[DRAFT] Condemn ANTIFA

[Aureumterra]

OOC: Well man, you never know

Trust me, we know. A snowball in hell has a 10000% chance of surviving longer than this rant.

OOC: Maybe the point of this resolution is to find those left wing voting blocs? Who knows? Maybe this is part of a much larger operation? Maybe not? Maybe there is a whole thing behind this that you dont understand. And it doesnt matter. Like what I said before, this is going to make it to the voting floor. If it doesnt pass, oh well.

Find left wing voting blocs? That is the best one I have heard yet. As for not understanding. Antifa raided a region you are affiliated with, so you are pissed off. As for making it to the voting floor? I will guarantee you, even with the best campaign in history, this will never come close to making it to vote.

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

Ground breaking evidence. This should be rich.

Here's the thing. If you ant to play nazi, that is your prerogative. Just expect that you will get a lot of blow back for doing so. As for evidence, you had better come up with some very quickly, as most of the SC regulars will be here soon, and trust me, you won't win.

OOC: I haven’t seen the “SC Regulars” ripping it to shreds yet, it just won’t pass due to voting blocs

[WayNeacTia]

OOC: I haven’t seen the “SC Regulars” ripping it to shreds yet, it just won’t pass due to voting blocs

Just wait....

[Wallenburg]

I am going to say this now. I know the chances of this passing are slim but I am still going to do it. If you don't have any criticism to push on me or information about more regions Antifa has raided then just leave this forum. Please.

Alternatively, you can leave the forum instead of everyone other than you.

[Nouveau Quebecois]

This draft needs a lot more meat on its bones. Give us more information and professional wording.

[Lord Dominator]

The Security Council;

Recognizing the extreme wrongdoing a region or nation must commit to receive condemnation;

Extreme is one word.

Seeing that one region has such qualities of wrongdoing, Antifa;

False

Noting that Antifa is not a region on it's own, but an alliance of regions, including The Leftist Assembly and The Communist Bloc, and the Pacific;

Innacurate, as noted by others

Proof of their intentions to destroy fascism is implanted everywhere and is well known.

Irrelevant, and doesn't help your argument to boot.

Understanding that this is not the worst part of Antifa,

But it is a bad thing apparently. Your language betrays you I think author.

as the worst part is unjust raids against non fascist regions

Appaled at Antifa for raiding, and provoking regions that are not fascist

Proof would be nice.

just for their affiliation or the belief in freedom of speech, including

:
I wonder about your assertion to a shared belief in free speech, given the usual use as a defense against being censured by others for being a fascist...

a. The Free Commonwealth A new region, destroyed for their hate of Antifa. Absolutely not fascist.
b. Northern Redlands Libertarian-Right of Center region, raided for no reason found.
c. Make America Great Again Conservative region, presumably raided for the wrong assumption that they are fascist

Speculation with no given proof.

Highlighting that these regions did nothing wrong to deserve a raid, other than disagree with principles of ANTIFA

The principles of fighting fascism?

Noticing that Antifa attacks ALL rightist regions as to fit the leftist and communist agenda of Antifa

False. Otherwise, proof.

Hereby condemns Antifa, a threat to peace in NationStates

Only to those we generally don't want on site anyways.

---

OOC: I haven’t seen the “SC Regulars” ripping it to shreds yet, it just won’t pass due to voting blocs

Just wait....

Are we good now?

[Kavagrad]

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

Go right ahead and prove it. Antifa's been active for years, if they were doing any of this the mods would've shut Antifa down a long time ago.

I'm sure you know far better than them though, huh?

[Marxist Germany]

This Assembly will never feel bad about fascists getting raided. Nor should they.

OOC: Yes because fascists are not humans who deserve some decency? Raiding regions just because they're fascist is a ludicrous reason. You're dehumanising fascists, which is quite hypocritical considering you're trying to stop fascists from dehumanising minorities.

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

If those are NS accounts being hacked into, and you have genuine evidence that proves it, you probably should file a GHR.

Right yes, let me compile all my evidence though.

