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1850 : Alternative Divergence [AH][OOC][CLOSED]

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Oscalantine
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1850 : Alternative Divergence [AH][OOC][CLOSED]

Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 7:41 pm

1850 : Alternative Divergence

OOC THREAD





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“Men make History, but not at the time he wishes.”

– Karl Marx__________________________________


But for the sake of argument, what if we could?

Be it a point of divergence or a whole new nation, what if we could make history EXACTLY at the point that we wish?





Hello and welcome to Another Alternative Divergence, an AH/AW RP where the world is your oyster to do whatever you wish. For the sake of continuity, the time now is 1850 C.E., and nations are expanding in a world not quite yet sobered by war for annihilation. What would be your vision of a world shaped by the nation that you call your own?





Again, for the sake of continuity, we should set a few ground rules.

  • All apps need a point of start and build-up – Whether you start from stone age and build it up to 1850 or simply change a few things here and there from 1800’s is up to you, but I would like for all nations to have an interesting history behind it… to prove you are capable AH/AW Rper.
  • All nations MUST be somewhat original – Let’s try to be a bit more creative than having Great Britain at all its glory. You can keep the name and title, but you MUST have some degree of DIFFERENCE between your nation and the IRL ones.
  • Everything can be excused with reason – I am willing to let anything be possible as long as it is stated clearly in the app with full explanation as to why it has come to be for your nation. … Similarly, I will accept NOTHING without a proper explanation.


Nation Application

Code: Select all
[b]Full Nation Name :[/b]
[b]Majority/Official Culture :[/b] [[What your people identify themselves with… French, Chinese, Iroquois, Touareg, etc.]]
[b]Territorial Core :[/b] [[place where you have absolute control over]]
[b]Territorial Claim :[/b] [[OPTIONAL]] [[region NOT your core where your nation’s ambition lies]]
[b]Capital City :[/b] [[Its IRL location and name]]
[b]Population :[/b]

[b]Government Type :[/b] [[Monarchy, Republic, etc.]]
[b]Government Ideology/Policies :[/b] [[OPTIONAL]] [[Militant, Imperialist, Expansionist, etc.]]
[b]Government Focus :[/b] [[Tell me a little bit about what is your government’s focus… be it military, economy, culture, legitimacy, etc.]]
[b]Head of State :[/b] [[highest-ranking individual in the nation according to rule of law]]
[b]Head of Government :[/b] [[highest-ranking defacto ruler]]
[b]Government Description :[/b]

[b]Majority/State Religion :[/b] [[OPTIONAL]] [[It does not have to be IRL religion]]
[b]Religious Description :[/b] [[OPTIONAL]]

[b]Economic Ideologies :[/b] [[Capitalism, Mercantilism, Socialism, Communism, etc.]]
[b]Major Production :[/b]
[b]Economic Description :[/b]

[b]Army Strength :[/b]
[b]Army Weakness :[/b]
[b]Naval Strength :[/b]
[b]Naval Weakness :[/b]
[b]Further Military Description :[/b] [[OPTIONAL]]

[b]National Goals :[/b]
[b]National Issues :[/b] [[what needs to be fixed in order for your nation to achieve its true potential]]
[b]National Figures of Interest :[/b] [[OPTIONAL]] [[Are there any Mother Teresas or Moses that we need to know about?]]
[b]National Ambition/Aspirations :[/b] [[OPTIONAL]] [[Not really a set objective, but rather the big picture that your nation is drawing towards]]

[b]History :[/b] [[Can be in paragraph or bulletpoint timeline.]]

[b]Comparison Points – Political :[/b] [[How much national focus is gone into administrating the government, i.e. espionage, royal marriages, counter-intelligence, etc.]]
[b]Comparison Points – Cultural/Religious :[/b] [[How much national focus is gone into religious and or cultural aspects, i.e. asking for excommunication, call for crusade, soviet revolution in other nations, etc.]]
[b]Comparison Points – Economy :[/b] [[How much national focus is gone into economic matters, i.e. embargo/blockade efficiency, lasting through war of attrition, simply feeding your people better, etc.]]
[b]Comparison Points – Military :[/b] [[How much national focus is gone into military, i.e. discipline, morale, better tacticians/generals, etc.]]
[b]Total Comparison Points used (10 Points MAX) :[/b] /10


Guidance System [[OPTIONAL]]

This is something that I would like to try. We are creating an alternative world, right? Is there any historical divergence that you would like to be uniquely yours? Did the Chinese industrialize faster than Europeans? Did the Vikings settled down and colonized the Americas? Did the plague never wipe out Native Americans? Submit the app below, and you can add ONE alternative point as FACTUAL HISTORY for our RP!

