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Last Major Civil War In YN

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When was your last civil war?

Prehistory
2
1%
Stone Age
0
No votes
Bronze Age
1
1%
Medieval Era
16
9%
1700's
12
7%
1800's
22
12%
Early 1900's
35
19%
Late 1900's
35
19%
2000's
38
21%
Future
20
11%
 
Total votes : 181

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New Acardia
Minister
 
Posts: 3275
Founded: Aug 04, 2009
Ex-Nation

Postby New Acardia » Wed Dec 02, 2020 9:41 pm

The last major civil war in my nation was the
Color War- Which was a three way civil war
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United Soviet Federation
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Posts: 14
Founded: Sep 11, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby United Soviet Federation » Wed Dec 02, 2020 9:45 pm

Most of the Federation's founding states were themselves established following revolutions and accompanying civil wars. The last one was the Second American Revolution/Civil War, as the workers of America rose up against the increasingly authoritarian government and the tyrannical robber barons, establishing a socialist state.
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Gran Argreriana
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Posts: 4
Founded: Sep 17, 2018
Ex-Nation

Postby Gran Argreriana » Wed Dec 02, 2020 9:47 pm

in 1986, there was a large civil war between the hardline monarchists and the communist guerillas supplied by china, by 1990 however, the communists were destroyed in a war of ideological cleansing. all suspected communists and their families were sent to one of the reeducation camps along the southern island chains, and have never been seen again, with the Emperor Dante I still in power, and all ideological enemies 'removed'

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South Quantia
Secretary
 
Posts: 28
Founded: Aug 04, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby South Quantia » Wed Dec 02, 2020 9:53 pm

The last major civil war in South Quantia was the Revolution of 2114. Following a coup d'etat against the elected left-wing government of Zavier Long III in late 2113, far-right military leader David Yunberger arrested Long and declared himself dictator. After passing unpopular reactionary policies, cracking down on opposition, and privatizing almost every government service possible, mass protests against the regime broke out in February of 2114. Long managed to escape from prison and join the protestors, which violently clashed with the police and military. After leading the quick invasion and subsequent annexation of Quantia's breakaway territory of Gradieshti to the north, Yunberger was assassinated by an unknown actor and rebels stormed the Quantian parliament. Yunberger's Vice-President, Frederick Dogbottom, fled to the northern city of New Prague, attempting to fight the rebels on the way but eventually giving up. The rebels succeeded and established socialism in South Quantia, but the North remains apart, a military dictatorship to this day.

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Gandoor
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Posts: 10232
Founded: Sep 23, 2008
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Gandoor » Wed Dec 02, 2020 11:07 pm

The most recent, and only, civil war to occur in our nation was the aptly-named Gandoor Civil War, which officially lasted from 1953 until 1957.

It began when Southside, Hegmon, and Freena Yon and parts of Yanot and Yontan Yon unilaterally declared their independence from the Democratic Republic and declared the establishment of the Gandoorese People's Republic.

While the Gandoorese Constitution does provide a way for yons to secede, the areas involved in the GPR did not follow this procedure and were ordered to put down their arms and surrender to Gandoorese authorities, which ultimately erupted into a full-scale war between the two Gandoors.

Despite the Democratic Republic having the advantage in the war, the Gandoorese People's Republic refused to surrender and a ceasefire for all troops wasn't declared until the Democratic Republic's victory in the Battle of Peninsular on 2 June 1956, at which point the People's Republic controlled less than 22% of the territory that it had in 1953.

Despite the ceasefire, the Gandoor Civil War would not come to an official end until 1 July 1957 when a treaty was signed between the Democratic Republic and the People's Republic (referred to in the treaty as 'the governing structure of the yons and other territories in rebellion') that dissolved the rebel government and all territory that had been in rebellion was restored as part of the Democratic Republic of Gandoor.

The war ultimately resulted in only about 35,000 casualties combined but the stress of the Gandoor Civil War, combined with the reign of Alexei Petrikov from 1940 until 1951 that preceded it, resulted in what was known as the Post-War Economic Crisis, which officially lasted from late-1957 until 1972.
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Batea del Nord
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Posts: 261
Founded: Dec 07, 2015
Anarchy

Postby Batea del Nord » Tue Feb 16, 2021 5:54 pm

We can consider the 3rd Batean Ucenan war our last civil war.

