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[DRAFT] Condemn The World Assembly Elite

A chamber dedicated to the dissemination of inter-regional peace and goodwill, via force if necessary.

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Trigori
Spokesperson
 
Posts: 125
Founded: Mar 17, 2014
Democratic Socialists

Postby Trigori » Sun Apr 12, 2020 11:22 am

Lord Dominator wrote:
Trigori wrote:I'll tell you. Raiding's fine. The proposal is stupid. I don't care what my WAD does. But raiding to kick off delegates supporting a WA proposal so it doesn't reach quorum is pretty damn greasy.

And...?

What "and?" I told you what I think. Conclude yourself.
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ShrewLlamaLand
Diplomat
 
Posts: 745
Founded: Nov 30, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby ShrewLlamaLand » Sun Apr 12, 2020 12:44 pm

Lord Dominator wrote:
ShrewLlamaLand wrote:The Black Hawks also participated in the later two raids. So much for apolitical. This was possibly as retaliation for my draft to "Repeal: Condemn The Black Hawks".

No, we screwed around with delegates because we don't like you, and are under no obligations to be apolitical like you seem to think we are.

It's okay buddy, there's no love lost there - we don't really like TBH much either. However, it's no secret that TBH holds absolutely no power over the CCD as we're impossible to raid :)

That said, as another nation has put it quite well, it's "pretty greasy" for you to attack unrelated regions just for their approval... especially when at that point I'd long conceeded it wouldn't make quorum on this attempt and I would have to resubmit at a later date.
ShrewLlamaLand
Confederation of Corrupt Dictators | Commission to the World Assembly

"The flag once raised will never fall!"

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Byrdonia
Secretary
 
Posts: 27
Founded: Jul 10, 2019
Iron Fist Consumerists

Postby Byrdonia » Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:04 pm

Honestly this is a new level of filth as curupt as a dictatorships voting season

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The New California Republic
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Posts: 27277
Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:17 pm

Frisbeeteria wrote:
ShrewLlamaLand wrote:We will not be silenced

Image

Gotta tilt at those WA windmills, they have invisible scripts hidden inside.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

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Druing
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Founded: Jan 16, 2020
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Druing » Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:23 pm

+1 support
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Sensorland
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Founded: Jun 30, 2013
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Sensorland » Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:30 pm

ShrewLlamaLand wrote:As people have likely noticed, this proposal "failed" to make quorum.

Why? A majority of GCRs: The Pacific, The North Pacific, The West Pacific, The East Pacific, and Balder raided small regions to force a change in their WA Delegate and remove their approval from this resolution.


Cool. Mission accomplished.
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Bowzin
Envoy
 
Posts: 258
Founded: Aug 13, 2018
Left-Leaning College State

Postby Bowzin » Sun Apr 12, 2020 1:38 pm

ShrewLlamaLand wrote:As people have likely noticed, this proposal "failed" to make quorum.

Why? A majority of GCRs: The Pacific, The North Pacific, The West Pacific, The East Pacific, and Balder raided small regions to force a change in their WA Delegate and remove their approval from this resolution.


A bunch of friends and allies got together to bash fash and fash related resolutions :( How evil of these GCRs to work to make NationStates a better place
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The Gilded Star
Envoy
 
Posts: 305
Founded: Nov 26, 2018
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby The Gilded Star » Sun Apr 12, 2020 2:58 pm

ShrewLlamaLand wrote:As people have likely noticed, this proposal "failed" to make quorum.

Why? A majority of GCRs: The Pacific, The North Pacific, The West Pacific, The East Pacific, and Balder raided small regions to force a change in their WA Delegate and remove their approval from this resolution.


Reenactment of this event in gif form:

Image

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Boda
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 409
Founded: Nov 14, 2019
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Boda » Sun Apr 12, 2020 3:14 pm

Fight back if you really think it's worth fighting for.
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ShrewLlamaLand
Diplomat
 
Posts: 745
Founded: Nov 30, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby ShrewLlamaLand » Sun Apr 12, 2020 3:15 pm

The proposal is now being re-drafted, and will be re-submitted in the near future.

Anyone with suggestions should feel free to contribute and I'll take everything on board, if there are no genuine suggestions I'm likely to re-submit it largely unchanged.
ShrewLlamaLand
Confederation of Corrupt Dictators | Commission to the World Assembly

"The flag once raised will never fall!"

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Wayneactia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1290
Founded: Aug 01, 2014
Corporate Bordello

Postby Wayneactia » Sun Apr 12, 2020 3:18 pm

ShrewLlamaLand wrote:The proposal is now being re-drafted, and will be re-submitted in the near future.

