The Historical RP Group HQ 2

[Australian Antarctica]

Anyone want to take a look at my Alt-Hist RP? viewtopic.php?f=31&t=336562

[Caltarania]

cool cool

I can link a map from the actual series

It mostly takes place round the Willamette valley, but your British empire is ob wank as well XD

http://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/attachment.php?attachmentid=240628&stc=1&d=1412633997

Book Mapa

coolio

maybe we should take the premise but custom nations

[Terminus Alpha]

I can link a map from the actual series

It mostly takes place round the Willamette valley, but your British empire is ob wank as well XD

http://www.alternatehistory.com/discussion/attachment.php?attachmentid=240628&stc=1&d=1412633997

Book Mapa

coolio

maybe we should take the premise but custom nations

ya, sounds interesting.

[The Industrial States of Columbia]

I was thinking a localized area, probably Europe or North America, as that is what most of us know. Great Lakes into Canada would be a goot alternate surviving area, and Europe could be fun to play. Most populated areas would become *Dead zones*, infested with eaters until nations could reclaim them.

We could also use any year after the book change for *The Change*, and build our nations from that point. So the main question is, where would we want to play?

[Alleniana]

only problem is teh germoney

goodnight

but skandy wouldn't let germoney make polska kill, tak? ...tak?

sorrie, germon is of teh skandfrend

Anyone want to take a look at my Alt-Hist RP? viewtopic.php?f=31&t=336562

interesting...

Definitely not loss.

Last time I checked MiM Germany in 1920(?) had a net loss in non-colonial territory, including territory with a German majority.
I'd ask if that isn't a loss, what is, but WW2 and Versailles happened, so I know what is. But you get my point.

Mmm, well, considering they went through a revolution almost immediately after the war (don't ask), I'd say they got off pretty light.

Mmm, not exactly Woodrow's peace, anyway, but similar.

To be honest, I really really don't see that happen, not with the Military in de-facto control and Wilhelm II as Emperor. I really don't.

I mean, Paris hysteria, which results in Germany wondering whether they should capitalise on it and start negotiations, which, due to media faffing, produces the Woodrow collapse effect.

I meant French Zhangjiang. It's my mum's hometown, which is why I got confused; surely a town like that would never be that relevant? Apparently it was. Anyway, Germany seized all other ports sans Macau, and gave Zhangjiang back as a sort of "goodwill". Maybe.

I see. Why sans Macau? IIRC Portugal was at war as well, and if they managed to gain from the British there is no reason for them not to have done so from the Portuguese.

Oh, I wasn't aware of Portugal's involvement. That's an idea, though I might wipe Portugal's involvement out, or at least whitewash it.

Which reminds me, Japan: I don't see Japan following and surrendering. Not in any scenario which neither is ASB nor has a PoD from before the war.
But I could see a small goodwill port being returned from those captured.

What happened was basically Japan realising that victory didn't have too much point to it any more, so Germany agreed to hand over some of the Kurils to Japan in Brest-Litovsk, and that was that. So, basically, both sides just shrugged and went on their way.

and some colonies

Speaking of colonies.... Wouldn't the british keep hold of those? I evaded that by basically placing them close to bankruptcy miles into depth, but with US entry into the war I wouldn't consider that the way out.
So why doesn't the RN prevent the Centrals from having any colonies?

Because they won the war Certainly, the Germans couldn't demand such terms that Britain would rather fight on, but they can certainly demand a fair bit from Britain's overbloated empire, now that France looks to have fallen, which would mean Germany's eventual naval catching-up wouldn't be too far behind. (in theory; in practise, it's Germany vs Britain, quite possibly for WW2)

(though it would lose Libya),

To the Ottomans, I guess?

Yup, along with Egypt, Sudan and Arabia from the British, which creates a remarkably strong Ottomans again.

[The Jonathanian States]

Last time I checked MiM Germany in 1920(?) had a net loss in non-colonial territory, including territory with a German majority.
I'd ask if that isn't a loss, what is, but WW2 and Versailles happened, so I know what is. But you get my point.