[Czechoslovakia and Zakarpatia]

This Assembly will never feel bad about fascists getting raided. Nor should they.

OOC: Yes because fascists are not humans who deserve some decency? Raiding regions just because they're fascist is a ludicrous reason. You're dehumanising fascists, which is quite hypocritical considering you're trying to stop fascists from dehumanising minorities.

OOC: Trying to appease them resulted in my nation being brutally enslaved and over 50 million people dying in a bloody war that lasted for nearly 6 years. I am most definitely not going to pity those who have butchered my nation like a animal back in 1938 and performed unspeakable acts of cruelty on my people.

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

told ya

If you’re talking about the Lady Morrighan and Cicero thing, then let me stop you there. it has no bearing over this resolution, Antifa as a whole wasn’t involved in the scandal. Only one member, and the evidence of that is weak. And if Antifa was engaged in doxxing and other things like it and you have concrete evidence of it, take it to the police or whoever is responsible. But real life illegal activity isn’t for the Security Council to debate.

It is if Antifa as a region condones, partakes, and approves it

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

OOC: Yes because fascists are not humans who deserve some decency? Raiding regions just because they're fascist is a ludicrous reason. You're dehumanising fascists, which is quite hypocritical considering you're trying to stop fascists from dehumanising minorities.

OOC: Trying to appease them resulted in my nation being brutally enslaved and over 50 million people dying in a bloody war that lasted for nearly 6 years. I am most definitely not going to pity those who have butchered my nation like a animal back in 1938 and performed unspeakable acts of cruelty on my people.

Y'know, communists did even worse. But that's besides the point. I hate fascists, but I believe it is their right to have their beliefs.

[Kavagrad]

This Assembly will never feel bad about fascists getting raided. Nor should they.

OOC: Yes because fascists are not humans who deserve some decency? Raiding regions just because they're fascist is a ludicrous reason. You're dehumanising fascists, which is quite hypocritical considering you're trying to stop fascists from dehumanising minorities.

Oh yes, because raiding a fascist region and wanting their trash ideology off of our platform is dehumanisation. So eager to play the victim card, aren't we?

If they don't want to be raided, maybe they should, y'know, not be fascists. Being an appeaser isn't enough.

[Wallenburg]

This Assembly will never feel bad about fascists getting raided. Nor should they.

OOC: Yes because fascists are not humans who deserve some decency? Raiding regions just because they're fascist is a ludicrous reason. You're dehumanising fascists, which is quite hypocritical considering you're trying to stop fascists from dehumanising minorities.

Raiding fascist regions is dehumanizing fascists now. Very cool comparing everyday R/D to real life genocide.

[Gagium]

This Assembly will never feel bad about fascists getting raided. Nor should they.

OOC: Yes because fascists are not humans who deserve some decency? Raiding regions just because they're fascist is a ludicrous reason. You're dehumanising fascists, which is quite hypocritical considering you're trying to stop fascists from dehumanising minorities.

Are you saying the feature of raiding in NationStates is 'dehumanizing' towards those who get raided?

Jesus. Don't raid in NationStates guys, it's going to cause you to shoot fascists out on the streets!

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

OOC: Yes because fascists are not humans who deserve some decency? Raiding regions just because they're fascist is a ludicrous reason. You're dehumanising fascists, which is quite hypocritical considering you're trying to stop fascists from dehumanising minorities.

Raiding fascist regions is dehumanizing fascists now. Very cool comparing everyday R/D to real life genocide.

I agree, it is not dehumanizing. Fascists are not dehumanized per se on this site. More so, swept under the rug. Ignored, laughed at, attacked constantly, etc.

[Kavagrad]

Raiding fascist regions is dehumanizing fascists now. Very cool comparing everyday R/D to real life genocide.

I agree, it is not dehumanizing. Fascists are not dehumanized per se on this site. More so, swept under the rug. Ignored, laughed at, attacked constantly, etc.

I agree, this is bad.

They shouldn't be ignored by anyone. Attacks from all sides are preferable.

