New Civilizations (2nd Era, OOC, Always Open )

[Joohan]

Maybe we have to have an Ulster Arbiter?

Oh no need for that. Antrim is solidly under Irish control.

In the future I may be willing to sell Wight for border cleanup purposes though

I was gonna say, you having the isle of wight just makes the map look... ewww...

Working on my post now. We should have it so the Treaty of Snowdonia get's formalized. I'm looking to have the wiki up by tomorrow. In my current post, I'm writing like my continental colonies, though technically sworn to service, are effectively under the jurisdiction of the WEC - and so in at least Callion Fair, a few Hibernians are going to be present.

Hope that is alright with you.

[Bortslovakia]

Oh no need for that. Antrim is solidly under Irish control.

In the future I may be willing to sell Wight for border cleanup purposes though

I was gonna say, you having the isle of wight just makes the map look... ewww...

Working on my post now. We should have it so the Treaty of Snowdonia get's formalized. I'm looking to have the wiki up by tomorrow. In my current post, I'm writing like my continental colonies, though technically sworn to service, are effectively under the jurisdiction of the WEC - and so in at least Callion Fair, a few Hibernians are going to be present.

Hope that is alright with you.

Sounds fine. Mind you one of the diplomatic lessons our folk have been teaching yours is that when dealing with new groups, you can never look like the bad guy. So the WEC is less "We'll be taking those resources please" and more "Howdy friends! We've got some shiny duds to trade, and it just so happens we're the only group that can compete in this market because we massively undercut our rivals! It's good for the both of us!"

The goal isn't exploitation, as we lack the tech to do imperialism properly anyway.

[Joohan]

I was gonna say, you having the isle of wight just makes the map look... ewww...

Working on my post now. We should have it so the Treaty of Snowdonia get's formalized. I'm looking to have the wiki up by tomorrow. In my current post, I'm writing like my continental colonies, though technically sworn to service, are effectively under the jurisdiction of the WEC - and so in at least Callion Fair, a few Hibernians are going to be present.

Hope that is alright with you.

Sounds fine. Mind you one of the diplomatic lessons our folk have been teaching yours is that when dealing with new groups, you can never look like the bad guy. So the WEC is less "We'll be taking those resources please" and more "Howdy friends! We've got some shiny duds to trade, and it just so happens we're the only group that can compete in this market because we massively undercut our rivals! It's good for the both of us!"

The goal isn't exploitation, as we lack the tech to do imperialism properly anyway.

Yeah yeah yeah, we're trying to chill out. Ever since the Imperial invasion, we've put a velvet glove over that iron fist. No more exterminations or expansion through fear. Just being neighborly and amicable to the continental tribes we come into contact with.

[Orostan]

Sounds fine. Mind you one of the diplomatic lessons our folk have been teaching yours is that when dealing with new groups, you can never look like the bad guy. So the WEC is less "We'll be taking those resources please" and more "Howdy friends! We've got some shiny duds to trade, and it just so happens we're the only group that can compete in this market because we massively undercut our rivals! It's good for the both of us!"

The goal isn't exploitation, as we lack the tech to do imperialism properly anyway.

Yeah yeah yeah, we're trying to chill out. Ever since the Imperial invasion, we've put a velvet glove over that iron fist. No more exterminations or expansion through fear. Just being neighborly and amicable to the continental tribes we come into contact with.

I wonder what those people you conquered will do once I introduce communism to them.

[Joohan]

Yeah yeah yeah, we're trying to chill out. Ever since the Imperial invasion, we've put a velvet glove over that iron fist. No more exterminations or expansion through fear. Just being neighborly and amicable to the continental tribes we come into contact with.

I wonder what those people you conquered will do once I introduce communism to them.

I'm sorry who are you?

[Orostan]

I wonder what those people you conquered will do once I introduce communism to them.

I'm sorry who are you?

a spectre soon to be haunting a europe near you

[Joohan]

I'm sorry who are you?

a spectre soon to be haunting a europe near you

Oh my gosh... you're like the commonwealth, but less serious... and Muwkeime, but with less personality.

I'm quaking in my baby seal leather boots

[Orostan]

a spectre soon to be haunting a europe near you

Oh my gosh... you're like the commonwealth, but less serious... and Muwkeime, but with less personality.

