[DRAFT] Repeal: “Condemn The Black Hawks”

[ShrewLlamaLand]

Bhang Bhang Duc is right that you need to address the contents of the resolution you're looking to repeal. That's a fundamental enough principle that it's enshrined as Rule 2d.

(Note: this isn't a ruling on whether what you've drafted complies with Rule 2d, just emphasising that this is a requirement.)

My intention was that the first two clauses address the content of the resolution itself:

Acknowledging The Black Hawks as one of the most powerful raiding organisations in NationStates;

Recognising that this resolution was originally passed with the intention of condemning The Black Hawks for their vile acts;

I'm not really criticising the content of the resolution, because I don't necessarily disagree with the content of the resolution. Most of it remains relevant and correct: the problem isn't in the content, it's with how the region and greater NationStates community view the resolution.

The next three clauses address this:

Noting, however, that this condemnation is generally considered a "badge of honour" by those within the region;

Presuming the Security Council's rejection of raiding principles, symbolised by the recent election of a defender nation as WA Secretary-General;

Believing that raiding organisations do not deserve such recognition from this august body;

I will likely expand on those first two clauses to better address the resolution in my next draft... woah, what is this blasphemy - forum drafting?!

I mean if you want to give more reason to get raided when the time strikes, so be it.

I really don't think so.

[The Gilded Star]

I'll add - this thread isn't about the CCD, it's about Repealing TBH's condemnation.

If I'm not personally responsible, I don't see why you keep bringing up this old coup attempt that I was never involved in. The CCD didn't submit this proposal - I submitted this proposal.

Partly because you recently contributed to this standard:

My only problem is that submitting this resolution so soon after the election, and by a former member of CCD, is inevitably going to make it look like it's about CCD.

It probably seems this way because it is about the CCD. The author spent the better part of a year within the CCD, in that time we gathered a pretty good idea of how they operate.

Let me highlight the key parts especially:

I'll add - this thread isn't about the CCD.

It probably seems this way because it is about the CCD.

If VZ's proposal can be tied to CCD through Renk's relationship with them, then there's no reason why this proposal can't be tied to CCD through your relationship with them. And as a follow-up, if you can accuse Renk of committing tit-for-tat against the CCD, then there's no reason others can't accuse you of committing tit-for-tat for CCD.

It makes sense to say either both of them are about CCD or neither of them are about CCD- you'll be hard pressed to convince people that a specific circumstantial evidence that convicts one proposal of CCD-bias simultaneously acquits another of the same charge.

[ShrewLlamaLand]

If VZ's proposal can be tied to CCD through Renk's relationship with them, then there's no reason why this proposal can't be tied to CCD through your relationship with them. And as a follow-up, if you can accuse Renk of committing tit-for-tat against the CCD, then there's no reason others can't accuse you of committing tit-for-tat for CCD.

It makes sense to say either both of them are about CCD or neither of them are about CCD- you'll be hard pressed to convince people that a specific circumstantial evidence that convicts one proposal of CCD-bias simultaneously acquits another of the same charge.

Can you explain to me what TBH has apparently done to the CCD to make this a tit-for-tat proposal? If you're going to make this claim, at least state what we're apparently trying to get back at them for.

The CCD is a region with an active founder, and I'm sitting on close to 130 endorsements. TBH poses absolutely no threat to our regional security whatsoever.

If you're going to reference the Sec-Gen election, that a) has nothing to do with the CCD as a region, because a region can't run for Sec-Gen, and b) Trans Anarcho whatever Catgirls would probably be the least guilty out of the top five candidates regarding the rigging of that election.

[Praeceps]

I've nowhere made out that you are personally responsible for what the CCD does.

When you are the Delegate of the region in which the founder was involved in an attempted coup, expect that to be relevant when you propose a resolution denouncing those types of actions.

If I'm not personally responsible, I don't see why you keep bringing up this old coup attempt that I was never involved in. The CCD didn't submit this proposal - I submitted this proposal.

Hahahahahaha

This gave me a good laugh. Imagine CCD, repealing a condemnation. For raiding.

What exactly about this do you find funny>

Ah yes, the "old" coup revealed just a couple of months ago. Nice.

It's relevant due to your position in the region.

[Badivermeraed]

Hahahahahaha

This gave me a good laugh. Imagine CCD, repealing a condemnation. For raiding.

What exactly about this do you find funny>[/quote]

I just think it's funny how you say you've have this on your list for a while, but we all know you're butt hurt. This isn't even gonna get approved by a majority, I'd think.

[Kanglia]

Have never really understood why people try so hard to repeal these condemnations. Kind of just sounds petty judging from all of the other statements. TBH are and always have been pretty deserving of the recognition regardless of how you feel about them

[Blood Wine]

If VZ's proposal can be tied to CCD through Renk's relationship with them, then there's no reason why this proposal can't be tied to CCD through your relationship with them. And as a follow-up, if you can accuse Renk of committing tit-for-tat against the CCD, then there's no reason others can't accuse you of committing tit-for-tat for CCD.

It makes sense to say either both of them are about CCD or neither of them are about CCD- you'll be hard pressed to convince people that a specific circumstantial evidence that convicts one proposal of CCD-bias simultaneously acquits another of the same charge.

Can you explain to me what TBH has apparently done to the CCD to make this a tit-for-tat proposal? If you're going to make this claim, at least state what we're apparently trying to get back at them for.

