NATION

PASSWORD

[Withdrawn] Liberate Createmino Region

A chamber dedicated to the dissemination of inter-regional peace and goodwill, via force if necessary.

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Parxland
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Posts: 455
Founded: Apr 21, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Parxland » Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:38 pm

Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:
Parxland wrote:
OOC: I'm pretty confident Varanius is anti-fascist. I don't know BBD enough to know where their politics align but I can assume from their signature they're anti-fascist too. The answer to your question is a solid no.

Just as fucking well. My dad was a Welsh Guard at the end of WW2, my grandfather (his dad) was a Chief Engineer in the Merchant Navy and did a number of convoys to Archangel. My other grandfather worked the railways at Cardiff Dock during bombing raids. I learnt anti-fascism from people who risked their fucking lives fighting it.


I salute your Family. Good shit. We don't have any legislation more significant in queue right now, so despite the lack of substance why not just vote so a few people can get rid of it during an update?
Last edited by Parxland on Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Outer Sparta
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Posts: 15109
Founded: Dec 26, 2014
Democratic Socialists

Postby Outer Sparta » Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:41 pm

Parxland wrote:
Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:Just as fucking well. My dad was a Welsh Guard at the end of WW2, my grandfather (his dad) was a Chief Engineer in the Merchant Navy and did a number of convoys to Archangel. My other grandfather worked the railways at Cardiff Dock during bombing raids. I learnt anti-fascism from people who risked their fucking lives fighting it.


I salute your ancestors. Good shit. We don't have any legislation more significant in queue right now, so despite the lack of substance why not just vote so a few people can get rid of it during an update?

Not a good justification for pushing this worthless liberation through.
Free Palestine, stop the genocide in Gaza

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Nepleslia
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Posts: 231
Founded: Jun 23, 2020
Right-wing Utopia

Postby Nepleslia » Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:41 pm

Parxland wrote:
Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:Just as fucking well. My dad was a Welsh Guard at the end of WW2, my grandfather (his dad) was a Chief Engineer in the Merchant Navy and did a number of convoys to Archangel. My other grandfather worked the railways at Cardiff Dock during bombing raids. I learnt anti-fascism from people who risked their fucking lives fighting it.


I salute your ancestors. Good shit. We don't have any legislation more significant in queue right now, so despite the lack of substance why not just vote so a few people can get rid of it during an update?

Because that - as far as I know - isn’t the intended purpose of liberations?

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Ultimus Tritonis
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Posts: 9
Founded: Oct 21, 2020
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Ultimus Tritonis » Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:46 pm

Nepleslia wrote:
Comfed wrote:It’s being liberated so that it can be raided.

That’s a pretty big yikes on the author’s behalf if your guess is accurate. Aren’t liberations meant to, y’know, liberate a region from raiders?

Yep, im one of the original members of the region all the way from its first version, Createminonia, and have served as delegate for all of them, though there may have been on occasion me expressing interest in joining the Blackhawks, that idea never came through and its also a fact, that the region had expressed themselves to be "Anti-raider", so it is indeed a big yikes on the author's behalf.
ocean


Ultimus Tritonis is a major power in the planet Atlas currently of 2057, serving as an international representative to the remaining interplanetary nations across the world, with holding the title of the strongest nation on the planet, Tritonis aligns with its past ancestors, Neos Helios, which was previously despised by most of the world before the disaster that hit Creatopia in the late-2030s.
The Tritonic Government is actively involved in WA Matters, serving as the current International Delegate of Createmino Region, and previously as Neos Helios in Createminonia and once again as Neos Helios in Creatopia.

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Bhang Bhang Duc
Senator
 
Posts: 4721
Founded: Dec 17, 2003
Democratic Socialists

Postby Bhang Bhang Duc » Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:47 pm

Parxland wrote:
Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:Just as fucking well. My dad was a Welsh Guard at the end of WW2, my grandfather (his dad) was a Chief Engineer in the Merchant Navy and did a number of convoys to Archangel. My other grandfather worked the railways at Cardiff Dock during bombing raids. I learnt anti-fascism from people who risked their fucking lives fighting it.


