1900 : Alternative Divergence | Interest Thread

[The Free Territory of Makhnovia]

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Nation Name:Khaganate of Mongolia
Territory:(Preferably in picture form)

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[The Orson Empire]

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Nation Name: Orson
Territory: Italy, Sicily, Sardinia, Corsica, Angola, the rest of Indonesia
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[Newne Carriebean7]

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Nation Name: The Franzi Empire
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[Oscalantine]

Another can be Isolationist, idealist Soviet Union (probably not possible as Bolshevik revolution wasnt a thing in 1900's) where Stalin failed to come to power and Trotsky's ideal communism prevailed. Such and so forth.

Isolationist Trotksy, now that's something new.

Crap. I think I used a wrong word for "isolationist." Trotsky would have done neverstop revolution against all capitalist worlds... if my Russian history memory isn't lying to me. So I suppose it is more along the lines of "revolutionary, idealist Soviet Union"?

[Danceria]

Isolationist Trotksy, now that's something new.

Crap. I think I used a wrong word for "isolationist." Trotsky would have done neverstop revolution against all capitalist worlds... if my Russian history memory isn't lying to me. So I suppose it is more along the lines of "revolutionary, idealist Soviet Union"?

Leninist, or mild Stalinist?

Edit: Is Franco Iberia still a thing?

[The V O I D]

Cool. I'm thinking of going for an Orwellian Chinese State of some kind, not sure if it'll encompass China or not. If parts of China are taken, great, whatever I get is smaller so that might be more manageable if I go for an Orwellian State. If not, I'll go for all of China under an Orwellian State.

What's an Orwellian State? Should be obvious. Think 1984.

Oh, well it's the year 1900, so a lot of the things common in a typical Orwellian society might be a bit different, but that seems possible. Some sort of legalist regime?

Yeah. A strong legalist regime or something of the sort. It's sorta like from History of the Entire World (I Guess).

"Fuck you, obey the law."

[The V O I D]

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Nation Name: China (placeholder)
Territory: Whatever's left of China, or at the very least, most of China along the eastern coast/most of Eastern China.
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[Togeria]

Oh, well it's the year 1900, so a lot of the things common in a typical Orwellian society might be a bit different, but that seems possible. Some sort of legalist regime?

Yeah. A strong legalist regime or something of the sort. It's sorta like from History of the Entire World (I Guess).

"Fuck you, obey the law."

I love that video.

[Oscalantine]

Crap. I think I used a wrong word for "isolationist." Trotsky would have done neverstop revolution against all capitalist worlds... if my Russian history memory isn't lying to me. So I suppose it is more along the lines of "revolutionary, idealist Soviet Union"?

Leninist, or mild Stalinist?

Hmmm... hold up. Let me get back to you with this...

Alright, back. I don't think Trotsky was either. He CERTAINLY wasn't a Stalinist, as he HATED Stalin, and while he agreed with Lenin in Communist ideals, Trotsky believed in universal communism, where revolution MUST continue at all corners of the globe and EVERY proletariat must be liberated from the bourgeois.

[Danceria]

Leninist, or mild Stalinist?

Hmmm... hold up. Let me get back to you with this...

Alright, back. I don't think Trotsky was either. He CERTAINLY wasn't a Stalinist, as he HATED Stalin, and while he agreed with Lenin in Communist ideals, Trotsky believed in universal communism, where revolution MUST continue at all corners of the globe and EVERY proletariat must be liberated from the bourgeois.

However, your leader realizes that your nation is crap/is determined to peacefully spread the revolution by demonstrating the utopia of Marxism?

[Elerian]

Crap. I think I used a wrong word for "isolationist." Trotsky would have done neverstop revolution against all capitalist worlds... if my Russian history memory isn't lying to me. So I suppose it is more along the lines of "revolutionary, idealist Soviet Union"?

Leninist, or mild Stalinist?

Edit: Is Franco Iberia still a thing?

I believe so, why?

[Oscalantine]

Hmmm... hold up. Let me get back to you with this...

