1906: Alternative Divergence [AH][OOC-CLOSED]

[The Baton Rouge Free State]

well in switzerland there are kind of multiple subcultures which is why it never fully became a republic its still a confederacy style system, where the cantons hold more power than the central government. But I would be looking for a smaller area where there are several subcultures/closely related cultures that could work together in a confederal system

Hmm. The area in Central/Eastern Europe that is still blank does have a lot of cultures, but they're not all closely related. You'd have Hungarians, Romanians, Ruthenians, Slovenians, Serbs, and Poles. Other than that I'm not really sure.

Mexico could potentially have natives, Spanish, and immigrants. Alternatively the Midwest might have natives and a lot of immigrants and it would be smaller, but it would be in a near impossible position, between the much larger Busang and the revolutionary states of Eastern America.

Originally I was thinking Hawaii could fit the dynamic but its size and location makes it irrelevant so that was struck. I've been think of maybe Senegal and The Gambia, but I'm not entirely sure about the current situation of the region ICly.

[Tracian Empire]

Hmm. The area in Central/Eastern Europe that is still blank does have a lot of cultures, but they're not all closely related. You'd have Hungarians, Romanians, Ruthenians, Slovenians, Serbs, and Poles. Other than that I'm not really sure.

Mexico could potentially have natives, Spanish, and immigrants. Alternatively the Midwest might have natives and a lot of immigrants and it would be smaller, but it would be in a near impossible position, between the much larger Busang and the revolutionary states of Eastern America.

Originally I was thinking Hawaii could fit the dynamic but its size and location makes it irrelevant so that was struck. I've been think of maybe Senegal and The Gambia, but I'm not entirely sure about the current situation of the region ICly.

Well, would the Hawaii have several subcultures to begin with? I'm not familiar with the area.

Senegal and the Gambia might work, but direct democracy on the Swiss model might be more difficult to explain in a not-European area, so perhaps if you want to go for Africa, you could focus on some tribal traditions as the origins of the system.

[The Baton Rouge Free State]

Originally I was thinking Hawaii could fit the dynamic but its size and location makes it irrelevant so that was struck. I've been think of maybe Senegal and The Gambia, but I'm not entirely sure about the current situation of the region ICly.

Well, would the Hawaii have several subcultures to begin with? I'm not familiar with the area.

Senegal and the Gambia might work, but direct democracy on the Swiss model might be more difficult to explain in a not-European area, so perhaps if you want to go for Africa, you could focus on some tribal traditions as the origins of the system.

Yah with Hawaii until King Kamehameha united the islands they all had separate subcultures and even their own dialects of the hawaiian language. I'll keep looking into Senegal for now tho. Perhaps some other locations might present themselves.

[Pasong Tirad]

Hmm. The area in Central/Eastern Europe that is still blank does have a lot of cultures, but they're not all closely related. You'd have Hungarians, Romanians, Ruthenians, Slovenians, Serbs, and Poles. Other than that I'm not really sure.

Mexico could potentially have natives, Spanish, and immigrants. Alternatively the Midwest might have natives and a lot of immigrants and it would be smaller, but it would be in a near impossible position, between the much larger Busang and the revolutionary states of Eastern America.

Originally I was thinking Hawaii could fit the dynamic but its size and location makes it irrelevant so that was struck. I've been think of maybe Senegal and The Gambia, but I'm not entirely sure about the current situation of the region ICly.

Might I suggest Spain, then? You've got the Castilians, Catalans, Basque, Galicians, Andalucians, etc. Given your idea of how the Swiss confederal system began, it might work.

[Pasong Tirad]

-snip-

I must say I'm a fan of those maps you've made.

I live for maps.

[The Baton Rouge Free State]

Originally I was thinking Hawaii could fit the dynamic but its size and location makes it irrelevant so that was struck. I've been think of maybe Senegal and The Gambia, but I'm not entirely sure about the current situation of the region ICly.

Might I suggest Spain, then? You've got the Castilians, Catalans, Basque, Galicians, Andalucians, etc. Given your idea of how the Swiss confederal system began, it might work.

I was thinking about it, but idk it seems to big and I'm more of looking for a smaller nation for this go around.

[Tracian Empire]

I must say I'm a fan of those maps you've made.