In some way our independence wars a where also a civil war as the Batean majority fought against the ethnic ucenans in Batea and it resulted in over 20000 civilian deaths another 20000 military ones 300000 ucenan displaced and refugees after the wars. Also 300000 ethnic Bateans were expelled from Ucena.
As We retaliated the ethnic cleansing made by the Ucenans. Total damage was worth 37U$ billion. But our economy recovered quickly.

As result of the 2 previous wars the recently independent Republic of Batea had been internationally recognized and Ucena was forced to cede the Northern part of Historical Batea. The problem is that the new Republic's Government didn't control the Ucenan majority Eastern province.
The New Government and their allies were focused in the country's stabilization and reconstruction.
As it was mostly populated by ethnic Ucenan population, being hostile to the new Republic and fearing a retribution for Ucenan atrocities during the first and second wars. Still having a great military force unwilling to dissolve itself. And, willing to join Ucena.

And, the New Batean majority Republic. the Democratic Government. Was fed up of constant bucanerism by Ucenan representatives. And the Batean public opinion was against giving concessions.
One side there was the new Batean army and police formed from the former National Batean Liberation Front. Trained and equipped by foreign nations that defeated Ucena twice. They simply rejected to allow ethnic Ucenans outside the that had joined the BNLF in the force as distrust was high. Counting that penniless eastern Batea would end dissolving their forces because they could not maintain them.
The new Batean army was small,, raw, but well trained, relatively well equipped, growing quickly, in spite of post war economic restrains. And, still outnumbered by the troops under control of the ucenan minority.
Ucenan separatists had the remnants of the 4th Ucenan army. And local paramilitaries.

Local Ucenans feared dissolving their forces and saw the Batean build up as a threat. In spite of Batean majority warranties.
Ucena itself had been defeated but the weak democracy didn't want to alienate their ultranationalists sectors. Nor foreign investors telling them.to not recognize the separatists. Ucenans wanted to support their proxies. Wanting to avenge the humiliation of being defeated twice. Many Ucenan soldiers especially those born in Batea decided "to defect" join the West ucena military. And, Ucena did what it could to keep supporting the separatists without attracting foreign nations attentions.

Tensions were high and with time going against Ucenan minority they decided to attack before Batean majority could and fix a border in the Àlgars river to join their homeland as fact acompli. Believing they could defeat the new Batean army before foreign allies could arrive in strenght.

The war was short.

The Batean army in spite of being outnumbered didn't collapse. It was not ill prepared, they fought in the retreat fighting harder than Ucenans though, in spite of being outnumbered 9:20. With supplies arriving due and Air bridge. With foreign troops arriving in force. Ucenan offensive crumbled in spite they managed to cross the river Àlgars. The allied offensive simply was too much. The counterattack made the Ucenan minority forces now tired, underfunded, out attached and out numbered, having spended they reserves trying to break Batean lines.
Ucenans were defeat soundly. Their Republic collapsed quickly and the Batean military was able to reunify the country. Ending with the separatist republic. The 30% of the ethnic minority fled the country. Also many of the ethnic Bateans living in Ucena also fled Ucena.
Last edited by Batea del Nord on Thu Jun 24, 2021 3:43 pm, edited 7 times in total.

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Bunkaiia
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Posts: 210
Founded: Nov 18, 2019
Ex-Nation

Postby Bunkaiia » Tue Feb 16, 2021 6:24 pm

The Soqotri-Aramaic-speaking Hashadoomani Christians have their own semi-autonomous island nation (along with the three other ethno-religious minorities within Bunkaiia).
The Hashadoomanis however, live on a hot desert island with poor soil. Bunkaiia - on the other hand - is a garden-centered vegan utopia and mandates a pseudo-vegan/vegetarian diet (insects & arthropods are consumed at certain festivals and bivalves are permitted).

The Hashadoomani in colonial times found allies with the Portuguese - at least until the Portuguese tried to impose their version of Christianity and eventually the Portuguese were ousted. In 19th century, the Italian empire took Bunkaiia as a protectorate after a massive drought that had killed thousands of Bunkaiians weakened the collective Bunkaiian resolve. During this time, the Hashadoomani began fishing to great dismay of their non-Christian counterparts on the other islands.

