The Third Age: The War for Middle-Earth [OOC|Open]

[Polish Prussian Commonwealth]

Tag, I suppose.

[Danceria]

Well, can the Easterlings hang with them? Perhaps by proxy order of Sauron the Affably Evil because while Dragons and Dwarves have many similarities, Dwarves can be loyal and actually make the shiny bits whereas Smaug can be a bit of a diva.

Well, Easterlings trade extensively with the Black Dwarves - Durins Kin probably consider that an issue though.

Black Dwarves? Are they the Petty-Dwarves or what are they?

[Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States]

Well, Easterlings trade extensively with the Black Dwarves - Durins Kin probably consider that an issue though.

Black Dwarves? Are they the Petty-Dwarves or what are they?

Decendants of Dwarves that allied with Sauron during the war of the Last Alliance.

[Danceria]

Black Dwarves? Are they the Petty-Dwarves or what are they?

Decendants of Dwarves that allied with Sauron during the war of the Last Alliance.

Oooh. Wonder where the Black Dwarves reside, aside from the "East"/Ash Mountains...

[Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States]

Realm: Isengard
Leader: Saruman of Many Colours
Race(s): Istar, Dunlendings, Uruk-Hai, Orcs, Goblins
History: In 1000 TA, the five Istari were sent from the Undying Lands to Middle-Earth in order to help oppose a resurgent Sauron. Chiefest among them was Curumo, called Saruman by the Mortals,who was wise and powerful, and knowledgeable of the devices of the Enemy. As leader of the Order of Wizards, he was gifted the fortress of Isengard and its citadel, Orthanc, in name of the Steward of Gondor. From there, Saruman tried to discover the machinations of the Dark Lord. However, in his studies, he grew both haterul and jealous of Sauron’s power. Saruman was impressed by the forging of the One Ring, a weapon that would entice Sauron’s enemies to use it impotently against him, thus bringing it ever back to his hand. Saruman, still desiring to defeat the Dark Lord as he had been commanded, now grew to desire the One Ring as much as Sauron himself, though he knew the Ring would not want to turn to him willingly. The Ring would not reveal itself until Sauron was back at strength.

These designs led him to veto any action taken against the Necromancer at Dol Guldur. He knew the Necromancer to be Sauron or one of his minions, so in order for Sauron to regain some of his potency, Saruman could not do anything that would oppose His rise. To this end, after the White Council had decided to aid Oakenshield in his quest for the Lonely Mountain, spies of Saruman informed the Goblin King that tresspassers would be entering his territory. The company of Oakenshield never made it across the Misty Mountains. Strangely, this would lead to the Ring not revealing itself in time, against Saruman’s original designs.

From that point on, Saruman became a mere nuisance in the White Council, frustrating all attempts to make meaningful impact against Sauron. He theorised openly that the Ring had been lost to the Anduin, and had flowed eventually into the sea, where it had been lost forever. Saruman’s council put the leaders of Men at rest, that Sauron could never again regain his full strength, and would at most o ly provide formidable opposition in defending Mordor. Meanwhile, Saruman’s own spies were abroad searching for the Ring, focussing on the Shire where Saruman expected Gandalf to be gathering some power unknown to him.

In 2951 of the TA, Saruman used the Palantir of Orthanc to come into contact with Sauron directly, hoping to overpower the still strengthening Dark Lord with his own Will. However, Saruman underestimated Sauron, and the Dark Lord showed the wizard visions of his imagined future, with Minas Tirith in flames and mining pits stretching across Rohan. Saruman grew desparate, and realised that there was no way to openly oppose Sauron and succeed. So, Saruman pledged himself to Sauron, hoping to eventually overthrow him from the inside of his machinations. The wizard had not realised, however, that even an unwilling pawn to Sauron remains a pawn to Sauron, and by joining the Dark Lord he betrayed the mission given to him by Manwë, even if his purpose is still to overthrow Sauron.

Over the last six decades, Saruman has worked to increase his forces. His Orcs and Goblins have begun to fell the ancient trees of Fangorn, and the Isen has been dammed to power the great water-wheels that churn rock and iron. Underground, away from view, large forges burn day and night to create weapons for the Goblin-men of Saruman’s army. Although Saruman has not realised this yet, Sauron has invaded his mind more than the wizard believes. Saruman now thinks in terms of order and efficiency, and in his quest for victory he has grown for himself a mind of metal and wheels. In a sense, he has grown to be much like Sauron in his attempts to destroy him, to the detriment of all of Middle-Earth.

On the political scene, Saruman has begun to make his preparations for war. The traitor Grima advises king Theoden, who has become enthralled by Saruman and is weary of war. To the West, the wizard has allied with the Dunlendings, whose raids provide Isengard with the food it needs to sustain his armies. However, the Wizard’s Vale and Dunland are unsuitable for farming, which provides a ticking clock for Saruman to make himself known, to go out and conquer. Every month his spies are abroad, Saruman risks discovery by the Free Peoples or the White Council, and now that the Ring has not yet revealed itself, Saruman grows ever-more worried. Though, every moment that the Ring does not reveal itself is a moment he can use to outmanouvre Sauron.
Alignment: Sauron (still in secret), himself (even more secret still)
Faction Bonuses:
Territory: Isengard, the Wizard’s Vale, Gap of Rohan
Settlements: Isengard (Level IV)
Strength:
3,000 Orcs
400 wargs
300 Uruk-Hai
200 Dunlendings

[G-Tech Corporation]

I'm confused, what's the point of having Thorin's quest fail? The realms of man were already in a shitty situation as it was, why was it necessary to make it worse?

Mainly just a generic pretext for not having the Ring as a timer on the RP, to either end it in favor of Evil via being caught by Sauron, or end it in favor of Good by making it to the Cracks of Doom. Plus, this is a scenario Tolkien himself posited, so I felt it worth an explore.

Well, Wargs made up one of the armies of of the Battle of the Five Armies so I'd think they'd prolly get to be single units as well if even the spiders do, prolly even with great Wargs as their own 'larger version'. And I suppose I am a bit too influenced there by GW's tabletop stragegy game which featured the bats as a unit for use. Well...if I had the Trollshaws and Ettenmoors, which are supposedly crawling with those things...

I know the Uruks and the Uruk-hai are different, hence why I am asking what the Uruk-hai's/Goblin-Men's conversion rates to elves are as they aren't listed.

Dunlendings, Southrons and Breemen have Numenorean blood? As far as I am aware they don't, especcially not the Southrons. It's more like the people of Umbar have by now mostly Southron blood and some mixed/Black Numenorean holding on. Dunlendings and Breemen were of the same people as the Numenoreans but didn't go to Numenor and never really got elevated.

I can certainly add Wargs if you want them as their own units. Uruks and Uruk-Hai I class together for our purposes, since in canon Uruk-Hai are from Mordor, not created by Saruman. His Orcs bred with Westron men are functionally equivalent for our purposes to Uruks.