Anyone with suggestions should feel free to contribute and I'll take everything on board, if there are no genuine suggestions I'm likely to re-submit it largely unchanged.

Image

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ShrewLlamaLand
Diplomat
 
Posts: 745
Founded: Nov 30, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby ShrewLlamaLand » Sun Apr 12, 2020 3:21 pm

Wayneactia wrote:
ShrewLlamaLand wrote:The proposal is now being re-drafted, and will be re-submitted in the near future.

Anyone with suggestions should feel free to contribute and I'll take everything on board, if there are no genuine suggestions I'm likely to re-submit it largely unchanged.

Image

The last campaign telegram used exactly 871 telegram stamps after refunds. 87 cents.

I'm not really sure how far that's going to go towards filling up NationStates' coffers, but okay, sure.
ShrewLlamaLand
Confederation of Corrupt Dictators | Commission to the World Assembly

"The flag once raised will never fall!"

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The Gilded Star
Envoy
 
Posts: 305
Founded: Nov 26, 2018
Psychotic Dictatorship

Postby The Gilded Star » Sun Apr 12, 2020 3:34 pm

I'll take a shot at legit proposal appraisal:

ShrewLlamaLand wrote:Horrified at their continued use of slander, by falsely labelling nations as "fascists" or "Nazis" in order to discredit them if they dare question their oppressive regime;


As far as I know, the Security Council stays in-character, and can't reference OOC/real-world circumstances.

In-character, many of the regions "RP" as Fascist/Nazi regions, or even have Fascist or Nazi in their names:

https://www.nationstates.net/region=the ... st_nations
https://www.nationstates.net/region=nazi_europa
https://www.nationstates.net/region=uni ... ssociation
https://www.nationstates.net/region=the_new_iron_order
https://www.nationstates.net/region=the ... xis_powers
https://www.nationstates.net/region=fifth_empire
https://www.nationstates.net/region=the ... socialists
https://www.nationstates.net/region=the ... azi_empire

From an in-character point of view, how is calling self-identified Nazi and Fascist regions "Nazi and Fascist regions" slander?

Whatever the "WA Elite" OOCly accuse of being Nazi/Fascist shouldn't come into the equation since that's entirely OOC and thus has no place within the in-character Security Council.

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Mallorea and Riva
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 9386
Founded: Sep 29, 2010
Benevolent Dictatorship

Postby Mallorea and Riva » Sun Apr 12, 2020 4:40 pm

ShrewLlamaLand wrote:The proposal is now being re-drafted, and will be re-submitted in the near future.

Anyone with suggestions should feel free to contribute and I'll take everything on board, if there are no genuine suggestions I'm likely to re-submit it largely unchanged.

Here's a question/critique: what do you expect to happen after you resubmit? Assume that you manage to get it to vote. What odds do you give yourself for it passing?
Ideological Bulwark #253
Major of The Black Hawks
Retired Charter Nation: Political Affairs in Antarctic Oasis
Retired Colonel of DEN Central Command, now defunct
Former Delegate of The South Pacific, winner of TSP's "Best Dali" Award
Retired Secretary of Defense of Stargate
Terror of The Joint Systems Alliance
Mall Isaraider, son of Tram and Spartz, Brother of Jakker, Tal, and apparently Sev the treacherous bastard.
Frattastan quote of the month: Major benefit of securing the delegacy of Asia ASAP: this debate ends and I don't have to read any more of what Mall says.

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The New California Republic
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27277
Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Sun Apr 12, 2020 4:44 pm

Mallorea and Riva wrote:
ShrewLlamaLand wrote:The proposal is now being re-drafted, and will be re-submitted in the near future.

Anyone with suggestions should feel free to contribute and I'll take everything on board, if there are no genuine suggestions I'm likely to re-submit it largely unchanged.

Here's a question/critique: what do you expect to happen after you resubmit? Assume that you manage to get it to vote. What odds do you give yourself for it passing?

Tbh this along with the other stuff they have recently submitted in the SC is just for one or both of the following reasons: recruitment purposes and/or to vent anger at folk hating them actually having consequences (who would have thought? :roll: ).
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

NS Hitman
White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
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Lord Dominator
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5967
Founded: Dec 22, 2016
Corporate Police State

Postby Lord Dominator » Mon Apr 13, 2020 12:01 am

Trigori wrote:
Lord Dominator wrote:And...?

What "and?" I told you what I think. Conclude yourself.

