[PROPOSED] Repeal "Commend 10000 Islands"

[Phoenix King]

Repeal "Commend 10000 Islands"

A resolution to repeal a previously passed resolution

Category: Repeal | Resolution: SC#30 | Proposed by: Phoenix King




Description: The Security Council,

ACKNOWLEDGING that the region of 10000 Islands has failed to live up to the great things to which it was commended for, and that their contributions are no longer exceptional;

RECOGNIZING that the only achievements that 10000 Islands has continued to fulfill was being the historical "firsts" of things, feats that are impossible to be undone, but provide no value to the contemporary world;


AWARE that TITO has failed in their mission to seek peace for all innocent regions;

NOTING that TITO has not liberated a region of over 20 raiders in several years;

FURTHER NOTING that TITO, 10000 Islands's "defending" organization, does nothing to serve the interests of defenderdom by combating the true raiders;

DISAPPOINTED by the conduct of TITO officers and their frequent beratings of other defender groups, directly leading to a rift in defender unity, leaving native communities to take the brunt of the consequences;

UNDERSTANDING that 10000 Islands no longer lives up to the expectations that were outlined in its commendation, and actually now serves a negative purpose in the world, hindering current defender efforts, WA efforts, and the glorious political area of the world, and is therefore unworthy of a commendation;

THEREFORE, the Security Council repeals the Commendation of 10000 Islands.

Co-authored by: Rovegia, Grenvi, and Everyone in NationStates

[Grenvi]

Strongly in favor of this resolution. 10000 Islands has not been able to live up to its commendation, and it should be repealed until such a time that 10000 Islands becomes truly commend-worthy.

[SkyDip]

Because this was submitted before it was posted here, I will be voting against this should it come to vote. Just an FYI.

Retroactively repealing a Commendation for things that are no longer exceptional is silly. The point being, those things were exceptional at one point. Just because they aren't now doesn't invalidate the Commendation. If you were to argue that XKI has done something to invalidate those things, you might have a solid argument. As-is, you are simply stating that those achievements are no longer exceptional simply because the passage of time has proved so.

[Milograd]

This worked out so well when Topid tried it.

[Alberrta]

I fully support.

Because this was submitted before it was posted here, I will be voting against this should it come to vote. Just an FYI.

Retroactively repealing a Commendation for things that are no longer exceptional is silly. The point being, those things were exceptional at one point. Just because they aren't now doesn't invalidate the Commendation. If you were to argue that XKI has done something to invalidate those things, you might have a solid argument. As-is, you are simply stating that those achievements are no longer exceptional simply because the passage of time has proved so.

But your repeal of Quote of the Day's commendation wasn't silly?

[Weed]

This worked out so well when Topid tried it.

Hey, the one I tried to repeal is gone now.

But yes, know that if they fought so hard to defend such a poorly written commendation that was clearly below WA standards, this is dead in the water. For good reason too, as SkyDip said the point is they were impressive at one point, it wouldn't matter even if grub closed the region.
So even if you could prove TITO is not as impressive it wouldn't make a good case, IMO. That'd be a hard case to make though, like them or not, TITO is definitely impressive in my book.

[Grenvi]

Because this was submitted before it was posted here, I will be voting against this should it come to vote. Just an FYI.

Retroactively repealing a Commendation for things that are no longer exceptional is silly. The point being, those things were exceptional at one point. Just because they aren't now doesn't invalidate the Commendation. If you were to argue that XKI has done something to invalidate those things, you might have a solid argument. As-is, you are simply stating that those achievements are no longer exceptional simply because the passage of time has proved so.

Incorrect. 10000 Islands has proactively done things to ensure that they are no longer worthy of what they were commended for. What they were commended for is still exceptional, but 10000 islands has taken it upon themselves to counteract the facets of their region that they were commended for. TITO has proactively committed actions to hurt native communities. The entirety of the region acts with indolence and is no longer commend-worthy.