Apologies, that was awkward punctuation. I meant to say that the Dunlendings, Southrons, Breemen, and so on lack Numenorean blood in large quantities, and are thus the 'Lesser Men' for our purposes. By this period Umbar has been overrun by Southrons for nearly a thousand years - saying the people there have Numenorean blood is roughly equivalent to claiming that a current citizen traces their bloodlines to an invader at Normandy under William the Conqueror. It might be technically true, but we're talking a vast amount of generations and dilution.

Decendants of Dwarves that allied with Sauron during the war of the Last Alliance.

Oooh. Wonder where the Black Dwarves reside, aside from the "East"/Ash Mountains...

The Black/Dark Dwarves live in the Orocarni, the Red Mountains, and are pretty much too far east for us to be concerned with.

Realm: Isengard
Leader: Saruman of Many Colours
Race(s): Istar, Dunlendings, Uruk-Hai, Orcs, Goblins
History: In 1000 TA, the five Istari were sent from the Undying Lands to Middle-Earth in order to help oppose a resurgent Sauron. Chiefest among them was Curumo, called Saruman by the Mortals,who was wise and powerful, and knowledgeable of the devices of the Enemy. As leader of the Order of Wizards, he was gifted the fortress of Isengard and its citadel, Orthanc, in name of the Steward of Gondor. From there, Saruman tried to discover the machinations of the Dark Lord. However, in his studies, he grew both haterul and jealous of Sauron’s power. Saruman was impressed by the forging of the One Ring, a weapon that would entice Sauron’s enemies to use it impotently against him, thus bringing it ever back to his hand. Saruman, still desiring to defeat the Dark Lord as he had been commanded, now grew to desire the One Ring as much as Sauron himself, though he knew the Ring would not want to turn to him willingly. The Ring would not reveal itself until Sauron was back at strength.

These designs led him to veto any action taken against the Necromancer at Dol Guldur. He knew the Necromancer to be Sauron or one of his minions, so in order for Sauron to regain some of his potency, Saruman could not do anything that would oppose His rise. To this end, after the White Council had decided to aid Oakenshield in his quest for the Lonely Mountain, spies of Saruman informed the Goblin King that tresspassers would be entering his territory. The company of Oakenshield never made it across the Misty Mountains. Strangely, this would lead to the Ring not revealing itself in time, against Saruman’s original designs.

From that point on, Saruman became a mere nuisance in the White Council, frustrating all attempts to make meaningful impact against Sauron. He theorised openly that the Ring had been lost to the Anduin, and had flowed eventually into the sea, where it had been lost forever. Saruman’s council put the leaders of Men at rest, that Sauron could never again regain his full strength, and would at most o ly provide formidable opposition in defending Mordor. Meanwhile, Saruman’s own spies were abroad searching for the Ring, focussing on the Shire where Saruman expected Gandalf to be gathering some power unknown to him.

In 2951 of the TA, Saruman used the Palantir of Orthanc to come into contact with Sauron directly, hoping to overpower the still strengthening Dark Lord with his own Will. However, Saruman underestimated Sauron, and the Dark Lord showed the wizard visions of his imagined future, with Minas Tirith in flames and mining pits stretching across Rohan. Saruman grew desparate, and realised that there was no way to openly oppose Sauron and succeed. So, Saruman pledged himself to Sauron, hoping to eventually overthrow him from the inside of his machinations. The wizard had not realised, however, that even an unwilling pawn to Sauron remains a pawn to Sauron, and by joining the Dark Lord he betrayed the mission given to him by Manwë, even if his purpose is still to overthrow Sauron.

Over the last six decades, Saruman has worked to increase his forces. His Orcs and Goblins have begun to fell the ancient trees of Fangorn, and the Isen has been dammed to power the great water-wheels that churn rock and iron. Underground, away from view, large forges burn day and night to create weapons for the Goblin-men of Saruman’s army. Although Saruman has not realised this yet, Sauron has invaded his mind more than the wizard believes. Saruman now thinks in terms of order and efficiency, and in his quest for victory he has grown for himself a mind of metal and wheels. In a sense, he has grown to be much like Sauron in his attempts to destroy him, to the detriment of all of Middle-Earth.

On the political scene, Saruman has begun to make his preparations for war. The traitor Grima advises king Theoden, who has become enthralled by Saruman and is weary of war. To the West, the wizard has allied with the Dunlendings, whose raids provide Isengard with the food it needs to sustain his armies. However, the Wizard’s Vale and Dunland are unsuitable for farming, which provides a ticking clock for Saruman to make himself known, to go out and conquer. Every month his spies are abroad, Saruman risks discovery by the Free Peoples or the White Council, and now that the Ring has not yet revealed itself, Saruman grows ever-more worried. Though, every moment that the Ring does not reveal itself is a moment he can use to outmanouvre Sauron.
Alignment: Sauron (still in secret), himself (even more secret still)
Faction Bonuses:
Territory: Isengard, the Wizard’s Vale, Gap of Rohan
Settlements: Isengard (Level IV), Wulf’s Seat in Dunland (Level III)
Strength: I will need a little help deciding what’s reasonable.

This all seems to be in order. As far as strength goes, some low thousands of Orcs, a few hundred Wargs, two or three hundred Uruks, and perhaps a few hundred Dunlendings ('Lesser Men') would make sense. This is before the sudden ramp up of breeding of Uruks for war that occurred after Gandalf was captured, and I'd rather treat the Dunlendings as allies than direct warriors answerable to Saruman, to leave that position open for someone who might want to make Dunland Great Again.

Sound reasonable?

[Remnants of Exilvania]

I'm confused, what's the point of having Thorin's quest fail? The realms of man were already in a shitty situation as it was, why was it necessary to make it worse?

Mainly just a generic pretext for not having the Ring as a timer on the RP, to either end it in favor of Evil via being caught by Sauron, or end it in favor of Good by making it to the Cracks of Doom. Plus, this is a scenario Tolkien himself posited, so I felt it worth an explore.

I mean, not having the Ring as a timer on the RP is a solid idea though we need to remember that destroying the Ring was the Free People's only chance of actually winning the war. They were being overrun without it.

Now they not only do not have any viable strength in the North, Esgaroth still being merely Esgaroth and the Iron Hills still being merely the Iron Hills, isolated in the east, the Orcs of the Misties and Grey Mountains now have the numbers to practically overrun even better than ever before and there's practically nothing stopping them. The passes across the Misties are now also all practically closed so Rhovanion is cut off from the west.

