NATION

PASSWORD

Westeros: Rise of a King (Dead)

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Who should win the melee?

King Aerion Targaryen
4
15%
Lord Loras Tyrell
1
4%
Ser Olyvar Hightower
7
27%
Arren
2
8%
Ser Tomos Dayne
5
19%
Dame Brienne of Tarth
3
12%
Some Other Guy
4
15%
 
Total votes : 26

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Of the Quendi
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Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Of the Quendi » Thu Dec 25, 2014 2:06 am

The territorial organization of the Second Empire of the Ghiscari
As it stood in the Twelth Year of the Reign of our Emperor Aemon the Magnificent


  • The Imperial Province and Kingdom of Meereen (also known as the Skahazadban)
  • The Free Province and Kingdom of Yunkai
  • The Free Province and Kingdom of Astapor
  • The Imperial Province of Ghiscar
  • The Free Province of Ghaen (also known as New Ghis)
  • The Imperial Province of the Isle of Cedars
  • The Imperial Province of the East
  • The Unorganzied Province of Bhorash
  • The Imperial Province of Khyzai-Lhazar
  • The Free Province of Lhazar
  • The Imperial Province of Upper Lhazar
  • The Fief of Tolos
  • The Fief of Elyria
  • The Fief of Mantarys

The Kingdom of Meereen
The Kingdom of Meereen is the first province of the empire, ruled directly by the imperial government. It consists of the Imperial City of Meereen and the Province of the Skahazadban. The Kingdom covers the whole of the Skahazadban river valley up to the Khyzai pass and it borders the Province of Khyzai-Lhazar to the east, the Province of Bhorash to the west and the Province of Yunkai to the south. To the north it borders the Dothraki Sea.

Arana wrote:Wait, the fleet has to sail through the Stepstones? Won't it be pretty easy to sink then?

Only if you knew its coming and has time to prepare. A fleet sailing through has the initiative. It can choose when and where it will try to make a breakthrough whereas the fleet that has to stop it will have to cover the whole of the Stepstones which are some 250 miles broad. But yes it would be a somewhat risky enterprise.
Arana wrote:As a note, any plot related supernatural, vision, warg stuff or anything of that nature needs to be approved by me. As of this point, that doesn't matter much, seeing as only a few characters are doing anything like that, and most of them are mine.

Well you where the one who said my character is a skinchanger it wasn't something I invented. I do plan on using it to my advantage as Viserys isn't (and don't know that Aemon is). In an air battle between Aemon and Viserys Aemon will in a crucial moment order Rhaegal to attack and then for a brief moment enter Drogon's mind to incapacitate him long enough for Rhaegal to kill Viserys.

Since Varamyr Sixskins, who presumably is a very capable is a very strong skinchanger sometimes had difficulty controlling his shadow cat I don't of course expect Aemon to be able to somehow take total control over Drogon. But him suddenly entering the mind of Drogon and doing everything in his power to restrain the dragon should be more than enough to cause a big enough distraction that Drogon won't be able to respond to a simultaneous physical attack by Rhaegal.
Last edited by Of the Quendi on Sat Dec 27, 2014 6:09 am, edited 2 times in total.
Nation RP name
Arda i Eruhíni (short form)
Alcarinqua ar Meneldëa Arda i Eruhíni i sé Amanaranyë ar Aramanaranyë (long form)

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Toronina
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Postby Toronina » Thu Dec 25, 2014 3:20 am

Should I have Brynden meet with the king?
Now I'm back in the ring to take another swing

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Arana
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Postby Arana » Thu Dec 25, 2014 5:02 am

Of the Quendi wrote:
The territorial organization of the Second Empire of the Ghiscari
As it stood in the Twelth Year of the Reign of our Emperor Aemon the Magnificent


  • The Imperial Province and Kingdom of Meereen (also known as the Skahazadban)
  • The Free Province and Kingdom of Yunkai
  • The Free Province and Kingdom of Astapor
  • The Imperial Province of Ghiscar
  • The Free Province of Ghaen (also known as New Ghis)
  • The Imperial Province of the Isle of Cedars
  • The Imperial Province of the East
  • The Unorganzied Province of Bhorash
  • The Imperial Province of Khyzai-Lhazar
  • The Free Province of Lhazar
  • The Imperial Province of Upper Lhazar
  • The Fief of Tolos
  • The Fief of Elyria
  • The Fief of Mantarys

The Kingdom of Meereen
WIP

Arana wrote:Wait, the fleet has to sail through the Stepstones? Won't it be pretty easy to sink then?

Only if you knew its coming and has time to prepare. A fleet sailing through has the initiative. It can choose when and where it will try to make a breakthrough whereas the fleet that has to stop it will have to cover the whole of the Stepstones which are some 250 miles broad. But yes it would be a somewhat risky enterprise.
Arana wrote:As a note, any plot related supernatural, vision, warg stuff or anything of that nature needs to be approved by me. As of this point, that doesn't matter much, seeing as only a few characters are doing anything like that, and most of them are mine.

Well you where the one who said my character is a skinchanger it wasn't something I invented. I do plan on using it to my advantage as Viserys isn't (and don't know that Aemon is). In an air battle between Aemon and Viserys Aemon will in a crucial moment order Rhaegal to attack and then for a brief moment enter Drogon's mind to incapacitate him long enough for Rhaegal to kill Viserys.

Since Varamyr Sixskins, who presumably is a very capable is a very strong skinchanger sometimes had difficulty controlling his shadow cat I don't of course expect Aemon to be able to somehow take total control over Drogon. But him suddenly entering the mind of Drogon and doing everything in his power to restrain the dragon should be more than enough to cause a big enough distraction that Drogon won't be able to respond to a simultaneous physical attack by Rhaegal.

Not sure I want him dead yet... also, Viserys is a warg, he's just not very good at it.
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Of the Quendi
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Postby Of the Quendi » Thu Dec 25, 2014 5:20 am

I wonder what would happen if Aemon Targaryen marched through the gates of the throne room in the Red Keep bringing his brother a wedding gift. According to the story the Tyrell's are feeding Aerion Aemon isn't much implicated in the murder of neither their mother or father. Running away with the man who slay Jon Targaryen after Jon had murdered his own wife is hardly a foul deed. If anything thats the big hole in the story. Why did Aemon feel the need to flee from Westeros if his life wasn't threatened by any of the villains of the Tyrell story?

So if he landed Rhaegal on the Red Keep and brought a wedding gift to his brother what would be done? Would he be arrested? Killed? For what then. Or would he be received?

The question is (mostly) hypothetical, but it is an interesting one I think. If Aerion isn't a very ambitious man himself (and I hadn't gotten that impression so far) and Aemon's only crime is having associated with the man who avenged his mother's death why would't Aemon welcome his brother?
Krugmar wrote:One of her legionnaires brought over a raven and held it nearby.

Aurinsula wrote:Meanwhile, in Mereen, a letter arrives at long last.

Since it as of ADWD (I think) was revealed that Ravens (who has never in RL been used as message carriers to my knowledge) isn't merely birds but are birds which has become the final resting place of skinchangingin children of the forest, why they are clearly much much more clever than any RL bird (animal even) and since they are used exclusively by maesters their use is probably restricted to places where the children of the forest used to live and where maesters operate. Westeros in other words. Since there would have been quite an exodus of people from Westeros when Aemon fled into exile I RP as having established an imperial postal system using ravens, but it would probably be the only use of ravens outside of Westeros. This postal system could maybe, in secret, be connected to the Eyrie and maybe one or two other Meereenese allied seats in Westeros, assuming the Westerosi lords would risk being caught in correspondence with a pretender to the Iron Throne.

