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[DRAFT] Commend Cobalt Network

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Aureumterra
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[DRAFT] Commend Cobalt Network

Postby Aureumterra » Tue Dec 25, 2018 12:24 pm

The Security Council,

RECOGNIZING the prevalence and importance of international interaction in the Nationstates community

FURTHER RECOGNIZING that international interaction is now a core aspect of Nationstates as a whole

APPLAUDING Cobalt Network for its efforts in maintaining multiple international events

PRAISING Cobalt Network for its efforts to teach and guide new nations in field of war, diplomacy, etc.

LAUDING Cobalt Network for creating a safe environment for all nations participating in international events through their established constitution, which contains strict rules for all of their events, intended for the safety of nations

IDENTIFYING Cobalt Network as one of the most influential regions dedicated to international interaction, as evident by the many international events they’ve overseen

DISTINGUISHING Cobalt Network for having an active, democratic region

FURTHER DISTINGUISHING Cobalt Network’s efforts to maintain free elections for each officer position every 100 days

Herbey commends Cobalt Network
This one had too little content for a proper resolution, but was legal
The Security Council,

RECOGNIZING the prevalence and importance of international interaction in the Nationstates community

FURTHER RECOGNIZING that international interaction is now a core aspect of Nationstates as a whole

APPLAUDING Cobalt Network for its efforts in maintaining multiple international events

PRAISING Cobalt Network for its efforts to teach and guide new nations in field of war, diplomacy, etc.

LAUDING Cobalt Network for creating a safe environment for all nations participating in international events

IDENTIFYING Cobalt Network as one of the most influential regions dedicated to international interaction

DISTINGUISHING Cobalt Network for having an active, democratic region

Herbey commends Cobalt Network

This one referring to roleplay, and I’ve changed it to fit with SC rules
The Security Council,

RECOGNIZING the prevalence and importance of roleplay in the Nationstates community

FURTHER RECOGNIZING that roleplay is now a core aspect of Nationstates as a whole

APPLAUDING Cobalt Network for its efforts in maintaining multiple roleplays in Portal to the Multiverse

PRAISING Cobalt Network for its efforts to teach and guide new roleplayers

LAUDING Cobalt Network for creating a safe environment for all rolepalyers in their roleplay threads

IDENTIFYING Cobalt Network as one of the most influential roleplay regions, especially on the forums

DISTINGUISHING Cobalt Network for having an active, democratic region

FURTHER DISTINGUISHING Cobalt Network for having an active offsite community

Herbey commends Cobalt Network
Last edited by Aureumterra on Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:08 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Postby Kuriko » Tue Dec 25, 2018 12:49 pm

Role play is against SC rules, so you need to remove that from your draft. Which leaves it with pretty much nothing.
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Postby Kostrorleauny » Tue Dec 25, 2018 12:58 pm

Kuriko wrote:Role play is against SC rules, so you need to remove that from your draft. Which leaves it with pretty much nothing.

Adding onto what Kuriko has said, there’s nothing wrong with having a Security Council resolution, mainly in the form of a commendation or condemnation, that deals with the RolePlay aspect of the game. In fact, there’s a shortage of those that have been passed in the past; and it’s probably because of how GamePlay-centric the Security Council can be at times.

That being said, you can’t refer to it being RolePlay. If you want to talk on the side about the actions you’re commending/condemning them for being actions that were taken in-character then that’s perfectly fine. You just can’t outright say that in the proposal itself for it to remain legal, and that’s where this proposal doesn’t make the cut.

Every in-character action, I believe, will have two perceptions: the understanding will vary, but usually it’s an in-character perception and then an out-of-character perception. Here, the understanding is that what they did in the context of in-character RolePlay is what you’re saying should get them commended. There’s a better way to word that whilist keeping the proposal itself in-character and therefore legal. You need to stimulate that out-of-character perception that “Hey, this is a commend on a RolePlayer” without outright stating that in the proposal draft itself.

Nothing wrong with giving your drafts context, but what’s written is what’s written and as it stands you won’t get far. If you’d find it helpful, go ahead and shoot me a telegram or something like that. There’s a possibility that if you give me enough information about the nominee I can better help you fit things from an in-character prospective as far as the proposal itself is concerned.

Anyway, just looking to help out.
Last edited by Kostrorleauny on Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Aureumterra » Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:00 pm

Kostrorleauny wrote:
Kuriko wrote:Role play is against SC rules, so you need to remove that from your draft. Which leaves it with pretty much nothing.

