1855 : Alternative Divergence [AH][OOC][REBOOT][Semi-closed]

[The Ik Ka Ek Akai]

Europe is Eastern to the Native Americans, and Persia is Western to China. Do not think geography, for "Western" is almost universally applied as an ethnic, cultural, and technological category.

Hence how there can be evil western influences on places like Korea and Arabia.

Oh my god stop. Now. We have tread this path before with Tracian and Novacom just stop now.

Wait, seriously? I didn't think there'd be an actual thing about this.

Also, I hope it is realized that the thing was simple jesting. I had been answering partially in-character for a reason, that being trying to discredit Saxahvall as "Foreign" and whatnot, it probably being a thing in Nepal's propaganda.

[Conwy-Shire]

Quietly creeping. I will get a post up tonight or at least asap. I am trying to do as little as possible right now because I am uncertain as to how everyone feels about me. Except rome and cheng I guess.

If they don't like what you're doing, snow them in with swarms of Russians - or better yet, non-russian minorities

[Oscalantine]

-snip-

Coolz. But even in character... you may need to visit Saxahvall's history a bit. He has been sovereign of India for SO long in our AH that Viking=India probably settled as a norm. ^^;;;

Also... something I want to ask: for secondary guidances... would it be too much to allow multiple partners? As in... if country A, B, and C has collectively created secondary guidance... would A and C be allowed to have another guidance? Or do you think that it would result in guidance-spamming?

[The Ik Ka Ek Akai]

-snip-

Coolz. But even in character... you may need to visit Saxahvall's history a bit. He has been sovereign of India for SO long in our AH that Viking=India probably settled as a norm. ^^;;;

Also... something I want to ask: for secondary guidances... would it be too much to allow multiple partners? As in... if country A, B, and C has collectively created secondary guidance... would A and C be allowed to have another guidance? Or do you think that it would result in guidance-spamming?

Ah, but then maybe Nepal's history should be revisited too. Nepal's queen is of the Imperial Gupta dynasty, as in the first guys since the Mauryans to unite India under Dharmic practice. I specify the later part because Saxahvall is getting there, but they've got their creole religion.

So, not only would Nepal have a claim to much of India based on that whole "Gupta" thing in theory, but they've got the nice habit of being the last major Hindu kingdom, and mixed with being the defender of Buddha, Nepal can claim itself as a beacon of Dharmic culture while attempting to emphasize the Norse aspects of Saxahvall, conveniently ignoring the Hindu aspects. Nepal is, in comparison, fully Hindu. The invention of linguistic study in the 18th century (wherein Sanskrit was linked to Latin and Greek) could also prove beneficial, as the Khas/Gurkha/Nepali language actually has Sanskrit influences, theoretically making it "closer" to the original pan-Indian language.

And don't get me started on the whole "Aryan vs. Aryan" thing that could be brought up.

[The Ik Ka Ek Akai]

Coolz. But even in character... you may need to visit Saxahvall's history a bit. He has been sovereign of India for SO long in our AH that Viking=India probably settled as a norm. ^^;;;

Also... something I want to ask: for secondary guidances... would it be too much to allow multiple partners? As in... if country A, B, and C has collectively created secondary guidance... would A and C be allowed to have another guidance? Or do you think that it would result in guidance-spamming?

Ah, but then maybe Nepal's history should be revisited too. Nepal's queen is of the Imperial Gupta dynasty, as in the first guys since the Mauryans to unite India under Dharmic practice. I specify the later part because Saxahvall is getting there, but they've got their creole religion.

So, not only would Nepal have a claim to much of India based on that whole "Gupta" thing in theory, but they've got the nice habit of being the last major Hindu kingdom, and mixed with being the defender of Buddha, Nepal can claim itself as a beacon of Dharmic culture while attempting to emphasize the Norse aspects of Saxahvall, conveniently ignoring the Hindu aspects. Nepal is, in comparison, fully Hindu. The invention of linguistic study in the 18th century (wherein Sanskrit was linked to Latin and Greek) could also prove beneficial, as the Khas/Gurkha/Nepali language actually has Sanskrit influences, theoretically making it "closer" to the original pan-Indian language.

