[DRAFT] Condemn ANTIFA

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

OOC: The same guy made a follow-up dispatch addressing this https://www.nationstates.net/page=dispatch/id=1197835

NS has a roughly even amount of people on all sides of the political spectrum, just go on NSG for that, WA voting bloc corruption does happen, and it’s common knowledge by now. The point is that the OP shouldn’t be too optimistic about this because the system has many flaws and biases against this proposal

OOC: If your policies didn't cause massive financial crises and stock market crashes every 3-7 years, prop up right-wing dictators and oligarchs in Latin America, and didn't exacerbate political corruption and the already severe gaps between incomes in Western countries or cause the deaths of tens of thousands in the U.S. alone every year due to a lack of access to healthcare for instance, then you would enjoy a far higher representation on the WA than you do in our timeline. My 50 cents here.

If you want to debate that, move somewhere else. Cuz if you don't it is threadjacking. But I would gladly counter you on discord or something if you want to debate that.

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpatia]

OOC: If your policies didn't cause massive financial crises and stock market crashes every 3-7 years, and didn't exacerbate political corruption and the already severe gaps between incomes in Western countries or cause the deaths of tens of thousands in the U.S. alone every year due to a lack of access to healthcare for instance, then you would enjoy a far higher representation on the WA than you do in our timeline. My 50 cents here.

OOC: Sigh It’s not about politics, it’s about voting blocs, I assume you know how they work, right?

The size of a political bloc, especially in elections and legislative structures, generally correlates with the popularity of their policies and schools of thought. If the ideas and doctrines of lets say for example a bloc of centre-leftists are reasonably popular and are not riddled with scandals and fallacies, then naturally, players would be more amenable towards their ideology and would eventually join them. If their ideology is unpopular on the other hand and generates a lot of controversy (Whether due to extremism and crankery, promotion of pseudoscience and factually incorrect information, abuse of power, corruption, a hostile and vitriolic community, etc), then players will begin to abandon their bloc and will either move towards the moderate center, or, if they are particularly disillusioned and pissed off, towards the right-wing. One may wield as much notoriety and clout as he/she wants, but if his/her ideas are hated and are just plain nonsense and do not match up with facts, then almost nobody will listen to said person, and therefore said bloc's influence will significantly diminish.

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

OOC: Sigh It’s not about politics, it’s about voting blocs, I assume you know how they work, right?

The size of a political bloc, especially in elections and legislative structures, generally correlates with the popularity of their policies and schools of thought. If the ideas and doctrines of lets say for example a bloc of centre-leftists are reasonably popular and are not riddled with scandals and fallacies, then naturally, players would be more amenable towards their ideology and would eventually join them. If their ideology is unpopular on the other hand and generates a lot of controversy (Whether due to extremism and crankery, promotion of pseudoscience and factually incorrect information, abuse of power, corruption, a hostile and vitriolic community, etc), then players will begin to abandon their bloc and will either move towards the moderate center, or, if they are particularly disillusioned and pissed off, towards the right-wing. One may wield as much notoriety and clout as he/she wants, but if his/her ideas are hated and are just plain nonsense and do not match up with facts, then almost nobody will listen to said person, and therefore said bloc's influence will significantly diminish.

Yes, and?

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpatia]

The size of a political bloc, especially in elections and legislative structures, generally correlates with the popularity of their policies and schools of thought. If the ideas and doctrines of lets say for example a bloc of centre-leftists are reasonably popular and are not riddled with scandals and fallacies, then naturally, players would be more amenable towards their ideology and would eventually join them. If their ideology is unpopular on the other hand and generates a lot of controversy (Whether due to extremism and crankery, promotion of pseudoscience and factually incorrect information, abuse of power, corruption, a hostile and vitriolic community, etc), then players will begin to abandon their bloc and will either move towards the moderate center, or, if they are particularly disillusioned and pissed off, towards the right-wing. One may wield as much notoriety and clout as he/she wants, but if his/her ideas are hated and are just plain nonsense and do not match up with facts, then almost nobody will listen to said person, and therefore said bloc's influence will significantly diminish.

Yes, and?

TL:DR, if you want to enlarge your bloc's size and representation, then expand your outreach and get players to actually like you and your policies, instead of wasting time and effort ranting about some sort of an insidious cabal that somehow "rigged" the World Assembly to be biased against conservative voices. Conspiracy theories won't win you any election, and even President Trump had to get the workers of the Rust Belt on his side and mobilize a large base of supporters in order to trounce Hillary Clinton in 2016.