Adding onto what Kuriko has said, there’s nothing wrong with having a Security Council resolution, mainly in the form of a commendation or condemnation, that deals with the RolePlay aspect of the game. In fact, there’s a shortage of those that have been passed in the past; and it’s probably because of how GamePlay-centric the Security Council can be at times.

That being said, you can’t refer to it being RolePlay. If you want to talk on the side about the actions you’re commending/condemning them for being actions that were taken in-character then that’s perfectly fine. You just can’t outright say that in the proposal itself for it to remain legal, and that’s where his proposal doesn’t make the cut.

Every in-character action, I believe, will have two perceptions: the understanding will vary, but usually it’s an in-character perception and then an out-or-character perception. Here, the understanding is that what they did in the context of in-character RolePlay is what you’re saying should get them commended. There’s a better way to word that whilist keeping the proposal itself in-character. You need to stimulate that out-of-character perception that “Hey, this is a commend on a RolePlayer” without outright stating that in the proposal draft itself.

Nothing wrong with giving your drafts context, but what’s written is what’s written and as it stands you won’t far. If you’d find it helpful, go ahead and shoot me a telegram or something like that. There’s a possibility that if you give me enough information about the nominee I can better help you fit things from an in-character prospective as far as the proposal itself is concerned.

Anyway, just looking to help out.

OOC: The commendation is based on their contributions and influence on the Roleplay community, so is there a way I can make that an in character remark?
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Postby Aureumterra » Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:04 pm

Kuriko wrote:Role play is against SC rules, so you need to remove that from your draft. Which leaves it with pretty much nothing.

OOC: This is not a commendation based on Roleplay actions themselves, but of the region’s contributions to the community, mainly the RP community
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Postby Kostrorleauny » Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:13 pm

Aureumterra wrote:OOC: The commendation is based on their contributions and influence on the Roleplay community, so is there a way I can make that an in character remark?

In a word, yes. There is always a way, never allow anyone to tell you differently of what can and cannot be done as it relates back to the Security Council and its workings. But, if you’re serious about wanting this to become a legal proposal then I’d be lying if I were to tell you that some work wasn’t needed here.

Apologies, I must have misunderstood. Or, Kuriko did, and so I went off that. You’re not wanting a commendation for their actions undertaken as a part of a RolePlay, you’re seeking a commendation for them as it relates to their contributions to RolePlay communities.

That can be made in-character, if you clause-build correctly and add a bit more meat to the actual proposal itself so we have grounds to even begin considering a commendation for them on. Here’s what I have chosen to address, however:

“DISTINGUISHING Cobalt Network for having an active, democratic region

FURTHER DISTINGUISHING Cobalt Network for having an active offsite community”

^^^ While it’s nice to say they have an active community that supports them, these two clauses alone do NOT give voters a reasoning to commend Cobalt Network.

The reason being, if you grow a region properly and with a bit of luck essentially anyone can host an active community. That’s nothing extraordinary, or at least not something that’s going to warrant a commendation taking passage. If we take those two lines out, you’re not left with much quite frankly. That’s why I suggest you add a lot more meat into this draft.
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Postby Aureumterra » Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:23 pm

Kostrorleauny wrote:
Aureumterra wrote:OOC: The commendation is based on their contributions and influence on the Roleplay community, so is there a way I can make that an in character remark?

In a word, yes. There is always a way, never allow anyone to tell you differently of what can and cannot be done as it relates back to the Security Council and its workings. But, if you’re serious about wanting this to become a legal proposal then I’d be lying if I were to tell you that some work wasn’t needed here.

That’s what drafts are for :p

Kostrorleauny wrote:Apologies, I must have misunderstood. Or, Kuriko did, and so I went off that. You’re not wanting a commendation for their actions undertaken as a part of a RolePlay, you’re seeking a commendation for them as it relates to their contributions to RolePlay communities.

Exactly so, I believe Kuriko misunderstood/misread the draft
Also, reading over the rules again, the closest I could find was to not refer to NS as a game outright

Kostrorleauny wrote:That can be made in-character, if you clause-build correctly and add a bit more meat to the actual proposal itself so we have grounds to even begin considering a commendation for them on. Here’s what I have chosen to address, however:

“DISTINGUISHING Cobalt Network for having an active, democratic region

FURTHER DISTINGUISHING Cobalt Network for having an active offsite community”

^^^ While it’s nice to say they have an active community that supports them, these two clauses alone do NOT give voters a reasoning to commend Cobalt Network.