OOC: Yes because fascists are not humans who deserve some decency? Raiding regions just because they're fascist is a ludicrous reason. You're dehumanising fascists, which is quite hypocritical considering you're trying to stop fascists from dehumanising minorities.

Are you saying the feature of raiding in NationStates is 'dehumanizing' towards those who get raided?

Jesus. Don't raid in NationStates guys, it's going to cause you to shoot fascists out on the streets!

Didn't expect to see you defending Antifa today, but I guess I'll hold my nose

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

To clarify, I am not against raiding.

[Kavagrad]

To clarify, I am not against raiding.

Except when it's against fascists, apparently.

You're letting your mask slip, pal.

[Israeli Empiratic Commonwealth]

To clarify, I am not against raiding.

Except when it's against fascists, apparently.

You're letting your mask slip, pal.

No, I am only angry at Antifa for raiding non fascist regions and masquerading them as fascists who need to be destroyed. If you want evidence of this I provided 3 regions.

[Gagium]

I agree, it is not dehumanizing. Fascists are not dehumanized per se on this site. More so, swept under the rug. Ignored, laughed at, attacked constantly, etc.

I agree, this is bad.

They shouldn't be ignored by anyone. Attacks from all sides are preferable.

Are you saying the feature of raiding in NationStates is 'dehumanizing' towards those who get raided?

Jesus. Don't raid in NationStates guys, it's going to cause you to shoot fascists out on the streets!

Didn't expect to see you defending Antifa today, but I guess I'll hold my nose

Defending Antifa? I wouldn't call it that, just going against the idea that raiding is dehumanizing people whos' ideology..dehumanizes.

I do want to see what OP's evidence is that ANTIFA doxxes and hacks into players' accounts. Interestingly enough though, earlier a fascist claimed to have hacked into an apparent ANTIFA operative's accounts and 'claimed' them.

[Rossiyaana]

Except when it's against fascists, apparently.

You're letting your mask slip, pal.

No, I am only angry at Antifa for raiding non fascist regions and masquerading them as fascists who need to be destroyed. If you want evidence of this I provided 3 regions.

All of the examples people provide to prove Antifa raid regions who aren’t fascist at either indeed fascist, another ideology that has elements of totalitarianism and fascism, or had a large community of fascists.

That’s besides the point though. This seems to be you trying to get revenge on Antifa for raiding some of your friends. If you’re so appalled by raiding (which you’ve already said you’re not) then don’t do it yourself.

[Marxist Germany]

OOC: Yes because fascists are not humans who deserve some decency? Raiding regions just because they're fascist is a ludicrous reason. You're dehumanising fascists, which is quite hypocritical considering you're trying to stop fascists from dehumanising minorities.

Are you saying the feature of raiding in NationStates is 'dehumanizing' towards those who get raided?

Jesus. Don't raid in NationStates guys, it's going to cause you to shoot fascists out on the streets!

OOC:That's not what I meant, the problem is that people are encouraging others to attack and destroy fascist regions, without even getting condemned because its seen as a heroic action.

[Rossiyaana]

Are you saying the feature of raiding in NationStates is 'dehumanizing' towards those who get raided?

Jesus. Don't raid in NationStates guys, it's going to cause you to shoot fascists out on the streets!

OOC:That's not what I meant, the problem is that people are encouraging others to attack and destroy fascist regions, without even getting condemned because its seen as a heroic action.

Well if a majority of NS thought Antifas actions were reprehensible, we’d know it, because a condemnation would’ve passed by now. Obviously they don’t. It’s all about majority. Sorry you’re not in the majority, but most people think that Antifa shouldn’t be condemned, so it’s just a waste of time to repeatedly bring this resolution up.

Edit: Or (as seen below) don’t think the resolutions you and others have written are good enough resolutions to be worthy of passing.

[Praeceps]

3 pages in about 4 hours? Well, this will be interesting.

Welcome to the Security Council. Thanks for posting your resolution here prior to submission for feedback.

Unfortunately, there are a litany of errors present in not only the resolution but also your actions in this thread. I've seen some other SC regulars looking in this forum so forgive me if by the time I post, someone else has already posted them.

