With Fire and Steel - AH RP (OOC/OPEN)

[Sabara]

Archaic institutions that facilitated the most powerful empire on earth for an upwards of five centuries? I highly doubt that. Europe only began to pull ahead of East Asia in terms of technology around the late 17th century; using Chinese technologies.

TIL microscopes, telescopes, and rifled artillery were invented in china

o

wait

It seems you forgot gunpowder..

[Liecthenbourg]

Naw. I contemplated joining on with Boney to rampage across Europe as a general of the Polacks, or their gov overall.

*hides away all the polish people under a massive piece of cloth*
No polish here. Only lots of cloth and stuff.

Nu.
Liar.
France know.

[The New Lowlands]

TIL microscopes, telescopes, and rifled artillery were invented in china

o

wait

It seems you forgot gunpowder..

inventing gunpowder is a matter of time

china stopped being relevant in 1492 : DDD

[Aden Protectorate]

Both are archaic institutions unable to modernize to be relevant in the 18th century.

Archaic institutions that facilitated the most powerful empire on earth for an upwards of five centuries? I highly doubt that. Europe only began to pull ahead of East Asia in terms of technology around the late 17th century; using Chinese stuff. We'll see who's more adaptive.

Both are archaic institutions unable to modernize to be relevant in the 18th century.

They were still highly relevant, seeing as how a majority of the worlds population was governed by some form of that kind of government.

Not going to argue this with you. Your "Asia can into rebirth and be relevant in the 18th Century" shit makes me sick. Just look at history at it will give you all the proof to disprove your argument.

[The New Lowlands]

Archaic institutions that facilitated the most powerful empire on earth for an upwards of five centuries? I highly doubt that. Europe only began to pull ahead of East Asia in terms of technology around the late 17th century; using Chinese stuff. We'll see who's more adaptive.
They were still highly relevant, seeing as how a majority of the worlds population was governed by some form of that kind of government.

Not going to argue this with you. Your "Asia can into rebirth and be relevant in the 18th Century" shit makes me sick. Just look at history at it will give you all the proof to disprove your argument.

Aden, no need to make it srs bsns, just chill out.

[Sabara]

It seems you forgot gunpowder..

inventing gunpowder is a matter of time

china stopped being relevant in 1492 : DDD

It still doesn't erase the fact that China invented most of the technologies that Europeans would later patent...

Archaic institutions that facilitated the most powerful empire on earth for an upwards of five centuries? I highly doubt that. Europe only began to pull ahead of East Asia in terms of technology around the late 17th century; using Chinese stuff. We'll see who's more adaptive.
They were still highly relevant, seeing as how a majority of the worlds population was governed by some form of that kind of government.

Not going to argue this with you. Your "Asia can into rebirth and be relevant in the 18th Century" shit makes me sick. Just look at history at it will give you all the proof to disprove your argument.

Well it looks like someone's not willing to look at different viewpoints and ideas. Eurocentrism really only occurred by the factors of geography and pure luck. I enjoy hearing your arguments on why Asia can't be relevant.

[The Jonathanian States]

*hides away all the polish people under a massive piece of cloth*
No polish here. Only lots of cloth and stuff.

Nu.
Liar.
France know.

No polish here. Try in Russia. Like in Novosibirsk.
Also in Tsaritsyn and in St.Petersburg. You definitely should siege the former and assault the latter.

[Aden Protectorate]

Not going to argue this with you. Your "Asia can into rebirth and be relevant in the 18th Century" shit makes me sick. Just look at history at it will give you all the proof to disprove your argument.

Aden, no need to make it srs bsns, just chill out.

I'm sorry it just gets me so annoyed. Being Asian I would love to see us rule the world, in fact my country almost succeeded in doing it. I am proud of that. But I also understand that we declined and fell behind for a reason - it is unrealistic for us to have continued to rule the world since Europe was so innovative and in constant conflict.

[Liecthenbourg]

Nu.
Liar.
France know.

