[DRAFT] Condemn The Communist Bloc

[Mlakhavia]

The almighty nation page. Only the elders can access such an important digital webpage

she actually is not part of tcb, i know because i have all member nations in tcb memorized 100%. you may be reading it wrong

see. even tcb's fm says i'm not in tcb. i am actually a proud member of the federation of conservative nations

[Toonela]

Well, this thread sure is something.

Opposed for reasons stated elsewhere by others before, so obviously not interested in helping drafting. I suggest the author and co. simply drop the topic.

[The Kingdom of the Three Isles]

The almighty nation page. Only the elders can access such an important digital webpage

she actually is not part of tcb, i know because i have all member nations in tcb memorized 100%. you may be reading it wrong

The ancient webpage, it has lied to me!

she actually is not part of tcb, i know because i have all member nations in tcb memorized 100%. you may be reading it wrong

see. even tcb's fm says i'm not in tcb. i am actually a proud member of the federation of conservative nations

[Civia Welephilostopia]

This thread now is who do you agree with?
Institue Class Warfarepeople or Repeal Liberate Nai Europe people.

[Sedgistan]

As for TCB's official position on the Holodomor, or really any hotly-debated political topic without one obvious answer? We don't have one. Individual government members' political beliefs don't necessarily align with everyone else's individual beliefs, and we don't force people to follow one specific viewpoint. The nature of being a pan-leftist region means that we all may disagree on some things, and we simply accept that rather than trying to establish an ever-shifting system of specifically accepted political views. The only rules are against rightwing ideology and bigotry.

This kind of weak "we don't take responsibility for the views our members espouse" policy wouldn't be tolerated elsewhere, and shouldn't be for your region either. It sounds like your region has got itself in the position where it'll ban someone for daring to suggest a tax cut, but will happily tolerate genocide deniers that accuse those that accept the Holodomor as reality of spreading Nazi propaganda. Flip Holodomor for Holocaust, communism for fascism, Soviet Union for Nazi Germany etc. in your post, and it reads just like the shameful apologism of Genua and its ilk.

You've even got the "I haven't researched the Holocaust Holodomor, so I don't know everything about it, but I've read these links and these knowledgeable people say it wasn't deliberate and the numbers weren't so high" act down to a T.

Sounds Condemnable to me, though blacklisting of the region might be a better option.

[Republic Of Ludwigsburg]

As for TCB's official position on the Holodomor, or really any hotly-debated political topic without one obvious answer? We don't have one. Individual government members' political beliefs don't necessarily align with everyone else's individual beliefs, and we don't force people to follow one specific viewpoint. The nature of being a pan-leftist region means that we all may disagree on some things, and we simply accept that rather than trying to establish an ever-shifting system of specifically accepted political views. The only rules are against rightwing ideology and bigotry.

This kind of weak "we don't take responsibility for the views our members espouse" policy wouldn't be tolerated elsewhere, and shouldn't be for your region either. It sounds like your region has got itself in the position where it'll ban someone for daring to suggest a tax cut, but will happily tolerate genocide deniers that accuse those that accept the Holodomor as reality of spreading Nazi propaganda. Flip Holodomor for Holocaust, communism for fascism, Soviet Union for Nazi Germany etc. in your post, and it reads just like the shameful apologism of Genua and its ilk.

You've even got the "I haven't researched the Holocaust Holodomor, so I don't know everything about it, but I've read these links and these knowledgeable people say it wasn't deliberate and the numbers weren't so high" act down to a T.

Sounds Condemnable to me, though blacklisting of the region might be a better option.

The thing about the Holodomor, while I think it is a genocide, many people have good points on whether it was a famine or a genocide. The holocaust however, was started purposefully to kill off the Jewish, Romani, and Slavic populations and has documents saying such, revealed after the Nuremberg trial.

[Anne of Cleves in TNP]

Proposal page.

As my proposal to allow civilian-owned nuclear weapons failed, I decided to condemn TCB!

Northumbria, this is for your attempt.

The Security Council,

Noting that the region known as The Communist Bloc, which can be abbreviated as TCB, is infamous for it's welcoming stance on an extreme form of communism,

Despising the ill region's open gates towards an improvised version of communist ideology, which makes the region, but also others, look bad for nations all over the endless, expanding metaverse.

Angry over the region's well-known and horrible policy of putting human rights in the trash bin,

Shocked about the region's enforcement of leftism, where regional dictators strike down upon any rightism found,

Suprised that The Communist Bloc believes in self-glory and imperialism, conquering friendly and poor communist regions allowing basic freedoms,

Honoring past yet failed attempts, such as the nation of Nationalist Northumbria's attempt to condemn such a despicable region,

Wanting to teach the multiverse a lesson about allowing basic freedoms by sanctioning the soon doomed-to-fail region,

Hereby condemns The Communist Bloc.