I live for maps.

Yeah, I have to say, I love the maps too xD

And the concept too of course, seeing Ethiopia is always interesting

[Tracian Empire]

(Image)

Full Nation Name : Most Serene Imperial States of Korea (대한제국)

As always, Korea is an incredibly interesting concept, accepted!

Historical details with the neighboring nations can of course be discussed later xD

[Oscalantine]

(Image)

Full Nation Name : Most Serene Imperial States of Korea (대한제국)

As always, Korea is an incredibly interesting concept, accepted!

Historical details with the neighboring nations can of course be discussed later xD

Thanks! I will definitely need to revisit my history, especially early ones with previous Japanese player and give a more general overview.

... that and how I managed to conquer my way through Sultanate of Malacca. Speaking of, I remember hearing that Islam wasnt a thing in Southeast. Did I hear that right?

[Tracian Empire]

As always, Korea is an incredibly interesting concept, accepted!

Historical details with the neighboring nations can of course be discussed later xD

Thanks! I will definitely need to revisit my history, especially early ones with previous Japanese player and give a more general overview.

... that and how I managed to conquer my way through Sultanate of Malacca. Speaking of, I remember hearing that Islam wasnt a thing in Southeast. Did I hear that right?

It wasn't a big thing there, yeah. It still could have reached it, but without the same level of thread, it probably never managed to gain the position it had IRL.

[Pyrghium]

Full Nation Name : Gallic Empire
Majority/Official Culture : Latin
Territorial Core : France, Spain
Territorial Claim : [[OPTIONAL]]
Capital City : Lugdunum (Lyons)
Population : 20 million

Government Type : Absolute Monarchy
Government Ideology/Policies : [[OPTIONAL]] [[Militant, Imperialist, Expansionist, etc.]]
Government Focus : Economy
Head of State : Emperor Valentinian XIV (ruled: 1853 AD - Present)
Head of Government : Emperor Valentinian XIV, Co-Emperor Theodosius VIII (ruled: 1896 AD - Present)
Government Description : WIP

Majority/State Religion : Latin Chalcedonian Christianity
Religious Description : [[OPTIONAL]]

Economic Ideologies : Mercantilism
Major Production : Iron, Coal, Manufactured Goods, Olive oil, Wine
Economic Description :

Development: [Modern, Semi-Industrialized, or Primitive]
Development Description : [Explain further why your nation is in one of the above categories]

Army Description : [[Describe your nation's army in as much detail as you can]]
Army Weakness :
Naval Description : [[Describe your nation's navy in as much detail as you can]]
Naval Weakness :
Further Military Description : [[OPTIONAL]]

National Goals :
National Issues : [[what needs to be fixed in order for your nation to achieve its true potential]]
National Figures of Interest : [[OPTIONAL]] [[Are there any Mother Teresas or Moses that we need to know about?]]
National Ambition/Aspirations : [[OPTIONAL]] [[Not really a set objective, but rather the big picture that your nation is drawing towards]]

History :

In 476 AD, Syagrius, the Roman Dux of Gaul, proclaimed himself Emperor after hearing of the deposition of Romulus Augustulus at the hands of the Ostrogothic King Odoacre. However, this declaration was not well-received by either the Ostrogoths, or the Eastern Roman Emperor Zeno, in Constantinople; however, due to the geographical distance, the only confrontation between Sygrianus and the others, was a war of words and letter-writing.