Alright, back. I don't think Trotsky was either. He CERTAINLY wasn't a Stalinist, as he HATED Stalin, and while he agreed with Lenin in Communist ideals, Trotsky believed in universal communism, where revolution MUST continue at all corners of the globe and EVERY proletariat must be liberated from the bourgeois.

However, your leader realizes that your nation is crap/is determined to peacefully spread the revolution by demonstrating the utopia of Marxism?

XDDD dude. You misread. I was just explaining what AD wants from the RPers, not that I support socialism.

Notice I said socialism. The ISK is more familiar with Coporatocracy, and I will have Corporate Revolution not unlike Communist Revolution. The point is that my nation will come to see the proletariat as simple cogs in the machine. It needs to be well oiled and well maintained, but also deserve a few good smacks to get it working. ISK in the 20th century would be seen as the greatest enemy of Communism as this RP progresses.

To be fair... and let's be fair... what happened in USSR under Stalin and Stalinism itself would be completely different from Trotskyism. I wouldn't say that the oppression would have stopped, but Trotsky wanted a soviet democracy, not soviet dictatorship. Trostsky's universal communism idea would have led to democratic federation (not confederation) which would elect a Council that will become the main governing body of ENTIRE communist movement. Its ideals not lied with cult of personality and authoritarian rule of one, but a democratic system which funded the neverending revolution across the globe. I cannot say that it would be effective, since the entire country would be under constant "wartime" preparations, but it certainly won't be politically oppressed Soviet Union that we know today.

[Democratic East-Asia]

-snip-

Basically that. Trotsky had this whole theory of "permanent revolution" where the USSR would be on a permanent war footing till the entire world was liberated. Although tbh, Trotsky was kinda iffy on a lot of things. He crushed the Ukraine anarchists, killed a lot of people, and supported forced industrialization just like Stalin.

RP-wise, a "Trotskyist" esque USSR may be possible, although it's rather iffy. Trotsky himself was in school / university as of 1900, but Russia did have multiple socialist movements prior to the 1900s.

Personally, I do quite like certain aspects of Trotskyism (Soviet democracy, internationalism).

[Greater Slavic Union]

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Nation Name: The Kingdom of Cossacks (The Cossack Hetmanate, informally)
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So... this fucks up my idea... given that you got Kyiv...

[Oscalantine]

-snip-

Basically that. Trotsky had this whole theory of "permanent revolution" where the USSR would be on a permanent war footing till the entire world was liberated. Although tbh, Trotsky was kinda iffy on a lot of things. He crushed the Ukraine anarchists, killed a lot of people, and supported forced industrialization just like Stalin.

RP-wise, a "Trotskyist" esque USSR may be possible, although it's rather iffy. Trotsky himself was in school / university as of 1900, but Russia did have multiple socialist movements prior to the 1900s.

Personally, I do quite like certain aspects of Trotskyism (Soviet democracy, internationalism).

Aaah... that's true. Trotsky joined the Soviets after he started to write about communism as a journal writer. It would take some time before Russia can use Trotsky as a medium for communist Russia, huh?

RP-wise, I have a feeling that Russia and Korea would see each other a a very sore pain in the rear. Both would have to protect their belly, so to say, as Russia has to protect their vulnerable eastern front while Korea has to fight on the ground... which Korea isn't very specialized in. Either way, fun scenario, but I rather not have it XDDD

[Intermountain States]

Basically that. Trotsky had this whole theory of "permanent revolution" where the USSR would be on a permanent war footing till the entire world was liberated. Although tbh, Trotsky was kinda iffy on a lot of things. He crushed the Ukraine anarchists, killed a lot of people, and supported forced industrialization just like Stalin.

RP-wise, a "Trotskyist" esque USSR may be possible, although it's rather iffy. Trotsky himself was in school / university as of 1900, but Russia did have multiple socialist movements prior to the 1900s.

Personally, I do quite like certain aspects of Trotskyism (Soviet democracy, internationalism).

Aaah... that's true. Trotsky joined the Soviets after he started to write about communism as a journal writer. It would take some time before Russia can use Trotsky as a medium for communist Russia, huh?