No polish here. Try in Russia. Like in Novosibirsk.
Also in Tsaritsyn and in St.Petersburg. You definitely should siege the former and assault the latter.

*fixes bayonets*
Prussia is oft lying.

[The Kingdom of Glitter]

*checks phone before arriving to party*

*sees argument about Asia*

*closes browser, turns off phone*

But for real, no need to argue over Asia. We all know it's backwards. Attempts at westernization can and are likely to be made, but they will be resisted by many. Change is never welcome.

However keep in mind. There was not as much of a difference technologically between Europe and Asia until the First Wave of the Industrial Revolution - that's when things began to change.

[The New Lowlands]

inventing gunpowder is a matter of time

china stopped being relevant in 1492 : DDD

It still doesn't erase the fact that China invented most of the technologies that Europeans would later patent...

no europeans patented those developments u git

europe invented decent telescopes which were necessary for landless oceanic navigation

denigrating european achievement as a compensation for China never giving birth to JFC Fuller is just poor form : DDD

[The New American commonwealth]

Where's Reichtangle vhen you need him....

*has idea*
Ich am Holy Roman Kaiser, so, ich give zhe rest of zhe Empire to Prussia (except mein Crownlands)

*runs out before the rise of Reichtangle begins*

Too late

heheheh, nein!

[Caltarania]

inventing gunpowder is a matter of time

china stopped being relevant in 1492 : DDD

It still doesn't erase the fact that China invented most of the technologies that Europeans would later patent...

Not going to argue this with you. Your "Asia can into rebirth and be relevant in the 18th Century" shit makes me sick. Just look at history at it will give you all the proof to disprove your argument.

Well it looks like someone's not willing to look at different viewpoints and ideas. Eurocentrism really only occurred by the factors of geography and pure luck. I enjoy hearing your arguments on why Asia can't be relevant.

>we have no guns
>we have no enlightenment
>we're stuck in the high level equilibrium trap
>we lack élan
>we lack infrastructure
>we lack industralisation
>we lack modern governance

Aden, no need to make it srs bsns, just chill out.

I'm sorry it just gets me so annoyed. Being Asian I would love to see us rule the world, in fact my country almost succeeded in doing it. I am proud of that. But I also understand that we declined and fell behind for a reason - it is unrealistic for us to have continued to rule the world since Europe was so innovative and in constant conflict.

THEY WILL WATER THEIR HORSES ON THE BANKS OF THE DANUBE!

[The Jonathanian States]

No polish here. Try in Russia. Like in Novosibirsk.
Also in Tsaritsyn and in St.Petersburg. You definitely should siege the former and assault the latter.

*fixes bayonets*
Prussia is oft lying.

I definitely not lying.
Those forms under the cloth just are.... Prussian babies. That's why they don't speak German yet. Or something.
Maybe look in Austria? If we're pulling an Austria that means they pull a Prussia which means that we barely don't lose our parts of Poland while they lose theirs. *nods*

[Sabara]

Aden, no need to make it srs bsns, just chill out.

I'm sorry it just gets me so annoyed. Being Asian I would love to see us rule the world, in fact my country almost succeeded in doing it. I am proud of that. But I also understand that we declined and fell behind for a reason - it is unrealistic for us to have continued to rule the world since Europe was so innovative and in constant conflict.

I don't think East Asia necessarily needs to "rule the world", but it was certainly a possibility. A very, very likely possibility.

I'm just confused on /why/ relevant East Asian nations aren't as accepted in these kind of roleplays.

It still doesn't erase the fact that China invented most of the technologies that Europeans would later patent...

no europeans patented those developments u git

europe invented decent telescopes which were necessary for landless oceanic navigation

denigrating european achievement as a compensation for China never giving birth to JFC Fuller is just poor form : DDD

Chinese had already been using compasses and telescopes under the expeditions of Yongle..