Wouldn't it be possible to lose Bilbo in Goblin Town, the party continues, rouses Smaug from his slumber who flies and gets shot out of the bloody air by Bard. I mean, Bilbo, despite having found Smaug's weakness, never told Bard of it so they can totally still kill the dragon, battle the orcs over the Lonely Mountain and then refound the Kingdoms of Dale and Erebor, greatly boosting their power in the north so that they hopefully won't get soloed by the Easterlings and Dol Guldur.

I can certainly add Wargs if you want them as their own units. Uruks and Uruk-Hai I class together for our purposes, since in canon Uruk-Hai are from Mordor, not created by Saruman. His Orcs bred with Westron men are functionally equivalent for our purposes to Uruks.

Apologies, that was awkward punctuation. I meant to say that the Dunlendings, Southrons, Breemen, and so on lack Numenorean blood in large quantities, and are thus the 'Lesser Men' for our purposes. By this period Umbar has been overrun by Southrons for nearly a thousand years - saying the people there have Numenorean blood is roughly equivalent to claiming that a current citizen traces their bloodlines to an invader at Normandy under William the Conqueror. It might be technically true, but we're talking a vast amount of generations and dilution.

Wargs and Grimwargs as larger version plz. Not as much worth as a great spider tho.

Of course, Uruks and Uruk-hai are plenty similar...though I do believe in canon, Uruk-hai are not from Mordor. Uruks are. I've only ever seen the 'hai' being used with Saruman's Uruks and it is debated wether these were an additional slight improvement. But eh, as said, they're functionally mostly the same.

Ah, I see. Also, noice, someone shares my opinion of the Numenorean Population by the time of the Third Age.

[Dentali]

Name: Dôlguzagar son of Tarîkmagân

Race: Black Numenorean

Appearance (Image)

Role: General of Sauron’s Armies in the North/ General of Agmar

Alignment: Sauron/ Agmar

History: Born in Agmar in 2934 T.A. among the Black Numenorians, Dôlguzagar knew what it was to grow up cold and hungry, at the same time he was told constantly of the former glory of the Numenoreans and grew up with a great resentment of Elves, Men and the Gods of the West. After the death of Thorin II Oakenshield and the rise of the forces of Sauron in the North in 2941 Dôlguzagar’s tribe became hugely important force for Sauron, with them forming the backbone of a resurgent Kingdom of Agmar. His father became known as Tarîkmagân or Tower-Builder as he spearheaded the construction efforts of fortifications throughout the region.

Dôlguzagar quickly became known as a military prodigy, arming himself with a black blade he warred against the many wild tribes of men and orcs in the North and the Anduin Vale distinguishing himself and was notably among a force sent to assist in the reoccupation of Dol Guldur in 2951. Through the decades Dôlguzagar showed time and again his skill in battle and in military strategy, as well as his ruthlessness as he killed several of his comrades while seeking greater ranks. Now as one of the top generals of Agmar he looks to invade the territories West of the Misty Mountains and create a new empire for the Numenorians.


Other: Commands a large army and has a dozen knights sworn to his personal command willing to fight and die for him. Has a beautiful blade blade.

[Tysklandia]

Any idea what my starting troop numbers should be?

I'm somewhat fine with building up via quests or whatever else, is you prefer a slow buildup.

[Latvijas Otra Republika]

Oh, just read it properly. Seems more like a game?
I'm guessing that was the intention, thought it was more of a RP driven thing.

[Remnants of Exilvania]

Oh, just read it properly. Seems more like a game?
I'm guessing that was the intention, thought it was more of a RP driven thing.

It is an RP.

G-Tech RPs just tend to also have a gameplay framework along with them.

[G-Tech Corporation]

Wargs and Grimwargs as larger version plz. Not as much worth as a great spider tho.

Yeah, I'm going to pass on Grimwargs. They're phenotypically identical to Wargs, just having the virtue of being better fed and living longer. From that perspective I should list Orc chieftains as their own entry, because they are stronger and more fell-handed than their comrades, but I'm certainly not going to do that.

Any idea what my starting troop numbers should be?

I'm somewhat fine with building up via quests or whatever else, is you prefer a slow buildup.

Well, I'd definitely temper your expectations for Black Numenoreans - if they still exist in the north, they are in very scarce numbers. More than a few dozen following his banner would be a great part indeed of their remaining strength. I'd think any incursion more than a few hundred Orcs or the like would be marked quickly by the Dunedain and Elves of Rivendell, and so unlikely to be committed by either Dol Guldur or any other black powers - but if you can convince me a higher number makes more sense, I'm happy to hear your argumentation.

Oh, just read it properly. Seems more like a game?
I'm guessing that was the intention, thought it was more of a RP driven thing.

Really, just a normal RP with a few numbers tacked on to keep things fair. I don't want players summoning ten thousand Dwarves from their veritable buttholes, or anything along those lines, and having a decent idea of how an engagement might go so I don't have to arbitrate absolutely everything.

[Remnants of Exilvania]

Wargs and Grimwargs as larger version plz. Not as much worth as a great spider tho.

Yeah, I'm going to pass on Grimwargs. They're phenotypically identical to Wargs, just having the virtue of being better fed and living longer. From that perspective I should list Orc chieftains as their own entry, because they are stronger and more fell-handed than their comrades, but I'm certainly not going to do that.

True, true I suppose.

Any idea what my starting troop numbers should be?

I'm somewhat fine with building up via quests or whatever else, is you prefer a slow buildup.

Well, I'd definitely temper your expectations for Black Numenoreans - if they still exist in the north, they are in very scarce numbers. More than a few dozen following his banner would be a great part indeed of their remaining strength. I'd think any incursion more than a few hundred Orcs or the like would be marked quickly by the Dunedain and Elves of Rivendell, and so unlikely to be committed by either Dol Guldur or any other black powers - but if you can convince me a higher number makes more sense, I'm happy to hear your argumentation.

Funny, I had this conversation with someone else before.

Tysk is the Moria Expedition, not the Black Numenorean General.

Generally do we know anything of Black Numenoreans in Angmar? The app makes it sound like its based on Battle for Middle-Earth 2 which just turned the Angmarim into Black Numenoreans for whatever reason rather than the Northmen/Middle Men they were.

Sure, a BN General and his BN guard being sent there to pick up the pieces there and make it a fighting force again sounds good but BNs coming from Angmar itself? Eh?

[G-Tech Corporation]

Funny, I had this conversation with someone else before.

Tysk is the Moria Expedition, not the Black Numenorean General.

Generally do we know anything of Black Numenoreans in Angmar? The app makes it sound like its based on Battle for Middle-Earth 2 which just turned the Angmarim into Black Numenoreans for whatever reason rather than the Northmen/Middle Men they were.

Sure, a BN General and his BN guard being sent there to pick up the pieces there and make it a fighting force again sounds good but BNs coming from Angmar itself? Eh?

Oh, herp derp. My apologies. As for the Dwarves, low hundreds would make sense. Balin's Expedition likely numbered no more than a hundred or two, and they came from a prosperous Erebor.