As for communications between Maelesa and Mantarys it would probably have to be carried out by pigeons since presumably they work as well in GRRM's universe as it does in RL. An attempt to send a pigeon by a suspected enemy of Ghiscar to her brother from Meereen would however be intercepted. It wouldn't mean a lot since the message contained nothing that would cause Khrazdaqan to withhold it, so he would simply take a copy for the secret police and then send it with a new pigeon.
Arana wrote:Not sure I want him dead yet... also, Viserys is a warg, he's just not very good at it.

Well that might not be up to you. But so far we are negotiating so it may not be relevant this time around.

How is Viserys a warg? He has no first men/Stark blood in his veins.
Nation RP name
Arda i Eruhíni (short form)
Alcarinqua ar Meneldëa Arda i Eruhíni i sé Amanaranyë ar Aramanaranyë (long form)

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Krugmar
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Postby Krugmar » Thu Dec 25, 2014 5:32 am

Of the Quendi wrote:
Krugmar wrote:One of her legionnaires brought over a raven and held it nearby.

Aurinsula wrote:Meanwhile, in Mereen, a letter arrives at long last.

Since it as of ADWD (I think) was revealed that Ravens (who has never in RL been used as message carriers to my knowledge) isn't merely birds but are birds which has become the final resting place of skinchangingin children of the forest, why they are clearly much much more clever than any RL bird (animal even) and since they are used exclusively by maesters their use is probably restricted to places where the children of the forest used to live and where maesters operate. Westeros in other words. Since there would have been quite an exodus of people from Westeros when Aemon fled into exile I RP as having established an imperial postal system using ravens, but it would probably be the only use of ravens outside of Westeros. This postal system could maybe, in secret, be connected to the Eyrie and maybe one or two other Meereenese allied seats in Westeros, assuming the Westerosi lords would risk being caught in correspondence with a pretender to the Iron Throne.

As for communications between Maelesa and Mantarys it would probably have to be carried out by pigeons since presumably they work as well in GRRM's universe as it does in RL. An attempt to send a pigeon by a suspected enemy of Ghiscar to her brother from Meereen would however be intercepted. It wouldn't mean a lot since the message contained nothing that would cause Khrazdaqan to withhold it, so he would simply take a copy for the secret police and then send it with a new pigeon.


Noted, I'll use pigeons from now on. Luckily the letter was very ambiguous, not much use as evidence.

Also should we have an archive thread? Somewhere to store all the information and histories of the different nations which are being fleshed out.
Liec made me tell you to consider Kylaris

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Arana
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Postby Arana » Thu Dec 25, 2014 5:32 am

Of the Quendi wrote:I wonder what would happen if Aemon Targaryen marched through the gates of the throne room in the Red Keep bringing his brother a wedding gift. According to the story the Tyrell's are feeding Aerion Aemon isn't much implicated in the murder of neither their mother or father. Running away with the man who slay Jon Targaryen after Jon had murdered his own wife is hardly a foul deed. If anything thats the big hole in the story. Why did Aemon feel the need to flee from Westeros if his life wasn't threatened by any of the villains of the Tyrell story?

So if he landed Rhaegal on the Red Keep and brought a wedding gift to his brother what would be done? Would he be arrested? Killed? For what then. Or would he be received?

The question is (mostly) hypothetical, but it is an interesting one I think. If Aerion isn't a very ambitious man himself (and I hadn't gotten that impression so far) and Aemon's only crime is having associated with the man who avenged his mother's death why would't Aemon welcome his brother?
Krugmar wrote:One of her legionnaires brought over a raven and held it nearby.

Aurinsula wrote:Meanwhile, in Mereen, a letter arrives at long last.

Since it as of ADWD (I think) was revealed that Ravens (who has never in RL been used as message carriers to my knowledge) isn't merely birds but are birds which has become the final resting place of skinchangingin children of the forest, why they are clearly much much more clever than any RL bird (animal even) and since they are used exclusively by maesters their use is probably restricted to places where the children of the forest used to live and where maesters operate. Westeros in other words. Since there would have been quite an exodus of people from Westeros when Aemon fled into exile I RP as having established an imperial postal system using ravens, but it would probably be the only use of ravens outside of Westeros. This postal system could maybe, in secret, be connected to the Eyrie and maybe one or two other Meereenese allied seats in Westeros, assuming the Westerosi lords would risk being caught in correspondence with a pretender to the Iron Throne.

As for communications between Maelesa and Mantarys it would probably have to be carried out by pigeons since presumably they work as well in GRRM's universe as it does in RL. An attempt to send a pigeon by a suspected enemy of Ghiscar to her brother from Meereen would however be intercepted. It wouldn't mean a lot since the message contained nothing that would cause Khrazdaqan to withhold it, so he would simply take a copy for the secret police and then send it with a new pigeon.
Arana wrote:Not sure I want him dead yet... also, Viserys is a warg, he's just not very good at it.

Well that might not be up to you. But so far we are negotiating so it may not be relevant this time around.

How is Viserys a warg? He has no first men/Stark blood in his veins.

I'd imagine Aerion would welcome either if his brothers, although not without suspicion. The Tyrells would probably jump on that bit of suspicion and try to turn him against Aemon.
Prophet of Lavanthulhu -- A Proud Portal Nationalist -- Bet on Bernie 2016

Arana wrote:Fuck you and your raps,
And all your stupid rhyming.
Haiku master race.

*Drops mic*
Seventeen year old probably straight Christian socialist from New England.

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New Granadeseret
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Postby New Granadeseret » Thu Dec 25, 2014 8:17 am

Also, there's nothing stopping the Tyrells from trying to arrange a little 'accident' for the leader which keeps one of Westros's rivals together. I'd imagine they'd be downright giddy if the Ghiscari Empire were suddenly tossed into political turmoil by the death of their Emperor. Aemon, being the leader he is, would certainly have at least a few ears in Westros, and if he hasen't gotten the hint the Tyrells want him dead by this point...
Stannis was robbed.

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Aurinsula
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Postby Aurinsula » Thu Dec 25, 2014 8:32 am

Of the Quendi wrote:Since it as of ADWD (I think) was revealed that Ravens (who has never in RL been used as message carriers to my knowledge) isn't merely birds but are birds which has become the final resting place of skinchangingin children of the forest, why they are clearly much much more clever than any RL bird (animal even) and since they are used exclusively by maesters their use is probably restricted to places where the children of the forest used to live and where maesters operate. Westeros in other words. Since there would have been quite an exodus of people from Westeros when Aemon fled into exile I RP as having established an imperial postal system using ravens, but it would probably be the only use of ravens outside of Westeros. This postal system could maybe, in secret, be connected to the Eyrie and maybe one or two other Meereenese allied seats in Westeros, assuming the Westerosi lords would risk being caught in correspondence with a pretender to the Iron Throne.


I wouldn't think it necessary. It would be easy enough just to have a person carry a letter, and in any case I doubt a raven could fly across the Narrow Sea. Much too far.

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Of the Quendi
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Postby Of the Quendi » Thu Dec 25, 2014 8:48 am

Krugmar wrote:Noted, I'll use pigeons from now on. Luckily the letter was very ambiguous, not much use as evidence.