[The Grand Republic of Hannover]

Generic Info
Nation Name: Most Serene Republic of Venice
Symbols: (ex. Flag, Coat of Arms, National Anthem, personifications, etc.)
Homeland Population: (population of everyone considered a citizen)
Imperial Population: (include population of colonies)
Location/Claims: (include map)
Capital City:

Government Info
Government Type: (ex. The USA is a Presidential Constitutional Federal Republic)
Brief Explanation of Government: (explain all the complex/unique stuff that can't be described in the type section)
Ideology: (Refer to this)
Leader/s: (Head of State, Head of Government, etc.)

Population Info
Religion:
Main/Accepted Culture(s): (ex. IRL-UK would be English, Scottish; only cultures that are dominant and the gov't favors)
Other Cultures: (ex. IRL-UK would have been Irish, Welsh, etc ; cultures that aren't accepted by the gov't/people)

Military Info
Army: (branches, number of troops, quality of army, etc,)
Navy: (branches, number of troops, quality of navy, etc,)

Other Info
Brief Description of your Economy:
Goals:
History:
RP Sample: (required)
Secret Phrase: (can be located within the OP, must be included to be accepted)
429 - Do not remove. This is for tracking purposes.

UNDER CONSTRUCTION.

[The New American commonwealth]

*fixes bayonets*
Prussia is oft lying.

I definitely not lying.
Those forms under the cloth just are.... Prussian babies. That's why they don't speak German yet. Or something.
Maybe look in Austria? If we're pulling an Austria that means they pull a Prussia which means that we barely don't lose our parts of Poland while they lose theirs. *nods*

Ich don't have any bits of Polen so Fick off!

[The New Lowlands]

on a more serious note, the achievements of China, India, Europe, etcetera can basically all be pinned down to geography for anything before 1900s or whatever, so saying that "Eurocentrism is just geography but CHINA IS SPESHUL" is actually kinda dumb imo. No offence intended, Sabara, I wasn't being entirely serious earlier.

no europeans patented those developments u git

europe invented decent telescopes which were necessary for landless oceanic navigation

denigrating european achievement as a compensation for China never giving birth to JFC Fuller is just poor form : DDD

Chinese had already been using compasses and telescopes under the expeditions of Yongle..

not real ones

the reason why East Asian countries are less accepted is because the OVERWHELMING majority of AHRPers is European and interested in European history.

[Capsland]

Generic Info
Nation Name: The United Kingdom of England-Ireland
Symbols: Flag, Anthem, Coat of Arms
Homeland Population: 13,484,000
Imperial Population: 26,604,000

• 304,000 in Canada
• 500,000 in Australia
• 25,800,000 in Bengal/India

Location/Claims: http://i.imgur.com/r7u5yHT.png
Capital City: London

Government Info
Government Type: Unitary parliamentary constitutional monarchy
Brief Explanation of Government:
The Government is led by the Prime Minister, who selects all the remaining ministers. The Prime Minister and the other most senior ministers belong to the supreme decision-making committee, known as the Cabinet. The Government Ministers all sit in Parliament, and are accountable to it. The Government is dependent on Parliament to make primary legislation. After an election, the monarch selects as Prime Minister the leader of the party most likely to command a majority of MPs in the House of Commons.

Under the uncodified English constitution, executive authority lies with the monarch, although this authority is exercised only by, or on the advice of, the Prime Minister and the Cabinet.
Ideology: Conservatism
Leader/s:
Head of State: King George III Tudor
Head of Government: Prime Minister William Pitt the Younger

Population Info
Religion: Anglicanism (Church of England)
Main/Accepted Culture(s): English, Irish
Other Cultures: Welsh, Cornish

Military Info
Army: The Royal army is organised into home armies and colonial armies. There are roughly 250,000 troops in the Royal Army all together. The Colonial Army of Canada is comprised of 60,000 colonial troops while the Colonial Army of Australia comprises 40,000 troops. There are 100,000 home guard troops stationed in England and Ireland while 50,000 troops (as well as many mercenaries (25,000)) are stationed in India under the East India Company.