I would appreciate it if someone would send a campaign telegram for me.

“I know that many ambassadors have made complaints on this, but I’ll add my complaints. First, I’m skeptical as to if any effort was put into this. Second, who has ever suggested that the only correct ideology is democracy and that the regions with extreme ideologies should be liberated? Exactly, no one. Therefore, the Clevesian people demand that this flawed condemnation is scrapped forever.”
-Ms. Charlotte Schafer, WA Ambassador for the Clevesian Empire

[Xatu the Great]

Regardless of the politics/people/region involved - this proposal isn't even written that well, half of it being filler, and the other half just being "they are evil commies" essentially

in particular:

Honoring past yet failed attempts, such as the nation of Nationalist Northumbria's attempt to condemn such a despicable region,

Violates 4B

Branding: Co-authors should use the in-built mechanics for recording co-authors, rather than listing them in the text of proposals. Lists of supporters or similar are not permitted.

[Sedgistan]

Honoring past yet failed attempts, such as the nation of Nationalist Northumbria's attempt to condemn such a despicable region,

Violates 4B

Branding: Co-authors should use the in-built mechanics for recording co-authors, rather than listing them in the text of proposals. Lists of supporters or similar are not permitted.

The branding rule doesn't prohibit mention of nations - that line is pretty typical SC fare, mentioning the past actions of various nations.

Happy to get another mod to confirm if you want, since I posted an opinion on the topic further up.

[Xatu the Great]

I don't think there's a particular need for that

[Burgundu]

TCB proclaims themselves as 'vanguards of socialism', but they sure did not show that when invading and occupying a region that had just overturned and liberated themselves from fash.

Seems as if they support fascists, they sure did get Nordor's revenge for them.

[Burgundu]

As for TCB's official position on the Holodomor, or really any hotly-debated political topic without one obvious answer? We don't have one. Individual government members' political beliefs don't necessarily align with everyone else's individual beliefs, and we don't force people to follow one specific viewpoint. The nature of being a pan-leftist region means that we all may disagree on some things, and we simply accept that rather than trying to establish an ever-shifting system of specifically accepted political views. The only rules are against rightwing ideology and bigotry.

This kind of weak "we don't take responsibility for the views our members espouse" policy wouldn't be tolerated elsewhere, and shouldn't be for your region either. It sounds like your region has got itself in the position where it'll ban someone for daring to suggest a tax cut, but will happily tolerate genocide deniers that accuse those that accept the Holodomor as reality of spreading Nazi propaganda. Flip Holodomor for Holocaust, communism for fascism, Soviet Union for Nazi Germany etc. in your post, and it reads just like the shameful apologism of Genua and its ilk.

You've even got the "I haven't researched the Holocaust Holodomor, so I don't know everything about it, but I've read these links and these knowledgeable people say it wasn't deliberate and the numbers weren't so high" act down to a T.

Sounds Condemnable to me, though blacklisting of the region might be a better option.

This sort of behavior comes at the same time as TCB proclaiming themselves "vanguard of leftist ideals" - yours truly, New Astri.

[Saksoni]

This proposal is just people condemning them because they hate communism (probably from the American societal propaganda about communism)

No. THey are warmongers that take democratic regions and as justification they use that they combat fascism. we need to stop it.

[Reavina]

100& Yes

[Bhang Bhang Duc]

This proposal is just people condemning them because they hate communism (probably from the American societal propaganda about communism)

No. THey are warmongers that take democratic regions and as justification they use that they combat fascism. we need to stop it.

And how will giving them a nice shiny badge stop them? Please explain, I’m all ears. Oh wait, you’re a Layemite, ‘nuff said.

By the way I’m really enjoying piling in your region.

[Peace and Love but Better]

As for TCB's official position on the Holodomor, or really any hotly-debated political topic without one obvious answer? We don't have one. Individual government members' political beliefs don't necessarily align with everyone else's individual beliefs, and we don't force people to follow one specific viewpoint. The nature of being a pan-leftist region means that we all may disagree on some things, and we simply accept that rather than trying to establish an ever-shifting system of specifically accepted political views. The only rules are against rightwing ideology and bigotry.

This kind of weak "we don't take responsibility for the views our members espouse" policy wouldn't be tolerated elsewhere, and shouldn't be for your region either. It sounds like your region has got itself in the position where it'll ban someone for daring to suggest a tax cut, but will happily tolerate genocide deniers that accuse those that accept the Holodomor as reality of spreading Nazi propaganda. Flip Holodomor for Holocaust, communism for fascism, Soviet Union for Nazi Germany etc. in your post, and it reads just like the shameful apologism of Genua and its ilk.