A few things to keep in mind:
  • You can only have ONE Guidance. I’ll be the deciding judge on what is or what is not a single guidance.
  • I would rather like this to be regional or global phenomenon, instead of “Nation A is the STRONGEST IN HISTORY!”
  • Remember, you can always use your Guidance to cancel our others.
    • EX- You can cancel out “Chinese industrialized faster than Europeans” with “Chinese industrialized faster than Europeans EXCEPT the English, French, Spanish, Portuguese, and the Dutch, which still managed to industrialize even faster.”
  • If not stated by app or by Guidance, assume that the world was same as before. Of course, every app and every guidance will become something that need to be kept in mind in the RP.

Guidance Application

Code: Select all
[b]Guidance Name :[/b] [[Every great event has a title. Doesn’t need to be fancy, like “Nanauatl hears our woes!” for curing the Smallpox by Spanish, and so on.]]
[b]Guidance Description :[/b] [[What happened?]]
[b]Affected Area :[/b] [[Just Europe? Just Middle East? Global?]]
Last edited by Oscalantine on Sat Sep 19, 2015 4:48 am, edited 33 times in total.

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Oscalantine
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Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 7:41 pm

Current Map - Updated 2015-08-29
Image

[Grey-ish Territories without names are claimed territories thus far]

ADDITIONAL INFORMATION
The light Grey areas are AUTO-DENY if app is done, with exceptions pointed out in the map.
Last edited by Oscalantine on Fri Aug 28, 2015 8:24 am, edited 29 times in total.

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Oscalantine
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Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 7:42 pm

Accepted Reserves - Updated 2015-07-26

[[Territories can be found in the above maps as to which territories are still open]]

Accepted Applications - Updated 2015-08-29




Hiatus Applications - Updated 2015-08-21
[[This is for apps that have since declared that they have to take a break. Claims by these apps can be taken, in which case the app will disappear]]


Accepted Guidance - Updated 2015-08-12
Guidance Name : The Achaemenid Collapse

Guidance Description : After the death of Darius I, the throne of Persia was contested between Xerxes and his half-brother Artobarzanes, the eldest son. The two brothers competed for influence amongst the satraps, and each created his own sphere of influence. The revolts in Egypt and Babylon grew, and the two brothers rushed to suppress them. In Babylon, Xerxes actions outraged the natives and the Persians were kicked out of the city. Achaemenes, a brother of Xerxes was sent to crush the revolt in Egypt, but he later declared the independence of Egypt by making himself Pharaoh and adopting Ancient Egyptian customs. Artobarzanes, taking the opportunity, declared himself King of Babylon and led her armies to victory over a few Persian armies. Unrest erupted over the empire and soon the Hebrews, Phoenicians, Anatolians and Assyrians too declared their independence. Xerxes and his armies were unable to prevent said things from occurring and he had to be content with Persia, Media and Elam.

Thus, the Persian empire was now pushed to the east, consisting of the Iranian plateau and parts of Central Asia. For many years after, they would try without success to conquer the territories of her former empire. In many of the states, old Persian marbles became the rulers. To cement their control, they adopted the cultures and languages of their respective territories

Affected Area : Middle East, Central Asia, Egypt, and Greece (Greece because Xerxe's invasion of Greece wouldnt have happened)

Implications :
  1. Alexander conquered the Middle East... Persian Empire. Regardless of this, Persia simply fell faster. In its place many kingdoms rose prior to Alexander's conquest. However, once Alexander passed away, the native kingdoms, NOT his general, replaced the power vacuum.
  2. For unforeseen reason, Roman influence in the region was never that high. Many of the Middle East kingdom survived either by outlasting the empire or simply paying tribute until the Romans fell apart.
  3. As a result, Jerusalem still lives, and its second temple is still intact. For all intents and purposes, the holiest place in Christian beliefs still stands tall. However, as the major religion is Judaism in the area and not of fully-Christian dogma, the Jewish would never surrender to Christian controls, indicating that a fully-independent Jewish nation must exist with Israel as core.
  4. Islamic conquest still happened. Prophet Muhammad's teachings still spread from Middle East to North Africa and Central Asia. However, in the Middle East, native religions such as Zoroastrianism and others survived, worshiped by the native kingdoms which has outlasted the hostile Jihad by the Muslims. As a result, North Africa and Middle East region has a very strong Islamic influence, and nations with cores in the region should at least tolerate Sunni religion for to start with the nation as its core.