Also should we have an archive thread? Somewhere to store all the information and histories of the different nations which are being fleshed out.

OK, and the letter was fine. I just wanted to say that if you want to send intelligence out of Meereen it won't happen by bird from Maelesa's room.

As for an archive I think I am the only one doing nation building for my empire. Also isn't it the only nation that is a creative work of this RP? If so I can just put all my various tables and summaries in my app.
Arana wrote:I'd imagine Aerion would welcome either if his brothers, although not without suspicion. The Tyrells would probably jump on that bit of suspicion and try to turn him against Aemon.

Well Aemon has the truth working for him, and I imagine that there would be plenty of lords eager to back up his stories. If nothing else Aemon could probably do a lot of damage to the Tyrell hold on Aerion. But its, at least for the foreseeable future a hypothetical scenario.
New Granadeseret wrote:Also, there's nothing stopping the Tyrells from trying to arrange a little 'accident' for the leader which keeps one of Westros's rivals together. I'd imagine they'd be downright giddy if the Ghiscari Empire were suddenly tossed into political turmoil by the death of their Emperor. Aemon, being the leader he is, would certainly have at least a few ears in Westros, and if he hasen't gotten the hint the Tyrells want him dead by this point...

There's a dragon stopping them. But mostly its a time issue. Aemon can land in the Red Keep, go to see his brother and get out again in a few hours, not even for a moment being alone in a dark alley. But Aemon has plenty of spies and agents all over the Seven Kingdoms. I RP him having a Venetian inspired secret police and espionage organization, it will feature somewhat in my next post.
Aurinsula wrote:I wouldn't think it necessary. It would be easy enough just to have a person carry a letter, and in any case I doubt a raven could fly across the Narrow Sea. Much too far.

It would take forever with a messenger traveling from the Eyrie/King's Landing to Meereen though. A raven would take long enough. The narrow sea shouldn't be that big a problem I think, its very narrow (yeah I know I am hilarious) maybe three hundred miles. Can't a raven fly that?

Anyway I am sending an ambassador to Westeros to represent Aemon with my next post so he will handle contact with the west.
Nation RP name
Arda i Eruhíni (short form)
Alcarinqua ar Meneldëa Arda i Eruhíni i sé Amanaranyë ar Aramanaranyë (long form)

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New Granadeseret
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Postby New Granadeseret » Thu Dec 25, 2014 9:25 am

Of the Quendi wrote:There's a dragon stopping them. But mostly its a time issue. Aemon can land in the Red Keep, go to see his brother and get out again in a few hours, not even for a moment being alone in a dark alley. But Aemon has plenty of spies and agents all over the Seven Kingdoms. I RP him having a Venetian inspired secret police and espionage organization, it will feature somewhat in my next post.


Well, there's the whole matter of the man who, if he's not exiled, is the rightful king of Westros landing in the middle of King's Landing. After his major centralizing reforms, there is probably some real fear that if he takes back the Iron Throne, the Westrosi lords will see the same fate as the Masters of Ghis. Depending on when he arrived, he simply must stay for the ceremony, and would to answer to any number of questions from assorted lords. He could be tied up in red tape with his dragon being kept in the Dragonpit while King's Landing has perhaps the highest concentration of Valyrian Steel blades anywhere will see for awhile.

Its still not a gurantee, but the wedding would probably be the moment he's the least safe; appearing to be trying to snatch the throne out from under his younger brother just as he comes of age, at the only point a force capable of killing his dragon could be assembled at short notice.
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The cold ice
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Postby The cold ice » Thu Dec 25, 2014 10:36 am

Ublia wrote:Character Name: Lord Conor Baelish
Age: 17

Ublia, shouldn't this say 24?
Last edited by The cold ice on Thu Dec 25, 2014 11:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Of the Quendi
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Postby Of the Quendi » Thu Dec 25, 2014 11:59 am

New Granadeseret wrote:Well, there's the whole matter of the man who, if he's not exiled, is the rightful king of Westros landing in the middle of King's Landing. After his major centralizing reforms, there is probably some real fear that if he takes back the Iron Throne, the Westrosi lords will see the same fate as the Masters of Ghis. Depending on when he arrived, he simply must stay for the ceremony, and would to answer to any number of questions from assorted lords. He could be tied up in red tape with his dragon being kept in the Dragonpit while King's Landing has perhaps the highest concentration of Valyrian Steel blades anywhere will see for awhile.

Its still not a gurantee, but the wedding would probably be the moment he's the least safe; appearing to be trying to snatch the throne out from under his younger brother just as he comes of age, at the only point a force capable of killing his dragon could be assembled at short notice.

I doubt anyone in Westeros knows much about his centralizations. The Westerosi of the books hardly knowns anything about what Daenerys do in Meereen. At some point Victarion proposed to sail across the Dothraki Sea so its safe to assume that knowledge of the far east is negligible in Westeros and vice versa in the books. After Aemon migrating there with a many Westerosi supporters and after eighteen years as parts of one unified monarchy that could of course have changed and interactions between east and west could have increased. But then, his centralizing tendencies are exaggerated. The Ghiscari cities where always centralized, what Aemon did was just merge a number of independent centralized countries into one centralized country. To the extent people know about it I don't think that would be the major cause for concern over his kingship. A kingship he isn't personally advocating.

must is a word difficult to use against a man who is the true king and the Prince of Dragonstone to the pretender king. Convention and manners might dictate that Aemon stays for a while but it would somewhat difficult to keep him there. As for using force against him that would be rather risky for the Tyrell's/Aerion. Ordering his murder (which would go against the traditional honor codes that at least some Westerosi takes very serious) would be pushing the great lords into a corner. Either they obey and commit a rather extreme act. Or they don't, and then its civil war. Aemon arriving at King's Landing might in a rather tangible way put him in harms way, but it also throws Aerion or the Tyrell's into a potential minefield.
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Alcarinqua ar Meneldëa Arda i Eruhíni i sé Amanaranyë ar Aramanaranyë (long form)

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Sebastianbourg
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Postby Sebastianbourg » Thu Dec 25, 2014 12:09 pm

Posted.

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Novae Vitae
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Postby Novae Vitae » Thu Dec 25, 2014 12:45 pm

Of the Quendi wrote:
New Granadeseret wrote:Well, there's the whole matter of the man who, if he's not exiled, is the rightful king of Westros landing in the middle of King's Landing. After his major centralizing reforms, there is probably some real fear that if he takes back the Iron Throne, the Westrosi lords will see the same fate as the Masters of Ghis. Depending on when he arrived, he simply must stay for the ceremony, and would to answer to any number of questions from assorted lords. He could be tied up in red tape with his dragon being kept in the Dragonpit while King's Landing has perhaps the highest concentration of Valyrian Steel blades anywhere will see for awhile.

Its still not a gurantee, but the wedding would probably be the moment he's the least safe; appearing to be trying to snatch the throne out from under his younger brother just as he comes of age, at the only point a force capable of killing his dragon could be assembled at short notice.

