1870 : Alternative Divergence [AH][OOC][REBOOT]

[Tracian Empire]

The Romans call many foreigners barbarians. And since we seem to have had a turbulent past, the Huns especially will be unfortunately called like that by most Romans.

Thats fine as long as the similarities are there.

Well, I'm not sure what to say. I mean, I have no problem with it, but Sanabel's point is slightly right, we already have four other nations with various degrees of Roman influence.

[Western Imperial Union]

Christ, is just everyone super Roman?

It somehow seems like that. But in the case of the Huns, I think that it would for the best for them to only accept Roman administrative and religious elements, culturally I don't know how much the Romans would spread north of the Danube.

This is largely what I am going for.

[The V O I D]

Void, would it be okay if we would change some dates? The Kingdom of Italia should be formed in 490 by Zeno, but we need Justinian and Belisarius, so Italy would be fully retaken only in 540(Rome) 560(all of Italy).

I mean, I can adjust them slightly, yes, but I'd prefer to avoid it if possible.

I'm trying to keep it at least somewhat gap-free.

[Western Imperial Union]

Thats fine as long as the similarities are there.

Well, I'm not sure what to say. I mean, I have no problem with it, but Sanabel's point is slightly right, we already have four other nations with various degrees of Roman influence.

I don't have to get the tech boost, I don't care about that I just wanted the interesting mix as my nation.

[Tracian Empire]

Void, would it be okay if we would change some dates? The Kingdom of Italia should be formed in 490 by Zeno, but we need Justinian and Belisarius, so Italy would be fully retaken only in 540(Rome) 560(all of Italy).

I mean, I can adjust them slightly, yes, but I'd prefer to avoid it if possible.

I'm trying to keep it at least somewhat gap-free.

Well, it's not necessarily about gaps. The Kingdom of Italia can be formed in the Roman controlled southern Italy at any time between the Fall of the WRE and the death of Zeno, 491. But there would be no Roman interest to retake Italy until Justinian, and the Italians themselves would have to face the Ostrogoths, which were pretty strong until their internal issues that began in 534.

[Sanabel]

Well, I'm not sure what to say. I mean, I have no problem with it, but Sanabel's point is slightly right, we already have four other nations with various degrees of Roman influence.

I don't have to get the tech boost, I don't care about that I just wanted the interesting mix as my nation.

that mix is a cliche now, though

[Western Imperial Union]

I don't have to get the tech boost, I don't care about that I just wanted the interesting mix as my nation.

that mix is a cliche now, though

I'm not worried about it, nor do I care.

Edit: This sounds far meaner than I meant

[Sanabel]

that mix is a cliche now, though

I'm not worried about it, nor do I care.

Just letting you know, since you wanted and interesting mix. Pannonia has a lot of other potential mixes, something with the Jassics could be cool.

[Tracian Empire]

Even taking FYROM, and I will only recognize the modern state of Macedonia as FYROM, would deal a significant dent in the Roman territory, so those wars will have to be discussed.

[The V O I D]

I mean, I can adjust them slightly, yes, but I'd prefer to avoid it if possible.

I'm trying to keep it at least somewhat gap-free.

Well, it's not necessarily about gaps. The Kingdom of Italia can be formed in the Roman controlled southern Italy at any time between the Fall of the WRE and the death of Zeno, 491. But there would be no Roman interest to retake Italy until Justinian, and the Italians themselves would have to face the Ostrogoths, which were pretty strong until their internal issues that began in 534.

Alright, I'll change the dates, but can you just TG them to me in chronological order please?

[Tracian Empire]

Well, it's not necessarily about gaps. The Kingdom of Italia can be formed in the Roman controlled southern Italy at any time between the Fall of the WRE and the death of Zeno, 491. But there would be no Roman interest to retake Italy until Justinian, and the Italians themselves would have to face the Ostrogoths, which were pretty strong until their internal issues that began in 534.

Alright, I'll change the dates, but can you just TG them to me in chronological order please?

Alright

[Tracian Empire]

So, any suggestions for Roman military weaknesses?

[Second Helghan Empire]

So, any suggestions for Roman military weaknesses?