There should have been, logically, Black Numenoreans in Angmar - from Cardolan and Rhudaur, at the very least. Their numbers, however, as I said, are variously dubious this far into the future from the date we knew of their lineages. Certainly the Dunedain themselves managed to survive in numbers in similar circumstances, so some knocking around is not impossible, but a great strength would be improbable. Especially given that the greater part of them probably interbred with the lesser men of Rhudaur.

[Remnants of Exilvania]

Could I play a "united" Misties? So all the major orc holds, Gundabad, Gram, Goblin Town and Moria united under Bolg (or not if we were to decide to buff the good guys a little and kill Bolg).

Of course if another player showed up who'd wish to play one of the orc holds, I'd give it to them, much like in the case of Gondor we might have players for the Principalities.

[Danceria]

I'm planning on being an Easterling exploration force, here to grab land and expand in the name of the King-In-The-East and Affably Evil Sauron.

[The Knights of Azorea]

Realm: Dunland
Leader: Gwynric the Red
Race(s): Lesser Men. Dunland is home to the Dunlendings, swarthy and dark haired cousins of the Haladin and little touched by Numenor.
History: Since time out of mind, when Numenor waxed and waned, the ancestors of the Dunlendings have ranged in the Enedwaith and beyond. Before the elf-touched came upon the land, their chiefs ruled as far as their great flocks could range. By their artifice, the Numenorean exiles from sunken Westernesse took the land from the fathers of the Dunlendings, and forced them back. Over many a score of years that which would become Gondor forced them out, until they kept domain by their fierceness only in the Enedhwaith and Calenardhon. Many fled further, to what would become Bree-land, and the stoors who'd lived for a time in Dunland left along with them. The Dunlendings grew to hate the men of Numenor who burned their villages and despoiled their woods, and this first slight by the Dunedain is well remembered. They abided there in Calenardhon and the Enedhwaith for a long time, and held the land well. Then, once again, fate came on and forced them from their homes, this time in the shape of the Eotheod.

When Gondor saw fit to grant their lands of Calenardhon to the roving Rohirrim, they stole from the men of Dunland, and this second slight by the heirs of Numenor is well remembered. For bitter years they fought with the kings of the Eotheod, with Brego and Aldor the Old, and though they struggled hard with axe and bow they were forced west. Though they fought hard at the passings of the Isen, by the time of Aldor's death they had come to settle only in Dunland, the eaves of Fangorn and the edges of the Westfold. With Aldor's passing, though, the Dunlendings came to uneasy peace with the Rohirrim, and many of the two peoples mingled and lived amongst one another.

Later, in the time of King Helm, came the third great slight. Freca, chief among Dunlendings and blood-kin to Freawine of the Eotheod, was slain at counsel by the treacherous Helm, for daring to demand a proper wife for his son. Wulf, heir of Freca, fought hard for his birthright against the Rohirrim who declared himself his foe, and lead his kin into their ancient fief of Calenardhon once more. As the Long Winter came on, Wulf smote the foe well and nobly at the fords of Isen- taking Edoras and the crown at Meduseld, leaving Helm to cower in his Hornburg. He slew Prince Haleth, while the cold slew Helm and his other sons. The men of Dunland had their land restored to them once again, before the fates struck, as ever they had, against them. Frealaf, sister-son to Helm, snuck into Edoras like a thief in the night with small retinue and slew Wulf upon the throne that was his right, before casting his loyal men back west in TA 2759. This third great slight against the Dunlendings burns like a scar on the pride of Dunland, and will never be forgotten.

In the years since, the Rohirrim have again pushed the men of Dunland ever westward, until Folcwine stole from them the Westfold, last part of their lands in Calenardhon. The folk of the Westfold, though, know that they are subjected to false men and treacherous-kings, and the blood of Dunland flows in them. Beyond the Isen, the Dunlendings wait now and seethe at the world, remembering in their hearts how they have been slighted. In recent years drawn together under the banner of one of the many petty kings of Wulf's blood, Gwynric the Red, they raid across the river, and hear the whispers that come out from Orthanc.
Alignment: The Dunlendings, rare among men, are not slaves to the dark nor beloved children of the light. The elves and Dunedain have no love for them, and are much despised in Dunland, but the Dunlendings know honour. They want only what was taken from them - their lands and proper honour, and while some look to Isengard for it, others see the darkness of the place and want no part in it. Though much spited, the Dunlendings are a free people yet.
Faction Bonuses: (Will be determined by me based on history, or are pre-generated for canon factions.)
Territory: Dunland, the Enedhwaith and the very fringes of Fangorn around the ring of Orthanc - for mapping purposes much of the western edge of the Misty Mountains up to Glanduin and down to the Isen.
Settlements: 6 Tier One (Names to be added as each is mentioned)
Strength: 3,500 Dunlending Warriors.

[G-Tech Corporation]

Could I play a "united" Misties? So all the major orc holds, Gundabad, Gram, Goblin Town and Moria united under Bolg (or not if we were to decide to buff the good guys a little and kill Bolg).

Of course if another player showed up who'd wish to play one of the orc holds, I'd give it to them, much like in the case of Gondor we might have players for the Principalities.

The goblins of the Misty/Gray Mountains will be pseudo-unified regardless, but if you RP as Bolg you’ll only directly control Gundabad, relying on NPC chieftains to rally the vast bulk of your forces.

I'm planning on being an Easterling exploration force, here to grab land and expand in the name of the King-In-The-East and Affably Evil Sauron.

Tre bien.

[G-Tech Corporation]

Realm: Dunland
Leader: Gwynric the Red
Race(s): Lesser Men. Dunland is home to the Dunlendings, swarthy and dark haired cousins of the Haladin and little touched by Numenor.
History: Since time out of mind, when Numenor waxed and waned, the ancestors of the Dunlendings have ranged in the Enedwaith and beyond. Before the elf-touched came upon the land, their chiefs ruled as far as their great flocks could range. By their artifice, the Numenorean exiles from sunken Westernesse took the land from the fathers of the Dunlendings, and forced them back. Over many a score of years that which would become Gondor forced them out, until they kept domain by their fierceness only in the Enedhwaith and Calenardhon. Many fled further, to what would become Bree-land, and the stoors who'd lived for a time in Dunland left along with them. The Dunlendings grew to hate the men of Numenor who burned their villages and despoiled their woods, and this first slight by the Dunedain is well remembered. They abided there in Calenardhon and the Enedhwaith for a long time, and held the land well. Then, once again, fate came on and forced them from their homes, this time in the shape of the Eotheod.