And don't get me started on the whole "Aryan vs. Aryan" thing that could be brought up.

There's a wonderful contrast. The small, nativist kingdom perpetuating ways of old, or the sprawling creole empire? Who will win?

[Elerian]

Coolz. But even in character... you may need to visit Saxahvall's history a bit. He has been sovereign of India for SO long in our AH that Viking=India probably settled as a norm. ^^;;;

Also... something I want to ask: for secondary guidances... would it be too much to allow multiple partners? As in... if country A, B, and C has collectively created secondary guidance... would A and C be allowed to have another guidance? Or do you think that it would result in guidance-spamming?

Ah, but then maybe Nepal's history should be revisited too. Nepal's queen is of the Imperial Gupta dynasty, as in the first guys since the Mauryans to unite India under Dharmic practice. I specify the later part because Saxahvall is getting there, but they've got their creole religion.

So, not only would Nepal have a claim to much of India based on that whole "Gupta" thing in theory, but they've got the nice habit of being the last major Hindu kingdom, and mixed with being the defender of Buddha, Nepal can claim itself as a beacon of Dharmic culture while attempting to emphasize the Norse aspects of Saxahvall, conveniently ignoring the Hindu aspects. Nepal is, in comparison, fully Hindu. The invention of linguistic study in the 18th century (wherein Sanskrit was linked to Latin and Greek) could also prove beneficial, as the Khas/Gurkha/Nepali language actually has Sanskrit influences, theoretically making it "closer" to the original pan-Indian language.

And don't get me started on the whole "Aryan vs. Aryan" thing that could be brought up.

Straight up Hinduism is so old hat tho . . .

Dhanga å Være is the new shiz, a synthesis between glorious Norse Paganism and old hat Hinduism. Its all the rage with the kids back home m8.

(Because of the big run on sentence in your second paragraph, I don't quite know what that whole bit about emphasizing Norse aspects of Saxahvall is all about)

[The Ik Ka Ek Akai]

Ah, but then maybe Nepal's history should be revisited too. Nepal's queen is of the Imperial Gupta dynasty, as in the first guys since the Mauryans to unite India under Dharmic practice. I specify the later part because Saxahvall is getting there, but they've got their creole religion.

So, not only would Nepal have a claim to much of India based on that whole "Gupta" thing in theory, but they've got the nice habit of being the last major Hindu kingdom, and mixed with being the defender of Buddha, Nepal can claim itself as a beacon of Dharmic culture while attempting to emphasize the Norse aspects of Saxahvall, conveniently ignoring the Hindu aspects. Nepal is, in comparison, fully Hindu. The invention of linguistic study in the 18th century (wherein Sanskrit was linked to Latin and Greek) could also prove beneficial, as the Khas/Gurkha/Nepali language actually has Sanskrit influences, theoretically making it "closer" to the original pan-Indian language.

And don't get me started on the whole "Aryan vs. Aryan" thing that could be brought up.

Straight up Hinduism is so old hat tho . . .

Dhanga å Være is the new shiz, a synthesis between glorious Norse Paganism and old hat Hinduism. Its all the rage with the kids back home m8.

(Because of the big run on sentence in your second paragraph, I don't quite know what that whole bit about emphasizing Norse aspects of Saxahvall is all about)

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Basically, Nepal can use the fact that Saxahvall is indo-Norse instead of pure Indian as propaganda. Nepal can push itself forward as the proper ruler, India for Indians, with their Gupta queen.

[Elerian]

Straight up Hinduism is so old hat tho . . .

Dhanga å Være is the new shiz, a synthesis between glorious Norse Paganism and old hat Hinduism. Its all the rage with the kids back home m8.

(Because of the big run on sentence in your second paragraph, I don't quite know what that whole bit about emphasizing Norse aspects of Saxahvall is all about)

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Basically, Nepal can use the fact that Saxahvall is indo-Norse instead of pure Indian as propaganda. Nepal can push itself forward as the proper ruler, India for Indians, with their Gupta queen.