I'm quaking in my baby seal leather boots

But I'm China so I have an enormous number of people.

[Guuj Xaat Kil]

Oh my gosh... you're like the commonwealth, but less serious... and Muwkeime, but with less personality.

I'm quaking in my baby seal leather boots

But I'm China so I have an enormous number of people.

Laughter stops when you realize they're not stopping.

[Orostan]

But I'm China so I have an enormous number of people.

Laughter stops when you realize they're not stopping.

>tfw you lose half of your men in the tarim basin so the Emperor gives you twice as many men for next time

[Joohan]

Oh my gosh... you're like the commonwealth, but less serious... and Muwkeime, but with less personality.

I'm quaking in my baby seal leather boots

But I'm China so I have an enormous number of people.

That's like me saying, " i'm Europe, so I have an enormous population. "

China doesn't exist. What you consider as China is just the result of 4,000 years of geopolitical theater. The year is 2975 b.c. - China doesn't exist. The earliest dynasty of what is yet to even be considered the beginning history of China is centuries from forming. You landed in a chalcolithic river valley somewhere in east asia. You are no more privy to the population and resources of China than I am to the rest of Europe.

And while we are on the topic, i've been lead to believe that you've been seriously fudging your expertise on metallurgy. Mind you, minor changes to an Author for story's sake are acceptable - e.g. my surname and the unit I was assigned to are not the same as the one's I posited in my app. This was done for matters of privacy. It would be quite ludicrous of me to posit that I possessed skills that I truly didn't, simply so that I might retain some kind of edge in the story; case in point, your metallurgical knowledge.

I'm going to have to ask that you remove that as one of your skills, as well as any reference to it in your ic posts.

[Orostan]

But I'm China so I have an enormous number of people.

That's like me saying, " i'm Europe, so I have an enormous population. "

China doesn't exist. What you consider as China is just the result of 4,000 years of geopolitical theater. The year is 2975 b.c. - China doesn't exist. The earliest dynasty of what is yet to even be considered the beginning history of China is centuries from forming. You landed in a chalcolithic river valley somewhere in east asia. You are no more privy to the population and resources of China than I am to the rest of Europe.

And while we are on the topic, i've been lead to believe that you've been seriously fudging your expertise on metallurgy. Mind you, minor changes to an Author for story's sake are acceptable - e.g. my surname and the unit I was assigned to are not the same as the one's I posited in my app. This was done for matters of privacy. It would be quite ludicrous of me to posit that I possessed skills that I truly didn't, simply so that I might retain some kind of edge in the story; case in point, your metallurgical knowledge.

I'm going to have to ask that you remove that as one of your skills, as well as any reference to it in your ic posts.

I already agreed to remove it from my app and did. Everything I am writing is not that hard to do and I already knew how it was done. Writing steel production will be much harder and require a lot more experimentation to do properly in the RP.

Besides that, 'China' right now does have a good number of people living it. I don't know how many, but I'd know China has historically had a high population especially around its rivers.

[Joohan]

I'll also say, i've been away for a couple of days now. I've not read any of your posts yet - but just skimming through your last post, two words immediately caught my attention: Emperor and Captain.

I'm going to have to catch up on the IC now - cause unless you have some good justification, neither one of those things should exist for another millennia.

[Orostan]

Besides that if you're talking about the whole 'soft metal around hard metal' thing I did with the swords that's an actual practice that is done to allow for hard but brittle metal to serve as a blade while softer metal acts as structural support and a shock absorber.

I'll also say, i've been away for a couple of days now. I've not read any of your posts yet - but just skimming through your last post, two words immediately caught my attention: Emperor and Captain.

I'm going to have to catch up on the IC now - cause unless you have some good justification, neither one of those things should exist for another millennia.

The 'Emperor' is basically just the ruler of a city. I think i've made it clear that only very primitive city states would realistically exist in China at this time. While Chinese mythology doesn't start for another few hundred years I think it's safe to say that basic concepts like 'ruler with mandate from heaven' are in the process of developing.

The only form of empire that exists is large settlements extracting tribute from smaller villages. Bronze and jade artifacts have been dug up from around this time period and I think my portrayal of ancient China is about as realistic as it can be given the information we have of the time period.