You've even got the "I haven't researched the Holocaust Holodomor, so I don't know everything about it, but I've read these links and these knowledgeable people say it wasn't deliberate and the numbers weren't so high" act down to a T.

Sounds Condemnable to me, though blacklisting of the region might be a better option.

This seems like wildly inappropriate behavior from an NS moderator. Like no, we obviously don't condone genocide in any form, that's our stance. EDIT: and we will absolutely yeet anyone who advocates for genocides right the hell to TRR, as they deserve.

Aside, this resolution is misguided anywho. Condemnations are a badge of honor, not one of shame like the name suggest. So, authors and anticommunists and whoever else, if you really want to make us feel bad then perhaps don't try and give us the thing that's a shiny badge of honor for contribution to gp and whatever. This is the same old discussion that always happens when people want to condem raiders because they're angry at them.

[The North Polish Union]

This kind of weak "we don't take responsibility for the views our members espouse" policy wouldn't be tolerated elsewhere, and shouldn't be for your region either. It sounds like your region has got itself in the position where it'll ban someone for daring to suggest a tax cut, but will happily tolerate genocide deniers that accuse those that accept the Holodomor as reality of spreading Nazi propaganda. Flip Holodomor for Holocaust, communism for fascism, Soviet Union for Nazi Germany etc. in your post, and it reads just like the shameful apologism of Genua and its ilk.

You've even got the "I haven't researched the Holocaust Holodomor, so I don't know everything about it, but I've read these links and these knowledgeable people say it wasn't deliberate and the numbers weren't so high" act down to a T.

Sounds Condemnable to me, though blacklisting of the region might be a better option.

This seems like wildly inappropriate behavior from an NS moderator. Like no, we obviously don't condone genocide in any form, that's our stance. EDIT: and we will absolutely yeet anyone who advocates for genocides right the hell to TRR, as they deserve.

Aside, this resolution is misguided anywho. Condemnations are a badge of honor, not one of shame like the name suggest. So, authors and anticommunists and whoever else, if you really want to make us feel bad then perhaps don't try and give us the thing that's a shiny badge of honor for contribution to gp and whatever. This is the same old discussion that always happens when people want to condem raiders because they're angry at them.

Emphasis mine.

Thanks for this additional clarification. I'm hoping for your best successes in stringent enforcement of this policy.

[Sedgistan]

This seems like wildly inappropriate behavior from an NS moderator.

Why? Mods are players too. I barely "play" NS any more, but once in a blue moon venture an opinion on an SC proposal. If you have a genuine grievance, take it up through official channels.

[Dawn Denac]

This kind of weak "we don't take responsibility for the views our members espouse" policy wouldn't be tolerated elsewhere, and shouldn't be for your region either. It sounds like your region has got itself in the position where it'll ban someone for daring to suggest a tax cut, but will happily tolerate genocide deniers that accuse those that accept the Holodomor as reality of spreading Nazi propaganda. Flip Holodomor for Holocaust, communism for fascism, Soviet Union for Nazi Germany etc. in your post, and it reads just like the shameful apologism of Genua and its ilk.

You've even got the "I haven't researched the Holocaust Holodomor, so I don't know everything about it, but I've read these links and these knowledgeable people say it wasn't deliberate and the numbers weren't so high" act down to a T.

Sounds Condemnable to me, though blacklisting of the region might be a better option.

This seems like wildly inappropriate behavior from an NS moderator. Like no, we obviously don't condone genocide in any form, that's our stance. EDIT: and we will absolutely yeet anyone who advocates for genocides right the hell to TRR, as they deserve.

Aside, this resolution is misguided anywho. Condemnations are a badge of honor, not one of shame like the name suggest. So, authors and anticommunists and whoever else, if you really want to make us feel bad then perhaps don't try and give us the thing that's a shiny badge of honor for contribution to gp and whatever. This is the same old discussion that always happens when people want to condem raiders because they're angry at them.

viewtopic.php?p=39638108&sid=6a031654959f60c699779cc7eab745b6#p39638108

Luna & Fris have already spoken regarding moderators acting as players with their own opinions and acting in their mod personas. He's just stating his voice as a player.

[Quebecshire]

I’m not going to call for blacklisting, not really a fan of doing that barring extreme cases, but TCB does have a serious problem with this stuff. Do a quick search on their RMB and you’ll find some genocide downplaying. Their Discord has no shortage of it in terms of the Holodomor and the Uyghur populations in China. Feel free to hit me up for logs, I dropped some in the NSGP Discord earlier.

That said, this proposal is bad, by someone throwing stones from a glass house, and shouldn’t be entertained as a serious response to TCB’s problems.