Good job! You didn't say Indo-Saxon.

I feel yah, but you're probably about 500 years late for that argument to be valid now.

[The Ik Ka Ek Akai]

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Basically, Nepal can use the fact that Saxahvall is indo-Norse instead of pure Indian as propaganda. Nepal can push itself forward as the proper ruler, India for Indians, with their Gupta queen.

Good job! You didn't say Indo-Saxon.

I feel yah, but you're probably about 500 years late for that argument to be valid now.

Well, that whole "Gupta claimant" thing is almost 1500 years late by this point. It's not going to stop her from trying.

[Elerian]

Good job! You didn't say Indo-Saxon.

I feel yah, but you're probably about 500 years late for that argument to be valid now.

Well, that whole "Gupta claimant" thing is almost 1500 years late by this point. It's not going to stop her from trying.

GG, Saxahvall is doomed, may as well jump ship and surrender now.

[The Ik Ka Ek Akai]

Well, that whole "Gupta claimant" thing is almost 1500 years late by this point. It's not going to stop her from trying.

GG, Saxahvall is doomed, may as well jump ship and surrender now.

#IndoAryanIsBestAryan

[Oscalantine]

GG, Saxahvall is doomed, may as well jump ship and surrender now.

#IndoAryanIsBestAryan

The interesting fact is that Nepal is in Cheng's pathway of getting roflstomped. I would have chosen friends with fellow Indians than choosing to go rivalry. I mean... Courland can only do so much when Chinese with all its men are tossed into the problem XDDD

[Tracian Empire]

The triumphus will start today, I only have to make some last edits to the rough draft I've written yesterday. I've even found a cool anthem for Rome.

[The Ik Ka Ek Akai]

#IndoAryanIsBestAryan

The interesting fact is that Nepal is in Cheng's pathway of getting roflstomped. I would have chosen friends with fellow Indians than choosing to go rivalry. I mean... Courland can only do so much when Chinese with all its men are tossed into the problem XDDD

To be perfectly honest, Nepal's content with staying as it is, although we are a bit concerned about the rapid growth of Saxahvall.

[Elerian]

#IndoAryanIsBestAryan

The interesting fact is that Nepal is in Cheng's pathway of getting roflstomped. I would have chosen friends with fellow Indians than choosing to go rivalry. I mean... Courland can only do so much when Chinese with all its men are tossed into the problem XDDD

I thought you said numbers weren't everything

[Conwy-Shire]

I thought you said numbers weren't everything

Numbers make me queasy

[Oscalantine]

The interesting fact is that Nepal is in Cheng's pathway of getting roflstomped. I would have chosen friends with fellow Indians than choosing to go rivalry. I mean... Courland can only do so much when Chinese with all its men are tossed into the problem XDDD

I thought you said numbers weren't everything

Yes, it isnt everything. However, for nations that has "numeric advantage" as their strength in their apps, these folks throwing weights around constitutes as using their nation's advantages to best potential.

The problem I have is someone saying "my billion men... never mind how I got them... owns you without any competition!!" Junk. If you say "since my nation has a lot of soldiers, I can continue to send soldiers to front lines to deplete your will to fight," that is clever use of your nation's characteristics (given that this IS your advantage point in your app) and is fine with me ^^

[Elerian]

I thought you said numbers weren't everything

Yes, it isnt everything. However, for nations that has "numeric advantage" as their strength in their apps, these folks throwing weights around constitutes as using their nation's advantages to best potential.

The problem I have is someone saying "my billion men... never mind how I got them... owns you without any competition!!" Junk. If you say "since my nation has a lot of soldiers, I can continue to send soldiers to front lines to deplete your will to fight," that is clever use of your nation's characteristics (given that this IS your advantage point in your app) and is fine with me ^^

Yay me then, cause I've got that trait. (I'll try and be tasteful how I use it though)

[Of the Quendi]

So I am not allowed any say in the matter while you are allowed to have sailed ships up and set up camp and at the same time claim I'm not allowed to do anything? Remember you started this all off by getting the idea of a Panama Event neutralized, it is a bit unfair to claim I can't say to have done anything while you yourself landed a sizable force.

