1906: Alternative Divergence [AH][OOC-DEAD]

[Nea Byzantia]

Would you be willing to do that with any of your territory? Would the ERE have any Protectorates or Client-Kings?

Well, for me it's a bit complicated. The territory that I could the easiest explain would be Egypt, as Egypt is divided into three vaguely autonomous Exarchates, but that province is too valuable for me to risk potential rebellions or stuff like that, so I would be very hesitant. The southernmost exarchate maybe, but even then I'm afraid that I would be too picky with the app for that player to feel comfortable.

Taurica/Crimea is also potentially organized as an Exarchate, but it's too small to do much, that was the main reason for why the player of that Principality there abandoned the roleplay.

Perhaps an Egyptian Exarchate was created because of a rebellion?

Would be a recent event...because if I apped for such an Exarechate, I'd make the Exarch an alternate version of this guy:

[The Traansval]

>The French are Protestant in this timeline

This is truly a cursed timeline

Hon hon hon.

Calvinist work ethic.

Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrates.

Puritan abolitionism.

Hon hon hon!

The thought of Protestant Frenchmen using Schmidt-Rubins to enforce colonial rule inside my country sends shivers up my spin e

[Nea Byzantia]

Btw can anybody recommend any other good AH RPs?

[The Traansval]

I'd be willing to play as Protectorate Morocco


I think the whites only confusing until its explained. A legend to go with the map could help a bit but I think its a minor point that doesn't really nessecitate changing the whole map.

Sounds good to me. Give my app a read-through, and then let me know what history for Morocco you find plausible in that context. I'm not going to be nitpicky here, so anything you come up with will probably be fine. This should be fun!

Seeing as how Eastern Rome defeated the Arabs early one I doubt that Islam and Arabic rule/culture would have spread as much as it did IRL, so my vision is for a Morocco more centered around Christianity (Eastern Orthodoxy, as Rome would have had a much earlier influence than France) and the native Berbers rather than Arabs which make up a large majority of the IRL Moroccan population. I'll flesh it out more in my app but the general idea is a Kingdom led by the more dominant of the Berber groups ruling over a precarious nation where different Berber groups hold power over different regions with different goals and different alligences. A nation ripe for French meddling, where groups can be played off each other, and a young King, newly brought to the crown after the death of his father, seeking centralization and modernization.

[Reverend Norv]

Sounds good to me. Give my app a read-through, and then let me know what history for Morocco you find plausible in that context. I'm not going to be nitpicky here, so anything you come up with will probably be fine. This should be fun!

Seeing as how Eastern Rome defeated the Arabs early one I doubt that Islam and Arabic rule/culture would have spread as much as it did IRL, so my vision is for a Morocco more centered around Christianity (Eastern Orthodoxy, as Rome would have had a much earlier influence than France) and the native Berbers rather than Arabs which make up a large majority of the IRL Moroccan population. I'll flesh it out more in my app but the general idea is a Kingdom led by the more dominant of the Berber groups ruling over a precarious nation where different Berber groups hold power over different regions with different goals and different alligences. A nation ripe for French meddling, where groups can be played off each other, and a young King, newly brought to the crown after the death of his father, seeking centralization and modernization.

That's a very cool idea, as far as I'm concerned. Feel free to go into as much detail about French involvement as you like; as I said, I am inclined generally to roll with whatever you develop, so don't worry about stepping on my toes.

[Kazarogkai]

Hon hon hon.

Calvinist work ethic.

Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrates.

Puritan abolitionism.

Hon hon hon!

The thought of Protestant Frenchmen using Schmidt-Rubins to enforce colonial rule inside my country sends shivers up my spin e

Just so you know large portions of both Africa and even a good bit of Oceania(central/southern Australia, New Zealand) are available to you if you change your mind. Some type of semi-advanced gun bearing Maori mounted on huge Moa's could be pretty cool or a somewhat revived Kanem-Bornu cavalry empire of lake chad could be interesting. Just helping out.

Also to the Ops I just want to make sure if my finished app has been seen yet and if there is any issues could you let me know? Thank you.