[Lyrical International Brigade]

...ANTIFA is broken

On the contrary, it seems to be functioning quite well. I'm not aware of an instance in which Antifa lent its support to raids of merely libertarian or conservative regions that were not giving aid and comfort to fascist or other reactionary-right nations and sentiments. This is in open and acknowledged contrast to organizations such as TCB and The Red Fleet, both of which loudly and enthusiastically raid anything right of center as a matter of course (we are several varieties of dastardly pinkos, after all ), on their own and without Antifa cover.

Even if you want to point out that several regions have abandoned their Antifa membership in the past eight months or so (of which I see no mention here - now I'm doing your research for you, I guess. You're welcome!), as far as I'm aware that's entirely due to its continuing embrace of New Pacific Order troops and officers in operations against fascist regions. We're sorry to see them go, but one cannot deny the Pacific's inventiveness in that department. The loss of allied regions happened for gameplay reasons involving non-RL-political GCR-UCR drama and intrigue (your research on that can start here - and yes, I am well aware of the irony of my post on the next page of that thread vs. what I'm about here. C'est la vie. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ )

This proposal comes across as little more than salt. I'll be sure to pull it up the next time I have to cook for a dinner party. Seasoning is everything!

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpatia]

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

Be our guest. Provide screenshots and describe the ideologies of said accounts if applicable.

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

...ANTIFA is broken

On the contrary, it seems to be functioning quite well. I'm not aware of an instance in which Antifa lent its support to raids of merely libertarian or conservative regions that were not giving aid and comfort to fascist or other reactionary-right nations and sentiments. This is in open and acknowledged contrast to organizations such as TCB and The Red Fleet, both of which loudly and enthusiastically raid anything right of center as a matter of course (we are several varieties of dastardly pinkos, after all ), on their own and without Antifa cover.

Even if you want to point out that several regions have abandoned their Antifa membership in the past eight months or so (of which I see no mention here - now I'm doing your research for you, I guess. You're welcome!), as far as I'm aware that's entirely due to its continuing embrace of New Pacific Order troops and officers in operations against fascist regions. We're sorry to see them go, but one cannot deny the Pacific's inventiveness in that department. The loss of allied regions happened for gameplay reasons involving non-RL-political GCR-UCR drama and intrigue (your research on that can start here - and yes, I am well aware of the irony of my post on the next page of that thread vs. what I'm about here. C'est la vie. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ )

This proposal comes across as little more than salt. I'll be sure to pull it up the next time I have to cook for a dinner party. Seasoning is everything!

As you are part of the red fleet I would expect nothing less from you.

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

Be our guest. Provide screenshots and describe the ideologies of said accounts if applicable.

That's the plan

[Ransium]

Yes, and?

TL:DR, if you want to enlarge your bloc's size and representation, then expand your outreach and get players to actually like you and your policies, instead of wasting time and effort ranting about some sort of an insidious cabal that somehow "rigged" the World Assembly to be biased against conservative voices. Conspiracy theories won't win you any election, and even President Trump had to get the workers of the Rust Belt on his side and mobilize a large base of supporters in order to trounce Hillary Clinton in 2016.

Please make sure your arguing about NS politics and not RL politics, tangled though they maybe in this case. If this becomes a General thread, I’ll start handing out threadjacking warnings.

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

told ya

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpatia]

TL:DR, if you want to enlarge your bloc's size and representation, then expand your outreach and get players to actually like you and your policies, instead of wasting time and effort ranting about some sort of an insidious cabal that somehow "rigged" the World Assembly to be biased against conservative voices. Conspiracy theories won't win you any election, and even President Trump had to get the workers of the Rust Belt on his side and mobilize a large base of supporters in order to trounce Hillary Clinton in 2016.

Please make sure your arguing about NS politics and not RL politics, tangled though they maybe in this case. If this becomes a General thread, I’ll start handing out threadjacking warnings.

It was an OOC remark, not an IC dialogue. I always mark any IC speech I make with dialogue quotes. "EXAMPLE." Apologies for getting too offtopic.

[Ransium]

Please make sure your arguing about NS politics and not RL politics, tangled though they maybe in this case. If this becomes a General thread, I’ll start handing out threadjacking warnings.

It was an OOC remark, not an IC dialogue. I always mark any IC speech I make with dialogue quotes. "EXAMPLE." Apologies for getting too offtopic.

OOC/IC isn’t relevant for threadjacking. OOC doesn’t mean it’s okay to be off topic.

[Aureumterra]

Yes, and?

TL:DR, if you want to enlarge your bloc's size and representation, then expand your outreach and get players to actually like you and your policies, instead of wasting time and effort ranting about some sort of an insidious cabal that somehow "rigged" the World Assembly to be biased against conservative voices. Conspiracy theories won't win you any election, and even President Trump had to get the workers of the Rust Belt on his side and mobilize a large base of supporters in order to trounce Hillary Clinton in 2016.

