Forge of Empires - AH RP [OOC/Open]

[Bujahla]

remove borscht
srsly though realistically french remains the world's lingua france b/c DK/burgundian empire

That is easily displaced by a combination of money, good relations, and a bit of elbow-grease. I highly doubt that Delhi, the Sokot, China, and Korea have any sort of special relationship with French.

Mainly elbow-grease.

railroad = stronk
stronk =
[RIP here lies money]

(;(;(;-;););)

Gotta wait on Reph to finish his post, but the French will have lots of influence in Sokot soon :3
And china and korea? they will eventually

[Delsola]

As I said, it's about staying power that's concerning, Hansa may come. Next, we may need to look at your Navy compared to population. From my limited understanding (Military History Degree - Stanford University) There's absolutely no way you could sustain that many ships at one time, based on population alone, much less monetarily.

Homeland Population: 541,000

Crew Compliments
2 First Rates (Crew Coompliment 850-1000 each)
5 Second Rates (Crew Compliment 750-850)
42 Other Ships-of-the-Line (200 [Sixth Rate estimate]-650 [Third Rates])
32 Sloops-of-War (230)
45 Brigs-of-War (200)

Lowest possible sailors to fully operate fleet: 38,610
First Rates: 1,700
Second Rates: 3,750
"Other Ships-of-the-Line": 16,800 (Taken at 400 average)
Sloops-of-War: 7,360
Brigs-of-War: 9,000

Percent of population to operate fleet: 7.1%

You have more sailors under arms than many have land forces and land forces are much easier to maintain. The price to maintain such a fleet in good condition, fully armed, and paid for would be astronomical. If only parts are being operated at once, many would be sitting in Harbor rotting or firing centuries old cannon.

To continue, you also have a land force of 10,000 (1.8% Population alone, an already troubling figure). Combine that with the sailors to operate the fleet and you have 9% population employed militarily. Your Army alone would start putting a drag on your economy but your Navy would cost your entire GDP.

Population of 541,000 half are female so likely ineligible for service, meaning 270,500 males total including babies and old men. Almost 20% of your men are under arms. Next to factor out youth and elderly (let's assume 70% are adult, healthy males) making only 189,350 eligible for service. At these numbers 1/4 of your adult male population is engaged in direct military service.

To forget all the calculations above, land based forces already comprise 1.8% of your population, where would the sailors necessary to man such a fleet come from?

Edit: Finally, look at your Navy comparatively. During the Napoleonic wars England had 113 ships of the line but the next closest navy had 45 (France & Spain each). Meaning your 49 ships of the line gives your tiny nation a Navy of equal strength to Napoleonic France and almost half as strong as England, the strongest navy in the war. http://www.napolun.com/mirror/napoleoni ... m/navy.htm

I posit it could be 100% incorrect on many of these aspects and many may have been explained, but if you insist on shoving this navy in my face, I would humbly like to hear some explanation for it. I'm not trying to be mean or argumentative but again, read the last sentence.


@Grim, no problem, academic education is infinitely better. Let's just hope they won't come home with any crazy ideas about rights or freedom.

Assuming the 113 GBR and 45 SPA/FRA is true, I thank you for this information.

Does 30 Aragonese ships-of-the-line sound reasonable in the Mediterranean theatre?

Also I think things like merchant marines and transport ships complicate peoples' naval figures. Just numbering capital ships may be a better figure (like remember Venice said 3,000 or something)

[Christstan]

As I said, it's about staying power that's concerning, Hansa may come. Next, we may need to look at your Navy compared to population. From my limited understanding (Military History Degree - Stanford University) There's absolutely no way you could sustain that many ships at one time, based on population alone, much less monetarily.

Homeland Population: 541,000

Crew Compliments
2 First Rates (Crew Coompliment 850-1000 each)
5 Second Rates (Crew Compliment 750-850)
42 Other Ships-of-the-Line (200 [Sixth Rate estimate]-650 [Third Rates])
32 Sloops-of-War (230)
45 Brigs-of-War (200)

Lowest possible sailors to fully operate fleet: 38,610
First Rates: 1,700
Second Rates: 3,750
"Other Ships-of-the-Line": 16,800 (Taken at 400 average)
Sloops-of-War: 7,360
Brigs-of-War: 9,000

Percent of population to operate fleet: 7.1%

You have more sailors under arms than many have land forces and land forces are much easier to maintain. The price to maintain such a fleet in good condition, fully armed, and paid for would be astronomical. If only parts are being operated at once, many would be sitting in Harbor rotting or firing centuries old cannon.

To continue, you also have a land force of 10,000 (1.8% Population alone, an already troubling figure). Combine that with the sailors to operate the fleet and you have 9% population employed militarily. Your Army alone would start putting a drag on your economy but your Navy would cost your entire GDP.