I salute your ancestors. Good shit. We don't have any legislation more significant in queue right now, so despite the lack of substance why not just vote so a few people can get rid of it during an update?

Oh I’m sorry did you think your grammatically incorrect, piddling attempt at a Liberation was significant?

It’s a nothing region which seems to be quietly passing away. There will be absolutely nothing gained from liberating it. Sorry, correction, you will gain a badge, which seems to be your main focus.

Edit: by the way they’re not my fucking ancestors, this is my family, people I knew, loved and lived with all my life until they passed away. They are not some fucking entry in a register or a gravestone in a churchyard.
Last edited by Bhang Bhang Duc on Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Former Delegate of The West Pacific. Guardian (under many Delegates) of The West Pacific. TWP's Former Minister for World Assembly Affairs and former Security Council Advisor.

The West Pacific's Official Welshman, Astronomer and Old Fart
Pierconium wrote:I see Funk as an opportunistic manipulator that utilises the means available to him to reach his goals. In other words, a nation after my own heart.

RiderSyl wrote:If an enchantress made it so one raid could bring about world peace, Unibot would ask raiders to just sign a petition instead.

Sedgistan wrote:The SC has just has a spate of really shitty ones recently from Northumbria, his Watermelon fanboy…..

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Outer Sparta
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Posts: 15109
Founded: Dec 26, 2014
Democratic Socialists

Postby Outer Sparta » Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:50 pm

Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:
Parxland wrote:
I salute your ancestors. Good shit. We don't have any legislation more significant in queue right now, so despite the lack of substance why not just vote so a few people can get rid of it during an update?

Oh I’m sorry did you think your grammatically incorrect, piddling attempt at a Liberation was significant?

It’s a nothing region which seems to be quietly passing away. There will be absolutely nothing gained from liberating it. Sorry, correction, you will gain a badge, which seems to be your main focus.

Isn't it also bandwagon jumping because the only justification the author gave was "fascism bad" even though the region is actually dead?
Free Palestine, stop the genocide in Gaza

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Ultimus Tritonis
Civil Servant
 
Posts: 9
Founded: Oct 21, 2020
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Ultimus Tritonis » Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:53 pm

Also you know we're just a roleplay region, from a external community right?
ocean


Ultimus Tritonis is a major power in the planet Atlas currently of 2057, serving as an international representative to the remaining interplanetary nations across the world, with holding the title of the strongest nation on the planet, Tritonis aligns with its past ancestors, Neos Helios, which was previously despised by most of the world before the disaster that hit Creatopia in the late-2030s.
The Tritonic Government is actively involved in WA Matters, serving as the current International Delegate of Createmino Region, and previously as Neos Helios in Createminonia and once again as Neos Helios in Creatopia.

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Tevuros
Lobbyist
 
Posts: 11
Founded: Feb 18, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby Tevuros » Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:54 pm

Ultimus Tritonis wrote:Also you know we're just a roleplay region, from a external community right?

Exactly.

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Outer Sparta
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Founded: Dec 26, 2014
Democratic Socialists

Postby Outer Sparta » Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:55 pm

Ultimus Tritonis wrote:Also you know we're just a roleplay region, from a external community right?

Tevuros wrote:
Ultimus Tritonis wrote:Also you know we're just a roleplay region, from a external community right?

Exactly.

Yes, to clarify from your WFE: "Season 3 has ended, this region is currently roleplay-wise paused until further notice."

To the OP: you're trying to liberate a region that is only for RP purposes as well as the fact it's dormant. There really is no point unless you are trying to work for a raider group to open it up for raiding, which isn't how liberations work.
Last edited by Outer Sparta on Sat Mar 27, 2021 2:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Free Palestine, stop the genocide in Gaza

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Parxland
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Posts: 455
Founded: Apr 21, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Parxland » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:02 pm

Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:-

Okay. I corrected my post so now it says your family.
Ultimus Tritonis wrote:Also you know we're just a roleplay region, from a external community right?
Tevuros wrote:Exactly.