I’ll take away the last clause, the first one mentions their successful democracy, which is a nice add-on to their contributions

Kostrorleauny wrote:The reason being, if you grow a region properly and with a bit of luck essentially anyone can host an active community. That’s nothing extraordinary, or at least not something that’s going to warrant a commendation taking passage. If we take those two lines out, you’re not left with much quite frankly. That’s why I suggest you add a lot more meat into this draft.

Again, The rules don’t mention a ban on referring to Roleplay as such
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Postby Aureumterra » Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:35 pm

Alright, made edits to fit with rules, thanks for the feedback!
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Postby Kuriko » Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:35 pm

I didn't misread the draft, I was pointing out that the word roleplay is an illegal term. I wasn't able to go into details or else I would've gotten yelled at by my dad for being on my phone during Christmas dinner. Thanks for the help Kostrorleauny, appreciate it!
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Postby Kostrorleauny » Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:36 pm

Aureumterra wrote:That’s what drafts are for :p

Right you are, hence why in my first post I offered my assistance via telegram or other social medium, as the ultimate goal is to better the drafting proposal.


Again, The rules don’t mention a ban on referring to Roleplay as such


^^^ You’re still going to want to be able to connect the dots from the perspective of the World Assembly, if you’re wanting nations to vote for it. In order to have members selecting the “For” button option on proposals they must be given appropriate reasoning to do as such and support a commendation. For that to happen, should this be the case somewhere down the line, you’ll need to make them believe that Cobalt Network’s contributions to RolePlaying communities is substantial enough to deserve the recognition and honour that comes with holding a badge of commendation.

With the current draft, you’re not doing this. I can anticipate that much, as the dots don’t really seem too connected here and it prevents the proposal from flowing naturally with reasoning others will understand enough to support it. It goes back to, add more meat to back up your claims that the nominee warrants a commendation by this body.
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Postby Aureumterra » Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:51 pm

Kostrorleauny wrote:^^^ You’re still going to want to be able to connect the dots from the perspective of the World Assembly, if you’re wanting nations to vote for it. In order to have members selecting the “For” button option on proposals they must be given appropriate reasoning to do as such and support a commendation. For that to happen, should this be the case somewhere down the line, you’ll need to make them believe that Cobalt Network’s contributions to RolePlaying communities is substantial enough to deserve the recognition and honour that comes with holding a badge of commendation.

With the current draft, you’re not doing this. I can anticipate that much, as the dots don’t really seem too connected here and it prevents the proposal from flowing naturally with reasoning others will understand enough to support it. It goes back to, add more meat to back up your claims that the nominee warrants a commendation by this body.

I changed it to fit with rules, I feel like this is looking legal (far from a resolution, I’m brainstorming stuff to add, I’ll probably contact a few regional officers from CN for more clauses)
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Postby Aureumterra » Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:58 pm

Another question: Is there a way I can make P2TM RPs IC?
Last edited by Aureumterra on Tue Dec 25, 2018 1:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Kostrorleauny » Tue Dec 25, 2018 2:02 pm

Aureumterra wrote:I changed it to fit with rules, I feel like this is looking legal (far from a resolution, I’m brainstorming stuff to add, I’ll probably contact a few regional officers from CN for more clauses)

Sounds good.

If you’re looking for a place to start doing this, here is what I would recommend:

Take these two clauses in your current draft, for example -

“LAUDING Cobalt Network for creating a safe environment for all nations participating in international events

IDENTIFYING Calt Network as one of the most influential regions dedicated to international interaction.”

^^^ Okay, now ask yourself the following questions:

1.) How has Cobalt Network created a safe environment for all nations participating in international events?

<<< It’s a feel good statement to say that, but unless it’s factual then it’s more or less the same as you saying “in my opinion” Colbat Network has created a safe environment for all nations participating in international events. If you said it that way, it would not make a good proposal and not actively achieve the end-goal you seek. So what I’d do is elaborate on that, maybe showcase some international events for which Cobalt Network presided over had some role in hosting that supposed “safe environment”. If you can cite specific examples rather than general terms you’ll have a better time getting others behind you and believing the same.

2.) How has Cobalt Network dedicated themselves to international interaction?

<<< Just as with the last question, the same applies. As you brainstorm, you’ll want to stack up examples and references that you can point towards to validate your claims that go with why the nominee deserves a commendation. It allows others to better understand, and since others re the ones voting on the proposal if it were to reach quorum in the future then it’s paramount they understand why they should support what you want them to.

Hope this helps! :)
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Postby Aureumterra » Tue Dec 25, 2018 2:58 pm

Kostrorleauny wrote:1.) How has Cobalt Network created a safe environment for all nations participating in international events?