From his capital at Lutetia (Paris), Emperor Syagrius I (ruled: 476 AD - 513 AD) had other more pressing problems: the Germanic kingdoms who had set themselves up in what was formerly Roman Gaul - these being the Franks, Visigoths, and Burgundians, respectively. In 486 AD, Clovis, King of the Franks met Syagrius on the field of battle, seeking to destroy Syagrius and his Roman State and seeking to expunge the last bastion of Romanity in the West. However, it seems God had other plans, for Clovis was slain on the field of battle, and the Romans won a decisive victory over the Franks. Emperor Syagrius followed this up by conquering the Franks, and adding them to his realm. This so intimidated the Visigoths, that the Visigoth King Alaric II recognized Syagrius as “Western Roman Emperor”, and gave his daughter, Aelina in marriage to Syagrius. In 491, Syagrius and his Empress had a son and heir, Valentinian. With there being peace for the time being, Emperor Syagrius turned to the organization of his Empire. He decided to integrate the barbarian (especially Frankish) chieftains in his domains, and so he named them all Senators and invited them to have their sons educated in Classical Roman learning, to that end, he sent for teachers from Italy and Constantinople, so that the chieftains’ sons might learn Latin and become more Romanized. In 507 AD, King Alaric II of the Visigoths died, and his sons began to squabble for the throne. Empress Aelina was able to win over some of the Visigoth nobles, especially those in Aquitaine to proclaim her son, Valentinian as “King of the Visigoths”. In return for this, they too, were named Senators, and as a result of this, Aquitaine would also be added to the Roman realm, when Valentinian would succeed his father. Emperor Syagrius also entered into alliance with Gundobad, King of the Burgundians, and arranged a marriage with the Burgundian King’s daughter, Blanche (Bianca), in 506 AD. In 513 AD, Syagrius passed away after having ruled for 37 years.

After this, Valentinian became Emperor (ruled: 513 AD - 556 AD). Almost immediately after this, Valentinian and his wife, Blanche had their first son, Augustine, in 514 AD. Wanting her son to also rule over Burgundy, after her father’s death, Blanche arranged the assassination of her elder brother, Sigismund on a hunting trip. This was followed by the mysterious death of her other brother, Godomar, and finally, the natural death of her father, King Gundobad, in 516 AD. After this, Blanche saw to it, that her son Augustine was named King of the Burgundians. Valentinian continued the Latinization policies of his fathers among the Franks, and began to apply the same policies among the Visigoths. This did not sit well with some of the chieftains/Senators, who, in 521, wrote letters to Alamaric King of the Visigoths in Spain to come into Aquitaine and “free his people from the Roman Yoke”. However, these letters did not ever reach Alamaric, as Empress Blanche’s spies intercepted these dispatches and killed the messengers before they even reached the Pyrenees. Meanwhile, the Empress invited the treacherous Visigoth chieftains/Senators to her villa in Soissons for a dinner, and there, poisoned them all.

In 522, the Franks rose up against Emperor Valentinian, who marched against them with his own armies, plus those allied forces of the Visigoths and Burgundians; he was able to quash the revolt in 4 years, and resume his reign over them. After this, Valentinian began to centralize his realm in Aquitaine and Salian Francia, creating a centralized bureaucracy and army, and bypassing the local chiefs more and more. This centralization process produced several more revolts between 530 - 545 AD, but the Emperor was able to crush almost all of them. In 536 AD, Eastern Roman general Belisarius conquered Rome and was named Caesar of the West by Emperor Justinian. Emperor Valentinian sent a delegation to Constantinople congratulating Justinian on his victory, sending him gifts and money, and requesting that he be recognized as Western Roman Emperor. Justinian refused this, and insisted that Valentinian was at best “Emperor of Gaul, and King of the Goths”. This infuriated Valentinian who vowed to someday have his vengeance, when the time was right. Alas, Valentinian was forced to put aside this for awhile, by several more revolts from the Franks, and a botched invasion by the Alamanni. In 556, some 20 years after Belisarius took Rome, Emperor Valentinian invaded Italy with his army intent on taking Rome. Alas, while besieging Turin, Valentinian suddenly and unexpectedly died (some say he was poisoned by an Eastern Roman spy who infiltrated the camp as a servant), after having reigned 43 years.

After this, Valentinian was succeeded by his son Augustine (ruled: 556 AD - 601 AD), who was named Emperor by the Senators (chieftains) and commanders in the camp outside Turin. Augustine unlike his father, had no desire to fight Belisarius and the Eastern Romans, so he sent a delegation to them, asking for peace, he paid them off, and promptly returned to Lutetia (Paris). In 558, he married Irene, a niece of Belisarius, so as to have good relations with the Caesar of the West. Augustine was at this time, King of the Visigoths (in Aquitaine) and King of the Burgundians. In 559, he officially abolished these titles, and instead administered the lands of the Visigoths and Burgundians as direct territories of the Empire. In 560, he and his wife, Irene gave birth to a son, Sergius. Augustine was interested in opening up trade with the East, and as, at this time, there was relative peace in Gaul, this was possible, and the local economy began to boom. This was good for Augustine’s desired policy of civilizing the Visigoth, Frankish, and Burgundian peoples, to make them more “Roman”. The Emperor also built churches and schools, throughout his realm, and his reign was generally remembered as a small “Golden Age”. In 601, Augustine reposed, after a 45 year reign.