Why are you opening embassies with fascist regions, and why does one of your puppet regions have the 'fascist' tag? You should get rid of those embassies and the tag.
Last edited by Parxland on Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Outer Sparta
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Posts: 15109
Founded: Dec 26, 2014
Democratic Socialists

Postby Outer Sparta » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:04 pm

Parxland wrote:
Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:Oh I’m sorry did you think your grammatically incorrect, piddling attempt at a Liberation was significant?

It’s a nothing region which seems to be quietly passing away. There will be absolutely nothing gained from liberating it. Sorry, correction, you will gain a badge, which seems to be your main focus.

Edit: by the way they’re not my fucking ancestors, this is my family, people I knew, loved and lived with all my life until they passed away. They are not some fucking entry in a register or a gravestone in a churchyard.


Okay. I corrected my post so now it says your family.

Ultimus Tritonis wrote:Also you know we're just a roleplay region, from a external community right?

Tevuros wrote:Exactly.


Why are you opening embassies with fascist regions, and why does one of your puppet regions have the 'fascist' tag? You should get rid of those embassies and the tag.

Why are you trying to push through a pointless liberation of a dormant region?
Last edited by Outer Sparta on Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Free Palestine, stop the genocide in Gaza

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Ultimus Tritonis
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Founded: Oct 21, 2020
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Ultimus Tritonis » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:06 pm

Parxland wrote:
Bhang Bhang Duc wrote:Oh I’m sorry did you think your grammatically incorrect, piddling attempt at a Liberation was significant?

It’s a nothing region which seems to be quietly passing away. There will be absolutely nothing gained from liberating it. Sorry, correction, you will gain a badge, which seems to be your main focus.

Edit: by the way they’re not my fucking ancestors, this is my family, people I knew, loved and lived with all my life until they passed away. They are not some fucking entry in a register or a gravestone in a churchyard.


Okay. I corrected my post so now it says your family.

Ultimus Tritonis wrote:Also you know we're just a roleplay region, from a external community right?

Tevuros wrote:Exactly.


Why are you opening embassies with fascist regions, and why does one of your puppet regions have the 'fascist' tag? You should get rid of those embassies and the tag.

those embassies are literally out of character, since we wanted to meet new people, and also "puppet region" is not the right word as we dont even control it anymore, theres the occasion a og wakes up and decides "hey why not do a legislation rq"; also fascist tag? im also 99% sure theres a communist tag somewhere there, i dont remember putting fascist tag nor communist tag there despite being a former executive power on my alt, Neos Helios, honestly man your point is stupid and doesnt make sense.
ocean


Ultimus Tritonis is a major power in the planet Atlas currently of 2057, serving as an international representative to the remaining interplanetary nations across the world, with holding the title of the strongest nation on the planet, Tritonis aligns with its past ancestors, Neos Helios, which was previously despised by most of the world before the disaster that hit Creatopia in the late-2030s.
The Tritonic Government is actively involved in WA Matters, serving as the current International Delegate of Createmino Region, and previously as Neos Helios in Createminonia and once again as Neos Helios in Creatopia.

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Parxland
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 455
Founded: Apr 21, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Parxland » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:09 pm

Outer Sparta wrote:To the OP: you're trying to liberate a region that is only for RP purposes as well as the fact it's dormant. There really is no point unless you are trying to work for a raider group to open it up for raiding, which isn't how liberations work.


If it's just an RP region then that's fine. They shouldn't have a problem with removing the embassies and the tag though, since those are tying them to groups that are OOC fascists and fash-sympathizers.

Outer Sparta wrote:Why are you trying to push through a pointless liberation of a dormant region?