[Tracian Empire]

Well, for me it's a bit complicated. The territory that I could the easiest explain would be Egypt, as Egypt is divided into three vaguely autonomous Exarchates, but that province is too valuable for me to risk potential rebellions or stuff like that, so I would be very hesitant. The southernmost exarchate maybe, but even then I'm afraid that I would be too picky with the app for that player to feel comfortable.

Taurica/Crimea is also potentially organized as an Exarchate, but it's too small to do much, that was the main reason for why the player of that Principality there abandoned the roleplay.

Perhaps an Egyptian Exarchate was created because of a rebellion?

Would be a recent event...because if I apped for such an Exarechate, I'd make the Exarch an alternate version of this guy:

I honestly doubt it. The Exarch basically acts as a monarch in itself, he only answers to the Emperor and has near complete control of his province's military and civilian administration. If it would be done to stop a rebellion, the normal themata system would be far more effective. A rebellion could at the very least explain why there are three Exarchates instead of one, as to limit each Exarch's powers, but even then - rebellions in Africa would be mostly the job of the oppressed Muslims/native Africans. For the time being and for the recent history, no rebellion among the Roman population should have been able to gain enough support.

And even if I were to give you control of one of the Exarchates there, I don't see what you could do besides from planning to rebel.

[Nea Byzantia]

Perhaps an Egyptian Exarchate was created because of a rebellion?

Would be a recent event...because if I apped for such an Exarechate, I'd make the Exarch an alternate version of this guy:

I honestly doubt it. The Exarch basically acts as a monarch in itself, he only answers to the Emperor and has near complete control of his province's military and civilian administration. If it would be done to stop a rebellion, the normal themata system would be far more effective. A rebellion could at the very least explain why there are three Exarchates instead of one, as to limit each Exarch's powers, but even then - rebellions in Africa would be mostly the job of the oppressed Muslims/native Africans. For the time being and for the recent history, no rebellion among the Roman population should have been able to gain enough support.

And even if I were to give you control of one of the Exarchates there, I don't see what you could do besides from planning to rebel.

Fair point. Which Exarchate would you allow me to have?

[Tracian Empire]

Sounds good to me. Give my app a read-through, and then let me know what history for Morocco you find plausible in that context. I'm not going to be nitpicky here, so anything you come up with will probably be fine. This should be fun!

Seeing as how Eastern Rome defeated the Arabs early one I doubt that Islam and Arabic rule/culture would have spread as much as it did IRL, so my vision is for a Morocco more centered around Christianity (Eastern Orthodoxy, as Rome would have had a much earlier influence than France) and the native Berbers rather than Arabs which make up a large majority of the IRL Moroccan population. I'll flesh it out more in my app but the general idea is a Kingdom led by the more dominant of the Berber groups ruling over a precarious nation where different Berber groups hold power over different regions with different goals and different alligences. A nation ripe for French meddling, where groups can be played off each other, and a young King, newly brought to the crown after the death of his father, seeking centralization and modernization.

Well, it didn't necessarily do that. Eastern Rome was embroiled in conflicts with the Arabs all the way up to 1600. It's true that they managed to slow down the Arab expansion (the Roman Levant only collapsed under the successor of Heraclius), and they pushed up much strongly than the OTL Byzantines were able to, but I always left the window open so that Islam could spread into Africa if needed.

That said, that's the idea - it's up to the African players, if any. The Caliphate could have been so weak as never to expand from Egypt, anything could be done, and I do historically plan for the Exarchate of Africa to have existed for a bit more than it did IRL.

[Tracian Empire]

I honestly doubt it. The Exarch basically acts as a monarch in itself, he only answers to the Emperor and has near complete control of his province's military and civilian administration. If it would be done to stop a rebellion, the normal themata system would be far more effective. A rebellion could at the very least explain why there are three Exarchates instead of one, as to limit each Exarch's powers, but even then - rebellions in Africa would be mostly the job of the oppressed Muslims/native Africans. For the time being and for the recent history, no rebellion among the Roman population should have been able to gain enough support.

And even if I were to give you control of one of the Exarchates there, I don't see what you could do besides from planning to rebel.

Fair point. Which Exarchate would you allow me to have?

