2024: Cold Interbellum (MT/AH/OOC/Dead/Reboot Coming Soon)

[Kelmet]

That is not a comparison.

Iran-back militias in syria is not the same as Korean personnel on (what they view as) korean soil.

Seems pretty willing to me when triggers start getting pulled.

They aren't on Korean soil, they are at sea, but I digress.

Japanese forces are acting in self-defense. Korea fired the first shot, and now Japanese forces are responding. From the broad point of view, the Japanese military is trying to save Japanese civilians under attack by the Korean military.

It is likely they will lose ships. Japan may lose ships as well. But that is a conflict, not war. Now if Russian forces violate Japanese/Korean waters, then it will really be war.

Korean territory.

You knew what I meant.

[Madrinpoor]

Not having an affinity does not translate to willingness to wage a war with them.

You should have had to change your history to re-write the pacifistic nature of the majority of Japanese people.

It isn't war, it is just a minor conflict. Mind you, I used civilian ships and Korea fired first. It isn't war. Just like 75% of Americans do not support war with Iran, but just last week Biden launched strikes on an Iran-back militia. There was no willingness to go to war, but Korea forced it upon Japan.

Wait...if there was a war, where Japan invaded Dokdo, they really couldn't do anything because of their constitution. So technically they could only wage a defensive war, and Korea only wants Dokdo. Plus the US has a treaty with Korea IRL. And military bases in both. They have a large stake in this, and would want it to be settled peacefully. As does Korea, we only want Dokdo, but wouldn't come helping you against Russia after this.

[Madrinpoor]

That is not a comparison.

Iran-back militias in syria is not the same as Korean personnel on (what they view as) korean soil.

Seems pretty willing to me when triggers start getting pulled.

They aren't on Korean soil, they are at sea, but I digress.

Japanese forces are acting in self-defense. Korea fired the first shot, and now Japanese forces are responding. From the broad point of view, the Japanese military is trying to save Japanese civilians under attack by the Korean military.

It is likely they will lose ships. Japan may lose ships as well. But that is a conflict, not war. Now if Russian forces violate Japanese/Korean waters, then it will really be war.

No, your ships resisted arrest and therefore Korea thought that the armed military helicopters coming into their waters were there to violently confront them, so after ample and repeated warning we opened fire. Plus, since our nations are supposed to be allies, or at least have mutual ones, you should not be sending armed vessels into my waters unless you started a confrontation. It was self defense of Korean sovereignty, as well as the fishermen and our boats, which all seemed targeted.

[TENNOHEIKA BANZAI NIHON]

It isn't war, it is just a minor conflict. Mind you, I used civilian ships and Korea fired first. It isn't war. Just like 75% of Americans do not support war with Iran, but just last week Biden launched strikes on an Iran-back militia. There was no willingness to go to war, but Korea forced it upon Japan.

Wait...if there was a war, where Japan invaded Dokdo, they really couldn't do anything because of their constitution. So technically they could only wage a defensive war, and Korea only wants Dokdo. Plus the US has a treaty with Korea IRL. And military bases in both. They have a large stake in this, and would want it to be settled peacefully. As does Korea, we only want Dokdo, but wouldn't come helping you against Russia after this.

Nevermind OOC justification, your whole post is confusing. I have several questions:

1. You say "The port side batteries (those not damaged by the missile, which were most) opened fire on the Korean Coast Guard and naval vessels."

Are you godmodding my forces, or are your ships shooting at each other?

2. You also say "31 Korean various antiship missiles launched, many streaking towards the smaller ships and clusters of ships where they could do damage."

This is less confusing than you launching SAMs at nothing, but I don't understand how a single missile could damage multiple ships unless you used a cluster bomb with is a warcrime/would be ineffective against ships.

3. Lastly, while I did allow you to determine your own losses, which you aren't clear if anything sank or not (although the destroyer which received two hits probably did) I question if calculated proportionately. With only 4 destroyers which are the most likely to have the air defense capabilities, you are saying my missiles had a 6.25% hit rate.

While technically possible, I have 10 destroyers deployed and 8 with the fleet, which would by your metric allow me to intercept all of your missiles, or only going with the 6.25% ratio, have only 2 hits.

Just FYI unless you have history changes, we are basically firing the exact same missiles at each other so you can't argue technological superiority. Technically Korea uses older anti-air missiles though.

[Madrinpoor]

Wait...if there was a war, where Japan invaded Dokdo, they really couldn't do anything because of their constitution. So technically they could only wage a defensive war, and Korea only wants Dokdo. Plus the US has a treaty with Korea IRL. And military bases in both. They have a large stake in this, and would want it to be settled peacefully. As does Korea, we only want Dokdo, but wouldn't come helping you against Russia after this.

