river and not by road.
Last edited by Orostan on Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed hungry person. True freedom can only be where there is no exploitation and oppression of one person by another; where there is not unemployment, and where a person is not living in fear of losing his job, his home and his bread. Only in such a society personal and any other freedom can exist for real and not on paper.” -J. V. STALIN
Ernest Hemingway wrote:Anyone who loves freedom owes such a debt to the Red Army that it can never be repaid.

Napoleon Bonaparte wrote:“To understand the man you have to know what was happening in the world when he was twenty.”

Cicero wrote:"In times of war, the laws fall silent"



#FreeNSGRojava
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G-Tech Corporation
Khan of Spam
 
Posts: 62444
Founded: Feb 03, 2010
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby G-Tech Corporation » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:15 pm

Orostan wrote:1. I think it is fair to say I might not be able to make engines as good as historical Watt engines yet, but the structure is there. I will write about quality variation in engines, but I don’t think even limited ability to construct these and provide sealant would stop me from providing a argue amount of good engines over time.


As you train more engineers you'll be capable of producing and maintaining more engines, sure. That goes without saying. The question is largely what you consider a 'good' engine. You've talked about using steam engines to haul cartloads of iron ore along cablecars - that would require a truly vast low pressure engine to operate at any appreciable speed, and scaling problems are absolutely a thing for steam boilers.

2. Again, I thought we agreed that most cities and the routes between them would be secure. Your yourself said the war has been going on a while - why would China be “still in the process” of raising armies?


Because gathering men, training them into soldiers, building cohesive chains of command, provisioning and arming them - that all takes time and specialized manpower. Good drill sergeants and officers don't grow on trees, and most of China's candidates for those positions are either up to their necks in the current war or dead and rotting on battlefields. If you want to say that the YRS is just throwing armies together with minimal training and green officers and tossing them at her foes, I'm happy to accept an accelerated timetable for deploying her forces.

We certainly did not agree that most cities and the routes between them would be safe - not within the current timeframe. How could they be? Where are the forces to defend their walls and patrol their extensive reaches? The only thing I gave you was a rough schedule for the pacification of China's foes, and you aren't anywhere near the end of that timetable yet.
TG if you have questions about RP. If I don't know the answer, I know someone who does.

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Biwolfia
Envoy
 
Posts: 204
Founded: May 22, 2021
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Biwolfia » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:31 pm

Author Applicaiton
Name: Jonas Smith
Age: 20
Height and Weight: 5' 5"
Skin, hair, and eye description: Tan skin, very dark brown hair, brown eyes
( Optional ) Picture: Not doing one

Prior Profession: Wrote up Wendy's roasts (and also worked at Wendy's as a cook)
Level of education ( specify degrees or note worthy classes ): Is in the middle of college and is trying to get a major in Physics
Physique description: Average physical health and strength
Useful skills: Has a good sense of direction, can map things easily

National Origin: New Zealand
What were you doing prior to falling asleep and awakening in the past?: In the middle of writing an essay for Physics on the subject of the possibility of being able to split quarks
Description of personality: Seclusive, not the most talkative of people, but with close friends, many interesting discussions can and will take place
Where in the world are you landing?: The Peloponnese Peninsula of Greece

Autobiography/Biography ( paragraph minimum ): Jonas was born in Auckland, New Zealand. His father was killed when he was 3, leaving him and his mother by themselves. They were able to survive until Jonas was old enough to get a job at Wendy's. Throughout his school years before getting a job, he was the "weird" kid at school. He never got along with anybody. He would constantly get into fights, but wouldn't share what happened.

His mother started getting worried about him and requested to his teachers in 6th grade whether he could have classes by himself to help him focus. The teachers agreed, and Jonas was given special classes by himself to keep him from getting into fights. He would be given special assignments and quickly became one of the smartest students in 6th grade. He was able to skip 7th grade and got into 8th grade quickly. When he got into college, he easily got into AP classes, and it gave him enough of a challenge that he wouldn't get bored in class.

