[Draft] Condemn Nordengrund

[Sepuron]

Condemned for what we believe is standing up for what is right, eh?

[Flamboyant People]

You want to Condemn Nordengrund for SOME horrible acts? wonderful, now tell me where it is you have power over Nordengrund citizens.

A condemnation is only a mark of the international community's disapproval of a country. We're not proposing to engage in any form of active hostility with Nordengrund, as one of our laws, the Neutrality Act, 2555 provides a no-first strike policy. We have "power" over Nordengrundian citizens only in how they wish to be viewed by the world.

Religion told it. Respect the religion.

Our religion does not tell us anything of the sort, and we will not make policy decisions based on the outdated beliefs of a foreign religion.

Then you are ignorant for not respecting the beliefs of a foreign religion...

[Phing Phong]

Then you are ignorant for not respecting the beliefs of a foreign religion...

No. We respect the right of all people to hold certain beliefs, even when we disagree with those beliefs ourselves. What we do not respect or condone is when certain groups use their beliefs as a justification for violating the rights of others. A religious person has the right to be religious, but not to kill because their beliefs told them to.

There is no logic to arguing that a belief itself should be respected, regardless of what the particular belief actually entails. Furthermore, arguing on the basis of "religion told it" is nonsensical, as there are plenty of religions which eschew forcibly imposing their archaic laws and punishments on non-believers.

[Cromarty]

Ugh. No.

RP Condemns should be for long standing accomplished members of the community. Not noob 14 year olds spewing out their disgusting politics in the form of ShitP.

[Nordengrund]

"Ah, so I guess it is true" said Chancellor Liechtenstein. "We Christians will and are being persecuted for standing up for what we believe in. What we believe is right is being condemned by other nations of the world. No where in the Bible does it say we will not be persecuted, in fact, we should expect it. Now let us set an example to the world by showing them how a Christian should live. Despite being condemned and persecuted by the world, as the Bible predicts, we are going to celebrate for the Lord! Amen!"

[Nusantara Raya]

"Ah, so I guess it is true" said Chancellor Liechtenstein. "We Christians will and are being persecuted for standing up for what we believe in. What we believe is right is being condemned by other nations of the world. No where in the Bible does it say we will not be persecuted, in fact, we should expect it. Now let us set an example to the world by showing them how a Christian should live. Despite being condemned and persecuted by the world, as the Bible predicts, we are going to celebrate for the Lord! Amen!"

"Uh, yes, whatever you say about....you condemned or not we'll support your nation. Beside, this is just "condemnation". It's like one of WA staffs come to your office and say, "curse you." then go. Believe me, in my first rise of power, thousands of politicians do that to me every day. Now they're all caught for corruption."
-President Daud Kartosuwiryo-

[Nordengrund]

"Ah, so I guess it is true" said Chancellor Liechtenstein. "We Christians will and are being persecuted for standing up for what we believe in. What we believe is right is being condemned by other nations of the world. No where in the Bible does it say we will not be persecuted, in fact, we should expect it. Now let us set an example to the world by showing them how a Christian should live. Despite being condemned and persecuted by the world, as the Bible predicts, we are going to celebrate for the Lord! Amen!"

"Uh, yes, whatever you say about....you condemned or not we'll support your nation. Beside, this is just "condemnation". It's like one of WA staffs come to your office and say, "curse you." then go. Believe me, in my first rise of power, thousands of politicians do that to me every day. Now they're all caught for corruption."
-President Daud Kartosuwiryo-

Thank you, we shall repay you somehow for standing up for us.

[Nusantara Raya]

"Uh, yes, whatever you say about....you condemned or not we'll support your nation. Beside, this is just "condemnation". It's like one of WA staffs come to your office and say, "curse you." then go. Believe me, in my first rise of power, thousands of politicians do that to me every day. Now they're all caught for corruption."
-President Daud Kartosuwiryo-

Thank you, we shall repay you somehow for standing up for us.

"Mmh..forget it. No need to. We're religious nation too, like you, have the many same ideology. And we just expect the stronger relations between us."
-President Daud Kartosuwiryo-

[Nordengrund]

Thank you, we shall repay you somehow for standing up for us.

"Mmh..forget it. No need to. We're religious nation too, like you, have the many same ideology. And we just expect the stronger relations between us."
-President Daud Kartosuwiryo-

"Okay, it is a deal."

_ Chancellor Archibald von Liechtenstein

[The Great Destruction]

Ahhh... Back from vacation.....ok....Uhhhmmmm

NO

Yes this nation my be acting a litle douchy but I don't see this as worthy to get a Condmenation yet. Let this fledglng nation spread its wings and stretch its legs first.

