[Passed] Commend Marrabuk

[Andusre]

If it helps at all to know this, Andy made sure that I took on the main part of the writing for that clause, rather than him being the one to author it.

I can confirm this, I asked Maowi to do the heavy lifting for the Thaecia section because of my position, knowing that to write much of it myself would likely be a bit dodgy. We also sought advice from people like Pluvie and Seva who really helped us make sure that section was good to go (huge thanks to them for that advice too!).

If it came from a different author I probably wouldn’t object

Perhaps you might reconsider the objection?

Like Maowi said we are working to address the points raised. I'll be editing the draft in maybe the next hour or so to reflect the changes we've agreed upon.

[Crowheim]

If it helps at all to know this, Andy made sure that I took on the main part of the writing for that clause, rather than him being the one to author it.

I can confirm this, I asked Maowi to do the heavy lifting for the Thaecia section because of my position, knowing that to write much of it myself would likely be a bit dodgy. We also sought advice from people like Pluvie and Seva who really helped us make sure that section was good to go (huge thanks to them for that advice too!).

If it came from a different author I probably wouldn’t object

Perhaps you might reconsider the objection?

Like Maowi said we are working to address the points raised. I'll be editing the draft in maybe the next hour or so to reflect the changes we've agreed upon.

I'm still a bit apprehensive about it. It's not something that would make me outright oppose the proposal but I am rather consistently not on board with patting oneself on the back in SC, and while that's not something I think you're doing here, it's something that's still on the radar as it relates to this proposal.

It is good to know you had Maowi draft it, while she is still not the most unbiased source (being a Thaecian citizen herself), it's certainly better than you yourself writing it and makes me more confidently support the draft overall, given that you seem to have demonstrated healthy drafting ethics.

[Andusre]

It is good to know you had Maowi draft it, while she is still not the most unbiased source (being a Thaecian citizen herself),

Just to clarify, Maowi is not a Thaecian citizen nor is she a Thaecian resident. She used to be many many months ago, long before we began this project, but it was for a relatively brief amount of time (a couple of weeks I think?)

[Crowheim]

It is good to know you had Maowi draft it, while she is still not the most unbiased source (being a Thaecian citizen herself),

Just to clarify, Maowi is not a Thaecian citizen nor is she a Thaecian resident. She used to be many many months ago, long before we began this project, but it was for a relatively brief amount of time (a couple of weeks I think?)

I mean, she was an elected official during that time and has what I’d consider to be relatively strong ties to the community

Anyways, if you’re not going to remove it there’s no point in continuing to nitpick that point, but I would say that further explanation of the Eastern Union clause is needed, and probably (unrelated to the conflict of interest) the trimming of the Thaecia clause or expansion of the Balder clause so that it looks more uniform, but that’s just me.

[Outer Sparta]

It is good to know you had Maowi draft it, while she is still not the most unbiased source (being a Thaecian citizen herself),

Just to clarify, Maowi is not a Thaecian citizen nor is she a Thaecian resident. She used to be many many months ago, long before we began this project, but it was for a relatively brief amount of time (a couple of weeks I think?)

I think that's generally fine. If your co-author was in Thaecia, then they have some knowledge to help you with parts of this resolution. It shouldn't have to be any sort of problem.

[Unibot III]

I'm a bit uncomfortable with the WASC commending a nominee for lowering their endorsement cap, but the resolution seems admirable & well written. I would support this proposed resolution.

[Quebecshire]

Even if Andusre was the sole author, I can't say the Thaecia thing particularly bothers me. The only mentions of Thaecia in the resolution being in this clause,

an ongoing affinity with Thaecia, now codified under the Poem of the Greats treaty: the influence of this partnership on Thaecia’s growth from staunch isolationism to a more open foreign policy is in large part owed to Marrabuk’s open-handed outreach efforts to initially develop relations and support Thaecia in interregional matters (such as abandoning unfair recruitment practices, and further on, shared cultural events including the Late Nite Festivals and Paradoxical);

I don't think anything here is unreasonable, it's all fairly true, essentially crediting Marrabuk for helping Thaecia improve and correct course. If I were to hypothetically write a commendation of Libertanny and cite something along the lines of "Led The East Pacific to pursue relations with a variety of user-created-regions including X region, Y region, and The League of Conservative Nations..." I don't think that'd be unreasonable.