Guidance Name : Legacy of Song continues
Guidance Description : Scientific and technological revolutions occurred during Song Dynasty was astounding. These legacies allowed Song Dynasty leaps and miles ahead of technological capabilities of other nations. It could be argued that Song Dynasty was able to continue its existence thanks to its own technological feats rather than its administrative capabilities. However, its eventual fall to the Mongols saw the fall of Song Dynasty… but nots its legacy.
Under the Pax Mongolia, the technologies were inherited Mongol Empire, who allowed these technologies to flourish and continue. More importantly, technological engineering of Song Dynasty were shared with the rest of the world. This allowed Mongol Empire and to spread the engineering feats of Song Dynasty with the Far East cousins, allowing Far East countries great amount of technological advancement under Pax Mongolia.
Furthermore, with the creation of Golden Khanate after the fall of Mongol Empire, which allowed the Khanate ideals of advancement and sharing of scientific advancements, invaded and successfully re-conquered the Chinese once more, further allowing Song Dynasty’s legacies to be continued and shared. This allowed the Song Dynasty’s scientific progress to continue throughout the oriental history.
Furthermore, as Golden Khanate held firm grip in the orient, the neo-Confucian idea were unable to become the dominant ideology. Neo-Confucianism, which in current timeline halted scientific progress due to its conservative beliefs, were unable to take root in China and Far East in general. Without the philosophical bottleneck, the legacy of Song Dynasty continued, allowing industrialization to occur in the Far East.
In short, due to Song Dynasty’s legacy kept in hold by the Mongolian grip on the Chinese proper, Far East regions maintained their technological growth, allowing them to compete with the Western nations. While not superior… and perhaps not even very well spread, the Europeans had to acknowledge that the Far East were their equals in terms of science and culture.

Affected Area : Oriental Asia, including Manchurian provinces, mainland China, Korean Peninsula, and Japanese Islands. European perception of Far East region has also changed from “primitive” to “equals.”

Implications :
  1. The region of East Asia has technological advancement similar to that of West.
  2. Due to this technological feats, East Asian nations are accepted into the "imperial world" much as the same as Westerners, as they are unable to ignore the East's power

Guidance Name : Potential diplomatic recognition by Britain?

Guidance Description : Despite the willingness of London's creditors, and bankers to deal with the supposedly rogue colonies within North America the royal government has since the creation of the American Commonwealth refused to deal with them. For a period of 204 years since the failed rebellion by Parliament against the absolutist tendencies of King Charles I, and the mass exodus to the colonies following the aftermath of the loss their has been absolute diplomatic silence. Now with the industrial revolution undermining the traditional power of the aristocracy there is being undermined by the expanding middle class. The need for goods which have long been absent from the British economy has also stirred some murmur in the government as well. A diplomatic attaché arrived in Philadelphia, and has been working toward progress in an official treaty known as the Convention of Philadelphia, but the question remains if the current monarch will approve of the treaty or continue longstanding policy.

Affected Area : The Americas, and potentially global trade.

Implications :
  1. The Parliament of England left the mainland for today-commonwealth, afterwards they pursued independence
  2. American Commonwealth and British mainland don't see eye to eye because former sees latter as a tyrant and hindrance to human progress
  3. Parliament did scorched earth upon the lands that they were settled on... which would have recovered by 1850. However, at the time it was damaging enough that it could have caused a massive setback, which allowed America to successfully gain independence with much of British claims in North America
  4. Cambria's religious reformation back to Druidism alienated many, forcing the exodus to this new nation where religious freedom was assured. While, again, population decrease since then has been mended by Cambria, the result was greater population increase in the ex-colony in the British-colonial regions and American Scientific Renaissance, the foundation from which the Industrial Revolution in the Commonwealth occurred.

