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Security Council Proposal to Condemn The Communist Bloc

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Outer Sparta
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Founded: Dec 26, 2014
Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Outer Sparta » Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:54 am

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:I wouldn’t call standing up inherently flawed ideology “bandwagoning” it’s simply people fighting the good fight.

If you want to rail against communism, I recommend the general forums instead of using the SC to advance your agenda. You have done absolutely nothing to actually make a quality proposal and keep on trying to justify it by boiling down your arguments to "communism bad" and nothing else.
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Kazakhstan 3
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Founded: Mar 01, 2021
Anarchy

Postby Kazakhstan 3 » Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:08 am

Mr Euameus all have you no my region is currently plagued with alt accounts, if you look solely at the WA accounts you will find a much different story. I have it on good authority that TCB is not in the same boat.

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Toerana
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Postby Toerana » Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:21 am

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:Mr Euameus all have you no my region is currently plagued with alt accounts, if you look solely at the WA accounts you will find a much different story. I have it on good authority that TCB is not in the same boat.

But c'mon, it's a two line proposal. You could have at least put more into it than that if you were serious about condemning TCB.
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Kazakhstan 3
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Anarchy

Postby Kazakhstan 3 » Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:38 am

Toerana wrote:
Kazakhstan 3 wrote:Mr Euameus all have you no my region is currently plagued with alt accounts, if you look solely at the WA accounts you will find a much different story. I have it on good authority that TCB is not in the same boat.

But c'mon, it's a two line proposal. You could have at least put more into it than that if you were serious about condemning TCB.


Like I have said, if you wish to do better be my guest. My proposal is brief to spare the good people their time and come to the quick yet obvious conclusion that TCB must be stopped.

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Sodoran Alesia
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Sodoran Alesia » Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:44 am

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:
Toerana wrote:But c'mon, it's a two line proposal. You could have at least put more into it than that if you were serious about condemning TCB.


Like I have said, if you wish to do better be my guest. My proposal is brief to spare the good people their time and come to the quick yet obvious conclusion that TCB must be stopped.


Stop us from what lol

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Hiram Land
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Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Hiram Land » Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:49 am

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:
Toerana wrote:But c'mon, it's a two line proposal. You could have at least put more into it than that if you were serious about condemning TCB.


Like I have said, if you wish to do better be my guest. My proposal is brief to spare the good people their time and come to the quick yet obvious conclusion that TCB must be stopped.

Dude. Just remove your proposal. It holds no weight besides the point that "communism is bad". You should look at previous proposals (which have already been suggested but might as well repeat it) and do some research on The Communist Bloc, or anyone that you seek to condemn, for that matter.

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Eumaeus
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Postby Eumaeus » Thu Mar 04, 2021 10:50 am

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:Mr Euameus all have you no my region is currently plagued with alt accounts, if you look solely at the WA accounts you will find a much different story. I have it on good authority that TCB is not in the same boat.

Fair enough, it does seem that there is an outlier nation skewing some of your region stats. This still doesn't address my more substantial criticisms though.
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Refuge Isle
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Refuge Isle » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:25 am

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:I wouldn’t call standing up inherently flawed ideology “bandwagoning” it’s simply people fighting the good fight.

The only people that you're fighting are people giving feedback in this thread, certainly The Communist Bloc OOC isn't going to be affected one way or another. The feedback is largely negative because the proposal is bad. I'm disappointed that you are keen to discard comments regarding your proposal's mechanical structure out of ideological conspiracy. Were it so easy in school to disregard your English test scores because you believe your professor to be a communist. :blush:

Drafting thread responses are also one way to get an idea about how a vote will go, since a number of people who comment here can either influence or predict the direction their delegate will vote, should a proposal hit the floor. Some of those delegates command seven hundred votes, which is surely a volume larger than the couple people you say that you've talked to who support the proposal on ideological grounds alone. Though it is a waste of time, at this point it is doubtlessly better off for the proposal to go to vote. If nothing else to demonstrate by what degree it will be defeated.

Given the nature of the content-free submission, there's no real reason to expect it would fare better than the similarly constructed Regions For SC Props proposal.
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Daarwyrth
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Postby Daarwyrth » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:32 am

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:You can pout all you want but my proposal is 100% legal and will reach quorum under the supervision of our numerous allies.

I'm not pouting. I'm just telling you that your proposal is a pile of refuse in its current form. Like the other posters, I am encouraging you to remove it from the submissions and redraft it here. The way you're going about it now, you're antagonizing more people than winning them over. In essence, you're shooting your own proposal down with your behaviour. Also, you should replace "numerous allies" with "a handful of people that don't really care about your proposal but want to kick up dust for the sake of it".
Last edited by Daarwyrth on Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Kazakhstan 3
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Anarchy

Postby Kazakhstan 3 » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:40 am

As I've said many times I am not looking for criticism, this thread was solely to raise support and address concerns where I see fit. If you dislike my proposal that's fine, but many people do not. I say let the people decide. For that reason it will stay up. My personal theory is that some of you are shaking in your boots at the strength and uniqueness my proposal has and its ability to upturn precedent and rewrite the way this game is played.