When Gondor saw fit to grant their lands of Calenardhon to the roving Rohirrim, they stole from the men of Dunland, and this second slight by the heirs of Numenor is well remembered. For bitter years they fought with the kings of the Eotheod, with Brego and Aldor the Old, and though they struggled hard with axe and bow they were forced west. Though they fought hard at the passings of the Isen, by the time of Aldor's death they had come to settle only in Dunland, the eaves of Fangorn and the edges of the Westfold. With Aldor's passing, though, the Dunlendings came to uneasy peace with the Rohirrim, and many of the two peoples mingled and lived amongst one another.

Later, in the time of King Helm, came the third great slight. Freca, chief among Dunlendings and blood-kin to Freawine of the Eotheod, was slain at counsel by the treacherous Helm, for daring to demand a proper wife for his son. Wulf, heir of Freca, fought hard for his birthright against the Rohirrim who declared himself his foe, and lead his kin into their ancient fief of Calenardhon once more. As the Long Winter came on, Wulf smote the foe well and nobly at the fords of Isen- taking Edoras and the crown at Meduseld, leaving Helm to cower in his Hornburg. He slew Prince Haleth, while the cold slew Helm and his other sons. The men of Dunland had their land restored to them once again, before the fates struck, as ever they had, against them. Frealaf, sister-son to Helm, snuck into Edoras like a thief in the night with small retinue and slew Wulf upon the throne that was his right, before casting his loyal men back west in TA 2759. This third great slight against the Dunlendings burns like a scar on the pride of Dunland, and will never be forgotten.

In the years since, the Rohirrim have again pushed the men of Dunland ever westward, until Folcwine stole from them the Westfold, last part of their lands in Calenardhon. The folk of the Westfold, though, know that they are subjected to false men and treacherous-kings, and the blood of Dunland flows in them. Beyond the Isen, the Dunlendings wait now and seethe at the world, remembering in their hearts how they have been slighted. In recent years drawn together under the banner of one of the many petty kings of Wulf's blood, Gwynric the Red, they raid across the river, and hear the whispers that come out from Orthanc.
Alignment: The Dunlendings, rare among men, are not slaves to the dark nor beloved children of the light. The elves and Dunedain have no love for them, and are much despised in Dunland, but the Dunlendings know honour. They want only what was taken from them - their lands and proper honour, and while some look to Isengard for it, others see the darkness of the place and want no part in it. Though much spited, the Dunlendings are a free people yet.
Faction Bonuses: (Will be determined by me based on history, or are pre-generated for canon factions.)
Territory: Dunland, the Enedhwaith and the very fringes of Fangorn around the ring of Orthanc - for mapping purposes much of the western edge of the Misty Mountains up to Glanduin and down to the Isen.
Settlements: I have no idea, honestly - probably not many and certainly none of any significance. Probably a smattering of long-house towns as you might expect of a less dense Rohan.
Strength: Again, I've little notion.

Delightful! Glad to see you Az. As far as Settlements go, you’re absolutely correct in that they’ll likely be small, but I would assume fairly numerous. A half dozen Tier Is would be logical, and I would guess a few thousand Dunlending warriors, three or four being my first thrust.

[Remnants of Exilvania]

Could I play a "united" Misties? So all the major orc holds, Gundabad, Gram, Goblin Town and Moria united under Bolg (or not if we were to decide to buff the good guys a little and kill Bolg).

Of course if another player showed up who'd wish to play one of the orc holds, I'd give it to them, much like in the case of Gondor we might have players for the Principalities.

The goblins of the Misty/Gray Mountains will be pseudo-unified regardless, but if you RP as Bolg you’ll only directly control Gundabad, relying on NPC chieftains to rally the vast bulk of your forces.

I mean, that was supposed to be sort of the case with all larger powers right, with NPCs/players having to follow the call to arms.

Well, I had an app prepared for those united Misties so let's see how it fares.

[Remnants of Exilvania]

Realm: The Orcish Domains of the Misty Mountains
Leader: Chieftain Durgash of the North
Race(s): Orcs, Goblins, Trolls, Wargs, Bats.
History: Following the War of Wrath, many of Morgoth's Servants fled the wrath of the Valar, seeking to hide in deep, underground places. Many of these refugees ended up in the Misty Mountains or Hithaeglir, hiding themselves deep below their peaks, away from Durin's Folk and away from the Valar. For as long as the Dwarves were strong, the orcs did not dare to act openly, hiding away in the deep, dark tunnels, doing little more than harassing unwary travellers.

During the Dark Years, as Sauron grew in might and sought to dominate all of Middle Earth, these orcs fell under his sway. With hatred and envy for both Elves and Dwarves in their heart, they were easily brought into the fold of Sauron's great hosts, lengthening his reach greatly and, under his and his captains' command, laying laying siege and conquering the ancestral home of Durin, Mount Gundabad, as well as blocking the strategically important passes across the Misty Mountains. But alas, Sauron was far away and when the armies of the Last Alliance crossed, the orcs and goblins hid themselves, fearful of the great hosts with their gleaming blades, preferring to prey on weaker targets. Such as the returning Isildur, ambushing him and his companions and shooting him dead in the river Anduin.

Yet with Sauron vanquished, atleast for the time, his hold over the Orcs of the Misty Mountains faded. The discipline upheld by his captains eroded as there were no more orders reaching them from Barad Dur and the orcs engaged in their favourite pastimes again. Waylaying travellers, plundering dwarven holds and just general banditry.

It was only deep into the Third Age, with the assignment of the Witch King of Angmar to the far north, that Sauron would regain a measure of control over the Orcs and Goblins populating the mountains. Under Sauron's orders the Witch King would amass great forces in Angmar, many among these being dark and vile creatures spewing forth from the vast tunnels of the orcs below the Misty Mountains and swelling the ranks of Angmar's armies, allowing it to go toe to toe with the weakened Arnor and eventually destroy it...though Angmar was destroyed in return by the Elves and the Gondorians and the orcs which had populated it were forced to flee back to their strongholds in the mountains as the plains were systematically cleansed of their presence by Elves and Gondorians in the west and the Eotheod in the east.

Yet they still gained much plunder from Arnor and soon they would gain even more for Durin's Bane was awoken in Khazad Dum and expelled the Dwarves from there, allowing the orcs to settle in those hallowed halls shortly after. Sauron of course eventually noticed this great hoard which had fallen under the sway of the orcs and soon sent his own to claim it. Black Uruks from Mordor came to Moria and ensured that tributes of Mithril and Dwarven Designs were sent to Mordor as well as Sauron's designs put into place in the Misty Mountains, leading to the orcs increasing their presence in the mountains and fortifying the passes. They also invaded southwards into Gondor, overrunning Calenardhon together with an Easterling host and putting Gondor at great risk untill the Eotheod came to their rescue, leading to the founding of Rohan. And of course westward into Eriador, busying the Rangers of the North and allowing the Hobbits of the Shire to invent Golf, an insult the orcs of Mount Gram still curse the halflings for.