Numbers and maybe mobility?
I would say flexibility and adapting but the romans tended to actually be pretty good at that if I recall school very well. For your navy maybe your ships are easier to destroy but faster and harder hitting?

[The Ik Ka Ek Akai]

A new year has come

es Thoopir Thkarie

[Danceria]

What'd I miss?

[Atreidya]

sorry it took so long to get this up, holiday season and all that.


Full Nation Name : Zagwe Sultanate
Majority/Official Culture :Ethiopian
Territorial Core : Ethiopia, Djibouti, Somalia, Sudan east of the Nile, Sychelles
Territorial Claim : East African Coast, Madagascar, Kenya, the rest of Sudan
Capital City : Alyabila, (Lalibela)
Population :12,000,000

Government Type : Monarchy
Government Ideology/Policies : Expansionist
Government Focus : Military and Culture
Head of State : Sultan Arkaan al-Alyabila
Head of Government : Sultan Arkaan al-Alyabila
Government Description : Traditionalist Monarchy

Majority/State Religion : Shia Islam
Religious Description : While still technically Shia the Sultanate is almost entirely alttakayuf, (Adapting). This became a core concept that altered the way both the sultanate and regional islam went about dealing with others. They followed a prospect of adapting their religion slightly to make it easier to convert people.

Economic Ideologies : Mercantilism
Major Production : Natural resources specifically large amounts of minerals and ores.
Economic Description : The economy has been based off of trading with foreign nations across the Indian ocean for centuries. While in recent years this has definitely diminished the Zagwe Sultanate is still known for it's trading power, even that which it once had. While in the past the economy relied almost entirely on trade passing through it's ports to other lands it now resides on the sale of resources from the inland region of the country. This has caused some to be unhappy as the exported goods vastly out way the imported and many feel Zagwe traders are given poorer deals than other nations. Trade and sailing however remain an integral part of the Zagwe identity.

Army Strength : well trained with Extreme Devotion
Army Weakness : Outdated weapons
Naval Strength : Very skilled and Proud Sailors
Naval Weakness : outdated ships
Further Military Description : The Zagwe Navy has greatly skilled and trained sailors. They have been loaned to allied navies throughout history. Zagwean sailors maintain this pride, and while now they largely just patrol their waters and trade lanes they remain some of the best in the world. Their ships are vastly outdated making their crews have to work much harder just to to try and make up the difference. The Zagwean army is in much the same situation, with soldiers trained extremely well for fighting in a diverse set of landscapes primarily deserts and arid grasslands. However while their training is very good arguably their greatest feature is their devotion to the Sultan. Many feel Sultan Arkaan will bring their nation back to it's former glory and them along with it. Their dedication is nigh limitless. Like the navy their equipment is severely outdated which causes many problems, however they have less developed nations on their immediate borders which makes this less of a problem. However the threat of a modern nation coming to blows with Zagwe has become the center of worry and the Sultanate looks to advance it's forces technology.

National Goals : Expand Further in africa and become a great trade power again.
National Issues : the Sultanate needs to attempt to modernize and build up it's trade ties.
National Figures of Interest : Ramis al-Alyabila, Taamir al-Mogadishu, Nizaam al-Medina
National Ambition/Aspirations : Become a world Player, have strong influence across the Indian ocean and Africa

History :
Axum continues as a major African state as far as 825, it then begins a slow decline that eventually fractures it into dozens of smaller states.

In 830 the coastal regions of the Sultanate were were invaded and largely made into a series of minor port colonies by several Muslim groups from the Arabian peninsula. In 854 they break from their Arabian masters and become a part of a renewed Kingdom of Aksum. Under Nizaam al-Medina in 868 Shia Islam begins it's spread into the region. Dominating the coastal areas it remains largely at peace with the Christian and Jewish native populace who largely welcome them with peace. Previous Muslim minorities further inland are quickly amalgamated by this offshoot.