Just after graduating from high school, he got a job at Wendy's as a cashier. He was promoted after a few months after showing his time management skills. He became a cook and raised the reviews through the roof. He made enough money that with him working a part-time job and his mom working a full-time job as a programmer that they were able to get a better house and living qualities. Jonas continued with school until now, when the story takes place.

Writing Sample: It was midnight and I was running through the woods. I wasn't sure what was chasing me or what they were going to do to me, but I knew that it wouldn't be good. By the way, my name is Janora Francis, but everybody calls me Jan. I'm 14 years old and I'm a runaway. Who I'm running from and why don't matter. All you need to know is that I'm terrified.

I'd been running for 3 days straight. I was wearing a backpack with food, water, and supplies. That's probably why my pursuer was able to stay on my trail, even though I'd been twisting and turning, zigging and zagging. I wasn't sure how much longer I could go, but it wouldn't be long until I had to stop. Suddenly, I ran out of breath. I couldn't go any farther. I was sure I would be caught. But, my pursuer stopped near me, looked around, and left.


( Optional on down)
What are your intentions for this RP, what's the long term goal?:
What people or places are you taking inspiration from?: Ancient Greek city-states, as well as a Japanese-inspired building structure
Why did you chose to land where you did?: The Mediterranean provides a useful amount of resources.
What vibe should we get from your civilization and it's culture?: Formal and peaceful
What are your character's motivations?: Just wanting to survive, hopefully get back to his mom somehow
Theme Song?: Immortals by Fall Out Boy; You Will Be Found by Dear Evan Hansen Cast
What do you wanna see in this RP? What would make it better?:
Last edited by Biwolfia on Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
The Matriarchal Phantasmocracy of Biwolfia

A Class 1.8 Civilization according to this index

User avatar
Joohan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6001
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Joohan » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:38 pm

Orostan wrote:
Joohan wrote:
Your armies have vastly been expanded from what they were prior to the rebellion, and so has the demand for iron to supply them. Your iron ore shipments would need to go through rural areas in order to reach cities. If by saying you've secured these places from attack, then that implies you have left other roads and swaths of countryside unprotected, which doesn't bode well from China's other fields of production. Also, slaves and pow's tend not to preform as well as loyal workers.

All in all, I would expect to see China's disposable ore reserves having lowered since the start of the rebellion.

The war has been going on for years. Bandit tribes that could seriously threaten iron ore shipments would have been destroyed already. The demand for iron weapons would be filled by now. I don’t understand why securing one area means I can’t keep any other area safe, especially over the span of years. Besides that most iron in China travels by river and not by road.


And in destroying a few tribes you've imported tens of thousands of their vengeful denizens as POW's and slaves. What is more, you're using these ticking time bombs to extract china's most valued resource. The greatest threat to China's iron supply, without doubt, comes from the very men who mine it. And even still, with the great migration of tribes around China's peripheries, just an area has recently saw it's prior inhabitants gone for whatever reason, it is very unlikely that it will remain that way for long. With iron being as valuable as it is, a migrant tribe will have ample reason to attempt stealing some of the cargo moved along those roads. Don't think of those routes as being akin to the border between Holland and Belgium - these should be your Golan heights. China has tens of thousands of miles of territory it might need to defend, and your iron routes are literally some of the most important.

As for the demand of iron weapons being filled - no. No army, even in the modern day, has enough, weapons. Does not the average soldier employed in one of your armies carry multiple heads for his halberds? Not even counting the other various weapons and tools he carries on himself? Will he not need a constant resupply after the numerous battles he faces? Are you not constantly needing to increase the size of your forces to accommodate for an ever increasing slave population?
If you need a witness look to yourself

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism!


User avatar
Orostan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6593
Founded: May 02, 2016
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Orostan » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:42 pm

G-Tech Corporation wrote:
Orostan wrote:1. I think it is fair to say I might not be able to make engines as good as historical Watt engines yet, but the structure is there. I will write about quality variation in engines, but I don’t think even limited ability to construct these and provide sealant would stop me from providing a argue amount of good engines over time.