Guidance Name : Rihla Dawah (The Great Journey of Invitation)
Guidance Description : The Great Journey of Invitation was an expansive network of missionaries, merchants, and converted leaders of African states originally formed during the early 14th century, but still active to this day as one of the largest organized groups religious groups on the planet. It was founded by notable Moroccan traveler and scholar Ibn Battuta (Though not intentionally), after his Hajj in 1325; the experience having filled him with a religious zeal and the journey filling his legs with wanderlust. His exploits are recorded in the famous novel A Gift to Those Who Contemplate the Wonders of Cities and the Marvels of Travelling, Ibn spent his life on a 32 year exploration of the globe alongside a collection of aṣ-ṣaḥābah made up of other visitors to the Holy Cities. Over the course of his adventures, he and his companions would stop in many wondrous places they recorded in great detail: The great trade cities of Mogadishu in the land of the Somalis and the city-states of the Swahili coast, traveling around the Arabic peninsula to stop in Persia and minor principalities of North India and the strange land of the Saxahvall where they wear horns atop their helms to celebrate sacred cattle, yet act much like the raiders of the Far North. He traveled to the jungles of the Viet and Thailand, where the temples commanded water and the kings were supposed gods incarnate, to the lands under the protection of the Great Khan in China where barbarity and the must groomed of cultures sit side by side, to where that culture survived in the far south alongside the isles of pepper and ginger. Sailing back through India, around the furthers south of Africa and the great, unorganized Savanna's, to the river tribes of the Congo and the great city of Mali with the Sultan rich in gold. the nomadic lands of the Tuerg and coastal folks of Tunis, Algers, and Tripolitania before finishing it off with a trip up the Nile to the pyramids and great buildings of Alexandria before finally taking his trip home alone. Along the way, in many of the places they stopped, one of his companions would take a fancy; remaining behind and teaching the locals of the Ways of the Prophet... setting off the spark in some of their souls which would fill them with the drive to convert, in a self-feeding cycle which would fan across the countryside in wave of holy fire. This was most effective where there was little organized force to halt the practice; casting the worship of totems and hills spirits to the four winds and stiffening the continent's souls against those who would make God three, though it did not take nearly the same hold where strong state church was there to squelch it, the converts and the decedents of the converts of each of the companions slowly coming to the realization of one another to trade and travel; lodges and orders dedicated to a particular Companion springing up to officiate the worship and care of these different fragments of the Ummah in each of their respective nations. Ibn spent much of the rest of his days composing his masterpiece to the greatest of his ability, and as a result A Gift to Those Who Contemplate the Wonders of Cities and the Marvels of Travelling has by this point been translated into nearly every language and is one of the most popular secular books on the planet and has earned him a place second only to Mohammed in the roster of Islamic figures. It's close companion, A Gift to Those Who Contemplate the Dearth of the Faith and it's Appeal to All Mankind, which is a collection of stories from Ibn's Companions preserved by their followers, was finally assembled in 1780, and is considered a holy book by most Muslim scholors

Affected Area : Africa, North India, Southern Asia, Golden Khanate

Implications :
  1. Native Populations of Africa is overwhelmingly Sunni Muslim
  2. North India and Southeast Asian native countries and natives also believe in Sunni, but notable minorities exist as Hinduism.
  3. Golden Khanate (it was agreed) will change its national religion to Sunni Muslim

Guidance Name : Jacobins and Blanquists and Communards, Oh My!

Guidance Description : France is the world leader in letters and subversive thought more generally. The French Revolution of 1789 made the country famous for its radical republicanism, striking fear into the hearts of monarchs throughout the world. However, after Bonaparte's empire, France's reputation as a subversive hellhole only continued to grow. Successful revolutions rocked France in 1830 and twice in 1848, causing the French bourgeoisie to always be on edge. Unlike many other labor movements across the world, French unions tended to be led by anarchists, greatly increasing French militancy. Famous socialists including Saint Simon, Charles Fourier, and Karl Marx lived in France, deepening the country's intellectual tradition. Socialist movements divided into several major camps before 1917: diehard labor organizers such as Jules Guesdes in the Parti Ouvier in the industrial north, electoral republicans such as Jean Jaurès and his Socialist Party, and Blanquists who thought a coup d'état was the only possible vehicle of workers' emancipation. French radicalism would later come to fruition when the Paris Commune established the world's first socialist government, founding the ideology of communism.