Yet all could not stay well for the orcs for long and as the great firedragon Smaug took the Lonely Mountain from the Dwarves, many were displaced and left to wander. And it was in this time that King Thror wandered into Moria where Azog, greatest of the chieftains of the Misty Mountains and undisputed ruler of Moria resided. Thror was killed, his severed head branded with Azog's name and returned to the dwarves who swore bloody vengeance, starting the War of Dwarves and Orcs. It lasted for 6 long years, the Dwarves fighting the orcs from the very north at Mount Gundabad, to the south at Moria, sacking every orcish stronghold they could find on their way and cleansing the Misty Mountains of their foul presence. In the final Battle of Azanulbizar, the depleted orcish and dwarven hosts clashed and despite the Dwarves taking the field in victory and slaying Azog, it had all come at a great price and their strength was not enough to pursue the foul folk that retreated into Moria or south, through Rohan and into the White Mountains from where they would wage war against the Rohirrim. And the Orcs too were greatly depleted, troubling the Free Folk no more for many, many years.

But undisturbed and in the dark, evil always festers. And with the dwarves successfully repulsed from their holdings, the orcish population of the Misty Mountains started to soar to dwindling heights once more as the Third Age was starting to approach its 4th millennium. Goblins and Orcs bred in great numbers under the mountains and allied themselves with the Wargs in their foothills, starting to raid the people on both sides of their mountains. In the west the Ettenmoors and Trollshaws soon became unsafe regions, only the efforts of the rangers and Elrond's patrols ensuring that the foul creatures did not spill forth further, into the Breeland. In the east things were looking far worse Beorn alone keeping the orcs at bay while the Eotheod in the north suffered from frequent raids of the Gundabad orcs.

Yet the orcs and goblins were still torn apart, their many holds bickering among themselves over territory and scraps of loot. Little cooperation was seen between them as even Sauron's dark discipline had faded once again, the Misty Mountains clearly becoming somewhat less important in his schemes. And they were not important, a threat for the barely settled regions along their borders but incapable of truly assaulting the greater realms along their borders such as Mirkwood and Lorien to the east or Lindon and the Ered Luin to the west. Untill one electrifying event.

A party of dwarves was sacked on the High Pass which the Goblins of Goblin Town held. Upon closer inspection by the Great Goblin of Goblin Town, the travellers were revealed to carry orc-slaying blades from the times of Gondolin of Old, blades an old veteran of Morgoth such as the Great Goblin immediately recognised. Yet the Great Goblin was slain before he could have the Dwarves executed and the party escaped in one mad dash out of Goblin Town. Setting the scene for a young and ambitious orc to take the stage.

Bolg of the North, son of Azog and Chieftain of Mount Gundabad, had always been influential. He was strong, he was smart and his lineage had some prestige to it. The Great Goblin of Goblin Town, an old, strong and well respected orc in the Misty Mountains, had been his chief opponent in the game over who would rule the orcs of the Misty Mountains. And now, with his sudden death at the hands of the hated Dwarves, Bolg saw his chance to not only finally gain the rule over all the orcs of the Misty Mountains that he so desired, but also to perhaps have his revenge on the Dwarves.

Stirring up the orcs of the Mountains with whispered rumours of another War of Dwarves and Orcs, of the presence of dwarven scouting parties and dwarven assassins, Bolg riled up the orcs gaining their support and loyalty and using it to strengthen the orcs' grip over the mountains. The High Pass was openly blocked. The Dwarven West-East road was cut and the passes became...impassable as hateful orcs roamed the mountains once more. Yet the great dwarf holds were far and the dwarven invasion that Bolg so desired, so needed to further cement his rule in the Misties, did not occur. And as the orcs multiplied and the dwarves did not come, so too did their willingness to go to all out war simmer down. Bolg's kingdom began to show cracks and the chiefs of the holds required constant reminders that it was in fact him, Bolg, who ruled and not them.
Alignment: Sauron~ish/Saruman~ish
Faction Bonuses:

• Lord of Gundabad: As the holder of the ancestral capitol of the Goblins of the Misty Mountains, all foul folk of the Misty Mountains and Grey Mountains acknowledge your overlordship. Every month, you may gain an additional 100 free Goblins at Gundabad. Also, all Goblin-majority factions must pass diplomacy checks to declare war on you or ignore your summons to battle. This bonus disappears if you lose Gundabad, though it may be reclaimed.
• The Black Host: In the dark places of the world, fetid pits and gnawings can be found from ancient times, old tunnels that may be easily reopened and will swiftly teem with foul creatures once more. If you establish a Settlement in a mountainous region, it takes three months less to reach Tier I.

Territory: Basically the entire Misties from Gundabad in the North, the small stretch south of the Nan Angmar in the West and to Moria in the South. Some bleeding into the Ettenmoors too.
Settlements:

• Mount Gundabad - Tier IV City
• Goblin Town - Tier III Town
• Mount Gram - Tier III Town
• Mount Ugular - Tier II Hamlet

Strength:

• Great Host of Mount Gundabad
  Led by Bolg of the North, Chieftain of Mount Gundabad.
  -18.000 Goblins
  -4.000 Orcs
  -500 Wargs
  -6 Cave Trolls
• Host of Mount Gram
  Led by Tharzog the Strong, Chieftain of Mount Gram
  -10.000 Goblins
  -1.500 Wargs
  -500 Orcs
  -18 Cave Trolls
• Host of Goblin Town
  Led by Gorkil the Fat, Great Goblin of Goblin Town
  -10.000 Goblins
  -2.500 Wargs
  -500 Orcs
• Host of Mount Dum
  Led by Durburz the Exiled, Chieftain of Mount Ugular
  2.000 Goblins
  500 Wargs

[Ralnis]

Realm: Wazmakaghul, the Solitude of Labyrinths
Leader: Skaldii the Pale,the Scholar-Drake of Solitude and the King in the Labyrinth
Race(s): A lone cold-drake that leads goblins and orcs that live in his hold
History: Long ago, the underground dwarf fortress of Wazmakaghul was built as a staging army to fight the dragons, bandits, or even rival dwarves should tensions rise. It was completed to be built like a labyrinth in order to defend themselves better. At the end it was tested in the War of Dwarves and Dragons by cold-drakes who came to for its treasure. Despite the power of dragons, Wamakaghul held but the Dwarves did not. Eventually the Dwarven fortress became a ruin that defenses still stood as it faded into history. But this is not the end of its story.

As time past, a female pregnant drake had found her way to the forgotten walls of the fortress and managed to best the defenses but nearly died in order to get to the treasure. On her last breaths, she laid her egg on the very gold and precious metals in the vault and wrapped her body around it. In her death, her victory was not in vain as her offspring will have inherited her victory. The babe in the egg nearly died but fate had favored this little wyrm.