By 900 the Influence of this 'adaptive' Muslim movement becomes the Majority of the African coastal areas, including Zagwe, a small Kingdom with the capital of Lalibela formerly strictly Christian. While the capital of Lalibela remained slightly Christian the kingdom had become Muslim in every thing but official decree. This would change at the invasion by the army of Taamir al-Mogadishu. Having wed the daughter of the king of Zagwe Taamir had a claim to the throne that began to slip when his new wife's uncle ascended to the throne before him. The Somalian forces under his rule attacked Lalibela however they found the nearby states supportive of the small kingdom and so Taamir was slain and his wife returned home to Lalibela. Her son however would ascend to the throne of Zagwe at twenty. Ramis al-Alyabila would be the first Muslim ruler of Zagwe.

Ramis like his father would be a warrior. He enforced his claim over the Somalians to the south and succeeded in replacing his cousin as the ruler. Ramis al-Alyabila would declare the Sultanate of Zagwe in 970. This would begin the expansion of Zagwe over the next several centuries.

By 1000 Zagwe reached from Lalibela in the north and west and then east to the Indian ocean. Mogadishu and Berbera as well as several other cities along the coast became rich. Resources and slaves from the interior made their way along the secure roads of the Sultanate before beginning the long sailing journey as far as Malayasia and even Japan. Zagwe was by far the dominant african state in the area. Several Client states along the fringes of the Sultanate existed almost purely at Zagwe's whim. Forming a protective buffer and paying tribute these states became a trouble by 1243.

In 1243 Zagwe had declined slightly. It's lack of steady expansion and show of force had made it's neighbors and vassals bold. Several refused to pay tribute and many others outright launched raids of the Sultanate's lands. This would in the long run actually revive Zagwe. Fearing their nation was about to be overrun the Sultanate would begin sacking it's rebellious vassals. Some chose to pay their tribute to attempt to avoid the wrath, few succeeded. By 1500 Zagwe had taken the territories spanning the land from the Southern Nile near Juba, as far as the Horn of Africa and from Asmara in the north to the southern tip of Somalia.

The 1500's and 1600's would see the transition again to a more trading focused styled state. Now able to trade with the likes of Korea, Japan, and China with more ease Zagwean ships sailed as far as western Europe. Trade boomed and again Zagwe grew rich. Exotic goods were brought from every corner of the known world and soon Zagwe was known by foreign traders as a friendly place for goods and work. Over this time slowly yet surely Zagwe continued it's expansion north into Sudan.

By 1785 Zagwe had territory from the edges of Egypt to the Jungles of Tanzania. However Zagwe entered a steady decline, rebellions and civil wars fought continuously from this time to 1850 would eventually caused the losses of several regions on the peripheral. Trade began to decrease, as it became easier for European and Asian powers to bypass the Sultanate for trade.

In 1850 Sultan Arkaan al-Alyabila took his elder brother's throne. He was forced to combat a conspiracy from his own younger brother to become Sultan and spent the first five years consolidating his throne. Arkaan was able to largely win over his supporters by promising them to renew the greatness of Zagwe. He further solidified this promise by seizing the Seychelles. It took a year to fully establish the military ports now used there, and another two to properly set up the civilian aspect of the Islands under the Sultanate. However by 1865 several hundred Zagweans settled onto the Islands.

Having accomplished this Sultan Arkaan has largely proven to his people he is willing to work toward his goal of rebuilding Zagwe or even expanding it. His commitment to Zagwe is matched by the people's commitment to him.

Comparison Points – Political :3
Comparison Points – Cultural/Religious :2
Comparison Points – Economy : 3
Comparison Points – Military : 2
Total Comparison Points used (10 Points MAX) : 10/10

Here Tracian, what else do I need to fix on my application?

[Imperial Idaho]

So wait, what's up with the brownish color in the western US?

[Elerian]

So wait, what's up with the brownish color in the western US?

Isn't that you?

[Intermountain States]

So when will the original post be updated with accepted nations?

[Imperial Idaho]

So wait, what's up with the brownish color in the western US?

Isn't that you?

Probably, just the claims seemed odd since I though Cambria was supposed to own part of it.

Nevermind then.

[Tracian Empire]

So, any suggestions for Roman military weaknesses?

