Europa Universalis: Our World (Alternate Earth: OOC/Open)

[Jamzmania]

They don't call themselves Corsica IC, but I looked at their app and that's where they are. Some kind of corrupt Roman Republic-style nation.

Page 5, three posts from the top. Called Ajacius.

I don't remember Ajacius ever being accepted. At least, Gar never did, and he was the sole OP back then.

Meh, I don't know.

[Ublia]

Hey Venice did you begin the attack on Croatia without me?

Yeah, I explained it in the IC. I'm starting off taking the my chunk (Croatian Slovenia and Dalmatia), and awaiting whenever you join. I'll probably help you out with your chunk if I finish taking before you.

Very well I'm busy invading Bohemia. So leave some of that Croatian cake for me okay.

[Jamzmania]

But really, I don't want tone stuck in a situation where we are in an assumed stalemate because he ain't here.

[Euronion]

Okay, that fabricated message is not possible. You wouldn't be able to fabricate my seal because you wouldn't know what my seal looks like. Only the King had access to the Royal Seal. Saying you can fabricate it is simply incorrect. I'm sorry I have to do this but I call foul.

[Jamzmania]

Okay, that fabricated message is not possible. You wouldn't be able to fabricate my seal because you wouldn't know what my seal looks like. Only the King had access to the Royal Seal. Saying you can fabricate it is simply incorrect. I'm sorry I have to do this but I call foul.

Just let it roll, for the point of good roleplay?

[Great Nepal]

Okay, that fabricated message is not possible. You wouldn't be able to fabricate my seal because you wouldn't know what my seal looks like. Only the King had access to the Royal Seal. Saying you can fabricate it is simply incorrect. I'm sorry I have to do this but I call foul.

Yes, you are trying to say there has never been any diplomatic interaction between Portugal and Britain in history? Because if there has been, template with seal will be given to the men and they fabricate the signature.
If he examines it very closely, they will notice fabrication but on first sight it looks like good copy.

[Euronion]

Okay, that fabricated message is not possible. You wouldn't be able to fabricate my seal because you wouldn't know what my seal looks like. Only the King had access to the Royal Seal. Saying you can fabricate it is simply incorrect. I'm sorry I have to do this but I call foul.

Yes, you are trying to say there has never been any diplomatic interaction between Portugal and Britain in history? Because if there has been, template with seal will be given to the men and they fabricate the signature.
If he examines it very closely, they will notice fabrication but on first sight it looks like good copy.

Well actually, besides the Declaration of war, no. My King is 18 now, when the RP began he was 16, he had just assumed the throne, after a son takes up his father's thrown, the official diplomatic seal changes. Even if I did send you a communique, your ships haven't docked in an English Port for a very long time. They would have no way of getting new orders, their orders were to pose as Knights of God and head towards the Strait of Tangiers.

[Great Nepal]

Yes, you are trying to say there has never been any diplomatic interaction between Portugal and Britain in history? Because if there has been, template with seal will be given to the men and they fabricate the signature.
If he examines it very closely, they will notice fabrication but on first sight it looks like good copy.

Well actually, besides the Declaration of war, no. My King is 18 now, when the RP began he was 16, he had just assumed the throne, after a son takes up his father's thrown, the official diplomatic seal changes. Even if I did send you a communique, your ships haven't docked in an English Port for a very long time. They would have no way of getting new orders, their orders were to pose as Knights of God and head towards the Strait of Tangiers.

Okay, I assumed diplomatic seal of nation would remain the same regardless of who was in throne. I will just send verbal message.

[Savski Venac]

Im terribly sorry that I couldn't respond to the RP I was very busy lately.I will post everything tommorow.

[Euronion]

Well actually, besides the Declaration of war, no. My King is 18 now, when the RP began he was 16, he had just assumed the throne, after a son takes up his father's thrown, the official diplomatic seal changes. Even if I did send you a communique, your ships haven't docked in an English Port for a very long time. They would have no way of getting new orders, their orders were to pose as Knights of God and head towards the Strait of Tangiers.

Okay, I assumed diplomatic seal of nation would remain the same regardless of who was in throne. I will just send verbal message.