The babe was pale in scale and eyes shine with a glowing hue to them. This babe had came to survive the growth by feeding on the corpse of his mother and coveted her bones and sinew as he did his hoard. Like all dragons, growth and sleep were deep and slow but during the periods of activity the dragon came to upon curiosity of the fortress that he called home. His mind was naturally sharp, more so than normal lesser dragons as he learned what he could from the ruins. This thirst of knowledge soon became tied to his greed for treasure as he would layer his treasure with tattered scrolls, ruined books, or stones with stories wanting to be told.

He deciphered a broken idea of the history of the dwarven fortress and understood the language of the people that abandoned due to the War. These tattered histories and legends only fueled his lust for knowledge, his dreams plagued by libraries of splendor, plunder of trinkets and of archaic knowledge from Eras beyond his life. His heart thirst for treasure of both material and knowledge as he wished to turned his hoard into a gold library that would be the envy of Middle Earth.

His long slumber was interrupted as goblins had settled and infest his lair. When the small vermin found the young cold-drake, he was not happy for these intruders dared to even step foot in his presence. He used his dragon-spell to not just interrogate them, but to sunder their minds into sludge as his voice was heard through the mouths of the goblins as they let the leadership just who they stumbled upon. The goblin chieftain who came before him bowed to his power and begged for forgiveness.

However, instead of forgiveness, the dragon sought something more. His eyes look towards the ruins of his home, to the battered statues of the dwarven kings and heroes and what could be restored in his image. He also saw the goblins and saw that in the minds he had shattered or read about the various settlements and strongholds but also that the Dark Lord has returned. While the schemes of godlike beings and Wizards as he is a lone lesser of a dragon like Smaug but lazy either.

To the Cold-drake, his greed was more to the point where he wanted more than just simple riches and scraps of knowledge. He sought the providence of majesty and statecraft, of nation-building. He looked at these goblins and made them a deal of offering protection in exchange for servitude. In his draconic eyes, he had plans for these small pitiful creatures and saw the potential for his own uses. The goblin chieftain didn't get much say in it from between the dragon and the wilds they rather deal with a scheming dragon.

The dragon knew he had a lot of work in order to make a nation that he could copy from what he knew about nation-building and that goblins weren't the greatest servants due to them being geared towards infighting and making things geared towards war. To make them become anything different from Goblin-Town and tooled to be more organized.

The goblins needed to be directed, both through selective breeding and cultural engineering in order to get the best that he could from the goblins. It was a good thing that penalties were harsh and their lives were short but plentiful. Of course, with the large surplus of goblins that infested his halls came with the matters of logistics which the dragon was more than happy to direct and eventually dictate for others to manage. The fortress eventually grew for fungal farms and other ramshackle structures as they mined even further into the mountain.

Eventually forges and other works were reclaimed or made from the ramshackle industry. The dragon was pleased somewhat, his experiments into giving them a state was more or less successful, but their statehood was loose as many of the goblins became tribes that bowed to the dragon because of fear of being dominated or eaten. Many had came to fight each other in ritualistic combat for feats of strength or even steal from his hoard.

Because of this, all that he had done was being ripped under him and this will not stand. The dragon went on a rampage and took many goblins, either eaten them or enslaved the survivors with his Dragon-spell. With his rage finally subsided, he figured out that he destroyed all that he had originally built was destroyed. Now he to rebuild everything, but now with more careful watch and needed to get someone who would listen better.

From here, he sent out the goblins to find him bands of orcs and goblins that he can use to create a government structure of a kingdom that he could use terror and domination to make them listen to his words and his laws.

What came out of this second attempt was something strange to the dragon and more successful in organization to building a new nation. Those that came to the Labyrinth give their respect and reverence out of the fear of a dragon and the power of the dragon-spell. The kingdom had effectively been established with laws and a caste system with goblins on the bottom and orcs on the top.

The reason why he specifically chosen female goblins and orcs that were taught by him personally to be his scholar caste, caretakers and minsters. It was the first Herald that gave him the name of Skaldii the Pale, the Scholar-Drake of Solitude and the King in the Labyrinth. All those titles he never gave himself but take them in stride as he finally saw all that he wanted to start becoming true.

Finally, in the start of the new era, where Darkness and Light started the war for the Ring, the fortress is finally seeing some degree of restoration. Metal and stone are being mined, weapons are being manufactured, and fungus is being grown. The goblins and orcs march with ramshackle industry and a focus to bring glory and in the name of the Scholar-Drake for the want is of the world and the enemies are everyone that doesn't respect or bow to their King.

Let them all fear the coming of Sakldii!

Alignment: Independent/Himself, if by DnD alignment, is between neutral and lawful evil
Faction Bonuses: (Will be determined by me based on history, or are pre-generated for canon factions.)
Territory: The Fortress is deep into the Grey Mountains, actually carved underground and into a mountain. It is west of the Withered Heath. It's well hidden and mostly ruined except for the ramshackle buildings of goblins coming in and out. It is well out of the way of the old maps that the Dwarves had prior to the War of Dwarves and Dragons.
Settlements: Wazmakaghul, the Solitude of Labyrinths(Tier II)
Strength: Besides Sakldii being a lesser cold-drake with scholarly knowledge, the number is a thousand goblins and a thousand orcs

Name: Sakldii the Pale, the Scholar-Drake of Solitude, King in the Labyrinth
Race: Dragon/Cold-Drake
Appearance:

Role: King of Wazmakaghul and seeker of knowledge
Alignment: Independent/Himself DnD alignment is around neutral and lawful evil
History: Born inside the fortress from his dead mother, Skaldii was alone in a cruel world and as a cruel being. He did not care that he was alone but that he had no mother like normal drakes, or so he believed. Instead he had her corpse as food and the bones as a blanket with the hoard as a bedding. During his growth and sleep cycles he learned much about his home that he added every little scrape of knowledge that he could find in the ruins but only as a means to grow his own mind. Eventually all was exhausted and he was once again unfulfilled and went back to sleep.

Eventually his sleep was interrupted by goblins who settled in his lair and subjugated them into servitude for a time, dreaming of using them as a means of acquiring more wealth of treasure and knowledge for his hoard. However he also was dreaming of nation-hood, a kingdom in the mountains that can outshine the accomplishments of greater dragons like Smaug the Tyrant. Though deep inside he also wanted something a dragon never should cross the mind, companionship. Of course something as prideful as a dragon would ever admit that, even a lesser one such as he.

Despite the treasure of knowledge and coin being shipped as much his lair being restored in some fashion, the goblins had tested his patience. The infighting and constant incompetence eventually made him try to experiment on them. Then someone stole from his hoard. The entire goblin population paid the price as he ate those in his wrath and captured the survivors to experiment on in order to make them more suitable for his goals. During these times, the goblins served as a great basis for his growing need for magical knowledge and made more subtle changes to their minds.