[SkyDip]

But your repeal of Quote of the Day's commendation wasn't silly?

Course not - that passed, obviously, proving that point beyond a shadow of a doubt.

Incorrect. 10000 Islands has proactively done things to ensure that they are no longer worthy of what they were commended for. What they were commended for is still exceptional, but 10000 islands has taken it upon themselves to counteract the facets of their region that they were commended for. TITO has proactively committed actions to hurt native communities. The entirety of the region acts with indolence and is no longer commend-worthy.

Then you would do well to mention those things. Or you would have, if you had the ability to edit this.

Topid and I both tried this. This is (and I'm biased, obviously) the worst of the three drafts I've seen.

[Grenvi]

Topid and I both tried this. This is (and I'm biased, obviously) the worst of the three drafts I've seen.

It is the effect and implication that matters.

[SkyDip]

It is the effect and implication that matters.

So what - you're submitting a proposal whose intent is not to repeal the Commendation but to make a point? Seems like a waste of queue space. I'm not against the idea on the whole, but this doesn't contain any persuasive or overly-pertinent arguments, IMHO.

[Weed]

I reiterate that I have never authored a repeal of this resolution, or supported one either. Stop saying that! XD

[SkyDip]

I reiterate that I have never authored a repeal of this resolution, or supported one either. Stop saying that! XD

Damn. I even went back to check that you didn't support mine. You are correct.

[Phoenix King]

Because this was submitted before it was posted here, I will be voting against this should it come to vote. Just an FYI.

Oh come on. Get over yourself.

[SkyDip]

Because this was submitted before it was posted here, I will be voting against this should it come to vote. Just an FYI.

Oh come on. Get over yourself.

Why even post it if we can't offer suggestions/edits to what is - outside of the submitting/co-author opinions - a weak and/or silly attempt?

[Weed]

*chuckles*

Seeing as the two nations endorsing you were founded, joined the WA, and then endorsed you and only you, I'd assume you multied to submit this. Very very bad form, mate. You are in TSP for goodness sakes, it takes 10 minutes to get endorsements if you just ask for them. No need to commit such a gross violation of rules.

[Frisbeeteria]

I'd assume you multied to submit this. Very very bad form, mate.

Occam's Razor isn't always correct, just usually. Let's not leap to any (potentially flamebaiting) conclusions, please. You might want to consider that even experienced players can create new nations as easily as newbies.

[Vladisvok Destino]

*chuckles*

Seeing as the two nations endorsing you were founded, joined the WA, and then endorsed you and only you, I'd assume you multied to submit this. Very very bad form, mate. You are in TSP for goodness sakes, it takes 10 minutes to get endorsements if you just ask for them. No need to commit such a gross violation of rules.

This post is all the funnier when you consider it's probably one of yours behind it. Then again it's UDL so anything is possible

[Weed]

*chuckles*

Seeing as the two nations endorsing you were founded, joined the WA, and then endorsed you and only you, I'd assume you multied to submit this. Very very bad form, mate. You are in TSP for goodness sakes, it takes 10 minutes to get endorsements if you just ask for them. No need to commit such a gross violation of rules.

This post is all the funnier when you consider it's probably one of yours behind it. Then again it's UDL so anything is possible

One of my WAs? My WA is on this nation. So, definitely not me. As I've said repeatedly in this thread: I don't support the repeal of this resolution. Plus, it is against the rules to post in a thread with more than one nation to confuse people, so if it was me I'd be called out by a mod. All in all, not a very informed post.

As to if this a UDL member or not, I see nothing to support that theory. Though there are certainly some I wouldn't put the text of the resolution itself past, most in the UDL are well-versed enough to know that submit before post is a no-go. If I had to guess based on post style, my suspect is a defender that is neither UDL or TITO. XD But, that's just idle speculation. Though the shady endorsement business leaves me guessing a noob from any camp is also likely.