Very Well, but a verbal message has no authority and would not be acknowledged by the Caliphate as legitimate. Especially since I just sent him a communique explaining that you are trying to frame me around the world and are responsible for the Knights of God. This is also the action of one ship staging as a Portuguese Naval Vessel, this makes no sense. You can go ahead with it but the Caliphate should be extremely skeptical. You cannot attack a ship before officially declaring war. It was the rules of War in the day and even today, you do not attack before telling your enemy you two are at war. You can attack an hour later, but you must declare war first.

[Great Nepal]

Okay, I assumed diplomatic seal of nation would remain the same regardless of who was in throne. I will just send verbal message.

Very Well, but a verbal message has no authority and would not be acknowledged by the Caliphate as legitimate. Especially since I just sent him a communique explaining that you are trying to frame me around the world and are responsible for the Knights of God. This is also the action of one ship staging as a Portuguese Naval Vessel, this makes no sense. You can go ahead with it but the Caliphate should be extremely skeptical. You cannot attack a ship before officially declaring war. It was the rules of War in the day and even today, you do not attack before telling your enemy you two are at war. You can attack an hour later, but you must declare war first.

Yes, this most likely wont be enough for war just enough to plant seeds of distrust. Next post will be the one for war (ships attack tiny coastal village, leave message demanding them to convert and there is letter from a country which says you purposed alliance against Caliphate.)

[Euronion]

Very Well, but a verbal message has no authority and would not be acknowledged by the Caliphate as legitimate. Especially since I just sent him a communique explaining that you are trying to frame me around the world and are responsible for the Knights of God. This is also the action of one ship staging as a Portuguese Naval Vessel, this makes no sense. You can go ahead with it but the Caliphate should be extremely skeptical. You cannot attack a ship before officially declaring war. It was the rules of War in the day and even today, you do not attack before telling your enemy you two are at war. You can attack an hour later, but you must declare war first.

Yes, this most likely wont be enough for war just enough to plant seeds of distrust. Next post will be the one for war (ships attack tiny coastal village, leave message demanding them to convert and there is letter from a country which says you purposed alliance against Caliphate.)

Again, it is not justifiable. Why would I send an official message promising a non-agression pact and then turn on them when I want a 10 year non-agression pact and attack them? it doesn't stand to reason. Again you are one ship that raids a few villages of the Caliphate claiming to be Portuguese claiming that the Portuguese are trying to force an alliance against them. Why would the Caliphate believe a band of pirates and terrorists over an official government?

[Euronion]

Okay, that fabricated message is not possible. You wouldn't be able to fabricate my seal because you wouldn't know what my seal looks like. Only the King had access to the Royal Seal. Saying you can fabricate it is simply incorrect. I'm sorry I have to do this but I call foul.

Just let it roll, for the point of good roleplay?

I let the getting through my port at night when my Navy is on patrol prepared for war and when over 10,000 troops are stationed in Lisbon for the point of good roleplay, but this goes too far in my opinion.

[Great Nepal]

Yes, this most likely wont be enough for war just enough to plant seeds of distrust. Next post will be the one for war (ships attack tiny coastal village, leave message demanding them to convert and there is letter from a country which says you purposed alliance against Caliphate.)

Again, it is not justifiable. Why would I send an official message promising a non-agression pact and then turn on them when I want a 10 year non-agression pact and attack them? it doesn't stand to reason. Again you are one ship that raids a few villages of the Caliphate claiming to be Portuguese claiming that the Portuguese are trying to force an alliance against them. Why would the Caliphate believe a band of pirates and terrorists over an official government?

1. That is his choice dont you think?
2. Because Portugal and Caliphate had tensions and sudden non-aggression pact would be just that sudden. According to interpretation of Caliphate King (decision of player), it can either be seen as someone framing them or Portugal backstabbing. Ball in his court, not your nor mine.

[Euronion]

Again, it is not justifiable. Why would I send an official message promising a non-agression pact and then turn on them when I want a 10 year non-agression pact and attack them? it doesn't stand to reason. Again you are one ship that raids a few villages of the Caliphate claiming to be Portuguese claiming that the Portuguese are trying to force an alliance against them. Why would the Caliphate believe a band of pirates and terrorists over an official government?