The Security Council;

Recognizing the extreme wrongdoing a region or nation must commit to receive condemnation;

Wrongdoing seems like an easy word choice but is awkward. I would recommend trying to fill it out more.

Seeing that one region has such qualities of wrongdoing, Antifa;

Once again, wrongdoing seems out of place here for word choice. You could also simplify the phrase, as "that one region" and "Antifa" are
Noting that Antifa is not a region on it's own, but an alliance of regions, including The Leftist Assembly and The Communist Bloc, and the Pacific;
Awkward phrasing here, you are saying that a region is not a region, it would be more accurate to say that the Antifa region is representative of an organization of regions (and individuals). As I saw someone here say, you have only handpicked a few regions here to list as members.

I have a pretty good guess that you selected these regions because it would make Antifa look bad to parts of the World Assembly instead of listing regions such as KGB. However, if it should be noted that certain regions are participating in the organization, explain why it should be noted that those regions are worthy of being noted. As it stands, this is a rather poor attempt to to subtly cast Antifa in a worse light.

As well, as Xoriet stated, The Pacific is not a member of Antifa.

Proof of their intentions to destroy fascism is implanted everywhere and is well known.

Yes... Why are you telling us this if it is "everywhere" and "well known"? Not a fan of the word "implanted" here—seems redundant.

This clause makes it seem that it is bad that Antifa is trying to destroy fascism, if it is bad that Antifa is trying to destroy fascism, say it.

I will warn you that saying that will most likely result in strong opposition from some I know would otherwise support a condemnation. An individual who will most likely be seen as fascist, working to condemn Antifa, will go over very poorly.

Understanding that this is not the worst part of Antifa, as the worst part is unjust raids against non fascist regions

Alright, you're definitely saying that attempting to destroy fascism is bad. Why is attempting to destroy fascism bad?

For the latter, you will need to be providing proof—å lot of it. There are very few raider regions which receive condemnations. Look at TBH's and LWU's condemnation. Now if Antifa is a raider region (and I am not saying they are, you still need to provide proof of it), do they reach the level of TBH and LWU? You don't need to look up those condemnations. I can tell you, if Antifa was doing as much raiding as they were, they would have already been condemned and by someone with far more experience than you.

Appaled at Antifa for raiding, and provoking regions that are not fascist just for their affiliation or the belief in freedom of speech, including:

a. The Free Commonwealth A new region, destroyed for their hate of Antifa. Absolutely not fascist.
b. Northern Redlands Libertarian-Right of Center region, raided for no reason found.
c. Make America Great Again Conservative region, presumably raided for the wrong assumption that they are fascist

Parts of this clause are a rather bold lie. Antifa lists on all of their raids/occupations the reason for which the region was targeted. Having a false statement is not acceptable in a resolution, especially is spotted during drafting. You should be looking at the reasons for Antifa targeting those regions and then providing a rebuttal in the condemnation to those reasons listed.

The "absolutely not fascist" sentence for the first region, is redundant and should be removed.

I'm rather stunned, you are bringing up a list of 3 regions and saying that Antifa is merit of condemnation because of three regions (even though you have yet to refute Antifa's statement on those regions being fascist). Now, even if they are not-fascist regions (and I am yet to be convinced they are), this isn't a condemnation. It's a participation ribbon. If this condemnation passes, I'm sure there will be a long line up of organizations who have taken over three regions, or spend a week taking over three, wanting their condemnation.

Highlighting that these regions did nothing wrong to deserve a raid, other than disagree with principles of ANTIFA

Again, as previously stated, you are going to be needing to refute Antifa's claims for justification. Other, this is just attempting to lie to the Security Council.

Noticing that Antifa attacks ALL rightist regions as to fit the leftist and communist agenda of Antifa

So much lack of support in your resolution... Again, we need evidence! You have a systemic issue throughout your resolution of lacking support. You need support or your resolution will not last.