I doubt anyone in Westeros knows much about his centralizations. The Westerosi of the books hardly knowns anything about what Daenerys do in Meereen. At some point Victarion proposed to sail across the Dothraki Sea so its safe to assume that knowledge of the far east is negligible in Westeros and vice versa in the books. After Aemon migrating there with a many Westerosi supporters and after eighteen years as parts of one unified monarchy that could of course have changed and interactions between east and west could have increased. But then, his centralizing tendencies are exaggerated. The Ghiscari cities where always centralized, what Aemon did was just merge a number of independent centralized countries into one centralized country. To the extent people know about it I don't think that would be the major cause for concern over his kingship. A kingship he isn't personally advocating.

must is a word difficult to use against a man who is the true king and the Prince of Dragonstone to the pretender king. Convention and manners might dictate that Aemon stays for a while but it would somewhat difficult to keep him there. As for using force against him that would be rather risky for the Tyrell's/Aerion. Ordering his murder (which would go against the traditional honor codes that at least some Westerosi takes very serious) would be pushing the great lords into a corner. Either they obey and commit a rather extreme act. Or they don't, and then its civil war. Aemon arriving at King's Landing might in a rather tangible way put him in harms way, but it also throws Aerion or the Tyrell's into a potential minefield.


If Aemon arrives, he's going to have a lot of questions that he must answer. Why did he flee? Surely once he was the rider of Rhaegal he would have been able to overpower any captor. Why did he wait so long to return? If the Tyrells were the monsters that Aemon and his rebels made them out to be, wouldn't it have been appropriate to return as soon as possible? Was he here to claim the throne? If he was, he has committed himself to treason against the de facto King of the Seven Kingdoms; if he was not, he is inciting revolt by his mere presence and is breaking the King's Peace--both viable causes for arrest.

Aemon must make the assumption that Westeros is full of political morons if he thinks he can land in King's Landing with impunity.

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Of the Quendi
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Postby Of the Quendi » Thu Dec 25, 2014 1:43 pm

Novae Vitae wrote:If Aemon arrives, he's going to have a lot of questions that he must answer. Why did he flee? Surely once he was the rider of Rhaegal he would have been able to overpower any captor. Why did he wait so long to return? If the Tyrells were the monsters that Aemon and his rebels made them out to be, wouldn't it have been appropriate to return as soon as possible? Was he here to claim the throne? If he was, he has committed himself to treason against the de facto King of the Seven Kingdoms; if he was not, he is inciting revolt by his mere presence and is breaking the King's Peace--both viable causes for arrest.

Aemon must make the assumption that Westeros is full of political morons if he thinks he can land in King's Landing with impunity.

All of those questions are already answered. Aemon spent the first two years of his exile in open war against the Tyrell's writing letters and possibly even throwing armies at House Tyrell. Every great lord would during that period have received dozens of letters making clear Aemon's position. Aerion would be the only one in need of any answers to these questions.

As for him committing treason he is the sovereign ruler of another country making it impossible for him to commit treason. At the most he can be branded an enemy of the state/king but would Aerion do that? Why? He has no reason to perceive his brother as an enemy. And if Aerion doesn't move against Aemon his visit to King's Landing could become a great triumph for him if he survives it. And if he does not at best it would be a pyrrhic Tyrell victory if they get his blood on their hands.
Last edited by Of the Quendi on Thu Dec 25, 2014 1:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Arda i Eruhíni (short form)
Alcarinqua ar Meneldëa Arda i Eruhíni i sé Amanaranyë ar Aramanaranyë (long form)

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Novae Vitae
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Postby Novae Vitae » Thu Dec 25, 2014 2:05 pm

Of the Quendi wrote:
Novae Vitae wrote:If Aemon arrives, he's going to have a lot of questions that he must answer. Why did he flee? Surely once he was the rider of Rhaegal he would have been able to overpower any captor. Why did he wait so long to return? If the Tyrells were the monsters that Aemon and his rebels made them out to be, wouldn't it have been appropriate to return as soon as possible? Was he here to claim the throne? If he was, he has committed himself to treason against the de facto King of the Seven Kingdoms; if he was not, he is inciting revolt by his mere presence and is breaking the King's Peace--both viable causes for arrest.

Aemon must make the assumption that Westeros is full of political morons if he thinks he can land in King's Landing with impunity.

All of those questions are already answered. Aemon spent the first two years of his exile in open war against the Tyrell's writing letters and possibly even throwing armies at House Tyrell. Every great lord would during that period have received dozens of letters making clear Aemon's position. Aerion would be the only one in need of any answers to these questions.

As for him committing treason he is the sovereign ruler of another country making it impossible for him to commit treason. At the most he can be branded an enemy of the state/king but would Aerion do that? Why? He has no reason to perceive his brother as an enemy. And if Aerion doesn't move against Aemon his visit to King's Landing could become a great triumph for him if he survives it. And if he does not at best it would be a pyrrhic Tyrell victory if they get his blood on their hands.


Wait . . . Aemon was throwing armies at the Tyrells? From where? Are you really saying that the legions of the empire just fell in step with . . . a twelve-year-old? And he was writing letters? I am sure someone has them on hand, to prove this statement true.

His is under the peace of the king, which means acts of aggression in the presence (i.e., claiming the Iron Throne) would be either treasonous or a declaration of war. And Aemon striding into the Red Keep demanding the Iron Throne . . . kind of a reason to perceive someone as enemy, especially considering Aerion has little idea of whom he can trust.

Besides, if Aemon just lands in King's Landing then he is never received nor invited. No laws of guest's rights are broken if he is arrested, executed, or . . . otherwise. *dramatic music plays*

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Postby New Granadeseret » Thu Dec 25, 2014 2:32 pm

Of the Quendi wrote:
Novae Vitae wrote:If Aemon arrives, he's going to have a lot of questions that he must answer. Why did he flee? Surely once he was the rider of Rhaegal he would have been able to overpower any captor. Why did he wait so long to return? If the Tyrells were the monsters that Aemon and his rebels made them out to be, wouldn't it have been appropriate to return as soon as possible? Was he here to claim the throne? If he was, he has committed himself to treason against the de facto King of the Seven Kingdoms; if he was not, he is inciting revolt by his mere presence and is breaking the King's Peace--both viable causes for arrest.

Aemon must make the assumption that Westeros is full of political morons if he thinks he can land in King's Landing with impunity.

All of those questions are already answered. Aemon spent the first two years of his exile in open war against the Tyrell's writing letters and possibly even throwing armies at House Tyrell. Every great lord would during that period have received dozens of letters making clear Aemon's position. Aerion would be the only one in need of any answers to these questions.

As for him committing treason he is the sovereign ruler of another country making it impossible for him to commit treason. At the most he can be branded an enemy of the state/king but would Aerion do that? Why? He has no reason to perceive his brother as an enemy. And if Aerion doesn't move against Aemon his visit to King's Landing could become a great triumph for him if he survives it. And if he does not at best it would be a pyrrhic Tyrell victory if they get his blood on their hands.


Yes, the cities were centralized, but there's a difference between independent, sovereign city-states (who arguably aren't that centeralized, considering the competition between the Masters. In Astapor they only co-operated to create Unsullied, after all) and one united empire, where dissent is crushed beneath the iron boot of imperial authority. Considering the Tyrells would be trying to demonize Aemon in any way they could (since, as the only other non-bastard child of the previous king and queen, he's the only REAL competition for the throne), they'd have their own spy network and propaganda machine to boot; spinning tails of how he crushed local sovereigns and what he'd do to the noble houses if he returned (Granted, the individual lords may or may not believe them). They'd be puffed-up stories, sure, but what propaganda isen'
t?