Romanticism, naturalist novels, French Grand Opera, luxurious cuisine, and fine wines are popular throughout the world, unintentionally spreading many subversive ideas. Trade with France with will strengthen your economy, but it will also rejuvenate radical movements such as republicanism, trade unionism, socialism, and anarchism.

Affected Area : Global, but affecting nations very disproportionately. California and Japan might not even notice the workers' movement, while monarchies adjacent to France such as Brittany, Belgium, Cambria, and the Papal States should have significant Republican movements. Nearby republics like Hansa should have vivacious trade unions, and any nation that permits it can important French political philosophy.

Implications :
  1. Nations with trade agreements or alliance with France (although not France themselves for the sake of fairness) will receive economic boost (Comparison Point +1) on Economy as a result of French influence.
  2. However, nations with trade agreements or alliance with France (although not France themselves) will receive cultural/religious debuff (Comparison Point -1) on Culture/Religion
  3. Nations with trade agreements or alliance with France will be more likely to have stronger radical movements towards republicanism, trade unionism, socialism, and anarchism. As a result, if any of those events fires, will be specified and notified of its magnitude.

Guidance Name : A Hamburg spark of Genius
Guidance Description : In 1756 a Hansa man by the name of Willhelm Kruft, designed aachine to increase his mill's production. The first steam powered engine was crude and tempermental. But a friend of Kruft, Joseph Richter saw vast potential. By 1785 he had several businesses running on a steam engine and had sold plans to his brother Rudolf Richter who drew up plans for another ground breaking machine, it took him 15 years and all his inheritance and some of his brothers but eventually became a reality. The Richter Steam powered transport. A train. In 1791 the Hansa government bought the design from the brothers and began developing extensive rail lines in and around Hamburg.

The new railroad system allowed for more ideas to spring to the forefront. Soon Hansa became the most advanced nation in europe. It attempted to keep all its technology to itself but by 1800 nearly every nation in europe had at least begun design of a steam engine.

However with a leg up on the competition Hansa remained technologically advanced by 1850 it was clear. Repeater support guns and repeater rifles protect all its cities. Rail lines allow the easy movement of materials and people, and factories pump out goods night and day at an unbelievable rate.
Affected Area : I would say global but correct me if i am wrong.

Implications
  1. All nations with "Western" or "Oriental" technology group (again, these groups are set when a nation declares the status and neighboring nations approve of this status) get a technology boost of +10 years. As a result, technology maxim for these nations in 1850, for instance, would be 1860.
  2. Hansa Federation does NOT gain extra technology leap, but has railway network extending throughout the empire by default history. No other nation can start this heights and cannot start an app with this infrastructure development.
  3. Major cities in Hansa Federation is equal to fully industrialized cities in 1860's of IRL. No other nation can start with this heights and cannot start an app with this development.
Last edited by Oscalantine on Sat Aug 29, 2015 7:33 pm, edited 48 times in total.

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Oscalantine
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Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:09 pm

Bump?

ARGH! I a not good playing by myself!!

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Oscalantine
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Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:38 pm

Bump

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ApplePieistan
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Postby ApplePieistan » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:40 pm

Can I be Britain?

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Oscalantine
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Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:41 pm

ApplePieistan wrote:Can I be Britain?


Not a problem for me, but... if you could change a bit about Britain so that it isn't the same Britain that we know and love from IRL, that would be awesome ^^

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ApplePieistan
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Postby ApplePieistan » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:42 pm

Oscalantine wrote:
ApplePieistan wrote:Can I be Britain?


Not a problem for me, but... if you could change a bit about Britain so that it isn't the same Britain that we know and love from IRL, that would be awesome ^^

Like having the royalists win the English Civil War?

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Oscalantine
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Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:45 pm

ApplePieistan wrote:Like having the royalists win the English Civil War?


Something like that. Any point in history (whether it be during the Arthurian Legend where King Arthur doesn't die in battle for Camelot or simply different faction winning the War of Roses) where something else happens, and as long as you follow through from that point onwards with a history, it would be golden! You can keep the GB name if you so desire.

Oh and forgot to say hello~!! Welcome to RP!

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ApplePieistan
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Postby ApplePieistan » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:47 pm

I don't know what I'm supposed to put for army and navy strengths and weaknesses.

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New Granadeseret
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Postby New Granadeseret » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:50 pm

Do you accept reservations? I love early POD alternative histories, but it's late right now and I don't know if I can fill out the whole application at the moment without falling asleep.

