NationStates

Posted: **Fri Jul 12, 2019 3:48 pm**

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Posted: **Fri Jul 12, 2019 3:59 pm**

Posted: **Fri Jul 12, 2019 4:44 pm**

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Posted: **Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:14 pm**

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Posted: **Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:29 pm**

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Posted: **Fri Jul 12, 2019 7:34 pm**

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Posted: **Fri Jul 12, 2019 8:50 pm**

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Posted: **Fri Jul 12, 2019 10:53 pm**

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Posted: **Fri Jul 12, 2019 11:46 pm**

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Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 4:16 am**

Mr Speaker, I am very concerned at the current state of affairs, in terms of the current abilities of MPs. Firstly, a further look at the office shows that the closing in question has been in place for nearly a month now with no apparent update. This is worrying for me in regard to the most recent passed bill, where the government had told us that we were supposed to fix it after it was voted in. And now, non-profit organisations could be considered as a business, which will cripple charities.
Also, there is no apparent ability for a request to receive records, a database to access, nor any specific individuals I could be directed to when I was told to speak to the government.
I think is unacceptable when we seem to have a common goal of independence and stability, and I feel that myself and colleagues who feel the same way are ignored.

Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:27 am**

New Lindale wrote:Mr Speaker, I am very concerned at the current state of affairs, in terms of the current abilities of MPs. Firstly, a further look at the office shows that the closing in question has been in place for nearly a month now with no apparent update. This is worrying for me in regard to the most recent passed bill, where the government had told us that we were supposed to fix it after it was voted in. And now, non-profit organisations could be considered as a business, which will cripple charities.
Also, there is no apparent ability for a request to receive records, a database to access, nor any specific individuals I could be directed to when I was told to speak to the government.
I think is unacceptable when we seem to have a common goal of independence and stability, and I feel that myself and colleagues who feel the same way are ignored.

OOC: Apologies for interrupting the vote (is that meant to be OOC or IC? Anyway I did both)
Someone has already told you that the Office thread was closed due to a ruling from the NS moderators (which we have no control over), and that bills are now meant to be submitted in the OOC thread, which everyone else seems to have no trouble following. As for records (like your request for how many people would fall under each tax bracket), what are we meant to do, make them up from thin air? We can't RP all aspects of a country. You're using an IC speech for mostly OOC affairs. But now, an IC response to legitimate IC parts, which is the part about the recently passed bill...

IC: "Mr Speaker, I apologize for interjecting during the vote, but I felt the misconceptions of the honourable member should be addressed sooner rather than later. I am not aware of any promise by the government to amend the Rational Taxation Act after it was passed. In fact, as far as I'm aware, such an act would be an act of bad faith towards their confidence and supply agreement with the Center-Progressives, and endanger the government's ability to stay in power. As for the honourable member's mention of non-profits, I must object. Even if a non-profit is considered a business, if it is truly non-profit, it should not pay any taxes as it would not have any net profit."

Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:29 am**

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Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:40 am**

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Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:28 am**

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Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 11:59 am**

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Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 1:54 pm**

"Order, order! On the question of should The Honourable Rep. Lucia Carlsson be this chambers new speaker, the result is the following:
Ayes: 14
Nays: 2
Abstains: 2
The Ayes have it. Congratulations to The Honourable Rep. Lucia Carlsson on becoming the new speaker for this chamber. "

Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 1:54 pm**

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Jonathon's eyes widen.

"Damn, they just called it too..."

Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 4:35 pm**

Lucia walks up to the chair and stands before the chamber.

“Friends, esteemed colleagues, I thank you. Today marks the day of my tenure as speaker. I hope it will be a long one. This chamber hasn’t been graced with the best of Sankta Hilda’s speakers, but I hope we can look past the mishaps of the past and work towards a prosperous future for all of Sankta Hilda.