As for being in open war with the King's court, that would probably make him a persona non grata. Landing anywhere in the Seven Kingdoms, much less waltzing into the Red Keep without a formal invitation and landing a living siege engine right in the heart of the capital, would be a huge crime and grounds for his immediate arrest. If he isen't banished/ kicked out of the line of succession for some legal reason, than the Tyrells don't have a leg to stand on when claiming Aerion is the rightful king. They're not so forgetful as to ignore that little fact.
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Of the Quendi
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Postby Of the Quendi » Thu Dec 25, 2014 3:26 pm

Novae Vitae wrote:Wait . . . Aemon was throwing armies at the Tyrells? From where? Are you really saying that the legions of the empire just fell in step with . . . a twelve-year-old? And he was writing letters? I am sure someone has them on hand, to prove this statement true.

His is under the peace of the king, which means acts of aggression in the presence (i.e., claiming the Iron Throne) would be either treasonous or a declaration of war. And Aemon striding into the Red Keep demanding the Iron Throne . . . kind of a reason to perceive someone as enemy, especially considering Aerion has little idea of whom he can trust.

Besides, if Aemon just lands in King's Landing then he is never received nor invited. No laws of guest's rights are broken if he is arrested, executed, or . . . otherwise. *dramatic music plays*

Sixteen, seated atop a one reptile army with reasonably close familial ties to at least three great lords. I am assuming that there would have been some sort of war going on. That the Tyrell marched into King's Landing and murdered king and queen and that the whole world just accepted that without a word of complaint sounds far more dodgy then someone picking up arms for a young man groomed and capable of leadership with the undeniably better claim to the throne.

Aemon isn't claiming the throne and if he is under the peace of the king the supporters of the king would need a pretty ironclad reason for moving against him, guest rights is taken pretty serious in Westeros (unlike in Ghiscar where we are fairly open about putting the guests we don't like in gilded cages). Aemon marching into the throne room of his brother, congratulating him with his nuptials and presenting a wedding gift isn't that.

Arrest or execution would require the king's approval which again brings us to the question why Aerion who, even if he may be suspicious of a brother he don't remember who shows up out of nowhere on a dragon, would do such a thing. Even if we totally disregard family ties arresting the sovereign of one of the most powerful kingdoms in the world isn't wise. The Seven Kingdoms and the Ghiscari Empire may have few common interests but creating hostility with a foreign land isn't something to be taken lightly. The dramatic music would be the real problem for Aemon and is the second reason why something like this won't happen in the near future.
New Granadeseret wrote:Yes, the cities were centralized, but there's a difference between independent, sovereign city-states (who arguably aren't that centeralized, considering the competition between the Masters. In Astapor they only co-operated to create Unsullied, after all) and one united empire, where dissent is crushed beneath the iron boot of imperial authority. Considering the Tyrells would be trying to demonize Aemon in any way they could (since, as the only other non-bastard child of the previous king and queen, he's the only REAL competition for the throne), they'd have their own spy network and propaganda machine to boot; spinning tails of how he crushed local sovereigns and what he'd do to the noble houses if he returned (Granted, the individual lords may or may not believe them). They'd be puffed-up stories, sure, but what propaganda isen'
t?

As for being in open war with the King's court, that would probably make him a persona non grata. Landing anywhere in the Seven Kingdoms, much less waltzing into the Red Keep without a formal invitation and landing a living siege engine right in the heart of the capital, would be a huge crime and grounds for his immediate arrest. If he isen't banished/ kicked out of the line of succession for some legal reason, than the Tyrells don't have a leg to stand on when claiming Aerion is the rightful king. They're not so forgetful as to ignore that little fact.

The fact that masters competed for influence within the cities doesn't mean they weren't centralized, it just means that while being centralized they practiced elite pluralism. Centralization is the consolidation of power in the center rather than in the periphery. The masters where all in the center. A decentralized slaver city would be one where towns surrounding the city had its own local autonomous rulers, that probably wasn't the case. What Aemon destroyed was pluralism. The decisions of the centralized states where no longer left up to competing elites but placed exclusively in the emperor's hands. A more effective propaganda would probably be calling Aemon a Ghiscari, a non-Seven worshipper, a polygamist or a more broad critique of him as being tyrannical and despotic.

Landing in the Seven Kingdoms is only going to be a crime if the king declares it so. (I suspect that there are more than a few places in the Seven Kingdoms where Aemon could land to thunderous applause from lords and small folk alike). As both Prince of Dragonstone and a foreign sovereign he can't be placed under arrest by anyone else and as for a going places with a dragon that can't possibly be criminal under Targaryen rule.
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Postby Novae Vitae » Thu Dec 25, 2014 3:39 pm

Of the Quendi wrote:
Novae Vitae wrote:Wait . . . Aemon was throwing armies at the Tyrells? From where? Are you really saying that the legions of the empire just fell in step with . . . a twelve-year-old? And he was writing letters? I am sure someone has them on hand, to prove this statement true.

His is under the peace of the king, which means acts of aggression in the presence (i.e., claiming the Iron Throne) would be either treasonous or a declaration of war. And Aemon striding into the Red Keep demanding the Iron Throne . . . kind of a reason to perceive someone as enemy, especially considering Aerion has little idea of whom he can trust.

Besides, if Aemon just lands in King's Landing then he is never received nor invited. No laws of guest's rights are broken if he is arrested, executed, or . . . otherwise. *dramatic music plays*

Sixteen, seated atop a one reptile army with reasonably close familial ties to at least three great lords. I am assuming that there would have been some sort of war going on. That the Tyrell marched into King's Landing and murdered king and queen and that the whole world just accepted that without a word of complaint sounds far more dodgy then someone picking up arms for a young man groomed and capable of leadership with the undeniably better claim to the throne.

Aemon isn't claiming the throne and if he is under the peace of the king the supporters of the king would need a pretty ironclad reason for moving against him, guest rights is taken pretty serious in Westeros (unlike in Ghiscar where we are fairly open about putting the guests we don't like in gilded cages). Aemon marching into the throne room of his brother, congratulating him with his nuptials and presenting a wedding gift isn't that.

Arrest or execution would require the king's approval which again brings us to the question why Aerion who, even if he may be suspicious of a brother he don't remember who shows up out of nowhere on a dragon, would do such a thing. Even if we totally disregard family ties arresting the sovereign of one of the most powerful kingdoms in the world isn't wise. The Seven Kingdoms and the Ghiscari Empire may have few common interests but creating hostility with a foreign land isn't something to be taken lightly. The dramatic music would be the real problem for Aemon and is the second reason why something like this won't happen in the near future.


No, twelve. I assure you, as per the quote of the OP: "Aerion’s two siblings, the six year old Viserys and twelve year old Aemon, were taken out of the city by loyalist forces, and brought to their mother’s empire in Slaver’s Bay." And though, I believe, Arana has described the war as ending ambiguously after a year, he wrote, also in the OP: "With Aerion in the custody of House Tyrell, the Targaryen forces in Essos and those of Targaryen loyalists in Westeros were unable to continue the war, which was forced to end inconclusively." I should believe that defeats your point of a twelve-year-old (perhaps thirteen-year-old) Aemon throwing armies at the Tyrells from a highly-hostile Slaver's Bay.

For what other reason would he land in King's Landing? Let us assume he arrives not to claim the throne, but . . . for whatever reason he arrives. The simple question of "Do you believe you are the rightful king of Westeros?" in public would put Aemon in an inescapable position, assuming: a) he says yes, which is de facto a declaration of war, b) he refuses to answer, which makes him look spineless, or, c) he says no, which is, de facto, surrendering his claims to the Iron Throne. The foremost is legal tenure for arrest and execution, and the latter two demean his position severely.

