Demens Chosen [PL: Into the Abyss - CLOSED]

[Giovenith]

Swith-

1) Your flag keeps fucking me up, making me think my internet's being spotty. Curse you.

2) How is it not common knowledge by now that you're a CoOP and your characters function as thread management and not just for a power jerkoff? It's been what, five years now you've been explaining this to people?

3) I echo Ched's sentiments, you and all our CoOPs' deserve a backpat. I think we all do actually, for putting up with each other's varying degrees of crap.

4) Take a Faustian gambit

If I cut down to essentials, then yes, definitely - assuming of course your replies coincide with that.

If something comes to taking him out, again, want to make clear I totally wouldn't be upset. Truly. I can do it in a way that makes sense storywise too. I'm just happy you're not holding a grudge (though you'd probably have every right to). If you're cool with me and I'm cool with you, that's all that matters in the end.

No grudge was considered.
If you think it's possible then let's try that. I won't count the days or anything but let's make an honest effort to get this done in 14 days or so and just keep that vague deadline as a motivator for all of us.
You're a great writer GIo never doubt that. I love the pony stuff and Sundae Surprise tickles me delightfully. One day I want you to write up a blurb for the pony version of Luxa.

Much goodness!

[Mincaldenteans]

So tempted to throw something semi-random at the Booze group right now.

But I'm waiting on a certain mole, cause I have no idea if he's got a reaction post or not.

-civet mulling mode activate-

[Cerillium]

Gio, if it makes you feel better, I actually clicked it expecting something other than a redirect to her nation page.

I'm obviously tired. I should have gone to bed an hour ago but I browsed here before logging off. Big mistake, as always.

@Gio. I'm all for sticking with the story to get it knocked out. Prim, Tilt and I can put our efforts in to support you in whatever you need. Also, Faust is a goddess.

@All. I couldn't do this without my CoOP team. They keep me sane, especially Tilt's humor. Problems arise and they approach it with maturity. I ask for help, they willingly give it despite their own hectic schedules. All that aside-

@Swith. I'm sorry you're still getting flack. You have my complete trust regarding your characters and your ability to balance them for sake of the game. It's the same trust I've extended to others with powerful characters. You've all had plenty of opportunity to power trip as well as the means to do so. You all aimed low to let others rise up in victory.

As for ownership - yup, the fennec is right.

@All. PL isn't a game to be won against other players. There's no reason for competition between characters. God or ostrich, every character brings their talents and minds to the setting. Rather than worrying about a character being too overpowered, find a reason to drag that character into a story where potency would be beneficial to the group. The character wouldn't be in PL if I didn't trust the player to play them properly.

@Min. DOO EET!

@Prim. Kick me tomorrow if I don't respond to your Googidoc.

G'nite all.

[Fvaarniimar]

@Swith. I'm sorry you're still getting flack. You have my complete trust regarding your characters and your ability to balance them for sake of the game. It's the same trust I've extended to others with powerful characters. You've all had plenty of opportunity to power trip as well as the means to do so. You all aimed low to let others rise up in victory.

As for ownership - yup, the fennec is right.

@All. PL isn't a game to be won against other players. There's no reason for competition between characters. God or ostrich, every character brings their talents and minds to the setting. Rather than worrying about a character being too overpowered, find a reason to drag that character into a story where potency would be beneficial to the group. The character wouldn't be in PL if I didn't trust the player to play them properly.

*is glad you trust her to play chars properly!*

Swith, I trust you a great deal. *nods* (I do think that Marcus' lashing out from having his organic hand touched was a bit unfair and the sort of thing which should have been cleared; while the Drova punching also was very out of line, a char sticking within the rules of a fight shouldn't be killed for that without warning by an experienced, respected player's non-vengeful character for the sake of not-hinted-at development - especially given how upsetting it was to every OTHER character.)

That, over years of RP, is the only time I've felt Swith wasn't living up to her own amazingly high standards - Swith, you're awesome. My single complaint about Nes taking charge is...she's less available for friendly interaction. Yes, seriously. If anything I wish your chars spent much less time in tool mode, because THEY'RE COOL. THANK YOU Swith and Cer. Hang in there!