As speaker, it should be expected that we as representatives of the people shall keep an atmosphere worthy of these great halls. This chamber and those who work in it will be shown the respect they deserve. Frontbenchers will not supersede backbenchers and vice versa. I am a champion for all voices in this house. I won’t be a puppet for the government nor its opposition. It is my job as head officer of the chamber to ensure that the government gets the chance to govern and the opposition gets to check them. The opposition will have one day designated to them in a legislative week. Representatives shall cooperate with each other no matter their rank, party, or popularity. Once again we are representatives of the people, not ambassadors for our own interests.

I welcome my term with open arms. And in a matter of minutes I will introduce government legislation. If the government has a priority of which bill shall go first then they shall present it to the speaker immediately. If not, wait patiently.”

Lucia sits down and asks her clerks to bring up government bills.

Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 6:47 pm**

“Order! Order! Voting will begin now and last for 24 hours. Lock the doors!”

Universal Rights Amendment
Author: Eloise Eliasson (NPP)
Sponsors: Karl Bergen (SDP), Austin Miller (SHAPC)
An amendment to the Constitution of Saint Hilda to give all persons within the territory of Saint Hilda rights and freedoms
BE IT ENACTED BY THE KING, sovereign of Saint Hilda, the Universal Rights Amendment to ensure common, universal rights to all citizens, permanent residents, foreigners, and those visiting for any period of time. To ensure all citizens the right to life, health, and opportunity. To guarantee all persons the right to speak freely, petition the government, and peacefully assemble to address grievances. To safeguard the freedom of worship and protect the sanctity of culture and tradition. To assure the equality of the sexes. To ensure the rights of all persons to a fair trial, and to protect them against abuse of power and government malpractice.

The Parliament of Saint Hilda shall introduce to the Constitution of Saint Hilda the following:

Section 1 - On the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and other matters of International Human rights
The Government of Saint Hilda shall prescribe to the word and spirit of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and shall thoroughly observe all directives of the United Nations Human Rights Council, as well as any other United Nations ombudsman institution concerned with human rights.

Section 2 - Inviolable rights of life and the person
Human life is sacred above all else; all human life shall be protected by the state without exception. The Government of Saint Hilda shall not, for any purpose, impose the penalty of death.
This clause shall not be interpreted to prohibit the killing of those who pose an immediate risk to the lives of others, or the killing in defense of one’s life or the lives of others, or killing of enemy combatants in wartime.

The integrity of one’s physical person, as well as one’s property, possessions, and assets, shall not be violated except by officers of the law, and such violations shall only be done with the purpose of gathering evidence on the basis of probable cause or protecting others as directed and sanctioned by a court of law.
The integrity of one’s body or possessions may be violated if the lives of others are immediately in jeopardy, or if one is found committing a crime in flagrante delicto.
No person shall be held against their volition, except for persons serving time in a penitentiary for committed or suspected crimes as determined by a court of law, or those found to be an immediate threat to others.
Private property shall only be made public by eminent domain for the public good, safety, or security.
All persons are guaranteed the right to live in health, to have access to hospitals and care facilities, and to enjoy access to an acceptable standard of living.
All persons are protected without exception from physical maiming, physiological abuse, or torture.

Section 3 - Equality before the law
All persons, regardless of sex, religion, culture, socioeconomic status, orientation, or political identity are equal before the Government of Saint Hilda, and shall not be discriminated against on those accounts.

Section 4 - Right of suffrage
All citizens shall have the right to freely vote without burden or hindrance.
The Government of Saint Hilda shall respect the votes of its citizens, and shall in no way attempt to alter them.
The Government of Saint Hilda shall not institute a poll tax or attempt in any way to obstruct any citizen from voting.

Section 5 - Rights of free speech and similar protections
The Government of Saint Hilda shall not infringe upon the free expression of any kind—verbal, written, artistic, etc.—of its citizen
Expression that clearly intends to incite violence or encourage illegal behavior is not protected by this clause.
This shall not be construed to prohibit the Government from protecting intellectual property.
The Government of Saint Hilda is empowered to protect its citizens and organizations from libel, slander, and defamation of character.
The Government of Saint Hilda shall protect the right of its citizens to petition to any authority, or to share their grievances without fear of reprisal.
The Government of Saint Hilda shall sanction peaceful assembly, so long as such assembly does not threaten the well-being of others.
The press shall enjoy special privilege within Saint Hilda; no press shall be searched, nor shall the press be forced to divulge information on its sources or operators, nor shall the Government of Saint Hilda interfere in any manner with the operations of the press.
A press may be searched or commanded to reveal its sources if the lives of others are in jeopardy, as determined by a court of law.