After this, Sergius succeeded his father as Emperor (ruled: 601 AD), however, his reign was very short, for he was murdered by a conspiracy of Senators, and replaced by his mentally handicapped son, Syagrius, who reigned as Syagrius II (ruled: 601 AD - 624 AD).

This ushered in the period known as the “Rule of the Senators” (601 AD - 713 AD) wherein the Senate, comprised of the landed aristocracy (the descendants of the chieftains), and powerful bureaucrats and the military handled the affairs of state, while the Emperors were mere figure heads. This period was characterized by a lot of civil war and infighting between the various senators and a great deal of corruption. However, after the fall of the Visigoth Kingdom in Spain to the Islamic forces, this pushed for a particular faction of the military to once again desire for strong central leadership. In 713, a commander Argoboald, seized control of the capital, Lutetia, and deposed the Regency of Empress Claudine (ruled: 699 AD - 713 AD), which served as a puppet regime for the senatorial elites, elevating Emperor Syagrius VII (ruled: 699 AD - 729 AD) to his proper powers. Argoboald was named as his Chief Minister, and he spent the next 15 years, quashing the senatorial oligarchs, and recentralizing power in the Emperor’s hands.

After this, there was a period of relative peace and strength in the Empire. Emperor Honorian (ruled: 729 AD - 775 AD) defeated an attempted Arab invasion of Gaul at the Battle of Tours, in 732, and conquered the weakening Alamanni Kingdom once and for all. Emperor Valentinian III (ruled: 775 AD - 789 AD) managed to establish an official alliance with the Western and Eastern Roman Empires (with the Empire in Gaul agreeing to be henceforth called “the Roman Empire in Gaul” or shorthand, the Gallic Empire), and Emperor Claude (ruled: 805 AD - 851 AD) presided over a period of profound peace and economic prosperity. However, this was followed by the Viking invasions, beginning in the 880s.

At first, the Emperors were able to buy off the Vikings to leave them alone, but by 930, it was clear the Norsemen were not going anywhere, as they had established the Duchy of Normandy in the north of France. The Emperors gradually warmed up to this by buying the loyalty of the Norman Dukes, and intermarrying with them, such that by the 1000s, the Norman Duchy had been effectively integrated into the Empire.

WIP

RP Sample: [[Either a link to a past post, or an example written right here.]]

#AltDiv (do not delete this, it's for keeping track of the apps)

WIP

[Tracian Empire]

Full Nation Name : Gallic Empire
Majority/Official Culture : Latin
Territorial Core : France, Spain
Territorial Claim : [[OPTIONAL]]
Capital City : Lugdunum (Lyons)
Population : 20 million

Government Type : Absolute Monarchy
Government Ideology/Policies : [[OPTIONAL]] [[Militant, Imperialist, Expansionist, etc.]]
Government Focus : Economy
Head of State : Emperor Valentinian XIV (ruled: 1853 AD - Present)
Head of Government : Emperor Valentinian XIV, Co-Emperor Theodosius VIII (ruled: 1896 AD - Present)
Government Description : WIP

Majority/State Religion : Latin Chalcedonian Christianity
Religious Description : [[OPTIONAL]]

Economic Ideologies : Mercantilism
Major Production : Iron, Coal, Manufactured Goods, Olive oil, Wine
Economic Description :

Development: [Modern, Semi-Industrialized, or Primitive]
Development Description : [Explain further why your nation is in one of the above categories]

Army Description : [[Describe your nation's army in as much detail as you can]]
Army Weakness :
Naval Description : [[Describe your nation's navy in as much detail as you can]]
Naval Weakness :
Further Military Description : [[OPTIONAL]]

National Goals :
National Issues : [[what needs to be fixed in order for your nation to achieve its true potential]]
National Figures of Interest : [[OPTIONAL]] [[Are there any Mother Teresas or Moses that we need to know about?]]
National Ambition/Aspirations : [[OPTIONAL]] [[Not really a set objective, but rather the big picture that your nation is drawing towards]]

History : [[Can be in paragraph or bulletpoint timeline.]]
RP Sample: [[Either a link to a past post, or an example written right here.]]