None unfortunately. Sorry, I missed it, but Oscal banned you from joining this roleplay.

[Nea Byzantia]

Fair point. Which Exarchate would you allow me to have?

None unfortunately. Sorry, I missed it, but Oscal banned you from joining this roleplay.

Why?

[Tracian Empire]

None unfortunately. Sorry, I missed it, but Oscal banned you from joining this roleplay.

Why?

viewtopic.php?p=35646873#p35646873

[Nea Byzantia]

Why?

viewtopic.php?p=35646873#p35646873

Ah. That's unfortunate. I was not aware this was an issue. My apologies. Hopefully, I could be allowed to come back in the future (not that there's any good territories to claim, anyways). I guess this is goodbye. Could you at least point me to any other good, still-existing AH RPs out there? Perhaps I'll have more fun with those.

[Tracian Empire]

viewtopic.php?p=35646873#p35646873

Ah. That's unfortunate. I was not aware this was an issue. My apologies. Hopefully, I could be allowed to come back in the future (not that there's any good territories to claim, anyways). I guess this is goodbye. Could you at least point me to any other good, still-existing AH RPs out there? Perhaps I'll have more fun with those.

Other than AOSS that you already know of, I'm afraid that I don't know any other.

[Nea Byzantia]

Ah. That's unfortunate. I was not aware this was an issue. My apologies. Hopefully, I could be allowed to come back in the future (not that there's any good territories to claim, anyways). I guess this is goodbye. Could you at least point me to any other good, still-existing AH RPs out there? Perhaps I'll have more fun with those.

Other than AOSS that you already know of, I'm afraid that I don't know any other.

Ah, ok

Thanks,

Bye,

Christ Has Risen!

[The Traansval]

Seeing as how Eastern Rome defeated the Arabs early one I doubt that Islam and Arabic rule/culture would have spread as much as it did IRL, so my vision is for a Morocco more centered around Christianity (Eastern Orthodoxy, as Rome would have had a much earlier influence than France) and the native Berbers rather than Arabs which make up a large majority of the IRL Moroccan population. I'll flesh it out more in my app but the general idea is a Kingdom led by the more dominant of the Berber groups ruling over a precarious nation where different Berber groups hold power over different regions with different goals and different alligences. A nation ripe for French meddling, where groups can be played off each other, and a young King, newly brought to the crown after the death of his father, seeking centralization and modernization.

Well, it didn't necessarily do that. Eastern Rome was embroiled in conflicts with the Arabs all the way up to 1600. It's true that they managed to slow down the Arab expansion (the Roman Levant only collapsed under the successor of Heraclius), and they pushed up much strongly than the OTL Byzantines were able to, but I always left the window open so that Islam could spread into Africa if needed.

That said, that's the idea - it's up to the African players, if any. The Caliphate could have been so weak as never to expand from Egypt, anything could be done, and I do historically plan for the Exarchate of Africa to have existed for a bit more than it did IRL.

I feel that in the spirit of Alternative Divergence, it'd be more fun really to have a completely different Morocco dominated by Orthodox Berbers and sort of Afro-Europeans rather than a slightly different twist to the Islamic Arab Sultanate of real life. Also it provided me with a bit better of a position in terms of diplomacy as its much easier to get along with Europeans as a predominant Christain nation rather than a predominant Muslim one.

[Tracian Empire]

Other than AOSS that you already know of, I'm afraid that I don't know any other.

Ah, ok

Thanks,

Bye,

Christ Has Risen!

Truly He is Risen!

[Tracian Empire]

Well, it didn't necessarily do that. Eastern Rome was embroiled in conflicts with the Arabs all the way up to 1600. It's true that they managed to slow down the Arab expansion (the Roman Levant only collapsed under the successor of Heraclius), and they pushed up much strongly than the OTL Byzantines were able to, but I always left the window open so that Islam could spread into Africa if needed.

That said, that's the idea - it's up to the African players, if any. The Caliphate could have been so weak as never to expand from Egypt, anything could be done, and I do historically plan for the Exarchate of Africa to have existed for a bit more than it did IRL.