I'd be standoffish or against one commending their own region, but I don't see anything wrong with mentioning the positive contributions of a commendee (Is that a word? Dunno) to one's own region, that's a level of adjacent appreciativeness I think is perfectly acceptable in the Security Council.

[Paleocacher]

The achievements of this nation as outlined in the proposed commendation are positive and show that this nation has had a beneficial effect on the TEP, Thaecia and other members of the international community. Commendations and condemnations should be focused on such nations and based on the proposal I would approve of it if it were to be sent to the delegates.

[Big Bad Badger]

Haha hahaha hahaha hahaha hahahaha...no

[Andusre]

Draft has been updated to reword the EPNS section to more accurately reflect Marrabuk's role in its revival, and also to include the EU Strait in the RP section + highlight that the EU is no longer in existence.

We have still to decide on what to do with the part Lib raised about the MoFA but we'll get round to that in due course.

All other constructive criticism is warmly welcomed

[Tinhampton]

"at the time of writing, is" ---> "remains"? I also have no idea what the question mark at the end of the ACCLAIMING clause is doing

[Andusre]

"at the time of writing, is" ---> "remains"? I also have no idea what the question mark at the end of the ACCLAIMING clause is doing

Oops! Two errors of copying & pasting on my part.

The question mark was a mistake when copying our agreed text from Discord to here. We talked about it in DMs and proposed a wording sort of like "how about [new wording of text]?" and changed it until we agreed on it, I just forgot to take the ? out - fixed now. I also appear to have accidentally edited the RP section in the first draft rather than the second Forums have never been my strong suit.

We are keeping "at the time of writing, is" in because we thought changing it to the past tense somewhat implied the RP alliance had been eclipsed by a larger one which, as best we know, is not the case. We have instead edited the first line of the clause to say:

Cognisant of Marrabuk’s vital contribution to the creation of the Eastern Union, a defensive and co-operative international alliance that formerly operated through TEP’s RMB, which:

Hmm, although in retrospect this may imply that it moved off-site. I'll bring that up to Maowi.

Edit: Text of the proposal has been edited again to take Tin's suggestion for 'remains' - thanks Tin

[Libertanny]

We have still to decide on what to do with the part Lib raised about the MoFA but we'll get round to that in due course.

Where is the issue? I literally pointed and shared evidence on why this clause is exactly opposed to truth. Marrabuk is opposed to the current structure and if you want to credit anyone, but the actual creators of it, credit Dilber. I took some inspiration from TWP's Ministry of Foreign Affairs, when me, Zuk, AMOM and EM were creating the structure. And again, the structure we are currently using is not *developed* structure of Marrabuk's MoFA, but a total abolishment and replacement of it.

[Mancheseva City]

I enthusiastically support this! Top-quality resolution for a deserving nominee. As Andy said I did give some feedback - I was very pleased when I first saw this

Nothing of substance to add, just noting that this clause is missing a semicolon:

restructuring the ministry to better delineate roles and duties of its members and setting the stage for the structure that is still in use at the time of writing, thus greatly helping newcomers develop their skills and become leaders in the ministry throughout future administrations

[Crowheim]

We have still to decide on what to do with the part Lib raised about the MoFA but we'll get round to that in due course.

Where is the issue? I literally pointed and shared evidence on why this clause is exactly opposed to truth. Marrabuk is opposed to the current structure and if you want to credit anyone, but the actual creators of it, credit Dilber. I took some inspiration from TWP's Ministry of Foreign Affairs, when me, Zuk, AMOM and EM were creating the structure. And again, the structure we are currently using is not *developed* structure of Marrabuk's MoFA, but a total abolishment and replacement of it.

Full agreement here. A commend such as this should be honest.

[Andusre]

I enthusiastically support this! Top-quality resolution for a deserving nominee. As Andy said I did give some feedback - I was very pleased when I first saw this

Nothing of substance to add, just noting that this clause is missing a semicolon:

restructuring the ministry to better delineate roles and duties of its members and setting the stage for the structure that is still in use at the time of writing, thus greatly helping newcomers develop their skills and become leaders in the ministry throughout future administrations

Thanks for the spot & the support It's been fixed

The Applauding clause's list has been edited to hopefully better represent Marrabuk's role.