You cannot god mod no. If you went through proper diplomatic channels before attacking you would have automatically alerted the Brazilian government to the possibility of an attack which would allow them to make preparations for one. If you didn't go through diplomatic channels then you can launch a surprise attack as much as you want. But you cannot do both, no.

Not even a high ranking soldier, someone completely expendable as trust in Brazilian honor is so low for it to be examined would require an archaeologist, in light of the declared intent of protecting the Americas and then going on a conquest spree and standing by and doing nothing while others conquer. As for Negotiations, he's been sent on a timer to get the Brazilians to leave, once they have begun to leave then further diplomacy can happen, simply because my government refuses to allow facts on the ground to be established and are well within their right to remove you by force, that exclusion zone is still in force after all, that alone gives me just cause enough.

The territory in question is terra nullius and the Aztecs have no greater rights to it then the Brazilians or anyone else. As for the supposed hypocrisy of me "going on a conquest spree" (name one American territory Brazil has conquered) seeing as that is exactly what the Aztecs is doing, annexing the very nations that the Sousa Doctrine was set up to protect I am getting tired of explaining to you why the Brazilian actions are in no way contradicting my doctrine (and even if they where, Brazil has the prerogative to alter its foreign policy priorities when realities changes).

In Brazil's defense, the Empire's foreign ministry largely succeeded in pushing France out of North and South America. Cambria is the only European power with vast colonies remaining in the Americas. That's an accomplishment.

Indeed. Its the one achievement Brazil was able to get done in the aftermath of the piracy thing, to at least save New Granada and Venezuela even if Haiti (which was of particular concern to Brazil) fell. With New Granada having had sovereignty over Panama I would argue that for Brazil to go there is not only acceptable by the Sousa Doctrine but a logical next step to implement its agenda of keeping (south) American states safe.

That's fairly realistic. 1864 was a bad year for Denmark.

While our King (a German) offered to have Denmark join the German Confederation I doubt it was ever more than a pipe dream. But yes that was definitely the closest Denmark has ever been to seizing to exist as a sovereign nation.

[Second Helghan Empire]

Too bad for poor Denmark in this RP eh Quendi?

I mean now being a german first european second and danish last nation the Danes have lived under hanseatic rule since the early 1800's shortly after Napoleon in fact. By 1900 their culture will have become so muted by the Hamburgian and Prussian ideals that Denmark as an Idea will be a long forgotten memory.

[Novacom]

So I am not allowed any say in the matter while you are allowed to have sailed ships up and set up camp and at the same time claim I'm not allowed to do anything? Remember you started this all off by getting the idea of a Panama Event neutralized, it is a bit unfair to claim I can't say to have done anything while you yourself landed a sizable force.

You cannot god mod no. If you went through proper diplomatic channels before attacking you would have automatically alerted the Brazilian government to the possibility of an attack which would allow them to make preparations for one. If you didn't go through diplomatic channels then you can launch a surprise attack as much as you want. But you cannot do both, no.

Not even a high ranking soldier, someone completely expendable as trust in Brazilian honor is so low for it to be examined would require an archaeologist, in light of the declared intent of protecting the Americas and then going on a conquest spree and standing by and doing nothing while others conquer. As for Negotiations, he's been sent on a timer to get the Brazilians to leave, once they have begun to leave then further diplomacy can happen, simply because my government refuses to allow facts on the ground to be established and are well within their right to remove you by force, that exclusion zone is still in force after all, that alone gives me just cause enough.

The territory in question is terra nullius and the Aztecs have no greater rights to it then the Brazilians or anyone else. As for the supposed hypocrisy of me "going on a conquest spree" (name one American territory Brazil has conquered) seeing as that is exactly what the Aztecs is doing, annexing the very nations that the Sousa Doctrine was set up to protect I am getting tired of explaining to you why the Brazilian actions are in no way contradicting my doctrine (and even if they where, Brazil has the prerogative to alter its foreign policy priorities when realities changes).