Ah, so you're just calling us greasy and weren't attempting to convince me of anything. Gotcha.
ShrewLlamaLand wrote:
Lord Dominator wrote:No, we screwed around with delegates because we don't like you, and are under no obligations to be apolitical like you seem to think we are.

It's okay buddy, there's no love lost there - we don't really like TBH much either. However, it's no secret that TBH holds absolutely no power over the CCD as we're impossible to raid :)

That said, as another nation has put it quite well, it's "pretty greasy" for you to attack unrelated regions just for their approval... especially when at that point I'd long conceeded it wouldn't make quorum on this attempt and I would have to resubmit at a later date.

See general above points, you're attempting to call a nearly 15 year old organization dedicated to trashing random regions "greasy." Hardly a meaningful point.
Dee Vytherov-Skollvaldr | Forest | TBH Major and Council Member | WA Vizier | Ambassador to the WA

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Wayneactia
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1290
Founded: Aug 01, 2014
Corporate Bordello

Postby Wayneactia » Mon Apr 13, 2020 1:04 am

Mallorea and Riva wrote:
ShrewLlamaLand wrote:The proposal is now being re-drafted, and will be re-submitted in the near future.

Anyone with suggestions should feel free to contribute and I'll take everything on board, if there are no genuine suggestions I'm likely to re-submit it largely unchanged.

Here's a question/critique: what do you expect to happen after you resubmit? Assume that you manage to get it to vote. What odds do you give yourself for it passing?

I'd put better odds on you becoming pregnant :p

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Xoriet
Ambassador
 
Posts: 1739
Founded: Jun 08, 2012
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Xoriet » Mon Apr 13, 2020 7:31 am

ShrewLlamaLand wrote:The proposal is now being re-drafted, and will be re-submitted in the near future.

Anyone with suggestions should feel free to contribute and I'll take everything on board, if there are no genuine suggestions I'm likely to re-submit it largely unchanged.

Why would you submit something that will end in the resolution not even passing, should you get it to quorum at all given the circumstances? It's a waste of stamp money for a little publicity. Since you were begging the fash for funds not that long ago, I suppose you must have found a new source of revenue for stamps after the departure of Riakou. A conspiracy theory is hardly worth this level of effort.
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ShrewLlamaLand
Diplomat
 
Posts: 745
Founded: Nov 30, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby ShrewLlamaLand » Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:37 am

Mallorea and Riva wrote:
ShrewLlamaLand wrote:The proposal is now being re-drafted, and will be re-submitted in the near future.

Anyone with suggestions should feel free to contribute and I'll take everything on board, if there are no genuine suggestions I'm likely to re-submit it largely unchanged.

Here's a question/critique: what do you expect to happen after you resubmit? Assume that you manage to get it to vote. What odds do you give yourself for it passing?

It depends. I'm fairly confident we can get it to vote next time around, we were a single approval short this time before the raiding started.

At vote? Realistically pretty low, the WA Elite has too much influence and too many votes. However, at the very least we should raise awareness and gain support for real change within the World Assembly, for example reducing the inequality resulting from large Delegate votes.

The Gilded Star wrote:I'll take a shot at legit proposal appraisal:

ShrewLlamaLand wrote:Horrified at their continued use of slander, by falsely labelling nations as "fascists" or "Nazis" in order to discredit them if they dare question their oppressive regime;


As far as I know, the Security Council stays in-character, and can't reference OOC/real-world circumstances.

In-character, many of the regions "RP" as Fascist/Nazi regions, or even have Fascist or Nazi in their names:

-snip-

From an in-character point of view, how is calling self-identified Nazi and Fascist regions "Nazi and Fascist regions" slander?

Whatever the "WA Elite" OOCly accuse of being Nazi/Fascist shouldn't come into the equation since that's entirely OOC and thus has no place within the in-character Security Council.

This is referring to the many regions, including the CCD, that are in-game dictatorial but not fascist nations or regions.

Xoriet wrote:
ShrewLlamaLand wrote:The proposal is now being re-drafted, and will be re-submitted in the near future.

Anyone with suggestions should feel free to contribute and I'll take everything on board, if there are no genuine suggestions I'm likely to re-submit it largely unchanged.

Why would you submit something that will end in the resolution not even passing, should you get it to quorum at all given the circumstances? It's a waste of stamp money for a little publicity. Since you were begging the fash for funds not that long ago, I suppose you must have found a new source of revenue for stamps after the departure of Riakou. A conspiracy theory is hardly worth this level of effort.

87 cents. I'm also very confident we'll get to quorum next time around.