Mmm, well, considering they went through a revolution almost immediately after the war (don't ask), I'd say they got off pretty light.

Revolutions tend to happen after wars lost, not after wars won.....

To be honest, I really really don't see that happen, not with the Military in de-facto control and Wilhelm II as Emperor. I really don't.

I mean, Paris hysteria, which results in Germany wondering whether they should capitalise on it and start negotiations, which,

So far so good.

due to media faffing, produces the Woodrow collapse effect.

There's my issue. IMO a critical part of that collapse effect cannot, simply cannot, come into existence without the offer being, well, Wilsonian.

I see. Why sans Macau? IIRC Portugal was at war as well, and if they managed to gain from the British there is no reason for them not to have done so from the Portuguese.

Oh, I wasn't aware of Portugal's involvement. That's an idea, though I might wipe Portugal's involvement out, or at least whitewash it.

Yep.

Which reminds me, Japan: I don't see Japan following and surrendering. Not in any scenario which neither is ASB nor has a PoD from before the war.
But I could see a small goodwill port being returned from those captured.

What happened was basically Japan realising that victory didn't have too much point to it any more, so Germany agreed to hand over some of the Kurils to Japan in Brest-Litovsk, and that was that. So, basically, both sides just shrugged and went on their way.

Kurils? Just that?
Japan cannot be beaten by Germany. Not by this point in time, and definitely not as long as Albion is still in the war. Also, define victory not having too much point anymore? They'd still be as likely to get what they always could have gotten: German territory in the east, only that now allied Lands could be up for auction as well.
Look, I'm all for an OP German Empire and all that belongs to that, but in WW1, assuming no pre-WW1 PoD, Japan wins. No other way for it to happen. And possibly more important, it knows that it can win.
Mind you, them taking all allied and Central colonies in the east would be madness, but I do see gaining them at least some of from both or one of them.

Speaking of colonies.... Wouldn't the british keep hold of those? I evaded that by basically placing them close to bankruptcy miles into depth, but with US entry into the war I wouldn't consider that the way out.
So why doesn't the RN prevent the Centrals from having any colonies?

Because they won the war

Britain is an island, and the colonies are over-seas. As long as the Navy hasn't been beaten, or something close enough to that, Germany having "won" won't matter in the negotiations as by that time Britain de-facto controlled the German colonies (except for parts of East-Africa and of Kaiser-Wilhelmsland).

Certainly, the Germans couldn't demand such terms that Britain would rather fight on,

obviously.

but they can certainly demand a fair bit from Britain's overbloated empire,

Eh.... as far as I see Britain still is undefeated. France has been beaten through and through, and it seems as if their public is completely panicking. But Britain rules the waves and all that.
But I guess it depends on the definition of fair.

now that France looks to have fallen,

Yes....

which would mean Germany's eventual naval catching-up wouldn't be too far behind.

Do you mean short-term, meaning immediately in the war? Don't see any reason for that.
Long-term, once the war has won? If Germany won areas with resources or gains reparations, yes. Otherwise I fail to see how so.

(in theory; in practise, it's Germany vs Britain, quite possibly for WW2)

I agree.

To the Ottomans, I guess?

Yup, along with Egypt, Sudan and Arabia from the British, which creates a remarkably strong Ottomans again.

Egypt, Sudan, Arabia, that's quite a lot to give to an Empire that was getting its ass kicked hard, if I may put it so bluntly.
Note also that Egypt and the British areas of Arabia are Sovereign States, some of which were under British Protection. Oh, and one that was actually allied with the Ottomans and then got nommed in the aftermath of the war.
Though if Egypt goes, then I suppose Sudan could go as well.

[Alleniana]

due to media faffing, produces the Woodrow collapse effect.

There's my issue. IMO a critical part of that collapse effect cannot, simply cannot, come into existence without the offer being, well, Wilsonian.

Something something media, mmkay? I haven't quite figured it out yet. It may be that it played a smaller role, and some other factor (say, Italy joining the centrals somehow or some other battle going awry) also playing a role in the victory.