Section 6 - Rights of religion and culture
All persons shall have the right to practice or to abstain from practicing any religion.
The Government of Saint Hilda shall not espouse, favor, or otherwise promote any religion or religious practice; it shall not comment or legislate on any non-violent religious practice.
The Government of Saint Hilda shall not give money or special favor to any religion or religious institution for any reason except for philanthropic, non-evangelizing missions.
Culture and cultural expression shall be protected; all cultures shall have the right to practice, maintain, and celebrate their traditions.
The Government of Saint Hilda shall not promote a culture or cultural practice above any other, nor shall it give authority to a single cultural group.

Section 7 - Rights relating to the judiciary and law
Upon arrest, all persons held for crimes yet unlitigated by a court of law shall have the right to apply for a writ of habeas corpus to be seen by a court within forty-eight hours of their detainment.
This right may be suspended in wartime or in a state of civil emergency

Criminal charges shall only be levied by a prosecutor under the direction of the state with the co-signature of the chief prosecutor responsible for the jurisdiction in which the crime was committed.
In such cases where prosecution is brought by the chief prosecutor of a jurisdiction, the co-signature of the Attorney General shall be required. In such cases where the Attorney General brings forth prosecution, the co-signature of the Deputy Attorney General shall be required, or, if the aforementioned prosecution is of a crime occurring solely in one jurisdiction, the co-signature of the chief prosecutor of that jurisdiction shall be sufficient.
All persons have a right to a fair, unbiased, and expeditious trial in a court of law.
All persons charged with a felony or grievous criminal offense shall be tried before a jury of their peers to determine guilt.
All persons shall have unconstrained access to a trained barrister or barristers for their civil or criminal defense, and all communication between a person and their barrister shall be privileged beyond any subpoena. If a person cannot afford a private barrister, the state shall furnish one for them.
The plaintiffs of civil cases are not required to be furnished a lawyer.
All persons shall have the right to access and examine any evidence or testimony against them, as well as the right to bring forth and compel any evidence or testimony in their defense. All evidence or testimony offered in support of the innocence of the defense must be considered, regardless of the nature of such evidence or testimony.
All persons shall be privileged against self-incrimination; the right to invoke this privilege shall not be held against the person who invokes it.
A spouse shall be privileged against incriminating their spouse and a parent shall be privileged against incriminating their child.
All persons found culpable for a criminal or civil offense shall have the right to petition for a writ of certiorari before a higher court to appeal the sentence.
No person shall be tried for the same offense more than once.

Section 8 - Free movement, privileges of the Swedish Monarch, and other matters
All persons shall have the right to freely move through public places and purchase domicile in a place of theirchoosing, and shall have full right to leave Saint Hilda on their own volition.
All native or foreign vessels—on land, in air, or at sea—shall be permitted entrance into the territory of Saint Hilda if such vessels are in need of serious repair.
An exception is made for vessels of foreign armies, vessels transporting arms or armaments, or vessels commandeered by unlawful organizations or pirates.
All minors below the age of majority shall be guaranteed an education.
The Monarch of Sweden as well as all persons of their household are immune from criminal prosecution within the territory of Saint Hilda.
Any person may, for any purpose, wave their rights before a court of law.
No law shall be passed retroactively.

Section 9 - On application and amendments
The Universal Rights Amendment shall apply to the government of Saint Hilda and all constituent and local governing bodies therein, as well as within all chancelleries, consulates, and other extensions of the Government of Saint Hilda abroad, as well as on all vessels of land or sea, public or private, that fly the Saint Hilda flag.
An amendment of the Universal Rights Amendment may be adopted with the support of at least three-fourths of Parliament

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Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 7:34 pm**

"Firstly, I'd like to congratulate the Speaker on his appointment. Secondly, in regards to respecting the right to human life, what shall, in this case, be considered human? Shall, for example, a fetus's life be protected by this act?"

Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 8:41 pm**

Roode Mann stands up.

"This bill is terrible and illegal because a sovereign legislature cannot bind itself. If Parliament can make a bill by simple majority, it must hold that Parliament can unmake the bill by a simple majority. It's a legal absurdity for Parliament to make a bill unrepealable."

Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 8:45 pm**

Ainin wrote:Roode Mann stands up.

"This bill is terrible and illegal because a sovereign legislature cannot bind itself. If Parliament can make a bill by simple majority, it must hold that Parliament can unmake the bill by a simple majority. It's a legal absurdity for Parliament to make a bill unrepealable."

"Hear."

Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:00 pm**

Ainin wrote:Roode Mann stands up.

"This bill is terrible and illegal because a sovereign legislature cannot bind itself. If Parliament can make a bill by simple majority, it must hold that Parliament can unmake the bill by a simple majority. It's a legal absurdity for Parliament to make a bill unrepealable."

"Hear, hear!"

Posted: **Sat Jul 13, 2019 9:07 pm**

Ainin wrote:Roode Mann stands up.

"This bill is terrible and illegal because a sovereign legislature cannot bind itself. If Parliament can make a bill by simple majority, it must hold that Parliament can unmake the bill by a simple majority. It's a legal absurdity for Parliament to make a bill unrepealable."

“Even if we were to make the bill unrepealable, it stands to reason that we could just amend it later to allow ourselves to repeal it, or supersede it in later legislation. You’re completely right, it’s not just a legal absurdity, but an affront to common sense.”

“Now, to point out several loopholes that I believe to be of the utmost importance.
Section 6, Subsection 4 allows for harmful cultural traditions that are not inherently religious to be preserved, and we are forbidden from interfering.
Section 2, Subsection 3 as written prevents vaccination, as children are unlikely to want to get their shots, and since they do not immediately endanger others, we cannot utilize clause a to get around it.
Section 2, subsection 4 prevents a state doctor from amputating where it may be necessary.!
For that matter, section 2, subsection 2 prevents doctors from saving someone who was rendered unconscious from, say, a car accident.
Section 3 prevents us from criminalizing pedophilic relations, because to do so would be discrimination against pedophilic sexual orientation.
Section 4, subsection 1 allows 1 year olds to vote. I shall assume this was not intended.
A requested amendment to Section 4: The creation of a National Election Day, a National holiday, so as to allow as many citizens as possible to vote.
Section 7, subsection 1 would allow a state inclined to do so to intern prisoners for their entire lives, simply by declaring a state of emergency and allowing it to go on as long as desired.
Section 7, subsection 3-Is this a citizen’s jury, or a trial by judge?
Section 8, subsection 1 would allow wanted parties to legally hop a boat and leave.
Section 8, subsection 5 is patently ridiculous. If the King was to rape a 5 year old, as long as they remained within the island, they would be perfectly untouchable.
Section 8, subsection 6 should be amended to read “as long as they do so free from coercion.”
Section 8, subsection 7. I assume this is to mean that no laws shall apply retroactively. We do not have a time machine, and thus, cannot pass laws retroactively. Unless you were to have one, Madam, and are keeping it secret from the rest of us.
Section 9, subsection 2 should also allow for a public referendum option, with amendments passing by whatever majority the rest of this August body seems appropriate.

Posted: **Sun Jul 14, 2019 12:11 am**

Carl von Leslie interjects.

"Section 6 Subsections 2 and 3 essentially prohibit the government from maintaining an established church, even if freedom of worship is guaranteed. Saint Hilda has had a historically established church, the Church of Sweden. Most of our subjects are God-fearing Lutherans. Would these articles not prohibit the government from maintaining one of Saint Hilda's most sacred institutions?"

OoC: I do not know if a local church hierarchy within the Church of Sweden is established in Saint Hilda or if it has been disestablished. Take note that I did not say specifically that the Church of Sweden is still established or not, only that it has historically been established.

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NS Parliament Chamber [IC]