t. Iraq/Afghanistan
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by Gallia- » Sat Sep 07, 2019 1:58 pm
by The World Capitalist Confederation » Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:06 pm
The Akasha Colony wrote:The World Capitalist Confederation wrote:So what, I just walk in with my marines and my paratroopers, clean the country up in the next week and then that's it?
It was that easy?
Wonderful, thank you.
No, because the Six-Day War did not involve these things. The Israelis won the war quickly because they kept their strategic objectives modest: Sinai, the West Bank, and the Golan Heights. They did not "clean up" Egypt, Syria, or Jordan. They seized a limited amount of territory they knew they could hold, proved that they still had the military upper hand, and then immediately called for a ceasefire from a position of strength. The Arab states decided to cut their losses and agreed.
by Gallia- » Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:20 pm
by Spirit of Hope » Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:26 pm
Imperializt Russia wrote:Support biblical marriage! One SoH and as many wives and sex slaves as he can afford!
by The Manticoran Empire » Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:40 pm
The World Capitalist Confederation wrote:The Akasha Colony wrote:
No, because the Six-Day War did not involve these things. The Israelis won the war quickly because they kept their strategic objectives modest: Sinai, the West Bank, and the Golan Heights. They did not "clean up" Egypt, Syria, or Jordan. They seized a limited amount of territory they knew they could hold, proved that they still had the military upper hand, and then immediately called for a ceasefire from a position of strength. The Arab states decided to cut their losses and agreed.
Alright then.
In terms of power level, the current situation is the United States vs WWII France (overconfident, unprepared, outdated doctrine, literally fighting with sticks) with the terrain of Russia (large grassy expanse with small marshes and a large mountain range far away from any sort of urban area) and the climate of Italy. I'm obviously the former country, so how easy would it be for me to win the war with the conditions mentioned in the previous parts of this thread?
by The World Capitalist Confederation » Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:41 pm
Spirit of Hope wrote:I don't get where you think France in WWII was "overconfident, unprepared, outdated doctrine, literally fighting with sticks." While France had a number of issues, it was less military issues and more political issues that lead to Frances poor performance, France very much didn't want to suffer heavy casualties, which kept them from attacking Germany or wanting to fight in France. Combine this with Germany pulling off a very risky gambit to outflank the main French army on the border and you get the fall of France.
As to how easy for you to win, that is going to depend on a lot of things, that aren't in this thread. What are your military objectives? How apposed to those military objectives is your opponent? What is the correlation of forces, how well trained are the forces, and where are those forces? What are the military plans of both sides? So on and so forth.
by The World Capitalist Confederation » Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:44 pm
The Manticoran Empire wrote:The World Capitalist Confederation wrote:Alright then.
In terms of power level, the current situation is the United States vs WWII France (overconfident, unprepared, outdated doctrine, literally fighting with sticks) with the terrain of Russia (large grassy expanse with small marshes and a large mountain range far away from any sort of urban area) and the climate of Italy. I'm obviously the former country, so how easy would it be for me to win the war with the conditions mentioned in the previous parts of this thread?
As Spirit said, France in World War 2 wasn't overconfident, unprepared, using outdated doctrines, or fighting with sticks. There were a great deal of other issues that France was dealing with. First, the French Government was deeply divided along Left and Right wing lines, with neither party trusting the military. As such, a lot of high ranking military jobs in France were filled by political appointees chosen for their loyalty as opposed to their experience. Second, the Germans had a much larger population than the French did, allowing Germany to deploy a larger army. Third, French Doctrine was actually solid, demonstrated as such by the fact that Germany HAD to go around the Maginot line. The only reasons the Ardennes gambit succeeded were the loss of Belgium's support before the war started and the lack of willingness on the part of the Allies to respond to German actions in the Ardennes.
Now, since this is Russia with a Mediterranean climate, you will lose. Allow me to explain why.
Logistics, logistics, logistics. There is a reason why Russia wasn't conquered by Napoleon or the Nazis and it wasn't because of winter. It was because of supply lines. Every mile your supply train has to travel is a mile in which it must be fed, watered, and in the modern world fueled. That's more supplies that must be brought, meaning more vehicles must be brought, meaning more supplies must be brought, and on and on it goes until you run out of trucks. When you have to bring those supplies hundreds or thousands of kilometers, the supplies required to maintain the supply trucks start to take the place of supplies needed for the men at the front, meaning that eventually you simply cannot advance anymore. Meanwhile, your enemy might still have the will to fight and, therefore, you will be forced back by the resultant counter attack. It isn't enough to simply destroy their air force and attack their infrastructure. If you are invading Russia, you want as much of that infrastructure intact as possible. Otherwise, your offensive is doomed to fail the same as Napoleon in 1812 and the Nazis in the 1940s.
by The World Capitalist Confederation » Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:47 pm
by Spirit of Hope » Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:56 pm
Imperializt Russia wrote:Support biblical marriage! One SoH and as many wives and sex slaves as he can afford!
by The World Capitalist Confederation » Sat Sep 07, 2019 2:58 pm
Spirit of Hope wrote:So your enemy is "overconfident, unprepared, using an outdated doctrine and fighting with sticks," but you "have no info on the other side."