What happened was basically Japan realising that victory didn't have too much point to it any more, so Germany agreed to hand over some of the Kurils to Japan in Brest-Litovsk, and that was that. So, basically, both sides just shrugged and went on their way.

Kurils? Just that?
Japan cannot be beaten by Germany. Not by this point in time, and definitely not as long as Albion is still in the war. Also, define victory not having too much point anymore? They'd still be as likely to get what they always could have gotten: German territory in the east, only that now allied Lands could be up for auction as well.
Look, I'm all for an OP German Empire and all that belongs to that, but in WW1, assuming no pre-WW1 PoD, Japan wins. No other way for it to happen. And possibly more important, it knows that it can win.
Mind you, them taking all allied and Central colonies in the east would be madness, but I do see gaining them at least some of from both or one of them.

Yes, which is why Germany hasn't signed a treaty of victory with it; they've agreed on a de jure white peace, but have come to the pragmatic solution that Japan loses no land but gains half the Kurils. Neither side wants to fight any more, but neither side wants to lose either. So Germany gives something that isn't its to give, and Japan gets something for free. Japan at this time, after all, was hardly as militant or hardline as it became in the leadup to WW2 and the interwar period (not a small amount because of their treatment by the Allies). Though, thinking about it, I might work the Chinese treaty ports into this.

Because they won the war

Britain is an island, and the colonies are over-seas. As long as the Navy hasn't been beaten, or something close enough to that, Germany having "won" won't matter in the negotiations as by that time Britain de-facto controlled the German colonies (except for parts of East-Africa and of Kaiser-Wilhelmsland).

If the war dragged on indefinitely, Germany would only consolidate its hold on Europe and keep it from Allied influence (and thus increases its capabilities, including navally), which is worth far more than any colonies could really ever be. Wars in Europe have always decided the fates of the colonies.

Yup, along with Egypt, Sudan and Arabia from the British, which creates a remarkably strong Ottomans again.

Egypt, Sudan, Arabia, that's quite a lot to give to an Empire that was getting its ass kicked hard, if I may put it so bluntly.
Note also that Egypt and the British areas of Arabia are Sovereign States, some of which were under British Protection. Oh, and one that was actually allied with the Ottomans and then got nommed in the aftermath of the war.
Though if Egypt goes, then I suppose Sudan could go as well.

I was thinking Libya wouldn't be a tall order to return, considering how recently it was taken, but Egypt would sort of be like the Khedivate again, and the Trucial States would be probably the most important gain. It does give the ailing Ottomans huge administrative tasks, though, so I think I may reduce things, or even assign Libya to the Khedivate.

[The Jonathanian States]

There's my issue. IMO a critical part of that collapse effect cannot, simply cannot, come into existence without the offer being, well, Wilsonian.

Something something media, mmkay? I haven't quite figured it out yet. It may be that it played a smaller role, and some other factor (say, Italy joining the centrals somehow or some other battle going awry) also playing a role in the victory.

I'll close an eye or two if tJS can into Germany plox.

Kurils? Just that?
Japan cannot be beaten by Germany. Not by this point in time, and definitely not as long as Albion is still in the war. Also, define victory not having too much point anymore? They'd still be as likely to get what they always could have gotten: German territory in the east, only that now allied Lands could be up for auction as well.
Look, I'm all for an OP German Empire and all that belongs to that, but in WW1, assuming no pre-WW1 PoD, Japan wins. No other way for it to happen. And possibly more important, it knows that it can win.
Mind you, them taking all allied and Central colonies in the east would be madness, but I do see gaining them at least some of from both or one of them.

Yes, which is why Germany hasn't signed a treaty of victory with it;

Because it can't.

they've agreed on a de jure white peace,

Fair enough.

but have come to the pragmatic solution that Japan loses no land but gains half the Kurils.

Again, here's my issue. White peace, no victor? Sure. But not for only those tiny Islands. At least give them the bloody northern half of Sakhalin.