Plus, really, it's not much effort from me - I'll look over it and maybe re-draft, then submit the proposal and send out two telegrams. If that's going to get six major raiding organisations including four feeders, Balder and TBH, to waste their time temporarily knocking off Delegates instead of actually raiding, I'll take that :)
ShrewLlamaLand
Confederation of Corrupt Dictators | Commission to the World Assembly

"The flag once raised will never fall!"

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Agarntrop
Powerbroker
 
Posts: 7886
Founded: May 14, 2018
Inoffensive Centrist Democracy

Postby Agarntrop » Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:38 am

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Mallorea and Riva
Retired Moderator
 
Posts: 9386
Founded: Sep 29, 2010
Benevolent Dictatorship

Postby Mallorea and Riva » Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:58 am

ShrewLlamaLand wrote:
Mallorea and Riva wrote:Here's a question/critique: what do you expect to happen after you resubmit? Assume that you manage to get it to vote. What odds do you give yourself for it passing?

It depends. I'm fairly confident we can get it to vote next time around, we were a single approval short this time before the raiding started.

At vote? Realistically pretty low, the WA Elite has too much influence and too many votes. However, at the very least we should raise awareness and gain support for real change within the World Assembly, for example reducing the inequality resulting from large Delegate votes.

Do you think you're the first person to raise this issue? And do you think that this is the way to foster technical changes in the game? I'd encourage you to read the Technical forum. There have probably been a dozen threads about this very issue. Pass or fail, the resolution will have no impact on whether a technical change should or will be made.
Ideological Bulwark #253
Major of The Black Hawks
Retired Charter Nation: Political Affairs in Antarctic Oasis
Retired Colonel of DEN Central Command, now defunct
Former Delegate of The South Pacific, winner of TSP's "Best Dali" Award
Retired Secretary of Defense of Stargate
Terror of The Joint Systems Alliance
Mall Isaraider, son of Tram and Spartz, Brother of Jakker, Tal, and apparently Sev the treacherous bastard.
Frattastan quote of the month: Major benefit of securing the delegacy of Asia ASAP: this debate ends and I don't have to read any more of what Mall says.

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ShrewLlamaLand
Diplomat
 
Posts: 745
Founded: Nov 30, 2015
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby ShrewLlamaLand » Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:08 am

Mallorea and Riva wrote:
ShrewLlamaLand wrote:It depends. I'm fairly confident we can get it to vote next time around, we were a single approval short this time before the raiding started.

At vote? Realistically pretty low, the WA Elite has too much influence and too many votes. However, at the very least we should raise awareness and gain support for real change within the World Assembly, for example reducing the inequality resulting from large Delegate votes.

Do you think you're the first person to raise this issue? And do you think that this is the way to foster technical changes in the game? I'd encourage you to read the Technical forum. There have probably been a dozen threads about this very issue. Pass or fail, the resolution will have no impact on whether a technical change should or will be made.

Thanks for the tip, but believe me, I've seen the posts you're referring to. I've created one of those posts: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=482132

This is not the only reason I'm fighting for this to pass, but it's a major part. I am well aware that this resolution passing will not cause the current system to change, but it may very well create the change in public opinion that leads to it.
ShrewLlamaLand
Confederation of Corrupt Dictators | Commission to the World Assembly

"The flag once raised will never fall!"

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The New California Republic
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27277
Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:11 am

ShrewLlamaLand wrote:This is not the only reason I'm fighting for this to pass, but it's a major part. I am well aware that this resolution passing will not cause the current system to change, but it may very well create the change in public opinion that leads to it.

It won't. Pigs will fly before that happens. Don't kid yourself. Save yourself the trouble.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

NS Hitman
White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

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Lord Dominator
Negotiator
 
Posts: 5967
Founded: Dec 22, 2016
Corporate Police State

Postby Lord Dominator » Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:13 am

As the mods & admins will be happy to tell you, Technical changes are not decided by a popularity contest.
Dee Vytherov-Skollvaldr | Forest | TBH Major and Council Member | WA Vizier | Ambassador to the WA

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The New California Republic
Postmaster of the Fleet
 
Posts: 27277
Founded: Jun 06, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby The New California Republic » Mon Apr 13, 2020 9:14 am

Lord Dominator wrote:As the mods & admins will be happy to tell you, Technical changes are not decided by a popularity contest.

Indeed. It's ridiculous to assume an SC proposal will lead to technical changes.
Last edited by Sigmund Freud on Sat Sep 23, 1939 2:23 am, edited 999 times in total.

The Irradiated Wasteland of The New California Republic: depicting the expanded NCR, several years after the total victory over Caesar's Legion, and the annexation of New Vegas and its surrounding areas.

NS Hitman
White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on
||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

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