<<< It’s a feel good statement to say that, but unless it’s factual then it’s more or less the same as you saying “in my opinion” Colbat Network has created a safe environment for all nations participating in international events. If you said it that way, it would not make a good proposal and not actively achieve the end-goal you seek. So what I’d do is elaborate on that, maybe showcase some international events for which Cobalt Network presided over had some role in hosting that supposed “safe environment”. If you can cite specific examples rather than general terms you’ll have a better time getting others behind you and believing the same.

Expanded on Clause 3, still working on the rest
Last edited by Aureumterra on Tue Dec 25, 2018 2:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Aureumterra » Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:08 pm

UPDATE: Added a clause, Still brainstorming more things
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Postby Tinhampton » Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:21 pm

This is your brain on highly delayed coffee! :P
Aureumterra wrote:The Security Council,

RECOGNIZING the prevalence and importance of international interaction in the Nationstates community

FURTHER RECOGNIZING that international interaction is now a core aspect of Nationstates as a whole Could the above two clauses not be merged?

APPLAUDING Cobalt Network for its efforts in maintaining multiple international events A lot of regions have organised events. What makes CN stand out in these regards?

PRAISING Cobalt Network for its efforts to teach and guide new nations in field of war, diplomacy, etc. How does it do this? What renowned community members have led this effort? Why is the region of Cobalt Network cowering behind a password through which nobody can enter?

LAUDING Cobalt Network for creating a safe environment for all nations participating in international events through their established constitution, which contains strict rules These are the six basic rules that the CN use in all of their RPs, which I certainly would not call "strict" and are standard fare for many regions: No Out Of Character in the In Character forum; No godmodding; No using multiple accounts; Word of OPs are law, unless there is good reason to debate in a civil manner; You will be kicked after [time period] of IC inactivity; Don’t be toxic for all of their events, intended for the safety of nations

IDENTIFYING Cobalt Network as one of the most influential regions dedicated to international interaction, as evident by the many international events they’ve overseen What makes this region more worthy of a Commendation than someplace like Atlantian Oceania or the New Warsaw Pact, both of which have made a much more obvious contribution to international RP than CN ever has?

DISTINGUISHING Cobalt Network for having an active, democratic region A lot of regions have active democracies. What makes CN stand out in these regards?

FURTHER DISTINGUISHING Cobalt Network’s efforts to maintain free elections for each officer position every 100 days A lot of regions have elections. What makes CN stand out in these regards?

Herbey commends Cobalt Network

Let's face it, this one is just your second draft, except with a lot more cheap, plasticy stocking-filler within it that will inevitably be binned within a week after everybody's bored with it. If you don't want to put in the proper effort and RESEARCH required to create a truly top-quality resolution, I'm afraid you may have to scrap this!
Last edited by Tinhampton on Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:52 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Kostrorleauny » Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:24 pm

Aureumterra wrote:UPDATE: Added a clause, Still brainstorming more things

You still need to get more specific examples - “many international events they’ve overseen” isn’t anything providing clarity, it’s a general, vague statement. I don’t mean to be hard of you or sound like I’m nitpicking on every minor detail, but if you want success as an author you’re going to need provide specified historical examples.

Take my commendation draft if you need inspiration, as I don’t mean to brag but people have said this far it’s very well-written and in this case I think the same could apply to you. See how under I say what my nominee has done, but the bullet point a list that denotes a handful of notable examples applying to what I’m saying? It gives those statements legitimacy, making the clauses stronger.

Use that to your advantage, build clause upon clause and don’t be afraid to dive into relevant details. If you must, go back and do more research so you have more background knowledge on the topic. You want to make this read like a statement, and by the end of it have voters convinced they should support it. Right now, there’s still too little substance; and I don’t mean to harp on you about it all day long.
Last edited by Kostrorleauny on Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Aureumterra » Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:29 pm

Kostrorleauny wrote:
Aureumterra wrote:UPDATE: Added a clause, Still brainstorming more things

You still need to get more specific examples - “many international events they’ve overseen” isn’t anything g providing clarity, it’s a general, vague statement. I don’t mean to be hard of you or sound like I’m nitpicking on every minor detail, but if you want success as an author you’re going to need provide specified historical examples.

Take my commendation draft if you need inspiration, as I don’t mean to brag but people have said this far it’s very well-written and in this case I think the same could apply to you. See how under I say what my nominee has done, but the bullet point a list that denotes a handful of notable examples applying to what I’m saying? It gives those statements legitimacy, making the clauses stronger.