I'd like to see fascist/alt-right groups completely gone from the game. IDK why max allows them when other platforms and game don't. I thought this was just another small fash group. They stood out because they still have a delegate which means they still have some activity and they're founderless so they can be removed by players if the password was removed through a liberation. Go back to my answer above you, that if they're an RP region then I'm fine with that, but they should probably lose the stuff tying them to the fash regions.

Ultimus Tritonis wrote:those embassies are literally out of character, since we wanted to meet new people, and also "puppet region" is not the right word as we dont even control it anymore, theres the occasion a og wakes up and decides "hey why not do a legislation rq"; also fascist tag? im also 99% sure theres a communist tag somewhere there, i dont remember putting fascist tag nor communist tag there despite being a former executive power on my alt, Neos Helios, honestly man your point is stupid and doesnt make sense.


Then just kill the embassies with barbaria and creatopia.
Last edited by Parxland on Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Outer Sparta
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Founded: Dec 26, 2014
Democratic Socialists

Postby Outer Sparta » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:12 pm

Parxland wrote:
Outer Sparta wrote:To the OP: you're trying to liberate a region that is only for RP purposes as well as the fact it's dormant. There really is no point unless you are trying to work for a raider group to open it up for raiding, which isn't how liberations work.


If it's just an RP region then that's fine. They shouldn't have a problem with removing the embassies and the tag though, since those are tying them to groups that are OOC fascists and fash-sympathizers.

Outer Sparta wrote:Why are you trying to push through a pointless liberation of a dormant region?


I'd like to see fascist/alt-right groups completely gone from the game. IDK why max allows them when other platforms and game don't. I thought this was just another small fash group. They stood out because they still have a delegate which means they still have some activity and they're founderless so they can be removed by players if the password was removed through a liberation. Go back to my answer above you, that if they're an RP region then I'm fine with that, but they should probably lose the stuff tying them to the fash regions.

So your only motive is to open this region up for raiding when it was never raided to begin with? That's also not how liberations work.
Free Palestine, stop the genocide in Gaza

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Ultimus Tritonis
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Founded: Oct 21, 2020
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Ultimus Tritonis » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:13 pm

Parxland wrote:
Outer Sparta wrote:To the OP: you're trying to liberate a region that is only for RP purposes as well as the fact it's dormant. There really is no point unless you are trying to work for a raider group to open it up for raiding, which isn't how liberations work.


If it's just an RP region then that's fine. They shouldn't have a problem with removing the embassies and the tag though, since those are tying them to groups that are OOC fascists and fash-sympathizers.

Outer Sparta wrote:Why are you trying to push through a pointless liberation of a dormant region?


I'd like to see fascist/alt-right groups completely gone from the game. IDK why max allows them when other platforms and game don't. I thought this was just another small fash group. They stood out because they still have a delegate which means they still have some activity and they're founderless so they can be removed by players if the password was removed through a liberation. Go back to my answer above you, that if they're an RP region then I'm fine with that, but they should probably lose the stuff tying them to the fash regions.

Ultimus Tritonis wrote:those embassies are literally out of character, since we wanted to meet new people, and also "puppet region" is not the right word as we dont even control it anymore, theres the occasion a og wakes up and decides "hey why not do a legislation rq"; also fascist tag? im also 99% sure theres a communist tag somewhere there, i dont remember putting fascist tag nor communist tag there despite being a former executive power on my alt, Neos Helios, honestly man your point is stupid and doesnt make sense.


Then just kill the embassies with barbaria and creatopia.

are you unironically taking this browser game seriously
ocean


Ultimus Tritonis is a major power in the planet Atlas currently of 2057, serving as an international representative to the remaining interplanetary nations across the world, with holding the title of the strongest nation on the planet, Tritonis aligns with its past ancestors, Neos Helios, which was previously despised by most of the world before the disaster that hit Creatopia in the late-2030s.
The Tritonic Government is actively involved in WA Matters, serving as the current International Delegate of Createmino Region, and previously as Neos Helios in Createminonia and once again as Neos Helios in Creatopia.