As you train more engineers you'll be capable of producing and maintaining more engines, sure. That goes without saying. The question is largely what you consider a 'good' engine. You've talked about using steam engines to haul cartloads of iron ore along cablecars - that would require a truly vast low pressure engine to operate at any appreciable speed, and scaling problems are absolutely a thing for steam boilers.

2. Again, I thought we agreed that most cities and the routes between them would be secure. Your yourself said the war has been going on a while - why would China be “still in the process” of raising armies?


Because gathering men, training them into soldiers, building cohesive chains of command, provisioning and arming them - that all takes time and specialized manpower. Good drill sergeants and officers don't grow on trees, and most of China's candidates for those positions are either up to their necks in the current war or dead and rotting on battlefields. If you want to say that the YRS is just throwing armies together with minimal training and green officers and tossing them at her foes, I'm happy to accept an accelerated timetable for deploying her forces.

We certainly did not agree that most cities and the routes between them would be safe - not within the current timeframe. How could they be? Where are the forces to defend their walls and patrol their extensive reaches? The only thing I gave you was a rough schedule for the pacification of China's foes, and you aren't anywhere near the end of that timetable yet.

1. In reference to that I was talking about lining up like ten engines and using them to pull carts by cable. At this point steam engines will mostly be used for pumps and powering workshops. What cable cars I do create will probably be light test lines right now - I can’t just start building something like that without a lot of testing.

2. It has been literal years why would it ever take that long? Every town and city in China has a militia and I can see zero reason why bandits near roads wouldn’t have been gotten rid of a long time ago.

Joohan wrote:
Orostan wrote:The war has been going on for years. Bandit tribes that could seriously threaten iron ore shipments would have been destroyed already. The demand for iron weapons would be filled by now. I don’t understand why securing one area means I can’t keep any other area safe, especially over the span of years. Besides that most iron in China travels by river and not by road.


And in destroying a few tribes you've imported tens of thousands of their vengeful denizens as POW's and slaves. What is more, you're using these ticking time bombs to extract china's most valued resource. The greatest threat to China's iron supply, without doubt, comes from the very men who mine it. And even still, with the great migration of tribes around China's peripheries, just an area has recently saw it's prior inhabitants gone for whatever reason, it is very unlikely that it will remain that way for long. With iron being as valuable as it is, a migrant tribe will have ample reason to attempt stealing some of the cargo moved along those roads. Don't think of those routes as being akin to the border between Holland and Belgium - these should be your Golan heights. China has tens of thousands of miles of territory it might need to defend, and your iron routes are literally some of the most important.

As for the demand of iron weapons being filled - no. No army, even in the modern day, has enough, weapons. Does not the average soldier employed in one of your armies carry multiple heads for his halberds? Not even counting the other various weapons and tools he carries on himself? Will he not need a constant resupply after the numerous battles he faces? Are you not constantly needing to increase the size of your forces to accommodate for an ever increasing slave population?


Again, I AM STILL PRODUCING WEAPONS! They just don’t take literally all of my productive capacity. Iron mines are guarded as are the barges and wagons that move iron ore. Any tribe threatening iron ore producing regions like china’s north would have been destroyed first.
“It is difficult for me to imagine what “personal liberty” is enjoyed by an unemployed hungry person. True freedom can only be where there is no exploitation and oppression of one person by another; where there is not unemployment, and where a person is not living in fear of losing his job, his home and his bread. Only in such a society personal and any other freedom can exist for real and not on paper.” -J. V. STALIN
Ernest Hemingway wrote:Anyone who loves freedom owes such a debt to the Red Army that it can never be repaid.

Napoleon Bonaparte wrote:“To understand the man you have to know what was happening in the world when he was twenty.”