Regarding competition - people are competitive sometimes. Maybe embracing that could be fun! What if competitions putting participants on a similar footing were worked in - whether as training or goofing off? I could see pop culture trivia proving interesting - especially to chars without that background. ESL residents could play vocabulary games. Ranged magic users could hold a contest of aim - judged by mundanes trained to hit their target precisely. Thought exercises - ie best way to handle a mission-typical situation - could be posed and answered. And the prize? Why, extra creamer! Of course!

I think the key to keeping such contests balanced might simply be choosing tasks that the group can't ace anywhere near effortlessly without being blatantly ooc. If I put Rmwtyliin in an English vocab contest - let's say bingo - I could see her maybe getting four easy common words, and that's assuming pronunciation and reading them don't throw her off. I simply couldn't have her do much better without messing up my canon or having her cheat. I expect Hectaros, Sig, and some others would be in a similar position.

But regarding "My char is best char! Is at center of story!" - Nah. I think anyone of that opinion needs to reread the fate of Gio's Emperor WhateverHisSixth-FloorMeritingNameIs.

I've seen GMs (ok, GM) trying to treat every other character as supporting cast for their Sues and Stus. It's groanworthy and RP-killing. And our illustrious staff's attitude COULD NOT be much farther from that. They keep squashing their chars into the background and giving everyone else so doggone many chances to shine - and even letting others in on stories like the frontlines against the rats despite needing to hold back as a result.

Do what our GMs have been doing - run your chars to help the story, but let them shine a bit as is happening with Rache and Meva! Pleeeeeeeaase?

Regarding the stories -
*lightly swats squirrel*
Give yourself credit! LC is amazing! Like Ched said, there's so much char development potential- of course I don't want out! I'm chomping at the bit to meet some Xo, though. And as for slow - I've had more off days than I'd like. It's not just one player's fault.

@Slo: Raiders is excellent! Slow? Ok, sure. But slow also means we're really covering the time - hour by hour, minute by minute. The setting is utterly fascinating - honestly I wish we had many, many pictures to which we could refer. I sincerly doubt my imagination is doing it justice!

[Ganonsyoni]

I talked it over with NA about it and I think it is time to park Kale for an amount of time. RPing and writing in PL has become less of a fun hobby activity and more of a chore. I don't get the same excitement out of posting as I did before. I don't know why. I feel like I could try something bigger, create and craft bigger stories and worlds beyond one character. But, I should take up writing instead of trying to run an actual RP with my inconsistent schedule. Plus I have other things to do and other friends to distract my time with jollymaking and jerking around. And games, and work, and etc. Maybe find some inspiration out there in the time I'm gone.

NA and I talked on how to park Kale. It would make sense. Leave her parked for a time, till I feel like coming back for another go.

I'll still be in the discord. I'll be around to pop in and chat. Talk about life and things. But RPing is on the backburner for the time being.

[Tiltjuice]

I talked it over with NA about it and I think it is time to park Kale for an amount of time. RPing and writing in PL has become less of a fun hobby activity and more of a chore. I don't get the same excitement out of posting as I did before. I don't know why. I feel like I could try something bigger, create and craft bigger stories and worlds beyond one character. But, I should take up writing instead of trying to run an actual RP with my inconsistent schedule. Plus I have other things to do and other friends to distract my time with jollymaking and jerking around. And games, and work, and etc. Maybe find some inspiration out there in the time I'm gone.

NA and I talked on how to park Kale. It would make sense. Leave her parked for a time, till I feel like coming back for another go.

I'll still be in the discord. I'll be around to pop in and chat. Talk about life and things. But RPing is on the backburner for the time being.

(beer)

[Swith Witherward]

Just doing a bit of explaining to clear up confusion.

Fvaar's observation: (I do think that Marcus' lashing out from having his organic hand touched was a bit unfair and the sort of thing which should have been cleared; while the Drova punching also was very out of line, a char sticking within the rules of a fight shouldn't be killed for that without warning by an experienced, respected player's non-vengeful character for the sake of not-hinted-at development - especially given how upsetting it was to every OTHER character.)

That's... not how it happened. That's how Torsi tried to pass it off, though.

Torsi's character had been doing very stupid things in the IC... everything from threatening people more powerful than her to openly talking genocide in front of the natives. Other characters had already expressed their exasperation at Torii's antics long before arriving at the island. The character was already in a hostile mood on Christmas and had threatened Drova, then blustered at Marcus. This was mainly because Torsi was bored, imho.