[Europa Undivided]

I'm sorry who are you?

a spectre soon to be haunting a europe near you

Mother Russia will stop you in maybe 500 years

[Plzen]

Oh my gosh... you're like the commonwealth, but less serious...

What’s that supposed to mean?!?

---

Bortslovakia, Joohan, Cainsland, the Commonwealth will be interested in getting some ground work done for proper diplomatic relations. Northern-Hibernian relations are fairly formal already, but that’s not true for Icedonia or Crimea.

I’m thinking we do our own equivalent of the Vienna Convention.

[Great Confederacy of Commonwealth States]

Oh my gosh... you're like the commonwealth, but less serious...

What’s that supposed to mean?!?

---

Bortslovakia, Joohan, Cainsland, the Commonwealth will be interested in getting some ground work done for proper diplomatic relations. Northern-Hibernian relations are fairly formal already, but that’s not true for Icedonia or Crimea.

I’m thinking we do our own equivalent of the Vienna Convention.

Which Vienna convention?

[Bortslovakia]

What’s that supposed to mean?!?

---

Bortslovakia, Joohan, Cainsland, the Commonwealth will be interested in getting some ground work done for proper diplomatic relations. Northern-Hibernian relations are fairly formal already, but that’s not true for Icedonia or Crimea.

I’m thinking we do our own equivalent of the Vienna Convention.

Which Vienna convention?

The one where Europe said Ireland could just annex all of Scandinavia clearly.

[Joohan]

the hardest part of writing a post is starting...

[G-Tech Corporation]

Besides that if you're talking about the whole 'soft metal around hard metal' thing I did with the swords that's an actual practice that is done to allow for hard but brittle metal to serve as a blade while softer metal acts as structural support and a shock absorber.

If you’re referring to lamination, you’ll actually be wanting the exact opposite of that - with the harder steel wrapped around the softer iron. Of course, though, that relies on producing an appreciably temperate level of carbon content in iron in the first place, instead of useless high impurity pig iron, which almost any combination of carbon and iron will do when produced swiftly by hand.

[Orostan]

Besides that if you're talking about the whole 'soft metal around hard metal' thing I did with the swords that's an actual practice that is done to allow for hard but brittle metal to serve as a blade while softer metal acts as structural support and a shock absorber.

If you’re referring to lamination, you’ll actually be wanting the exact opposite of that - with the harder steel wrapped around the softer iron. Of course, though, that relies on producing an appreciably temperate level of carbon content in iron in the first place, instead of useless high impurity pig iron, which almost any combination of carbon and iron will do when produced swiftly by hand.

Cast and wrought iron can be produced in a primitive blast furnace like the one I made though, the issue is using the correct ratio of coal to iron or charcoal to iron to get it right. Pig iron would be easier and less labor intensive to make though.

The problem with using harder iron to protect softer iron is that I want my weapons to keep their edge, and that’s best done with brittle but hard cast iron as opposed to malleable yet softer wrought iron. When I start producing actual steel I might begin using soft cores and hard outer shells because at that point I’ll be able to make hard steel which is also more able to take a blow.

Using cast iron to wrap wrought iron would result in a blade that can’t keep its sharpness and a sword prone to fracturing. Now that I think about it though that sword might be able to bend better because the core won’t be as brittle - assuming i want the sword to bend.

[Endem]

Very little. I think the Nestos folks have formally made contact with the southern parts of the League, but that's all I recall.

What happened was that we got to Gdansk for the amber and seaweed. Then we left and the Vistulan League moved in, essentially taking over Gdansk and the surrounding area on the Vistula. It would be an odd situation. The amber traders on the Vistulan river which go to Gdansk would still be going up and down the river, but they would find themselves in a strange situation as the Cvart and Vistulan League took over. Some of them might flee south to the Imperium or further south to the Cucuteni lands. They came to us first to Varna with amber.

Gdansk controls 90% of the worlds amber supply in real life. It would be a truly odd situation. We tried to get up the Vistula being escorted through freshly conquered territory by silent masked men who tortured people on occasion with acid. When our expedition made it to Gdansk, we found ourselves part of a secretive society which offered us petroleum, seaweed, and amber for our trade goods. It would be a scary enough situation where traders would not be so quick to go up the river again. Trade would be initiated, but it would be the kind of thing where only people with hearts of iron or motivated by high levels of greed would be willing to go there. The most extreme of traders.