Numbers and maybe mobility?
I would say flexibility and adapting but the romans tended to actually be pretty good at that if I recall school very well. For your navy maybe your ships are easier to destroy but faster and harder hitting?

Maybe despite my technological advancement, which would make my army be pretty good, my navy, except for some ironclads, would be bad?

The Romans were never known for their Navy, and perhaps except for a small core that became the ironclads, they relied on the Greek fire too much to invest a lot in their navy.

[Tracian Empire]

A new year has come

es Thoopir Thkarie

We don't speak barbarian tho

[Tracian Empire]

So when will the original post be updated with accepted nations?

I would, if only the rest of the OP board would give me the password to the puppet.

[Tracian Empire]

sorry it took so long to get this up, holiday season and all that.


Full Nation Name : Zagwe Sultanate
Majority/Official Culture :Ethiopian
Territorial Core : Ethiopia, Djibouti, Somalia, Sudan east of the Nile, Sychelles
Territorial Claim : East African Coast, Madagascar, Kenya, the rest of Sudan
Capital City : Alyabila, (Lalibela)
Population :12,000,000

Government Type : Monarchy
Government Ideology/Policies : Expansionist
Government Focus : Military and Culture
Head of State : Sultan Arkaan al-Alyabila
Head of Government : Sultan Arkaan al-Alyabila
Government Description : Traditionalist Monarchy

Majority/State Religion : Shia Islam
Religious Description : While still technically Shia the Sultanate is almost entirely alttakayuf, (Adapting). This became a core concept that altered the way both the sultanate and regional islam went about dealing with others. They followed a prospect of adapting their religion slightly to make it easier to convert people.

Economic Ideologies : Mercantilism
Major Production : Natural resources specifically large amounts of minerals and ores.
Economic Description : The economy has been based off of trading with foreign nations across the Indian ocean for centuries. While in recent years this has definitely diminished the Zagwe Sultanate is still known for it's trading power, even that which it once had. While in the past the economy relied almost entirely on trade passing through it's ports to other lands it now resides on the sale of resources from the inland region of the country. This has caused some to be unhappy as the exported goods vastly out way the imported and many feel Zagwe traders are given poorer deals than other nations. Trade and sailing however remain an integral part of the Zagwe identity.

Army Strength : well trained with Extreme Devotion
Army Weakness : Outdated weapons
Naval Strength : Very skilled and Proud Sailors
Naval Weakness : outdated ships
Further Military Description : The Zagwe Navy has greatly skilled and trained sailors. They have been loaned to allied navies throughout history. Zagwean sailors maintain this pride, and while now they largely just patrol their waters and trade lanes they remain some of the best in the world. Their ships are vastly outdated making their crews have to work much harder just to to try and make up the difference. The Zagwean army is in much the same situation, with soldiers trained extremely well for fighting in a diverse set of landscapes primarily deserts and arid grasslands. However while their training is very good arguably their greatest feature is their devotion to the Sultan. Many feel Sultan Arkaan will bring their nation back to it's former glory and them along with it. Their dedication is nigh limitless. Like the navy their equipment is severely outdated which causes many problems, however they have less developed nations on their immediate borders which makes this less of a problem. However the threat of a modern nation coming to blows with Zagwe has become the center of worry and the Sultanate looks to advance it's forces technology.

National Goals : Expand Further in africa and become a great trade power again.
National Issues : the Sultanate needs to attempt to modernize and build up it's trade ties.
National Figures of Interest : Ramis al-Alyabila, Taamir al-Mogadishu, Nizaam al-Medina
National Ambition/Aspirations : Become a world Player, have strong influence across the Indian ocean and Africa

History :
Axum continues as a major African state as far as 825, it then begins a slow decline that eventually fractures it into dozens of smaller states.

In 830 the coastal regions of the Sultanate were were invaded and largely made into a series of minor port colonies by several Muslim groups from the Arabian peninsula. In 854 they break from their Arabian masters and become a part of a renewed Kingdom of Aksum. Under Nizaam al-Medina in 868 Shia Islam begins it's spread into the region. Dominating the coastal areas it remains largely at peace with the Christian and Jewish native populace who largely welcome them with peace. Previous Muslim minorities further inland are quickly amalgamated by this offshoot.