Also, of all the things to criticize Sedge for, his post earlier isn’t a strong one to go for. If anything his pointing out of the tired and awful rhetoric Iota was using is fair enough to be quite honest.

[Raskana]

I’m not going to call for blacklisting, not really a fan of doing that barring extreme cases, but TCB does have a serious problem with this stuff. Do a quick search on their RMB and you’ll find some genocide downplaying. Their Discord has no shortage of it in terms of the Holodomor and the Uyghur populations in China. Feel free to hit me up for logs, I dropped some in the NSGP Discord earlier.

That said, this proposal is bad, by someone throwing stones from a glass house, and shouldn’t be entertained as a serious response to TCB’s problems.

Also, of all the things to criticize Sedge for, his post earlier isn’t a strong one to go for. If anything his pointing out of the tired and awful rhetoric Iota was using is fair enough to be quite honest.

so what is the solution to this problem then?

[Peace and Love but Better]

This seems like wildly inappropriate behavior from an NS moderator.

Why? Mods are players too. I barely "play" NS any more, but once in a blue moon venture an opinion on an SC proposal. If you have a genuine grievance, take it up through official channels.

I'm going to go out on a limb and state that a moderator saying a region should be blacklisted is a bit beyond the just "posting like a regular user. " like yall have more power and thus more responsibility than regular users, so it reads more like a threat
But I don't expect telling the moderators to investigate their own behavior is gonna get me far, anyhow. Whether it's acceptable according to the staff team or not I stand by that I think it's not an appropriate way for a site mod to act and leave it at that. My opinions on the proposal are the same, its not in the spirit of the sc and isnt well written, (further, TCBs stance celebrating genocide or famine (of any kind) is that we don't tolerate it, but thats a real world political issue that i dont think is relevant to the SC anyway)

[Dawn Denac]

Why? Mods are players too. I barely "play" NS any more, but once in a blue moon venture an opinion on an SC proposal. If you have a genuine grievance, take it up through official channels.

I'm going to go out on a limb and state that a moderator saying a region should be blacklisted is a bit beyond the just "posting like a regular user. " like yall have more power and thus more responsibility than regular users, so it reads more like a threat
But I don't expect telling the moderators to investigate their own behavior is gonna get me far, anyhow. Whether it's acceptable according to the staff team or not I stand by that I think it's not an appropriate way for a site mod to act and leave it at that. My opinions on the proposal are the same, its not in the spirit of the sc and isnt well written, (further, TCBs stance celebrating genocide or famine (of any kind) is that we don't tolerate it, but thats a real world political issue that i dont think is relevant to the SC anyway)

viewtopic.php?p=39638108&sid=681fed1dc9bf1bd4bb8a620cad949aaa#p39638108

Again. Site staff are allowed to have opinions. He's not abusing his mod powers to sway this thread in any way whatsoever.

EDIT: hyperlink go brr

[Outer Sparta]

I’m not going to call for blacklisting, not really a fan of doing that barring extreme cases, but TCB does have a serious problem with this stuff. Do a quick search on their RMB and you’ll find some genocide downplaying. Their Discord has no shortage of it in terms of the Holodomor and the Uyghur populations in China. Feel free to hit me up for logs, I dropped some in the NSGP Discord earlier.

That said, this proposal is bad, by someone throwing stones from a glass house, and shouldn’t be entertained as a serious response to TCB’s problems.

Also, of all the things to criticize Sedge for, his post earlier isn’t a strong one to go for. If anything his pointing out of the tired and awful rhetoric Iota was using is fair enough to be quite honest.

Practically every single proposal regarding TCB are all written by authors who have no intention of writing good drafts and are clear opportunists. Cause why listen to feedback when you can submit your own "masterpiece?"

[Quebecshire]

I’m not going to call for blacklisting, not really a fan of doing that barring extreme cases, but TCB does have a serious problem with this stuff. Do a quick search on their RMB and you’ll find some genocide downplaying. Their Discord has no shortage of it in terms of the Holodomor and the Uyghur populations in China. Feel free to hit me up for logs, I dropped some in the NSGP Discord earlier.

That said, this proposal is bad, by someone throwing stones from a glass house, and shouldn’t be entertained as a serious response to TCB’s problems.

Also, of all the things to criticize Sedge for, his post earlier isn’t a strong one to go for. If anything his pointing out of the tired and awful rhetoric Iota was using is fair enough to be quite honest.

so what is the solution to this problem then?

Ideally it would come from within TCB on the part of administrators and moderators. Though given the apparent complacency of those people and TCB’s already dubious (at best) separation of IC and OOC issues, Im not holding my breath. My recommendation personally would be that people probably shouldn’t associate with or enable them whilst this behavior remains an extant problem.