I imagine it might be something like a Heart of Darkness type situation where we are entering very dangerous territory. I could imagine one of the traders saying or doing something stupid and simply disappearing. The singular goal with the Vistulans is to get to Gdansk for amber. It is the source for the Amber Road.

I believe you have misunderstood much of the society my Author created, first of all, Czart don't just torture lot's of people ( yet ) for criminals we have a very early form of trials ( like, the chief of the village being the judge ) we only torture people who we believe have valuable information and who will not give it up willingly, second the society isn't secretetive, we are actually very welcoming of merchants ( after all that's our only source of iron ) it's just works on a "we give you this you give us this, no questions asked no questions given" ( however, yes, you would not be given any knowledge ) and lastly, Vistulan Confederation ( again, it's not a League ) didn't move in to Gdansk, Gdansk was the originating city of the Confederation

[Plzen]

Which Vienna convention?

I was confused for a while, until I searched on Google to try and figure out what you meant and I found out that what I was thinking of as the “Vienna Convention” actually encompass two separate and distinct treaties.

Well, I guess this is why it’s useful to have an actual expert in our roleplay.

I’m referring to both the 1961 Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations and the 1969 Vienna Convention on the Law of Treaties.

The IC world needs more developed international law...

N/B - On another note, no professional commentary on the Northern-Moravian peace treaty I linked you to?

[Pyrghium]

the hardest part of writing a post is starting...

Isn’t that the hardest part of anything?

[UniversalCommons]

What happened was that we got to Gdansk for the amber and seaweed. Then we left and the Vistulan League moved in, essentially taking over Gdansk and the surrounding area on the Vistula. It would be an odd situation. The amber traders on the Vistulan river which go to Gdansk would still be going up and down the river, but they would find themselves in a strange situation as the Cvart and Vistulan League took over. Some of them might flee south to the Imperium or further south to the Cucuteni lands. They came to us first to Varna with amber.

Gdansk controls 90% of the worlds amber supply in real life. It would be a truly odd situation. We tried to get up the Vistula being escorted through freshly conquered territory by silent masked men who tortured people on occasion with acid. When our expedition made it to Gdansk, we found ourselves part of a secretive society which offered us petroleum, seaweed, and amber for our trade goods. It would be a scary enough situation where traders would not be so quick to go up the river again. Trade would be initiated, but it would be the kind of thing where only people with hearts of iron or motivated by high levels of greed would be willing to go there. The most extreme of traders.

I imagine it might be something like a Heart of Darkness type situation where we are entering very dangerous territory. I could imagine one of the traders saying or doing something stupid and simply disappearing. The singular goal with the Vistulans is to get to Gdansk for amber. It is the source for the Amber Road.

I believe you have misunderstood much of the society my Author created, first of all, Czart don't just torture lot's of people ( yet ) for criminals we have a very early form of trials ( like, the chief of the village being the judge ) we only torture people who we believe have valuable information and who will not give it up willingly, second the society isn't secretetive, we are actually very welcoming of merchants ( after all that's our only source of iron ) it's just works on a "we give you this you give us this, no questions asked no questions given" ( however, yes, you would not be given any knowledge ) and lastly, Vistulan Confederation ( again, it's not a League ) didn't move in to Gdansk, Gdansk was the originating city of the Confederation

Part of this would be the idea of torture for any reason would be pretty terrifying. The merchants would come up and see the early forms of trials and maybe hear someone get tortured and it would terrify them. The outward openness would be great. But, there are still masked men who we don't understand. It would be very easy in this situation to not understand what was happening. One of our primary trade goods is knowledge. Not trading knowledge to a scholar would be considered secretive. Also no questions asked to a scholarly society would also be challenging. Lets say we offered you to teach some farming methods for example, you would say no. Also, lets say we offered to trade you knowledge of parchment for something you knew. You would say no? One of the advantages of trading in knowledge is that it is cumulative.

It might take a few trips before the wariness stops. We after all try to keep a low profile and can be quite paranoid. Some of the posts with the Imperium demonstrate this.