If you are outnumbered that isn't a good sign for carrying out an invasion of another nation. Since you appear to be invading an island, how are you sustaining your forces logistically? What is their navy, and what is yours? How about air forces? Since you don't seem to be able to give us answers we can't give you the answers you seem to want.
Look, we can't tell you you are going to win this RP, or how to win the RP. Forum role playing is about creating a story, and that is something you have to do in that thread. Even if in reality you could crush your enemy faster than the US did in the Gulf War, doesn't mean it will happen that way in the RP because there is another person who gets to make calls on how things go, and has the ultimate veto power. We certainly aren't going to get involved and say one side or another wins, let alone how fast they win.
by The Akasha Colony » Sat Sep 07, 2019 3:07 pm
The World Capitalist Confederation wrote:Before I go any further, let me make it clear that this is a low-quality war RP where nobody actually wrote any military details down except for me and brains are optional. However, I would like to get this war done as fast as possible so I can focus on the others, as there's a six-way war going on and I don't want to get flanked.
by The Manticoran Empire » Sat Sep 07, 2019 3:14 pm
The World Capitalist Confederation wrote:The Manticoran Empire wrote:As Spirit said, France in World War 2 wasn't overconfident, unprepared, using outdated doctrines, or fighting with sticks. There were a great deal of other issues that France was dealing with. First, the French Government was deeply divided along Left and Right wing lines, with neither party trusting the military. As such, a lot of high ranking military jobs in France were filled by political appointees chosen for their loyalty as opposed to their experience. Second, the Germans had a much larger population than the French did, allowing Germany to deploy a larger army. Third, French Doctrine was actually solid, demonstrated as such by the fact that Germany HAD to go around the Maginot line. The only reasons the Ardennes gambit succeeded were the loss of Belgium's support before the war started and the lack of willingness on the part of the Allies to respond to German actions in the Ardennes.
Now, since this is Russia with a Mediterranean climate, you will lose. Allow me to explain why.
Logistics, logistics, logistics. There is a reason why Russia wasn't conquered by Napoleon or the Nazis and it wasn't because of winter. It was because of supply lines. Every mile your supply train has to travel is a mile in which it must be fed, watered, and in the modern world fueled. That's more supplies that must be brought, meaning more vehicles must be brought, meaning more supplies must be brought, and on and on it goes until you run out of trucks. When you have to bring those supplies hundreds or thousands of kilometers, the supplies required to maintain the supply trucks start to take the place of supplies needed for the men at the front, meaning that eventually you simply cannot advance anymore. Meanwhile, your enemy might still have the will to fight and, therefore, you will be forced back by the resultant counter attack. It isn't enough to simply destroy their air force and attack their infrastructure. If you are invading Russia, you want as much of that infrastructure intact as possible. Otherwise, your offensive is doomed to fail the same as Napoleon in 1812 and the Nazis in the 1940s.
Not specifically Russia. but rather the same terrain. It is much smaller, again, around the size of...well, we don't actually know. This is a rather low-quality RP since nobody had to put in any military information despite it being a war RP. I just meant it has a large plain with mountains, as populations are concentrated around both coasts, with some living inland.
The World Capitalist Confederation wrote:Before I go any further, let me make it clear that this is a low-quality war RP where nobody actually wrote any military details down except for me and brains are optional. However, I would like to get this war done as fast as possible so I can focus on the others, as there's a six-way war going on and I don't want to get flanked.
by Gallia- » Sat Sep 07, 2019 3:19 pm
The World Capitalist Confederation wrote:Our military objectives are to form a puppet government in the region which supports our interests, but mostly to enter the capital and to force a surrender.
by Allanea » Sat Sep 07, 2019 11:48 pm
by United Earthlings » Sun Sep 08, 2019 8:04 pm
by The Manticoran Empire » Sun Sep 08, 2019 8:26 pm
United Earthlings wrote:Does anyone know off hand what the specific manoeuvering capability rating is of the various SAMs and AAMs in service around the world and/or a source they could direct me to that provides that information all in one place?