#AltDiv (do not delete this, it's for keeping track of the apps)

WIP

Rejected. You can't claim both France and Spain, and it would be realistically impossible for Latin to be a country's language in 1906.

[Pyrghium]

Full Nation Name : Gallic Empire
Majority/Official Culture : Latin
Territorial Core : France, Spain
Territorial Claim : [[OPTIONAL]]
Capital City : Lugdunum (Lyons)
Population : 20 million

Government Type : Absolute Monarchy
Government Ideology/Policies : [[OPTIONAL]] [[Militant, Imperialist, Expansionist, etc.]]
Government Focus : Economy
Head of State : Emperor Valentinian XIV (ruled: 1853 AD - Present)
Head of Government : Emperor Valentinian XIV, Co-Emperor Theodosius VIII (ruled: 1896 AD - Present)
Government Description : WIP

Majority/State Religion : Latin Chalcedonian Christianity
Religious Description : [[OPTIONAL]]

Economic Ideologies : Mercantilism
Major Production : Iron, Coal, Manufactured Goods, Olive oil, Wine
Economic Description :

Development: [Modern, Semi-Industrialized, or Primitive]
Development Description : [Explain further why your nation is in one of the above categories]

Army Description : [[Describe your nation's army in as much detail as you can]]
Army Weakness :
Naval Description : [[Describe your nation's navy in as much detail as you can]]
Naval Weakness :
Further Military Description : [[OPTIONAL]]

National Goals :
National Issues : [[what needs to be fixed in order for your nation to achieve its true potential]]
National Figures of Interest : [[OPTIONAL]] [[Are there any Mother Teresas or Moses that we need to know about?]]
National Ambition/Aspirations : [[OPTIONAL]] [[Not really a set objective, but rather the big picture that your nation is drawing towards]]

History : [[Can be in paragraph or bulletpoint timeline.]]
RP Sample: [[Either a link to a past post, or an example written right here.]]

#AltDiv (do not delete this, it's for keeping track of the apps)

WIP

Rejected. You can't claim both France and Spain, and it would be realistically impossible for Latin to be a country's language in 1906.

Could I claim France (Gaul) then, and have it be a breakaway Exarchate of the other Roman Empires?

[Tracian Empire]

Rejected. You can't claim both France and Spain, and it would be realistically impossible for Latin to be a country's language in 1906.

Could I claim France (Gaul) then, and have it be a breakaway Exarchate of the other Roman Empires?

I'm not sure what to say to be honest. It would be the third instance of a similar concept (Romans surviving), and from the fact that you've used Latin as your language, including classical Latin names and cities, I'm not sure that you understand how such a concept would happen. Languages evolve and change, even such a France would certainly not be using classical Latin anymore.

[Pyrghium]

Could I claim France (Gaul) then, and have it be a breakaway Exarchate of the other Roman Empires?

I'm not sure what to say to be honest. It would be the third instance of a similar concept (Romans surviving), and from the fact that you've used Latin as your language, including classical Latin names and cities, I'm not sure that you understand how such a concept would happen. Languages evolve and change, even such a France would certainly not be using classical Latin anymore.

Fair point, and realistically, a “Roman France” would be more a mix of Roman and Germanic influences, no? Could I do something like that? Maybe a rogue Exarch of Gaul breaks with the Western Roman Empire and proclaims himself Emperor in Gaul? I guess that would depend on what happened to the Western Roman Empire?

[Tracian Empire]

I'm not sure what to say to be honest. It would be the third instance of a similar concept (Romans surviving), and from the fact that you've used Latin as your language, including classical Latin names and cities, I'm not sure that you understand how such a concept would happen. Languages evolve and change, even such a France would certainly not be using classical Latin anymore.

Fair point, and realistically, a “Roman France” would be more a mix of Roman and Germanic influences, no? Could I do something like that? Maybe a rogue Exarch of Gaul breaks with the Western Roman Empire and proclaims himself Emperor in Gaul? I guess that would depend on what happened to the Western Roman Empire?