Aerion has been instructed--and clearly believes in his instruction--to listen to Loras in any major decisions. And well I cannot speak for the actions of Aerion under such circumstance, he appears relatively convinced that Sansa murdered his parents. If this belief holds true in him, I find it probable that he would at least arrest the key pawn in Sansa's scheming.

Also, the Ghiscari are free to try and invade Westeros. The Royal Fleet and the Redwyne Fleet combined will have a field day with them, if there is no dragon to protect them.
Last edited by Novae Vitae on Thu Dec 25, 2014 3:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Legatia
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Legatia » Thu Dec 25, 2014 3:56 pm

NS Nation Name: Legatia
House Name: House Forrester
Leader: Ryon Forrester
Lands: Ironrath (Located in the Wolfswood)
Overlord, if any: Holds fealty to House Glover and by extension, Stark.
Coat of Arms: A white ironwood tree on a black background emblazoned with a black sword. Image


NS Nation Name: Legatia
Character Name: Ryon Forrester
Nickname, if any:
Title, if any: Lord of Ironrath
Age: 39
Gender: Male
House Allegiance: Forrester
Appearance:
Image

Biography
Born shortly before the tumultuous War of the Five Kings as the fourthborn son, he was reprieved from most duties, living a carefree life. Because of this, he was not at first the steadfast and dauntless lord he eventually became. He was quite shy and fearful in reality. He spent his childhood chasing his older siblings Ethan and Talia in the groves in Forrester land, and generally living a relaxed lifestyle. His life, as well as life for the rest of the North, took a wild direction in the aftermath of the Red Wedding, where his father, Lord Gregor Forrester, and eldest brother and heir, Rodrick Forrester, were killed. His older, thirdborn brother, Ethan, took the reins as Lord of Ironrath. His reign was extremely short. In the aftermath of a dispute between the Forresters, bannermen to House Stark, and the Whitehills, their bitter rivals and loyal to House Bolton, the new Wardens of the north, Ethan is killed by Ramsay Snow- leader of the Bolton's forces in the North. Ryon was taken by the Whitehills as a ward to ensure the cooperation of the now leaderless House Forrester.

He spent many months as the equivalent of a slave to Lord Whitehill, being abused, beaten, starved and threatened, some scars he still bears to this day. It was not until the Boltons were usurped from their power in the North that Ryon was retrieved, and Jon was made Lord of Winterfell. He was returned to Ironrath, where he took the reins from his older sister Talia, who had been guided by his lady mother throughout his rule. Ryon was still young, but the time he spent with the Whitehills beat the spirit he had possesed as a child out of him. However, the Gods saw fortune upon him and did not make him cruel, yet a fair and noble leader. Many said he encompassed the spirit of his father and brother Ethan in his rule. His life from then on was quiet and calm, retaining their alliance to House Stark. He married a woman of another house, Adianna and has sired a son, Ethan, named after his brother, and two daughters, Talia (named after his sister) and Lyra.

Any Additional Information:
All this was based off of Telltale's Game of Thrones game. I'm pretty sure House Forrester isn't canon, so I hope that's okay.
Last edited by Legatia on Sun Dec 28, 2014 11:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Of the Quendi
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Postby Of the Quendi » Thu Dec 25, 2014 4:09 pm

Novae Vitae wrote:No, twelve. I assure you, as per the quote of the OP: "Aerion’s two siblings, the six year old Viserys and twelve year old Aemon, were taken out of the city by loyalist forces, and brought to their mother’s empire in Slaver’s Bay." And though, I believe, Arana has described the war as ending ambiguously after a year, he wrote, also in the OP: "With Aerion in the custody of House Tyrell, the Targaryen forces in Essos and those of Targaryen loyalists in Westeros were unable to continue the war, which was forced to end inconclusively." I should believe that defeats your point of a twelve-year-old (perhaps thirteen-year-old) Aemon throwing armies at the Tyrells from a highly-hostile Slaver's Bay.

For what other reason would he land in King's Landing? Let us assume he arrives not to claim the throne, but . . . for whatever reason he arrives. The simple question of "Do you believe you are the rightful king of Westeros?" in public would put Aemon in an inescapable position, assuming: a) he says yes, which is de facto a declaration of war, b) he refuses to answer, which makes him look spineless, or, c) he says no, which is, de facto, surrendering his claims to the Iron Throne. The foremost is legal tenure for arrest and execution, and the latter two demean his position severely.

Aerion has been instructed--and clearly believes in his instruction--to listen to Loras in any major decisions. And well I cannot speak for the actions of Aerion under such circumstance, he appears relatively convinced that Sansa murdered his parents. If this belief holds true in him, I find it probable that he would at least arrest the key pawn in Sansa's scheming.

Also, the Ghiscari are free to try and invade Westeros. The Royal Fleet and the Redwyne Fleet combined will have a field day with them, if there is no dragon to protect them.

The OP hasn't updated Aemon's age. He asked me a while back to make my character twenty eight. The Tyrell rebellion was in 318 and now its 330 so he was sixteen. The OP to me seems far too ambiguous about the aftermath of the rebellion for it to be concluded that combat didn't take place after the fall of King's Landing. The rebellion is called a war. If its only battle is a surprise attack on King's Landing that would be a coup. But its not important. I have never assumed that it was certain that there was a war.

For his reason to land in Westeros of course. To convince his brother that the Tyrell's are traitors and have him execute them and become a strong king of the Seven Kingdoms. And Aemon doesn't have to answer questions from anyone but his brother. If he chooses to do so he will make sure to answer them in a manner that doesn't incriminate himself in any wrong doing but doesn't seem weak either. An example; "the contested legality of the rule of my revered brother is a matter that need to be appropriately resolved, hence I have come to settle in the spirit of fraternity what outstanding issues remain between me and my brother. But these are lofty matters for kings and emperors to discuss between themselves, and not something a humble rose lord need be made privy to. Get thee gone and take thy due place Lord Tyrell, and leave it to your betters to resolve these issues." That is hardly criminal and even if it may seem a tad spineless I suspect it would undermine the position of the Tyrell asker more then that of Aemon.

Obviously if Aerion always does what Loras wants Aemon would have made a great mistake in coming to King's Landing. The whole reason why I asked the question of what would happen if he did was to find out if there is cases where Aerion will not do as told. But if Aerion has been told that it was Sansa who incited Jon to kill Daenerys why would he hold a grudge against Aemon.

As for an the Redwyne and Royal navies combined are certainly stronger then the Ghiscari one but that doesn't mean a Ghiscari landfall cannot be conducted (and if an invasion takes place at least one dragon will be providing cover for the fleet, possibly more). The Golden Company managed to pull of amphibious invasions of half of the Stormlands without trouble. A wooden wall isn't a guarantee that an invasion can't take place. And though its navy isn't its strong suit Ghiscar has ships. Elyria and New Ghis must have had plenty and even Meereen, Astapor and Yunkai must have had some, then there are the smaller cities and towns, it adds up and Aemon has been trying to expand his fleet.