The Royal army is well equipped to fight in nearly any terrain and well trained to fight any foe. It has a good amount of cannons and heavy weaponry and uses cavalry charges to a great extent. There are also many officers to command the individual forces of the army making sure that, when in battles, the troops fight in unity and together. However, there are still some flaws. Even though the Royal Army boasts it's tech advantage and amount of troops, it still is considered small compared to nations like France and Spain. It is also stretched out over the colonies making it considerably weaker when fighting nations on their home continent.

Home Guard

• 60,000 Men stationed in England with 66 horse artillery pieces and 168 field artillery pieces
• 40,000 Men stationed in Ireland with 18 horse artillery pieces batteries and 102 field artillery pieces

Royal Canadian Colonial Army

• 60,000 Men with 48 horse artillery pieces and 90 field artillery pieces
• Mainly irregulars and light infantry

Royal Australian Army

• 30,000 Men stationed in Sydney with 6 horse artillery pieces and 18 field artillery pieces
• 10,000 Men stationed in Perth with 12 field artillery pieces
• Mainly consists of irregulars

East India Company Army

• 40,000 Men stationed in Bengal with 120 horse artillery pieces and 48 field artillery pieces, supported by 15,000 mercenaries under the EIC
• 10,000 Men stationed in Madurai with 18 horse artillery pieces and 30 field artillery pieces, supported by 10,000 mercenaries under the EIC

(susceptible to change)
Navy: The English navy, or Royal Navy, is the pride of the English armed forces. The navy is the first, in some cases, last line of defence against invaders coming from the continent. Due to this importance, the navy has seen much more care and attention than the army. (However, the ground forces are no laughing matter either.)

The Royal Navy is the biggest and strongest navy in the western hemisphere, with hundreds of ships protecting England's financial and colonial interests. It has some of the finest trained sailors in the world and has seen action pretty much anywhere in the seven seas. The navy can hold it's own against nearly any foe, however, numbers don't always mean everything, which is why the English have invested so much into maintaining and modernising their navy.
Number of vessels: 450
Total crew: 100,000 Men

20 Ships of the Line - 122 Guns
29 Ships of the Line - 106 Guns
42 Ships of the Line - 80 Guns
55 Ships of the Line - 74 Guns
66 Third Rates - 64 Guns
72 Fourth Rates - 50 Guns
80 Fifth Rates - 32 Guns
96 Sloops - 15-20 Guns

Other Info
Brief Description of your Economy:
With money coming in from the colonies and exotic new goods being traded in English ports, the economy of England is on its up. The depletion of the European beaver made demand for fur pelts sky rocket, also the price. With furs coming from Canada, England was able to profit from the high demand. Also spices, tea and cotton from India makes England one of the highest valued traders in the western world thus boosting the economy.
Overall, England's economy is doing good, but can do better with the expansion of colonies and more protected trade routes.
Goals: 'Deal' with Scotland, Continue naval superiority over France, Expand allies outside of Europe.
History:
Unable to invade and incorporate Scotland into the United Kingdom due to fears that the war would be dragged out and cost massive amounts of manpower, England looked to its colonies. Upon King George III's coronation, he issued numerous acts that would bolster England's colonial grip in the Americas, South Atlantic, Australia and Asia. Following the American Revolution and this new age of republicanism, England's border with Scotland became very militarised. Many forts and refurbished castles were built through the counties of Cumbria and Northumberland and a fast reaction fleet deployed to Ulster for an impending attack or if England needed to show superiority over the island.

To the south, England saw its ultimate rival, France. Parliament, over the years, had issued many anti French policies, some of which were edging close to war declarations. French merchant ships using the channel would often be harassed by privateers funded by the English government while the Royal Navy would often have naval standoffs with French warships. Due to this new powerful rival, England's armies had been bolstered up with new equipment, better weapons and good training to deal with France if the time came. Luckily, England had the royal navy to protect herself from any Frenchies that wanted to fly the French flag from the tower of London.

Now, in 1796, England prepares itself for imminent war with France and her allies, as Europe fights over republicanism and monarchism

RP Sample: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=337075#p24257135
Secret Phrase: I will always date my posts
429 - Do not remove. This is for tracking purposes.