Nevermind OOC justification, your whole post is confusing. I have several questions:

1. You say "The port side batteries (those not damaged by the missile, which were most) opened fire on the Korean Coast Guard and naval vessels."

Are you godmodding my forces, or are your ships shooting at each other?

2. You also say "31 Korean various antiship missiles launched, many streaking towards the smaller ships and clusters of ships where they could do damage."

This is less confusing than you launching SAMs at nothing, but I don't understand how a single missile could damage multiple ships unless you used a cluster bomb with is a warcrime/would be ineffective against ships.

3. Lastly, while I did allow you to determine your own losses, which you aren't clear if anything sank or not (although the destroyer which received two hits probably did) I question if calculated proportionately. With only 4 destroyers which are the most likely to have the air defense capabilities, you are saying my missiles had a 6.25% hit rate.

While technically possible, I have 10 destroyers deployed and 8 with the fleet, which would by your metric allow me to intercept all of your missiles, or only going with the 6.25% ratio, have only 2 hits.

Ok. What I mean is:

1. I meant to say. Japanese Coast Guard, I was thinking of Korea and I said Korea, I will fix that. That's embarrassing.

2. I thought you said you launched more helicopters didn't you. I am 90% sure you said you did so that is what my SAMs are shooting at. Also, I was trying to say, if a missile (which has a pretty large blast radius, I don't care the size) hits a boat, and it is near many others, then the blast radius might affect the other boats too. If that is not how missiles work, then I will redact that, but I think that is how missiles work. I am not using cluster bombs.

3. I said that only three missiles hit the destroyers. I never said how many hit the smaller patrol ships. And I will give you my losses.

I said the Mulchongsae (more than a destroyer, it is a capital ship like an Iowa class) was only hit in a port battery, so it wouldn't sink but that area would need urgent repair. The ROKS Pusan (the corvette) would likely sink. So would four of my smaller patrol ships also sink, the ROKS Doma, ROKS San, ROKS Hungtoo, and the ROKS Dodalhala. Does this clear things up

[TENNOHEIKA BANZAI NIHON]

Nevermind OOC justification, your whole post is confusing. I have several questions:

1. You say "The port side batteries (those not damaged by the missile, which were most) opened fire on the Korean Coast Guard and naval vessels."

Are you godmodding my forces, or are your ships shooting at each other?

2. You also say "31 Korean various antiship missiles launched, many streaking towards the smaller ships and clusters of ships where they could do damage."

This is less confusing than you launching SAMs at nothing, but I don't understand how a single missile could damage multiple ships unless you used a cluster bomb with is a warcrime/would be ineffective against ships.

3. Lastly, while I did allow you to determine your own losses, which you aren't clear if anything sank or not (although the destroyer which received two hits probably did) I question if calculated proportionately. With only 4 destroyers which are the most likely to have the air defense capabilities, you are saying my missiles had a 6.25% hit rate.

While technically possible, I have 10 destroyers deployed and 8 with the fleet, which would by your metric allow me to intercept all of your missiles, or only going with the 6.25% ratio, have only 2 hits.

Ok. What I mean is:

1. I meant to say. Japanese Coast Guard, I was thinking of Korea and I said Korea, I will fix that. That's embarrassing.

2. I thought you said you launched more helicopters didn't you. I am 90% sure you said you did so that is what my SAMs are shooting at. Also, I was trying to say, if a missile (which has a pretty large blast radius, I don't care the size) hits a boat, and it is near many others, then the blast radius might affect the other boats too. If that is not how missiles work, then I will redact that, but I think that is how missiles work. I am not using cluster bombs.

3. I said that only three missiles hit the destroyers. I never said how many hit the smaller patrol ships. And I will give you my losses.

I said the Mulchongsae (more than a destroyer, it is a capital ship like an Iowa class) was only hit in a port battery, so it wouldn't sink but that area would need urgent repair. The ROKS Pusan (the corvette) would likely sink. So would four of my smaller patrol ships also sink, the ROKS Doma, ROKS San, ROKS Hungtoo, and the ROKS Dodalhala. Does this clear things up

That makes things more clear.

As for missiles, these are anti-ship missiles so they penetrate though armor before exploding. So they don't explode as widely. Not to mention these ships aren't in port, they are several hundred feet from each other at minimum to avoid collision.

[Madrinpoor]

Ok. What I mean is:

1. I meant to say. Japanese Coast Guard, I was thinking of Korea and I said Korea, I will fix that. That's embarrassing.

2. I thought you said you launched more helicopters didn't you. I am 90% sure you said you did so that is what my SAMs are shooting at. Also, I was trying to say, if a missile (which has a pretty large blast radius, I don't care the size) hits a boat, and it is near many others, then the blast radius might affect the other boats too. If that is not how missiles work, then I will redact that, but I think that is how missiles work. I am not using cluster bombs.