If so, I am thinking and Imperial Al-Andalus, based on the removal of the Fitna of al-Andalus and success in the full conquest of the peninsula. Perhaps including a leading role in the Age of Colonization and a wide cultural/religious impact on Western Europe as a whole.
Stannis was robbed.

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Oscalantine
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Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:51 pm

ApplePieistan wrote:I don't know what I'm supposed to put for army and navy strengths and weaknesses.


The strength and weakness is simply for you to think about what would your military work like. If I remember correctly from other RPs, it is something along the lines of "____ military is highly disciplined due to consistent conflict in the borders, but due to conservative army tradition we still rely too heavily on Calvary for effective modern conflicts"

Same thing for navy. Saying things like "____ navy has some of the fastest ships in the region, but due to this quickness they are not as heavily armed." Basically pros and cons of your military.

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ApplePieistan
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Postby ApplePieistan » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:52 pm

Question about the comparison points, so I need to have at least one point in everything, or can I go full Sparta?
Last edited by ApplePieistan on Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Oscalantine
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Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:53 pm

New Granadeseret wrote:Do you accept reservations? I love early POD alternative histories, but it's late right now and I don't know if I can fill out the whole application at the moment without falling asleep.

If so, I am thinking and Imperial Al-Andalus, based on the removal of the Fitna of al-Andalus and success in the full conquest of the peninsula. Perhaps including a leading role in the Age of Colonization and a wide cultural/religious impact on Western Europe as a whole.


Hello~!!

Sure. I actually know this PoD and I absolutely LOVE what it entails!
... but since it is a reserve, could you don't go nuts with territory claims? Having parts of Iberian penin is find, but it may be a bit discouraging to future RPers if you have the entire peninsula plus Morocco and things like that.

If there is no one who claimed that when you are making the app, you can apply for it afterwards ^^

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Oscalantine
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Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:54 pm

ApplePieistan wrote:Question about the comparison points, so I need to have at least one point in everything, or can I go Sparta?


Sparta is fine ^^
The point of comparison is just for dispute settlements. If you went ham on military, and someone blockades your ports, you are sort of expected to starve your people because you don't have economic sustain for a prolonged conflict.

... in other words, the points really don't matter unless you are trying to win every wars. So go nuts! XDD

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ApplePieistan
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Postby ApplePieistan » Sat Jul 25, 2015 8:57 pm

Can you explain the benefits of having points in each thing?

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Oscalantine
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Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:03 pm

ApplePieistan wrote:Can you explain the benefits of having points in each thing?


It really depends on how creative you can be with the conflicts. I may need to update the app so that people can get the gist of what that is...

It isn't an exhaustive list, but...
Political is more to do with espionage and infiltration. To find spies in your country, probably points in this is ideal.
Military is... well, going ham on military. Your troops are better trained and they fight better in general (when all things are held constant)
Cultural/Religious is basically a deterrent of sort. If Catholic Curia still exists, a hefty point in this area could get the Pope involved in your wars, excommunicate the other side and get them to stop "meaningless" war or to start a crusade of sort.
Economy is a different aspect of war, where you can embargo their trade with your or blockade their ports. Your army and people can be fed better with better economy.

Again... not a fully list. But that's what I was envisioning when I made the points. Again, as long as you don't try to win every wars, it really shouldn't be too important other than making your lore a little bit more interesting ^^

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New Granadeseret
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Postby New Granadeseret » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:03 pm

Oscalantine wrote:
New Granadeseret wrote:Do you accept reservations? I love early POD alternative histories, but it's late right now and I don't know if I can fill out the whole application at the moment without falling asleep.

If so, I am thinking and Imperial Al-Andalus, based on the removal of the Fitna of al-Andalus and success in the full conquest of the peninsula. Perhaps including a leading role in the Age of Colonization and a wide cultural/religious impact on Western Europe as a whole.


Hello~!!

Sure. I actually know this PoD and I absolutely LOVE what it entails!
... but since it is a reserve, could you don't go nuts with territory claims? Having parts of Iberian penin is find, but it may be a bit discouraging to future RPers if you have the entire peninsula plus Morocco and things like that.