Hold your hats! I think I may finally be done!

[The Jonathanian States]

I'm sorry it just gets me so annoyed. Being Asian I would love to see us rule the world, in fact my country almost succeeded in doing it. I am proud of that. But I also understand that we declined and fell behind for a reason - it is unrealistic for us to have continued to rule the world since Europe was so innovative and in constant conflict.

THEY WILL WATER THEIR HORSES ON THE BANKS OF THE DANUBE!

YES!

I definitely not lying.
Those forms under the cloth just are.... Prussian babies. That's why they don't speak German yet. Or something.
Maybe look in Austria? If we're pulling an Austria that means they pull a Prussia which means that we barely don't lose our parts of Poland while they lose theirs. *nods*

Ich don't have any bits of Polen so Fick off!

Really? Ah, right, then surely Russia has them, right?
*glares at Austria* Russia stole all of our Poland, of both of us, did it not?

[The New American commonwealth]

It still doesn't erase the fact that China invented most of the technologies that Europeans would later patent...


Well it looks like someone's not willing to look at different viewpoints and ideas. Eurocentrism really only occurred by the factors of geography and pure luck. I enjoy hearing your arguments on why Asia can't be relevant.

>we have no guns
>we have no enlightenment
>we're stuck in the high level equilibrium trap
>we lack élan
>we lack infrastructure
>we lack industralisation
>we lack modern governance

I'm sorry it just gets me so annoyed. Being Asian I would love to see us rule the world, in fact my country almost succeeded in doing it. I am proud of that. But I also understand that we declined and fell behind for a reason - it is unrealistic for us to have continued to rule the world since Europe was so innovative and in constant conflict.

THEY WILL WATER THEIR HORSES ON THE BANKS OF THE DANUBE!

yes, gib bad nightmares to the Rus claim on the Danube, und let me keep mein hungary...

THEY WILL WATER THEIR HORSES ON THE BANKS OF THE DANUBE!

YES!

Ich don't have any bits of Polen so Fick off!

Really? Ah, right, then surely Russia has them, right?
*glares at Austria* Russia stole all of our Poland, of both of us, did it not?

Ja, und mein Carpathian Slovak territories in Ungarn
*begins to cry*

[Aden Protectorate]

I'm sorry it just gets me so annoyed. Being Asian I would love to see us rule the world, in fact my country almost succeeded in doing it. I am proud of that. But I also understand that we declined and fell behind for a reason - it is unrealistic for us to have continued to rule the world since Europe was so innovative and in constant conflict.

I don't think East Asia necessarily needs to "rule the world", but it was certainly a possibility. A very, very likely possibility.

I'm just confused on /why/ relevant East Asian nations aren't as accepted in these kind of roleplays.

no europeans patented those developments u git

europe invented decent telescopes which were necessary for landless oceanic navigation

denigrating european achievement as a compensation for China never giving birth to JFC Fuller is just poor form : DDD

Chinese had already been using compasses and telescopes under the expeditions of Yongle..

How can you be confused about that? How? East Asia RL declined and was irrelevant by this time? This may be an Alt-Hist RP but we are not departing that far from reality. And the point is moot so just stop mkay?

[Sabara]

I never said China was 'better' than Europe. I think the argument that European culture was the ideal "industrializing force" is a dumb argument.

[The New Lowlands]

I never said China was 'better' than Europe. I think the argument that European culture was the ideal "industrializing force" is a dumb argument.

literally nobody started talking about culture as a serious cause for China's non-industrialisation.

the reason why China and associates can't/couldn't/wouldn't industrialise is because they're caught in a high-level economic equilibrium.

[Sabara]

I never said China was 'better' than Europe. I think the argument that European culture was the ideal "industrializing force" is a dumb argument.

Just bolstering my point here. I believe that steel was first made by the Wu, preceding the Europeans by over 1,000 years. Also, the Song dynasty saw intensive industry in steel production, and coal mining. No other premodern state advanced as nearly as starting an industrial revolution than the Southern Song.