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Daarwyrth
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Postby Daarwyrth » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:47 am

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:My personal theory is that some of you are shaking in your boots at the strength and uniqueness my proposal has and its ability to upturn precedent and rewrite the way this game is played.

Reality will pop your bubble of delusions soon enough, my friend ;)

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:this thread was solely to raise support

You're defeating your own proposal with this kind of behaviour. You're antagonizing people, not winning their support. You could have won a lot of people over, if you showed initiative to work with the criticism you were getting, not against it. You're creating a very unwelcome aura around your proposal at this moment, and present yourself - as its author - in an unsympathetic manner. As I said, you're shooting down your own proposal, while you could have helped it if you worked with the feedback you were given.
Last edited by Daarwyrth on Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Baedan
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Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby Baedan » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:52 am

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:I say let the people decide.

What does that make SC commenters? 0.o
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Nova Vandalia
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Nova Vandalia » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:52 am

Kazakhstan 3 wrote: this thread was solely to raise support and address concerns where I see fit.


And how has this gone for you?

People offered helped rather nicely actually, and you've kind of shot them down. You're hurting this before it's even out of the gate. Take the time listen to thier advice they're trying to help you.S o take a moment re-read this thread, take a breather, and think.
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Outer Sparta
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Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Outer Sparta » Thu Mar 04, 2021 11:54 am

Nova Vandalia wrote:
Kazakhstan 3 wrote: this thread was solely to raise support and address concerns where I see fit.


And how has this gone for you?

People offered helped rather nicely actually, and you've kind of shot them down. You're hurting this before it's even out of the gate. Take the time listen to thier advice they're trying to help you.S o take a moment re-read this thread, take a breather, and think.

They won't change their minds at all. The author just keeps on rehashing stuff like "my proposal's legal therefore it's good" and is simply using this space to bash communism.
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Westinor
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Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Westinor » Thu Mar 04, 2021 12:04 pm

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:As I've said many times I am not looking for criticism, this thread was solely to raise support and address concerns where I see fit. If you dislike my proposal that's fine, but many people do not. I say let the people decide. For that reason it will stay up. My personal theory is that some of you are shaking in your boots at the strength and uniqueness my proposal has and its ability to upturn precedent and rewrite the way this game is played.

Absolutely. I love this proposal because it's just that - an incredibly strong and unique piece of legislation that is completely ground-breaking in both quality and substance. This proposal will, quite literally, rip the roots of this twenty-year-old game up and out of the ground. I have absolutely no doubt that it was the writing (which brought me to tears) and not the incessant campaign TGs that brought each approving delegate to push this undeniably pristine, perfect, and innovative piece of work one step closer to quorum. This proposal should serve as a bellwether to the SC - it is a sign of new things to come, a golden age of prosperity, characterized by flawlessly written proposals championing the greatest of causes. The doubters will learn. Carry on, and do your great work.

Is this the kind of support you've been getting? You may be getting trolled. Call 1-800-WAP-HELP or visit the TNP Ministry of World Assembly Affairs today to receive genuine advice on how to write a proposal that has a chance of passing! A few prerequisites - bring an open-minded attitude, some paper and a pen. Maybe two pens. A lot of work needs to be done.
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Sodoran Alesia
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Left-wing Utopia

Postby Sodoran Alesia » Thu Mar 04, 2021 12:26 pm

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:As I've said many times I am not looking for criticism, this thread was solely to raise support and address concerns where I see fit.

With that attitude you'll get nowhere lol It is a widely accepted convention to draft proposals on the forum before submitting and receiving criticism and feedback and improving it. Your proposal has very little support and you have refused to listen to any criticism.

If you dislike my proposal that's fine, but many people do not. I say let the people decide. For that reason it will stay up.

lol, as of now your proposal is sitting at 40 approvals and needs 22 more with less than a day left. Unless your buddy decides to open his wallet it's not going to make quorum and will fail in queue and even so, have you paid attention to any of the people commenting here? Many of them are extremely influential in the WA with their respective regions. Your obstinance will only ensure this proposal gets curbstomped if it ever reaches vote. If it does, I predict you won't even get 5% support across the entire WA lol

My personal theory is that some of you are shaking in your boots at the strength and uniqueness my proposal has and its ability to upturn precedent and rewrite the way this game is played.


Ah yes, it's totally because your proposal is that good and not because you've ignored all feedback, have created an extremely short, shoddy proposal based on a pack of lies, and are so arrogant to think you've created the perfect proposal. You think you're gonna revolutionize the game? lol Talk about delusions of grandeur, but of course you anticommunists are all the same, if this fails it'll just be "tHe EbUl Wa AnD tCb StOpPeD mY pRoPoSaL!!!!"