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Tinhampton
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Posts: 13705
Founded: Oct 05, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Tinhampton » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:17 pm

I cannot offer my support for this Liberation, or any Liberation that is based solely on guilt by association.
The Self-Administrative City of TINHAMPTON (pop. 329,537): Saffron Howard, Mayor (UCP); Alexander Smith, WA Delegate-Ambassador

Authorships & co-authorships: SC#250, SC#251, Issue #1115, SC#267, GA#484, GA#491, GA#533, GA#540, GA#549, SC#356, GA#559, GA#562, GA#567, GA#578, SC#374, GA#582, SC#375, GA#589, GA#590, SC#382, SC#385*, GA#597, GA#607, SC#415, GA#647, GA#656, GA#664, GA#671, GA#674, GA#675, GA#677, GA#680, Issue #1580, GA#682, GA#683, GA#684, GA#692, GA#693, GA#715
The rest of my CV: Cup of Harmony 73 champions; Philosopher-Queen of Sophia; *author of the most popular SC Res. ever; anti-NPO cabalist in good standing; 48yo Tory woman w/Asperger's; Cambridge graduate ~ currently reading The World by Simon Sebag Montefiore

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Outer Sparta
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Founded: Dec 26, 2014
Democratic Socialists

Postby Outer Sparta » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:19 pm

Tinhampton wrote:I cannot offer my support for this Liberation, or any Liberation that is based solely on guilt by association.

Tinhampton pulling approval of a resolution, quite a rare sight :p
Free Palestine, stop the genocide in Gaza

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Comfed
Minister
 
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Founded: Apr 09, 2020
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Comfed » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:33 pm

Outer Sparta wrote:
Parxland wrote:
If it's just an RP region then that's fine. They shouldn't have a problem with removing the embassies and the tag though, since those are tying them to groups that are OOC fascists and fash-sympathizers.



I'd like to see fascist/alt-right groups completely gone from the game. IDK why max allows them when other platforms and game don't. I thought this was just another small fash group. They stood out because they still have a delegate which means they still have some activity and they're founderless so they can be removed by players if the password was removed through a liberation. Go back to my answer above you, that if they're an RP region then I'm fine with that, but they should probably lose the stuff tying them to the fash regions.

So your only motive is to open this region up for raiding when it was never raided to begin with? That's also not how liberations work.

Actually, how they "work" is they remove the password from a founderless region. They can be used for anything.
(That being said, I oppose this resolution.)

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Outer Sparta
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Outer Sparta » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:38 pm

Comfed wrote:
Outer Sparta wrote:So your only motive is to open this region up for raiding when it was never raided to begin with? That's also not how liberations work.

Actually, how they "work" is they remove the password from a founderless region. They can be used for anything.
(That being said, I oppose this resolution.)

Yeah, but of course the author most likely wants to open this region up for raiding and jump on the anti-fascism bandwagon.
Free Palestine, stop the genocide in Gaza

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Parxland
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Founded: Apr 21, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Parxland » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:43 pm

Ultimus Tritonis wrote:are you unironically taking this browser game seriously


Some alt-right seriously like to recruit teens and young adults in video games and radicalize them to the ideology. So in response to your question, the fascist community is a part of this game that I take seriously. If you ask me about anything else, my answer is probably not.

My question is why don't you remove those two embassies, since you have the power to do it yourself? Doing that will shut me up pretty quickly.
Last edited by Parxland on Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Outer Sparta
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Founded: Dec 26, 2014
Democratic Socialists

Postby Outer Sparta » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:45 pm

Parxland wrote:
Ultimus Tritonis wrote:are you unironically taking this browser game seriously


Some alt-right seriously like to recruit teens and young adults in video games and radicalize them to the ideology. So in response to your question, the fascist community is a part of this game that I take seriously. If you ask me about anything else, my answer is probably not.

My question is why don't you remove those two embassies, since you have the power to do it yourself? Doing that will shut me up pretty quickly.