RP-wise, I have a feeling that Russia and Korea would see each other a a very sore pain in the rear. Both would have to protect their belly, so to say, as Russia has to protect their vulnerable eastern front while Korea has to fight on the ground... which Korea isn't very specialized in. Either way, fun scenario, but I rather not have it XDDD

Just build a wall and make Russia pay for it.

[Greater Slavic Union]

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Nation Name: Western Slavic Kingdom
Territory: Czechoslovakia, Poland, Lithuania (in 1936 borders), East Prussia, Silesia, and west bank of the Dniepr*
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*I suggest to use imgur for the map, also it might be just me, but it is impossible to edit, with this size (to edit decently)

[Oscalantine]

Just build a wall and make Russia pay for it.

Meh, I would let space decide with lots and lots of spies littered in the Siberia. It would take long enough time for Russians to move their forces that I can probably mobilize and build a wall before Russians arrive.

And when they lose, I will make them pay for it. Problem solved XDDD

[Rygondria]

So without norse india i wonder what would happen with southern india, Besides the Indo-Hellenic influences from the north would their be a multitude of independent rajah's, is it larger nations, ETC.

[Oscalantine]

So without norse india i wonder what would happen with southern india, Besides the Indo-Hellenic influences from the north would their be a multitude of independent rajah's, is it larger nations, ETC.

Probably gobbled up by the Koreans if the new India didn't step in. Coastal regions would be controlled and used as ports by Korean trade companies to ship goods more safely to Babylos, which is a primary trade port for Koreans to move their goods up to Constantinople.

Alternatively Korea would have assisted Hellenic India to enforce authority in the region. Chuk-Jae-Do only seeks military intervention when absolutely necessary... see pirates for more details... and would have helped the North subjugate all the Rajah's to ensure security in the region. By extension, the Viceroyalty would have desired free trade going through India, literally force-opening free trade of spices to Rome.

In short? Two ways:
1) Korea saw that Northern India was too weak to side with, and took it upon themselves to maintain waterways clean. No net gain or loss from any parties, but Korea would have guarded Southern India like a dog and as a result no technological innovation in the region.

2) Korea saw potential in Northern India and assisted them to keep order in the South, providing goods, technology, and supply to the northern regime to aid in squashing any insurrections. However in return Korea would have wanted their merchants free reign in the area, which would have opened up spice market through Korea rather than through Persia. End result: India benefits from a strong ally to the south, Korean merchants become even more wealthy, and Rome becomes the largest supplier of Indian spices in Europe.

So... take your pick?

[Rygondria]

So without norse india i wonder what would happen with southern india, Besides the Indo-Hellenic influences from the north would their be a multitude of independent rajah's, is it larger nations, ETC.

Probably gobbled up by the Koreans if the new India didn't step in. Coastal regions would be controlled and used as ports by Korean trade companies to ship goods more safely to Babylos, which is a primary trade port for Koreans to move their goods up to Constantinople.

Alternatively Korea would have assisted Hellenic India to enforce authority in the region. Chuk-Jae-Do only seeks military intervention when absolutely necessary... see pirates for more details... and would have helped the North subjugate all the Rajah's to ensure security in the region. By extension, the Viceroyalty would have desired free trade going through India, literally force-opening free trade of spices to Rome.

In short? Two ways:
1) Korea saw that Northern India was too weak to side with, and took it upon themselves to maintain waterways clean. No net gain or loss from any parties, but Korea would have guarded Southern India like a dog and as a result no technological innovation in the region.

2) Korea saw potential in Northern India and assisted them to keep order in the South, providing goods, technology, and supply to the northern regime to aid in squashing any insurrections. However in return Korea would have wanted their merchants free reign in the area, which would have opened up spice market through Korea rather than through Persia. End result: India benefits from a strong ally to the south, Korean merchants become even more wealthy, and Rome becomes the largest supplier of Indian spices in Europe.

So... take your pick?

It would be a 2 but with the whole sons of Alexander thing might cause them to grow a bit more ambitious, but having the south in revolt at the start of the rp might give the company something to do and would give me time to detail the tactics of the son of Alexander.