Population of 541,000 half are female so likely ineligible for service, meaning 270,500 males total including babies and old men. Almost 20% of your men are under arms. Next to factor out youth and elderly (let's assume 70% are adult, healthy males) making only 189,350 eligible for service. At these numbers 1/4 of your adult male population is engaged in direct military service.

To forget all the calculations above, land based forces already comprise 1.8% of your population, where would the sailors necessary to man such a fleet come from?

Edit: Finally, look at your Navy comparatively. During the Napoleonic wars England had 113 ships of the line but the next closest navy had 45 (France & Spain each). Meaning your 49 ships of the line gives your tiny nation a Navy of equal strength to Napoleonic France and almost half as strong as England, the strongest navy in the war. http://www.napolun.com/mirror/napoleoni ... m/navy.htm

I posit it could be 100% incorrect on many of these aspects and many may have been explained, but if you insist on shoving this navy in my face, I would humbly like to hear some explanation for it. I'm not trying to be mean or argumentative but again, read the last sentence.


@Grim, no problem, academic education is infinitely better. Let's just hope they won't come home with any crazy ideas about rights or freedom.

Assuming the 113 GBR and 45 SPA/FRA is true, I thank you for this information.

Does 30 Aragonese ships-of-the-line sound reasonable in the Mediterranean theatre?

Also I think things like merchant marines and transport ships complicate peoples' naval figures. Just numbering capital ships may be a better figure (like remember Venice said 3,000 or something)

You're very welcome. Denmark had around 20 if I remember correctly. True, numbering Capital ships might be more useful since those were the only ones considered strong enough to form up for Navy v Navy battles. Brigs and sloops were more for convoy duty, signal ships and whatnot.

However, the case with Hansa is that these are not said to be merchant ships but warships. His Ships of the line alone are excessive.

Edit: In other news, Paradox now has $50 more of my dollars weekend sale too stronk

[Lunas Legion]

Assuming the 113 GBR and 45 SPA/FRA is true, I thank you for this information.

Does 30 Aragonese ships-of-the-line sound reasonable in the Mediterranean theatre?

Also I think things like merchant marines and transport ships complicate peoples' naval figures. Just numbering capital ships may be a better figure (like remember Venice said 3,000 or something)

You're very welcome. Denmark had around 20 if I remember correctly. True, numbering Capital ships might be more useful since those were the only ones considered strong enough to form up for Navy v Navy battles. Brigs and sloops were more for convoy duty, signal ships and whatnot.

However, the case with Hansa is that these are not said to be merchant ships but warships. His Ships of the line alone are excessive.

Edit: In other news, Paradox now has $50 more of my dollars weekend sale too stronk

By other 'ships of the line' I mean 5th/6th rates (effectively frigates) rather than 3rd rates or 4th rates; so the crew numbers would be a lot less, considering the drastic difference in size. The standing army is also meant to act as a fire service, customs officials, riot squad and police rolled into one, so they have a civilian role as well.

[Liecthenbourg]

That is easily displaced by a combination of money, good relations, and a bit of elbow-grease. I highly doubt that Delhi, the Sokot, China, and Korea have any sort of special relationship with French.

Mainly elbow-grease.

railroad = stronk
stronk =
[RIP here lies money]

(;(;(;-;););)

Gotta wait on Reph to finish his post, but the French will have lots of influence in Sokot soon :3
And china and korea? they will eventually

#LatinLinguaFranca.
#EuropeislikemuchCatholic.

[Bujahla]

Gotta wait on Reph to finish his post, but the French will have lots of influence in Sokot soon :3
And china and korea? they will eventually

#LatinLinguaFranca.
#EuropeislikemuchCatholic.

Gonna say French is probs the Lingua Franca because of the influence of DK+Burgundy. Though within the Med Sea it may as well be Latin.

[The Grim Reaper]

#LatinLinguaFranca.
#EuropeislikemuchCatholic.

Gonna say French is probs the Lingua Franca because of the influence of DK+Burgundy. Though within the Med Sea it may as well be Latin.

...that defeats the entire purpose of a lingua Franca

[Liecthenbourg]

#LatinLinguaFranca.
#EuropeislikemuchCatholic.

Gonna say French is probs the Lingua Franca because of the influence of DK+Burgundy. Though within the Med Sea it may as well be Latin.

I can assure you, the Bavarians would much prefer to speak Latin than your silly Dual Kingdom languages.

Scots Gaelic should be lingua franca!

[The Grim Reaper]

Gonna say French is probs the Lingua Franca because of the influence of DK+Burgundy. Though within the Med Sea it may as well be Latin.

I can assure you, the Bavarians would much prefer to speak Latin than your silly Dual Kingdom languages.