In Brazil's defense, the Empire's foreign ministry largely succeeded in pushing France out of North and South America. Cambria is the only European power with vast colonies remaining in the Americas. That's an accomplishment.

Indeed. Its the one achievement Brazil was able to get done in the aftermath of the piracy thing, to at least save New Granada and Venezuela even if Haiti (which was of particular concern to Brazil) fell. With New Granada having had sovereignty over Panama I would argue that for Brazil to go there is not only acceptable by the Sousa Doctrine but a logical next step to implement its agenda of keeping (south) American states safe.

That's fairly realistic. 1864 was a bad year for Denmark.

While our King (a German) offered to have Denmark join the German Confederation I doubt it was ever more than a pipe dream. But yes that was definitely the closest Denmark has ever been to seizing to exist as a sovereign nation.

Complete and utter Hypocrisy, you landed in that area without giving ANYBODY a chance to respond you specifically argued for that to be the case with the only option I was offered was some of my own ships being sank after the fact, yet you would accuse me of godmodding?

This whole surprise attack angle has come out of everyone else's suppositions, I have planned out my course of actions which will be in accordance with said plans not to fit into others preconceptions, as for waving the savage card and international norms, as I said I declared the sea you traveled through as an exclusion zone. If this had been RP'd out properly (Which I actually argued for with what you'd initially being posted retconned so something could be sorted out properly but as ever ignored as usual!) opposed to teleporting in and setting up shop, I would have either intercepted you and turned you back through threat of force or through actual force as given this is my back yard moving around sufficient forces wouldn't have been difficult while this area is still some distance away from what would be your established military ports. Especially as you stated in past posts you sent a truly massive force, and you've already demonstrated that you ignore my own diplomacy ala that zone so the idea of you having ignored a request to leave isn't that far fetched. If you want to claim you are prepared for an attack then you also acknowledge that you've ignored Diplomacy, I did mention this course of action cut the rug out from under you and I certainly don't shy away from doing what needs to be done, the Ascendancy isn't a toothless dog nursing wounded prestige after all



By your own Logic much of your own expansions were American nations, so can the rhetoric it doesn't wash, especially as you've declared this doctrine and then acted against it, that has repercussions on how others will view you, your right or not it changes others opinions of you based on that fact, it makes Brazil look like opportunistic liars who can't be trusted and you can protest all you like it doesn't actually change opinions as ICly your justifications arn't going to be known. As for New Granada, again not buying it, no Spanish settlers meaning that the natives which were Nahua among other flavours means that I have direct claim over that area as remember no Aztec Genocide means that the facts are rather different on the ground to what you would prefer as I have frequently said and you have frequently tried to rearrange to suit your own purposes.

[Tracian Empire]

For the ones who would want to listen to the song I took as the anthem of Rome, here is a link. It might be from a movie made in China, but it's the only thing I found that's close to a possible anthem, and it's really cool.

[Oscalantine]

For the ones who would want to listen to the song I took as the anthem of Rome, here is a link. It might be from a movie made in China, but it's the only thing I found that's close to a possible anthem, and it's really cool.

Alright. I take your anthem, and raise you [Roma]. It may not be anthem material, but it fits Imperium's current situation AND its pride perfectly! XDDD

Love Lesiem... for all their effects... they make rather interesting musics.

[Tracian Empire]

For the ones who would want to listen to the song I took as the anthem of Rome, here is a link. It might be from a movie made in China, but it's the only thing I found that's close to a possible anthem, and it's really cool.

Alright. I take your anthem, and raise you [Roma]. It may not be anthem material, but it fits Imperium's current situation AND its pride perfectly! XDDD

Love Lesiem... for all their effects... they make rather interesting musics.

Quite an interesting song you've got there. I like it. It wouldn't sound that official to be an anthem though, but I still like it.

[Tracian Empire]

About the origin of the anthem I've used, I think that it would have been made sometime during the Crusade that attacked Constantinople, since it speaks about how the Imperium isn't scared about the might of the enemy forces, and then about victory.