1. That is his choice dont you think?
2. Because Portugal and Caliphate had tensions and sudden non-aggression pact would be just that sudden. According to interpretation of Caliphate King (decision of player), it can either be seen as someone framing them or Portugal backstabbing. Ball in his court, not your nor mine.

Well it depends, it is the ball in his court, though it would be like if you RPed as a gay man in my court and then my King, upon finding out he was gay, legalized gay marriage throughout the Kingdom. It wouldn't make sense. So yes, technically he could do that, but it is not historically accurate, it is not proper etiquette on either Portugal's or the Caliphate's part. I cannot attack him unless there is an officialy Declaration of war, this would not happen and therefore would make no sense.

[Great Nepal]

1. That is his choice dont you think?
2. Because Portugal and Caliphate had tensions and sudden non-aggression pact would be just that sudden. According to interpretation of Caliphate King (decision of player), it can either be seen as someone framing them or Portugal backstabbing. Ball in his court, not your nor mine.

Well it depends, it is the ball in his court, though it would be like if you RPed as a gay man in my court and then my King, upon finding out he was gay, legalized gay marriage throughout the Kingdom. It wouldn't make sense. So yes, technically he could do that, but it is not historically accurate, it is not proper etiquette on either Portugal's or the Caliphate's part. I cannot attack him unless there is an officialy Declaration of war, this would not happen and therefore would make no sense.

Etiquette is just that, convention and not one that is always followed. It depends on how much Caliphate King trusts/ distrusts Portugal. If king absolutely trusts Portugal, then perfectly forced letter can be disregarded while if King absolutely distrusts Portugal, then plank saying it was Portugal on robbed village will do the job.

[Mondrova]

Nonetheless, it was possible for him to do it. The technology was within reach, but we still don't know whether or not St Brendan actually did it.

Sure, it's possible. But there is no evidence that anyone save the Vikings made a trans-atlantic crossing before Columbus. After all, possible does not mean probable.

Actually there is pretty decent evidence to support Zheng He's having possibly made it. I mean, I would say it's still unclear, as most do, but not impossible.

[The Cookish States]

I don't remember Ajacius ever being accepted. At least, Gar never did, and he was the sole OP back then.

Meh, I don't know.

If he's made IC posts, I'll go from that point. Otherwise I'd start from its historic standing at that point in time.

Anyways, if I need to go more in depth I can do that, or I could jump right into the fray after it's accepted. I'm unsure of what to do.

[Euronion]

Well it depends, it is the ball in his court, though it would be like if you RPed as a gay man in my court and then my King, upon finding out he was gay, legalized gay marriage throughout the Kingdom. It wouldn't make sense. So yes, technically he could do that, but it is not historically accurate, it is not proper etiquette on either Portugal's or the Caliphate's part. I cannot attack him unless there is an officialy Declaration of war, this would not happen and therefore would make no sense.

Etiquette is just that, convention and not one that is always followed. It depends on how much Caliphate King trusts/ distrusts Portugal. If king absolutely trusts Portugal, then perfectly forced letter can be disregarded while if King absolutely distrusts Portugal, then plank saying it was Portugal on robbed village will do the job.

I'm not sure how to explain the rules of war. It doesn't happen, you do not attack your enemy without issuing a Declaration of War, you don't attack your enemy before a Declaration of War. It would be like the US President sending in Navy Seals to kill the Chinese Premier, it doesn't happen especially back then. You do not attack your enemy without a Declaration of War, it just doesn't happen, it's the rule of war. Even Hitler issued Declarations of War before attacking, he didn't just invade on the whim. You do not do that, I'm not sure how else to explain it.

[Mondrova]

Etiquette is just that, convention and not one that is always followed. It depends on how much Caliphate King trusts/ distrusts Portugal. If king absolutely trusts Portugal, then perfectly forced letter can be disregarded while if King absolutely distrusts Portugal, then plank saying it was Portugal on robbed village will do the job.

I'm not sure how to explain the rules of war. It doesn't happen, you do not attack your enemy without issuing a Declaration of War, you don't attack your enemy before a Declaration of War. It would be like the US President sending in Navy Seals to kill the Chinese Premier, it doesn't happen especially back then. You do not attack your enemy without a Declaration of War, it just doesn't happen, it's the rule of war. Even Hitler issued Declarations of War before attacking, he didn't just invade on the whim. You do not do that, I'm not sure how else to explain it.