Neither side wants to fight any more,

Applies for Germany, but does it for Japan? Japan took Qingdao, possibly had a campaign on some of the Pacific possession but nothing even close to the devastation of public morale in Germany.
So Japan obviously doesn't want to fight, because it'd rather have gains now. But it is far more willing to fight than Germany.

but neither side wants to lose either.

And one of them can't, basically.

So Germany gives something that isn't its to give,

I agree.

and Japan gets something for free.

Indeed.

Japan at this time, after all, was hardly as militant or hardline as it became in the leadup to WW2 and the interwar period (not a small amount because of their treatment by the Allies).

True.

Though, thinking about it, I might work the Chinese treaty ports into this.

Yes. Returning Port Arthur might be a thing.

Because they won the war

Britain is an island, and the colonies are over-seas. As long as the Navy hasn't been beaten, or something close enough to that, Germany having "won" won't matter in the negotiations as by that time Britain de-facto controlled the German colonies (except for parts of East-Africa and of Kaiser-Wilhelmsland).

If the war dragged on indefinitely,

Define war dragging on infinitely.... With Britain it would, France would just peace out on its own, sooner or later.

Germany would only consolidate its hold on Europe

Without a doubt.

and keep it from Allied influence

Yes.

(and thus increases its capabilities, including navally),

No. Assuming the war to go on, and the US to be guaranteeing British financial existence due to being in the war, German capabilities won't grow for quite some time. It'd take time until the east could properly organized, and in the west everything that could possibly become German already was occupied, more or less. Meanwhile the British would still blockade the Germans from gaining resources they need.

which is worth far more than any colonies could really ever be.

If that were correct, yes.

Wars in Europe have always decided the fates of the colonies.

True, in general. Only that if you control neither Britain nor any colonies, while aforementioned Britain controls both itself and all the colonies (including yours), you hardly demand anything from them.
Also, Colonial wars can be determined by the colonies if at home the Status Quo hasn't changed (significantly).

Egypt, Sudan, Arabia, that's quite a lot to give to an Empire that was getting its ass kicked hard, if I may put it so bluntly.
Note also that Egypt and the British areas of Arabia are Sovereign States, some of which were under British Protection. Oh, and one that was actually allied with the Ottomans and then got nommed in the aftermath of the war.
Though if Egypt goes, then I suppose Sudan could go as well.

I was thinking Libya wouldn't be a tall order to return,

No, because it comes from Italy. Though it would decisively crush any Italian ambitions and probably lead to Italy being Entente in the next war.

considering how recently it was taken,

That too.

but Egypt would sort of be like the Khedivate again,

May I tell that to the Sultan?

and the Trucial States would be probably the most important gain.

Probably.

It does give the ailing Ottomans huge administrative tasks,

Administrative tasks? No, my friend, those aren't their largest issue.

though, so I think I may reduce things, or even assign Libya to the Khedivate.

I don't know. Maybe make Libya an "independent" Kingdom.

[Of the Quendi]

I was thinking a localized area, probably Europe or North America, as that is what most of us know. Great Lakes into Canada would be a goot alternate surviving area, and Europe could be fun to play. Most populated areas would become *Dead zones*, infested with eaters until nations could reclaim them.

We could also use any year after the book change for *The Change*, and build our nations from that point. So the main question is, where would we want to play?

An Emberverse RP? How exciting. I did one of those some years back that died quickly and since I have been wanting to do another.

[Altito Asmoro]

Hmm, reading the premise of Wolfenstein: The New Order make me want to make an RP about Nazi winning the WW2, but instead of going with science pathway, it goes with occultism pathway, with Thule Society as the main reason why Nazi could won the WW2. Sounds good?

[Aldelxane]

Hmm, reading the premise of Wolfenstein: The New Order make me want to make an RP about Nazi winning the WW2, but instead of going with science pathway, it goes with occultism pathway, with Thule Society as the main reason why Nazi could won the WW2. Sounds good?

ASB is not really my thing, tbh.

[Altito Asmoro]

Hmm, reading the premise of Wolfenstein: The New Order make me want to make an RP about Nazi winning the WW2, but instead of going with science pathway, it goes with occultism pathway, with Thule Society as the main reason why Nazi could won the WW2. Sounds good?