This second attempt was more profitable as he built the goblins into something similar to what the Dark Lord did. They had come to worship the cold-drake as a deity and king of the hold, even making themselves organized in a fashion that wanted them to be. In a way, he had came to finally was able to accept these goblins as his own and his own dreams of an empire started to come to fruition. He taught them and led them as any true king should.

It was them who gave him his name and titles. In exchange, he gave them the caste and the Heralds, female goblins and orcs who were marked by oath to be his representative, caretaker, and agents of his law. This, coupled with the warchiefs that lead the charge in his name have allowed him to march outside of his lair. His is the bid for Middle Earth and to gather all the treasure and knowledge in the world.

Other: Skaldii has a caste of goblins and orcs called Heralds. These are female orcs and goblins that are his scholar assistants, caretakers, representatives, and agents of his rule in the Labyrinth. They are essentially overseers and internal managers of the kingdom. They make sure that everything is tip-top shape and efficient for the industry of the fortress. Many of them would oversee industrial sectors and the growing needs of housing and healthcare. They also are envoys when needing to diplomacy, which hasn't been needed but a Dragon never thinks short.

Skaldii also has a love for pipeweed and has had the goblins craft him a large pipe to smoke it. It is also grown or raided from other goblins or caravans for the dragon's favor and blessings. It is one of the few things that are grown outside in the mountains and, if contact with the outside world is worth it, could be traded outside of the usual tax.

Secretly, Skaldii wants a companion or at least a mother. His evil nature has twisted it to be a compulsion to want female caretakers around him. They are considered part of his hoard, which is why he has created the Heralds. They are also considered the most cuddled and spoiled of the caste, akin to nobles.

[Danceria]

I'm planning on being an Easterling exploration force, here to grab land and expand in the name of the King-In-The-East and Affably Evil Sauron.

Tre bien.

Hence why I am asking about how diplomatic I can be with the Northmen/Lakemen and the Dwarves of the Iron Hills, and the presence of Smaug and other Great-Drakes. Large roving bands of angry creatures make for poor farming, and farms mean slaves, and slaves are what Sauron wants. I was hoping to utilize a motley crew/play as the Empire from Total War Warhammer Fantasy-whereupon I as the "Lord-Protector of the Western Expanses" can recruit either:
1) Colonists from Rhun
2) Aforementioned Locals
3) Orcs and other fell creatures such as Wargs and/or Spooders from Mirkwood
With ensuing ties and events related to each "subfaction". Presuming the Lord-Protector doesn't die of dysentery while on the Dorwinion Trail. On the subject of Rhun, could I handwave the fact that many aristocrats of Rhun may have Avari blood in them, similar to the Edain in the West?

[G-Tech Corporation]

Realm: The Orcish Domains of the Misty Mountains
Leader: Chieftain Bolg of the North

This looks good, and so I am happy to accept it, with only minor revisions - Moria being too far south for direct control, I'm going to chop that off, and you can replace it with a Tier II settlement somewhere in the Grey Mountains near Gundabad - the Spitepeak, or some such idea.

As for numbers, we'll say, oh, forty thousand Goblins, five thousand Orcs, five thousand Wargs, and two dozen Cave Trolls.

Realm: Wazmakaghul, the Solitude of Labyrinths
Leader: Skaldii the Pale,the Sorcerer-Drake of Solitude and the King in the Labyrinth

Hm. I like the premise, but, again, a few minor revisions - magic, or enchantment, is relatively exclusively the domain of either those who came from Valinor or the Maia/Vala themselves. Dragons and drakes are creations of magic, certainly, but Tolkien never had them wielding ought aside from the dragon-spell itself, an inherent power to dominate the will of others. That should do well enough, alongside terror, to get Skaldii his kingdom - but the idea of Orcs wielding magic through their connection with him is a tough one to onboard, so I'd rather not.

The Labyrinth, itself, I'd put at a humble Tier II for now, and we'll say he has oh, a thousand Goblins and a thousand Orcs under his command. A formidable force, but not yet enough for open war with Mirkwood or the like.

Hence why I am asking about how diplomatic I can be with the Northmen/Lakemen and the Dwarves of the Iron Hills, and the presence of Smaug and other Great-Drakes. Large roving bands of angry creatures make for poor farming, and farms mean slaves, and slaves are what Sauron wants. I was hoping to utilize a motley crew/play as the Empire from Total War Warhammer Fantasy-whereupon I as the "Lord-Protector of the Western Expanses" can recruit either:
1) Colonists from Rhun
2) Aforementioned Locals
3) Orcs and other fell creatures such as Wargs and/or Spooders from Mirkwood
With ensuing ties and events related to each "subfaction". Presuming the Lord-Protector doesn't die of dysentery while on the Dorwinion Trail. On the subject of Rhun, could I handwave the fact that many aristocrats of Rhun may have Avari blood in them, similar to the Edain in the West?

Well, the Lakemen, at least, are known to trade with Dorwinion, which I think it is safe to say has at least some Avari characteristic on account of her name. Dwarves of the lineage of Durin would shun the men of Rhun, likely, for their allegiance to Sauron and the black folk that serve him, though not treat them with open hostility, and the Lakemen rely on trade with Mirkwood for their prosperity, and so are unlikely to traffic with someone who recruits Orcs/Wargs/etc.

I'm not saying diplomacy is impossible, since the gray men of Rhun are certainly more palatable allies to the Lakemen/Dwarves of the Iron Hills than Sauron himself - but making common cause with goblins from the Mountains of Rhun, or the power in the Grey Mountains, will likely see them refusing most overtures aside from those of extreme favor to their interests. Certainly building an alliance of Orcs and Dwarves will be all but impossible.

[Danceria]

Well, the Lakemen, at least, are known to trade with Dorwinion, which I think it is safe to say has at least some Avari characteristic on account of her name. Dwarves of the lineage of Durin would shun the men of Rhun, likely, for their allegiance to Sauron and the black folk that serve him, though not treat them with open hostility, and the Lakemen rely on trade with Mirkwood for their prosperity, and so are unlikely to traffic with someone who recruits Orcs/Wargs/etc.

I'm not saying diplomacy is impossible, since the gray men of Rhun are certainly more palatable allies to the Lakemen/Dwarves of the Iron Hills than Sauron himself - but making common cause with goblins from the Mountains of Rhun, or the power in the Grey Mountains, will likely see them refusing most overtures aside from those of extreme favor to their interests. Certainly building an alliance of Orcs and Dwarves will be all but impossible.

I see, and it's very unlikely that the Easterlings would conscript Orcs or mingle with them, unless demanded by the Dark Lord. The Men and Dwarves of the region may find an "enemy of my enemy is my friend" relationship, when and if the Drakes in the Lonely and Grey Mountains make their moves...