*wispers to himself* Why all this SC activity surrounding The Royal Alliance?

[Jormengand]

"Ah, so I guess it is true" said Chancellor Liechtenstein. "We Christians will and are being persecuted for standing up for what we believe in. What we believe is right is being condemned by other nations of the world. No where in the Bible does it say we will not be persecuted, in fact, we should expect it. Now let us set an example to the world by showing them how a Christian should live. Despite being condemned and persecuted by the world, as the Bible predicts, we are going to celebrate for the Lord! Amen!"

Ambassador Maind'aigle leapt from her chair. "Excuse me, but if I were to create a religion which insisted in the death of all those who live in Nordengrund, would you expect me to stand up for this religion? Such a thing would be absurd. You are free to believe, no-one is disputing that. What you are not free to do is use your beleifs as feeble excuses to tear people apart, a punishment which I may add is not so much as mentioned in the so-called Good Book, and nor is the 'crime.' In short, you are abusing the principle of freedom of religion to commit atrocities.

Ugh. No.

RP Condemns should be for long standing accomplished members of the community. Not noob 14 year olds spewing out their disgusting politics in the form of ShitP.

"What, so newer nations are allowed to get away with such atrocities as older ones are not? Congratulations, ambassador, I wish I could make as much sense as you."

"And finally, for the two unnamed ambassadors who believed that the current draft was bad, but could be improved, how so? Please, we welcome suggestions."

[Weed]

"What, so newer nations are allowed to get away with such atrocities as older ones are not? Congratulations, ambassador, I wish I could make as much sense as you."

What, so we are supposed to recognize every new nation that comes along and commits a few atrocities? That'd be dozens per week. Which doesn't make as much sense as you wished, I suppose.

Against.

[Jormengand]

"What, so newer nations are allowed to get away with such atrocities as older ones are not? Congratulations, ambassador, I wish I could make as much sense as you."

What, so we are supposed to recognize every new nation that comes along and commits a few atrocities? That'd be dozens per week. Which doesn't make as much sense as you wished, I suppose.

Against.

What, would you like us to come back in a few months and condemn them again?

[Weed]

What, so we are supposed to recognize every new nation that comes along and commits a few atrocities? That'd be dozens per week. Which doesn't make as much sense as you wished, I suppose.

Against.

What, would you like us to come back in a few months and condemn them again?

If you come back in a few months and his nation still exists and is active you have a chance of this going somewhere, yes.

[Cromarty]

Ugh. No.

RP Condemns should be for long standing accomplished members of the community. Not noob 14 year olds spewing out their disgusting politics in the form of ShitP.

"What, so newer nations are allowed to get away with such atrocities as older ones are not? Congratulations, ambassador, I wish I could make as much sense as you."

"And finally, for the two unnamed ambassadors who believed that the current draft was bad, but could be improved, how so? Please, we welcome suggestions."

My comments were entirely OOC. Responding to them in IC is inappropriate.

However since you probably intend to continue doing so, here's your answer, in IC:
"Ambassador, if you spent an equal amount of time on every little backwater shithole with genocide on the mind, you will do nothing but waste this Council's time with pointless proposal after pointless proposal.
"There is a huge difference between the actions of Automagfreek, the Kraven Corporation, Milograd and other hells condemned by this assembly and Norengrund. The former group are among the most evil and despicable regimes in existence. The latter is a wannabe, an attention seeker. An amateur."

The Ambassador paused, looking directly at the ambassador from Jormengand. "Thus, for reasons of practicality, peace and my friggin' head, we should oppose this proposal."

[Zevassa]

OOCly I can't see this one making it through simply because he's too new, and truth be told a condemnation is actually a badge of honour worn by such roleplaying legends as Automagfreek and Milograd. So in that sense he isn't really deserving.

However ICly I fully support it, as a fellow RPer (and someone involved in that thread). Nordengrund is an evil nation, no doubt about it.

However as Skyrim Diplomacy said... call me once he has some genocides under his belt.

I too would support a Condemnation of Nordengrund IC, and had considered writing up a proposal of my own.

However, despite the fact that his stated views and opinions regarding the LGBT community are downright appalling and borderline monstrous, Nordengrund has also shown a willingness to compromise with the international community (and has at least once invited outsiders to participate in Nordengrundian political decisions), unlike other nations that have been ICly Condemned. Beyond that, he hasn't exactly targeted too many other groups or expressed a desire to commit too many other atrocities, so there's really nothing, at present, that could reasonably survive a vote.