Since independence though the Mazdakite-led & militant animal rights Bunkaiian government and its semi-autonomous states (Pinonimic Jewish Chaykarosh, Yabaneyan Jain Maleibidulu-Samberiti, and the Austronesian Animistic-Ancestor worshipping Doyan Islands have all denounced the Hashadoomanis.

In the 1980s and 90s, several small scale conflicts took place between a Hashadoomani rebel militia who wanted to fish and wanted increased autonomy - or outright independence and Bunkaiia and its allies. The Civil War was fought until a Peace Treaty was signed that guaranteed the Hashadoomanis fishing rights within their regional border. The war destroyed much of the infrastructure of Hashadooma, which has not seen the booming benefits of tourism spread to its region yet. There is a strong dislike and distrust now in much of Bunkaiia (and its semi-autonomous regions) against the Hashadoomanis (and vice versa) and many have placed the blame on Global Warming, Colonial Interference, or lack of vision and zealotry in Hashadooma and/or Bunkaiia.

Only time will tell if another war is on the horizon.
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Wochaystein
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Posts: 496
Founded: May 06, 2018
Authoritarian Democracy

Postby Wochaystein » Tue Feb 16, 2021 9:18 pm

Wochaystein wrote:The Trouble across the Four Corners is a major civil war between the supporters of the major sibling-claimants to the title of Emperor: Adalbert, Adaldunk, Grimbert, and Grimdunk. It was never resolved and caused the shattering of the Holy Empire. All of its successor states claim that they are the "true" Empire.
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Tsarstvo Alyaski
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Founded: Dec 30, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Tsarstvo Alyaski » Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:46 am

On a technical level, Tsarstvo Alyaski has never been subject to a civil war.
But, if one is to refer to the country as it's old name, the Russian Empire... Well, I think the answer is pretty obvious, is it not?

(Hint hint, Russian Civil War)

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Alternate Gallifrey
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Posts: 14
Founded: Jan 12, 2021
Democratic Socialists

Postby Alternate Gallifrey » Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:46 am

The most recent civil conflict was the 'Fourth Gallifreyan Civil War' that was instigated by former Lord President Morbius, also known as the 'Imperator.' The Imperator sought to conquer the universe and establish an all-powerful 'Time Lord Imperium.' The civil war ended with the capture and apparent execution of the Imperator.
Last edited by Alternate Gallifrey on Fri Jan 26, 2024 11:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Naxera
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Founded: Jun 28, 2017
New York Times Democracy

Postby Naxera » Wed Feb 17, 2021 4:42 pm

Well, our civil war was short it lasted 21 weeks and relatively bloodless as it caused less than 3000 fatalities. Communist people party had to gained control of the country in 1948 election but by 1952 they had grown in popular. They had used the security forces and party militias against the oposition. They accused winner and the CIA of having rigged the elections. So the communist party leader said he was the winner. And the repression against oppositors increased.

After the main opposition leader was arrested and "accidentally shoot" while trying to escape. Under CIA assistance a force of 700 Naxeran exiles reinforced by US WW2 veterans. With an small air force and navy. Had formed a force and invaded the country. Receiving the aid 1200 locals opposition supporters. Defeating a force of 300 soldiers. The Army in spite of being 8000 strong, more the police and communists party paramilitaries. Were unable to stop the rebels.
Meanwhile rebels advanced quickly. Many military troops defected. Or avoiding fighting the rebels. In few weeks the rebels had quickly advanced thanks to 8-10 Shermans received by the rebels few days before.
The rebel columns now numbering 4000 had reached the outskirts of the capital.
Government and their supporters were running low from supplies. 7000 government supporters surrendered. And the anticommunist rebels took control of the capital.

The main communist leaders were imprisoned. But received amnesty in 1964. Communist party was reorganized in 1970.
Ironically the new government implemented many communist policies directed to building a welfare state, improving education and access to healthcare. While defending a market economy. After five years of transition government in 1957 started the first Free elections.

The Army was rebuilt completely with US assistance. And, it managed to defeat a small communist guerrilla in the late 60s in a 11 months COIN operation.