I mean, this opens a lot of questions.

The WRE fell as it did in real life, but during the Justinian reconquest, Belisarius was granted the title of Caesar of the West by Justinian, which practically led to the revival of the Western imperial title which had died with Julius Nepos/Romulus Augustulus, albeit in a form that was subordinated to Constantinople, whose emperors retained both the higher title of Augustus and the title of Caesar. Belisarius remained in Italy, and lived longer than in real life, managing to repel the Lombard invasion of Italy. So the WRE continued to exist, initially organized as an Exarchate and eventually becoming de facto independent as the ERE nearly collapsed like in real life.

So the WRE has become its own thing in time, being Italo-Dalmatian and having its own culture.

How would Gaul have remained Roman? Why would a province like that retain a Roman identity and claim the imperial title with no legitimacy even after breaking away?

I'm not completely opposed to the idea, but seeing as we already have two Roman Empires around, having a third one might be a bit too much, unless you find some ways to make your concept more original.

[Pyrghium]

Post Deleted.

[Pyrghium]

Fair point, and realistically, a “Roman France” would be more a mix of Roman and Germanic influences, no? Could I do something like that? Maybe a rogue Exarch of Gaul breaks with the Western Roman Empire and proclaims himself Emperor in Gaul? I guess that would depend on what happened to the Western Roman Empire?

I mean, this opens a lot of questions.

The WRE fell as it did in real life, but during the Justinian reconquest, Belisarius was granted the title of Caesar of the West by Justinian, which practically led to the revival of the Western imperial title which had died with Julius Nepos/Romulus Augustulus, albeit in a form that was subordinated to Constantinople, whose emperors retained both the higher title of Augustus and the title of Caesar. Belisarius remained in Italy, and lived longer than in real life, managing to repel the Lombard invasion of Italy. So the WRE continued to exist, initially organized as an Exarchate and eventually becoming de facto independent as the ERE nearly collapsed like in real life.

So the WRE has become its own thing in time, being Italo-Dalmatian and having its own culture.

How would Gaul have remained Roman? Why would a province like that retain a Roman identity and claim the imperial title with no legitimacy even after breaking away?

I'm not completely opposed to the idea, but seeing as we already have two Roman Empires around, having a third one might be a bit too much, unless you find some ways to make your concept more original.

Perhaps after the Ostrogoths depose Romulus Augustulus as Western Roman Emperor, he flees to the Franks, and marries the daughter of the King, who crowns him “Emperor” and wishes to use him as a puppet to oust the Ostrogoths. This falls through, in that the Franks, never retake Italy from the Ostrogoths, but the “Gallic Empire” is born of this, with the “Emperors” being descended from Romulus Augustulus, and the “Senate” being comprised of the Frankish chieftains/nobles. Does that seem like it could make sense?

That way, the Gallic Emperors can claim descent from the Roman Empire, and Gaul is basically Frankish with a Roman veneer, and Roman Emperors.

[Tracian Empire]

I'm not sure what to say to be honest. It would be the third instance of a similar concept (Romans surviving), and from the fact that you've used Latin as your language, including classical Latin names and cities, I'm not sure that you understand how such a concept would happen. Languages evolve and change, even such a France would certainly not be using classical Latin anymore.

Or perhaps after the Ostrogoths depose Romulus Augustulus as Western Roman Emperor, he flees to the Franks, and marries the daughter of the King, who crowns him “Emperor” and wishes to use him as a puppet to oust the Ostrogoths. This falls through, in that the Franks, never retake Italy from the Ostrogoths, but the “Gallic Empire” is born of this, with the “Emperors” being descended from Romulus Augustulus, and the “Senate” being comprised of the Frankish chieftains/nobles. Does that seem like it could make sense?

Hmm, I'm afraid that concept is a bit too simplistic. Besides from the fact that Romulus Augustulus was deposed by Odoacer and not by the Ostrogoths, him fleeing to the Franks and marrying there is still very complicated. How would he have managed to get through all those barbarian lands? Why go to the Franks especially, when he could have tried to escape to the ERE, or to one of Odoacer's neighbors, the Burgundians or the Alamanni? How would the Franks have even tried to take Italy from the Ostrogoths, since in real life they only absorbed the Burgundians a century later? Why would the Franks, enemies of the Romans, who would in real life go on to destroy the Roman rump state of Syargius, try to claim the imperial title and emulate the empire?