GODDAMNIT I JUST POSTED AGAIN RRREEEEEEEE

I....I don't wanna revise...fights bruh...

I've low key been itching for a fight with those two for a while.

Unfortunately, that edit after I posted changed the continuity.

The only downside to the edit is that my post doesn't match the intensity any longer. Marcus responded to her calling him a jackass and chasing after him. Now he looks like he's a sociopath screaming at a calm girl.

Torsi didn't want to redact. She was given every opportunity to have her character back down from this fight. Other characters urged Torii to in the IC. Torsi asked my opinion via TG and I was very clear that things wouldn't end like a typical fight between teenagers. Marcus also made clear what was at stake and gave her the opportunity to walk away with her head held high... a chance for some potent character growth.

Torsi went full-on stupid and had her character fight rather than walking away.Torii died. Torsi progressed the scene while people were offline, thus nobody was on to write their characters coming to Torii's aid.

I make no apology. I feel no remorse. Roleplay is what it is. We've all said it over the years: don't advance the story while people are offline, and take responsibility for your character's actions.

An unfair death is one that comes without any warning... no communication attempts made. There's no motive nor reason for it. This was a fairly played combat scene. Torsi had warning in both the form of OOC and TG communication, as well as other player posts in the IC. I offered fair warning in the post preceding her action, a full indication that Marcus was powering up (Torii was present when he powered up to stop a creature crashing through the jungle, though it turned out to be Opa). Her final post with Torii indicated that she was aware of his ability, though she broke continuity by saying she'd never associated ozone with Marcus. It's not my fault that she overlooked canon, nor should I play out of character to compensate for player ignorance.

Immediately afterwards, Torsi stated, "I fucked up". That progressed to "it was unfair" and everyone else's fault. Repeating nonsense doesn't make it true, but it does skewer other people's perceptions of an event over time. Thankfully, we have record of it in the IC and OOC, and Cer's response includes some of the TG conversation between Torsi and I.

I really don't think you get why I'm annoyed.

I knew of Torii's two options: Fight or back down. I shot a TG asking about the fight option, and was told to think of it like a martial art style psyche¹, yada yada yada. What I took from that was that Torii would have to approach a fight carefully, and from what I assumed through TG, that if they did fight, then she would have a chance to win, even if slim . The lightning seemed out of nowhere on my part, because it had been inferred that it was a fistfight, which I assumed a character with a backbone would go for.² That was one point where I was initially confused, and then worried. I had taken fron TG's that between her two options, even if Torii did fight, and looking at dialogue between her and Marcus, assumed that she would have a chance to actually duke it out and win, despite Marcus being bigger³.

Then the death in general. Swith was initially confused as well as to why characters just stood there and then walked away. To me, it was annoying that this whole scene had played out, one person kills another, and then onlookers just shrug and walk off, or go back to dinner to socialize. I'd taken from past experiences in the IC that, justified or not, there would be consequences for one resident killing the other over an argument.⁴

On top of that, the immediate "well, too bad, she's dead, Jim." That confused me. I didn’t expect a revive, but, again, from TG's with Swith, I was told that there are ways to start a stopped heart (it does happen with lightning strike victims), and that healers would be able to help. Come to the IC, try to do both, and the general consensus is immediately "nope, no chance, she's dead", and healers doing pretty much nothings, besides one giving a glorified pulse check.

The entire playout of the situation felt unnatural and dirty. I'd talked it over. I took the chance, and I didn't expect any miracles, but I had been under the impression that the day could be saved, and that if I tried I could pull it off. The insta-kill without a chance to fight and the instant indifference/jaded reactions and lack of anyone else save for Magh stepping in to offer aid was what left me disappointed and annoyed. So the group suddenly now realizes it's disjointed in some sudden lesson? That's good and all, but nobody felt the need to speak out or try to revive? I find that whole sudden realization way to much to swallow.