*sighs*

Once again, we need evidence that Antifa is a "threat to peace". I have read your entire resolution but this is the first time that I am hearing anything about how they are a thread to peace.

Overall, your resolution needs to be redone and identify where you have evidence and where you don't. As in most places you don't have evidence, you will need to bring that.

I don't know all the regions ANTIFA has taken over, if anyone knows some more non fascist regions that's be much appreciated

The onus isn't on us to do your research, you need to do it yourself. And given the considerable lack of evidence, there will need to be a lot more research on your end...

Then you need to do your own research before drafting a proposal. This comes across as incredibly lazy, as it's not the job of others to fill in YOUR proposal. You're the one who wants to put this out there, that means YOU are responsible for the information and research, not anyone else.

I am working on it, how about you look at other parts of the resolution and continue saying how lazy I am.

You should be "working on it" before presenting it here. Otherwise, you will receive the criticism you are receiving.

I am going to say this now. I know the chances of this passing are slim but I am still going to do it. If you don't have any criticism to push on me or information about more regions Antifa has raided then just leave this forum. Please.

Most people just try to claim thread ownership. Nice to see someone being more ambitious and claim subforum ownership. Guess what, there's no thread ownership in this subforum unlike other subforums. And there is NO subforum ownership anywhere on the NationStates forum. This thread is used for debating the resolution, attempting to get people to leave, shows a disregard for free speech which is rather frowned upon.

OOC: People know Antifa is broken, they’re too influential to have this passed though, they pull the strings on many left wing voting blocs

OOC: Maybe the point of this resolution is to find those left wing voting blocs? Who knows? Maybe this is part of a much larger operation? Maybe not? Maybe there is a whole thing behind this that you dont understand. And it doesnt matter. Like what I said before, this is going to make it to the voting floor. If it doesnt pass, oh well.

I'm sorry, are you actually trying to get this resolution passed? Or are you just trying to waste the Security Council's time? Don't pretend to have a secret master plan which you will state pre-emptively in the event that this resolution fails at vote. That's just attempting to deflect from failure if it does. Be honest and forthcoming. Your attempts at a diabolical evil plan are not appreciated.

Ok I have groundbreaking evidence coming in from friends on discord about Antifa doxing and hacking into player's accounts. Stand-by.

Instead of ominously saying you have evidence and not posting it, do not say anything and get the evidence first. Doxxing and hacking are serious accusations and if done in-game are acted upon my moderation. If this is done off-site, it typically results in blacklisting of those organizations/individuals. However, not only is doxxing and hacking serious, making false statements that others are doing so is serious as well. This lack of evidence and attempting to say whatever you want and wanting us to take you on your word is not acceptable in the Security Council

Be our guest. Provide screenshots and describe the ideologies of said accounts if applicable.

That's the plan

Again, stop fueling a fire without proof.

If those are NS accounts being hacked into, and you have genuine evidence that proves it, you probably should file a GHR.

Right yes, let me compile all my evidence though.

Again, compile your evidence and then file a GHR. Stop making nebulous claims in this forum as to OOC behaviour of individuals in the region you are attempting to condemn to attempt to cast them in a bad light without any evidence to such. The only person that it is making look bad here is you.

I should note I have not commented on whether Antifa is deserving of condemnation or not, whether they are or they are not, it is clear to see this resolution is not worthy of one. Additionally, you are not helping your case by attempting to claim subforum ownership, an unwillingness for free speech, a lack of research, and casting serious OOC accusations without evidence.

EDIT: Ninja'ed by half a dozen people...

[Gagium]

Are you saying the feature of raiding in NationStates is 'dehumanizing' towards those who get raided?

Jesus. Don't raid in NationStates guys, it's going to cause you to shoot fascists out on the streets!

OOC:That's not what I meant, the problem is that people are encouraging others to attack and destroy fascist regions, without even getting condemned because its seen as a heroic action.

I don't see the problem with attacking and destroying fascist regions, or attacking and destroying communist regions. Or any combination thereof. I see attacking regions of either ideologies as good in my book, though I'm not sure whether you can express much 'heroism' on NationStates by raiding.