Cicero wrote:"In times of war, the laws fall silent"



#FreeNSGRojava
Z

User avatar
Joohan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6001
Founded: Jan 11, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Joohan » Sun Nov 21, 2021 5:46 pm

Biwolfia wrote:Author Applicaiton
Name: Jonas Smith
Age: 20
Height and Weight: 5' 5"
Skin, hair, and eye description: Tan skin, very dark brown hair, brown eyes
( Optional ) Picture: Not doing one

Prior Profession: Wrote up Wendy's roasts (and also worked at Wendy's as a cook)
Level of education ( specify degrees or note worthy classes ): Is in the middle of college and is trying to get a major in Physics
Physique description: Average physical health and strength
Useful skills: Knows what elements can combine into others to make certain essential needs, and can perform the combinations to create things like water

National Origin: New Zealand
What were you doing prior to falling asleep and awakening in the past?: In the middle of writing an essay for Physics on the subject of the possibility of being able to split quarks
Description of personality: Seclusive, not the most talkative of people, but with close friends, many interesting discussions can and will take place
Where in the world are you landing?: The middle of Mesopotamia

Autobiography/Biography ( paragraph minimum ): Jonas was born in Auckland, New Zealand. His father was killed when he was 3, leaving him and his mother by themselves. They were able to survive until Jonas was old enough to get a job at Wendy's. Throughout his school years before getting a job, he was the "weird" kid at school. He never got along with anybody. He would constantly get into fights, but wouldn't share what happened.

His mother started getting worried about him and requested to his teachers in 6th grade whether he could have classes by himself to help him focus. The teachers agreed, and Jonas was given special classes by himself to keep him from getting into fights. He would be given special assignments and quickly became one of the smartest students in 6th grade. He was able to skip 7th grade and got into 8th grade quickly. When he got into college, he easily got into AP classes, and it gave him enough of a challenge that he wouldn't get bored in class.

Just after graduating from high school, he got a job at Wendy's as a cashier. He was promoted after a few months after showing his time management skills. He became a cook and raised the reviews through the roof. He made enough money that with him working a part-time job and his mom working a full-time job as a programmer that they were able to get a better house and living qualities. Jonas continued with school until now, when the story takes place.

Writing Sample: It was midnight and I was running through the woods. I wasn't sure what was chasing me or what they were going to do to me, but I knew that it wouldn't be good. By the way, my name is Janora Francis, but everybody calls me Jan. I'm 14 years old and I'm a runaway. Who I'm running from and why don't matter. All you need to know is that I'm terrified.

I'd been running for 3 days straight. I was wearing a backpack with food, water, and supplies. That's probably why my pursuer was able to stay on my trail, even though I'd been twisting and turning, zigging and zagging. I wasn't sure how much longer I could go, but it wouldn't be long until I had to stop. Suddenly, I ran out of breath. I couldn't go any farther. I was sure I would be caught. But, my pursuer stopped near me, looked around, and left.


( Optional on down)
What are your intentions for this RP, what's the long term goal?:
What people or places are you taking inspiration from?: Mostly Sumeria and stuff like that, there's also a little bit of Greek inspiration in the building style, but the irrigation, agriculture, and law systems are all Sumerian and Babylonian.
Why did you chose to land where you did?: Because of the Fertile Crescent, an ideal spot to create a civilization.
What vibe should we get from your civilization and it's culture?: Formal and peaceful
What are your character's motivations?: Just wanting to survive, hopefully get back to his mom somehow
Theme Song?: Immortals by Fall Out Boy; You Will Be Found by Dear Evan Hansen Cast
What do you wanna see in this RP? What would make it better?:


So, some things to note:

Your skills - are they actually practical? In a laboratory setting, sure. Consider though, if you were naked in the forest with zero instruments and no people around who could provide either insight or tools. Are your listed skills actually useful? Could you give an example?

Second, you are free to land in Mesopotamia if you want, but you should know that it has been radically changed from our own timeline. Another Author named Luther Holly landed there a few decades ago, and he helped to create a more or less unified state, known as the holy dynasty. New technologies and ideas of religion and governance were introduced, heightening the area's overall development. About, I want to say fifteen years ago, a civil war started between various cities, which persists somewhat to this day. luther abandoned Sumeria about five years ago for China ( he's disappeared since ). Sumeria today is under going something i've likened to their own Sengoku Gidai

Just something to keep in mind if you want to land there, it's been touched already
If you need a witness look to yourself

There is no room in this country for hyphenated Americanism!


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