Well of for tonight. Creative discussions (or whatever this is) must have to wait. I doubt I will have internet access tomorrow and possibly not much of it the day after that.
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Postby Novae Vitae » Thu Dec 25, 2014 4:24 pm

Of the Quendi wrote:
Novae Vitae wrote:No, twelve. I assure you, as per the quote of the OP: "Aerion’s two siblings, the six year old Viserys and twelve year old Aemon, were taken out of the city by loyalist forces, and brought to their mother’s empire in Slaver’s Bay." And though, I believe, Arana has described the war as ending ambiguously after a year, he wrote, also in the OP: "With Aerion in the custody of House Tyrell, the Targaryen forces in Essos and those of Targaryen loyalists in Westeros were unable to continue the war, which was forced to end inconclusively." I should believe that defeats your point of a twelve-year-old (perhaps thirteen-year-old) Aemon throwing armies at the Tyrells from a highly-hostile Slaver's Bay.

For what other reason would he land in King's Landing? Let us assume he arrives not to claim the throne, but . . . for whatever reason he arrives. The simple question of "Do you believe you are the rightful king of Westeros?" in public would put Aemon in an inescapable position, assuming: a) he says yes, which is de facto a declaration of war, b) he refuses to answer, which makes him look spineless, or, c) he says no, which is, de facto, surrendering his claims to the Iron Throne. The foremost is legal tenure for arrest and execution, and the latter two demean his position severely.

Aerion has been instructed--and clearly believes in his instruction--to listen to Loras in any major decisions. And well I cannot speak for the actions of Aerion under such circumstance, he appears relatively convinced that Sansa murdered his parents. If this belief holds true in him, I find it probable that he would at least arrest the key pawn in Sansa's scheming.

Also, the Ghiscari are free to try and invade Westeros. The Royal Fleet and the Redwyne Fleet combined will have a field day with them, if there is no dragon to protect them.

The OP hasn't updated Aemon's age. He asked me a while back to make my character twenty eight. The Tyrell rebellion was in 318 and now its 330 so he was sixteen. The OP to me seems far too ambiguous about the aftermath of the rebellion for it to be concluded that combat didn't take place after the fall of King's Landing. The rebellion is called a war. If its only battle is a surprise attack on King's Landing that would be a coup. But its not important. I have never assumed that it was certain that there was a war.

For his reason to land in Westeros of course. To convince his brother that the Tyrell's are traitors and have him execute them and become a strong king of the Seven Kingdoms. And Aemon doesn't have to answer questions from anyone but his brother. If he chooses to do so he will make sure to answer them in a manner that doesn't incriminate himself in any wrong doing but doesn't seem weak either. An example; "the contested legality of the rule of my revered brother is a matter that need to be appropriately resolved, hence I have come to settle in the spirit of fraternity what outstanding issues remain between me and my brother. But these are lofty matters for kings and emperors to discuss between themselves, and not something a humble rose lord need be made privy to. Get thee gone and take thy due place Lord Tyrell, and leave it to your betters to resolve these issues." That is hardly criminal and even if it may seem a tad spineless I suspect it would undermine the position of the Tyrell asker more then that of Aemon.

Obviously if Aerion always does what Loras wants Aemon would have made a great mistake in coming to King's Landing. The whole reason why I asked the question of what would happen if he did was to find out if there is cases where Aerion will not do as told. But if Aerion has been told that it was Sansa who incited Jon to kill Daenerys why would he hold a grudge against Aemon.

As for an the Redwyne and Royal navies combined are certainly stronger then the Ghiscari one but that doesn't mean a Ghiscari landfall cannot be conducted (and if an invasion takes place at least one dragon will be providing cover for the fleet, possibly more). The Golden Company managed to pull of amphibious invasions of half of the Stormlands without trouble. A wooden wall isn't a guarantee that an invasion can't take place. And though its navy isn't its strong suit Ghiscar has ships. Elyria and New Ghis must have had plenty and even Meereen, Astapor and Yunkai must have had some, then there are the smaller cities and towns, it adds up and Aemon has been trying to expand his fleet.

Well of for tonight. Creative discussions (or whatever this is) must have to wait. I doubt I will have internet access tomorrow and possibly not much of it the day after that.


Well I shall not assume to understand the OP perfectly, Aemon's age is clearly stated there--until such time as it is updated, I must defer to it. And there was a war, but ended, as described in the OP, as "inconclusively." The amount of time it would have required Aemon to go from Ghiscar to Westeros would be such that it would almost be pointless for him to have engaged in warfare at all--indeed, it is clearly specified in the OP that he did not.

No, he has no need to answer questions--but how incredibly stupid he shall look. And your dialogue--well demeaning the position of literally every lord in Westeros except Aerion--did not even answer the question. I shall reiterate the question: "Do you believe you are the rightful king of Westeros?" If Aemon attempted such a dialogue in King's Landing, hypothetically, this would be Loras's swift reply:

"Convincing, my lord, convincing indeed. Not only have you totally ignored my question, but you have insulted every person living in all of Westeros with the exception of His Grace. How stunning is your rhetoric." I should think therein Aemon will be severely demeaned.

Loras has explained to Aerion that Sansa is rebellious; and that if they seize Sansa, several lords will rebel and Aemon will conquer Westeros. Therefore, by proxy, the death or seizure of Aemon allows for the arrest and execution of Sansa.

And since a dragon will likely be guarding the Ghiscari fleet, the point is somewhat mute. We can continue the point of naval invasion if you want to continue, however.

And I prefer to think of this as a friendly debate. Have a good holiday; until . . . the next few days, I suppose. :)

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Asyir
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Postby Asyir » Thu Dec 25, 2014 9:00 pm

I've decided to also play as the Hightowers, if I may.
Team Pelinal for life!

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New Granadeseret
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Postby New Granadeseret » Thu Dec 25, 2014 9:48 pm

Of the Quendi wrote:
The fact that masters competed for influence within the cities doesn't mean they weren't centralized, it just means that while being centralized they practiced elite pluralism. Centralization is the consolidation of power in the center rather than in the periphery. The masters where all in the center. A decentralized slaver city would be one where towns surrounding the city had its own local autonomous rulers, that probably wasn't the case. What Aemon destroyed was pluralism. The decisions of the centralized states where no longer left up to competing elites but placed exclusively in the emperor's hands. A more effective propaganda would probably be calling Aemon a Ghiscari, a non-Seven worshipper, a polygamist or a more broad critique of him as being tyrannical and despotic.

Landing in the Seven Kingdoms is only going to be a crime if the king declares it so. (I suspect that there are more than a few places in the Seven Kingdoms where Aemon could land to thunderous applause from lords and small folk alike). As both Prince of Dragonstone and a foreign sovereign he can't be placed under arrest by anyone else and as for a going places with a dragon that can't possibly be criminal under Targaryen rule.


I was not speaking of the cities in and of themselves: I was speaking of the structure of power within Slaver's Bay as a whole (The frame of reference on which Aemon is operating). The Bay was so decentralized that not even a nominal central authority existed (unlike the Holy Roman Empire IRL;the best example of a decenteralized state that could still function as a single nation I can think of.), with power divided between the cities and further between the various Masters within the cities, alongside those holding outside estates (like olive plantations). This authority, which was recognized as sovereign, was removed. Thus, in a short period of time you go from a culturally similar put politically diverse group of city-states, to a nation here all authority rests in the hands of a single man, who doles it out to his underlings. This is a fairly radical shift, and sit poorly among nobles with inborn authority who displeased Aemon by not answering his call to arms all those years ago. I'd agree the Ghiscari claim and tyrannical would certainly work, but non-Seven worshipper might fall flat: King Stannis worshiped R'hllor, King Jon held the Old Gods, and the Northerners, Ironmen, some Dornish, and a handful of assorted houses (Blackwood, for instance) don't worship The Seven either and aren't any less legitimate because of it.