[Pyrghium]

Or perhaps after the Ostrogoths depose Romulus Augustulus as Western Roman Emperor, he flees to the Franks, and marries the daughter of the King, who crowns him “Emperor” and wishes to use him as a puppet to oust the Ostrogoths. This falls through, in that the Franks, never retake Italy from the Ostrogoths, but the “Gallic Empire” is born of this, with the “Emperors” being descended from Romulus Augustulus, and the “Senate” being comprised of the Frankish chieftains/nobles. Does that seem like it could make sense?

Hmm, I'm afraid that concept is a bit too simplistic. Besides from the fact that Romulus Augustulus was deposed by Odoacer and not by the Ostrogoths, him fleeing to the Franks and marrying there is still very complicated. How would he have managed to get through all those barbarian lands? Why go to the Franks especially, when he could have tried to escape to the ERE, or to one of Odoacer's neighbors, the Burgundians or the Alamanni? How would the Franks have even tried to take Italy from the Ostrogoths, since in real life they only absorbed the Burgundians a century later? Why would the Franks, enemies of the Romans, who would in real life go on to destroy the Roman rump state of Syargius, try to claim the imperial title and emulate the empire?

Because maybe it could give Clovis (the first King of the Franks, the one who conquered Syagrius’ rump state) legitimacy to attempt to rule over all of Gaul, and perhaps Romulus went to Constantinople, but Zeno wasn’t interested in restoring him to his throne. This could serve to make the Gallic Empire the “black sheep” of the Roman Empires.

Or maybe it would make more sense for Romulus to flee to the Burgundians, and they could become the dominant power rather than the Franks?

[The Palmetto]

Reservation

Nation Name: South Africa (will make a unique one based off whatever language I pick)
Territory: South Africa, Namibia, Botswana, Lesotho, eSwatini
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*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP board reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.

Just doing something simple: what might of been some countries which colonized South Africa? For whatever reason, I'm thinking Protestant Frenchies could be interesting, though I'll work with whatever makes sense.

[Tracian Empire]

Hmm, I'm afraid that concept is a bit too simplistic. Besides from the fact that Romulus Augustulus was deposed by Odoacer and not by the Ostrogoths, him fleeing to the Franks and marrying there is still very complicated. How would he have managed to get through all those barbarian lands? Why go to the Franks especially, when he could have tried to escape to the ERE, or to one of Odoacer's neighbors, the Burgundians or the Alamanni? How would the Franks have even tried to take Italy from the Ostrogoths, since in real life they only absorbed the Burgundians a century later? Why would the Franks, enemies of the Romans, who would in real life go on to destroy the Roman rump state of Syargius, try to claim the imperial title and emulate the empire?

Because maybe it could give Clovis (the first King of the Franks, the one who conquered Syagrius’ rump state) legitimacy to attempt to rule over all of Gaul, and perhaps Romulus went to Constantinople, but Zeno wasn’t interested in restoring him to his throne. This could serve to make the Gallic Empire the “black sheep” of the Roman Empires.

Or maybe it would make more sense for Romulus to flee to the Burgundians, and they could become the dominant power rather than the Franks?

Maybe, but it could have led to the other barbarian states forming a coalition against him, and even then, it would hardly explain why the Franks would continue the claim. This was after all, just a century or so after the Franks had rebelled against the Romans, I don't think that the Frankish population would have ever adopted the Roman identity in that context.

If he would have escaped to Constantinople, Zeno would have most certainly not supported his claim - Zeno's initial intention was to support Julius Nepos to begin with, and only agreed to the request of the Senate and Odoacer as a fait accompli.

But Romulus at the time was a 16 year old boy who had only ruled as a puppet of his father. It's a bit difficult to believe that he could have returned to Constantinople and then went back to Gallia.