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Kazakhstan 3
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Anarchy

Postby Kazakhstan 3 » Thu Mar 04, 2021 12:27 pm

Thanks for the advice I may confer in future propositions but I am satisfied with this one. Luckily, I have not been trolled as all communications with supporting parties has been distant and relatively infrequent. They have chosen to support this glorious idea on their own volition and have not attempted to reach out to me in any way. Thanks for your concern though, I do appreciate it.

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Kazakhstan 3
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Anarchy

Postby Kazakhstan 3 » Thu Mar 04, 2021 12:29 pm

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:Thanks for the advice I may confer in future propositions but I am satisfied with this one. Luckily, I have not been trolled as all communications with supporting parties has been distant and relatively infrequent. They have chosen to support this glorious idea on their own volition and have not attempted to reach out to me in any way. Thanks for your concern though, I do appreciate it.


Also this was a reference to an earlier post not the TCB dude who keeps acting cringe.

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Hiram Land
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Liberal Democratic Socialists

Postby Hiram Land » Thu Mar 04, 2021 12:32 pm

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:As I've said many times I am not looking for criticism, this thread was solely to raise support and address concerns where I see fit. If you dislike my proposal that's fine, but many people do not. I say let the people decide. For that reason it will stay up. My personal theory is that some of you are shaking in your boots at the strength and uniqueness my proposal has and its ability to upturn precedent and rewrite the way this game is played.

(fair warning, I am a bit brash with this response)
...this thread was solely to raise support and address concerns where I see fit.


Mate, all SC proposals, or WA proposals, which have gone through to a vote, have had some kind of discussion and advice from other players, without having the author being reluctant at best to accept criticisms. If you simply wanted to raise support towards your proposal, why did you bring it up to the "Security Council" sub-forum? That's where people go to make proposals and get constructive criticisms on their proposals.

I understand that you may be new to NationStates, or at least not have an understanding on how the World Assembly works. I'd say it's highly recommended that before you put a proposal to the people, that you look at other proposals that have successfully passed, and see how they were created and criticized. Otherwise, you make yourself out to be a fool for not looking at precedent.

I think that you need to take a hard look at your proposal and try again. At this point your proposal is already ruined thanks to you not conceding or compromising and listening to others. That's how NationStates (and indeed the entire roleplay aspect) works - with co-operation and understanding of past precedent.

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Kazakhstan 3
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Anarchy

Postby Kazakhstan 3 » Thu Mar 04, 2021 12:49 pm

From what I've seen SC threads intended to make a proposal are marked [draft] current proposals are unmarked or marked [proposed/proposal] and passed legislation is marked [passed] or unmarked. So no the SC thread is not for one purpose. While I appreciate the tone and kindness of your words I reject the implications behind them.

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Pluvie
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Pluvie » Thu Mar 04, 2021 1:14 pm

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:From what I've seen SC threads intended to make a proposal are marked [draft] current proposals are unmarked or marked [proposed/proposal] and passed legislation is marked [passed] or unmarked. So no the SC thread is not for one purpose. While I appreciate the tone and kindness of your words I reject the implications behind them.

Those are literally all the same thing in different stages of creation. The SC forums are in fact for the drafting of proposals and for getting responses to help one's writing. Pretty sure that's not disputable.
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Praeceps
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Democratic Socialists

Postby Praeceps » Thu Mar 04, 2021 1:16 pm

Is there really any point in engaging?

Hopefully, in 20 hours, this proposals fails to make quorum and we can go about our regular business. The author does not seem interested in receiving any criticism or feedback, seems like a waste of time to argue with them. If the proposal somehow does make it to vote, I imagine it'll be easily stomped.
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Kazakhstan 3
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Anarchy

Postby Kazakhstan 3 » Thu Mar 04, 2021 1:23 pm

There is no point, your efforts have been futile in thwarting this legislation. There is no doubt that the good people of NationStates will vote for my modest proposal. Unfortunately it has not spread as far as I would've hoped and many nations have not heard about it yet. Once this proposal reaches quorum they will hear our cause and join us in legions.
Last edited by Kazakhstan 3 on Thu Mar 04, 2021 1:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Wrapper
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Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Wrapper » Thu Mar 04, 2021 1:31 pm

Praeceps wrote:Is there really any point in engaging?

No.

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Sorianora
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Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Sorianora » Thu Mar 04, 2021 1:53 pm

Kazakhstan 3 wrote:There is no point, your efforts have been futile in thwarting this legislation. There is no doubt that the good people of NationStates will vote for my modest proposal. Unfortunately it has not spread as far as I would've hoped and many nations have not heard about it yet. Once this proposal reaches quorum they will hear our cause and join us in legions.

Ah yes our futile efforts. This proposal reminds me of the “condemn lily” proposal that recently reached the floor of the SC. Do you know what happened to that proposal? It was stomped down in voting. The author acted slightly similar to you, where they didn’t listen to the advice of the SC forum members, and, as a result, had their proposal stomped.

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