ASB is not really my thing, tbh.

It's not really my thing too. It's an idea only. A concept.

[Alleniana]

@Jon, I was going to reply about the germoneywwistronk scenario but I got sidetracked. Tomorrow, tomorrow.

[The Jonathanian States]

@Jon, I was going to reply about the germoneywwistronk scenario but I got sidetracked. Tomorrow, tomorrow.

A'ight.

Also, does my Kaiser Allen accept enlistment for that coming rp plox? If yes, I am Germoney

[Caltarania]

I was thinking a localized area, probably Europe or North America, as that is what most of us know. Great Lakes into Canada would be a goot alternate surviving area, and Europe could be fun to play. Most populated areas would become *Dead zones*, infested with eaters until nations could reclaim them.

We could also use any year after the book change for *The Change*, and build our nations from that point. So the main question is, where would we want to play?

I think we should do Eurasiafrica. We can say that the New World was just lost to the Northern Barbarians. In terms of contact, we could probably have something similar to the CK2 system, ei you can only communicate with peeps who are within a certain range of you or something -shrug-

[Of the Quendi]

I think we should do Eurasiafrica. We can say that the New World was just lost to the Northern Barbarians. In terms of contact, we could probably have something similar to the CK2 system, ei you can only communicate with peeps who are within a certain range of you or something -shrug-

Unless the RP would be set a long time after the change when strong states and empires have had time to form (and if it is isn't a lot of the appeal of the concept lost?) Afro-Eurasia is a far too large region for the different countries to be in contact with one another. If we do pick a region that large we might as well include the rest of the planet.

[Reatra]

(Image)

Important Links:Map

Year:1890
Genre:Alt-History
OP:Kisinger
Co-OPs:~none~
Target Audience:Alt-History Fans
Skill Level Required for Nations:
Great Powers:Proven Roleplayers who show themselves of great quality and or above the average roleplayer.
Secondary Powers:Your average roleplayer who has shown noteworthy skills in the past.
Minor Powers and below: None really, just is willing to roleplay or learning how to roleplay, proven to at least want to roleplay in a good manner.

1156~Occatinia Gains Independence from France
1456~Isabella I of Castile marries Alfonso V of Portugal, Uniting the two Realms
(Insert further detailed History)
1821~Napoleon is defeated at Sedan
1839~Belgium is restored to the Netherlands
1871~ The German Empire is formed.
1881~The Scramble for Africa Begins

I still have a lot of work to do but, I need your help to do it! Seeing as though RPs are one person's idea played by the greater rp Community why not make a roleplay with the Community's ideas(with guidance of said map)? So please do help!

Coming to you this Summerish with a vastly improved OP!

Oh and sorry Allen, I just put this here because my mind went blank, if you want me to take it down I will :3

P... P... Peru...

*inkagasms*

[Caltarania]

I think we should do Eurasiafrica. We can say that the New World was just lost to the Northern Barbarians. In terms of contact, we could probably have something similar to the CK2 system, ei you can only communicate with peeps who are within a certain range of you or something -shrug-

Unless the RP would be set a long time after the change when strong states and empires have had time to form (and if it is isn't a lot of the appeal of the concept lost?) Afro-Eurasia is a far too large region for the different countries to be in contact with one another. If we do pick a region that large we might as well include the rest of the planet.

I mean I did literally say that we'd have a rule about only being able to contact countries in a certain range of yours but w/e you can ignore the fact that I said that.

[The Jonathanian States]

(Image)

Important Links:Map

Year:1890
Genre:Alt-History
OP:Kisinger
Co-OPs:~none~
Target Audience:Alt-History Fans
Skill Level Required for Nations:
Great Powers:Proven Roleplayers who show themselves of great quality and or above the average roleplayer.
Secondary Powers:Your average roleplayer who has shown noteworthy skills in the past.
Minor Powers and below: None really, just is willing to roleplay or learning how to roleplay, proven to at least want to roleplay in a good manner.