It actually isn't necessary. It happened quite a few times in history, however, it was the norm by in large I believe. I would say that it would be quite odd indeed though so there would certainly be the question of legitimacy.

[Jamzmania]

Etiquette is just that, convention and not one that is always followed. It depends on how much Caliphate King trusts/ distrusts Portugal. If king absolutely trusts Portugal, then perfectly forced letter can be disregarded while if King absolutely distrusts Portugal, then plank saying it was Portugal on robbed village will do the job.

I'm not sure how to explain the rules of war. It doesn't happen, you do not attack your enemy without issuing a Declaration of War, you don't attack your enemy before a Declaration of War. It would be like the US President sending in Navy Seals to kill the Chinese Premier, it doesn't happen especially back then. You do not attack your enemy without a Declaration of War, it just doesn't happen, it's the rule of war. Even Hitler issued Declarations of War before attacking, he didn't just invade on the whim. You do not do that, I'm not sure how else to explain it.

Just because it's not "right" for you to attack them without a declaration of war doesn't mean you can't do it. And attack is an attack, and while it may not be considered an "official" declaration of war, it is still an act of war, and so the Caliphate will most likely, in the situation he does believe it was at the ands of Portugal, treat it as a declaration of war. And not too sure about Hitler doing it. I think he at least invaded Poland without giving them a heads up.

[Mondrova]

I'm not sure how to explain the rules of war. It doesn't happen, you do not attack your enemy without issuing a Declaration of War, you don't attack your enemy before a Declaration of War. It would be like the US President sending in Navy Seals to kill the Chinese Premier, it doesn't happen especially back then. You do not attack your enemy without a Declaration of War, it just doesn't happen, it's the rule of war. Even Hitler issued Declarations of War before attacking, he didn't just invade on the whim. You do not do that, I'm not sure how else to explain it.

Just because it's not "right" for you to attack them without a declaration of war doesn't mean you can't do it. And attack is an attack, and while it may not be considered an "official" declaration of war, it is still an act of war, and so the Caliphate will most likely, in the situation he does believe it was at the ands of Portugal, treat it as a declaration of war. And not too sure about Hitler doing it. I think he at least invaded Poland without giving them a heads up.

I don't know what I will do yet, I'm thinking.

Anyway, from what I see, Germany didn't give any formal declarations of war during WW2 aside from the U.S. with Italy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaratio ... rld_War_II

[Euronion]

Just because it's not "right" for you to attack them without a declaration of war doesn't mean you can't do it. And attack is an attack, and while it may not be considered an "official" declaration of war, it is still an act of war, and so the Caliphate will most likely, in the situation he does believe it was at the ands of Portugal, treat it as a declaration of war. And not too sure about Hitler doing it. I think he at least invaded Poland without giving them a heads up.

I don't know what I will do yet, I'm thinking.

Anyway, from what I see, Germany didn't give any formal declarations of war during WW2 aside from the U.S. with Italy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaratio ... rld_War_II

Well there was the whole "Danzing or War" event that caused the Allied nations to guarantee the independence of Poland, so when Poland refused to give Danzing up, they attacked. It wasn't like Hitler got up one day and said "I'm going to invade Poland today".

[Jamzmania]

I don't know what I will do yet, I'm thinking.

Anyway, from what I see, Germany didn't give any formal declarations of war during WW2 aside from the U.S. with Italy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaratio ... rld_War_II

Well there was the whole "Danzing or War" event that caused the Allied nations to guarantee the independence of Poland, so when Poland refused to give Danzing up, they attacked. It wasn't like Hitler got up one day and said "I'm going to invade Poland today".

Still doesn't matter. An attack is an attack.

[Mondrova]

I don't know what I will do yet, I'm thinking.

Anyway, from what I see, Germany didn't give any formal declarations of war during WW2 aside from the U.S. with Italy. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaratio ... rld_War_II

Well there was the whole "Danzing or War" event that caused the Allied nations to guarantee the independence of Poland, so when Poland refused to give Danzing up, they attacked. It wasn't like Hitler got up one day and said "I'm going to invade Poland today".

Which is irrelevant.

Also, Hitler wasn't the most rational guy, I imagine he did many things rather whimsically.