I feel that in the spirit of Alternative Divergence, it'd be more fun really to have a completely different Morocco dominated by Orthodox Berbers and sort of Afro-Europeans rather than a slightly different twist to the Islamic Arab Sultanate of real life. Also it provided me with a bit better of a position in terms of diplomacy as its much easier to get along with Europeans as a predominant Christain nation rather than a predominant Muslim one.

You can certainly do that! I was just trying to explain everything to make sure that you would make an informed choice, you could have a historical conflict with Muslims if you so desire.

As for it being Orthodox, that is why I mentioned the Exarchate. Yes, Catholics and Orthodox Churches are united in a single, Greater Chalcedonian Church but that is a political matter, all the religious and dogmatic differences between the two branches still exist. So if you wish to be Orthodox, instead of the Catholic, WRE Libya, you could potentially tie it to the existence of the Exarchate, the bases of the Orthodox church there could have been formed then.

[Tracian Empire]

The thought of Protestant Frenchmen using Schmidt-Rubins to enforce colonial rule inside my country sends shivers up my spin e

Just so you know large portions of both Africa and even a good bit of Oceania(central/southern Australia, New Zealand) are available to you if you change your mind. Some type of semi-advanced gun bearing Maori mounted on huge Moa's could be pretty cool or a somewhat revived Kanem-Bornu cavalry empire of lake chad could be interesting. Just helping out.

Also to the Ops I just want to make sure if my finished app has been seen yet and if there is any issues could you let me know? Thank you.

It has been seen, Oscal started reviewing it yesterday as far as I know, he will finish it as soon as he can.

[Kazarogkai]

It has been seen, Oscal started reviewing it yesterday as far as I know, he will finish it as soon as he can.

I understand, thank you. I kinda expected the wait, it's a pretty... long app to say the least. Both Parts(first comprising the details, the second the history) are at the edge of the character limit for both posts. Not surprisingly I had a reputation for being long winded among my English teachers in school

[Tracian Empire]

Full Nation Name : The Golden Commonwealth of the Rus.

Well, this is a pretty complicated concept and I'm really curious to see how it will work in the IC. I see no particular issues with it, so accepted!

One small issue though - you mention in your history The Golden Horde under Uzbeg saw a flourishing of trade especially with merchants from the northern port cities of the Western Roman Empire, and I believe that you meant the Eastern Roman Empire - the WRE has no northern ports that could directly trade with you xD

I suppose that you'll mention what the "lost princely states in the possession of another power" are after the PLC player will finish his history, as most of those would be there, or do you also claim the old Mongolia?

[Tracian Empire]

>The French are Protestant in this timeline

This is truly a cursed timeline

Hon hon hon.

Calvinist work ethic.

Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrates.

Puritan abolitionism.

Hon hon hon!

Eww.

Orthodox mysticism and Roman pragmatism.

The Roman imperial doctrine and the concept of the universal empire and true orthodox faith.

Caesaropapist Autocracy

Roma aeterna est

[Reverend Norv]

Hon hon hon.

Calvinist work ethic.

Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrates.

Puritan abolitionism.

Hon hon hon!

Eww.

Orthodox mysticism and Roman pragmatism.

The Roman imperial doctrine and the concept of the universal empire and true orthodox faith.

Caesaropapist Autocracy

Roma aeterna est

And this is the basic reason why Europe has been at war for three centuries.

[Tracian Empire]

Map and list updated. We will proceed to take care of inactive reservations tomorrow. As always, not having the time to finish/working on an app is an acceptable excuse, but we have to know about it. People who don't say anything about their inactivity will be removed.

We're discussing the idea of IC events, but until then it would be nice of those accepted would start posting in the IC, me included, as soon as I properly finish my app xD

[Tracian Empire]

Now...for a slightly uncomfortable topic. How was slavery handled?

Slavery came to an end because of the Industrial Revolution. Machines has proved to be more productive and less costly than an enslaved workforce.

And SCP, I understand that you might be busy, but Great Britain is prime real estate. You have 24 hours to try to convince us of the validity of your alternative history concept, as your app so far is a bit worrying, and you have to put some more significant effort into it if you wish to retain your reservation.