If there is no one who claimed that when you are making the app, you can apply for it afterwards ^^


It would contain Iberia, Sardina, and Sicily (The whole Two Sicilies; as an extension of the historical Emirate of Sicily, is probably too ambitious) , as well as scattered islands and a few colonies/dominion-esque allies in the Americas (and possibly Africa, if the AH is pushing that particular history up... though I see know reason why I should instigate that). I have no issues laying out my claims now... just that writing the full 800 + years of history might take more time then I have at the moment.

Though, I would like to have been at one point a larger presence in Europe before loosing it, leaving behind some Andalusian culture and converts. Like having had a land-based Golden Age during the 1200-1300 with a major presence in the Italian peninsula and south France. Normal empires expanding/contracting stuff.
Stannis was robbed.

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Oscalantine
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Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:11 pm

New Granadeseret wrote:
Oscalantine wrote:
It would contain Iberia, Sardina, and Sicily (The whole Two Sicilies; as an extension of the historical Emirate of Sicily, is probably too ambitious) , as well as scattered islands and a few colonies/dominion-esque allies in the Americas (and possibly Africa, if the AH is pushing that particular history up... though I see know reason why I should instigate that). I have no issues laying out my claims now... just that writing the full 800 + years of history might take more time then I have at the moment.

Though, I would like to have been at one point a larger presence in Europe before loosing it, leaving behind some Andalusian culture and converts. Like having had a land-based Golden Age during the 1200-1300 with a major presence in the Italian peninsula and south France. Normal empires expanding/contracting stuff.



"I would like to have been at one point a larger presence in Europe before loosing it, leaving behind some Andalusian culture and converts."

That's EXACTLY why I have Guidance System. Look it up and send me an app, and it will be a norm for the RP ^^

Other than that... hmmm... again, no problems with you having a large claim. But... until you are done with your app, sure, I'll keep parts of Iberia, Sardina, and Sicily occupied for you. When you are somewhat done with the app, let me know and I'll reserve/approve other parts of your claims as well.

It is just that other major nations like Genoa (although giving you Sardina I am already ruining Genoa) and Aragon have problems with your claims. If someone wants to do those nations, I want to keep the opinion open for them, since you are already claiming larger chunk of Iberia ^^

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ApplePieistan
Negotiator
 
Posts: 6614
Founded: Apr 06, 2015
Father Knows Best State

Postby ApplePieistan » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:11 pm

Whats the difference between national claims and core, because I'm about to put all my colonies in my core.

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Oscalantine
Minister
 
Posts: 2655
Founded: Apr 17, 2008
Ex-Nation

Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:13 pm

ApplePieistan wrote:Whats the difference between national claims and core, because I'm about to put all my colonies in my core.


If you played EU4, it would be easier.

But basically, think of mainlands and colonies as your cores, and where you wish to expand to as your claims. You may have parts of North America (if 13 colonies didn't rebel on your arse) and Caribbeans as your core, and have entire African continent as your Ambition/Claims.

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New Granadeseret
Minister
 
Posts: 3424
Founded: Apr 28, 2014
Ex-Nation

Postby New Granadeseret » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:21 pm

Oscalantine wrote:
New Granadeseret wrote:



"I would like to have been at one point a larger presence in Europe before loosing it, leaving behind some Andalusian culture and converts."

That's EXACTLY why I have Guidance System. Look it up and send me an app, and it will be a norm for the RP ^^

Other than that... hmmm... again, no problems with you having a large claim. But... until you are done with your app, sure, I'll keep parts of Iberia, Sardina, and Sicily occupied for you. When you are somewhat done with the app, let me know and I'll reserve/approve other parts of your claims as well.

It is just that other major nations like Genoa (although giving you Sardina I am already ruining Genoa) and Aragon have problems with your claims. If someone wants to do those nations, I want to keep the opinion open for them, since you are already claiming larger chunk of Iberia ^^


The first part is just a theory for now... though if Guidance can be spent on something as crazy as making the natives immune to European illnesses, I'll have to consider if I want to apply it here.

Understood.... I'm going to go to bed quickly so I can get up early and starting writing up my history. I look forward to this very much... AH threads are often littered with clones, and I hope this one takes off with some rich ideas .
Stannis was robbed.

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Benuty
Post Czar
 
Posts: 33631
Founded: Jan 21, 2013
Democratic Socialists

Postby Benuty » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:22 pm

Oscalantine wrote:
ApplePieistan wrote:Whats the difference between national claims and core, because I'm about to put all my colonies in my core.


If you played EU4, it would be easier.