The CCD is a region with an active founder, and I'm sitting on close to 130 endorsements. TBH poses absolutely no threat to our regional security whatsoever.

If you're going to reference the Sec-Gen election, that a) has nothing to do with the CCD as a region, because a region can't run for Sec-Gen, and b) Trans Anarcho whatever Catgirls would probably be the least guilty out of the top five candidates regarding the rigging of that election.

Helped beat you in the election, ergo tit for tat

[Anarchitaria]

If Jocospor can't recieve his badge of honor, then nobody gets any badge of honor!

[WayNeacTia]

I mean if you want to give more reason to get raided when the time strikes, so be it.

I really don't think so.

Then I wouldn't run around pissing in other peoples swimming pools. It has a nasty habit of coming back to bite you in the ass later down the road.

Just sayin'

[ShrewLlamaLand]

I really don't think so.

Then I wouldn't run around pissing in other peoples swimming pools. It has a nasty habit of coming back to bite you in the ass later down the road.

Just sayin'

Jocospor and I aren't going anywhere, and as long as we are present the CCD is under zero threat from raiders.

As long as NationStates stands, the CCD will stand.

[WayNeacTia]

Then I wouldn't run around pissing in other peoples swimming pools. It has a nasty habit of coming back to bite you in the ass later down the road.

Just sayin'

Jocospor and I aren't going anywhere, and as long as we are present the CCD is under zero threat from raiders.

As long as NationStates stands, the CCD will stand.

Pretty sure I've heard similar words from other people, until they weren't here anymore.

[Kanglia]

Then I wouldn't run around pissing in other peoples swimming pools. It has a nasty habit of coming back to bite you in the ass later down the road.

Just sayin'

Jocospor and I aren't going anywhere, and as long as we are present the CCD is under zero threat from raiders.

As long as NationStates stands, the CCD will stand.

Press X to doubt....

[The New California Republic]

Then I wouldn't run around pissing in other peoples swimming pools. It has a nasty habit of coming back to bite you in the ass later down the road.

Just sayin'

Jocospor and I aren't going anywhere, and as long as we are present the CCD is under zero threat from raiders.

As long as NationStates stands, the CCD will stand.

Again, I really don't understand your attitude:

It's just weird. They have decided to revel in being hated (as their dispatches and main region page show), but then are salty when that hate has actual consequences for them? Something doesn't quite square there...

[Praeceps]

Then I wouldn't run around pissing in other peoples swimming pools. It has a nasty habit of coming back to bite you in the ass later down the road.

Just sayin'

Jocospor and I aren't going anywhere, and as long as we are present the CCD is under zero threat from raiders.

As long as NationStates stands, the CCD will stand.

Do not overstate your importance. If Jocospor is gone you will hardly be sufficient to protect the CCD.

[ShrewLlamaLand]

Jocospor and I aren't going anywhere, and as long as we are present the CCD is under zero threat from raiders.

As long as NationStates stands, the CCD will stand.

Do not overstate your importance. If Jocospor is gone you will hardly be sufficient to protect the CCD.

Jocospor and I know each other in real life, it's never something we've tried to hide. If Jocospor ever decides to quit I'm sure we'll work something out.

[Agarntrop]

Support

[ShrewLlamaLand]

I have decided to refocus my Condemn TBH repeal attempt on SC#52 at first, given a repeal of this older proposal seems more popular among NSGP.

I note that, regardless of whether you believe TBH deserves a condemnation or not, SC#217 much better details TBH's "achievements", and a single condemn is apparently sufficient for every other nation/region condemned in the history of the Security Council.

[Aurum Raider]

A single condemn is apparently sufficient for every other nation/region condemned in the history of the Security Council.

TBR held two before being Deleted. Long-dead regions aside, though

SC#52 may be 'lacking' in comparison to SC#217, but that's more indicative of how good a writer The Stalker is, and all the things TBH accomplished in a 6-year span. There is very little material in either resolution that can be argued over - the majority of it is all factual.

TBH has raided hundreds of regions. They've raided hundreds of regions this month alone, and to deny this is a reach that any newcomer to R/D will call you out on. Your core - and only - argument is something that anybody remotely versed in R/D can categorically refute.

If you don't think that TBH deserves the condemnation, then you probably should spend a little more time reasoning out exactly why that is.

[Kanglia]

Shrew, TBH is more worthy of getting a third condemnation at some point than they are to lose even the less substantive condemnation of SC#52.

They're just really that good at raiding. It feels like this is much more of a ploy to complain about "the WA Elite" more if I'm being entirely honest with you.

[ShrewLlamaLand]

From my other thread:

The occupation of Asia is technically a raid, you put a bunch of nations into a region and took over the WA delegacy. This isn't a successful raid, because either you didn't even bother to try to successfully secure or refound the region, or the attempt has been prevented by "Liberate Asia" which you're apparently content to roll over and let past.

If TBH were really, truly "the super evil raiding region" like the two condemns apparently suggest, you'd be trying everything to stop the liberation, quorum raiding if you couldn't stop it otherwise, and refounding the region just to prove a point to the rest of NationStates.

[The Church of Satan]

If TBH were really, truly "the super evil raiding region" like the two condemns apparently suggest, you'd be trying everything to stop the liberation, quorum raiding if you couldn't stop it otherwise, and refounding the region just to prove a point to the rest of NationStates.

There's a difference between raiding and region crashing. TBH so far hasn't really cared much for region crashing as far as I can tell. Region crashing also isn't the norm.