By 900 the Influence of this 'adaptive' Muslim movement becomes the Majority of the African coastal areas, including Zagwe, a small Kingdom with the capital of Lalibela formerly strictly Christian. While the capital of Lalibela remained slightly Christian the kingdom had become Muslim in every thing but official decree. This would change at the invasion by the army of Taamir al-Mogadishu. Having wed the daughter of the king of Zagwe Taamir had a claim to the throne that began to slip when his new wife's uncle ascended to the throne before him. The Somalian forces under his rule attacked Lalibela however they found the nearby states supportive of the small kingdom and so Taamir was slain and his wife returned home to Lalibela. Her son however would ascend to the throne of Zagwe at twenty. Ramis al-Alyabila would be the first Muslim ruler of Zagwe.

Ramis like his father would be a warrior. He enforced his claim over the Somalians to the south and succeeded in replacing his cousin as the ruler. Ramis al-Alyabila would declare the Sultanate of Zagwe in 970. This would begin the expansion of Zagwe over the next several centuries.

By 1000 Zagwe reached from Lalibela in the north and west and then east to the Indian ocean. Mogadishu and Berbera as well as several other cities along the coast became rich. Resources and slaves from the interior made their way along the secure roads of the Sultanate before beginning the long sailing journey as far as Malayasia and even Japan. Zagwe was by far the dominant african state in the area. Several Client states along the fringes of the Sultanate existed almost purely at Zagwe's whim. Forming a protective buffer and paying tribute these states became a trouble by 1243.

In 1243 Zagwe had declined slightly. It's lack of steady expansion and show of force had made it's neighbors and vassals bold. Several refused to pay tribute and many others outright launched raids of the Sultanate's lands. This would in the long run actually revive Zagwe. Fearing their nation was about to be overrun the Sultanate would begin sacking it's rebellious vassals. Some chose to pay their tribute to attempt to avoid the wrath, few succeeded. By 1500 Zagwe had taken the territories spanning the land from the Southern Nile near Juba, as far as the Horn of Africa and from Asmara in the north to the southern tip of Somalia.

The 1500's and 1600's would see the transition again to a more trading focused styled state. Now able to trade with the likes of Korea, Japan, and China with more ease Zagwean ships sailed as far as western Europe. Trade boomed and again Zagwe grew rich. Exotic goods were brought from every corner of the known world and soon Zagwe was known by foreign traders as a friendly place for goods and work. Over this time slowly yet surely Zagwe continued it's expansion north into Sudan.

By 1785 Zagwe had territory from the edges of Egypt to the Jungles of Tanzania. However Zagwe entered a steady decline, rebellions and civil wars fought continuously from this time to 1850 would eventually caused the losses of several regions on the peripheral. Trade began to decrease, as it became easier for European and Asian powers to bypass the Sultanate for trade.

In 1850 Sultan Arkaan al-Alyabila took his elder brother's throne. He was forced to combat a conspiracy from his own younger brother to become Sultan and spent the first five years consolidating his throne. Arkaan was able to largely win over his supporters by promising them to renew the greatness of Zagwe. He further solidified this promise by seizing the Seychelles. It took a year to fully establish the military ports now used there, and another two to properly set up the civilian aspect of the Islands under the Sultanate. However by 1865 several hundred Zagweans settled onto the Islands.

Having accomplished this Sultan Arkaan has largely proven to his people he is willing to work toward his goal of rebuilding Zagwe or even expanding it. His commitment to Zagwe is matched by the people's commitment to him.

Comparison Points – Political :3
Comparison Points – Cultural/Religious :2
Comparison Points – Economy : 3
Comparison Points – Military : 2
Total Comparison Points used (10 Points MAX) : 10/10

Here Tracian, what else do I need to fix on my application?

Try to write the strengths and weaknesses in sentences at least. The rest looks okay to me. There are still some capital letters around that have to be fixed.

[Tracian Empire]

Well, this has been quiet.