I don’t think you understand, the WA works in a way that not every members vote is equal, the more endorsements you have, your vote counts as more. This is why the vote of a feeder delegate can change the total balance by a hundreds or more votes

[LiberNovusAmericae]

Yes, and?

TL:DR, if you want to enlarge your bloc's size and representation, then expand your outreach and get players to actually like you and your policies, instead of wasting time and effort ranting about some sort of an insidious cabal that somehow "rigged" the World Assembly to be biased against conservative voices. Conspiracy theories won't win you any election, and even President Trump had to get the workers of the Rust Belt on his side and mobilize a large base of supporters in order to trounce Hillary Clinton in 2016.

The WA works by granting large amounts of power to delegates with high amounts of endorsements, and a good chunk of them are feeder delegates. Many feeders and GCRs are undemocratic, which means that even if a philosophy is moderately popular here, it probably cannot gain very much influence. Unless someone can build a super large UCR or get the feeders on their side, there is no hope of even being mildly influential as a voting block in the WA. Since those delegates are mostly left-leaning, and they're mostly not elected, I don't see how even a popular right-wing coalition can become influential here in the WA.

[WayNeacTia]

OOC: Well man, you never know

Trust me, we know. A snowball in hell has a 10000% chance of surviving longer than this rant.

OOC: Maybe the point of this resolution is to find those left wing voting blocs? Who knows? Maybe this is part of a much larger operation? Maybe not? Maybe there is a whole thing behind this that you dont understand. And it doesnt matter. Like what I said before, this is going to make it to the voting floor. If it doesnt pass, oh well.

Find left wing voting blocs? That is the best one I have heard yet. As for not understanding. Antifa raided a region you are affiliated with, so you are pissed off. As for making it to the voting floor? I will guarantee you, even with the best campaign in history, this will never come close to making it to vote.

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

Ground breaking evidence. This should be rich.

Here's the thing. If you ant to play nazi, that is your prerogative. Just expect that you will get a lot of blow back for doing so. As for evidence, you had better come up with some very quickly, as most of the SC regulars will be here soon, and trust me, you won't win.

[LiberNovusAmericae]

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

If those are NS accounts being hacked into, and you have genuine evidence that proves it, you probably should file a GHR.

[Aureumterra]

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

…

I don’t think you can hack into an NS account(?)

[Rossiyaana]

told ya

If you’re talking about the Lady Morrighan and Cicero thing, then let me stop you there. it has no bearing over this resolution, Antifa as a whole wasn’t involved in the scandal. Only one member, and the evidence of that is weak. And if Antifa was engaged in doxxing and other things like it and you have concrete evidence of it, take it to the police or whoever is responsible. But real life illegal activity isn’t for the Security Council to debate.

[LiberNovusAmericae]

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

…

I don’t think you can hack into an NS account(?)

People have done it before, and it is a severe offense. It can get a player insta-DOS. If they have done that on NS, information about it should be in a report to the moderators, not in a condemnation proposal.

Edit:

Nation Hijacking: Stealing someone else's nation by gaining their password is a very serious offense and likely to result in a permanent ban from the site. Note the section on shared accounts for when an account is shared.

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpatia]

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

…

I don’t think you can hack into an NS account(?)

If you somehow manage to brute-force someone else's password, assuming you have the technical expertise and tools to do so, then yes, you could theoretically hack someone else's nation on this site. But doing so is a flagrant violation of this community's rules and is a one-way ticket to DEAT.

[Dekks]

If you want to condemn antifa why not condemn every region or organization that raids? Otherwise what's this obsession with condemning antifa?

[LiberNovusAmericae]

…

I don’t think you can hack into an NS account(?)

If you somehow manage to brute-force someone else's password, assuming you have the technical expertise and tools to do so, then yes, you could theoretically hack someone else's nation on this site. But doing so is a flagrant violation of this community's rules and is a one-way ticket to DEAT.

Probably a one way ticket to Delete-on-Sight. I quoted the rule above.

[Xoriet]

Even if you want to point out that several regions have abandoned their Antifa membership in the past eight months or so (of which I see no mention here - now I'm doing your research for you, I guess. You're welcome!), as far as I'm aware that's entirely due to its continuing embrace of New Pacific Order troops and officers in operations against fascist regions. We're sorry to see them go, but one cannot deny the Pacific's inventiveness in that department.

The Disney Princess Brigade of the Legio Pacifica will strike again!

And yes, as the military commander of The Pacific and a member of the Senate, I can confirm that the New Pacific Order works alongside Antifa for a just common cause, but is not a member.

[Fauxia]

If you want to condemn antifa why not condemn every region or organization that raids? Otherwise what's this obsession with condemning antifa?

All the ones that do it well get condemnations anyway...

This Assembly will never feel bad about fascists getting raided. Nor should they.