3. I said that only three missiles hit the destroyers. I never said how many hit the smaller patrol ships. And I will give you my losses.

I said the Mulchongsae (more than a destroyer, it is a capital ship like an Iowa class) was only hit in a port battery, so it wouldn't sink but that area would need urgent repair. The ROKS Pusan (the corvette) would likely sink. So would four of my smaller patrol ships also sink, the ROKS Doma, ROKS San, ROKS Hungtoo, and the ROKS Dodalhala. Does this clear things up

That makes things more clear.

As for missiles, these are anti-ship missiles so they penetrate though armor before exploding. So they don't explode as widely. Not to mention these ships aren't in port, they are several hundred feet from each other at minimum to avoid collision.

...You do know port is the left side of a ship right

[TENNOHEIKA BANZAI NIHON]

That makes things more clear.

As for missiles, these are anti-ship missiles so they penetrate though armor before exploding. So they don't explode as widely. Not to mention these ships aren't in port, they are several hundred feet from each other at minimum to avoid collision.

...You do know port is the left side of a ship right

You seem confused. A port is a place where ships dock and unload. That is the type of port I am referring to.

[Madrinpoor]

...You do know port is the left side of a ship right

You seem confused. A port is a place where ships dock and unload. That is the type of port I am referring to.

And not the one I am referring to. Why would they be docked at a port in the middle of the sea?

[Madrinpoor]

Also how do you have so many missiles? That seems unrealistic.

Anyway I think I will wait to post my response until other nations have had a chance to respond.

[TENNOHEIKA BANZAI NIHON]

You seem confused. A port is a place where ships dock and unload. That is the type of port I am referring to.

And not the one I am referring to. Why would they be docked at a port in the middle of the sea?

Exactly, they aren't so they are relatively far away from each other which is why a single missile couldn't damage multiple ships. I

If you want to get into semantics, I could ask you why you say the missile his your battleship's "port battery." There are only 3 main batteries on most battleships, and there are only 3 on the Iowa which you said describes your ship.

Only thing remotely close to a port battery is the ship's secondary batteries, which would have been replaced if they are supposed to be "modern" battleships. So either what happened is the missile hit the "port battery" and continued to destroy the entire bridge, which would cripple the ship, or what you actually mean is it hit one of the 3 turrets.

[Madrinpoor]

And not the one I am referring to. Why would they be docked at a port in the middle of the sea?

Exactly, they aren't so they are relatively far away from each other which is why a single missile couldn't damage multiple ships. I

If you want to get into semantics, I could ask you why you say the missile his your battleship's "port battery." There are only 3 main batteries on most battleships, and there are only 3 on the Iowa which you said describes your ship.

Only thing remotely close to a port battery is the ship's secondary batteries, which would have been replaced if they are supposed to be "modern" battleships. So either what happened is the missile hit the "port battery" and continued to destroy the entire bridge, which would cripple the ship, or what you actually mean is it hit one of the 3 turrets.

I don't mean a port battery like a technical term, I mean a battery on the left side of the ship. Also known as the port side.

[TENNOHEIKA BANZAI NIHON]

Also how do you have so many missiles? That seems unrealistic.

Anyway I think I will wait to post my response until other nations have had a chance to respond.

Most nations have thousands of missiles. Iran for example has a stockpile of several thousand. Nations like China, Russia, and the US have many thousands of different missiles stockpiled. Modern warfare relies on overwhelming an enemy's defenses with dozens of missiles. In theory, a modern anti-aircraft system could track up to 100 targets at a time, and engage multiple simultaneously. You also have to account for weapons failures as well. I fired from 36 batteries which represents maybe a third of Japan's Type 12 launcher arsenal.

[Deblar]

No one’s denounced the crackdown yet...
Something’s wrong, I can feel it.

[TENNOHEIKA BANZAI NIHON]

Exactly, they aren't so they are relatively far away from each other which is why a single missile couldn't damage multiple ships. I

If you want to get into semantics, I could ask you why you say the missile his your battleship's "port battery." There are only 3 main batteries on most battleships, and there are only 3 on the Iowa which you said describes your ship.

Only thing remotely close to a port battery is the ship's secondary batteries, which would have been replaced if they are supposed to be "modern" battleships. So either what happened is the missile hit the "port battery" and continued to destroy the entire bridge, which would cripple the ship, or what you actually mean is it hit one of the 3 turrets.

I don't mean a port battery like a technical term, I mean a battery on the left side of the ship. Also known as the port side.

Going off the Iowa, there are only 3 main batteries. There are none on the sides of the ship. It is possible that you have port batteries, but that would mean you don't have room for antiship missiles. Also with the port batteries having much less armor, the missile would punch right through them and hit the bridge of the ship taking out its command center.

[Sao Nova Europa]

No one’s denounced the crackdown yet...
Something’s wrong, I can feel it.