Any claim to be Prince of Dragonstone would also be up for debate, since in order for Aerion to be King in the first place Aemon must have been kicked out of the line of succession. As I mentioned earlier, the Tyrells aren't stupid enough to not cover their hindquarters at least that much. They've been working to gain legitimacy, and that only works if they say Aemon and his children don't qualify for the Iron Throne because (insert somewhat convincing legal argument here). By accepting that kind of title, they'd basically be saying he can come back and take the throne if Aerion were to die... which is certainly not in their plans. I can't speak for the Tyrells, but they'd probably prefer anything over a personal union (in a best case scenario, annexation at worst) with the Ghiscari Empire under as competent and strong-willed a leader as Aemon (Who would, in all likelihood, disinherit them for their actions) or, gods forbid, having to put the Dotharaki bastard on the throne.

If you've already been declared to be banished, it remains a crime to land unless the King specifically lifts your banishment. Landing a dragon might not be forbidden to the Aerion, who as King can theoretically do whatever he wants, but consider the following: if Viserys landed Drogon right at the gates of the Imperial Palace; a creature who has the power to set the entire capital ablaze in mere minutes, I'd imagine Aemon wouldn't wait to subdue him until after all his high officials were roasting alive. Its the same thing here; a dragon is an extremely dangerous creature and may as well be considered an army for all practical purposes. The sovereign may deploy it wherever he wishes on his own land, but the head of a foreign nation can't be expected to get away with it.
Last edited by New Granadeseret on Fri Dec 26, 2014 12:03 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Founded: Oct 28, 2013
Ex-Nation

Postby Asyir » Thu Dec 25, 2014 11:59 pm

The Hightowers of Oldtown



NS Nation Name: Asyir
House Name: House Hightower
Leader: Jovaryn Hightower
Lands: Oldtown and the Hightower
Overlord, if any: the Tyrells of course.
Coat of Arms: The Sigil of House Hightower



NS Nation Name: Asyir
Character Name: Lord Jovaryn Hightower
Nickname, if any: "The Stalwart"
Title, if any: Lord of the Hightower.
Age: 41
Gender: Male
House Allegiance: House Tyrell of the Reach
Appearance: Lord Jovaryn Hightower
Biography: Born in 289 AC to Lord Baelor Hightower, Jovaryn was born for leadership and battle. His early childhood was spent being a ward to Lord Mace Tyrell, where he witnessed "Reach Chivalry" at its finest. Jovaryn was quite fond of his mentor Mace, and has only pleasant memories of Highgarden. At the age of 14 he was squired to Ser Garlan Tyrell, where he learned the art of the sword, eventually becoming a master. By the age of 18, he was anointed as a knight, and took his place beside his father, whom groomed him for leadership. Jovaryn became a regular in tourneys, usually taking place in both the jousts and melees. Jovaryn kept away from the dangerous realm of politics, and speaks plainly and honestly with everyone. Jovaryn and House Hightower flourished in these times of peace, and their influence spread along with the Tyrells. He married a beautiful woman named Talana, a daughter of Lord Redwyne.

In 318 AC,Lord Baelor Hightower was summoned by Mace Tyrell to Highgarden, leaving Jovaryn in charge of Oldtown. Unbeknownst to them, Mace would be arrested and executed by Jon and Daenerys Targaryen. When word reached Jovaryn, he mustered his forces, and was the first bannerman of the Tyrells to muster. Jovaryn led his forces under Lord Willas Tyrell, and took part in the assault on King's Landing. After, he assumed the lordship of Oldtown and became a just ruler. He has always been loyal to the Tyrell family, and his advice is well regarded and received amongst them. Lord Willas Tyrell once called him,"the Stalwart Guardian of the Reach". He has taken that as his alias, and some refer to him as simply "Stalwart".
Any Additional Information: Currently ruling at Oldtown. Will not attend the King's Wedding.



NS Nation Name: Asyir
Character Name: Ser Ryndar Hightower
Nickname, if any: "The Stormblade". "Iron-Wall of the Hightower".
Title, if any: A knight and the heir to the Hightower and Oldtown.
Age: 21
Gender: Male
House Allegiance: To the Tyrells and his father Jovaryn.
Appearance: Ser Ryndar Hightower
Biography: Born in 309 AC to Lord Jovaryn Hightower and Lady Talana Redwyne, he is the current heir to Jovaryn. From an early age, he showed great interest in swordplay and knights. Lord Jovaryn took notice of this, and had him taught beginning courses. He was warded to his grandfather, Lord Redwyne at the age of 8, and remained there until 11. By age 11, he was squired to Lord Redwyne's son. He excelled as not only a squire, but as a swordsman himself. At the age of 18, he was knighted. He entered several tourneys over the course of the following year, and won his own nameday tourney at Oldtown. He became known as the "Stormblade", after winning a melee held at Arbor. He showed impressive swordsmanship and horsemanship. However, Ryndar became "bored" of tourneys, and wanted the taste of real battle.

In 328 AC, a group of bandits began ransacking some farmsteads on Hightower land. Ser Ryndar led a handful of knights and soldiers, and tracked the cutthroats down. During the skirmish with them, Ryndar stood like an "Iron-Wall", and became known as "The Iron-Wall of the Hightower". The first taste of battle humbled the arrogant and proud knight. Ryndar is seen as loyal and strong, like his father. He has no great care for politics. He takes great strides to protect his family, especially his younger brother Olyvar. He is very picky with the topic of marriage and women.
Any Additional Information:Wields the ancestral Valyrian steel greatsword Vigilance. An heirloom of House Hightower.



NS Nation Name: Asyir
Character Name: Ser Olyvar Hightower
Nickname, if any: "The Rose of the Hightower", "The Silver Knight"
Title, if any: Knight and Hightower
Age: 20
Gender: Male
House Allegiance: Tyrell and Hightower
Appearance: Ser Olyvar Hightower
Biography (At least 2 well written paragraphs) Ser Olyvar Hightower is the second son of Lord Jovaryn Hightower and Lady Talana Redwyne. He was born a year after Ryndar in 310 AC. Like his father and elder brother, he had great interest in knights and chivalry from an early age. He mastered horsemanship by the age of 14, and was seen as second to his brother Ryndar with the sword. He was warded to Lord Willas Tyrell up until the age of 15, when he was squired to his son, Loras Tyrell. Olyvar became close to his mentor, Loras, and the two travelled across the Reach. Olyvar was knighted at 17, and entered a number of tourneys for honor and glory. He bested his brother Ryndar in a joust i
at Oldtown, and was dubbed,"The Silver Knight", for his tendency to wear silver armor. He is a handsome youth, and it is said that all maidens weep and lust for him above all others. Ser Ryndar called him,"the Rose of the Hightower", after a group of maidens nearly rioted as the two passed by.

Olyvar seeks nothing more than glory as a knight. He views himself as superior to other knights, and calls himself the "pinnacle of chivalry". He is loyal to his family, but even more so to Lord Loras Tyrell, and acts as his chief bodyguard. He is very well-mannered, even more so than his older brother. His glory has surpassed Ryndar's as a tourney knight, and he is revered throughout the Seven Kingdoms.
Any Additional Information:Will participate in the King's Tourney.



More characters with House Hightower may be added on later as separate apps.
Team Pelinal for life!

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