Also, while I'm posting @Mods: I remember a ruling a long long time ago that I couldn't list "The Security Council", my region of SC authors, as a co-author because it made the proposal seem like it had more validity than it did, or could be seen as a trick to make a proposal look more widely supported. Would not, "Everyone in NationStates" as a co-author be similar? [/ruleslawyer]

[Land filled with People]

Okay, let's break this down...

ACKNOWLEDGING that the region of 10000 Islands has failed to live up to the great things to which it was commended for, and that their contributions are no longer exceptional;

I'll address the first part of this later (in the spoiler), as for the second - 'exceptional' is rather subjective...I would say it was rather exceptional to be the largest UCR with over 3000 nations, to have the delegate with the highest endorsement count, to have an active and vibrant community etc etc. but then I'm biased too

RECOGNIZING that the only achievements that 10000 Islands has continued to fulfill was being the historical "firsts" of things, feats that are impossible to be undone, but provide no value to the contemporary world;

I'll address this later as well (in the spoiler), nevertheless establishing an economy/regional currency is something that multiple regions have implemented and expanded upon further than XKI has into the contemporary world.

AWARE that TITO has failed in their mission to seek peace for all innocent regions;

Proof?

NOTING that TITO has not liberated a region of over 20 raiders in several years;

Proof?

FURTHER NOTING that TITO, 10000 Islands's "defending" organization, does nothing to serve the interests of defenderdom by combating the true raiders;

Proof? And who is defined as a 'true raider'?

DISAPPOINTED by the conduct of TITO officers and their frequent beratings of other defender groups, directly leading to a rift in defender unity, leaving native communities to take the brunt of the consequences;

Emphasis mine. AFAIK the only 'defender group' we 'berate' is UDL. We have good relations with and work well with other defender groups, isn't that by nature 'defender unity'?

UNDERSTANDING that 10000 Islands no longer lives up to the expectations that were outlined in its commendation, and actually now serves a negative purpose in the world, hindering current defender efforts, WA efforts, and the glorious political area of the world, and is therefore unworthy of a commendation;

Description: The World Assembly Security Council,

RECOGNIZING the region 10000 Islands as a pioneer of what are now vastly used components of regional government and organization, being one of the first regions to:
• create its own private forum,
• design a constitution for its members to obey in order to promote regional unity and better organize regional activity,
• introduce a regional economy,
• and establish a regional currency, thereby pushing the boundaries of the seemingly limited world of NationStates and setting numerous conventions for many regions that formed later;

We still do/have all of these things.

ADMIRING the fact that 10000 Islands has managed to accomplish the difficult task of maintaining a population of over 200 nations for seven years,

We have still managed this, in fact it will be coming to 9 years.

ACKNOWLEDGING the existence of TITO, the Ten Thousand Islands Treaty Organization, a defender army based out of 10000 Islands,

TITO still exists.

APPLAUDING TITO's home region, 10000 Islands, for initiating over 1200 successful defensive interventions (through the mobilization of TITO-involved WA nations) to protect hundreds of regions from raider invasion,

TITO continues to initiate 'defensive interventions' and has now completed over 1865 (from the WFE)

AWARE that TITO also keeps the World Assembly from being overwhelmed with liberation requests, as their goal of "seek[ing] to live in peace with all regions in NationStates, but [refusing to] back down to those that wish to impose their will on innocent regions" shares the fundamental principles of the World Assembly Security Council, a body "dedicated to the dissemination of inter-regional peace and goodwill, via force if necessary."

AFAIK neither TITO nor the SC's respective goals have changed.

NOTING that 10000 Islands was, in fact, the very first region to be commended, however the original commendation of 10000 Islands was later repealed because it was poorly written,

Still true.

BELIEVING that the many contributions of 10000 Islands to the world of NationStates go far beyond what can normally be expected of a single region, and are hence worthy of World Assembly comendation,
HEREBY commends 10000 Islands.

Well I guess that's what we're discussing.