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Greater Eireann
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Posts: 170
Founded: Nov 02, 2016
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Greater Eireann » Wed Feb 17, 2021 5:02 pm

We actually just won our most recent civil war, but it really was more of a world war rather than just within the nation. The far-right group Imperial Front seized control of a recently free former colony of ours and turned it into their own fascist state, and began posturing. The world's far right flocked to the state, bolstering its population massively. The Western powers, my nation included, tried to stop them through diplomatic channels, but eventually they invaded their neighbour, Egypt, another postcolonial state in the North Sea Federation's sphere, with the ultimate aim of taking over the North Sea Federation. They then attacked Moscow Pact member the Arabic Soviets, as well as Oceanic Treaty Association member Cyrenaica, drawing both major blocs into war against them.

Initially, they did quite well, as they had access to many top Northarian generals that defected to them before or early into the war. Along with their allies in China and Anatolia, they swept through Allied forces quickly. Soon, they were just across the Øresund. Had they crossed it, they would have had a very short journey from there to Norway, where two of my capital cities are located. However, due to the heroic actions of Eastern Screech Owl General Talon, they were unable to cross the straits. They marched up through Russia to invade through Northarian Finland, but a combination of Northarian and Canadian soldiers turned them back.

Soon, Europe was crippled with partisans, all fighting back against the fascist puppet regimes that Imperial Front had placed in power. It was at this time as well that the regular armies of Europe began to turn the tide. Former Prime Minister turned General, Iseabeil Doherty, led a massive campaign through North Africa, dubbed "Doherty's March to the Red Sea," which cut Imperial Front in half. At the same time, their allies in China had also been wiped out. The fascists ordered a retreat to North Italy, and they holed up in Ravenna.

Soon the Allied forces had retaken their nations, and Italy was surrounded. Italian partisans conducted one of the most destructive sabotage campaigns in history, and eventually Allied soldiers were advancing to Ravenna from the west. The battle was long, but eventually the ringleaders were cornered. Most were captured trying to flee to neutral Iran, but many killed themselves, including the self proclaimed king, Ler O'Hara.

Basically a civil war blew up into a world war due to one side getting greedy. This was from early 2018 to September 2020.
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Mevraq
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Founded: Dec 23, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Mevraq » Thu Feb 18, 2021 11:46 pm

The Second Revolution of 1969 could be characterized as a civil war, but this would be stretching things. The only serious violence occurred in Minafi Aleasifa, when Ibrahim Kohen engaged in his infamous purges of anyone who questioned if the deceased Premier. Ari Berkane, had actually named his bodyguard as his successor. Across most of the country, the response was confusion, not violence. The violence came to an end when the Alliance of Labor Unions stormed the capital and executed Kohen.

The First Revolution of 1909, on the other hand, was undoubtedly a civil war, fought between the socialist revolutionaries and the plutocratic government. Unlike most civil wars, it was largely a series of naval battles, Mevraq being an archipelago. The socialists' control of the shipyards at Minafi Aleasifa, and especially their seizure of the dreadnought Maqabi, proved crucial to their victory.

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Avinaa
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Founded: Aug 01, 2013
Scandinavian Liberal Paradise

Postby Avinaa » Fri Feb 19, 2021 9:04 am

The last major civil war in Avinna was from 1928-1945 between two rival religious denominations within the Order of Huicism, the religion of 92% of the country. The 150+ year long divisions centered on the manner of the election of the chief religious official, the Kia, and their powers within the country and faith. This eventually resulted in two rival Kia's being elected in 1828-present effectively creating two churches. While holding no formal powers of state and politically neutral the Kia was a majorly influential figure on the country. A delicate balance between the two rival factions was struck by the then-Imperial family in 1773 that divided offices of state between the two factions. The Imperial Family would join neither faction and the offices of prime minister, parliament speaker, and the ministers of War, and Imperial Affairs were evenly divided between them.