[Andusre]

Shameless bumping of thread in 3, 2, 1, go

Hello! Just to remind everyone that we are still open and looking for any tips or constructive criticism you may have to offer - any help would be greatly appreciated

I also want to note that some minor changes of wording have been enacted to the first half of the Applauding clause with Libertanny's help - thanks Lib, I hope the new text represents Marrabuk better/more accurately!

[Zukchiva]

masterminded the operation of Eastern Union's Strait, which economically sustained TEP's international community via the RMB throughout its existence;

What I'm about to say isn't really a big thing, but thought I'd mention it.

It's been a few years, but if I recall correctly, the EU Strait wasn't something that specifically aimed at helping out the RMB at the time. It was mainly a controversial tax meant to benefit the EU and the EU only. A lot of nations weren't happy with it (you'll have to go to context and scroll down to see the reactions to the posts I've linked here).

The EU was a good thing and I do believe it should be in this commend. I just don't know if the strait is something you'd wanna include or not.

[Crowheim]

I still have some quibbles with the Eastern Union clause - primarily, I'm just not sure it's commendable, especially if Marrabuk only contributed to it, as you stated in the proposal. Participation in a roleplay is not something that belongs in a resolution - if he had founded it or "won" it somehow, I think it would have a place. (And I do get the idea that this may be the case, your wording is just a little bit messy. )

[Andusre]

masterminded the operation of Eastern Union's Strait, which economically sustained TEP's international community via the RMB throughout its existence;

What I'm about to say isn't really a big thing, but thought I'd mention it.

It's been a few years, but if I recall correctly, the EU Strait wasn't something that specifically aimed at helping out the RMB at the time. It was mainly a controversial tax meant to benefit the EU and the EU only. A lot of nations weren't happy with it (you'll have to go to context and scroll down to see the reactions to the posts I've linked here).

The EU was a good thing and I do believe it should be in this commend. I just don't know if the strait is something you'd wanna include or not.

We included the Strait because from what we gathered the EU rose to an unprecedented position of strength & influence in the TEP RMB RP which required (commendable) strategic genius, especially given its provision of mutual defence allowing for smooth integration of new players. I believe we intend to keep the mention of the Strait in for these reasons in spite of some disagreements from others, but thank you for raising the point <3

that last bit sounded really passive aggressive but i am sure you know i didn't mean it that way

Also - a minor tweak has been made to the wording of the EU section. We changed it in light of Crowheim's comments as we hope the new wording is less down-playing of Marrabuk's RP achievements.

[Crowheim]

What I'm about to say isn't really a big thing, but thought I'd mention it.

It's been a few years, but if I recall correctly, the EU Strait wasn't something that specifically aimed at helping out the RMB at the time. It was mainly a controversial tax meant to benefit the EU and the EU only. A lot of nations weren't happy with it (you'll have to go to context and scroll down to see the reactions to the posts I've linked here).

The EU was a good thing and I do believe it should be in this commend. I just don't know if the strait is something you'd wanna include or not.

We included the Strait because from what we gathered the EU rose to an unprecedented position of strength & influence in the TEP RMB RP which required (commendable) strategic genius, especially given its provision of mutual defence allowing for smooth integration of new players. I believe we intend to keep the mention of the Strait in for these reasons in spite of some disagreements from others, but thank you for raising the point <3

that last bit sounded really passive aggressive but i am sure you know i didn't mean it that way

Also - a minor tweak has been made to the wording of the EU section. We changed it in light of Crowheim's comments as we hope the new wording is less down-playing of Marrabuk's RP achievements.

Looks better! Full-ish support.

[Andusre]

Hello again SC thread o/

With the comments seemingly beginning to run dry, Maowi & I are hopeful to be in a position for submission in a week or two and just wanted to see if anyone else has any more feedback/criticism at all to give - as I said earlier in this thread, it's all much appreciated! <3

[Andusre]

Shameless bumping of thread, episode 2

Hallo again, we're looking to submit in the next few days if no one has anything else to add, thanks all!

[Andusre]

The proposal has been submitted.

Huge thank you to everyone who gave constructive feedback!!

https://www.nationstates.net/page=UN_vi ... 1617450832

[Lenlyvit]

This is at vote but not pinned.