[Oscalantine]

It would be a 2 but with the whole sons of Alexander thing might cause them to grow a bit more ambitious, but having the south in revolt at the start of the rp might give the company something to do and would give me time to detail the tactics of the son of Alexander.

Contrary to popular belief, Korean merchants are not Korean Imperial officials. The operation will be considered under the jurisdiction of Chuk-Jae-Do, and the Viceroy is more than willing to swallow any pride for as long as the deals are met.

Korea will immediately fling support to Indian regime if it means that the revolts will start burning ports, as I am 90% certain that there will be major trade ports in the area that will be connected to Chuk-Jae-Do's trade route. It is extremely unlikely that Koreans would be using European trade routes as mercantilism was a force in Europe even until the 20th century, and thus their ports would have been too unstable depending on which governing policies were prominent.

[Rygondria]

It would be a 2 but with the whole sons of Alexander thing might cause them to grow a bit more ambitious, but having the south in revolt at the start of the rp might give the company something to do and would give me time to detail the tactics of the son of Alexander.

Contrary to popular belief, Korean merchants are not Korean Imperial officials. The operation will be considered under the jurisdiction of Chuk-Jae-Do, and the Viceroy is more than willing to swallow any pride for as long as the deals are met.

Korea will immediately fling support to Indian regime if it means that the revolts will start burning ports, as I am 90% certain that there will be major trade ports in the area that will be connected to Chuk-Jae-Do's trade route. It is extremely unlikely that Koreans would be using European trade routes as mercantilism was a force in Europe even until the 20th century, and thus their ports would have been too unstable depending on which governing policies were prominent.

The revolts are from the many ethnic groups that have not been brought under the Indo-Hellenic umbrella, that and religious rebellion, they would see the koreans as poisoning their culture and depending on the faction will react either violently or economically or not at all. But expect it to be very violent since they all despise the mostly Hellenic emperor. Either way things are about to get messy in India.

[Oscalantine]

The revolts are from the many ethnic groups that have not been brought under the Indo-Hellenic umbrella, that and religious rebellion, they would see the koreans as poisoning their culture and depending on the faction will react either violently or economically or not at all. But expect it to be very violent since they all despise the mostly Hellenic emperor. Either way things are about to get messy in India.

Hmmm... well, that is always going to be a possibility. As I said, option two assumes that Korea found current Indian regime capable of ruling their own lands, and thus will blame the government if their merchants are hurt within Indian soil. However, Chuk-Jae-Do cannot care less about what the populous think about and will support the Indian government regardless. If rebellion overthrow the current regime, however, Koreans will park their ships to enforce option one, which probably won't be prompted until it is 100% certain that the current government will collapse.

[Rygondria]

The revolts are from the many ethnic groups that have not been brought under the Indo-Hellenic umbrella, that and religious rebellion, they would see the koreans as poisoning their culture and depending on the faction will react either violently or economically or not at all. But expect it to be very violent since they all despise the mostly Hellenic emperor. Either way things are about to get messy in India.

Hmmm... well, that is always going to be a possibility. As I said, option two assumes that Korea found current Indian regime capable of ruling their own lands, and thus will blame the government if their merchants are hurt within Indian soil. However, Chuk-Jae-Do cannot care less about what the populous think about and will support the Indian government regardless. If rebellion overthrow the current regime, however, Koreans will park their ships to enforce option one, which probably won't be prompted until it is 100% certain that the current government will collapse.

The emperor is ofcourse not going to sit around and will send the imperial army to deal with it, the problem arises when the reach jungle which will slow their approach and give the rebels time to ambush, one of the only ways they can face the imperial army because head on battle with the Imperial army would result in the rebellion being crushed. That and siege warfare of the important port cities on the coast would take up alot of time, so it might take a couple months for the full force of the Imperial army to arrive in the south with the garrisons being pinned down in holding the fortifications. That and the fact that they might or might not still use war elephants might give you an idea on some of their military tradition though modern arms are becoming the standard their is still a strong sense of Alexandrian tradition in the army.