I've find the information for some types like the ESSM and the IRIS-T, but that's it so far.
by New Vihenia » Mon Sep 09, 2019 5:06 am
by Radictistan » Tue Sep 10, 2019 7:03 pm
by Manokan Republic » Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:45 am
Gallia- wrote:The World Capitalist Confederation wrote:Our military objectives are to form a puppet government in the region which supports our interests, but mostly to enter the capital and to force a surrender.
Sounds familiar.
You've set your goals to be literally impossible given your analogy. The Taliban fight with sticks, have never even heard of the word "doctrine", and are totally unprepared to fight stealth bombers. They still whooped the ass of the USA. The Iraqi government, meanwhile, not only is hostile to the United States and supportive of its enemies (Iran), but the invasion of Iraq and ouster of the local regional strongman (Saddam) led to a power vacuum that created the impetus for the ongoing Syrian Civil War, the explosion of the Iran-Saudi proxy war, and the creation of ISIS, all due to the USA's meddling in the region. In one fell swoop, twenty years of hedging against Iran basically collapsed and the USA suffered the greatest defeat in the Middle East since 1979.
So not only will you utterly fail to win, you will have everything else that goes against you morally, politically, and militarily aligned against you.
This is also called "shooting yourself in the foot".
Of course that's assuming you have any idea what you're talking about when you gave that analogy. Since I don't know who you are and you post on NS the answer is probably "no", you just assume that big tanks and fleets > the other guys.
by Manokan Republic » Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:52 am
The World Capitalist Confederation wrote:The Manticoran Empire wrote:As Spirit said, France in World War 2 wasn't overconfident, unprepared, using outdated doctrines, or fighting with sticks. There were a great deal of other issues that France was dealing with. First, the French Government was deeply divided along Left and Right wing lines, with neither party trusting the military. As such, a lot of high ranking military jobs in France were filled by political appointees chosen for their loyalty as opposed to their experience. Second, the Germans had a much larger population than the French did, allowing Germany to deploy a larger army. Third, French Doctrine was actually solid, demonstrated as such by the fact that Germany HAD to go around the Maginot line. The only reasons the Ardennes gambit succeeded were the loss of Belgium's support before the war started and the lack of willingness on the part of the Allies to respond to German actions in the Ardennes.
Now, since this is Russia with a Mediterranean climate, you will lose. Allow me to explain why.
Logistics, logistics, logistics. There is a reason why Russia wasn't conquered by Napoleon or the Nazis and it wasn't because of winter. It was because of supply lines. Every mile your supply train has to travel is a mile in which it must be fed, watered, and in the modern world fueled. That's more supplies that must be brought, meaning more vehicles must be brought, meaning more supplies must be brought, and on and on it goes until you run out of trucks. When you have to bring those supplies hundreds or thousands of kilometers, the supplies required to maintain the supply trucks start to take the place of supplies needed for the men at the front, meaning that eventually you simply cannot advance anymore. Meanwhile, your enemy might still have the will to fight and, therefore, you will be forced back by the resultant counter attack. It isn't enough to simply destroy their air force and attack their infrastructure. If you are invading Russia, you want as much of that infrastructure intact as possible. Otherwise, your offensive is doomed to fail the same as Napoleon in 1812 and the Nazis in the 1940s.
Not specifically Russia. but rather the same terrain. It is much smaller, again, around the size of...well, we don't actually know. This is a rather low-quality RP since nobody had to put in any military information despite it being a war RP. I just meant it has a large plain with mountains, as populations are concentrated around both coasts, with some living inland.
by Hrstrovokia » Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:53 am
by New Vihenia » Wed Sep 11, 2019 11:30 am
Hrstrovokia wrote:Can someone point me in the right direction for a decent site or forum concerning military optics [sights, scopes etc]. Especially if it's Soviet/Russian.
RussianOptics would be a decent reservoir of information were it not for the terrible layout of the site. Gunrf.u is decent. After that I'm acquiring most of my information from sites selling optics [RusOptics, NPZOptics, AKStuff, BearOptics] and that's ok but not great for building knowledge at my current base.
by Austrasien » Wed Sep 11, 2019 12:21 pm
Hrstrovokia wrote:Can someone point me in the right direction for a decent site or forum concerning military optics [sights, scopes etc]. Especially if it's Soviet/Russian.
RussianOptics would be a decent reservoir of information were it not for the terrible layout of the site. Gunrf.u is decent. After that I'm acquiring most of my information from sites selling optics [RusOptics, NPZOptics, AKStuff, BearOptics] and that's ok but not great for building knowledge at my current base.
by Hrstrovokia » Wed Sep 11, 2019 12:36 pm
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