Considering the very real possibility of war in East Asia, I guess most people are focused there.

[Kelmet]

No one’s denounced the crackdown yet...
Something’s wrong, I can feel it.

I haven't had the chance to post yet.

[Madrinpoor]

Also how do you have so many missiles? That seems unrealistic.

Anyway I think I will wait to post my response until other nations have had a chance to respond.

Most nations have thousands of missiles. Iran for example has a stockpile of several thousand. Nations like China, Russia, and the US have many thousands of different missiles stockpiled. Modern warfare relies on overwhelming an enemy's defenses with dozens of missiles. In theory, a modern anti-aircraft system could track up to 100 targets at a time, and engage multiple simultaneously. You also have to account for weapons failures as well. I fired from 36 batteries which represents maybe a third of Japan's Type 12 launcher arsenal.

But how many in a small detachment of ships?

[Madrinpoor]

I don't mean a port battery like a technical term, I mean a battery on the left side of the ship. Also known as the port side.

Going off the Iowa, there are only 3 main batteries. There are none on the sides of the ship. It is possible that you have port batteries, but that would mean you don't have room for antiship missiles. Also with the port batteries having much less armor, the missile would punch right through them and hit the bridge of the ship taking out its command center.

This is what I mean. Here is the Iowa firing.

See how its batteries are turned to the side? That is what I am thinking of because it is more convenient than having batteries on just one side.

[TENNOHEIKA BANZAI NIHON]

Most nations have thousands of missiles. Iran for example has a stockpile of several thousand. Nations like China, Russia, and the US have many thousands of different missiles stockpiled. Modern warfare relies on overwhelming an enemy's defenses with dozens of missiles. In theory, a modern anti-aircraft system could track up to 100 targets at a time, and engage multiple simultaneously. You also have to account for weapons failures as well. I fired from 36 batteries which represents maybe a third of Japan's Type 12 launcher arsenal.

But how many in a small detachment of ships?

So far I have fired 96 anti-ship missiles from actual ships. Each destroyer and frigate has 8 dedicated anti-ship missiles. My navy fleet consisted of 10 destroyers and 2 frigates plus one carrier and one light carrier.

Thus, now my fleet has expended all dedicated anti-ship missiles and will use the missiles that have a secondary anti-ship function if they need to. Otherwise the supply ships with the fleet will resupply them.

[TENNOHEIKA BANZAI NIHON]

Going off the Iowa, there are only 3 main batteries. There are none on the sides of the ship. It is possible that you have port batteries, but that would mean you don't have room for antiship missiles. Also with the port batteries having much less armor, the missile would punch right through them and hit the bridge of the ship taking out its command center.

This is what I mean. Here is the Iowa firing.

See how its batteries are turned to the side? That is what I am thinking of because it is more convenient than having batteries on just one side.

Yes the batteries you are referring to are the ship's main batteries. They are located nearest to the forward bow and to the aft. They are called Turret 1, Turret 2, and Turret 3. There are no main batteries on the port side. There are only secondary batteries on the port, but that is where in modern day missile launchers would go.

[Madrinpoor]

But how many in a small detachment of ships?

So far I have fired 96 anti-ship missiles from actual ships. Each destroyer and frigate has 8 dedicated anti-ship missiles. My navy fleet consisted of 10 destroyers and 2 frigates plus one carrier and one light carrier.

Thus, now my fleet has expended all dedicated anti-ship missiles and will use the missiles that have a secondary anti-ship function if they need to. Otherwise the supply ships with the fleet will resupply them.

I have to go IRL, but I will respond to this probably tomorrow (EST) and it will give people a chance to respond to this first.

[TENNOHEIKA BANZAI NIHON]

So far I have fired 96 anti-ship missiles from actual ships. Each destroyer and frigate has 8 dedicated anti-ship missiles. My navy fleet consisted of 10 destroyers and 2 frigates plus one carrier and one light carrier.

Thus, now my fleet has expended all dedicated anti-ship missiles and will use the missiles that have a secondary anti-ship function if they need to. Otherwise the supply ships with the fleet will resupply them.

I have to go IRL, but I will respond to this probably tomorrow (EST) and it will give people a chance to respond to this first.

Ok. Don't forget you can respond to the battle... it is not as if anyone is going to really respond to the events in a timely manner. This in unfolding all within a half hour

[Madrinpoor]

I will respond, but give me time, at least until noon because of RL stuff going on.

Also, not to nitpick but can the US please do more than "call for a ceasefire"? You guys have a pretty big part of this and a lot of influence.

[Bolslania]

I will respond, but give me time, at least until noon because of RL stuff going on.

Also, not to nitpick but can the US please do more than "call for a ceasefire"? You guys have a pretty big part of this and a lot of influence.

Thats all they really can do without military involvement