Infantry Discussion Thread 10: Shovel Edition [NO FWORDS]

[Puzikas]

Or make it caseless

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

Or make it caseless :o

That's too radical for "frod".

[Torrocca]

Or make it caseless

That's too radical for "frod".

Ford "the Mace" Orsia

cant uncase the mace

[Fordorsia]

Well there is a conveniently placed gap between the scope and 20mm. But I'll give it a deflector.

The gap will exacerbate it because it'll let the casing ping off the cannon and hit the scope multiple times.



Something like that is just fine. You'd have to empty it occasionally, which just means pitching it out the top I guess, but it's better than risking equipment damage.

It's also tidy.

That's too high tech. I just put an angled plate on the 20mm to deflect them downwards.

Not that hitting the scope out of alignment to any degree is much of a big deal anyway. It's just a viewing scope for seeing the tracers and impacts, not for precision aiming.

Or make it caseless

gross

[Gallia-]

The angled plate should be on the MG 15, since that is where the bullets come out of.

[Fordorsia]

I think that would make it a bit too hard to get at the ejection port for whatever reason though

[Austria-Bohemia-Hungary]

I think that would make it a bit too hard to get at the ejection port for whatever reason though

This is like intentionally sticking your finger on a red hot frying pan.

[Prosorusiya]

Anybody have some background on the use of actual sniper teams, as opposed to designated marksmen, by the Soviets? I am considering making a modern variant of the Nagant, the OTs-48, as part of my repitor for sniper teams, as opposed to designated marksmen. Either that or just give them old Mosins/Type 38s.

Also, what kind of weapon would the assistant be carrying? A normal AKM/AK-74?

[Rhodesialund]

Stoner 63 was cool I guess, but M16 HBAR is my winner. Then again I have communist sideclamps on Galla's M16s. The left side too, so shooters can see down the iron sights while they use their scope, because that's apparently a thing IRL. I thought I had a picture of some Iraqis with a Tabuk doing it, but I don't.

The US Army, for whatever reason, came to love belt-feds so much they bought a belt-fed BAR.

Belt-fed
Automatic
Rifle

M249 BAR.

Unfortunately the magazine adapter sinks that. Too useful to be abandoned and too obscure to be noticed by anyone who hasn't shot the gat. ;~;

Gah, shot the M249 at an MG shoot. The magazine feeding fucking sucks. Fucked up two of my magazines despite the owner saying that he would not recommend it. A fool and his two magazines are soon separated by their destruction.

[Federated Kingdom of Prussia]

How did mass production of non-standardized guns and ammo work during the Napoleonic Wars and Seven Years' War? I'm guessing armies had stocks of black powder and lead ingots, and soldiers would cast their own bullets and measure their own powder, but I have no idea.

[Husseinarti]

Stoner 63 was cool I guess, but M16 HBAR is my winner. Then again I have communist sideclamps on Galla's M16s. The left side too, so shooters can see down the iron sights while they use their scope, because that's apparently a thing IRL. I thought I had a picture of some Iraqis with a Tabuk doing it, but I don't.

The US Army, for whatever reason, came to love belt-feds so much they bought a belt-fed BAR.

Belt-fed
Automatic
Rifle

M249 BAR.

Unfortunately the magazine adapter sinks that. Too useful to be abandoned and too obscure to be noticed by anyone who hasn't shot the gat. ;~;

Gah, shot the M249 at an MG shoot. The magazine feeding fucking sucks. Fucked up two of my magazines despite the owner saying that he would not recommend it. A fool and his two magazines are soon separated by their destruction.

Its not the primary means of feeding by any margin. They told us in BCT that the feed lips of AR mags will be fucked up by it. But again, its a 'Oh fuck take the mags off the dead SL we're getting fucking overrun.' kind of feature that has been used enough times for the US Army to justify keeping it.

Stoner 63 was cool I guess, but M16 HBAR is my winner. Then again I have communist sideclamps on Galla's M16s. The left side too, so shooters can see down the iron sights while they use their scope, because that's apparently a thing IRL. I thought I had a picture of some Iraqis with a Tabuk doing it, but I don't.

The US Army, for whatever reason, came to love belt-feds so much they bought a belt-fed BAR.

Belt-fed
Automatic
Rifle

M249 BAR.

Unfortunately the magazine adapter sinks that. Too useful to be abandoned and too obscure to be noticed by anyone who hasn't shot the gat. ;~;

Its a great way for a wild spent link or two to find their way into as well.

[Gallia-]

The magazine adapter is just there when you run out of belted ammunition.

Which is generally bound to happen if the SAW is being used in a static position...

I cross trained with some 12B's in Korea and at the 82nd, Odd how I had the opportunity in both places - Korea had to do with mines in the Z and breaching, while at Ft. Bragg (I want to say it was the 37th or something like that - they were across the street from us at the 2/505). I did a course of breaching and demolitions on a bridge on some range while a couple of engineers laid down "supressive fire."