And he could have maybe went to the Burgundians, but the issue is the same. I don't think that adopting the title would have been accepted by the tribes, and even then - this title would be devoid of legitimacy. Romulus was mercilessly mocked as Augustulus in real life too, and abandoning Rome would have probably ruined his reputation just as much as surrendering to Odoacer did. And even if we assume that he would have been welcomed by Clovis, that just opens a lot of questions. How would his children have become the heirs to the Frankish realm too? Even if we assume that Clovis would have given one of his daughters for him to marry, the Franks had their very weird system of inheritance which divided the kingdom between the sons of the last King - the children of Romulus would be born on the martilineal line. And even if we assume that Romulus would have been granted a territory, who would have paid heed to that imperial title? Simple descendence from an Emperor was never enough in terms of legitimacy. This realm would have never controlled Rome, and would have never had the acceptance of either of the ERE or the WRE. Which would make it the black sheep, but would also render its imperial title kinda useless.

A more realistic point of divergence would be to work on from Syargius, but even then, like i said - we already have two Roman Empires, so your idea would have to be pretty unique and well made.

[Tracian Empire]

Reservation

Nation Name: South Africa (will make a unique one based off whatever language I pick)
Territory: South Africa, Namibia, Botswana, Lesotho, eSwatini
#AltDiv (do not delete this, it's for keeping track of the apps)
*Note: Reservations will last for 48 hours. The OP board reserves the right to be subjective in regards to accepting and removing reservations.

Just doing something simple: what might of been some countries which colonized South Africa? For whatever reason, I'm thinking Protestant Frenchies could be interesting, though I'll work with whatever makes sense.

Well, we're not yet sure what would happen to France and whether it would be Protestant or not

[Pyrghium]

Because maybe it could give Clovis (the first King of the Franks, the one who conquered Syagrius’ rump state) legitimacy to attempt to rule over all of Gaul, and perhaps Romulus went to Constantinople, but Zeno wasn’t interested in restoring him to his throne. This could serve to make the Gallic Empire the “black sheep” of the Roman Empires.

Or maybe it would make more sense for Romulus to flee to the Burgundians, and they could become the dominant power rather than the Franks?

Maybe, but it could have led to the other barbarian states forming a coalition against him, and even then, it would hardly explain why the Franks would continue the claim. This was after all, just a century or so after the Franks had rebelled against the Romans, I don't think that the Frankish population would have ever adopted the Roman identity in that context.

If he would have escaped to Constantinople, Zeno would have most certainly not supported his claim - Zeno's initial intention was to support Julius Nepos to begin with, and only agreed to the request of the Senate and Odoacer as a fait accompli.

But Romulus at the time was a 16 year old boy who had only ruled as a puppet of his father. It's a bit difficult to believe that he could have returned to Constantinople and then went back to Gallia.

And he could have maybe went to the Burgundians, but the issue is the same. I don't think that adopting the title would have been accepted by the tribes, and even then - this title would be devoid of legitimacy. Romulus was mercilessly mocked as Augustulus in real life too, and abandoning Rome would have probably ruined his reputation just as much as surrendering to Odoacer did. And even if we assume that he would have been welcomed by Clovis, that just opens a lot of questions. How would his children have become the heirs to the Frankish realm too? Even if we assume that Clovis would have given one of his daughters for him to marry, the Franks had their very weird system of inheritance which divided the kingdom between the sons of the last King - the children of Romulus would be born on the martilineal line. And even if we assume that Romulus would have been granted a territory, who would have paid heed to that imperial title? Simple descendence from an Emperor was never enough in terms of legitimacy. This realm would have never controlled Rome, and would have never had the acceptance of either of the ERE or the WRE. Which would make it the black sheep, but would also render its imperial title kinda useless.

A more realistic point of divergence would be to work on from Syargius, but even then, like i said - we already have two Roman Empires, so your idea would have to be pretty unique and well made.

Could Syagrius have conceivably defeated the Franks, and could he have crowned himself Emperor of the Western Roman Empire after 476?

[Plzen]

Just doing something simple: what might of been some countries which colonized South Africa? For whatever reason, I'm thinking Protestant Frenchies could be interesting, though I'll work with whatever makes sense.

If nothing else, Scandinavia plausibly might have. This would involve initial colonisation sometime in the early 1600s and independence probably in the mid-to-late 1700s. We weren't as heavy a settler nation as Britain was IRL, so it would mean a more prominent native African presence than South Africa IRL.

That's an option, if you wish.