This power agreement remained through the second civil war, a brief military junta from 1801-03, the abolition of the monarchy, and the 1922 fascist coup. The authoritarian Fascist government wanted to control this position to limit a potential rival, but it only served to divide the party within itself. After the assassination of President-for-life Phillip Green in 1927 his vice-president, Augustus Fergusson, assumed office. He immediately appointed a new government stacked with members of his own religious faction and openly practiced his faith essentially ending the power-sharing deal. President Fergusson's government passed discrimination laws and planned to outlaw his rival factions. This sparked open revolt among the majority Accordists who supported the deal and minority Purists. In 1928 through 1945 the Accordists and Purists fought throughout the homeland for 17 years bloody years killing over 200,000 people, mostly civilians. The fighting weakened the Fascist Party and strengthened the anti-fascist National League for Democracy (NLD) in the empire's colonies and among those who wanted an end to authoritarianism and wanted religious toleration.

The Civil War formally ended in 1945 with an Accordist victory over the Purists, but a badly weakened civilian political class and a broken Order of Huicism opened the door for rivals. Not wanting to see an eventual NLD victory in a protracted civil war the military, led by General-in-Chief Francis Durbin, seized power and established a secular and religiously tolerant military-government. The Fascist Party while not officially dissolved lost nearly all its influence as the party was removed from government institutions. It is worth noting that the NLD continued to operate peacefully in the homeland gradually building support for democracy. Overseas in the colonies however the Democratic Forces Alliance (DFA), the military arm of the NLD, fought a prolonged insurgency until the end of military rule in 1954.

The two factions formally split and recognized each other's existence in 1981. There are no current tensions between the groups and teaching remain similar.
Last edited by Avinaa on Fri Feb 19, 2021 9:10 am, edited 3 times in total.

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Corrington
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Founded: Dec 21, 2020
Ex-Nation

Postby Corrington » Fri Feb 19, 2021 9:57 am

The last civil war experienced in Corrington was the last War of the Roses, during 1496. With the support of James IV of Scotland, Richard Duke of York invaded England. When warfare commenced in England, Cornwall assisted the armies of York and Scotland to usurp the illegitimate reign of Henry VII after the king had tyrannically hiked taxes upon the oppressed Cornish people. Wars between Yorkist and Lancaster factions resumed with this invasion, with England splitting into factions which supported Henry VII as rightful king, or factions that supported the Duke of York as rightful king. When the war was won, the alliance of Scotland, Cornwall, and the Yorkists formed the United Kingdom of Corrington in 1497, assimilating the territory of England when Richard, Duke of York and his wife Lady Catherine Gordon were coronated as King Richard IV and Queen Catherine.

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Thermodolia
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Founded: Oct 07, 2011
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Thermodolia » Fri Feb 19, 2021 9:02 pm

The last major civil war, and the last civil war in general was fought from 1832 to 1834. The civil war started just after the Republican Coup which overthrew the then monarchy. The republican forces would end up defeating the monarchists two years later
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Socialist North Britain
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Founded: Mar 08, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby Socialist North Britain » Fri Mar 12, 2021 2:00 pm

The British Socialist Republic was formed as a consequence of the British Civil War of 1947-49, fought between the pro-Soviet and pro-US factions in Britain following World War II. It was triggered when a split in the Constitutional Convention led the communist faction to declare a provisional socialist government in the north of the country, which had been designated the Soviet sphere of influence. The pro-US southern government viewed it as illegitimate, and invaded. After a year and a half of fighting, the war ground to a halt due to a stalemate. Both factions agreed to an armistice, dividing the island of Great Britain in two, with each state holding onto the territory they currently held, essentially freezing the conflict. As of 1971, the situation remains unresolved, with the BSR occupying most of the island north of Birmingham, and the US-backed Commonwealth of Great Britain controlling the south, except for the County of London which is a neutral international zone.

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Saint Arsenio
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Founded: Jul 19, 2018
Democratic Socialists

Postby Saint Arsenio » Wed Jun 09, 2021 6:35 pm

The last (and only) major Saint Arsenian civil war, fought between the Saint Arsenian Rebels and the Dictator Loyalists, lasted from 1417 - 1418. The civil war was fought as a result of Saint Arsenio's then-king, King Johan, taking control of the entirety of the Saint Arsenian government, making him an absolute monarch. The Saint Arsenian civil war is recognized as one of the nation's shortest battles, and the bloodiest battle fought on Saint Arsenian soil.
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Islamic Holy Sites
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Founded: Mar 20, 2021
Ex-Nation

Postby Islamic Holy Sites » Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:32 am