Bastards melted the handguard on my SAW. They were giggling and throwing 16 mags in the side like kids chucking bread at ducks after they used up my 800 belted rounds.

All in all a pretty good bunch of guys for non-infantry. They worked almost as hard as us!!

[Fordorsia]

How mechanically different are snail drums and saddle drums? I want to make a double drum thing for the 20mm for if I ever decide to need to extra ammo

[Gallia-]

A "saddle drum" is two snails stuck together.

[Crookfur]

How did mass production of non-standardized guns and ammo work during the Napoleonic Wars and Seven Years' War? I'm guessing armies had stocks of black powder and lead ingots, and soldiers would cast their own bullets and measure their own powder, but I have no idea.

Post 30 years war most ammo was produced and supplied to troops as ready made cartridges. Due to this and the variance in individual gun barrel diameter the balls were all undersized and wadding/patches in the cartridge were used to hopefully bridge the gap so to speak.

Hand casting bullets with a mould matched to the gun was only really the preserve of specialist light troops. In practice the accuracy of full hand loads with self moulded bullets was not significantly better than that of just using issued cartridges (with leather or paper patches) in your rifle and this has been recreated and demonstrated a few times recently (there is a nice video of some Aussie 95th reenactors experimenting with this stuff).

A bit of windage in the bore wasn't considered to be the end of the world although everyone was constantly fiddling with sizes to get the best ballance of accuracy and ease of loading, Cap and Ball.eu has a couple of good videos on this.

[Rhodesialund]

Its not the primary means of feeding by any margin. They told us in BCT that the feed lips of AR mags will be fucked up by it. But again, its a 'Oh fuck take the mags off the dead SL we're getting fucking overrun.' kind of feature that has been used enough times for the US Army to justify keeping it.

TBH, it would be nice if the mag adapter didn't fuck up mags. This is especially considering that I want the FN 249S that's on the market right now. >.>

[Gallia-]

Its not the primary means of feeding by any margin. They told us in BCT that the feed lips of AR mags will be fucked up by it. But again, its a 'Oh fuck take the mags off the dead SL we're getting fucking overrun.' kind of feature that has been used enough times for the US Army to justify keeping it.

TBH, it would be nice if the mag adapter didn't fuck up mags. This is especially considering that I want the FN 249S that's on the market right now. >.>

Magazines are disposable though. If it fucks up the magazines, just get new ones.

You're not really supposed to DX them and back in the day, before the Austerity Wars, the USA had so many magazines you'd just dump them on the ground.

Maybe if we went back to a single uniform for the entire military you'd save enough money between the branches to afford magazines again!

[Theodosiya]

Would like to have disposable mags and different uniform n camo pattern, though.

[Rhodesialund]

TBH, it would be nice if the mag adapter didn't fuck up mags. This is especially considering that I want the FN 249S that's on the market right now. >.>

Magazines are disposable though. If it fucks up the magazines, just get new ones.

You're not really supposed to DX them and back in the day, before the Austerity Wars, the USA had so many magazines you'd just dump them on the ground.

Maybe if we went back to a single uniform for the entire military you'd save enough money between the branches to afford magazines again!

I was speaking in terms of me IRL with one person on a normal everyday budget. Spending six bucks for failtastic steel mags every thirty rounds ain't exactly fun.

[Gallia-]

Magazines are disposable though. If it fucks up the magazines, just get new ones.

You're not really supposed to DX them and back in the day, before the Austerity Wars, the USA had so many magazines you'd just dump them on the ground.

Maybe if we went back to a single uniform for the entire military you'd save enough money between the branches to afford magazines again!

I was speaking in terms of me IRL with one person on a normal everyday budget. Spending six bucks for failtastic steel mags every thirty rounds ain't exactly fun.

You're not the principal intended user of the guns or magazines, so it's a bit irrelevant.

[Taihei Tengoku]

the USA had so many magazines you'd just dump them on the ground.

This is highly [citation needed]

[Gallia-]

the USA had so many magazines you'd just dump them on the ground.

This is highly [citation needed]

It's mostly just anecdotes from old people.

To get the real skinny you'd need to draw individual unit's financial records or something. Preferably from a reasonably modern battle like Mogadishu, Panama, or Desert Storm.

They didn't have dump pouches at 73 Easting, though.

If you're a Soldier(TM), they still don't.

[Taihei Tengoku]

Without dump pouches you just replace the fresh mag with the empty one in the normal magazine pouch.

[Gallia-]

Yes, that's the idea, although it's easier to stuff them into a shirt/blouse pocket apparently.

[Laritaia]

magazines haven't been a disposable item since the very early days of the M16, it's not the end of the world if you lose or break one.

but if you consistently lose them the Quartermaster is going to start screaming "Stores are for storing, if they were for issuing they would be called Issues" when you ask for some more, before he collapses and starts foaming at the mouth.