If they remove the embassies, is that where you draw the line and withdraw this pointless proposal? Or are you still trying to push that because you're on the anti-fascism bandwagon?
Free Palestine, stop the genocide in Gaza

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Parxland
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 455
Founded: Apr 21, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Parxland » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:47 pm

Outer Sparta wrote:
Parxland wrote:
Some alt-right seriously like to recruit teens and young adults in video games and radicalize them to the ideology. So in response to your question, the fascist community is a part of this game that I take seriously. If you ask me about anything else, my answer is probably not.

My question is why don't you remove those two embassies, since you have the power to do it yourself? Doing that will shut me up pretty quickly.

If they remove the embassies, is that where you draw the line and withdraw this pointless proposal? Or are you still trying to push that because you're on the anti-fascism bandwagon?


If they withdraw those embassies, that's where I'll withdraw this proposal.
Last edited by Parxland on Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Tinhampton
Postmaster-General
 
Posts: 13705
Founded: Oct 05, 2016
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Tinhampton » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:50 pm

Parxland wrote:
Ultimus Tritonis wrote:are you unironically taking this browser game seriously


Some alt-right seriously like to recruit teens and young adults in video games and radicalize them to the ideology. So in response to your question, the fascist community is a part of this game that I take seriously. If you ask me about anything else, my answer is probably not.

My question is why don't you remove those two embassies, since you have the power to do it yourself? Doing that will shut me up pretty quickly.

Name me one member of Createmino Region (or allied regions) who has been "radicalize[d] to" "alt-right" or "the fascist community" as a result of the embassies constructed with Barbaria or Genua.
The Self-Administrative City of TINHAMPTON (pop. 329,537): Saffron Howard, Mayor (UCP); Alexander Smith, WA Delegate-Ambassador

Authorships & co-authorships: SC#250, SC#251, Issue #1115, SC#267, GA#484, GA#491, GA#533, GA#540, GA#549, SC#356, GA#559, GA#562, GA#567, GA#578, SC#374, GA#582, SC#375, GA#589, GA#590, SC#382, SC#385*, GA#597, GA#607, SC#415, GA#647, GA#656, GA#664, GA#671, GA#674, GA#675, GA#677, GA#680, Issue #1580, GA#682, GA#683, GA#684, GA#692, GA#693, GA#715
The rest of my CV: Cup of Harmony 73 champions; Philosopher-Queen of Sophia; *author of the most popular SC Res. ever; anti-NPO cabalist in good standing; 48yo Tory woman w/Asperger's; Cambridge graduate ~ currently reading The World by Simon Sebag Montefiore

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Outer Sparta
Post Marshal
 
Posts: 15109
Founded: Dec 26, 2014
Democratic Socialists

Postby Outer Sparta » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:54 pm

Parxland wrote:
Outer Sparta wrote:If they remove the embassies, is that where you draw the line and withdraw this pointless proposal? Or are you still trying to push that because you're on the anti-fascism bandwagon?


If they withdraw those embassies, that's where I'll withdraw this proposal.

Why not just withdraw the proposal now since it's nothing but a waste of time?
Free Palestine, stop the genocide in Gaza

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The Reformed American Republic
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7643
Founded: May 23, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby The Reformed American Republic » Sat Mar 27, 2021 3:57 pm

Outer Sparta wrote:
Parxland wrote:
Some alt-right seriously like to recruit teens and young adults in video games and radicalize them to the ideology. So in response to your question, the fascist community is a part of this game that I take seriously. If you ask me about anything else, my answer is probably not.

My question is why don't you remove those two embassies, since you have the power to do it yourself? Doing that will shut me up pretty quickly.

If they remove the embassies, is that where you draw the line and withdraw this pointless proposal? Or are you still trying to push that because you're on the anti-fascism bandwagon?

It is a pathetic act to attempt to liberate a region over an embassy and you're right, this is just needless grandstanding.
"It's called 'the American Dream' 'cause you have to be asleep to believe it." - George Carlin
"My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right." - Carl Schurz
Older posts do not reflect my positions.

Holocene Extinction

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