I wouldn't be as rustled as I am now if it were Torii just dying, even if I knew there had been a fighting chance and some greater reaction or backlash, but as it is it just feels way too out of touch for me. That's why I feel as annoyed as I am. It's a bit worse, considering he sudden clusterfuck that ruined Christmas because me, and then suddenly screwing up the boar hunt, which was the most interesting thing to happen since the arrival at the island, and an event that I was ready to do, and felt like Christmas would mess up, which it did IMO.

1. What was stated between you and Swith (screen capture available):

The Confederacy of Torsiedelle
21 hours ago
I'm worried on how to pursue this IC...
I mean, I want Torii to throw a punch, but I also know how to go peaceful...

Wired To → Torsiedelle
20 hours ago
[snip unrelated]
If she throws a punch, even verbal, it means she accepts the consequences. He'll counterattack. Think of it as a martial arts approach rather than as a teen approach. She's been in enough combat situations to understand, and probably has a better perspective than a civilian teen the same age would have.

Emphasis mine. Coupled with the IC posts, character warnings (Marcus and Gio), Romy's stern advice, and Brit's interruption, I'm not seeing where anyone thought she had any chance of winning.

Martial arts are codified systems and traditions of combat practices, which are practiced for a number of reasons: as self-defense, military and law enforcement applications, mental and spiritual development; as well as entertainment and the preservation of a nation's intangible cultural heritage. What Swith was saying, from what I can see, was "I'm going to have Marcus respond as he's trained to, not as a silly teen thing". Her IC posts display a codified approach. Readers don't have to be familiar with Marcus' culture in order to see he's laying down terms that he intends both parties to abide by.


2. "The lightning seemed out of nowhere on my part, because it had been inferred that it was a fistfight, which I assumed a character with a backbone would go for."
This approach is unfair, really. You expect everyone to fit your character's cultural norms though those norms all seem based in American culture. There's some major cultural insensitivity going on, most of it due to the sisters' intolerance of everything that isn't their nation. I'm fine with this approach. However, characters should not be expected to run out of character just to prevent these OOC dustups.

3. There is no three. I forgot what I was going to add. Might go back to it.

4. Torsi, you rushed things. Players weren't online. You kept posting for Katya, advancing time, not giving people a chance to post. People inside the pavlion are still unaware of what's going on. I wasn't on to scramble cultist or a medical team. You haven't allowed for anyone to bring up the death (beyond Katya screaming). This results in a dogpile of posts, with many posters unable to post because someone else already shifted the setting while they were writing. I just encountered that posting for Adrastus. Had to remove a large section because the Jedi walked off.

You also aren't cutting anyone any slack. The Jedi doesn't carry automated external defibrillators (AED) on them. Nobody does. The Jedi can sense that a heart has stopped though. Opa doesn't have that equipment. Meps or Bran might be able to harness the droid's energy but the result might damage the body. Plus they aren't there yet.

Now you're angry again. Katya is storming off. We players must live with the consequences of your actions once more. We weren't online thus our characters were bypassed. We weren't able to articulate our posts without certain elements in place (naming dispatching someone trained to help with this shit), so our characters are blamed. Swith is blamed for misleading you, though she couldn't have possibly known that you'd be in such a rush.

All of this for a character that isn't perma-dead (yet)?

Take a break from PL stress. Not a ban or anything. Just take the night off. Allow the IC to catch up and players to sort things. Give yourself a chance to decompress.

If you have a problem with things after that, take it up with me. Don't punish these good people for not responding fast enough to "jump!" They do not deserve a guilt trip. They are not responsible for your actions as a player. They did not want to spend Christmas night caught up in more Torii drama. They are trying to help you see this as a positive way to grow as a player but every suggestion is met with "no" in a myriad of forms.

And thar ya have it.

Good luck, Carly! I think parking Kale is a good idea. Taking time away lets you come back with fresh ideas for her.

[Giovenith]

Excellent words of encouragement, Fvaar!

I think you've got the right idea, Carly. See if you prefer solo writing more, but be welcome back anytime.

[Swith Witherward]

*snorts* I spoilered, and snipped off my prior stuff. Lemme try to recapture!

Fvaar, I think it would be fun to have some sort of competition IC. I'd wanted to do an obstacle course between teams, but we ended up not doing the actual training for sake of having a mental break. And yeah, I'm not into "my char is best char" either. It's great in a game designed for one-upping, but we've got so much diversity in PL that it just doesn't work well here.