1156~Occatinia Gains Independence from France
1456~Isabella I of Castile marries Alfonso V of Portugal, Uniting the two Realms
(Insert further detailed History)
1821~Napoleon is defeated at Sedan
1839~Belgium is restored to the Netherlands
1871~ The German Empire is formed.
1881~The Scramble for Africa Begins

I still have a lot of work to do but, I need your help to do it! Seeing as though RPs are one person's idea played by the greater rp Community why not make a roleplay with the Community's ideas(with guidance of said map)? So please do help!

Coming to you this Summerish with a vastly improved OP!

Oh and sorry Allen, I just put this here because my mind went blank, if you want me to take it down I will :3

P... P... Peru...

*inkagasms*

Probably just a greater PBC

[Reatra]

P... P... Peru...

*inkagasms*

Probably just a greater PBC

*stares*

*continues inkagasm*

[Of the Quendi]

I mean I did literally say that we'd have a rule about only being able to contact countries in a certain range of yours but w/e you can ignore the fact that I said that.

Well if we are going to implement a range that makes sense for small fledgling state entities of an early post-Change world then statistically if we go with the whole of Afro-Eurasia as a region then most people will not be able to contact many, if any, other players unless a very large amount join. If we say ten people join and is randomly spread across Afro-Eurasia then statistically there is little chance that any one country would be even aware of the existence of more then maybe one or two other ones, let alone be in a position to be in regular contact with them, or waging war against them. If we pick a very large region chances are that the RP would become more of a world building exercise where everyone runs their own isolated kingdom then an interactive RP.

[The Industrial States of Columbia]

Unless the RP would be set a long time after the change when strong states and empires have had time to form (and if it is isn't a lot of the appeal of the concept lost?) Afro-Eurasia is a far too large region for the different countries to be in contact with one another. If we do pick a region that large we might as well include the rest of the planet.

I mean I did literally say that we'd have a rule about only being able to contact countries in a certain range of yours but w/e you can ignore the fact that I said that.

In the books most of the story (early in the change years) Takes place in Washington-Oregon, not straying too far from that. It all depends on how far after the change this would be set. 10 years is pretty much the West American coast (Area reference) with some isolated cases of greater contact, where as ten years ye start exploring more of your own continent and have some idea of what lies elsewhere in the world.

[Of the Quendi]

In the books most of the story (early in the change years) Takes place in Washington-Oregon, not straying too far from that. It all depends on how far after the change this would be set. 10 years is pretty much the West American coast (Area reference) with some isolated cases of greater contact, where as ten years ye start exploring more of your own continent and have some idea of what lies elsewhere in the world.

I think the RP should be set relatively few years after the Change (10 for example) when countries are still relatively small fledging entities lead by people who experienced the Change and remember the world before. Making it much later would in my opinion deprive an Emberverse RP of much of its appeal. Region wise I am open minded but the simplest solution would seem to be to go with the western half of the US. If the RP attracts a lot of attention the region can always be expanded.

[Reatra]

I mean I did literally say that we'd have a rule about only being able to contact countries in a certain range of yours but w/e you can ignore the fact that I said that.

Well if we are going to implement a range that makes sense for small fledgling state entities of an early post-Change world then statistically if we go with the whole of Afro-Eurasia as a region then most people will not be able to contact many, if any, other players unless a very large amount join. If we say ten people join and is randomly spread across Afro-Eurasia then statistically there is little chance that any one country would be even aware of the existence of more then maybe one or two other ones, let alone be in a position to be in regular contact with them, or waging war against them. If we pick a very large region chances are that the RP would become more of a world building exercise where everyone runs their own isolated kingdom then an interactive RP.

wat ist dis

[Of the Quendi]

wat ist dis

A discussion about the limitation of pre-modern modes of communication.

Or if you meant more generally what we are talking about and RP based on the S. M. Stirling book series Emberverse which depicts the collapse of modern civilization due to modern technology mysterious stopping to work, prompting the rise of a new dark age of survivalist groups, later fledgling countries struggling to establish themselves using pre-modern technology. Lots of fun in other words.