As a defender organisation who regularly defends; how do we hinder defender efforts?

How do we hinder WA efforts? Our delegate frequently looks through current proposals, approving those he believes are worth the WA's time. Additionally, WA authors are welcomed and even encouraged to join our forums to debate for their proposals and our delegate typically votes according to the will of those who vote in the poll on our off-site forum.

How do we hinder the 'glorious political area of the world'?

[Sedgistan]

Proposal removed due to a co-authorship violation, specifically by listing "Everyone in NationStates" as a co-author. Co-authors are required to be nations, and that one was clearly intended to represent more than just a single nation. You can submit again listing a different puppet of that player as co-author.

[Cerberion]

Bravo for whichever group coordinated their puppets to start this. It was pretty slick on the timing.

I'd have been more impressed by seeing this issued under the "primary" nations who dreamed this up, but I suspect that kind of courage is in short supply.

I think the content of the commendation was pretty ludicrous mind you, but then I am biased. :)

[Kulaloe WA]

The Security Council,

ACKNOWLEDGING that the region of 10000 Islands has failed to live up to the great things to which it was commended for, and that their contributions are no longer exceptional; 1)

RECOGNIZING that the only achievements that 10000 Islands has continued to fulfill was being the historical "firsts" of things, feats that are impossible to be undone, but provide no value to the contemporary world; 2)


AWARE that TITO has failed in their mission to seek peace for all innocent regions;

NOTING that TITO has not liberated a region of over 20 raiders in several years; 3)

FURTHER NOTING that TITO, 10000 Islands's "defending" organization, does nothing to serve the interests of defenderdom by combating the true raiders; 4)

DISAPPOINTED by the conduct of TITO officers and their frequent beratings of other defender groups, directly leading to a rift in defender unity, leaving native communities to take the brunt of the consequences; 5)

UNDERSTANDING that 10000 Islands no longer lives up to the expectations that were outlined in its commendation, 6) and actually now serves a negative purpose in the world, hindering current defender efforts,7) WA efforts, and the glorious political area of the world, and is therefore unworthy of a commendation;

THEREFORE, the Security Council repeals the Commendation of 10000 Islands.

Co-authored by: Rovegia, Grenvi, and Everyone in NationStates

1) Assuming this is true, they still have not done anything to counter these acheivements.

2) Oh, right. Because being the first to do something totally doesn't show an innovactive genius.

3) So what? If you are held up in a lib in progress with a raider lead not yet kicked, it can be so tedious (and sometimes risky) to switch to do another lib and then switch back in time for the update of the region already being libbed. It's not like detagging, you know. Besides, the UDL does small pile libs all the time. If you don't have the numbers at the time, you don't have the numbers at the time.

4) I've seen them beat us UDL'ers to a lib before. Beat us by a couple of nations. I didn't complain, a fenda is a fenda in my eyes. I believe the raider force involved was a joint effort between The Black Riders and The Black Hawks. I guess they aren't true raiders then are they?

5) I am only aware of them berating the UDL. I am in no position to comment on the specifics because I have not yet heard TITO's side of it, but I'm sure it can be resolved eventually. While it is true that less griefings would occur and more hold raids would be ended quicker if TITO/UDL relations were as positive as FRA/UDL relations are, it is not grounds for repealing commendation.

6) Same as point 1.

7) Same as point 5.

This proposal does nothing to further the defender community's objectives and hurts defender unity.

AGAINST

[Frisbeeteria]

* snip *

Next time you take the time to post an extended riposte, make a note of the date of the last post in the thread. This has been dead for weeks.

[Free Tristania]

If you would look at the number of posts they have made you would see that they are probably just a couple of puppet nations from one and the same poster. In other words: I call fraud. Which means that Free Tristania, who has always received a great deal of help from 10.000 Islands will vote against this resolution and calls upon others to do the same thing.

[Harold I]

I'll vote FOR this resolution