But basically, think of mainlands and colonies as your cores, and where you wish to expand to as your claims. You may have parts of North America (if 13 colonies didn't rebel on your arse) and Caribbeans as your core, and have entire African continent as your Ambition/Claims.

Which gives an interesting point of divergence since the American colonies were in a state of limbo during the affair between the Royalists, and the Parliamentarians. I suppose an exodus among the intellectuals, defeated parliamentarians, and a motley collection of people who stood to lose should the royals have won decided to flee to the American colonies in hopes of the preservation of the English tradition against the forces of royal absolutism.
Last edited by Hashem 13.8 billion years ago
King of Madness in the Right Wing Discussion Thread. Winner of 2016 Posters Award for Insanity.
Please be aware my posts in NSG, and P2TM are separate.

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Oscalantine
Minister
 
Posts: 2655
Founded: Apr 17, 2008
Ex-Nation

Postby Oscalantine » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:27 pm

New Granadeseret wrote:The first part is just a theory for now... though if Guidance can be spent on something as crazy as making the natives immune to European illnesses, I'll have to consider if I want to apply it here.

Understood.... I'm going to go to bed quickly so I can get up early and starting writing up my history. I look forward to this very much... AH threads are often littered with clones, and I hope this one takes off with some rich ideas .


It isn't alternative history unless something truly alternative happened, right?
I am hoping that those who use this will try to limit themselves for the sake of fun. Similar to European illness... it was really given as an example, but I hope that it would be used (if it is used in that way) for a Native American Federation of sort that has somehow managed to find a way to cure themselves using whatever means and westernize to fight off Europeans from their homelands... and not to go Sparta on everyone.


Benuty wrote:Which gives an interesting point of divergence since the American colonies were in a state of limbo during the affair between the Royalists, and the Parliamentarians. I suppose an exodus among the intellectuals, defeated parliamentarians, and a motley collection of people who stood to lose should the royals have won decided to flee to the American colonies in hopes of the preservation of the English tradition against the forces of royal absolutism.


That... sounded disturbingly like Britannian Empire from Code Geass. Sorry that I nerded out there XDDD.

Welcome~! Hope you are planning on staying!!

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Benuty
Post Czar
 
Posts: 33631
Founded: Jan 21, 2013
Democratic Socialists

Postby Benuty » Sat Jul 25, 2015 9:39 pm

Oscalantine wrote:
New Granadeseret wrote:The first part is just a theory for now... though if Guidance can be spent on something as crazy as making the natives immune to European illnesses, I'll have to consider if I want to apply it here.

Understood.... I'm going to go to bed quickly so I can get up early and starting writing up my history. I look forward to this very much... AH threads are often littered with clones, and I hope this one takes off with some rich ideas .


It isn't alternative history unless something truly alternative happened, right?
I am hoping that those who use this will try to limit themselves for the sake of fun. Similar to European illness... it was really given as an example, but I hope that it would be used (if it is used in that way) for a Native American Federation of sort that has somehow managed to find a way to cure themselves using whatever means and westernize to fight off Europeans from their homelands... and not to go Sparta on everyone.


Benuty wrote:Which gives an interesting point of divergence since the American colonies were in a state of limbo during the affair between the Royalists, and the Parliamentarians. I suppose an exodus among the intellectuals, defeated parliamentarians, and a motley collection of people who stood to lose should the royals have won decided to flee to the American colonies in hopes of the preservation of the English tradition against the forces of royal absolutism.


That... sounded disturbingly like Britannian Empire from Code Geass. Sorry that I nerded out there XDDD.

Welcome~! Hope you are planning on staying!!


In fairness it was somewhat inspired by it. Of course I intend on making the former colonies a patchwork nation of governments with varying local traditions bound by a centralized authority which emphasizes a strong parliament, but a somewhat ceremonial executive function. The original articles binding them together get modified as they progress through the Enlightenment, and other eras. This creates a nation which is somewhat more diverse especially the culture of the exiles has fermented into something truly unique as well. Not to mention religious freedom draws a lot of disenfranchised Europeans to them (Oliver Cromwell actually allowed Jews to come back to England ending a centuries long ban).
Last edited by Hashem 13.8 billion years ago
King of Madness in the Right Wing Discussion Thread. Winner of 2016 Posters Award for Insanity.
Please be aware my posts in NSG, and P2TM are separate.

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