Use that to your advantage, build clause upon clause and don’t be afraid to dive into relevant details. If you must, go back and do more research so you have more background knowledge on the topic. You want to make this read like a statement, and by the end of it have voters convinced they should support it. Right now, there’s still too little substance; and I don’t mean to harp on you about it all day long.

Tinhampton wrote:Let's face it, this one is just your second draft, except with a lot more cheap, plasticy stocking-filler within it that will inevitably be binned within a week after everybody's bored with it. If you don't want to put in the proper effort and RESEARCH required to create a truly top-quality resolution, I'm afraid you may have to scrap this!

I have been in contact with CN Officers, you can expect much more in the clauses once I have enough material, however, I have done my research on CN
Last edited by Aureumterra on Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Kostrorleauny » Tue Dec 25, 2018 6:38 pm

Aureumterra wrote:I have been in contact with CN Officers, you can expect much more in the clauses once I have enough material, however, I have done my research on CN

That’s good, once again not trying to be rude. I think Tinhampton was a bit more blunt about things, but that’s to be expected when you’re in the drafting phases of a proposal. What you want from these is honest feedback, and that’s what you’re getting.

As I said before, if you’d like any assistance with clause-building or taking the information you’ve gathered from research and putting it into words then don’t be afraid to just shoot me a telegram. My door is open.
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Postby Aureumterra » Wed Dec 26, 2018 8:37 am

Tinhampton wrote:APPLAUDING Cobalt Network for its efforts in maintaining multiple international events A lot of regions have organised events. What makes CN stand out in these regards?

I think you misunderstood this part, this is mainly referring to Roleplay without outright stating it
Tinhampton wrote:PRAISING Cobalt Network for its efforts to teach and guide new nations in field of war, diplomacy, etc. How does it do this? What renowned community members have led this effort? Why is the region of Cobalt Network cowering behind a password through which nobody can enter?

Because they have a recruitment thread where nations need to submit applications to be accepted
Tinhampton wrote:LAUDING Cobalt Network for creating a safe environment for all nations participating in international events through their established constitution, which contains strict rules These are the six basic rules that the CN use in all of their RPs, which I certainly would not call "strict" and are standard fare for many regions: No Out Of Character in the In Character forum; No godmodding; No using multiple accounts; Word of OPs are law, unless there is good reason to debate in a civil manner; You will be kicked after [time period] of IC inactivity; Don’t be toxic for all of their events, intended for the safety of nations

Doing some more research and talking to officers, I have discovered other guidelines and rules on their recruitment hub
Tinhampton wrote:Let's face it, this one is just your second draft, except with a lot more cheap, plasticy stocking-filler within it that will inevitably be binned within a week after everybody's bored with it. If you don't want to put in the proper effort and RESEARCH required to create a truly top-quality resolution, I'm afraid you may have to scrap this!

I know the research required for a quality proposal, I take part in SC discussion and see proposals good and bad, keep in mind this is the early drafting stage, and CN is undoubtedly one of the most influential regions for P2TM RPs, I see no reason to scrap this
Last edited by Aureumterra on Wed Dec 26, 2018 8:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Gagium » Wed Dec 26, 2018 8:40 am

Currently against. While Cobalt Network definitely seems like a fine region, I don't see anything special about their region commendable from the proposal.
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Postby Aureumterra » Wed Dec 26, 2018 8:42 am

Gagium wrote:Currently against. While Cobalt Network definitely seems like a fine region, I don't see anything special about their region commendable from the proposal.

Surprising, you haven’t heard of CN before this? (or are you never active on P2TM?)
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Postby Gagium » Wed Dec 26, 2018 12:03 pm

Aureumterra wrote:
Gagium wrote:Currently against. While Cobalt Network definitely seems like a fine region, I don't see anything special about their region commendable from the proposal.

Surprising, you haven’t heard of CN before this? (or are you never active on P2TM?)

Not active on P2TM, though I have heard of them. Like I said, they seem like fine guys, and they've definitely contributed a lot to the community and roleplay on said subforum, but I don't believe that's commendable.
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Postby The Palmetto » Wed Dec 26, 2018 1:55 pm

I agree with what Gagium said. It's a nice community that's made some good RPs and some minor contributions to P2TM, but at the end of the day we haven't done anything extraordinary compared to other NS regions. We're a nice, relatively small community, and even if we don't deserve an official commendation, I feel we're fine without it. It would probably blow up our egos anyways

With that said, even if I disagree, I'm glad you think our region deserves to be commended up in the WA. Thanks for putting time and effort into this, it's the thought that counts.
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