Thanks for being supportive. I really appreciate that. We wouldn't have a game without you and the rest of the fam.

Is it Friday yet? Please tell me it's Friday!

[Northwest Slobovia]

Is it Friday yet? Please tell me it's Friday!

Three minutes.

[Tiltjuice]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWEZyP_t4uA

[Cerillium]

Prim, we need to conspire. Klingon food must go home with the group. Must.

Gio, yes! HWE is back! Beautiful to read, too.

Lovecraftian horror = "shiny woo-woo stuff".

[Swith Witherward]

I'm probably going to take the night off.

You see, I have a death wish. It involves my wonderful child inviting eight of her classmates over to spend the night. Nine tween girls. MLP DVD collections, Twilight, and food. Oh sweet Jesus. Oh Lord, preserve us all.

[Mincaldenteans]

Post later today, off to see Wonder Woman!

[Northwest Slobovia]

You see, I have a death wish. It involves my wonderful child inviting eight of her classmates over to spend the night. Nine tween girls. MLP DVD collections, Twilight, and food. Oh sweet Jesus. Oh Lord, preserve us all.[/spoiler]

That's not a death wish, that's proof of insanity. *sends men with butterfly nets*

[Tiltjuice]

I'm probably going to take the night off.

You see, I have a death wish. It involves my wonderful child inviting eight of her classmates over to spend the night. Nine tween girls. MLP DVD collections, Twilight, and food. Oh sweet Jesus. Oh Lord, preserve us all.

Enough marshmallows and all your senses will be dampened.

[Giovenith]

I'm probably going to take the night off.

You see, I have a death wish. It involves my wonderful child inviting eight of her classmates over to spend the night. Nine tween girls. MLP DVD collections, Twilight, and food. Oh sweet Jesus. Oh Lord, preserve us all.

Twilight's still popular?

[Monfrox]

I'm probably going to take the night off.

You see, I have a death wish. It involves my wonderful child inviting eight of her classmates over to spend the night. Nine tween girls. MLP DVD collections, Twilight, and food. Oh sweet Jesus. Oh Lord, preserve us all.

SCHO-KA-KOLA!

[Giovenith]

I thought of Cer.

[Cerillium]

Still looking for apps. Some people are working on them:

Swith - Am and Nila are in the works. I'm reviewing Charu prior to publication. I've got Marcus covered.
Prim - he's actively reworking his apps.
Slo - will post them after Raiders.
Fvaar - I need Rmwtyliin Fvvarniimalasaakuuliia, Kwa'a Bhewehg, and Nick.
Tilt - wasn't sure if you're parking all but MB and Calani?
Min - Col Fluffy, though he's not vital at the moment.
Sakarias and Oecammi?
My characters - I've got many. Some might be dropped. Others are going through a revision.

I bring this up because it's a good excuse for players to look over their apps (if current) or reconsider the old app's content. Are the characters working towards their objectives? Have they found a purpose? Has that purpose changed? Have they honed existing skills? Have they picked up any new skills?

[Cerillium]

I thought of Cer.

LMAO

[Chedastan]

I bring this up because it's a good excuse for players to look over their apps (if current) or reconsider the old app's content. Are the characters working towards their objectives? Have they found a purpose? Has that purpose changed? Have they honed existing skills? Have they picked up any new skills?

I think Romy and Nivea's apps are a tiny bit outdated in format, and I mean like one or two character minor questions are missing that in the current version of the app. I think this is probably because there were released a tad early before the current one was officially finalized as the most updated one.

Regardless, I'll look them over myself too and see if anything about the characters have changed.

[Mincaldenteans]

I was working on Oecammi, though I'm still mulling over it. The ol' colonel also WIP, but far more completed than Oecammi, just missing a respectable picture and some minor incomplete details -nods-

[Tiltjuice]

Still looking for apps. Some people are working on them:

Tilt - wasn't sure if you're parking all but MB and Calani?

Mains - Chrys, MB, Calani/Mathias. Those last two rotate and I think everyone except MB has an up to date app.

Cuisine - parked
Luce - generally parked / reserved for Minerva, Misaki, cultists in general

I thought of Cer.

How do you find?

[Swith Witherward]

*winces* Min and Boozy teammates, if that doesn't work for you, let me know.