If you count this as a civil war, the Islamici (Muqaddasi) Revolution that abolished the monarchy.
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Greater Angelus
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Founded: Jul 12, 2014
Corrupt Dictatorship

Postby Greater Angelus » Thu Jun 10, 2021 11:09 am

The Angelan War of Liberation, lasting from 1869-1971, was fought in several stages with intermittent periods of stalemate over the course of the century. The last phase, lasting from approximately 1968-1971, saw the combined forces of the Angelan Liberation Movement take Adragenia (modern-day Victorique), the final surrender of the Imperial Army in Angelus, and the establishment of the Socialist Republic of Greater Angelus later that year. Cumulative fatalities totaled at least 190,000 in the 1968-1971 phase in a country with a population of around 2.2 million at the time.

The Aichelle conflict is a continued territorial dispute between Angelus and the remnant Imperial Army which managed to cling to power in the southwestern part of the country. While Angelus has not officially committed troops to support the Catrionan National Liberation Army, it is known to provide significant funding and training to CNLA operatives, as well as personnel from the ISO division of the Ministry of State Security and paramilitary support from the ANRO's Volunteer Brigades. Since the 1990s, there has not been major fatalities (currently totaling to at least 10,000), but the conflict remains unresolved.
Last edited by Greater Angelus on Mon Aug 30, 2021 3:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Wille-Harlia
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Founded: Apr 09, 2020
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Wille-Harlia » Thu Jun 10, 2021 11:20 am

The Third Wille-Harlian Civil War (2011-2014), sometimes referred to as "Randolph's War" due to the involvement of that person, a former member of the Margauxian Imperial Family, in starting that conflict. This Randolph stirred up anti-monarchists to revolt against the Empire's Imperial Family, leading to the assassination of Emperor William I. His son, Prince Charles, brought the nation through the war, leading the monarchists to a victory, with help from the Margauxians, who sought to kill Randolph for his previous crimes.
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Bigpipstan
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Founded: Apr 21, 2020
Left-wing Utopia

Postby Bigpipstan » Thu Jun 10, 2021 11:40 am

The last civil war(pretty much the only one) was a war between north Transfur tribes and south Transfur tribes.
The south Transfur tribes wanted to coexist peacefully with the rest of Anocratic empire while the north tribes wanted to assimilate and transform everyone into them.
With some support of the imperial goverment the south Transfurs defeated and eliminated the north Transfurs.
There wasn't much that happend after that since the Transfur war ended just recently but the Transfurs were granted autonomy by Emperor Bigpip(see map of Fequm VI)

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Last edited by Bigpipstan on Thu Jun 10, 2021 11:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The Imagination Animals
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Founded: Mar 27, 2020
Authoritarian Democracy

Postby The Imagination Animals » Thu Jun 10, 2021 11:55 am

Our last Civil War was in 2020 and it lasted a whole year.
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Political Columnist
 
Posts: 4
Founded: May 24, 2021
Capitalizt

Postby -USA » Thu Jun 10, 2021 1:26 pm

In 1861-1865, the American Civil War.
This nation is a puppet of Dangine and I answer NS issues based on how the U.S in general has been governed.
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Dangine
Chargé d'Affaires
 
Posts: 352
Founded: Nov 02, 2018
Civil Rights Lovefest

Postby Dangine » Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:22 pm

Our last civil war was in 2019, November 5th.
On November 5th, 2019, two days after Dangine Day (the day Dangine was founded), a radical member, James Wilson of the Social Democrat Party took over the government with the help of his supporters, he thought all old people should die. He got his supporters and other terrible people to go around the country and kill every old person in sight. His rain of terror ended in November 19th, as citizens and ex-military fought against his supporters in a civil war. Wilson was brutally beaten to death. The war lasted 14 days. 150,000,000 of the elderly were murdered, and 20,000 others killed in the civil war. This was the last straw and 8 days later (Nov 27th) the military was reinstated.

Pete Dangine got rid of the military in the first place as they had little enemies and he used diplomacy rather than the military to get his way. Most of his country was very pacifist like him.
Last edited by Dangine on Thu Jun 10, 2021 4:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Dangine is a Socialist nation that has a lot of political freedom and civil rights.
Thank you Brusseldorf for redesigning my official flag. They did so without me asking.
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