Scots Gaelic should be lingua franca!

Bavaria want Russian? <3

Failing that, we could all compromise with Arabic?

[The New Lowlands]

Gotta wait on Reph to finish his post, but the French will have lots of influence in Sokot soon :3
And china and korea? they will eventually

#LatinLinguaFranca.
#EuropeislikemuchCatholic.

>catholic europe used french as a lingua franca
>implying implications

[Bujahla]

Gonna say French is probs the Lingua Franca because of the influence of DK+Burgundy. Though within the Med Sea it may as well be Latin.

...that defeats the entire purpose of a lingua Franca

A lingua Franca doesn't mean its absolutely global. I'd imagine french to be the political lingua franca, but within the med sea they'd used Latin for trade.

[Liecthenbourg]

#LatinLinguaFranca.
#EuropeislikemuchCatholic.

>catholic europe used french as a lingua franca
>implying implications

>mostofeuropeusedfrenchaslinguafranca.
>papalstateshasswegcouldenforcelatin.
>latinmaynothavedied.
>doweevenhavefrench,orisitanglois?

I can assure you, the Bavarians would much prefer to speak Latin than your silly Dual Kingdom languages.

Scots Gaelic should be lingua franca!

Bavaria want Russian? <3

Failing that, we could all compromise with Arabic?

As a secondary language? That'd be cool.

[The Grim Reaper]

As a secondary language? That'd be cool.

o/

Germany can into glorious trade partnership with Russia as result.

Unless you meant about the Arabic, in which case ;-;

[The New Lowlands]

russian 0/10 worst lingo franco
cyrillic = poopy alphabet which nobody can be bothered to learn

[Bujahla]

russian 0/10 worst lingo franco
cyrillic = poopy alphabet which nobody can be bothered to learn

agreeeed

[Liecthenbourg]

As a secondary language? That'd be cool.

o/

Germany can into glorious trade partnership with Russia as result.

Unless you meant about the Arabic, in which case ;-;

I meant Russian.
Arabic wouldn't help the Germans much.

Would ye like German, is good switch.
We have words like the ones in this video!

[Lunas Legion]

I'm going to have to drop the Hansa for now; a bunch of RL stuff just reappeared and I need to deal with that before NS.

[Bujahla]

I'm going to have to drop the Hansa for now; a bunch of RL stuff just reappeared and I need to deal with that before NS.

Kk. Best of luck with real life stuff. I'll keep it for you, since no body really cares to have a bunch of cities anyhow, lol.

[Lunas Legion]

I'm going to have to drop the Hansa for now; a bunch of RL stuff just reappeared and I need to deal with that before NS.

Kk. Best of luck with real life stuff. I'll keep it for you, since no body really cares to have a bunch of cities anyhow, lol.

The only reason I picked them was because I like the Hansa in EUIV/EUIII.

[Christstan]

I'm going to have to drop the Hansa for now; a bunch of RL stuff just reappeared and I need to deal with that before NS.

That's unfortunate but alas RL always takes precedence.

[The imperial canadian dutchy]

After the war in Persia and the war of German unification is completed (whichever comes later), Russia will be aiming to start up a second round of diplomatic favors for the targets of its 'casus belli' declaration. This one will be tiered - one tier for most applicants, and a higher one for those who agree to promote Russian as their government's preferred second language.

It is likely it will be a very aggressive trade agreement.

remove borscht
srsly though realistically french remains the world's lingua france b/c DK/burgundian empire

Naples is of stronk Roman, Fuk u Anglois pigdog, we of into Latin as liga franca huehuehuehue Remove Baguette

[Tyben]

remove borscht
srsly though realistically french remains the world's lingua france b/c DK/burgundian empire

Naples is of stronk Roman, Fuk u Anglois pigdog, we of into Latin as liga franca huehuehuehue Remove Baguette

Naples=/=Roman, you don't have Rome.

[Bujahla]

remove borscht
srsly though realistically french remains the world's lingua france b/c DK/burgundian empire

Naples is of stronk Roman, Fuk u Anglois pigdog, we of into Latin as liga franca huehuehuehue Remove Baguette

*marches army on Naples*

[The imperial canadian dutchy]

Naples is of stronk Roman, Fuk u Anglois pigdog, we of into Latin as liga franca huehuehuehue Remove Baguette

*marches army on Naples*

Coem at me brosef I will raep u holmes Fuk u

[The imperial canadian dutchy]

Naples is of stronk Roman, Fuk u Anglois pigdog, we of into Latin as liga franca huehuehuehue Remove Baguette

Naples=/=Roman, you don't have Rome.

....
Roman as in Latin, and was once Majourity Latin,rather than French (Anglois Pigdogs)